Daily Sun Article 11/11

[Ben Rocky \'04]

bigredapple-
Learn to read.
I said that parents should worry about more important things then swearing that their offspring deal with.
A good athletic director should worry about the ice being the proper temp. and the team having working equpiment, not what fans are saying.
I said that the ushers should worry about more imporant things then swearing.  They do a poor job of enforcing the current policies, so athletics should reduce the amount of rules they have, and the most foolish to me seems to be the one on swearing.

[DisplacedCornellian]

Ben...you're still missing the point.

Just because you think that swearing is not a problem and people shouldn't find it offensive, doesn't mean other people think that way.

Like DeltaOne said...maybe you think nudity is a beautiful thing.  That doesn't mean we're going to stand to see your naked ass running all over campus.  

As for not knowing that they kick people out for swearing...I can't imagine how that is possible.  I remember people being tossed out for swearing quite regularly as early as the '99-'00 season.  (There was this one guy who was a real bastard about it too...I think his name was Al.  He seemed to take great pleasure in his job...)  

Anyway, I think the point is, regardless of whether you think the rule is right or not, if you break it you should be willing to deal with the consequences.  Do you think if you get busted for possession the courts are going to care that you think people should be free to experiment with whatever mind altering substances they feel like??

Also, getting back to what sparked this little flamewar... Regardless of whether the rule against swearing is stupid or not, Linder is a complete tool for crying to the Daily Sun about getting tossed from a game.  He broke the rules and got caught.  Deal with it.

[Robb \'94]

Regarding "fair" enforcement: next time you get a speeding ticket, try telling the judge that your ticket shouldn't count because the cop didn't pull over every speeder on the highway that day.  Unlike college, these sort of things don't work on a curve - it's not necessarily the fastest speeder who gets a ticket, nor the most vulgar fan who gets booted.  Your behavior stands on its own merit.  Did you break the rule?  Yes.  It doesn't matter at all what anyone else did or didn't do - take your lumps like an adult!

[bigggreddd77]

does Ben really deserve any more of our attention?  Come on...its a CLEARLY stated rule...it was CLEARLY broken...and the guy was punished...end of story.  

'But everyone else in the bar was underage and had fake ID's too...thats not fair to arrest me!!!'  Tough...you got caught breaking a rule...deal with the consequences...  And Ben, please spare us from your judgements on what proper morals or standards should be...

[arik marks \'91]

This all is nothing new.  Late in Coach Mccutcheon's time at Lynah he made the same plea to fans (and was quoted in the sun) about cutting out the profanity.  He in fact wouldn't allow his young daughters to the games at the time and a crackdown on crowd profanity ensued.  

I'd agree it was enforced arbitrarily then as well- quite amusing to watch an usher wander into the then drunken mess of section B and pick one individual at random from amongst the horde that was all swearing at the same time.  In fact, if everyone just pointed at the same person that person would go, whether they swore or not.

My take on this is suck it up and live with it if you want to go to the games - the issue is never going to go away.  And this comes from someone who's favorite part of any cheer is being able to end it with "you suck" or "sucks."  On the administration side of the house I know an athletics staffer who didn't like the policy either - but that was because he had to help kick people out and that was no fun for him. So it's no fun for anybody, but  evidently necessary.

Hmm maybe we can turn Harvard's rink into Profanity East this year?  Are they going to revoke our four-packs?    ::nut::

[Ithaca High \'00]

Ben --

Since you keep mentioning how you've been going to games since you were a little kid, I can only assume that you value this experience as a fan and that you would want the same experience for others.  I had season tickets for 10 years while growing up in Ithaca, and even though I now go to school on the other side of the country, I still pay attention to every game and consider myself a lifelong fan of Cornell hockey.  Apparently, both of our parents were willing to take us to games in spite of the profanity that occured in the rink (which many people seem to agree was less prevalent in the 80s and early 90s than it is today).  What about kids whose parents are uncomfortable or unwilling to take their kids to games because of the profanity that now occurs?  Is it worth it to you to be able to spew forth vulgarities at games at the expense of enabling other kids to experience the formative experience as a fan that you claim to value?  Is it worth disrespecting Schafer as a coach and as a parent?  If so, you're doing a disservice to the team you claim to be such a huge fan of, not to mention that your sense of entitlement is rather nauseating.

[ugarte]

On the INCH newsstand scroll, the Daily Sun article header is "Ahhhh ... See ya!"

[DeltaOne81]

Ben,

It's fine of you to say that you don't think swears are such a big deal - each his own. But what's not fine of you it so assume that you have the right to be indignant about the fact that other people do. If you can say your personal opinion is that swears aren't all that bad, then you have to respect the people who say that they are pretty bad. And furthermore, you have absolutely no right, as a college senior, to stand there and tell other people what they should be worried about as far as raising their children. Don't stand there and say what parents should and shouldn't care about... get over yourself. Just because they care about their kids being exposed to vulgar language doesn't mean they're not also taking care of the "more important stuff." So live your own life and drop the holier than thou, "I know what other people should care about" air you have. And respect the wishes of the community as a whole without being pissy about it.

Robb,

That's a good point about fair enforcement and it's well taken. The only thing I'll say is there are honestly probably a good amount of people in Lynah who don't realize that swearing is actively being enforced... while no one would doubt that about speeding. I think the AD should make a slightly more visible attempt to stress that. Have Schafer come out before the first regular season game each year. Or have Arthur make an announcement in a way that it actually sounds vital. Or something. Of course, I think this whole article did it this year... for the vast majority of people.

[Ben Rocky \'04]

Jenny ( i assume)-
As I said before, i view swearing as a really dumb thing for parents to worry about.  Mine didn't, yours didn't.  My opinion on the language is just that, an opinion.  
I THINK that parents should bring their kids and not worry about a few words.  Its just that simple.

[Ben Rocky \'04]

Making an example out of one just seems like an attempt to send a message to that one student that they are the token one punished for thousands of violations of the policy that evening, where as everone else just says "sucks for them" and goes on.  The one person kicked out gets to not view the game they paid for and no one else reduces their swearing.  What a waste of time.  If they threw out a few hundred people (not that im saying this is a good idea) then people would start to notice & change their language, but a quota of 5 a game does nothing in a crowd of 1500 plus undergrads.

[Ben Rocky \'04]

Delta-
Stop preaching & get over yourself.  I have the right to be angry about whatever I want and write about it, just as you do. I have the right to state my opinions on what is profane and useless language, just as you do.  You seem to think that parents should care about swearing, I disagree.  We both seem to have a great quantity of opinions on parenting, so please note that it is not just me who thinks I know how people should raise their kids.  Don't be a hypocrite.
If my OPINIONS are that offensive to you, stop reading my postings.

[atb9]

Are you kidding me??  I know of at least 2 of my friends and 6 people in section E that got kicked out the last weekend of home games.  They weren't making an example of him!  They were punishing him.

[atb9]

unfortunately I haven't...  ::stupid::  :-/

[Greg Berge]

Well, college students have never and will never have much life experience to draw from when pontificating.  That didn't stop me from being a loudmouth know-nothing 21 year old, and it won't stop anybody else.  Nor should it -- everybody's entitled to their own opinion.  But at the same time, children should not be shocked when their rhetoric gets the auto-delete from their elders.  In the same vein, I'm sure 60 year olds listen to 40 year olds and think, "sophomoric idiots."

So, obviously it isn't remotely tangential to a free speech issue and to conflate it with those issues is, in a word, assinine.  But as somebody who has a kid, there are MUCH more important things to get indignant about than whether the fan next to your little pride and joy is cussing out the ref.  Your little darling says worse things to its friends, ten seconds after leaving the house for the bus each morning.  Big deal.

[Ben Rocky \'04]

Real mature, kid.