Cornell lacrosse 2019

[BearLover]

The more success a program has, the better recruits it gets. It's possible to build a great program over several years, increasing the quality of recruits as you win. As they did in hockey, Yale took about 8 years to go from a middling program to a national power. It's usually hard to prove a rival's success hurt us in recruiting, but in this case it's pretty easy to reason that if Cornell were the clear best Ivy, as it was for most a ten-year stretch until a few years ago, this FOGO guy wouldn't have as much of a choice. On average, we get better recruits when we win more than our rivals, since we compete with our rivals for recruits. Anyway, I'm going to drop this and raise it again in a few weeks, and then a few weeks after that, and th

[George64]

The other Ierlan (Chayse).

[Al DeFlorio]

Congrats to everyone on this forum who was happy for Yale's success, especially their national championship.

As opposed to the joy of Duke winning.

The guy's just a whiner, Bill.  Always has been.

And, yes, I'm delighted that an Ivy won the lacrosse championship.

"Just a whiner," or, just a regular sports fan? Go on a Duke Basketball forum, tell everyone how you're rooting for UNC in the game against Kentucky, and see how you fare.

There are costs to Cornell when its rivals do well. This is one of them.

You're a whiner.  And annoying.  And embarrassing.

And I don't give a shit what Duke fans think.  You, too, for that matter.

Yeah, because my statement was definitely specific to Duke fans.

We're potentially losing out on the biggest transfer in the country because one of our rivals started winning. I stopped harping awhile ago on the point that our rivals doing well will hurt us, but this seems like a very appropriate time to return to that argument given how clear the causality is.

That makes no sense. We ourselves finished among the top 8 teams in the country in 2018, and with our without him we're poised to make another deep run next year. Yale lost a lot more talent than we did (including of course the fantastic Ben Reeves), so if he were making his choice from a pure "which team has the best chance to win it all next year" standpoint, that would be us.  While I'll be a bit baffled if Ierlan in fact choose Yale, he would be choosing to go there for some other reason than because Yale gives him the better chance to win.

But he would never be considering it if not for Yale's recent run of success. Just like he probably wouldn't be considering us if we hadn't finished in the final eight this year and had a history of winning.

Are you really so clueless that you think the only reason someone might choose Yale over Cornell is because they won a lacrosse championship?  You've been beating this uninformed drum for years and, pal, it makes no sense. Really.

[Al DeFlorio]

Jeff Teat, Brennan Donville, and Jason Noble named to Canada's 2018 world championship team.

[BearLover]

Congrats to everyone on this forum who was happy for Yale's success, especially their national championship.

As opposed to the joy of Duke winning.

The guy's just a whiner, Bill.  Always has been.

And, yes, I'm delighted that an Ivy won the lacrosse championship.

"Just a whiner," or, just a regular sports fan? Go on a Duke Basketball forum, tell everyone how you're rooting for UNC in the game against Kentucky, and see how you fare.

There are costs to Cornell when its rivals do well. This is one of them.

You're a whiner.  And annoying.  And embarrassing.

And I don't give a shit what Duke fans think.  You, too, for that matter.

Yeah, because my statement was definitely specific to Duke fans.

We're potentially losing out on the biggest transfer in the country because one of our rivals started winning. I stopped harping awhile ago on the point that our rivals doing well will hurt us, but this seems like a very appropriate time to return to that argument given how clear the causality is.

That makes no sense. We ourselves finished among the top 8 teams in the country in 2018, and with our without him we're poised to make another deep run next year. Yale lost a lot more talent than we did (including of course the fantastic Ben Reeves), so if he were making his choice from a pure "which team has the best chance to win it all next year" standpoint, that would be us.  While I'll be a bit baffled if Ierlan in fact choose Yale, he would be choosing to go there for some other reason than because Yale gives him the better chance to win.

But he would never be considering it if not for Yale's recent run of success. Just like he probably wouldn't be considering us if we hadn't finished in the final eight this year and had a history of winning.

Are you really so clueless that you think the only reason someone might choose Yale over Cornell is because they won a lacrosse championship?  You've been beating this uninformed drum for years and, pal, it makes no sense. Really.

You sure throw around a lot of insults.

But, okay. You're being obtuse. I assume you understand more than one factor can go into a decision. Would you like to hazard a guess as to why this kid, with presumably no relation to Yale whatsoever, chose them as a finalist in his transfer decision, but not Harvard or Princeton or any other Ivy besides the one where his brother will be playing next year? Could it be that Yale has had sustained success over the past eight seasons and just won a national championship?

[KenP]

Congrats to everyone on this forum who was happy for Yale's success, especially their national championship.

As opposed to the joy of Duke winning.

The guy's just a whiner, Bill.  Always has been.

And, yes, I'm delighted that an Ivy won the lacrosse championship.

"Just a whiner," or, just a regular sports fan? Go on a Duke Basketball forum, tell everyone how you're rooting for UNC in the game against Kentucky, and see how you fare.

There are costs to Cornell when its rivals do well. This is one of them.

You're a whiner.  And annoying.  And embarrassing.

And I don't give a shit what Duke fans think.  You, too, for that matter.

Yeah, because my statement was definitely specific to Duke fans.

We're potentially losing out on the biggest transfer in the country because one of our rivals started winning. I stopped harping awhile ago on the point that our rivals doing well will hurt us, but this seems like a very appropriate time to return to that argument given how clear the causality is.

That makes no sense. We ourselves finished among the top 8 teams in the country in 2018, and with our without him we're poised to make another deep run next year. Yale lost a lot more talent than we did (including of course the fantastic Ben Reeves), so if he were making his choice from a pure "which team has the best chance to win it all next year" standpoint, that would be us.  While I'll be a bit baffled if Ierlan in fact choose Yale, he would be choosing to go there for some other reason than because Yale gives him the better chance to win.

But he would never be considering it if not for Yale's recent run of success. Just like he probably wouldn't be considering us if we hadn't finished in the final eight this year and had a history of winning.

Are you really so clueless that you think the only reason someone might choose Yale over Cornell is because they won a lacrosse championship?  You've been beating this uninformed drum for years and, pal, it makes no sense. Really.

You sure throw around a lot of insults.

But, okay. You're being obtuse. I assume you understand more than one factor can go into a decision. Would you like to hazard a guess as to why this kid, with presumably no relation to Yale whatsoever, chose them as a finalist in his transfer decision, but not Harvard or Princeton or any other Ivy besides the one where his brother will be playing next year? Could it be that Yale has had sustained success over the past eight seasons and just won a national championship?

If he were truly split about which school would be best for his lacrosse play and decided to look at academics, school reputation and strength of alumni network... I bleed carnelian but c'mon guys.

[marty]

Congrats to everyone on this forum who was happy for Yale's success, especially their national championship.

As opposed to the joy of Duke winning.

The guy's just a whiner, Bill.  Always has been.

And, yes, I'm delighted that an Ivy won the lacrosse championship.

"Just a whiner," or, just a regular sports fan? Go on a Duke Basketball forum, tell everyone how you're rooting for UNC in the game against Kentucky, and see how you fare.

There are costs to Cornell when its rivals do well. This is one of them.

You're a whiner.  And annoying.  And embarrassing.

And I don't give a shit what Duke fans think.  You, too, for that matter.

Yeah, because my statement was definitely specific to Duke fans.

We're potentially losing out on the biggest transfer in the country because one of our rivals started winning. I stopped harping awhile ago on the point that our rivals doing well will hurt us, but this seems like a very appropriate time to return to that argument given how clear the causality is.

That makes no sense. We ourselves finished among the top 8 teams in the country in 2018, and with our without him we're poised to make another deep run next year. Yale lost a lot more talent than we did (including of course the fantastic Ben Reeves), so if he were making his choice from a pure "which team has the best chance to win it all next year" standpoint, that would be us.  While I'll be a bit baffled if Ierlan in fact choose Yale, he would be choosing to go there for some other reason than because Yale gives him the better chance to win.

But he would never be considering it if not for Yale's recent run of success. Just like he probably wouldn't be considering us if we hadn't finished in the final eight this year and had a history of winning.

Are you really so clueless that you think the only reason someone might choose Yale over Cornell is because they won a lacrosse championship?  You've been beating this uninformed drum for years and, pal, it makes no sense. Really.

You sure throw around a lot of insults.

But, okay. You're being obtuse. I assume you understand more than one factor can go into a decision. Would you like to hazard a guess as to why this kid, with presumably no relation to Yale whatsoever, chose them as a finalist in his transfer decision, but not Harvard or Princeton or any other Ivy besides the one where his brother will be playing next year? Could it be that Yale has had sustained success over the past eight seasons and just won a national championship?

If he were truly split about which school would be best for his lacrosse play and decided to look at academics, school reputation and strength of alumni network... I bleed carnelian but c'mon guys.

You're ignoring that lucrative professional lacrosse contract that he'll land after his college years. Who needs "Boola boola" when you've got the moola moola? ::demented::

[Al DeFlorio]

Sorry to clutter your thinking with facts but let's look at what's happened since you bellyached after Yale's 2013 NCAA hockey championship.  In the five seasons since, Yale's record's been 82-60-20 while Cornell's was 90-50-25.  In the two season's since the last members of Yale's championship team graduated in 2016, Yale's gone 28-30-6, while Cornell's been 46-15-7.

Some recruiting bonanza for Yale, huh?  I think you just have a hyperactive envy gene.

[Jim Hyla]

Sorry to clutter your thinking with facts but let's look at what's happened since you bellyached after Yale's 2013 NCAA hockey championship.  In the five seasons since, Yale's record's been 82-60-20 while Cornell's was 90-50-25.  In the two season's since the last members of Yale's championship team graduated in 2016, Yale's gone 28-30-6, while Cornell's been 46-15-7.

Some recruiting bonanza for Yale, huh?  I think you just have a hyperactive envy gene.

Thanks for posting this Al. In the offseason I'm not as regular on eLynah, but as I was reading this thread I had the same thought about Yale being a "national power". Yale hit gold that year, but they wen't even a national power then. It was a series of very fortunate events that allowed a very good team to win. Everyone expected them to continue, but as you point out, they basically became an also ran after that.

[Trotsky]

Yale hit gold that year, but they wen't even a national power then. It was a series of very fortunate events that allowed a very good team to win. Everyone expected them to continue, but as you point out, they basically became an also ran after that.

The ironic thing is Yale actually did have a title-level dominant team the prior few years but always potted out.  Then they backed into the Show with their weakest team and everything just happened to go their way.

This as opposed to U who made the most of the best chance they'll ever have.  And Q who had two very, very good looks but just ran out of gas.

Just.  Get.  In.  If we can get in 16 more times in my lifetime I'll get to see one title.

[marty]

Yale hit gold that year, but they wen't even a national power then. It was a series of very fortunate events that allowed a very good team to win. Everyone expected them to continue, but as you point out, they basically became an also ran after that.

The ironic thing is Yale actually did have a title-level dominant team the prior few years but always potted out.  Then they backed into the Show with their weakest team and everything just happened to go their way.

This as opposed to U who made the most of the best chance they'll ever have.  And Q who had two very, very good looks but just ran out of gas.

Just.  Get.  In.  If we can get in 16 more times in my lifetime I'll get to see one title.

At the time I thought that Yale's secret weapon was Keith Allain. Now, not so much.

[Swampy]

Yale hit gold that year, but they wen't even a national power then. It was a series of very fortunate events that allowed a very good team to win. Everyone expected them to continue, but as you point out, they basically became an also ran after that.

The ironic thing is Yale actually did have a title-level dominant team the prior few years but always potted out.  Then they backed into the Show with their weakest team and everything just happened to go their way.

This as opposed to U who made the most of the best chance they'll ever have.  And Q who had two very, very good looks but just ran out of gas.

Just.  Get.  In.  If we can get in 16 more times in my lifetime I'll get to see one title.

At the time I thought that Yale's secret weapon was Keith Allain. Now, not so much.

Interesting point. Remarkably, Cornell continually sits at or near the top in hockey and lacrosse, although of course we have down periods, esp. when we have such exogenous things as hockey's reconstruction when MS decided we needed to be faster & more skilled even if this means smaller or the "Noel Holes" caused by firing Deluca & then Kerwit's "resignation." We haven't won any brass rings in a long time, but I think in this century we've had teams in both hockey & lacrosse capable of winning a NC. We've had shitty luck in both.

To win a NC, you have to get to the Final 4. At that point, all teams are excellent. There have been teams that regularly make it in hockey, but I don't remember any that either win or place year after year. Ditto for lacrosse. MD has been getting there, but only won it last year for the first time in ages. The days when 1-2 dominant teams (e.g., BU & Cornell in hockey) take turns are over. Duke in lacrosse may be the closest to a exception.

With the Ivy League's expanded "need-based" financial aid, the recruiting gap against athletic-scholarship schools in both sports has narrowed, although HYP's larger endowments give them an advantage over the rest of the Ivies and adds to their already considerable "prestige" advantages. We're very lucky that Harvard has had coaches who can recruit but not use to full advantage the talent they attract.

Remember, we handily beat Yale in lacrosse this year. I know Yale fans think the fact that Cornell & Yale split their two games shows the teams were more or less equal and Yale did not play up to its potential in the ILT, but I think Cornell's coaches took a rather disorganized team at the start of the season and turned it into a top-4 power with a big asterisk. The asterisk is that the team is vulnerable to SOT. If they fix this for next year and rebuild the defense, we should be the favorite to win the Ivies. If we win the Ierlan lottery, we have as good a shot or better at winning the NC as anyone.

Let's hope Andy Shay follows in Keith Allain's footsteps.

[Trotsky]

To win a NC, you have to get to the Final 4. At that point, all teams are excellent. There have been teams that regularly make it in hockey, but I don't remember any that either win or place year after year.

BC had a GREAT run.  Win or place in 98, 00, 01, 06, 07, 08, 10, 12.  8 finals in 15 seasons, with 4 titles.

UMD just did it back-to-back.  Minny and Denver won back-to-back titles this century.  Q placed twice in 4 years.  Wisco 2 finals in 5 years,

That's it for this century.

[margolism]

TD going to Yale

[George64]

TD going to Yale

Daily Messenger article