illegal ticket sale on ebay

[ftyuv]

I believe GWB and his unary executive theory have made it clear that activist judges should have no role in interpreting laws or the constitution.

So unless Bush signs an order to send the scalper to Gitmo, the sale is as legal as, say, the surveillance by which Bush would have heard about it.

[ftyuv]

Ken '70:  I'm no lawyer, but it seems to me that the problem with your analysis is that it simply doesn't apply with respect to Cornell taking any action.  They can -- and it's written in plain English on the back of the tickets -- take away your ticket for any reason they want.  So if they don't like this ebay dude scalping, they have the right to ask eBay to cancel the sale -- and I don't know of any reason for eBay to not be within their rights to do so -- and revoke the season tickets (though I don't know how they'd enforce that).

So even if the scalping law is bogus, it seems to me that Cornell has the right to protect its tickets' artificially low prices by responding to scalpers, and it furthermore seems within the public's rights to ask Cornell to do so, whether or not you agree that it's a right we should exercise.

Oh, and also, I believe the scalping law is actually New York State's, not the Federal's.  And pointing again to that famous document, precisely because the Federal government does *not* have jurisdiction here, as you point out, the Tenth Amendment gives that jurisdiction to NYS.

[ugarte]

[quote Ken '70]No, we don't get to decide.  The Constitution decides.  It's a plain language document.  The powers of the Federal government are enumerated in article 1 section 8.  Go here to refesh your memory http://www.law.cornell.edu/constitution/constitution.articlei.html#section8

The Bill of Rights specifically and unambigously limits government power to those enumerated.  The 14th amendment extends those individual rights to protection from the States as well as the Feds.[/quote]So you are both an originalist and a fan of incorporation theory? Don't see too many of those. I think most constitutional scholars would agree that (a) the Feds have the right to regulate interstate commerce (I, 8, iii), so to the extent that the sales are done interstate OR there is a national market for the goods (Wickard v. Filburn, Gonzalez v. Raich) scalping laws would be ok, but more relevant here, (b) it is well within the police power of state governments to establish contract law for transactions within its borders (Am. X).


Feel free to despise the economic theory behind ticket scalping law but please don't drag the Constitution through the mud in the process.

[Beeeej]

[quote ugarte][quote Ken '70]No, we don't get to decide.  The Constitution decides.  It's a plain language document.  The powers of the Federal government are enumerated in article 1 section 8.  Go here to refesh your memory http://www.law.cornell.edu/constitution/constitution.articlei.html#section8

The Bill of Rights specifically and unambigously limits government power to those enumerated.  The 14th amendment extends those individual rights to protection from the States as well as the Feds.[/quote]So you are both an originalist and a fan of incorporation theory? Don't see too many of those. I think most constitutional scholars would agree that (a) the Feds have the right to regulate interstate commerce, so to the extent that the sales are done interstate OR there is a market that extends beyond state lines scalping laws would be ok, but more relevant here, (b) it is well within the police power of state governments to establish contract law for transactions within its borders.

Feel free to despise the economic theory behind ticket scalping law but please don't drag the Constitution through the mud in the process.[/quote]

Plus, see Lochner v. New York and its (ugh) "progeny" for why completely unrestrained freedom of contract is not always a swell idea, constitutionality aside.  If you can privately negotiate a $1/day wage and a 90-hour work week with someone, who should be able to tell you that you're not allowed?  The unemployment rate is a market force, too.  Aren't all market forces good?

Beeeej

[Oat]

I am not being sarcastic. I agree with krose. By talking about it, I think we're helping the seller by drawing more attention to this auction.

[Beeeej]

[quote Oat]I am not being sarcastic. I agree with krose. By talking about it, I think we're helping the seller by drawing more attention to this auction.[/quote]

Well, that ship has pretty much sailed.  But you could always fight fire with fire by starting a dummy account and bidding up the price to where nobody will outbid you, then not pay.  Though I would certainly never advise such a thing.

Beeeej

[Oat]

[quote Beeeej][quote Oat]I am not being sarcastic. I agree with krose. By talking about it, I think we're helping the seller by drawing more attention to this auction.[/quote]

Well, that ship has pretty much sailed.  But you could always fight fire with fire by starting a dummy account and bidding up the price to where nobody will outbid you, then not pay.  Though I would certainly never advise such a thing.

Beeeej[/quote]

HAHAHAHA!!! Beeeej's logic is UNDENIABLE!!!   ::laugh::

Although.. remember guys, he would certainly never advise such a thing, especially on the internet.

[Free11Skier]

ELynah: the only college hockey forum where users cite Supreme Court cases on a regular basis.

(I love this school :-))

[KenP]

Sorry, but I'm opposed to selling tickets at "market" price.  Hockey tickets are subsidized by the school.  Remember, most undergrads aren't exactly rolling in dough.  Also remember, we're in an institute that believes in amateurism to the point of not offering athletic scholarships.  If you start letting people scalp tickets to a hockey game, the base price will rise to even more unrealistic levels and be unattainable except for the richest fans, student or townie.

Maybe I'm still an idealist, but I believe in the concept of community.  And in this case that means only buying hockey tickets if you intend to be a hockey fan, and looking out for your neighbor by not selling tickets specifically for profit.

[anon]

Look, I'm as big a fan of capitalism as the next guy but I think an institution has a right to set ticket prices at whatever level they deem appropriate to guarantee an audience composition of their liking and they deserve some help from the government to achieve their goal.  If were talking about the New York Yankees with 81 homes games in a 55,000 seat stadium I'd be less inclined to rally to the support of Steinbrenner's revenue or his fans ability to pay.  Cornell is a non-profit entity and while hockey is the only real revenue generating sport the school has decided to sacrifice some income for the good of the students.  Broadway theaters often offer last minute tickets at the box office (I'm not talking about the half price TKTS booth in the middle of Times Square) for very low prices.  These tickets are often referred to as "student rush" which I always assumed meant the theaters were trying to put tickets in the hands of people with less money.  Or take the free Shakespeare in Central Park.  Do you think it right for someone to get a free ticket and then sell them it on Craigslist for $50 an hour later?  Is it ok because Time Warner is underwriting the event so the Public Theatre isn't deprived of anything?  If unbridled capitalism is the end game then why doesn't Cornell do away with student and non-student sections and simply hold a dutch auctio for all seats?

And Kyle I disagree that this makes more tickets available.  In this particular ebay sale the seller has zero previous sales of any kind - at least under this user name.  As he or she has provided us with the section and row number only - Sec. G, row 10 - and no seat number it is clear they are doing everything they can to not get caught.  I suspect that this person is trying to recoup as much of the cost of the season ticket package as possible.  If he or she succeeds, what incentive do they have to sell their tickets to lesser games like Quinnipiac or RIT?  Are we to believe that this person has made it to every home game thus far, even the ones over break, and can't make it to the Harvard game?  Call me skeptical.

[anon]

You all do realize that this auction is from out of state?  Here is the tagline from the auction:

New York residents: New York state law limits the resale ticket price for this event location, so your maximum bid cannot exceed $145.00.


Here is a tagline from another auction that resides in NYS:

Bidders: New York state law limits the resale ticket price for this event location.
This means that bidding will end when the price reaches $577.10. See eBay's ticket policy.


Notice the first only applies to NYS residents.  That's because the seller's billing address is in another state so eBay doesn't have to enforce a NYS law unless the other party is located in NYS.  They're not going to stop this auction because as far as they know this guy is located out of state.

[original poster]

The auction clearly says that the item is in Ithaca, NY and the only delivery option is local pickup.

[Beeeej]

Anybody else finding it impossible to actually file a report with eBay?  "Report a violation" links that lead nowhere, forms with only one field that return a "You haven't filled out all the fields" error message, etc.?

What a fabulous self-policing system.

Beeeej

[DeltaOne81]

[quote Beeeej]Anybody else finding it impossible to actually file a report with eBay?  "Report a violation" links that lead nowhere, forms with only one field that return a "You haven't filled out all the fields" error message, etc.?

What a fabulous self-policing system.

Beeeej[/quote]

http://pages.ebay.com/help/policies/event-tickets.html

"Report Listing Violations" at the bottom.

[Beeeej]

[quote DeltaOne81][quote Beeeej]Anybody else finding it impossible to actually file a report with eBay?  "Report a violation" links that lead nowhere, forms with only one field that return a "You haven't filled out all the fields" error message, etc.?

What a fabulous self-policing system.

Beeeej[/quote]

http://pages.ebay.com/help/policies/event-tickets.html

"Report Listing Violations" at the bottom.[/quote]

That points me to a very helpful form which, after I enter the item number and press "Send," tells me, "There was an error in your input. Please go back and ensure that all fields are properly filled in."

If you are able to obtain a different result, I hope you're actually reporting the auction in question (item 6602432109).

Beeeej