Lynah now at full capacity

[ugarte]

love 3x3 sorry! (do not love 55% but would probably be fine if we could negotiate this to, say, 70%)

[Al DeFlorio]

You go 3x3 to try and remove most of the ties.. no different than soccer deciding that a play at midfield wouldnt even be worthy of a card but in the penalty area is worth a PK that often decides a game. Some things are dumb in all sports. They could also go 5x5 for 5 min then 4x4 for 5 min then 3x3 or something..   But if you create a rule that makes a winner you shouldnt be giving them the same 2 pts but devaluing it in other places. If thats the case then they should be going to 3-2-1 win/Ot/Tie or something.

You should remove the tie by playing the same game with the same rules that resulted in the tie, not some bastardized version of it.  If the tie stands up, so what?  It's the fair outcome.  2/1/0 still the best.

Sudden death is not playing by the same rules, though. Should it be like soccer where you play the full extra period?

Read the NCAA overtime rules for soccer:  Two ten-minute SUDDEN DEATH periods.  In a game where goals are scarce as hen's teeth, like hockey and soccer, sudden death is appropriate.  In lacrosse, where twenty-plus goals per game are the norm, it isn't.

[Dafatone]

You go 3x3 to try and remove most of the ties.. no different than soccer deciding that a play at midfield wouldnt even be worthy of a card but in the penalty area is worth a PK that often decides a game. Some things are dumb in all sports. They could also go 5x5 for 5 min then 4x4 for 5 min then 3x3 or something..   But if you create a rule that makes a winner you shouldnt be giving them the same 2 pts but devaluing it in other places. If thats the case then they should be going to 3-2-1 win/Ot/Tie or something.

You should remove the tie by playing the same game with the same rules that resulted in the tie, not some bastardized version of it.  If the tie stands up, so what?  It's the fair outcome.  2/1/0 still the best.

Sudden death is not playing by the same rules, though. Should it be like soccer where you play the full extra period?

I wouldn't mind 3v3 whole period as much as 3v3 sudden death. And I like sudden death. But it's too random in 3v3.

[jtwcornell91]

What does it count as for RPI? The pairwise is practically just RPI with the occasional wrinkle. Looks like a tie to me, or maybe the same 55% stuff.

Good fodder for JTW's students, but not so much for my vintage brain.

[marty]

Did Samuel Beckett dream this nonsense up?  Just play a five skaters on a side, sudden death overtime for ten minutes, and you either get a deserving winner or a deserved tie.  No gimmicks.  Just real hockey. Worked fine for a lot of years.  And everybody understood it.

Agreed!

After a few more hours of watching ESPN+ and listening to Grady quote Coach as saying if 3x3 is so wonderful then why not use it in the post season... it finally occurred to me that no one will be going into the post season with any 5x5 sudden death experience.  Ugh!

[Scersk '97]

love 3x3 sorry! (do not love 55% but would probably be fine if we could negotiate this to, say, 70%)

Disagree. It's dumb and anti-climactic.

How much better would it have been to have 5x4 for overtime tonight and 100% of a win instead of 55% of a tie?

I could get on board with 4x4, five minutes, no sudden death.

[arugula]

Attended tonight.  First game together at Lynah with my freshman daughter. Big night. We mostly controlled action but typically cannot finish. Question-is there a return to Alaska?  The university would not possibly allow that unless it was in January. These trips UA makes are anathema to a so-called education. Actually a bit disappointed we participated in that. They've been on the road 4,000 miles-away from home for like 3 weeks. Nuts.

[scoop85]

Attended tonight.  First game together at Lynah with my freshman daughter. Big night. We mostly controlled action but typically cannot finish. Question-is there a return to Alaska?  The university would not possibly allow that unless it was in January. These trips UA makes are anathema to a so-called education. Actually a bit disappointed we participated in that. They've been on the road 4,000 miles-away from home for like 3 weeks. Nuts.

Maybe not as big a deal these days with Zoom and the like.

[CU2007]

Attended tonight.  First game together at Lynah with my freshman daughter. Big night. We mostly controlled action but typically cannot finish. Question-is there a return to Alaska?  The university would not possibly allow that unless it was in January. These trips UA makes are anathema to a so-called education. Actually a bit disappointed we participated in that. They've been on the road 4,000 miles-away from home for like 3 weeks. Nuts.

Maybe not as big a deal these days with Zoom and the like.

Exactly. Hard to say when half the schools in America charged full tuition for a year of online college

[jtwcornell91]

love 3x3 sorry! (do not love 55% but would probably be fine if we could negotiate this to, say, 70%)

I've just barely got used to the 3-2-1-0 point system in international/European hockey, but accepting an OT win as 55% of a win is a lot harder than 2/3 of a win.  (I'd be reasonably happy with a 5-4-3-2-1-0 system where you lost a point for going to OT, and the shootout after a tie counted for 1/4 as much as the rest of the game.)

[ugarte]

i just like watching firewagon hockey. it's fun. i don't want the whole game to be open ice but it's a wild way to finish and really hard to keep scoreless.

feel getting a pair of OT wins against UAF is going to be bad in the long run for COpp but maybe they are good and will sting enough teams with Ls. (annoyingly, Clarkson went 3-1)

[Swampy]

love 3x3 sorry! (do not love 55% but would probably be fine if we could negotiate this to, say, 70%)

I've just barely got used to the 3-2-1-0 point system in international/European hockey, but accepting an OT win as 55% of a win is a lot harder than 2/3 of a win.  (I'd be reasonably happy with a 5-4-3-2-1-0 system where you lost a point for going to OT, and the shootout after a tie counted for 1/4 as much as the rest of the game.)

+1

[Swampy]

IIRC, a few years ago we played Wisconsin to triple OT in the NCAA semifinals. Remembering this I'm torn.

Of course it was a single elimination game, so the in-season scenario did not apply. But had the game been in-season, I'd want to reward both teams for such a heroic show, OTOH, I'd @lso want to make the stakes high.

[Weder]

You go 3x3 to try and remove most of the ties.. no different than soccer deciding that a play at midfield wouldnt even be worthy of a card but in the penalty area is worth a PK that often decides a game. Some things are dumb in all sports. They could also go 5x5 for 5 min then 4x4 for 5 min then 3x3 or something..   But if you create a rule that makes a winner you shouldnt be giving them the same 2 pts but devaluing it in other places. If thats the case then they should be going to 3-2-1 win/Ot/Tie or something.

You should remove the tie by playing the same game with the same rules that resulted in the tie, not some bastardized version of it.  If the tie stands up, so what?  It's the fair outcome.  2/1/0 still the best.

Sudden death is not playing by the same rules, though. Should it be like soccer where you play the full extra period?

Read the NCAA overtime rules for soccer:  Two ten-minute SUDDEN DEATH periods.  In a game where goals are scarce as hen's teeth, like hockey and soccer, sudden death is appropriate.  In lacrosse, where twenty-plus goals per game are the norm, it isn't.

Ah, I don't really follow college soccer and didn't realize OT was sudden death.

[nshapiro]

love 3x3 sorry! (do not love 55% but would probably be fine if we could negotiate this to, say, 70%)

I've just barely got used to the 3-2-1-0 point system in international/European hockey, but accepting an OT win as 55% of a win is a lot harder than 2/3 of a win.  (I'd be reasonably happy with a 5-4-3-2-1-0 system where you lost a point for going to OT, and the shootout after a tie counted for 1/4 as much as the rest of the game.)

+1

This was discussed 5 years ago. Depressing that college hockey has followed the poor implementation of the NHL

http://elf.elynah.com/read.php?1,199648,203620#msg-203620

I am ok with the shootout, but the effect should be de-emphasized, especially the creation of the extra point in the standings.

Each game should be worth 5 points -
5 - regulation win
4 - overtime win
3 - shootout win
2 - shootout loss
1 - overtime loss
0 - regulation loss

http://elf.elynah.com/read.php?1,199648,203620#msg-203620
No.  No, no, no, no, no.  No.

The ECAC does this one thing exactly right, and everyone from mites to the NHL should adopt it and then leave it alone forever.

I agree with Greg, and the biggest thing that has bugged me about the NHL system is that each game should have the same total point value.  Is winning one game in overtime and losing another in overtime really 50% better than a 3 period win and a 3 period loss?   Now that the NHL has gone to the exciting but gimmicky 3 on 3 overtime, at least I'd like to see a 3-2-1-0 point value for NHL games, with the 2-1 covering both overtimes and shootouts. In effect then, an o't or shootout win would only be worth 1.33x what it was worth in the old system where teams divided 2 points.

The non-constant point value is a horrible feature of the OT rules and has been since the beginning. Neil and/or Jeff's suggestions would at least eliminate this quirk. But getting rid of the OT gimmicks is really the answer.

I've also never liked the idea of playing with a different rule set in OT than used in the rest of the game.  Adding gimmicky rules in special situations to add "excitement" just diminishes the game.  If OT with fewer than five skaters per side is a good idea then why not use it in the playoffs too?

For the same reason that we don't use 20 minute overtimes in the regular season: it's just different.

In addition, teams have a reason to try to play for a tie in the regular season. Having 10 skaters on the ice allows a team playing for the tie to completely clamp down and clog everything. This is bad from an entertainment perspective and from a perspective that argues we want teams to play for the win.

Contrastingly, neither team plays for a tie in the postseason (obviously), and thus 5-on-5 isn't a hinderance.

Turn on Caps-Penguins for OT right now: both teams are going to be flying up and down. That will not happen in the ECAC (unless you get a situation like Harvard-Cornell a couple years ago where both teams really want the win and have nothing to lose)