Basketball 2014-15

Al DeFlorio · February 01, 2015, 04:21:57 PM

Quote from: CASDonahue had winning Ivy records his last 6 years at Cornell, going a combined 63-21. Courtney is currently 21-39 in the Ivies.

As has been said several times in this thread, he was gifted three All-Ivy players for those last four years. Prior to that he was ordinary at best. Let's stop lionizing him. His first five years Donahue was 23-47 in the Ivies.

semsox · February 01, 2015, 05:03:11 PM

Quote from: Al DeFlorio
Quote from: CASDonahue had winning Ivy records his last 6 years at Cornell, going a combined 63-21. Courtney is currently 21-39 in the Ivies.
As has been said several times in this thread, he was gifted three All-Ivy players for those last four years. Prior to that he was ordinary at best. Let's stop lionizing him. His first five years Donahue was 23-47 in the Ivies.

Fairly or unfairly, context matters, and Courtney has put up his first 5 years in the wake of the most successful run in Cornell basketball history, coming off of a Sweet 16. Now if you think it's fair to do a direct apples-to-apples comparison between Bill and Steve's first several years, be my guest.

The truth is that in the wake of that success, with our basketball profile as high as we're likely to see, and having used that profile to recruit several players that are much more athletically gifted than Wittman/Dale/Foote were, we're topping out at .500 in the Ivies with a senior-laden team. The defense has been there this year, but the offense, as it has been for the duration of BC's tenure, is simply not competitive in today's college basketball landscape.

Al DeFlorio · February 01, 2015, 05:35:24 PM

Quote from: semsox
Quote from: Al DeFlorioAs has been said several times in this thread, he was gifted three All-Ivy players for those last four years. Prior to that he was ordinary at best. Let's stop lionizing him. His first five years Donahue was 23-47 in the Ivies.

Fairly or unfairly, context matters, and Courtney has put up his first 5 years in the wake of the most successful run in Cornell basketball history, coming off of a Sweet 16. Now if you think it's fair to do a direct apples-to-apples comparison between Bill and Steve's first several years, be my guest.

The truth is that in the wake of that success, with our basketball profile as high as we're likely to see, and having used that profile to recruit several players that are much more athletically gifted than Wittman/Dale/Foote were, we're topping out at .500 in the Ivies with a senior-laden team. The defense has been there this year, but the offense, as it has been for the duration of BC's tenure, is simply not competitive in today's college basketball landscape.

Oh, please. Four of Donahue's starters graduated, leaving only Wroblewski. And don't make me laugh by saying recruits were more gifted than Dale, Wittman, and Foote.

My point is that Donahue was an ordinary coach until three extraordinary players found their way to Cornell with minimum effort from him. One even had to personally mail a tape of his high school playing. I'm not comparing Courtney to Donahue. I'm saying Donahue was ordinary until three terrific Ivy-level players found their way to his team. "Be my guest" if you want to disagree, but Donahue was nothing special until they arrived. And I agree Courtney is not a good half-court coach. Neither was--or is--Donahue.

ugarte · February 06, 2015, 10:27:44 PM

Tough loss to Penn.

I didn't see the game but I was following the live stats. We had an 8 point lead at the half, 5 point lead with around 1:44 left IIRC. Penn hit a 3 to take its first lead in forever with around 40 seconds left, we tied it with a free throw (after missing one - a real problem as we went 1 for 2 on a bunch of late Penn fouls), and Penn hit the game winning jumper with 4 seconds left.

Booooo.

ithacat · February 06, 2015, 11:13:13 PM

That pretty much sums up the Courtney era: crumbling in crunch time.

ugarte · February 07, 2015, 12:03:16 AM

Quote from: ithacatThat pretty much sums up the Courtney era: crumbling in crunch time.

Even without watching I'm not sure this one's on Courtney. Penn kept fouling and we kept going 1 for 2 from the line when we could have put the game away. That game was lost at the stripe not on the whiteboard.

ithacat · February 07, 2015, 08:06:24 AM

They may not all be on Coutney, but it doesn't change the fact that one of the calling cards of his teams is folding under pressure.

ugarte · February 07, 2015, 11:09:57 PM

Quote from: ithacatThey may not all be on Coutney, but it doesn't change the fact that one of the calling cards of his teams is folding under pressure.

OK

Robb · February 08, 2015, 12:31:29 AM

Quote from: ugarte
Quote from: ithacatThey may not all be on Coutney, but it doesn't change the fact that one of the calling cards of his teams is folding under pressure.
OK

Why are you bringing up weather in a discussion about climate?

ugarte · February 08, 2015, 12:48:18 AM

Quote from: Robb
Quote from: ugarte
Quote from: ithacatThey may not all be on Coutney, but it doesn't change the fact that one of the calling cards of his teams is folding under pressure.
OK
Why are you bringing up weather in a discussion about climate?

lol

billhoward · February 08, 2015, 09:14:55 PM

Skimming the final scores, a quick tally shows Cornell has yet to win a game where the margin was 5 or less. If we split those, we'd be 14-8.

Cornell losing margins after Penn/Princeton Feb. 6-7. Lost by:
0 (tied end regulation, lost by 7 OT)
1
2 twice
3
5
8
>10 four times

Cornell winning margins. Won by:
6
7
8 three times
10 twice
>10 four times

Maybe there's a solid reason like Cornell doesn't have the bench depth of opponents.

CAS · February 21, 2015, 11:28:43 AM

Last nite our 3 senior starters combined for all but 6 of Cornell's points in a 62-51 loss to Yale.

ithacat · February 21, 2015, 08:28:48 PM

Another Courtney collapse. I'm shocked.

billhoward · February 21, 2015, 10:31:59 PM

Quote from: ithacatAnother Courtney collapse. I'm shocked.

Brown 57, Cornell 56 on a shot with 2 seconds to play. Cornell led the game for 39:28 of the 40 minutes. Leaving Cornell at, I believe, either just one or two games won where the margin of victory was 5 points or less, or it went to OT.

ithacat · February 22, 2015, 08:02:21 AM

Quote from: billhoward
Quote from: ithacatAnother Courtney collapse. I'm shocked.
Brown 57, Cornell 56 on a shot with 2 seconds to play. Cornell led the game for 39:28 of the 40 minutes. Leaving Cornell at, I believe, either just one or two games won where the margin of victory was 5 points or less, or it went to OT.

11 point lead at the half. 17 point lead in the second half...this isn't the only time this season, and this isn't the only season of it either. Penn State, Drexel, Penn come to mind this season.

I feel bad for Courtney. He seems like a good guy and he has brought in better athletes than program has probably ever had. I just wish he could coach them.