Cornell @ Clark

[BearLover]

Honestly, they just suck.  Almost no one on the entire team can contribute on both ends of the ice.  Throw in a subpar year from Iles and idiotic penalties and it's not surprising they're at the bottom of the ECAC.  I wouldn't be surprised if Ferlin and Lowry bolt after this season.

Everyone this year is having a bad year except for Bardreau until he got hurt with a neck fracture. I dont think Ferlin or Lowery will leave after a season like that because all it would do is show the professional leagues that they are quitters when things on the ice get tough. Its a very bad look and no one wants to keep quitters. Matteau from last year is a perfect example.

The NHL doesn't look at it that way.  A bunch of LSU football players left for the NFL after a terrible loss in their bowl game this year.  Are they quitters?  Was Riley Nash a quitter when he left after a disappointing tournament exit his junior year?  Hopefully Ferlin and Lowry feel enough of an obligation toward their teammates to stick around, but a horrific season like this one is not going to help their chances of staying.

[scoop85]

I thought it seemed like a panic-driven move to bench so many of our key guys for the Brown game after we lost in OT to a very good Yale team, and had played two reasonably solid periods to boot. I wonder how, if at all, that has affected the locker room.

[css228]

I thought it seemed like a panic-driven move to bench so many of our key guys for the Brown game after we lost in OT to a very good Yale team, and had played two reasonably solid periods to boot. I wonder how, if at all, that has affected the locker room.

I thought it was a good idea to bench guys, I'm just not sure those are the guys I  would have chosen to bench (I think repeat offenders of stupidity should get a priority ticket to ride the pine over guys like Lowry).

[Trotsky]

I thought it seemed like a panic-driven move to bench so many of our key guys for the Brown game after we lost in OT to a very good Yale team, and had played two reasonably solid periods to boot. I wonder how, if at all, that has affected the locker room.

There is no way we can know the temperature in the locker-room.  Schafer is not Mark Morris -- the benching of so much talent was a radical step for a coach who prides his staff on resolving these issues during the week and not during games.  It seems to strongly hint that some players had started to think of themselves as unique little snowflakes, and that won't fly in any locker-room.

I firmly believe 95% of these "intractable" problems will suddenly and magically resolve themselves if they put a couple wins together.  We're dealing with 20-year old boys here; it aint Aeschylus.

[Jim Hyla]

I realize that any kind of criticism constructive or not, opinions or not, if it's about Iles, they are forbidden by some on here.
However, the facts are what they are - stats not just "selected" by conference but rather overall and includes the progression year over year.
Iles was and in my opinon still is over-rated.  He is a good, average goalie.  It is when your goalie can CONSISTENTLY demonstrate his true value, whether PK situations, weak defense extra quality shots with quality saves is he a superstar, GREAT goalie.. sorry Iles has not been that.  As far as Gillam you are right, he saw what happened to Marozzi and probably decided that was not in his best interest for continued development.  In fact,
in his recruitment article, he said he was told that he actually may be arriving on the Hill this season in case Iles was going PRO.  I think Gillam would have come to "start" as a backup as long as like any other good quality goalie, he would see SOME game time with legitimate healthy competition - and I dont believe Marozzi would have left either if he wasnt stapled to the bench.  Again, a team legitimately aspiring to win the Championship this year, you should have a good, quality backup .. Look at Washington Capitals last year.

I put up some facts, you don't like my conclusion. OK, but what are the facts that you are talking about? I used ECAC results, as it seems to be a more accurate way to compare. You don't like that, present your own facts. Don't just say mine are "selected", as if I used them in an odd way. Comparing goalies year to year, especially over decades, is difficult at best. I'd hope that everyone, well that's probably too strong a hope, would agree that we are no longer playing the same tight defensive style that was present 5-10 years ago. That can change stats. And many of those Hobey goalies we had flamed out in the pros. Maybe part of their sucess was "It's the system".

I've never said that Iles was a great goalie, very good, yes. My point was, and is, that the problem this year is not his fault. If you think you're going to pick up a goalie who will do just as well on the PK as 5 on 5, well good luck in finding them. If they exist, and I've never seen those stats anywhere, they must be few and far between.

No, we have a team problem this year, not a goalie problem. If we had played smarter, we could have held onto some of our leads, and had a lot better GA without all the dumb penalties that we took. I think the stats show that. You can disbelieve if you want, but I'd like to see your stats.

In regards to Gillam, I guess you agree with me that maybe it was his decision to not come this year. It's not like coach could just call him up and say come, and he'd do it.

[dag14]

I agree; if the team loses games, it probably isn't the goaltender's fault.  And I don't think there is a statistic that can show otherwise because so many of the stats that appear to measure a goaltender's performance in fact measure team defense.  Goals aganist average measures the goals scored when the goaltender was in net but does not differentiate between those that might have been his or her fault or those that might belong to someone else on the team.  Saves percentage measures the number of shots-on-goal that are stopped v. let in the net without any parsing as to how a particular shot came to be rocketing toward the goaltender.  Was it an odd man rush or break away because a skater missed his/her assignment up ice or was it caused by a goaltender out of position?

The goaltender is the sixth person on the ice and his or her performance is a component of a team's performance.  Cornell men's ice hockey -- as a team -- is not performing very well right now.  There are too many persons on the roster who have played in these games to blame any individuals for where they sit in the standings.  Every member of the team who has seen ice time bears some responsibility and I suspect that they all realize it.

As fans we may ring our hands and lament the premature end to the season.  But these guys are living it.  Don't think for a minute they are content with where they are, or willing to throw in the towel.  Maybe the fans should back off a little.

[jftf1958]

My point is that a goalie's performance is based on his play - meaning overall, not just the conference as his job is to stop that puck regardless of who the opponents are.
I am not referencing goalies from 5 - 10 years ago either.  Iles has been averaging 27 - 28 shots per game/yearly.
The basis of my comments are on the fact that Iles has been rated highly therefore the expectation with experience is that year over year he would produce solid numbers and increased performance %   - that has not happened.  I also stated that the overall accountablity is not with just the goalie postion, I believe it is with the coaching staff, but at the same time, the goalie position is probably (in my opinion) the most important position.    
In terms of :  i]"In regards to Gillam, I guess you agree with me that maybe it was his decision to not come this year. It's not like coach could just call him up and say come, and he'd do it"[/i]  I agree with you that he probably decided not to come given the circumstances - but I disagree that the coach could not just call him up as he could if he would have probably said " I will give you a chance to play and develop and compete for the #1 job."   If Gillam isnt willing to compete for the playing time, then its time to go look for another goalie.  You cannot assess a goalie's playing time  just from practicing at least not good decent talent coming in, nor, is it wise to shelf the backup and if you need him in the final championship game of the year- you are screwed.

[Jim Hyla]

My point is that a goalie's performance is based on his play - meaning overall, not just the conference as his job is to stop that puck regardless of who the opponents are.
I am not referencing goalies from 5 - 10 years ago either.  Iles has been averaging 27 - 28 shots per game/yearly.
The basis of my comments are on the fact that Iles has been rated highly therefore the expectation with experience is that year over year he would produce solid numbers and increased performance %   - that has not happened.  I also stated that the overall accountablity is not with just the goalie postion, I believe it is with the coaching staff, but at the same time, the goalie position is probably (in my opinion) the most important position.    
In terms of :  i]"In regards to Gillam, I guess you agree with me that maybe it was his decision to not come this year. It's not like coach could just call him up and say come, and he'd do it"[/i]  I agree with you that he probably decided not to come given the circumstances - but I disagree that the coach could not just call him up as he could if he would have probably said " I will give you a chance to play and develop and compete for the #1 job."   If Gillam isnt willing to compete for the playing time, then its time to go look for another goalie.  You cannot assess a goalie's playing time  just from practicing at least not good decent talent coming in, nor, is it wise to shelf the backup and if you need him in the final championship game of the year- you are screwed.

But when you're playing different teams each year, you certainly can't compare those, can you? And although you never showed any stats, I assume that you mean that Iles is worse this year than the last two, correct? If so I'd like to parse out the Pks etc. I know you don't feel that which teams we play, nor whether we are 5 on 5 or PK, should make any difference in a goalies performance, however I think the vast majority would disagree with you. A pitchers performance will depend upon which team he plays against, don't you agree?

I can't understand, at all, your comments on Gillam. They don't seem to be in English.

[Johnny 5]

As fans we may ring our hands and lament the premature end to the season.  But these guys are living it.  Don't think for a minute they are content with where they are, or willing to throw in the towel.  Maybe the fans should back off a little.

I'm sure many fans would be willing to "back off" if there appeared to be even the slightest change in the behavior that is the root of the problem.
Perhaps if they can avoid a DQ this weekend it will restore some faith.
However, I will not be holding my hand over my......

::bang::

[jftf1958]

My point is that a goalie's performance is based on his play - meaning overall, not just the conference as his job is to stop that puck regardless of who the opponents are.
I am not referencing goalies from 5 - 10 years ago either.  Iles has been averaging 27 - 28 shots per game/yearly.
The basis of my comments are on the fact that Iles has been rated highly therefore the expectation with experience is that year over year he would produce solid numbers and increased performance %   - that has not happened.  I also stated that the overall accountablity is not with just the goalie postion, I believe it is with the coaching staff, but at the same time, the goalie position is probably (in my opinion) the most important position.    
In terms of :  i]"In regards to Gillam, I guess you agree with me that maybe it was his decision to not come this year. It's not like coach could just call him up and say come, and he'd do it"[/i]  I agree with you that he probably decided not to come given the circumstances - but I disagree that the coach could not just call him up as he could if he would have probably said " I will give you a chance to play and develop and compete for the #1 job."   If Gillam isnt willing to compete for the playing time, then its time to go look for another goalie.  You cannot assess a goalie's playing time  just from practicing at least not good decent talent coming in, nor, is it wise to shelf the backup and if you need him in the final championship game of the year- you are screwed.

But when you're playing different teams each year, you certainly can't compare those, can you? And although you never showed any stats, I assume that you mean that Iles is worse this year than the last two, correct? If so I'd like to parse out the Pks etc. I know you don't feel that which teams we play, nor whether we are 5 on 5 or PK, should make any difference in a goalies performance, however I think the vast majority would disagree with you. A pitchers performance will depend upon which team he plays against, don't you agree?

I can't understand, at all, your comments on Gillam. They don't seem to be in English.

It is quite entertaining how, the moment Iles numbers are looking great, shut outs etc., then his stats are used for awards, and disappointments are expressed on how he would not get recognized for goaltender of the week etc.., if someone should dare share that his great numbers are a result of 'the system' - that individual is crucified.  When Iles numbers are NOT looking so great, then its all kinds of excuses, PK, teams he played against, 5 on 5 etc.etc... I am sure the NHL also shares these views that stats do not mean much if they look bad, but, if they are great, then it due to a highly ranked goalies.  
 
It also seems that while for Gillam to sit out one year is ok as it is to "adjust" but not two years.., yet that would not be the case with Iles' freshman year - Garman sat for two years ? hmmm Garman left, Marozzi left, Gillam will not come in...

I will ignore the fact that you do not understand my English...evidently, on this topic neither does Schaf.  Now, all these opinions aside, sincerely hope the boys turn this around. GO RED

[MattS]

As fans we may ring our hands and lament the premature end to the season.  But these guys are living it.  Don't think for a minute they are content with where they are, or willing to throw in the towel.  Maybe the fans should back off a little.

I'm sure many fans would be willing to "back off" if there appeared to be even the slightest change in the behavior that is the root of the problem.
Perhaps if they can avoid a DQ this weekend it will restore some faith.
However, I will not be holding my hand over my......

::bang::

I game without a major would be nice too.

[Trotsky]

The one incontestable fact is that losing 7 of 8 irritates everybody.

[ftyuv]

The one incontestable fact is that losing 7 of 8 irritates everybody.

The silver lining is that they seem to have finally found that consistency we've been after for years.

[RichH]

It is quite entertaining how, the moment Iles numbers are looking great, shut outs etc., then his stats are used for awards, and disappointments are expressed on how he would not get recognized for goaltender of the week etc.., if someone should dare share that his great numbers are a result of 'the system' - that individual is crucified.  When Iles numbers are NOT looking so great, then its all kinds of excuses, PK, teams he played against, 5 on 5 etc.etc... I am sure the NHL also shares these views that stats do not mean much if they look bad, but, if they are great, then it due to a highly ranked goalies.

For my entertainment, it's the occassional comment about how reasoned disagreement on an internet forum is tantamount to crucifixion.  I like coming here because it's open to honest criticism about all facets of our obsession.  Save for the occassional troll and gruff personalities one often finds online, it's all pretty respectful and on a geekery level of a passionate fandom I'm comfortable with.

Anyway, so what you're saying is "it's the system" when Iles has a good year or a bad year?  Or no?  I can't tell.

[nyc94]

The one incontestable fact is that losing 7 of 8 irritates everybody.

More fun facts from the ECAC blog on USCHO:

The Big Red are baffled by their first five-game losing streak since the fall of 1999, which was also the last time the program failed to finish at .500 in either league play or overall. The Ithacans are 1-8-0 in their last nine games, and 2-8-0 since the holiday break.