Why the hate/dislike of Cornell?

[TimV]

How about Klump's comment at the end of the ECAC blog today on USCHO? ::rolleyes::


Jason Klump:
Cornell fans can't win with class, as usual.  Chanting "winning team, losing team" as they point back and forth.

Gotta tell ya - I'm as rabid a Red fan as anyone here, but I didn't like it either, and I think that our later applause as Union was announced as runner up was probably unnoticed by simultaneously cheering Union (and other) fans.

The winning team/losing team thing is OK during regular season, but in a championship it's just shitty.  Some of those players were skating off the ice for the last time, and some parents were watching with tears in their eyes.  Maybe you have to be an athlete who takes off his jertsey for the last time to understand that feeling.  I wish we didn't do it.

Tradition is tradition. There was nothing wrong with what we did. We earned the victory, and we earned the right to celebrate. Should the hockey team not hoist the trophy and skate toward the glass? Should they not throw their gloves and sticks and helmets on the ice? Should they not pose for a team picture? Where do you draw the line -- it's okay to do "winning team/losing team" in all games except the championship? What about the semis? We stood and applauded Union in a sportsmanlike manner. I have no regrets and make no apologies about our conduct vis-a-vis "winning team/losing team".

So I take it you see no difference between hoisting the trophy, being joyful, and saluting your fans, which are all directed at teammates and supporters, as opposed to a taunt directed at the other side.  Really?

Jason Klump's reaction more accurately reflects the opinions of neutral observers who even more than our opponents are the object of the question about hate/dislike.  If something you do is traditionally obnoxious, it is indeed a tradition.  But it's still obnoxious non the less and generates hate and dislike.  Be arrogant, if that is your thing,  but the question posed in this thread does have certain answers that reasonable people can understand.

[TimV]

Tim
You should have been with us at the Crowne when we were waiting for the team after the game.
We cheered and congratulated every Union player as they returned. There were none of their
fans waiting for them.
Doug

I was going to comment on this as well. I'll just add the following:

As this was going on one Union fan (he was wearing a Union hockey windbreaker) who may well have been the father of a Union player (many of the Union players were arriving with their families) looked right at me as I was clapping, and said, "Classy guys. Very classy,", and patted me on the shoulder. He was definitely not being sarcastic at all. It was clear he really appreciated the fact that while we were obviously waiting there to greet and congratulate our own players, we were treating the Union players with respect.

I believe you.  And clearly you are deservedly proud of his reaction.  Why hide your light under a bushel?  Relatively few people witnessed the classiness displayed.  That other thing was put on display for the whole arena.  Think those few Union people present at the hotel will tell all the others at the arena and fix it all up?

[andyw2100]

Tim
You should have been with us at the Crowne when we were waiting for the team after the game.
We cheered and congratulated every Union player as they returned. There were none of their
fans waiting for them.
Doug

I was going to comment on this as well. I'll just add the following:

As this was going on one Union fan (he was wearing a Union hockey windbreaker) who may well have been the father of a Union player (many of the Union players were arriving with their families) looked right at me as I was clapping, and said, "Classy guys. Very classy,", and patted me on the shoulder. He was definitely not being sarcastic at all. It was clear he really appreciated the fact that while we were obviously waiting there to greet and congratulate our own players, we were treating the Union players with respect.

I believe you.  And clearly you are deservedly proud of his reaction.  Why hide your light under a bushel?  Relatively few people witnessed the classiness displayed.  That other thing was put on display for the whole arena.  Think those few Union people present at the hotel will tell all the others at the arena and fix it all up?

I don't think there's anything that needs fixing. I really don't think the majority of the Union fans are going to have their impression of Cornell fans influenced very much by whether or not we did "Winning Team / Losing Team" after the game.

I do think the players and their families who were applauded by the opposing teams' fans as they came back to their hotel will remember that a whole lot more than they remember "winning team / losing team", if they were even aware of it in the first place.

[A-ron]

Amen. It's sports and it's a cheer we do after every win...probably not the nicest thing to do when it's the final game for the opposing team but it's just excited fans yelling and cheering. I guess that next time we as fans want to win with class we should make sure to all collectively remove our top hats and take a moment of silence for the losing team while readjusting our bow ties and polishing our monocles with our embroidered handkerchiefs. Perhaps a few taps of our strolling canes on the ground in recognition of a job well done by the other team...

[marty]

Tim
You should have been with us at the Crowne when we were waiting for the team after the game.
We cheered and congratulated every Union player as they returned. There were none of their
fans waiting for them.
Doug

I was going to comment on this as well. I'll just add the following:

As this was going on one Union fan (he was wearing a Union hockey windbreaker) who may well have been the father of a Union player (many of the Union players were arriving with their families) looked right at me as I was clapping, and said, "Classy guys. Very classy,", and patted me on the shoulder. He was definitely not being sarcastic at all. It was clear he really appreciated the fact that while we were obviously waiting there to greet and congratulate our own players, we were treating the Union players with respect.

I believe you.  And clearly you are deservedly proud of his reaction.  Why hide your light under a bushel?  Relatively few people witnessed the classiness displayed.  That other thing was put on display for the whole arena.  Think those few Union people present at the hotel will tell all the others at the arena and fix it all up?

I don't think there's anything that needs fixing. I really don't think the majority of the Union fans are going to have their impression of Cornell fans influenced very much by whether or not we did "Winning Team / Losing Team" after the game.

I do think the players and their families who were applauded by the opposing teams' fans as they came back to their hotel will remember that a whole lot more than they remember "winning team / losing team", if they were even aware of it in the first place.

You may both be right, but I am with Tim here.  It may be funny to do the taunt during the season, but it was rude and unnecessary in Albany.  We are often jerks with our cheers.  We shouldn't be jerks quite so often.

[ugarte]

Tim
You should have been with us at the Crowne when we were waiting for the team after the game.
We cheered and congratulated every Union player as they returned. There were none of their
fans waiting for them.
Doug

I was going to comment on this as well. I'll just add the following:

As this was going on one Union fan (he was wearing a Union hockey windbreaker) who may well have been the father of a Union player (many of the Union players were arriving with their families) looked right at me as I was clapping, and said, "Classy guys. Very classy,", and patted me on the shoulder. He was definitely not being sarcastic at all. It was clear he really appreciated the fact that while we were obviously waiting there to greet and congratulate our own players, we were treating the Union players with respect.

I believe you.  And clearly you are deservedly proud of his reaction.  Why hide your light under a bushel?  Relatively few people witnessed the classiness displayed.  That other thing was put on display for the whole arena.  Think those few Union people present at the hotel will tell all the others at the arena and fix it all up?

I don't think there's anything that needs fixing. I really don't think the majority of the Union fans are going to have their impression of Cornell fans influenced very much by whether or not we did "Winning Team / Losing Team" after the game.

I do think the players and their families who were applauded by the opposing teams' fans as they came back to their hotel will remember that a whole lot more than they remember "winning team / losing team", if they were even aware of it in the first place.

You may both be right, but I am with Tim here.  It may be funny to do the taunt during the season, but it was rude and unnecessary in Albany.  We are often jerks with our cheers.  We shouldn't be jerks quite so often.

Jerk.

[Jordan 04]

I find the argument that "winning team, losing team" following the Championship game is in poor taste to be quite laughable.

Where does the imaginary line get drawn? Should we not have done "It's all your fault" after the empty-netter? After all, it was clear at that point that Union were losers, and [sob]some of them were playing their last games [/sob].

And frankly, with the way Union was being dominated, Gary Glitter to start the 3rd was probably unnecessary. Tradition, schmadition. Those poor guys were playing their last games.

And don't get me started on the Tubas. Starting up a "Die!" cheer with a few minutes to play in a Championship game, with Union practically on life-support. Classless.

::rolleyes::

To the victors go the spoils. And the victors gave Union a standing ovation when they were announced in the post-game ceremony.

[RichH]

Amen. It's sports and it's a cheer we do after every win...probably not the nicest thing to do when it's the final game for the opposing team but it's just excited fans yelling and cheering. I guess that next time we as fans want to win with class we should make sure to all collectively remove our top hats and take a moment of silence for the losing team while readjusting our bow ties and polishing our monocles with our embroidered handkerchiefs. Perhaps a few taps of our strolling canes on the ground in recognition of a job well done by the other team...

Ascots. You forgot ascots.

Right on. The whole "classy vs. classless" fans label is one of my least favorite things to argue about ever on teh internets, and I think that's what finally drove me away from the USCHO forum. C'mon. I stopped caring about what fans thought about other fans a while ago, just like I rarely care about what other people think of me in other situations. I do what I think is right, but I'm not perfect with that.  It's a game, and it's supposed to be fun.  Anyone who gets upset over something so silly need to take a look at themselves.  Sports fans need to get over themselves sometimes.

[Scersk '97]

It's not even barely surprising that I agree wholeheartedly with Rich, but, seriously people, get over it:  we taunt because we love.

And, anyway, this was Union's initiation.  If they're going to play with the big boys, they'll have to take their lumps just like everyone else.

[Josh '99]

It's not even barely surprising that I agree wholeheartedly with Rich, but, seriously people, get over it:  we taunt because we love.

Except Harvard.  We taunt them because they suck.

[Scersk '97]

It's not even barely surprising that I agree wholeheartedly with Rich, but, seriously people, get over it:  we taunt because we love.

Except Harvard.  We taunt them because they suck.

We were talking about this after you left this morning.  I might even root for Harvard in some situations.

But never, never will I root for those pricks from Princeton.  They I taunt because I hate.

[Josh '99]

It's not even barely surprising that I agree wholeheartedly with Rich, but, seriously people, get over it:  we taunt because we love.

Except Harvard.  We taunt them because they suck.

We were talking about this after you left this morning.  I might even root for Harvard in some situations.

But never, never will I root for those pricks from Princeton.  They I taunt because I hate.

Why Princeton?

I've come around to being able to root for Harvard or whoever else in the ECAC in nonconference games where them winning might potentially help our selection criteria.  But once tournament time comes around?  Fuck them.  (I'll root for Yale next weekend though, or, in general, any ECAC team in the tournament as long as I don't have something specific against them, e.g. Bob Gaudet's douchebaggery.)

[Scersk '97]

Why Princeton?

Oh, I doubt you'll ever need to root for Dartmouth in the tournament as long as Gaudet is coaching.

Why Princeton?  Because it's a country club, not a university.  Because it's a bastion of WASPy-ness that goes far beyond what even this unibrow-plucking, argyle-socks-wearin', non-self-hating WASP can take.  Because I hate that fucking double-double rotating P.

[KeithK]

You may both be right, but I am with Tim here.  It may be funny to do the taunt during the season, but it was rude and unnecessary in Albany.  We are often jerks with our cheers.  We shouldn't be jerks quite so often.

Winning team. losing team is part of the post game celebration. No reason to change it regardless of the venue.  It's all in good hockey fun.

Now if we did it while the second place trophy was being awarded I'd feel differently.

I bet some of you folks think "third place team, fourth place team" during the consy is classless too.

[marty]

Jerk.

George Fenneman here.