Retire Cornell jersey numbers

[billhoward]

The eLynah poll, "Should Cornell Retire [Jersey] Numbers," currently runs exactly three-to-one against, 240 no, 80 yes.

Ken Dryden didn't do enough in his years on the Hill? Joe Nieuwendyk really wasn't special until he found his way in the NHL? Or is it just that the retired jerseys aren't a concept for college sports? Or we're in danger of winding up with hockey jerseys numbering past the 30s?

I voted yes (okay to retire a jersey) with only the tangential concern that if a third or fourth hockey jersey is retired, it will probably be for a person less accomplished than Dryden, because how could you be more accomplished? Sort of like the Cornell Athletics (all sports) Hall of Fame which admitted all the really sensational Cornell athletes the first couple years starting in 1978 and now is extending outward so the recent winners are run of the mill All-America athletes, not the greatest Cornellian ever to pick up a stick or ball in X sport. 510 total out of someting like 300,000 Cornellians. But that's more than okay, too. Nobody's there who doesn't deserve recognition from Cornell.

Hockey has 31 in the Cornell Athletics Hall of Fame
Bertrand, Richard L.
Cornell, Brian L.
Cropper, Brian G.
Dadswell, Douglas D.
Doran, Michael L.
Dryden, Kenneth W.
Duthie, William
Eliot, Darren J.
Elliott, Jason
Ferguson, Douglas R.
Fullan, Lawrence J.
Hayward, Brian G.
Hughes, John W.
Hunter, Francis T. (Frank)
Kennedy, Laing E.
Kerling, Roy G.
Lodboa, Daniel S.
McCutcheon, Brian K.
Moeser, Duanne
Murray, William
Nethery, Lance
Nieuwendyk, Joseph
Orr, Harry
Pattison, D. Bruce
Rule, Robert <- perhaps more for lacrosse  
Shier, Pete <- eLynah participant
Stanowski, (Walter) Skip
Tredway, R. Brock
Tufford, E. Peter
Vaughan, James
Wiggans, Robert L.

[KeithK]

Are there any specific requirements to be in the Cornell Athletics Hall of Fame?  (Aside from playing a sport at Cornell, of course).  The baseball HoF, for instance, requires a ten year career and then a five year wait after retirement.  Anything similar here?

[billhoward]

Are there any specific requirements to be in the Cornell Athletics Hall of Fame?  (Aside from playing a sport at Cornell, of course).  The baseball HoF, for instance, requires a ten year career and then a five year wait after retirement.  Anything similar here?

Maybe a drug test? For 1960s-1970s stars, if the preserved hair sample turns up no THC, you have to wait 5 more years.

[Trotsky]

Or is it just that the retired jerseys aren't a concept for college sports?

90% that, and 10% that all hockey numbers > 31 look stupid.

[Al DeFlorio]

Or is it just that the retired jerseys aren't a concept for college sports?

90% that, and 10% that all hockey numbers > 31 look stupid.

Agree.  I'm also a bit concerned that someone's follow-on professional career can carry too much weight in selection, even subconsciously.  For example, while Joe Nieuwendyk had a remarkable NHL career, his Cornell record is not more impressive--to me--than that of several others, like Lance Nethery, Dan Lodboa, Doug Ferguson, and Brian Cornell, for example.  Seems to me any college honors for athletes should be based on contribution while in school, not afterwards.  Retiring numbers smacks too much of professional sports, I guess.  The Cornell Athletics Hall of Fame is enough recognition, and I think it should be kept more exclusive than it is.

[jtwcornell91]

Or is it just that the retired jerseys aren't a concept for college sports?

90% that, and 10% that all hockey numbers > 31 look stupid.

Agree.  I'm also a bit concerned that someone's follow-on professional career can carry too much weight in selection, even subconsciously.  For example, while Joe Nieuwendyk had a remarkable NHL career, his Cornell record is not more impressive--to me--than that of several others, like Lance Nethery, Dan Lodboa, Doug Ferguson, and Brian Cornell, for example.  Seems to me any college honors for athletes should be based on contribution while in school, not afterwards.  Retiring numbers smacks too much of professional sports, I guess.  The Cornell Athletics Hall of Fame is enough recognition, and I think it should be kept more exclusive than it is.

I think it's telling that the [http://cornellbigred.com/news/2009/10/20/MICE_1020092019.aspx?path=mhockey article] about the retirement on the athletics website shows both players in NHL rather than Cornell uniforms.  It's also kind of funny since Dryden is wearing #29 in the picture and there's a red "1" to remind you what number they're retiring.

Another reason why this is a bad idea is that it goes against a lot of the regard for history that Schafer has established, several manifestations of which make a connection between players and their predecessors who wore the same numbers.  You don't honor Dryden and Nieuwendyk (and Nethery and Lodboa and ...) by taking their numbers out of circulation, but by having today's players remember whose nunmber they have on their sweater.

[Al DeFlorio]

Another reason why this is a bad idea is that it goes against a lot of the regard for history that Schafer has established, several manifestations of which make a connection between players and their predecessors who wore the same numbers.  You don't honor Dryden and Nieuwendyk (and Nethery and Lodboa and ...) by taking their numbers out of circulation, but by having today's players remember whose nunmber they have on their sweater.

Excellent point.

I may be influenced by the fact that all goalies (well, there were a few exceptions), even backups, wore #1 back in the day, so retiring that number just makes no sense to me.

[billhoward]

I noticed also that the site shows Dryden and Nieuwendyk in their pro jerseys. It may be that Cornell's sense of history may not extend back to having significant photo archives let alone color photo archives.

You could argue that the sense of history Cornell players should feel is to all who wore the number not just the most famous person.

No way can you argue that Dryden's Cornell success was inadequate for any kind of honor Cornell bestows including retiring a jersey if that's what Cornell wants. So who is Cornell's second greatest player based on what he accomplished in a Cornell uniform, if not Nieuwendyk?

[Trotsky]

So who is Cornell's second greatest player based on what he accomplished in a Cornell uniform, if not Nieuwendyk?

I love Nieuwendyk, but I wouldn't even put him in the top 10 all-time based solely on Cornell achievements.

[Josh '99]

Or is it just that the retired jerseys aren't a concept for college sports?

90% that, and 10% that all hockey numbers > 31 look stupid.

Maybe so (in my observation, anything from 31-35 for a goalie is pretty standard everywhere except Cornell), but honestly, I've come to not really care much about this.  If it makes a player happy to wear #64 and he plays better as a result, I say let him wear it.

(Which doesn't mean I won't still make fun of players on other teams for wearing football numbers, of course.)

[ACM]

Are there any specific requirements to be in the Cornell Athletics Hall of Fame?  (Aside from playing a sport at Cornell, of course).  The baseball HoF, for instance, requires a ten year career and then a five year wait after retirement.  Anything similar here?

Playing (or, for that matter, coaching) a sport at Cornell isn't even a requirement for induction into the Cornell Athletics Hall of Fame. People like Mike Teeter, Dave Wohlhueter and Kenny VanSickle, among others, have been chosen for contributions that did not involve playing or coaching.

[marty]

The eLynah poll, "Should Cornell Retire [Jersey] Numbers," currently runs exactly three-to-one against, 240 no, 80 yes.

Ken Dryden didn't do enough in his years on the Hill? Joe Nieuwendyk really wasn't special until he found his way in the NHL? Or is it just that the retired jerseys aren't a concept for college sports? Or we're in danger of winding up with hockey jerseys numbering past the 30s?

I voted yes (okay to retire a jersey) with only the tangential concern that if a third or fourth hockey jersey is retired, it will probably be for a person less accomplished than Dryden, because how could you be more accomplished? Sort of like the Cornell Athletics (all sports) Hall of Fame which admitted all the really sensational Cornell athletes the first couple years starting in 1978 and now is extending outward so the recent winners are run of the mill All-America athletes, not the greatest Cornellian ever to pick up a stick or ball in X sport. 510 total out of someting like 300,000 Cornellians. But that's more than okay, too. Nobody's there who doesn't deserve recognition from Cornell.

Hockey has 31 in the Cornell Athletics Hall of Fame
Bertrand, Richard L.
Cornell, Brian L.
Cropper, Brian G.
Dadswell, Douglas D.
Doran, Michael L.
Dryden, Kenneth W.
Duthie, William
Eliot, Darren J.
Elliott, Jason
Ferguson, Douglas R.
Fullan, Lawrence J.
Hayward, Brian G.
Hughes, John W.
Hunter, Francis T. (Frank)
Kennedy, Laing E.
Kerling, Roy G.
Lodboa, Daniel S.
McCutcheon, Brian K.
Moeser, Duanne
Murray, William
Nethery, Lance
Nieuwendyk, Joseph
Orr, Harry
Pattison, D. Bruce
Rule, Robert <- perhaps more for lacrosse  
Shier, Pete <- eLynah participant
Stanowski, (Walter) Skip
Tredway, R. Brock
Tufford, E. Peter
Vaughan, James
Wiggans, Robert L.

So the answer is simple.  Retire all the numbers and issue bar codes.

[KeithK]

barcodes would make for interesting scoreboards.

[Rita]

barcodes would make for interesting scoreboards.

What would happen is that scoreboards would become antiques.  There would be some sort of App so that when a player went on the ice, his barcode would be scanned and transmitted to the fans' crackberries, iPhones, Droids, etc. Additional apps would allow you to do on screen tracking of real time stats like skating velocity, shot speed, and for some special players, intensity and heart ;-), during their shift.

Maybe even someone from the band (or a cranky alum) could come up with an app that will allow fans to keep the right tempo for the cowbell, "Kill Red Kill" and other cheers that have sped up over time. **]

[Swampy]

barcodes would make for interesting scoreboards.

What would happen is that scoreboards would become antiques.  There would be some sort of App so that when a player went on the ice, his barcode would be scanned and transmitted to the fans' crackberries, iPhones, Droids, etc. Additional apps would allow you to do on screen tracking of real time stats like skating velocity, shot speed, and for some special players, intensity and heart ;-), during their shift.

Maybe even someone from the band (or a cranky alum) could come up with an app that will allow fans to keep the right tempo for the cowbell, "Kill Red Kill" and other cheers that have sped up over time. **]

Hey, great idea, Rita. Instead of Redcast, Google Earth could track the players in real time as they skate around the rink during the game! ::woot::