Retired Number

[Rosey]

I would add, as a point of clarification, that Cornell has granted exactly 2 honorary degrees in its history, to David Starr Jordan '72 (first president of Stanford) and the introduction-less ADW, both at the same time (1886), and with an unwritten return to a policy of not granting honorary degrees that has stood for the last 121 years.  See Morris Bishop's "A History of Cornell", pp. 262-263.

The reason I mention this is that it is not without precedent in Cornell's history to retire Joe's number and then never retire another number.  The circumstances are even the same, with the honor having already been announced without prior community approval, making it impossible to avoid bad feelings were it to be revoked at this point.  So, let's just use this opportunity to inform the Cornell administration and the AD that no further such honors should be bestowed because it goes against long-standing tradition.

Kyle

[Al DeFlorio]

[quote RichH][quote Jim Hyla]And of course that is exactly what all of us are discussing. We all agree that honoring him is correct; for me that belongs in the Hall of Fame. Retire the number, no.[/quote]

I agree completely with Jim, and I actually feel quite strongly about this.  I haven't spoken up mainly because I couldn't have said how I feel any better than the text at http://www.cutradition.com has already done.  Also, I knew once I started writing, it would probably turn into something resembling a reactionary manifesto.  But then again, the support that the petition hasn't gotten has been a little disappointing to me.  Thus I begin:

Look...perhaps I'm kidding myself in the athlete/celebrity world in which we live, but I'm still married to the idea of keeping collegiate athletics as close as possible to the amateur ideal of the fading existence of the "student-athlete."  I'm as proud as anyone of the people who came through the university that I attended, and love to show that pride to the college football/basketball "fans" who buy hats and foam fingers of institutions of higher education that they never intend to attend.  Those who perpetuate the exploitation of our educational system by people who have decided to use schools as certain professional sports' "minor leagues" and whore themselves for the almighty buck.  *huff*  [/steps away from the soapbox]

My point:  I love all the great players who chose for one reason or another to attend Cornell and play hockey.  Even some of the not-so-great.  Retiring numbers is such a thing for professional sports.  I'm of the opinion that collegiate uniform numbers should not be retired, except in such circumstances that an event happened that so changed a program emotionally that nobody would want to wear the number again out of respect.  Such is the case with the two retired Lax jerseys.  Or Travis Roy at BU.  Or Syracuse's #44 in football.  Joe Nieuwendyk's #25, while worn by one of the best and most successful and classy athletes to come to Ithaca, shouldn't be holier-than-thou.  On top of all the players I love, I also love the program's tradition.  I like to think of how excited the team was to learn about the great players who wore their numbers before them.  I see the great uniform numbers as a torch to be passed (maybe that's too romantic, but I'm trying to explain why this is important to me).  

1-31.  

That's my TEAM.  No individual is above that, just like nobody's skating around with #91 because that's what he wore in Juniors.  Retiring numbers is so...Florida State University.  If we retire numbers, we may as well just switch to the Nike Swift jersey with crazy star striping, chevrons, and shimmer jersey material, and slap together a black 3rd jersey with a huge Huggy Bear off-centered and space-age fonts with numbers on the shoulder.  Yeah!  (sorry, got carried away again.)

I'm all for honoring the Cornell hockey greats in the renovated Lynah.  There's a nice, thick edge along the floor of the mezzanine that faces the entire rink.  Let's do a "Ring of Honor" instead of retiring uniform numbers.  The original thread already had people making lists of numbers to retire once we do the first one.  Let's not be that school.  Hang the name and number on the walls, and let the skaters lining up on the blue line during introductions be able to see that and feel some pride of having the same number on his back.

Heck, I'll even throw this out there: for the first full season of the renovated Lynah, let's bring back some of the legends that generations of fans haven't had the chance to meet or hear about.  One per home weekend. Celebrate all the greats.  Nieuwendyk, Dryden, Nethery, Lodboa, Harkness.  We all know the names, but we've never had a chance to give them our thanks in a proper Lynah roar.  In 1995, the 1970 team came back, and it was pretty special.

If you agree with the gist of what I've said here, sign the petition.  Don't retire the numbers.
http://www.cutradition.com/[/quote]
What Rich said.  Very, very well done.

[jtwcornell91]

[quote RichH]No individual is above that, just like nobody's skating around with #91 because that's what he wore in Juniors.[/quote]

Or 13, for that matter.  (We had that discussion about Moulson a few years ago.)

[Ben Rocky '04]

[quote krose]I would add, as a point of clarification, that Cornell has granted exactly 2 honorary degrees in its history, to David Starr Jordan '72 (first president of Stanford) and the introduction-less ADW, both at the same time (1886), and with an unwritten return to a policy of not granting honorary degrees that has stood for the last 121 years.  See Morris Bishop's "A History of Cornell", pp. 262-263.

The reason I mention this is that it is not without precedent in Cornell's history to retire Joe's number and then never retire another number.  The circumstances are even the same, with the honor having already been announced without prior community approval, making it impossible to avoid bad feelings were it to be revoked at this point.  So, let's just use this opportunity to inform the Cornell administration and the AD that no further such honors should be bestowed because it goes against long-standing tradition.

Kyle[/quote]

Not to nitpick, but I think the controversy over those two honorary degrees also ended the presidency of Charles Kendall Adams.  Maybe we can use this to get Andy Noel fired.... ? ::uptosomething::

Regardless, I don't think there is any way we're going to get this retiring revoked.  Kyle is right, if you seriously disagree with this, this is the opportunity to make sure it never happens again.  Personally, I trust Schafer and other alumni of the program to make sure we don't go on a number retiring spree, and for that reason, I am refraining from signing the petition.

PS:  Whose petition is this anyway?  Why was it posted with a new, anonymous posting name?

[Josh '99]

[quote jtwcornell91][quote RichH]No individual is above that, just like nobody's skating around with #91 because that's what he wore in Juniors.[/quote]

Or 13, for that matter.  (We had that discussion about Moulson a few years ago.)[/quote]That tradition is stupid.

(The one about #13, not the one about high numbers.)

[nyc94]

[quote Ben Rocky 04]Personally, I trust Schafer and other alumni of the program to make sure we don't go on a number retiring spree, and for that reason, I am refraining from signing the petition. [/quote]

Not trying to pick a fight but what gives you such confidence?

[ursusminor]

Although I don't know if he asked for the number at Cornell, Shane Hynes didn't wear #57 as he did in Juniors. I always thought that would have been appropriate.

[CowbellGuy]

He did, and was assured he'd get it while being recruited, then obviously discovered otherwise once he got here.

[ugarte]

Although I don't know if he asked for the number at Cornell, Shane Hynes didn't wear #57 as he did in Juniors. I always thought that would have been appropriate.

How so? I don't get the reference.

Update: I am an idiot.

[BCrespi]

He was especially pissed-off when they didn't spell his name correctly while he was here, in addition to not giving him his long-assoicated number.  Jeez, looking back, no wonder he left.  Unfortunately for Shane, his new team seems to have gone with the Cornell spelling as well.

[nyc94]

[quote ugarte]

Although I don't know if he asked for the number at Cornell, Shane Hynes didn't wear #57 as he did in Juniors. I always thought that would have been appropriate.

How so? I don't get the reference.[/quote]

Heinz 57

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heinz_57

[KeithK]

[quote nyc94][quote Ben Rocky 04]Personally, I trust Schafer and other alumni of the program to make sure we don't go on a number retiring spree, and for that reason, I am refraining from signing the petition. [/quote]

Not trying to pick a fight but what gives you such confidence?[/quote]I think trusting those involved in the program enough not to make your voice heard is silly.  I agree that the petition probably has no chance of success (unless Joe himself signed it) but it's a way of speaking out on the issue. That's why I signed it.

I do think Schafer is unlikely to go on a number retiring spree.  But who knows what the next guy will do?  Once you've set the precedent it's a lot easier to continue.

[ugarte]

[quote nyc94][quote ugarte]

Although I don't know if he asked for the number at Cornell, Shane Hynes didn't wear #57 as he did in Juniors. I always thought that would have been appropriate.

How so? I don't get the reference.[/quote]

Heinz 57

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heinz_57[/quote]I said, "Update:..."!

[Ben Rocky '04]

[quote KeithK][quote nyc94][quote Ben Rocky 04]Personally, I trust Schafer and other alumni of the program to make sure we don't go on a number retiring spree, and for that reason, I am refraining from signing the petition. [/quote]

Not trying to pick a fight but what gives you such confidence?[/quote]I think trusting those involved in the program enough not to make your voice heard is silly.  I agree that the petition probably has no chance of success (unless Joe himself signed it) but it's a way of speaking out on the issue. That's why I signed it.

I do think Schafer is unlikely to go on a number retiring spree.  But who knows what the next guy will do?  Once you've set the precedent it's a lot easier to continue.[/quote]

NYC94- Under Schafer(the only coach I've really seen run the team), this team has been all about tradition: the rink renovation respected its history, players have to research the history of their numbers, we've had one number over 31 > these point to not retiring more than a few numbers, if any more, because then we'll be having numbers over 31 all the time.

Keith- You're right, its silly of me to trust people hired by Day Hall to run something I care about. Schafer I trust, the next guy I dont(unless its Casey Jones or some other Cornellian). I'll sign the petition.

[nyc94]

[quote ugarte][quote nyc94][quote ugarte]

Although I don't know if he asked for the number at Cornell, Shane Hynes didn't wear #57 as he did in Juniors. I always thought that would have been appropriate.

How so? I don't get the reference.[/quote]

Heinz 57

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heinz_57[/quote]I said, "Update:..."![/quote]

In my defense, my reply posted at 12:59 and your edit is at 12:58.  I probably hit "quote" around 12:57 so I didn't see your edit until it was too late.