Message from the Ticket Office

[Chris '03]

[quote Liz '05]
The rein/reign distiction drives me nuts when I see it misused, especially when it should've been caught by the newspaper editor.
[/quote]

I saw this in a graphic on a major news network just yesterday:
"...U.N. attempts to reign in North Korea"

So they are trying to rule NK... or are they tring to rein them in?

[Lauren '06]

[quote ftyuv][quote Section A Banshee][quote ftyuv]That's a sic page (<-- pun not typo).  I would disagree with "I could care less" being wrong, though.  I think it's valid to throw it in with the corpus of sarcastic idioms, a la "yeah, right" to mean "no way."

I would like to see a rain of terror.  The question-begging cartoon was great![/quote]
I think it's safe to say that when people use "I could care less," they're not doing it sarcastically, they're doing it incorrectly.[/quote]

I bet lots of people don't get the irony of cheering "Safety school!" against Harvard, either.  Doesn't mean that those of us who do get it can't use it

I like what that woman said in her first article -- that she's allowed to break the rules she sets forth, cause she knows them pat.  I'm fine with people taking liberty with language, as long as they know they're doing it.[/quote]
In that case, if every person I hear say "I could care less" from now until the end of my life doesn't follow up immediately with a "don't worry, I know better" disclaimer in tone or comment, I will happily go on thinking they are idiots.  That may be your reasoning, but I can't believe that the vast majority of people misusing that phrase do it with full knowledge.  I can't be alone in thinking this, can I?

[ugarte]

[quote jtwcornell91]"wave off", not "waive off" (Note: I am deliberately employing a different comma usage from the standard one.  I believe my usage is consistent.)[/quote]IIRC, this is the correct form in UK English but incorrect in standard American English. I agree with you that the Brits have the better of the argument.

And since you are living in Europe, stick with the rules of the closest English speaking country.

[ftyuv]

[quote Section A Banshee][quote ftyuv][quote Section A Banshee][quote ftyuv]That's a sic page (<-- pun not typo).  I would disagree with "I could care less" being wrong, though.  I think it's valid to throw it in with the corpus of sarcastic idioms, a la "yeah, right" to mean "no way."

I would like to see a rain of terror.  The question-begging cartoon was great![/quote]
I think it's safe to say that when people use "I could care less," they're not doing it sarcastically, they're doing it incorrectly.[/quote]

I bet lots of people don't get the irony of cheering "Safety school!" against Harvard, either.  Doesn't mean that those of us who do get it can't use it

I like what that woman said in her first article -- that she's allowed to break the rules she sets forth, cause she knows them pat.  I'm fine with people taking liberty with language, as long as they know they're doing it.[/quote]
In that case, if every person I hear say "I could care less" from now until the end of my life doesn't follow up immediately with a "don't worry, I know better" disclaimer in tone or comment, I will happily go on thinking they are idiots.  That may be your reasoning, but I can't believe that the vast majority of people misusing that phrase do it with full knowledge.  I can't be alone in thinking this, can I?[/quote]

Well I certainly see your point.  And if I should ever use that phrase without following it up, and you take it to mean that I'm an idiot -- well, I could care less

It does raise an interesting point, though.  If it is sarcastic, presumably the first person to use it realized what they were saying (note my conscious decision to help push forward "they" as a gender-neutral singular pronoun).  Then it reached some sort of idiomatic (idiotmatic?) critical mass, such that in essence people were using a sarcastic phrase without realizing it.  At that point, certainly they've lost control of the expression -- but are they ignorant for not knowing the correct expression (as you assert) or for not knowing the true meaning behind the [corrent] expression they're using (as I assert)?

Stay tuned for more... Tales Of Interest!

[KeithK]

[q]I can't be alone in thinking this, can I?[/q]Nope.  I'm with ya.

[ftyuv]

[quote Chris '03]
"...U.N. attempts to reign in North Korea"[/quote]
Take off the prep phrase and you've got enough of a challenge for them as it is ::rolleyes::

[jtwcornell91]

[quote Chris '03]You should also read Eats, Shoots & Leaves by Lynne Truss.

http://eatsshootsandleaves.com/[/quote]

The equivalent book in German is called Der Dativ ist dem Genitiv sein Tod, BTW.

[Scersk '97]

[quote Section A Banshee]
In that case, if every person I hear say "I could care less" from now until the end of my life doesn't follow up immediately with a "don't worry, I know better" disclaimer in tone or comment, I will happily go on thinking they are idiots.  That may be your reasoning, but I can't believe that the vast majority of people misusing that phrase do it with full knowledge.  I can't be alone in thinking this, can I?[/quote]

To be annoying, I'll say that one can safely use both phrases without explanation.  For example:

I couldn't care less about McKee's early departure.

and:

I could care less about McKee's early departure.

As is clear from the italics, it's a matter of emphasis.  I would expect most people to follow up the latter with a hearty "Really, I could care less, but I'm a big nerd," but I'd let it slide with those I knew were on the up and up.

[Lauren '06]

[quote ftyuv][quote Section A Banshee]
In that case, if every person I hear say "I could care less" from now until the end of my life doesn't follow up immediately with a "don't worry, I know better" disclaimer in tone or comment, I will happily go on thinking they are idiots.  That may be your reasoning, but I can't believe that the vast majority of people misusing that phrase do it with full knowledge.  I can't be alone in thinking this, can I?[/quote]

Well I certainly see your point.  And if I should ever use that phrase without following it up, and you take it to mean that I'm an idiot -- well, I could care less [/quote]
You have explained yourself, therefore I don't think you're an idiot. :-}

It does raise an interesting point, though.  If it is sarcastic, presumably the first person to use it realized what they were saying (note my conscious decision to help push forward "they" as a gender-neutral singular pronoun).

Despite being improper, the "they" thing has actually never bothered me.  I guess because it's not as word-for-word obvious as "could care less" ought to be.

Then it reached some sort of idiomatic (idiotmatic?) critical mass, such that in essence people were using a sarcastic phrase without realizing it.  At that point, certainly they've lost control of the expression -- but are they ignorant for not knowing the correct expression (as you assert) or for not knowing the true meaning behind the [corrent] expression they're using (as I assert)?

Stay tuned for more... Tales Of Interest!

Ockham's Razor would dictate "my" explanation is the right one, but I don't have any linguistic data other than my dismal view of the general intelligence to back that up. :-D

[Lauren '06]

[quote Scersk '97][quote Section A Banshee]
In that case, if every person I hear say "I could care less" from now until the end of my life doesn't follow up immediately with a "don't worry, I know better" disclaimer in tone or comment, I will happily go on thinking they are idiots.  That may be your reasoning, but I can't believe that the vast majority of people misusing that phrase do it with full knowledge.  I can't be alone in thinking this, can I?[/quote]

To be annoying, I'll say that one can safely use both phrases without explanation.  For example:

I couldn't care less about McKee's early departure.

and:

I could care less about McKee's early departure.

As is clear from the italics, it's a matter of emphasis.  I would expect most people to follow up the latter with a hearty "Really, I could care less, but I'm a big nerd," but I'd let it slide with those I knew were on the up and up.[/quote]
Okay, but you made my point.  You used emphasis to describe your intent.  I've never heard that emphasis used in common parlance when the phrase is used--in my opinion--incorrectly.

[Scersk '97]

[quote Section A Banshee][quote Scersk '97][quote Section A Banshee]
... disclaimer in tone or comment...[/quote]

To be annoying...

[and I was--snip]

[/quote]
Okay, but you made my point.  You used emphasis to describe your intent.  I've never heard that emphasis used in common parlance when the phrase is used--in my opinion--incorrectly.[/quote]

My reading comprehension just kicked in:  sorry for the belaboring.

Yeah, I've only heard those emphases used by those already "in the know."

[Avash]

[quote ftyuv]That's a sic page (<-- pun not typo).  [/quote]

http://www.onehorseshy.com/most_recent/bad_grammar_makes_me_sic?p=onehorseshy.46737923