Hunter's first trial

[Jeff Hopkins '82]

Roy,

Appealing to the greater good doesn't work in this country.  Why else do we have SUVs all over the place increasing hydrocarbon and CO2 emissions while the country is going to war over oil?  And nobody in elected office who isn't already in the pocket of corporate America has the financial wherewithal to do anything but cave in to the lobbyists.  The best you can hope for is a few invidivuals doing the right thing and "the marketplace" sorting out the rest.

[KeithK]

Roy, your initial response was sufficiently snarky (or came off that way) to induce similarly irritable responses.

There is clearly more demand for parking on campus than supply.  How to correct the imbalance is a policy decision.  More parking is one way.  Restricting student parking permits is another.  Adding other transportation options is a third, though I suspect one that is tough to take very far in a place like Ithaca.  Not addressing the imbalance is also an option of sorts, but an irresponsible one that in particular will adversely affect relations with staff.

For the record, I think prohibiting freshman from having cars wouldn'tt be a terrible thing.  

[jtwcornell91]

[Q]KeithK Wrote:
For the record, I think prohibiting freshman from having cars wouldn'tt be a terrible thing.  [/q]

Freshmen are required to live in the dorms, right?  If you live on campus and have a full meal plan, there's not a lot of need for a car.

[nyc94]

[Q]jtwcornell91 Wrote:
Freshmen are required to live in the dorms, right?  If you live on campus and have a full meal plan, there's not a lot of need for a car.[/q]

Unless your parents don't live in New York City or Long Island which is pretty much the only places served by buses.  The vast majority of the miles I put on my car in college were driving to and from Connecticut.  

And isn't the Redbud Woods lot simply replacing a parking lot that was where the first West Campus residential college was built?  I can't believe the parking currently on the West Campus tennis courts is going to be permanent.  Or is it?

[marty]

[Q]marty Wrote:

 Get a load of this statement which was alluded to by tub(a):

[Q2]An agreement has been reached between the Working Group and the Cornell Administration to end the occupation of the woods in exchange for a number of steps to further sustainability and democracy at Cornell. We remain opposed to this parking lot, and are still determined to challenge and transform the power structures of our University. To all our supporters, thanks and stay involved![/Q]
[/q]

Now that everyone is awake and ranting I would like to know....What is the meaning of the word "sustainability" when used properly and just how did the dope who wrote this vapid piece of tripe use it incorrectly?  Many thanks in advance to anyone who can write a humorous yet understandable response.:-)

Please note that I will be upset if it was used properly but I will also be simultaneously more than a bit amused if that is the case.  (On a sad note I ponied up the dough for season tickets to RIP this week - an error in judgment - but I can't stay away from any division one rink so conveniently situated to my home.)

[David Harding]

[Q]nyc94 Wrote:

 [Q2]jtwcornell91 Wrote:
Freshmen are required to live in the dorms, right?  If you live on campus and have a full meal plan, there's not a lot of need for a car.[/Q]
Unless your parents don't live in New York City or Long Island which is pretty much the only places served by buses.  The vast majority of the miles I put on my car in college were driving to and from Connecticut.  

And isn't the Redbud Woods lot simply replacing a parking lot that was where the first West Campus residential college was built?  I can't believe the parking currently on the West Campus tennis courts is going to be permanent.  Or is it?

[/q]
The long range plan for the ex-tennis courts is not a restoration of tennis.
http://ezra.cornell.edu/posting.php?timestamp=1033617600#rquestion6

[RatushnyFan]

What about road trips to Montreal (drinking age arbitrage)?  Come on people!!

[DeltaOne81]

[Q]nyc94 Wrote:

 [Q2]jtwcornell91 Wrote:
Freshmen are required to live in the dorms, right?  If you live on campus and have a full meal plan, there's not a lot of need for a car.[/Q]
Unless your parents don't live in New York City or Long Island which is pretty much the only places served by buses.  The vast majority of the miles I put on my car in college were driving to and from Connecticut.[/q]

Amen. Driving from Ithaca to my home in Connecticut was about 4.5 hours for me. The bus? Well, after you got past the drivers with attitudes, the 3 bus changes, the full buses when you have to then wait for them to find another one, and the price (not bad, but more than driving in my nearly 30 mpg car, nevermind if passengers tossed in a little)... well, I had to take a 6.5 hour bus ride to get to Newburgh, NY where my parents would drive an hour and a half to meet me and then, naturally, an hour and a half to bring me back home.

So what *should* be a 4.5 hour trip turns into a just lovely, uncomfortable, annoying 8 hour affair and a 3 hour trip for my parents. I did it freshman year, and I refused to do it after that. I still hate Shortline.

And no, I don't believe freshman are *required* to live in the dorms, as I've heard of them not doing so, but it's pretty rare cause, well, most people like a social life... and engineers, well, we like the cheap internet (at least it used to be that way).

[KeithK]

For some period of time freshmen were specifically required to live in dorms.  This policy was institued a couple of years after I arrived.  I have no idea whether that changed - Fred seems to indicate that it has.

Commuting to and from home is the one solid reason that I can think of to allow students to have cars on campus.  However, Cornell could build a parking lot somewhere in the middle of nowhere (further than A lot) and only allow freshmen/underclassmen/whatever to purchase permits to that lot.  Provide bus service to that lot around breaks.  Such a system would keep cars off campus and alleviate parking problems while still allowing students to drive to and from home.

[cth95]

What about road trips to away games?  Not many buses going to Potsdam and Canton I imagine.

[nyc94]

To answer my own question, the "Red Bud" lot will have fewer parking spaces (176) than the lots lost to the West Campus Residential Initiative (286).
http://campuslife.cornell.edu/docs/redbud.html

Anyone know if the garage behind the Law School is still going to happen?

[Andy]

While banning cars for freshman occurs at many campuses and works as a seniority privilege thing, it doesn't make any sense at Cornell.  All freshmen live on North Campus now, which is also the site of a gigantic parking lot that is at least 50% empty.  There is also another one between the IM fields and the north campus dorms, which is generally pretty full.  By banning cars for freshmen, the number of cars on campus will decrease, but it wouldn't alleviate the parking problem, you would just have an even emptier lot on North Campus.  The parking problem lies on west campus and in collegetown, or for staff that work on central campus, and also in the fact that Cornell is set in a rural area.  Some tradeoff has to exist between green space and ease of transportation.  If there is going to be open space, then its going to take time to get places.  Or you can pave the whole thing and build a subway.  You can't really have it both ways.

[KeithK]

Good point, Andy.  This clearly points out yet again how stupid it was to move all freshmen to North Campus.  :-D

[Jerseygirl]

One transportation issue resolution I (ok, and everyone else on the business end of the slope) would have liked is a ski lift or at the very least a dang tow-rope on part of the slope. I still get clammy and pukey thinking about the hungover Friday mornings spent racing uphill to class 10 minutes after rolling out of bed. Yeah, the support structures would have been "eyesores," but there's a lot of ugly kids driving BMW SUV's around campus, and I don't see them being eliminated for aesthetic reasons. Unfortunately.

Personally, my vote is for 20 minutes between classes, reliable shuttles to downtown/Wegmans/Wings Over Ithaca, and ample parking (garages?) in remote locations with, again, reliable shuttles, completely subsidized for University employees. I'm sure there are major flaws in those ideas, but it's off the top of my procrastinating head.

[jtwcornell91]

[Q]Jerseygirl Wrote:

 One transportation issue resolution I (ok, and everyone else on the business end of the slope) would have liked is a ski lift or at the very least a dang tow-rope on part of the slope. I still get clammy and pukey thinking about the hungover Friday mornings spent racing uphill to class 10 minutes after rolling out of bed. Yeah, the support structures would have been "eyesores," but there's a lot of ugly kids driving BMW SUV's around campus, and I don't see them being eliminated for aesthetic reasons. Unfortunately.
[/q]

Do students really drive from West Campus to Central Campus?  I didn't think they could get permits that let them park there.