(OT) Pat Tillman

[gtsully]

Former Arizona Cardinals safety Pat Tillman was killed in Afghanistan after foregoing millions in an NFL contract and enlisting with the Army Rangers two years ago.  This is about the saddest thing I can think of in recent memory, especially when you look at the next headline down and see that Eli Manning would rather hold out than play in San Diego or that NHL players would strike rather than make a million or two less a year.  This news just makes me sick.

[billhoward]

[Q]gtsully Wrote:

 Former Arizona Cardinals safety Pat Tillman was killed in Afghanistan after foregoing millions in an NFL contract and enlisting with the Army Rangers two years ago.  This is about the saddest thing I can think of in recent memory, especially when you look at the next headline down and see that Eli Manning would rather hold out than play in San Diego or that NHL players would strike rather than make a million or two less a year.  This news just makes me sick.[/q]

It's sad about anyone dying in the fighting, especially when he didn't have to go yet chose to do what he thought was important.

Eli Manning is a separate story. Here's a person qualified to play for every employer in his chosen profession, but because all the owners belong to a cartel and consider themselves to be a single employer, he will have only one job offer in the U.S. at the end of his senior season.

If the NHL players want to strike, that's their right, and it's not a slap at the memory of Pat Tillman. The players would be crazy to strike because hockey's financial health is precarious.

It was only in the past three and a half decades that baseball players weren't essentially bound for life to a team. Curt Flood caught a lot of flak for challenging the status quo and critics said he should be grateful for the chance to earn ten times as much as the average American (and, wink-wink, way more than the average black American). The Supreme Court's Flood vs. Kuhn decision (against Flood) was not a high point of American jurisprudence; quoting Casey at the Bat was part of the majority opinion. ... And wasn't it 25 years before that when players who played in the Mexican League were blacklisted for life from Major League Baseball?

For the next couple weeks, one can expect to hear about the the newest seeming-ingrate from radio show callers whose parents a generation ago wondered why this Cassius-Clay-Who-Thinks-He's-Muhammed-Somebody wouldn't do the honorable thing and join the army, or why Curt Flood was about to bankrupt and then destroy baseball.

We fight to defend our freedom to choose, and then we get upset when someone chose to exercise those freedoms.

[adamw]

Note:
- The draft is collectively bargained for and is designed to help the sport
- Baseball players are still bound to the organizations that draft them for up to 10 years.

[KeithK]

[Q]We fight to defend our freedom to choose, and then we get upset when someone chose to exercise those freedoms. [/Q]We fight to defend freedom, including the right to act in ways that are petty, selfish or worse.  This does not in any way mean that we should not criticize someone for making choices that we disagree with.  I would argue that we have a responsibility to stand up for what we feel is right, even while supporting someone's right to do otherwise.

[ugarte]

[Q]KeithK Wrote:

 [Q2]We fight to defend our freedom to choose, and then we get upset when someone chose to exercise those freedoms. [/Q]
We fight to defend freedom, including the right to act in ways that are petty, selfish or worse.  This does not in any way mean that we should not criticize someone for making choices that we disagree with.  I would argue that we have a responsibility to stand up for what we feel is right, even while supporting someone's right to do otherwise.
[/q]Fair enough, but it is something of a cheap shot to say "This person died, proving that this other person is a greedy ingrate."  Tillman deserves more than to be converted into a political cudgel before his body is even laid to rest.

I've already expressed my feelings about Tillman's sacrifice elsewhere.

[KeithK]

[Q]Fair enough, but it is something of a cheap shot to say "This person died, proving that this other person is a greedy ingrate." Tillman deserves more than to be converted into a political cudgel before his body is even laid to rest. [/Q]
I agree with that.  Definitely. I started to write a second paragraph on Tillman, but couldn't say what I wanted in a cogent manner so I deleted it.  I'll just say that whether some athletes are greedy ingrates or not doesn't affect the respect I have for Pat Tillman or the sorrow I feel that he was killed.  Trying to connect the two is unfair to Tillman.

[Greg]

Unfortunately, Tillman's memory will be abused for any number of political causes.  9/11 was.  Everything is.  Political activitists aren't noted for their sensibilities or sense of proportion.

Let the guy rest, and his family mourn, in peace.

[gtsully]

I just thought that the juxtoposition of the stories about Tillman and all of the Eli Mannings out there (read that as you will - greedy athletes, politicians, whatever) should serve as a wake up call to all of us - nothing more than that.  It makes me sick everytime a soldier dies, but this really hammers it home.

[Pete Godenschwager]

[Q]...all of the Eli Mannings out there...[/Q]

     I guess I don't understand why Eli is getting such a bad rap.  Here's a guy who's worked his ass off to get where he is.  He wants to put himself in a place where he feels he can do his best.  Maybe he feels the Chargers are a bunch of morons, and he's going to be stuck in a crappy system for years.  Can you then blame the guy for wanting something else?  Why can't a player look out for his own best interest?  

[CowbellGuy]

Because the draft system was, as previously stated, collectively bargained for, by the players (union) as well. No player should be able to simply decide they're above the system or it completely undermines the system. Do the Chargers suck? Of course. But as long as players circumvent the system that's designed to help the sucky teams stop, err... sucking, the teams will have a hard time climbing out of their holes and more and more players will follow suit. If you want to play in the NFL, play by the rules. I, for one, hope he goes by the way of the Eric Crouches, Brian Wesenbergs, and Brien Taylors* of the world, and not just because he ended up with the Giants. On the other hand, ending up with the Giants might be torture enough...

*Who? OK, another Yankee example: Drew Henson. That better?

[Pete Godenschwager]

[Q]If you want to play in the NFL, play by the rules. [/Q]

He is playing by the rules.  If the Chargers had the rights to him, he would not play and go find another job.  He never asked for the rules to be bent for him.   I understand that crappy teams need to have a chance at the better players, and I think it's a good system.  I don't think the fact that the Chargers are a bad team had much to do with it.  The Colts were a bad team when they drafted Peyton, and the Mannings had no beef with them.      

[Chris \'03]

If by "he would... go find another job." you mean he could go play for another league (the CFL or AFL for example), then I agree with you. If you mean another team, then I disagree. The way the draft and revenue sharing in the NFL is set up is such that it blurs the line between the league and the individual franchises. It's more like a large corporation with 32 offices than a group of 32 individual competing businesses. If the NFL offers Eli a job in the san diego "office" he should be happy to play football at the highest level. If he doesn't want to work in the san diego "office" of the NFL he should look for another employer (not cry about it until they move him to another "office"). I guess I just don't have much respect for the eli mannings and J.D. Drews of the world.

[Pete Godenschwager]

I guess I just meant that he'd find another job (outside the NFL) for a year, and then re-enter the draft next year (as per what was collectively bargained by the players).  I don't mean to argue that Eli Manning is a wonderful human being, and we should all love him.  I just don't think what he did is all that terrible.

[dss28]

I tend to agree, Pete, and I don't think that Archie should be hated for wanting what he views as what's best for his son.

[Robb]

And who knows better than Archie - the ultimate poster boy for a great player on a horrible team...  The Saints were approximately 55-150-3 during his tenure (includes a couple seasons he didn't play - the only breakdown I could find was by head coach and that didn't line up totally with his career) with ZERO postseason games.   ::yark::