CCM Cornell hockey cap?

[bigggreddd77]

Honestly...the lack of availability of Cornell athletics (especially hockey) memorabilia online or anywhere is downright pathetic...  I mean...I'm obviously realistic and don't expect to find it in every Champs/Sports Authority that I go into (a la Michigan Miami, etc), but come on...  When I can do a google search for 'CCM College Hockey hats' and find out how to purchase a Massachusettes Maritime Hockey hat and can't find Cornell there is a problem...

 ::screwy::

From the CCM website:
We do have a CCM Custom Apparel and Cap Program. If you visit your local CCM dealer they can fill you in the on the details of the many options available along with the minimum quantities required.

Anyone know who the local...for Ithaca or NYC dealer may be?

So I went to the CCM website and submitted this...figured it couldn't hurt:

I am an alumnus of Cornell University and an avid college hockey fan.  At one point in time I recall seeing a fan with a Cornell Hockey cap in the CCM Practice Cap style, but I have since come up empty in my efforts to find one for myself.  Have you thought of making caps of this style available for all of the major college teams? (Cornell is #2 in the nation right now and I can't find a thing)  I know I've seen them for other teams...and I see that you have a custom cap program...but I would think it would be worth it for you to have some supply readily available online for the major college teams.  Well...if you could help me in my search for a cap I would greatly appreciate it...thanks!  

[Lowell '99]

Good lord.

Having personally dealt with getting approval for various trademark uses many times as both a student and an alumnus, I can say that based on my experience, I would expect Cornell to approve the use of its name on CCM hats if somebody were to try to set up an order.  You know, given that they've done it already.  Then again, I'm just guessing, so I assume I should keep my mouth shut.  

And to clarify: I wasn't even close to suggesting to try to do this under the table, so that's NOT the right question.  I think they'd give it the green light, but I wouldn't want to suggest that this might be a worthwhile venture.  

But no, let's just use this as an opportunity to bash Cornell, as if Andy Noel does everything from set the Athletics budget to clean the bathroom at Dunbar's.

[Weingarm]

Cornell CCM caps were available online somewhere back in 98-99-00.  I actually got mine (yes, I have a true Cornell CCM cap) at the Mall of America in Minneapolis, MN back in August, 1999.  I was on a road trip out to Montana at the time and I was suprised to see it.  Have no idea where to find them now.

[Jim Hyla]

Lowell, thanks for a very measured response to a rather "Cranky bastard '71"::rolleyes:: response from "bra". I thought your suggestion was reasonable, even though I'm not sure that Cornell will give out the rights. After all, they do have caps(?) of their own to sell for a profit. But unless you want to do it under the table, the only solution is to ask, right?

Oh well, we all have bad posts, bad days, etc.. I just wish we could all try for civility in posting or responding.

[pat]

bra,

It's my opinion that Lowell gave an opinion on the kind of design that might not pose much of a problem for that section of the Application for Use of Cornell Names and Artwork, which to the best of my recollection is submitted to Community Relations. He didn't say, but you might have inferred from his statement, that having submitted that form and gained approval, one would lessen one's chances of getting a "nasty letter" from Counsel upon producing said design with the stated and approved manufacturer and by the stated and approved distribution method for which one had obtained any necessary permits and paid or made arrangement for the payment of any applicable fees or royalties. If he had, I might hold the opinion that that could have possibly been construed as something resembling legal advice and could be thus chastised, but then I'm not a lawyer, so I'll keep my mouth shut.

;-)

[ugarte]

Since people are starting to pile on here as if I were some kind of roving "uncivil" Starr chamber I think I should make clear what I said and why I said it.

First, I didn't infer from Lowell's first response that he was suggesting that his belief that Cornell would approve the label came from experience.  It is a significant difference, and one made clear in his second posting.  I also didn't infer, though I might have, that Lowell was suggesting that Cornell would formally approve the request if directed through proper channels.  That isn't legal advice, it is good inside info from someone who has been through the drill.  Had I known that at the time, I also would have stayed silent.  I still think that the first posting left these questions ambiguous, but I have separately apologized to Lowell for the confusion.  (The legal effect of that formal approval is, as you say, potentially thorny, but I would hope that whoever you submit the form to in Community Relations could answer any questions about the breadth of rights conferred by a formal approval.)

Second, my second posting wasn't directed at Lowell at all.  I thought that Adam was suggesting that Cornell wouldn't care about an unapproved but limited production of non-disparaging hats, and I found that response irresponsible.  Adam and I have also cleared up that misunderstanding; he was apparently also suggesting that Cornell would approve a formal request.

Both of my postings boil down to this: Cornell trademarked its name for a reason, and it has a way of licensing its trademarks.  Pat appears to have given a how-to guide (but read the fine print in the application if there is any).  If you want to use the trademark, go through those channels, and be aware that beyond mere approval of content, there may be a licensing fee involved.

Giving legal advice is a dangerous enterprise, even for a lawyer (that is why there are so many disclaimers on everything).  Quasi-legal advice from a layman can be dangerous, and because that is what I thought I saw, a serious response was in order.  You can search the archives here and find plenty of uncivil moments in my past.  This wasn't one of them.

[Ben Doyle 03]

[Q]Jason Demby '99 wrote:

 "Anyone know who the local...for Ithaca or NYC dealer may be?" [/Q]

If there were going to be a place in Central New York. . .this would be the place:

Mc Kie Sports Shop
829 State Fair Blvd
Syracuse, NY
phone: 315-488-5940

:-)Good luck!:-)

[atb9]

Yup, I wasn't trying to give legal advice; it was just some hopeful thinking out loud on my part.  I initially didn't understand where BRA was coming from when he responded to Lowell but I understand that he was just worried about people getting in trouble (for doing something that a lot of us don't really understand) and facing serious consequences.  I agree that speculation about hockey (which is what the board is all about) is one thing but speculation about law can lead to real trouble.  BRA, you're cool in my book.  B-]

How about that 2007 recruiting class?  :-)

[CU at Stanford]

Jason:

Cool.  Thanks for contacting CCM.  If you hear back a positive response, please ping me privately in addition to leaving a message here (for I may be traveling overseas mid-March).

Informally, folks, how many of you would like to buy a CCM Cornell cap today if it were available?  I, for one, would probably buy one or two.

Tom