Legacy situation

[chominky]

We were aware of the alternate-school option, but we were advised that it was best only for superior applicants.  Using 20/20 hindsight, he should have chosen the option, especially consdering that he had some interest in MAP at HumEc.  Although not an official recruit, my son also had support from the Athletic Dept. and one of Cornell's head coaches, and would have played for CU if admitted. Considering also my participation in CAAAN (which enabled me to get to know someone in Admissions), my involvement in another alumni athletic organization, and my modest yet consistent gift-giving, I thought that I did as much as I could to help my kid.  The rest was up to my son and Cornell.  It didn't work out.  Sometimes my son says that he's interested in trying to transfer to Cornell, and at others, he's pretty pleased with Lafayette, and he has every reason to be.

Although I wish he was admitted, my reason for posting is not to complain or argue the merits of his candidacy, but rather to explain how strange it is not to be crazy about Cornell.  I want to know how others deal with it, and if the feeling goes away.  I reckon it does, and I hope it goes sooner than later.  Besides family, Cornell was probably the greatest thing that ever happened to me.  It's hard to reconcile.

[billhoward]

If Cornell turns down awesomely well qualified kids, they're going to do great things at places such as Lafayette (a gem of a small campus and a gorgeous football field, we discovered on a recent visit) or Lehigh (as if all of Cornell was built onto the side of Libe Slope). Recall also some studies from the turn of the decade saying college outcomes are more heavily influenced by SAT scores and family income than anything else. In other words, Cornell grads emerge rich and smart because they went in rich and smart.

Our older son (junior) is probably not going to look at Cornell while our ninth grader already has a short list of Cornell, Stanford, Cal, and Berkeley, which he believes is four separate institutions. Even if he's close to straight-A, he's going to need to look at Lafayettes and Vanderbilts and Hamiltons, too, and who knows if that's a sure thing. It's disheartening to have a ninth grader think about not what he wants to do with his outside time during his next four years, but what he may have to do look good for admissions committees. Is he to be yet another one of the zillion kids who does the Habitat for Humanity thing in Honduras? Should he stick out Scouts for his Eagle badge (something he actually wants to do)? And then, since he loves lacrosse, does he start (well, not this year) thinking about the schools that would want his caliber of long pole defense, on account of he's not the second coming of Mich Belisle or Ryan McClay.

In many ways it's even tougher being a kid these days. There is the compensating advantage of the awesome outfits the girls wear to class.

[KeithK]

[quote billhoward]There is the compensating advantage of the awesome outfits the girls wear to class.[/quote]You must not have daughters...

[Ben Rocky '04]

[quote KeithK][quote billhoward]There is the compensating advantage of the awesome outfits the girls wear to class.[/quote]You must not have daughters...[/quote]

Soon, it will be summer in DC.  G-Town is good for at least one thing. Wow, now I'm that old alumni.  
::popcorn::

[redhair34]

[quote chominky]
Although I wish he was admitted, my reason for posting is not to complain or argue the merits of his candidacy, but rather to explain how strange it is not to be crazy about Cornell.  I want to know how others deal with it, and if the feeling goes away.  I reckon it does, and I hope it goes sooner than later.  Besides family, Cornell was probably the greatest thing that ever happened to me.  It's hard to reconcile.[/quote]

I didn't take a look at this thread until now, but I hope you're still following it. I was in a similar but admittedly different situation this past year--my senior year at Cornell.  I wanted to go to Cornell Law School in the worst way.  I felt I was a pretty strong but clearly not a shoe-in applicant.  I finished in the top 5% of my class at the "school" at Cornell I was in (trying not to out myself), had great recommendations, etc. but my LSAT score was a tad lower than the median. Still I think I was a bit better than a borderline candidate.  To make a long story short, I was waitlisted, led to believe I had a very good chance of getting, then I was asked to jump through a number of hoops over the summer to get in off the waitlist before I was ultimately rejected in the end of August.  It was rough; like you, Cornell the greatest experience of my short life and I wanted more than anything to stay there.  For the first few months I had mixed feelings about the place.  But,  I've been back to campus (mostly for hockey games :-P) and I'm starting to feel better about the place. I just try to remember all the great times I had, people I met and that I shouldn't let a handful of admissions officers get in the way with how I feel about my alma mater or prevent me from staying in touch now that my days as a student are over.  


Oh and BTW, if all else fails, listen to "My Old Cornell" nonstop.

[nyc94]

Today's NY Times has a story about the number of high school seniors peaking soon.  Not much consolation for this year's seniors.

Math Suggests College Frenzy Will Soon Ease

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/03/09/education/09admissions.html?_r=1&ex=1362801600&en=397c41bbe66a4f30&ei=5088&partner=rssnyt&emc=rss&oref=slogin

"Projections show that by next year or the year after, the annual number of high school graduates in the United States will peak at about 2.9 million after a 15-year climb. The number is then expected to decline until about 2015. Most universities expect this to translate into fewer applications and less selectivity, with most students probably finding it easier to get into college."

[chominky]

Thanks, Redhair.  I took my 11-year-old son to the Cornell-Princeton basketball game on Saturday, which was good therapy.  BTW, I asked my Lafayette-bound son if he wanted to join us.  He didn't.  

My oldest daughter is a HS sophomore, and her #1 so far is Cornell too.  I told her not to rely on just her grades, but to work harder on her track and field skills.  What's wrong with this picture?  Sadly, it's true.

[ftyuv]

[quote chominky]I told her not to rely on just her grades, but to work harder on her track and field skills.  What's wrong with this picture?[/quote]

I guess it's all how you look at it, whether it's good or bad that colleges are nudging people in that non-academic direction.

Personally, I was very un-athletic growing up, and I got into colleges on the merit of grades, community service and other "academic" extracurriculars.  Looking back, if I had one regret -- other than not having a girlfriend -- it'd be that I didn't get seriously into sports earlier.  On a statistically level, it's no secret that Americans are getting fatter (not saying you or your family, of course; just the national average).

If colleges are morphing into institutions that reward more than just academic merit, it's probably one of the few things I don't think is wrong with the system of higher education we have in this country/world.

[KeithK]

[quote ftyuv][quote chominky]I told her not to rely on just her grades, but to work harder on her track and field skills.  What's wrong with this picture?[/quote]

I guess it's all how you look at it, whether it's good or bad that colleges are nudging people in that non-academic direction.

Personally, I was very un-athletic growing up, and I got into colleges on the merit of grades, community service and other "academic" extracurriculars.  Looking back, if I had one regret -- other than not having a girlfriend -- it'd be that I didn't get seriously into sports earlier.  On a statistically level, it's no secret that Americans are getting fatter (not saying you or your family, of course; just the national average).

If colleges are morphing into institutions that reward more than just academic merit, it's probably one of the few things I don't think is wrong with the system of higher education we have in this country/world.[/quote]
Cornell is supposed to be an institute of higher learning.  I fully support having athletic and extracurricular activities on a college campus.  But the fact is playing sports is not a qualification for higher learning.  Being good at running 400m or throwing a football has little relevance when it comes to writing a history paper or doing a linear algebra problem set or running a chemistry experiment.

I agree that dedication and success in athletics can lend some insight into the character of an individual and show such attributes as time management skills that might correlate well with academic success.  But that's on the margin.

If you feel otherwise then maybe we ought to be offering scholarships to boost the hockey team?  If having a great slapshot is relevant to success in higher education then we might as well spend money on it.

fWIW - I got into Cornell purely on the basis of academics.

[Beeeej]

[quote KeithK]If you feel otherwise then maybe we ought to be offering scholarships to boost the hockey team?  If having a great slapshot is relevant to success in higher education then we might as well spend money on it.[/quote]

Not sure how this is a sensible argument.  I don't think Cornell gives out scholarships for any other "merit" reason - why athletics?  The admissions staff may simply feel that athletes, like musicians and active volunteers, are more well-rounded individuals who will contribute more to the community.  Cornell doesn't offer dance scholarships any more than they do hockey scholarships.  Money doesn't belong in this particular debate.

[ftyuv]

[quote KeithK][quote ftyuv][quote chominky]I told her not to rely on just her grades, but to work harder on her track and field skills.  What's wrong with this picture?[/quote]

I guess it's all how you look at it, whether it's good or bad that colleges are nudging people in that non-academic direction.

Personally, I was very un-athletic growing up, and I got into colleges on the merit of grades, community service and other "academic" extracurriculars.  Looking back, if I had one regret -- other than not having a girlfriend -- it'd be that I didn't get seriously into sports earlier.  On a statistically level, it's no secret that Americans are getting fatter (not saying you or your family, of course; just the national average).

If colleges are morphing into institutions that reward more than just academic merit, it's probably one of the few things I don't think is wrong with the system of higher education we have in this country/world.[/quote]
Cornell is supposed to be an institute of higher learning.  I fully support having athletic and extracurricular activities on a college campus.  But the fact is playing sports is not a qualification for higher learning.  Being good at running 400m or throwing a football has little relevance when it comes to writing a history paper or doing a linear algebra problem set or running a chemistry experiment.

I agree that dedication and success in athletics can lend some insight into the character of an individual and show such attributes as time management skills that might correlate well with academic success.  But that's on the margin.

If you feel otherwise then maybe we ought to be offering scholarships to boost the hockey team?  If having a great slapshot is relevant to success in higher education then we might as well spend money on it.

fWIW - I got into Cornell purely on the basis of academics.[/quote]

Yes, and writing a history paper or doing a linear algebra problem set has little to do with what a lot of people who do those things in college end up doing in life.

The point of my first post was that the notion of "[University] is supposed to be an institute of higher learning" is outdated.  Universities have evolved past that simple definition.  Some of what they've changed into is good, some of it sucks. Of all the changes, their shift towards promoting athleticism is one I actually support.

And if you're preparing for the "writing a history paper may not be a directly transferable skill, but it still teaches you things you use later in life," then I think sports definitely have just as much benefit.

[KeithK]

[quote Beeeej][quote KeithK]If you feel otherwise then maybe we ought to be offering scholarships to boost the hockey team?  If having a great slapshot is relevant to success in higher education then we might as well spend money on it.[/quote]

Not sure how this is a sensible argument.  I don't think Cornell gives out scholarships for any other "merit" reason - why athletics?  The admissions staff may simply feel that athletes, like musicians and active volunteers, are more well-rounded individuals who will contribute more to the community.  Cornell doesn't offer dance scholarships any more than they do hockey scholarships.  Money doesn't belong in this particular debate.[/quote]
OK, it's a little weak.  But it sounded good at the time. :-)

[KeithK]

[quote ftyuv]The point of my first post was that the notion of "[University] is supposed to be an institute of higher learning" is outdated.[/quote]
Well, we'll have to disagree on that.  IMO learning is still the primary purpose.  Everything else is secondary.

[ftyuv]

[quote KeithK][quote ftyuv]The point of my first post was that the notion of "[University] is supposed to be an institute of higher learning" is outdated.[/quote]
Well, we'll have to disagree on that.  IMO learning is still the primary purpose.  Everything else is secondary.[/quote]Agree to disagree.  When in Rome.  A whale's V...


I know most people on this board love Cornell, so I'll spare everyone the embittered rant.  PM me for details if you want to know what I think is the primary purpose of institutions of higher learning.

[billhoward]

[quote KeithK][quote billhoward]There is the compensating advantage of the awesome outfits the girls wear to class.[/quote]You must not have daughters...[/quote]
Our neighbors' daughters think the outfits are awesome, too. Leaving only their parents a mite unhappy.