Generic Off Season Thread

I could root for him if he went to Cornell.

But it would be so much more fun to root against him.

css228

Josh '99

Aaron M. Griffin

Trotsky

pfibiger
I imagine this means Mitch Gillam will accelerate and come in this year instead of next (assuming he's already been admitted and deferred).

Very interesting. Gillam is the second-oldest of the non-Fall prospects (after Woody). He turns 20 in September and is almost 2 years younger than Willcox and Stoick.

This in turn sets up the recruiting for the next goaltending "blue chippah" for Fall 2014 rather than 2015. And on the wheels turn.

Marty Brodeur's son, Anthony, a senior goalie, wants to play in college. Which schools interest him? "All of them," his HS coach told me.

— Matt Slovin (@MattSlovin) July 9, 2012

What better school is there for a goalie to attend than Cornell? Anthony Brodeur will be a senior at Shattuck-St. Mary's during the 2012-13 season.

Is that Uncle Daddy's son with his first wife, or from after he cheated on her with her sister-in-law and then married her?

(From the "realism instead of vitriol" department, a blue chip recruit attending Shattuck isn't all that likely to wind up at Cornell.)

Yeah... I couldn't root for a Broduer.

You'd root for him and love it if he gets drafted by the Rangers. Don't kid yourself. Just like I'll be rooting hard for Stephane Matteau's son (who's named Stefan Matteau, not Stephane Matteau Jr.) if he ever makes it to the NHL.

Ronald '09

css228

Josh '99

Aaron M. Griffin

Trotsky

pfibiger
I imagine this means Mitch Gillam will accelerate and come in this year instead of next (assuming he's already been admitted and deferred).

Very interesting. Gillam is the second-oldest of the non-Fall prospects (after Woody). He turns 20 in September and is almost 2 years younger than Willcox and Stoick.

This in turn sets up the recruiting for the next goaltending "blue chippah" for Fall 2014 rather than 2015. And on the wheels turn.

Marty Brodeur's son, Anthony, a senior goalie, wants to play in college. Which schools interest him? "All of them," his HS coach told me.

— Matt Slovin (@MattSlovin) July 9, 2012

What better school is there for a goalie to attend than Cornell? Anthony Brodeur will be a senior at Shattuck-St. Mary's during the 2012-13 season.

Is that Uncle Daddy's son with his first wife, or from after he cheated on her with her sister-in-law and then married her?

(From the "realism instead of vitriol" department, a blue chip recruit attending Shattuck isn't all that likely to wind up at Cornell.)

Yeah... I couldn't root for a Broduer.

You'd root for him and love it if he gets drafted by the Rangers. Don't kid yourself. Just like I'll be rooting hard for Stephane Matteau's son (who's named Stefan Matteau, not Stephane Matteau Jr.) if he ever makes it to the NHL.

I'm from Philadelphia... so no... I'd definitely not root for him if he were drafted by the Rangers

css228

Ronald '09

css228

Josh '99

Aaron M. Griffin

Trotsky

pfibiger
I imagine this means Mitch Gillam will accelerate and come in this year instead of next (assuming he's already been admitted and deferred).

Very interesting. Gillam is the second-oldest of the non-Fall prospects (after Woody). He turns 20 in September and is almost 2 years younger than Willcox and Stoick.

This in turn sets up the recruiting for the next goaltending "blue chippah" for Fall 2014 rather than 2015. And on the wheels turn.

Marty Brodeur's son, Anthony, a senior goalie, wants to play in college. Which schools interest him? "All of them," his HS coach told me.

— Matt Slovin (@MattSlovin) July 9, 2012

What better school is there for a goalie to attend than Cornell? Anthony Brodeur will be a senior at Shattuck-St. Mary's during the 2012-13 season.

Is that Uncle Daddy's son with his first wife, or from after he cheated on her with her sister-in-law and then married her?

(From the "realism instead of vitriol" department, a blue chip recruit attending Shattuck isn't all that likely to wind up at Cornell.)

Yeah... I couldn't root for a Broduer.

You'd root for him and love it if he gets drafted by the Rangers. Don't kid yourself. Just like I'll be rooting hard for Stephane Matteau's son (who's named Stefan Matteau, not Stephane Matteau Jr.) if he ever makes it to the NHL.

I'm from Philadelphia... so no... I'd definitely not root for him if he were drafted by the Rangers

Huh. So you will boo him no matter where he ends up.

Marty Brodeur's son, Anthony, a senior goalie, wants to play in college. Which schools interest him? "All of them," his HS coach told me.

— Matt Slovin (@MattSlovin) July 9, 2012

For those who don't know, Matt Slovin is at the center of a controversy regarding OHL player poaching. He reported an anonymous source's statement that the Kitchener Rangers have offered Michigan blue-chip recruit Jacob Trouba $200,000. The Kitchener Rangers, the team that signed Cornell-recruit Ben Thomson, has taken steps to sue The Michigan Daily for libel.

Rumors of under-the-table payments by OHL teams, especially the Kitchener Rangers, have been rampant, but it has never been proven.

Since February, I have gotten to know Matt Slovin and his work. His reporting has appeared impeccable, and I cannot fathom that he and The Michigan Daily would run that article without believing the source was sharing reliable information.

That said, I have my own anti-CHL biases regarding this controversy.

RichH

css228
Yeah... I couldn't root for a Broduer.

Really. You couldn't? You would root for Cornell to lose then, because of some relation? What if he's a great kid? And a talented player?

You'd do what I do with alex Rodriguez. You root for the jersey, not the player.

RichH
Really. You couldn't? You would root for Cornell to lose then, because of some relation? What if he's a great kid? And a talented player?

I'm sure Brodeur is a BC/BU kinda guy, but I'd have no problem rooting for him in a Cornell sweater. Hell, I'd have no problem rooting for a Cleary if he came to Cornell (actually, that would be extra funny).

Wasn't the son who fooled around.

Thread drift...........two of my boys went to Cornell hockey camp this past week. Espo is still in an air cast, he did not skate all week (with the kids at least). High ankle sprain, right? Obviously takes a long time to heal fully, must be frustrating for him.

Topher Scott was there. He was very enthusiastic with the kids (and the parents!). Nice to see him back on campus, I have to believe with his approach he'll be a good recruiter. I love his attitude.

Joe Nieuwendyk was there the last day, he was kind enough to sign a lot of jerseys for the kids. He seemed relaxed, no expressions that would indicate "I just paid those 40+ year old guys how much??" or "Sure he can put up points with Claude Giroux, but so could I!!"

I didn't pester him with any such questions, that would be rude to do in his old barn.

The Chicago Park District, proprietors of Soldier Field have lined up Notre Dame, Miami (Ohio), Minnesota, and Wisconsin for a double-header on February 17, Hockey City Classic. They hope it leads to an NHL Winter Classic game in the future, having lost out to Wrigley Field as the Chicago site in 2009. Chicago Tribune story here.

RatushnyFan
Thread drift...........

I think this has already been addressed on this thread, but can a "generic" thread drift?

Yes it can. Simply by changing topics. See p. 47 of Strunk & White's new book on posting on the Internet.

RatushnyFan
Yes it can. Simply by changing topics. See p. 47 of Strunk & White's new book on posting on the Internet.

The most recent edition notes how most media have abandoned the historical convention of capitalizing "internet" when referring to "the Internet." The word internet, without capitalization, is now the preferred form of the noun.

It's the Internet...........without it, I have nothing. I choose to capitalize.

RatushnyFan
It's the Internet...........without it, I have nothing. I choose to capitalize.

Intern_t to the truly observant.

Brown's top recruit, Kevin Roy, has recently decommitted, along with his brother. Bummer for them.

scoop85
Brown's top recruit, Kevin Roy, has recently decommitted, along with his brother. Bummer for them.

Wouldn't surprise me if he ends up at Northeastern. Their new coach is a very impressive guy.

Cole Bardreau invited to US WJ Camp. nhl.com

The Rancor
Cole Bardreau invited to US WJ Camp. nhl.com

As is Joakim Ryan.

And article and video on D'Agostino with Penquins at NHL.com.

Jim Hyla

The Rancor
Cole Bardreau invited to US WJ Camp. nhl.com

As is Joakim Ryan.

Cole Bardreau made the roster of 22 out of the United States World Junior camp.

Looks like we're in the market for another defenseman, as Mathieu Brisson has decided to leave school:

Defenseman Mathieu Brisson, unhappy with his ice time @cornell, has decided to report to the #QMJHL as an overager. #Remparts

— Claudia Fortier (@cfortier23) August 7, 2012

pfibiger
Looks like we're in the market for another defenseman, as Mathieu Brisson has decided to leave school:

Defenseman Mathieu Brisson, unhappy with his ice time @cornell, has decided to report to the #QMJHL as an overager. #Remparts

— Claudia Fortier (@cfortier23) August 7, 2012

That's too bad. Given the depth and talent on the blue line, he must have figured he wasn't going to be a regular in the rotation this year. Best of luck to him.

scoop85

pfibiger
Looks like we're in the market for another defenseman, as Mathieu Brisson has decided to leave school:

Defenseman Mathieu Brisson, unhappy with his ice time @cornell, has decided to report to the #QMJHL as an overager. #Remparts

— Claudia Fortier (@cfortier23) August 7, 2012

That's too bad. Given the depth and talent on the blue line, he must have figured he wasn't going to be a regular in the rotation this year. Best of luck to him.

After playing in 17 games his freshman year, he was down to 10 as a sophomore, so he probably had reason to figure that.

Beeeej

scoop85

pfibiger
Looks like we're in the market for another defenseman, as Mathieu Brisson has decided to leave school:

Defenseman Mathieu Brisson, unhappy with his ice time @cornell, has decided to report to the #QMJHL as an overager. #Remparts

— Claudia Fortier (@cfortier23) August 7, 2012

That's too bad. Given the depth and talent on the blue line, he must have figured he wasn't going to be a regular in the rotation this year. Best of luck to him.

After playing in 17 games his freshman year, he was down to 10 as a sophomore, so he probably had reason to figure that.

How come the CU site lists him as GP 15, for last year?

Jim Hyla

Beeeej

scoop85

pfibiger
Looks like we're in the market for another defenseman, as Mathieu Brisson has decided to leave school:

Defenseman Mathieu Brisson, unhappy with his ice time @cornell, has decided to report to the #QMJHL as an overager. #Remparts

— Claudia Fortier (@cfortier23) August 7, 2012

That's too bad. Given the depth and talent on the blue line, he must have figured he wasn't going to be a regular in the rotation this year. Best of luck to him.

After playing in 17 games his freshman year, he was down to 10 as a sophomore, so he probably had reason to figure that.

How come the CU site lists him as GP 15, for last year?

Because I'd apparently been looking at the wrong stat - ECAC regular season games only. But that means he was down from 27 his freshman year to 15, so that's pretty drastic as well.

Seeing as the siting of the ECAC championship weekend composed much of the discussion on this thread, I'll put this here:

CHN has learned that ECAC tournament headed back to Lake Placid in 2014. News conference and official announcement coming Tuesday.

— College Hockey News (@chnews) August 10, 2012

Well, shit. I know some people are happy - and since I couldn't even be bothered to go to AC me and my opinion can go pound sand - but... shit. At least if it were in AC I could go if the stars aligned properly.

CHN has learned that ECAC tournament headed back to Lake Placid in 2014. News conference and official announcement coming Tuesday.

— College Hockey News (@chnews) August 10, 2012

Per Adam Wodon, "Lake Placid won out in a tight vote that included Providence and Albany."

[www.collegehockeynews.com]

ugarte
Well, shit. I know some people are happy - and since I couldn't even be bothered to go to AC me and my opinion can go pound sand - but... shit. At least if it were in AC I could go if the stars aligned properly.

ECAC stupidity increases one more notch. Boneheads. Ridiculous freak-sized rink.

Wow. Very surprised. I'm glad a new generation will get to enjoy Lake Placid.

Is Mud Puddles still in business?

Too bad. Doubtful I'd ever make the trip up to LP.

Jordan 04
Too bad. Doubtful I'd ever make the trip up to LP.

For all my bitching about the distance, the expense, and the hotel cancellation policies, it really is a beautiful place, and they certainly have a better handle than Atlantic City does on how to host a hockey tournament weekend.

I might complain about it, but if Cornell makes it, I'll probably go.

So, do we start making hotel reservations now, so we can get a room in the town, and then kiss that money goodbye if we don't make it? Or will Adam be correct that the policy will change? This is ridiculous. The only good thing is that I might be able to ski a half day at Whiteface. Let's hope that it's a short stay. I wonder how much money they got with this move. I can come up with more negatives, but will save them for later.

jkahn

CHN has learned that ECAC tournament headed back to Lake Placid in 2014. News conference and official announcement coming Tuesday.

— College Hockey News (@chnews) August 10, 2012

Per Adam Wodon, "Lake Placid won out in a tight vote that included Providence and Albany."

[www.collegehockeynews.com]

Well, that's news that Providence submitted a formal bid, it seems. That was always an intriguing option, in my eye. I would have preferred there or Albany, but anything to get us out of AC.

Since I'm fond of non-car transportation for hockey trips, I just learned that Amtrak does service Lake Placid (bus transfer off the Adirondack route from Westport), so one could travel from NYC or Albany without a car.

I'm one of those people who think this is probably the best of a miserable set of options.

For me, LP always had more going for it than the tournament. The birdwatching is great up there (and on the way home), and if they open the bobsled run, that is a blast.

Now hopefully the hotel deposit situation got fixed. If that happened, nothing will stop me from going if we're in the tourney.

Al, that stupidity includes the schools that voted for it, so you'll have to be sure you want to call them all stupid.

Mudpuddles is no longer Mudpuddles ... The building is there, but now called Wiseguys. I haven't been in it...I only know this because I'm coincidentally in town for the World Junior Evaluation Camp, and noticed.

I'm going to be writing another article on this soon, but I know that one counter-argument to my April article that advocated for LP was that the mystique of the place meant nothing, or less, to "kids today." I can say this is universally untrue. Every player I've spoken to at camp, most without prompting, have talked about the incredible feeling of being there. They all know the history, they've all seen the movie, they all get the significance, and, most importantly, they all personally feel the significance.

Jim ... I haven't been able to ask yet about hotels. I don't know if there was a guarantee on that yet or not. I will be asking. If the answer is no, then I will certainly be critical of that component of it.

adamw
Al, that stupidity includes the schools that voted for it, so you'll have to be sure you want to call them all stupid.

I'm quite sure, Adam. Trust me.

RichH
Since I'm fond of non-car transportation for hockey trips, I just learned that Amtrak does service Lake Placid (bus transfer off the Adirondack route from Westport), so one could travel from NYC or Albany without a car.

Given that I have recently done the non-car trip to Placid, I will opine that your best option, and a reasonably comfortable one at that, is actually to chop short at Albany and take Adirondack Trailways there and back. The Westport shuttle is convenient but slow and expensive; the trip from Albany is longer (bus-wise) but cheaper when combined with a discount ticket via Amtrak to Albany. I hate cabs, but cab is your best option between the bus station and the Amtrak station across the river—it's only about $10. Still cheaper overall than the Westport shuttle.

Nitwits!! Fucking nitwits!!

Oh well, at least with this much advance notice it's easy to develop more worthwhile activities for that weekend of March over the next few years.

The Hockey East tournament is looking better all the time. A slightly better brand of hockey and there's always BOSTON to enjoy during the off-hockey hours!! Easy choice to make...

There ought to be a way to "timeshare" reservations between fans of the teams that play in the QF. It's the internet age. Somebody can make a tidy sum with a 5% markup that insures against getting stuck with tickets if your team is eliminated.

adamw
Al, that stupidity includes the schools that voted for it, so you'll have to be sure you want to call them all stupid.

Mudpuddles is no longer Mudpuddles ... The building is there, but now called Wiseguys. I haven't been in it...I only know this because I'm coincidentally in town for the World Junior Evaluation Camp, and noticed.

I'm going to be writing another article on this soon, but I know that one counter-argument to my April article that advocated for LP was that the mystique of the place meant nothing, or less, to "kids today." I can say this is universally untrue. Every player I've spoken to at camp, most without prompting, have talked about the incredible feeling of being there. They all know the history, they've all seen the movie, they all get the significance, and, most importantly, they all personally feel the significance.

Jim ... I haven't been able to ask yet about hotels. I don't know if there was a guarantee on that yet or not. I will be asking. If the answer is no, then I will certainly be critical of that component of it.

Adam, I assume that the Camp you were at was for an American team. I would think that the Canadian players don't have a similar feeling overall.

IMO, there are two problems with LP that make either Albany or Providence better -- the ice size and the difficulty to make last-minute plans for attendance. To me that outways the benefits of LP as a recruiting tool and the fact that the town historically has supported the tourney. JMHO.

ursusminor

IMO, there are two problems with LP that make either Albany or Providence better -- the ice size and the difficulty to make last-minute plans for attendance. To me that outways the benefits of LP as a recruiting tool and the fact that the town historically has supported the tourney. JMHO.

A way to keep the LP/ECAC connection and alleviate some of the drawbacks is to use LP for some king of ECAC Invitational, sort of like the old GLI. Every year 3 ECAC teams and a guest play a two day tournament in November(?). Every ECAC players gets to do it once. The large ice isn't impacting league titles and folks can book well in advance because the field will be set well in advance. Only issue is attendance but that's going to be an issue in LP Round 2 without Vermont and if Clarkson and SLU don't make it anyway. If you keep CU, SLU, and CCT apart in the rotation you can get some balance...

I don't know, it's something. I enjoyed going to Lake Placid as a student and would like for younger fans to get that experience too but I would almost certainly not make the trip now due to the distance and expense. I fear that with Cornell's recent, prolonged, success and national expectations, the Red contingent will not be as strong in LP this time around. As has been kicked around here repeatedly, with sights set on NCAAs and more at large bids available, the ECAC tournament has taken a diminished role in a lot of fans' minds it seems.

ursusminor
Adam, I assume that the Camp you were at was for an American team. I would think that the Canadian players don't have a similar feeling overall.

True, of course, however I'm sure Canadian players also appreciate its significance, and the overall point is that the ECAC being associated with Lake Placid gives it some credibility that the other places don't. To someone in Canada, you can't compare Joe Louis Arena with Albany. But compared to Lake Placid, at least it's something. It doesn't feel as much like an admission of defeat that "we are too small for big arenas" ...even though they are. It feels more like, "we are good enough to have our own cool place too."

IMO, there are two problems with LP that make either Albany or Providence better -- the ice size and the difficulty to make last-minute plans for attendance. To me that outways the benefits of LP as a recruiting tool and the fact that the town historically has supported the tourney. JMHO.

Some good news on this front. They are in the middle of constructing a brand new Hampton Inn here near the arena. Should alleviate things at least a little, we can hope.

Chris '03
I fear that with Cornell's recent, prolonged, success and national expectations, the Red contingent will not be as strong in LP this time around. As has been kicked around here repeatedly, with sights set on NCAAs and more at large bids available, the ECAC tournament has taken a diminished role in a lot of fans' minds it seems.

I hope that's not the case. As much as I like the NCAAs, they will always be the cherry on top. The ECAC tourney is our tourney. I'm glad to see it back closer to where it belongs.

Now they just need a 15k facility in downtown Ithaca...

Beeeej

Jordan 04
Too bad. Doubtful I'd ever make the trip up to LP.

For all my bitching about the distance, the expense, and the hotel cancellation policies, it really is a beautiful place, and they certainly have a better handle than Atlantic City does on how to host a hockey tournament weekend.

I might complain about it, but if Cornell makes it, I'll probably go.

Yes. It's lovely. That's about it. I enjoyed my trips there; of course, that was when I didn't have to worry about transportation, accommodation, or other expenses. Or using vacation days.

But now it makes pretty much zero sense for me. I'm not sure how a town is evaluated on "how to host a hockey tournament weekend". Personally, as long as there's a rink and a way to buy tickets to see the game, I couldn't care less what else happens around it. In fact, I know it's blasphemy 'round these parts, but I found gambling, shopping, and strolling the boardwalk to be the most enjoyable pre- and post- game activities I've had at an ECAC tournament. (Aside from the year we made our Sweet 16 run, but that was obviously uncorrelated to the location of the ECAC's).

Adam, I'm sure you feel good about this; just as I'm sure you know I hate the choice. So let's look at the positives and negatives.

Positives:
1: We get to talk about something related to hockey in the summer.
2: It's got mystique.
3: The town loves us. Why shouldn't they, we bring money.
4: Maybe there is one, but I can't think of another.


Negatives:
1: It's difficult to get to, especially for the casual fan. Does anyone really think someone, at the last minute, will just decide to go.

2: Not enough easy and reasonable rooms. Maybe the Hampton Inn will help, but if the 7 day cancelation remains, it should be a deal breaker. I went to all LP tourneys. My wife didn't mind, and my daughter was too young to have a say. If it had been the last few years, there would have been no way I could have paid for a hotel a year in advance, and then thrown that money away if CU wasn't there.

3: No easy parking. If you didn't get there early, no place to park.

4: It all leads up to not great crowds, unless SLU +/or CCT makes it. Go Casey.

5: Too big an ice surface. Why in the world would we want to pick a champion based upon who does best on Olympic ice, when the NCAAs can't be on that.

6: Will we get TV coverage? Albany had TW, especially with Union now a force.

7: The best newspaper coverage is the Watertown Times, wow. In Albany we at least had the 3 local papers, 2 of whom had strong ties to ECAC schools, and the third has the name of the rink.

That's it for now, but I can't emphasize more how difficult it will be for the less than aggressive fan.

EDIT: If anyone wants a view of attendance at all 3 recent venues, here's Ken Schott's column.

1. Difficult, but worth it

2. Difficult, but hopefully better than last time around...we'll see

3. Better than paying up the wazoo at other venues...minor inconvenience

4. Crowds have not been, nor would they be, great anywhere

5. From everyone I've ever spoken to, including players, coaches, etc..., it's only a handful of coaches who care about this. The players don't mind at all. They say they adjust quickly. That said, ideally it would be better at 200x85, but again, not enough to offset the plusses, IMO

6. As I said months ago, I don't see this as any better or worse a possibility. I've spoken to people about this. Stay tuned for Hagwell quotes on the issue. Nobody would be in better position to know than him.

7. There's a local daily, the Adirondack Daily...and the Lake Placid weekly. And the Albany papers will come if their teams are in it. And I don't think it matters anyway. The best coverage is on College Hockey News ... Non-issue.

The one truth that we all should realize after going through all of this whining/bitching back in the 90's. There is absolutely nobody in the ECACHL office or the athletic depts of any of the schools who give a damn about our opinions, pro or con, and justifications.

It is all a pointless exercise here.

To those who like it: Enjoy!!!

To those who do not: Make the best of it.

Back to planning my alternate March activities. Carry on.......

I think they do ... But each athletic dept. cares only about their own fan base, and even within that, opinions are all over the map.

In terms of policy, does the ECAC even exist separate from the agendas of the 12 ADs?

adamw
I think they do ... But each athletic dept. cares only about their own fan base, and even within that, opinions are all over the map.

I think you're fooling yourself on that.. Perhaps because this went that way you wanted.

Whatever. If the athletic dept. cared about only their own fan base, just what evidence do we have that they reached out to their fan base for opinions. If they were foolish enough to sample ELF opinion, it would seem that CU athletic dept. would have voted against it. Opinions here seemed to favor NOT going to LP. Of course, it's silly to think that this is a good sampling of opinion for the Cornell fan base.

Heading to Boston in March is going to be so much fun...

redice
Whatever. If the athletic dept. cared about only their own fan base, just what evidence do we have that they reached out to their fan base for opinions.

I'm not saying any of them specifically reached out to ask ... But I can tell you this - they acted in the way they thought their fan bases wanted. Perhaps they were wrong in their assumption - but I'm sure that's what they did. At least most of them.

Trotsky
In terms of policy, does the ECAC even exist separate from the agendas of the 12 ADs?

Not really ... the 12 ADs (or their reps - asst. AD Anita Brenner in Cornell's case) decide on each matter based on a simple vote. Though there are the usual assortment of committees that can recommend things to the whole.

adamw

redice
Whatever. If the athletic dept. cared about only their own fan base, just what evidence do we have that they reached out to their fan base for opinions.

I'm not saying any of them specifically reached out to ask ... But I can tell you this - they acted in the way they thought their fan bases wanted. Perhaps they were wrong in their assumption - but I'm sure that's what they did. At least most of them.

It seems like assumptions are being made and not all by athletic depts........

redice
It seems like assumptions are being made and not all by athletic depts........

meaning?

Do we know which site Cornell favored? Are the votes secret? It's not exactly national security.

Trotsky
Do we know which site Cornell favored? Are the votes secret? It's not exactly national security.

The collective we does not know, no ... Funny, the line about national security was exactly what I said ... but they won't officially say who voted for what. We'll see what comes out over the coming weeks. To the extent that I know, I can't say ... sorry for the tease - I'm only saying that so you don't think I'm talking completely out my rear

adamw

redice
It seems like assumptions are being made and not all by athletic depts........

meaning?

It sure reads to me that you are making certain assumptions on how the process was handled by the athletic depts. On what do you base these assumptions?

Read your earlier posting:

adamw
I'm not saying any of them specifically reached out to ask ... But I can tell you this - they acted in the way they thought their fan bases wanted. Perhaps they were wrong in their assumption - but I'm sure that's what they did. At least most of them.

How can you possibly pretend to be in the heads of these people to know the nature of their thought processes?

I'm just sayin.......

redice
How can you possibly pretend to be in the heads of these people to know the nature of their thought processes?

I'm just sayin.......

How do you know what I know and don't know?

adamw

redice
How can you possibly pretend to be in the heads of these people to know the nature of their thought processes?

I'm just sayin.......

How do you know what I know and don't know?

Yawn....

Adam, the point is, how can you know, or think you know, what your fan base wants if you don't ask them? If their concern was attendance, then they should have hired a polling company to ask. Otherwise you've just got 12 men, whoops people, in a room; and we should know how fair that can be.

Oh God. Let the season start soon. PLEASE!

Jim Hyla
Adam, the point is, how can you know, or think you know, what your fan base wants if you don't ask them? If their concern was attendance, then they should have hired a polling company to ask. Otherwise you've just got 12 men, whoops people, in a room; and we should know how fair that can be.

I didn't say you were wrong ... I just said that I know that the ADs voted how they *thought* their fan bases would want it, in most cases. I was challenged on that statement. I didn't say their thought process was correct. I don't think any of us knows what the entirety of the fan base wants for sure.

Ultimately, the actual attendance will tell what the fanbases want.

The far more important fact is that Cornell now has only one chance to win in Atlantic City. Given that Cornell has won in every ECAC host city, that makes 2012-13 a must win season!

Trotsky
The far more important fact is that Cornell now has only one chance to win in Atlantic City. Given that Cornell has won in every ECAC host city, that makes 2012-13 a must win season!

That's what I have been saying for some time now. 13 in '13.

Aaron M. Griffin

Trotsky
The far more important fact is that Cornell now has only one chance to win in Atlantic City. Given that Cornell has won in every ECAC host city, that makes 2012-13 a must win season!

That's what I have been saying for some time now. 13 in '13.

Agreed!

And in case anyone cares about the hotel situation (which it seems all of you do...) a quick check on Priceline reveals the cancellation policy for a stay from March 22-24 of this year:

For the room type you've selected, you can cancel your reservation for a full refund up until noon on Friday, March 15th (local hotel time). If you decide to cancel your reservation anytime between noon on Friday, March 15th and noon on Friday, March 22nd (local hotel time), the hotel requires payment for the first night's stay. You will be charged for the first night's stay including taxes and fees. Any remaining amount will be refunded to you. Refunds or cancellations are not available after noon local hotel time on your day of arrival (Friday, March 22nd).

This is the Lakeview Inn.

Depending on the room type with the Courtyard by Marriot, you get either:

Good news! This reservation qualifies for free cancellation up until 11:59 PM local hotel time on Monday, March 18, 2013. If cancelled or modified up to 3 days before date of arrival, no fee will be charged. If cancelled or modified later or in case of no-show, 100 percent of the first night will be charged. Any cancellation and/or change fees described here are charged directly by the hotel.

or

For the room type you've selected, you can cancel your reservation for a full refund up until noon on Thursday, March 21st (local hotel time). If you decide to cancel your reservation anytime between noon on Thursday, March 21st and noon on Friday, March 22nd (local hotel time), the hotel requires payment for the first night's stay. You will be charged for the first night's stay including taxes and fees. Any remaining amount will be refunded to you. Refunds or cancellations are not available after noon local hotel time on your day of arrival (Friday, March 22nd).

Another one...

Good news! This reservation qualifies for free cancellation up until 11:59 PM local hotel time on Monday, March 18, 2013. If cancelled or modified up to 3 days before date of arrival, no fee will be charged. If cancelled or modified later or in case of no-show, 100 percent of the first night will be charged. Any cancellation and/or change fees described here are charged directly by the hotel.

That hardly sounds Draconian. That is the Northwoods Inn.

The EconoLodge Lake Placid has an even more flexible cancellation policy:

For the room type you've selected, you can cancel your reservation for a full refund up until noon on Thursday, March 21st (local hotel time). If you decide to cancel your reservation anytime between noon on Thursday, March 21st and noon on Friday, March 22nd (local hotel time), the hotel requires payment for the first night's stay. You will be charged for the first night's stay including taxes and fees. Any remaining amount will be refunded to you. Refunds or cancellations are not available after noon local hotel time on your day of arrival (Friday, March 22nd).

The Town and Country Motor Inn allows cancellation 10 days prior or elsetotal reservation fee will be charged.

Depending on the room type in the Crowne Plaza Resort Hotel, it is either non-refundable or

This reservation qualifies for free cancellation up until 11:59 PM local hotel time on Tuesday, March 19, 2013. If cancelled or modified up to 2 days before date of arrival, no fee will be charged. If cancelled or modified later or in case of no-show, 100 percent of the first night will be charged. Any cancellation and/or change fees described here are charged directly by the hotel.

Least notice goes to the Whiteface Lodge:

This reservation qualifies for free cancellation up until 11:59 PM local hotel time on Tuesday, February 19, 2013. If cancelled or modified up to 30 days before date of arrival, no fee will be charged. If cancelled or modified later or in case of no-show, 100 percent of the first night will be charged.

The Lake Placid Summit Hotel and Kiwassa Lake B&B and Cabins allow for no cancellation/refunds whatsoever.

So yes, some still have these rules in place, but a Bed and Breakfast or a Lodge are places which have these rules typically regardless of location. If you want to go only for our team though, there are more than enough options that allow for cancellation with as little as 3 days. And these are only the hotels in Lake Placid, proper. Once you go SLIGHTLY outside of Lake Placid, they are all refundable. So the hotel argument to me seems to be invalid.

bnr24
So yes, some still have these rules in place, but a Bed and Breakfast or a Lodge are places which have these rules typically regardless of location. If you want to go only for our team though, there are more than enough options that allow for cancellation with as little as 3 days. And these are only the hotels in Lake Placid, proper. Once you go SLIGHTLY outside of Lake Placid, they are all refundable. So the hotel argument to me seems to be invalid.

Not really, you're going to need to know the policy during ECAC week. What they do now doesn't mean what they will do then. Many hotels have different policies for major events. Certainly those were not the policies when the ECAC was there before. Hopefully it will all be explained tomorrow.

adamw

Jim Hyla
Adam, the point is, how can you know, or think you know, what your fan base wants if you don't ask them? If their concern was attendance, then they should have hired a polling company to ask. Otherwise you've just got 12 men, whoops people, in a room; and we should know how fair that can be.

I didn't say you were wrong ... I just said that I know that the ADs voted how they *thought* their fan bases would want it, in most cases. I was challenged on that statement. I didn't say their thought process was correct. I don't think any of us knows what the entirety of the fan base wants for sure.

Adam, I wrote my statement poorly. I didn't mean what you, meaning Adam, know, rather how can the ADs think they know what their fans want, if they never ask? Sorry that I made it sound like I was referring to you.

edit: And I'm glad CHN has links to the articles in the "Lake Placid News" and "Adirondack Daily Enterprise", the same article in each. It's so good to know that we've got those great papers publicizing it.

kingpin248
Seeing as the siting of the ECAC championship weekend composed much of the discussion on this thread, I'll put this here:

CHN has learned that ECAC tournament headed back to Lake Placid in 2014. News conference and official announcement coming Tuesday.

— College Hockey News (@chnews) August 10, 2012

Huh. So THAT'S why there were 43 new posts in the offseason thread over an otherwise uneventful weekend.

RichH
Since I'm fond of non-car transportation for hockey trips, I just learned that Amtrak does service Lake Placid (bus transfer off the Adirondack route from Westport), so one could travel from NYC or Albany without a car.

But you lose the fun of getting a ticket if you drive 36 MPH on Rt 73.

Crowne Plaza has a decent bar with a nice view and the rink is just a stumble down a (huge) hill...........decent place. I stayed there in March while attending my son's tournament. One of my high school buddies is married to a woman whose family owns the hotel.

I like going to LP even though it is a hike. The restaurants, bars, shops, I think it's just fun. I was < 2 hours from Albany near NYC so I won't get to go as much with my own kids playing most weekends. But I can hope and sometimes good things happen. Just ask Douglas Murray.

Jim Hyla

bnr24
So yes, some still have these rules in place, but a Bed and Breakfast or a Lodge are places which have these rules typically regardless of location. If you want to go only for our team though, there are more than enough options that allow for cancellation with as little as 3 days. And these are only the hotels in Lake Placid, proper. Once you go SLIGHTLY outside of Lake Placid, they are all refundable. So the hotel argument to me seems to be invalid.

Not really, you're going to need to know the policy during ECAC week. What they do now doesn't mean what they will do then. Many hotels have different policies for major events. Certainly those were not the policies when the ECAC was there before. Hopefully it will all be explained tomorrow.

What makes you think that it will not be made even better a year later than that and during a weekend when demand will be high? They will make even MORE money if they are able to make better cancellation policies during that weekend. Besides, since when have hotels gotten MORE draconian in their policies into the future when it is already almost unheard of for places which are not B&Bs or Resorts.

bnr24

Jim Hyla

bnr24
So yes, some still have these rules in place, but a Bed and Breakfast or a Lodge are places which have these rules typically regardless of location. If you want to go only for our team though, there are more than enough options that allow for cancellation with as little as 3 days. And these are only the hotels in Lake Placid, proper. Once you go SLIGHTLY outside of Lake Placid, they are all refundable. So the hotel argument to me seems to be invalid.

Not really, you're going to need to know the policy during ECAC week. What they do now doesn't mean what they will do then. Many hotels have different policies for major events. Certainly those were not the policies when the ECAC was there before. Hopefully it will all be explained tomorrow.

What makes you think that it will not be made even better a year later than that and during a weekend when demand will be high? They will make even MORE money if they are able to make better cancellation policies during that weekend. Besides, since when have hotels gotten MORE draconian in their policies into the future when it is already almost unheard of for places which are not B&Bs or Resorts.

Ummm. Past experience?

I see LP is winning the eLynah poll up top ... guess they really did listen to the fan base

adamw
I see LP is winning the eLynah poll up top ... guess they really did listen to the fan base

Exactly how many shell accounts do you have to stuff the eLynah ballot box?

Al DeFlorio

bnr24

Jim Hyla

bnr24
So yes, some still have these rules in place, but a Bed and Breakfast or a Lodge are places which have these rules typically regardless of location. If you want to go only for our team though, there are more than enough options that allow for cancellation with as little as 3 days. And these are only the hotels in Lake Placid, proper. Once you go SLIGHTLY outside of Lake Placid, they are all refundable. So the hotel argument to me seems to be invalid.

Not really, you're going to need to know the policy during ECAC week. What they do now doesn't mean what they will do then. Many hotels have different policies for major events. Certainly those were not the policies when the ECAC was there before. Hopefully it will all be explained tomorrow.

What makes you think that it will not be made even better a year later than that and during a weekend when demand will be high? They will make even MORE money if they are able to make better cancellation policies during that weekend. Besides, since when have hotels gotten MORE draconian in their policies into the future when it is already almost unheard of for places which are not B&Bs or Resorts.

Ummm. Past experience?

Life. Hotels. Basic common sense?

I'm saying given that we are living in 2012, where social media is incredibly influential in our lives and people are living on the web, that things have likely changed in the last decade. Things have changed in the last four years and to think that hotel policies are somehow magically free of this is naive.

bnr24

Al DeFlorio

bnr24

Jim Hyla

bnr24
So yes, some still have these rules in place, but a Bed and Breakfast or a Lodge are places which have these rules typically regardless of location. If you want to go only for our team though, there are more than enough options that allow for cancellation with as little as 3 days. And these are only the hotels in Lake Placid, proper. Once you go SLIGHTLY outside of Lake Placid, they are all refundable. So the hotel argument to me seems to be invalid.

Not really, you're going to need to know the policy during ECAC week. What they do now doesn't mean what they will do then. Many hotels have different policies for major events. Certainly those were not the policies when the ECAC was there before. Hopefully it will all be explained tomorrow.

What makes you think that it will not be made even better a year later than that and during a weekend when demand will be high? They will make even MORE money if they are able to make better cancellation policies during that weekend. Besides, since when have hotels gotten MORE draconian in their policies into the future when it is already almost unheard of for places which are not B&Bs or Resorts.

Ummm. Past experience?

Life. Hotels. Basic common sense?

I'm saying given that we are living in 2012, where social media is incredibly influential in our lives and people are living on the web, that things have likely changed in the last decade. Things have changed in the last four years and to think that hotel policies are somehow magically free of this is naive.

Look, no one is saying you are wrong, just that the policies in the past were crap and we wait to see if the ECAC has convinced them to change. Maybe they have and you are correct, but we don't have any hard evidence that you are right. Yes things change, they change every year, but they never changed during all the years we were there before. Not even Adam seems able to say that things will be different. Having lived through the past, we don't want to experience it again.

You can give all the reasons that you want, and the seem to be good ones, but that doesn't change our worry. Maybe it will happen in a few more hours.

bnr24

Al DeFlorio

bnr24

Jim Hyla

bnr24
So yes, some still have these rules in place, but a Bed and Breakfast or a Lodge are places which have these rules typically regardless of location. If you want to go only for our team though, there are more than enough options that allow for cancellation with as little as 3 days. And these are only the hotels in Lake Placid, proper. Once you go SLIGHTLY outside of Lake Placid, they are all refundable. So the hotel argument to me seems to be invalid.

Not really, you're going to need to know the policy during ECAC week. What they do now doesn't mean what they will do then. Many hotels have different policies for major events. Certainly those were not the policies when the ECAC was there before. Hopefully it will all be explained tomorrow.

What makes you think that it will not be made even better a year later than that and during a weekend when demand will be high? They will make even MORE money if they are able to make better cancellation policies during that weekend. Besides, since when have hotels gotten MORE draconian in their policies into the future when it is already almost unheard of for places which are not B&Bs or Resorts.

Ummm. Past experience?

Life. Hotels. Basic common sense?

I'm saying given that we are living in 2012, where social media is incredibly influential in our lives and people are living on the web, that things have likely changed in the last decade. Things have changed in the last four years and to think that hotel policies are somehow magically free of this is naive.

"Naive" is thinking things will "magically" change because you'd like them to.

LP is a one-horse town...and barely that. When that one horse shows up, they milk attendees for all they can get. Big difference between a hick place in the boonies like LP and an accessible, attractive city like Providence.

Al DeFlorio
LP is a one-horse town...and barely that. When that one horse shows up, they milk attendees for all they can get.

Doesn't that make it a "one cow town"?

Trotsky

Al DeFlorio
LP is a one-horse town...and barely that. When that one horse shows up, they milk attendees for all they can get.

Doesn't that make it a "one cow town"?

I'm not one for mixed metaphors, but I think it would be only a one-cow town if Harvard were the only team in town. Considering in Al's metaphor, the attendees are the cow(s) and hockey is the one "dog and pony show" that Lake Placid can do, according to him.

The athletic website article references the following in its recent comments about the move to Lake Placid:

The Big Red holds an 11-9 all-time record at Herb Brooks Olympic Arena...

Leaving out the fact that it was not "Herb Brooks Arena" until 2005 when the ECAC was no longer a tenant, what other games account for the alleged 11-9-0 record? The Arena hosted the 1994-2002 ECAC Championships. Cornell did not appear in the ECAC Championships in 1994, 1995, 1998, and 1999. Cornell finished fourth in the ECAC Tournament in 2000, this accounts for a record of 0-2-0 at Lake Placid. Cornell finished second in 2000 and 2001, which accounts for a 2-2-0 record. Cornell won the ECAC Championship in 1996 and 1997, this accounts for a record of 4-0-0. The cumulative record of Cornell in the ECAC Championships during its tenure from 1994 to 2002 would then be 6-4-0. This creates a deficit record of 5-5-0. Now, even if one assumes incorrectly that the 1970 NCAA Championship series that was played in Lake Placid, but played in the Shea Arena from the 1932 Olympic Games, was played in the Herb Brooks Arena, the deficit record would become 3-5-0 for games played in Herb Brooks Arena. When did those eight other games that the athletic site references occur? Or, is it just another error in a post that implies that Cornell appeared in the ECAC Championship game last season?

We also lost a play-in game in 1998 and won a play-in game in 2000, so those are two of the "missing" games. Not sure about the other 2-4-0 record, though - was there ever a regular season tournament held there?

Aaron M. Griffin
The athletic website article references the following in its recent comments about the move to Lake Placid:

The Big Red holds an 11-9 all-time record at Herb Brooks Olympic Arena...

Leaving out the fact that it was not "Herb Brooks Arena" until 2005 when the ECAC was no longer a tenant, what other games account for the alleged 11-9-0 record? The Arena hosted the 1994-2002 ECAC Championships. Cornell did not appear in the ECAC Championships in 1994, 1995, 1998, and 1999. Cornell finished fourth in the ECAC Tournament in 2000, this accounts for a record of 0-2-0 at Lake Placid. Cornell finished second in 2000 and 2001, which accounts for a 2-2-0 record. Cornell won the ECAC Championship in 1996 and 1997, this accounts for a record of 4-0-0. The cumulative record of Cornell in the ECAC Championships during its tenure from 1994 to 2002 would then be 6-4-0. This creates a deficit record of 5-5-0. Now, even if one assumes incorrectly that the 1970 NCAA Championship series that was played in Lake Placid, but played in the Shea Arena from the 1932 Olympic Games, was played in the Herb Brooks Arena, the deficit record would become 3-5-0 for games played in Herb Brooks Arena. When did those eight other games that the athletic site references occur? Or, is it just another error in a post that implies that Cornell appeared in the ECAC Championship game last season?

The Big Red's record in the 1993-2002 ECAC championships in Lake Placid is actually 7-5. Your accounting omits the 1998 (loss) and 2000 (win) "preliminary games." From 1998 to 2002, five teams advanced to championship weekend, with the two lowest seeds playing off on Thursday night; the loser of the game went home right away. That still does leave one four wins and four losses short.

Robb
We also lost a play-in game in 1998 and won a play-in game in 2000, so those are two of the "missing" games. Not sure about the other 2-4-0 record, though - was there ever a regular season tournament held there?

kingpin248
The Big Red's record in the 1993-2002 ECAC championships in Lake Placid is actually 7-5. Your accounting omits the 1998 (loss) and 2000 (win) "preliminary games." From 1998 to 2002, five teams advanced to championship weekend, with the two lowest seeds playing off on Thursday night; the loser of the game went home right away. That still does leave one four wins and four losses short.

Thanks for those corrections. The five-team set-up was before my time, so I overlook that historic setup occasionally considering it's not as easy to research/recognize as historic games like national title games or even ECAC Championship games before my time.

I was wondering if there was a regular-season tournament there too in which Cornell participated. I know that RPI and Union have had Halloween and Festivus events there recently, but Cornell did not participate in those in recent years.

Aaron M. Griffin

Robb
We also lost a play-in game in 1998 and won a play-in game in 2000, so those are two of the "missing" games. Not sure about the other 2-4-0 record, though - was there ever a regular season tournament held there?

kingpin248
The Big Red's record in the 1993-2002 ECAC championships in Lake Placid is actually 7-5. Your accounting omits the 1998 (loss) and 2000 (win) "preliminary games." From 1998 to 2002, five teams advanced to championship weekend, with the two lowest seeds playing off on Thursday night; the loser of the game went home right away. That still does leave one four wins and four losses short.

Thanks for those corrections. The five-team set-up was before my time, so I overlook that historic setup occasionally considering it's not as easy to research/recognize as historic games like national title games or even ECAC Championship games before my time.

I was wondering if there was a regular-season tournament there too in which Cornell participated. I know that RPI and Union have had Halloween and Festivus events there recently, but Cornell did not participate in those in recent years.

It would seem there was such a tournament in the early 1980's. From the all-time score archive, the Big Red participated from 1981-82 through 1984-85, going 1-1 in each of those four years - add that to the ECAC Tournament results and you get 11-9.

CHN's story on the move | CHN's column on the move, both authored by Adam.

Jim Hyla

bnr24

Al DeFlorio

bnr24

Jim Hyla

bnr24
So yes, some still have these rules in place, but a Bed and Breakfast or a Lodge are places which have these rules typically regardless of location. If you want to go only for our team though, there are more than enough options that allow for cancellation with as little as 3 days. And these are only the hotels in Lake Placid, proper. Once you go SLIGHTLY outside of Lake Placid, they are all refundable. So the hotel argument to me seems to be invalid.

Not really, you're going to need to know the policy during ECAC week. What they do now doesn't mean what they will do then. Many hotels have different policies for major events. Certainly those were not the policies when the ECAC was there before. Hopefully it will all be explained tomorrow.

What makes you think that it will not be made even better a year later than that and during a weekend when demand will be high? They will make even MORE money if they are able to make better cancellation policies during that weekend. Besides, since when have hotels gotten MORE draconian in their policies into the future when it is already almost unheard of for places which are not B&Bs or Resorts.

Ummm. Past experience?

Life. Hotels. Basic common sense?

I'm saying given that we are living in 2012, where social media is incredibly influential in our lives and people are living on the web, that things have likely changed in the last decade. Things have changed in the last four years and to think that hotel policies are somehow magically free of this is naive.

Look, no one is saying you are wrong, just that the policies in the past were crap and we wait to see if the ECAC has convinced them to change. Maybe they have and you are correct, but we don't have any hard evidence that you are right. Yes things change, they change every year, but they never changed during all the years we were there before. Not even Adam seems able to say that things will be different. Having lived through the past, we don't want to experience it again.

You can give all the reasons that you want, and the seem to be good ones, but that doesn't change our worry. Maybe it will happen in a few more hours.

My main point (to both Jim and Al) is that we have no reason to think that it will NOT change when so many other things have and to worry about this before we can know anything for certain is pointless. Those who are going to go will go regardless of the policies, given that it is not a cheap thing to do in the first place. As someone who wasn't around last time it was played there, I am personally excited to see it go back.

As someone who wasn't alive when the miracle happened, I have to say I'm really excited that we're going to be in LP my senior year if we make the ECAC Final Four. However I'm glad it starts in my senior year because I really don't want to make that trip twice. Well that and I want to be making another trip in the general direction of AC in early April, and not just to see the folks.

css228
As someone who wasn't alive when the miracle happened, I have to say I'm really excited that we're going to be in LP my senior year if we make the ECAC Final Four. However I'm glad it starts in my senior year because I really don't want to make that trip twice. Well that and I want to be making another trip in the general direction of AC in early April, and not just to see the folks.

Interesting that the newest generation of fans (of which I am part) does not just assume that Cornell is going to the ECAC Championships. Especially considering that Cornell has made it seven out of the last eight seasons.

css228
As someone who wasn't alive when the miracle happened, I have to say I'm really excited that we're going to be in LP my senior year if we make the ECAC Final Four. However I'm glad it starts in my senior year because I really don't want to make that trip twice. Well that and I want to be making another trip in the general direction of AC in early April, and not just to see the folks.

Frozen Four in Philly??

Aaron M. Griffin

css228
As someone who wasn't alive when the miracle happened, I have to say I'm really excited that we're going to be in LP my senior year if we make the ECAC Final Four. However I'm glad it starts in my senior year because I really don't want to make that trip twice. Well that and I want to be making another trip in the general direction of AC in early April, and not just to see the folks.

Interesting that the newest generation of fans (of which I am part) does not just assume that Cornell is going to the ECAC Championships. Especially considering that Cornell has made it seven out of the last eight seasons.

It has less to do with my experiences as a Cornell fan than with my lifelong experiences as Philadelphia sports fan. The moment you assume that you've got something in the bag, thats when the sucker punch is coming. Well that or Bud Selig will wait until the Rays tie the game to call a rain delay and you'll have to wait another 3 days to win. But point is I really should have realized when Stevens basically ended Lindros's career (or the useful portion of it at least), that we don't all get to grow up being yankees fans.

bnr24

css228
As someone who wasn't alive when the miracle happened, I have to say I'm really excited that we're going to be in LP my senior year if we make the ECAC Final Four. However I'm glad it starts in my senior year because I really don't want to make that trip twice. Well that and I want to be making another trip in the general direction of AC in early April, and not just to see the folks.

Frozen Four in Philly??

No, I just really want a cheese steak from Jim's .

css228
But point is I really should have realized when Stevens basically ended Lindros's career (or the useful portion of it at least), that we don't all get to grow up being yankees fans.

Hey, even Yankees fans have lean years. The fact that you may not have been alive during the last stretch is beside the point.

[[i]Ed: Come on, everyone reading the board was alive during the terrible trauma of 2008 when the Yanks missed the playoffs![/i]]

Al DeFlorio

bnr24

Al DeFlorio

bnr24

Jim Hyla

bnr24
So yes, some still have these rules in place, but a Bed and Breakfast or a Lodge are places which have these rules typically regardless of location. If you want to go only for our team though, there are more than enough options that allow for cancellation with as little as 3 days. And these are only the hotels in Lake Placid, proper. Once you go SLIGHTLY outside of Lake Placid, they are all refundable. So the hotel argument to me seems to be invalid.

Not really, you're going to need to know the policy during ECAC week. What they do now doesn't mean what they will do then. Many hotels have different policies for major events. Certainly those were not the policies when the ECAC was there before. Hopefully it will all be explained tomorrow.

What makes you think that it will not be made even better a year later than that and during a weekend when demand will be high? They will make even MORE money if they are able to make better cancellation policies during that weekend. Besides, since when have hotels gotten MORE draconian in their policies into the future when it is already almost unheard of for places which are not B&Bs or Resorts.

Ummm. Past experience?

Life. Hotels. Basic common sense?

I'm saying given that we are living in 2012, where social media is incredibly influential in our lives and people are living on the web, that things have likely changed in the last decade. Things have changed in the last four years and to think that hotel policies are somehow magically free of this is naive.

"Naive" is thinking things will "magically" change because you'd like them to.

LP is a one-horse town...and barely that. When that one horse shows up, they milk attendees for all they can get. Big difference between a hick place in the boonies like LP and an accessible, attractive city like Providence.

Accessible? I guess, though not as much so as Albany; however, this to some extent disregards the fact that the ECAC is no longer, and in all likelihood never will again be, a Boston-centered league. Providence is at one end of the league's geographic footprint as much so as Lake Placid is, and for the schools with sizable student/townie fan bases, Lake Placid is comparably convenient (Capital District schools) or much more so (Cornell, North Country schools).

As for attractiveness, one thing the Lake Placid region certainly has going for it is natural beauty out the wazoo (albeit, in fairness, much of it snow-covered even into March), if that's a major concern.

Here's the realization I had earlier: dedicated alumni fans, like we who read these boards, will be around forever, and, as much as we claim otherwise, I think a lot of us will probably schlep to Lake Placid or Atlantic City or Providence or whatever other random place the ECAC picks. But we become] that kind of fan because of the experiences we have in our formative years, i.e. (for most of us) as undergrads or recent alumni. For many of you folks from the national championship era, that means the great memories you have of tournaments at the old Boston Garden before the Divorce; for people from my era, it's the back-to-back championships in 1996 and 1997, the improbable playoff run of 2000, the heartbreak of the 2002 championship game, and the eventual successes of 2003. To some extent, the team is the team, and our school is our school, and those games could have taken place anywhere; but on the flip side, having had many of those experiences in a unique setting like Lake Placid, in my view made them memories with more resonance than if they'd happened somewhere conveniently located but generic like the Times-Union Center. Reasonable minds may differ on this point, of course, but I think trips to someplace "special" like LP will cultivate the next generation of hockey-mad Faithful in a way that Albany or Providence won't.

All that being said, I hope the hotel operators in LP ease up on their cancellation policies this time around, because that was asinine.

KeithK

css228
But point is I really should have realized when Stevens basically ended Lindros's career (or the useful portion of it at least), that we don't all get to grow up being yankees fans.

Hey, even Yankees fans have lean years. The fact that you may not have been alive during the last stretch is beside the point.

[[i]Ed: Come on, everyone reading the board was alive during the terrible trauma of 2008 when the Yanks missed the playoffs![/i]]

Terrible trauma? 2008? The year the Phillies won the series? No trauma whatsoever.

Josh '99
Accessible? I guess, though not as much so as Albany; however, this to some extent disregards the fact that the ECAC is no longer, and in all likelihood never will again be, a Boston-centered league. Providence is at one end of the league's geographic footprint as much so as Lake Placid is, and for the schools with sizable student/townie fan bases, Lake Placid is comparably convenient (Capital District schools) or much more so (Cornell, North Country schools).

As for attractiveness, one thing the Lake Placid region certainly has going for it is natural beauty out the wazoo (albeit, in fairness, much of it snow-covered even into March), if that's a major concern.

Well, there are trains--with frequent service--and interstate highways that go right into downtown Providence from all major northeast cities, where many alumni live (How many Clarkson alums live in Potsdam?) Albany is also much more accessible than LP, but, in my opinion (sorry, Tim) is not as attractive a city as Providence. As far as attractiveness goes, what else is there to do in LP other than a bogus bobsled ride? A ski jump? [I'll go if Adam promises to jump for us.]

I would be very happy to have seen the ECACs return to Albany, but if the brilliant ADs who chose Atlantic City over Albany felt a continuing need for an alternative to Albany, Providence would be a much more desirable location than LP.

You're a sweet guy Al.

As for what's there to do? It's all in the eye of the beholder. Depends on what you want to do. Suggesting there's nothing to do in LP however, is completely ridiculous. There's more to do there than Providence and Albany, as far as I'm concerned. And unless you're gambling, more than A.C. too.

adamw
You're a sweet guy Al.

As for what's there to do? It's all in the eye of the beholder. Depends on what you want to do. Suggesting there's nothing to do in LP however, is completely ridiculous. There's more to do there than Providence and Albany, as far as I'm concerned. And unless you're gambling, more than A.C. too.

Like what? Besides the bobsled and ski jump? Golf? Horseback riding? In March? A spa? How many hockey fans go to a spa? It's a one-street town with nothing to offer but overpriced hotels and restaurants, and a hockey rink that's the wrong size and not nearly as comfortable as the ones in Albany and Providence. Then, of course, there's the weather.

Like I said, it's in the eye of the beholder. If you want to be cranky about it, have a blast. Not gonna affect me. It's pretty useless for me to try to convince anyone, you in particular.

Al DeFlorio
Like what? Besides the bobsled and ski jump? Golf? Horseback riding? In March? A spa? How many hockey fans go to a spa? It's a one-street town with nothing to offer but overpriced hotels and restaurants, and a hockey rink that's the wrong size and not nearly as comfortable as the ones in Albany and Providence. Then, of course, there's the weather.

Having been there over last New Year's, I can say, from recent firsthand experience, that your characterization of the town is either out of whack or out of date. Perhaps both. My special lady and I are not made of money, yet we spent a great, somewhat economical four days in Placid.

Ummm... Sliding, skating, jumping, and hockey are not the only winter sports up to which one might get in Lake Placid, even in mid-March. You may have heard of these things called skis? And [inserting reference to favorite humorous Placid memory] if your team's victory parade to the rink doesn't get rescheduled, you pretty much have all of Saturday's daylight free. To be more blunt: there's the enormous speed skating oval, there's the cross-country course, there's Whiteface. Look around.

We went skiing. Was it cheap? No, but skiing isn't anywhere. I am not God's great gift to athletics, and it was my first downhill experience. On Whiteface, commonly nicknamed Iceface. Not known as a beginner's hill. But it was important to my ladyfriend for me to give it a try, so I got over my chittering fear and clipped in. Know what? I guess they've opened a lot of terrain lately, and a bunch of that for kids and beginners. And ski technology has changed. I learned, didn't die, and, even on the last, iciest of our days, got pretty far up the mountain. Even started to enjoy the difficulty. Ich habe viel Spass gemacht. I'm itching for the summit next time, but ya gotta work up to Whiteface blues.

We stayed at a very well-run motel, if slightly too economical for my delicate nasal mucosa. (I hate combination heater/air conditioners.) There was the pretty great brewpub with the good happy hour. There was the excellent, edgy restaurant with strikingly imaginative cocktails and cuisine down by the old mill. Not cheap, but worth it. And I'm hard on restaurants. There was the welcoming, cheap breakfast place. There was even nearly edible Mexican. In the North Country. You can find what you want at the price point you're looking for if you do some legwork.

So, it's time to give Placid another chance. Hopefully we'll all have a few years of having a reason to go.

Josh '99


Accessible? I guess, though not as much so as Albany; however, this to some extent disregards the fact that the ECAC is no longer, and in all likelihood never will again be, a Boston-centered league. Providence is at one end of the league's geographic footprint as much so as Lake Placid is, and for the schools with sizable student/townie fan bases, Lake Placid is comparably convenient (Capital District schools) or much more so (Cornell, North Country schools).

As for attractiveness, one thing the Lake Placid region certainly has going for it is natural beauty out the wazoo (albeit, in fairness, much of it snow-covered even into March), if that's a major concern.

I don't buy the accessibility/geography argument. According to Google Maps, these are the driving times from ECACHL locations to Lake Placid & Providence:

LP
Brown: 5:19; Clarkson: 2:32; Colgate: 3:41; Cornell: 4:52; Dartmouth: 3:22; Harvard: 5:26; Princeton: 5:45; Quinnepeac: 5:00; RPI: 2:27; St. L: 1:46; Union: 2:32; Yale: 5:06


Providence
Brown: 0; Clarkson: 6:39; Colgate: 4:53; Cornell: 5:47; Dartmouth: 3:04; Harvard: 1:10; Princeton: 4:30; Quinnepeac: 1:56; RPI: 2:59; St. L: 6:38; Union: 3:10; Yale: 1:48

So the average travel time to LP is 3:59 but to Providence it's only 3:32. At that's by car! The last I heard, Providence is served by Amtrak, Southwest, and Jet Blue. So I'd presume public transportation would be even more in Providence's favor.

Swampy

Josh '99


Accessible? I guess, though not as much so as Albany; however, this to some extent disregards the fact that the ECAC is no longer, and in all likelihood never will again be, a Boston-centered league. Providence is at one end of the league's geographic footprint as much so as Lake Placid is, and for the schools with sizable student/townie fan bases, Lake Placid is comparably convenient (Capital District schools) or much more so (Cornell, North Country schools).

As for attractiveness, one thing the Lake Placid region certainly has going for it is natural beauty out the wazoo (albeit, in fairness, much of it snow-covered even into March), if that's a major concern.

I don't buy the accessibility/geography argument. According to Google Maps, these are the driving times from ECACHL locations to Lake Placid & Providence:

LP
Brown: 5:19; Clarkson: 2:32; Colgate: 3:41; Cornell: 4:52; Dartmouth: 3:22; Harvard: 5:26; Princeton: 5:45; Quinnepeac: 5:00; RPI: 2:27; St. L: 1:46; Union: 2:32; Yale: 5:06


Providence
Brown: 0; Clarkson: 6:39; Colgate: 4:53; Cornell: 5:47; Dartmouth: 3:04; Harvard: 1:10; Princeton: 4:30; Quinnepeac: 1:56; RPI: 2:59; St. L: 6:38; Union: 3:10; Yale: 1:48

So the average travel time to LP is 3:59 but to Providence it's only 3:32. At that's by car! The last I heard, Providence is served by Amtrak, Southwest, and Jet Blue. So I'd presume public transportation would be even more in Providence's favor.

All right you lunatic Aspies. I want these travel times weighted by Fan Travel Impact by COB.