Portable Internet Radio

[dss28]

Does it exist?

Like, let's say I want to listen to the internet broadcast of the Cornell Hockey games while I'm out.  We have laptops with wireless internet and walkmans (walkmen?)... what about portable internet radio?

[CowbellGuy]

Intel should be shot for their stupid Centrino ad campaign. Yeah, there's an 802.11b hot spot on the side of Mt. Everest... ::twak::

[Shorts]

I suppose that, wherever you can get a wireless internet connection with sufficient bandwidth (including local WI-FI hotspots, satellite uplinks, cellular-based systems, etc.), you can use just about any laptop as an "internet radio".  If you're looking for something with the portability of a walkman, the range/reliability of "traditional" AM/FM radio, and the ability to access any audio stream that a WI-FI'd laptop can...I'm pretty sure the FCC would have big problems with such a system if it became anything more than a rare gizmo for rich geeks.  The current regulatory and advertising systems are set up based on the assumption that, if you want to hear realtime music/sports/talk/whatever, and you're jogging or in your car or wherever else people listen to a radio, that you're listening to one of the stations "in that market".

To follow the example Cornell Hockey (or other sports)...if you could listen to the online streams, including the coverage from other schools, then WHCU or whoever it is that covers the Big Red these days would stand to lose a significant fraction of their advertising money.

As another example, ClearChannel Communications recently purchased one of the few remaining modern rock (ie. vs. classic rock) music stations in my "home market" of Hartford, CT, and decided that rap/hip-hop would be a more profitable format.  As some sort of compromise thingie, they set up an online audio stream playing roughly the same sort of rock music that was now impossible to find on the air at home.  The music is completely free, plays no commercials (or any non-profit interruptions, or anything...just music), and the programming is pretty decent.  If a listener, anywhere in the America, could turn on a walkman-shaped device and listen to this stream for free (in contrast to things like XM Satellite radio), there would be the potential for this huge media conglomerate to instantly push some fraction of rock stations nationwide out of profitability.

At present, the government continues to act in the interest of diversity and market specificity over the air, to try to prevent such things from happening.  What will happen in the future...I don't know.

[jeh25]

Shorts '04 wrote:

As another example, ClearChannel Communications recently purchased one of the few remaining modern rock (ie. vs. classic rock) music stations in my "home market" of Hartford, CT, and decided that rap/hip-hop would be a more profitable format.  

Of course, ClearChannel also killed Dee Snider Radio so the could save costs by carrying f'ing Bubba the Love Sponge or some such dreck.   ::yark::

I also imagine I was one of the few 20-something males that switched exculsively to NPR for drive time radio when DSR was cancelled. :-P

[Jim Hyla]

[Q]Shorts '04 wrote:


At present, the government continues to act in the interest of diversity and market specificity over the air, to try to prevent such things from happening. What will happen in the future...I don't know.[/Q]With the recently disputed Bush admim. ruling on station ownership, some think that the future may be now. ::worry::

[Greg Berge]

Bubba the Love Sponge?    ::twitch::

[dss28]

Interesting -- I'm based in Hartford now as well, and I used to listen to Dee ALL the time.  I thought he just left to be closer to his family (wasn't he spending only weekends at home anyway?)... never thought it was because ClearChannel bought radio 104 (which, by the way, now plays crap.)  

But I'm not sure, Shorts '04, why the FCC would have a problem with the portable internet radio idea... if you programmed a device so that it received online broadcasts exclusively, how is that different from people having Walkman AM/FM radios?  Or palm pilots with internet access (if they exist)?  ...I'm not CS or any type of engineer, so bear with me

And btw, I switched to NPR, too (although I'm one of the 20-something females... maybe it's something about our age group)!  That's some quality programming.

[jeh25]

dss28 wrote:
  I thought he just left to be closer to his family (wasn't he spending only weekends at home anyway?)... never thought it was because ClearChannel bought radio 104 (which, by the way, now plays crap.)  

Actually, I was under the impression that Dee frequently broadcasted from his house on LI. I guess sending a sound engineer to Dee's house was getting expensive.

With regard to WMRQ, I wouldn't know about the new format since I removed it from my car radio's presets the day they cancelled DSR.

[jeh25]

Greg Berge '85 wrote:

Bubba the Love Sponge?    ::twitch::

Yup. Bubba the Love Sponge. A Florida based Stern wannabe.

http://www.btls.com/bubba_.html

[Shorts]

As far as CS or engineering differences...they exist, I suppose, but I agree that they could probably be worked out without too much trouble.  As far as I know, you might even be able to do it now with something like a Tungsten C with Real Audio, or a PocketPC handheld.

The problems are more regulation and advertising oriented.  To give other examples:

The FCC (much like Cornell Athletics) has regulations about things like profanity and sex over the airwaves.  The internet, at least in this country, has very few such restrictions, making exceptions only for things like child pornography.  If little Johnnie could ask his parents for an internet walkman for Christmas, then turn it on and immediately listen to readings from Penthouse letters...many people would likely take objection to that.  Not just morally conservative people, either--the AM/FM radio broadcasters who are left trying to compete against unregulated internet broadcasters would feel pretty bad.

Most radio broadcasters sell some mixture of national advertising (things like Pepsi) and local advertising (like Pyramid Mall).  Advertising is generally sold on a per-listener basis, roughly.  Now, suppose that, instead of having one station that carries Howard Stern (for example) in every city, there's a single internet station that carries Howard Stern.  The economics wouldn't change much for national advertisers, but local advertisers would be left having to choose between advertising to millions of people who don't even live nearby, or not advertising at all during that program.  It really changes things up, neh?

I'm not saying that it's an impossibility--as Jim Hyla notes, things may change, even in the near future.  I'm just saying that there are obstacles and complications aside from the raw technology.

[CowbellGuy]

Shorts '04 wrote:
As far as I know, you might even be able to do it now with something like a Tungsten C with Real Audio, or a PocketPC handheld.

At least on PalmOS, at the moment I don't think it's possible. The RealOne player for Palm only plays files and has no ability to play any kind of stream. No plugin or anything for the browser either. Certianly shouldn't be a hardware limitation though, just need the software to catch up. Theoretically you should be able to push data over Bluetooth from a GPRS phone fast enough. I've seen 4-5k/s (and occasionally better) with a good signal. It gets a bit trickier with streaming content, but should be doable.

[pat]

Call me old school, but I think the games should be broadcast over shortwave. It's not so pressing now that the Murrays aren't listening any more, but it'd still be neat. The transmitter and license are not trivial expenses, but there are stations that sell blocks of airtime.

[jtwcornell91]

Shorts '04 wrote:
Most radio broadcasters sell some mixture of national advertising (things like Pepsi) and local advertising (like Pyramid Mall).  Advertising is generally sold on a per-listener basis, roughly.  Now, suppose that, instead of having one station that carries Howard Stern (for example) in every city, there's a single internet station that carries Howard Stern.  The economics wouldn't change much for national advertisers, but local advertisers would be left having to choose between advertising to millions of people who don't even live nearby, or not advertising at all during that program.  It really changes things up, neh?

These issues have already played out in the cable vs satellite TV arena.  Cable carries local affiliates of national networks, and those affiliates carry local advertizing.  Satellite carries national networks, and FCC regulations prevent them from delivering non-local network feeds to people who can get local network stations through other means, to protect those local affiliates from losing viewers.  (Which is why it's a headache if you're in a market which isn't big enough for satellite companies to carry your local network affiliates.)

Fortunately "Fox Sports Net" is not treatd by the FCC as a national network with regional affiliates, but as a bunch of distinct local networks, and I can watch Minnesota games with "Save big money at Menard's" ads and BU games with Mohegan Sun ads.

[Shorts]

While some of the issues have played out, there are differences between cable/satellite and an internet-based system.  For national networks (like NBC, etc.), cable and satellite companies carry local affiliates if they can, and can be forced not to carry out-of-market programming.  For example, here in Ithaca there's one of the low-numbered stations (I can't remember which) that is almost always blacked out because of this type of issue.  At this point in time, however, the Internet has been fairly difficult to regulate.  If NBC decided it wanted to reincorporate overseas and broadcast one national stream over the internet, it would be much harder to stop (and probably cheaper to implement) then if it tried to buy out all the local stations.

[dss28]

What about wireless updates?  Is there a way to get updates sent to your phone, say each time a goal is scored or at the end of each period, or is it only available for the final score?