Money: Cornellians lost to (and gained from) the portal

[stereax]

I mean, delaying graduation in and of its own is doable. You can figure out how to strategically fail enough classes, etc.

The problem is, why the fuck would you create a system that incentivizes that?

Just make it a flat 5 years from, like, either when you enter college or 20. So if you enter college at 17, 5 years. If you enter at 20, 5 years. If you enter at 23, 2 years. Blueblood 18-year-old college athletes stay unaffected because they dip after 2-3 years anyway.

The thing is, the NCAA proposal doesn't fit with the already-well-developed junior hockey system which you usually age out of at 20. In a sport like football or basketball, where you go directly from HS to college, the proposal makes more sense.

[BearLover]

One more thing - to the extent kids are graduating too early to play 4-5 years, well, that mitigates the downside of the Ivies not being able to take advantage of 5-year eligiblity, at least.

I don't know what you mean here. Kids cannot be graduating too early to play 4-5 years. That's only if they then go to play juniors because their clock starts ticking at graduation. Blueblood programs won't have this problem if they're already getting cream of the crop 18-year olds. The teams taking 19 and 20 year olds are ... everyone else, especially ECAC/CCHA/Atlantic teams. They're the ones that have to someone ensure that the kids don't graduate HS until 19 to get 5 years. But if they get them at 20, like they have been, they get them 4. That part in itself is probably not a big deal. The issue for me is how you're going to get kids to not graduate HS until 19. That will be a lot trickier for Canadians than Americans. And why would you want to encourage that if you're the NCAA? Spoiler alert: because they are clueless.

Since the eligibility clock starts ticking at graduation, kids who graduate at 17 and play a couple of years in juniors will only have three years of eligibility. Or those who play one year of juniors will only have four years. That mitigates the downside of the Ivies not getting to use the fifth year of eligibility because most kids won't get five years.

[stereax]

One more thing - to the extent kids are graduating too early to play 4-5 years, well, that mitigates the downside of the Ivies not being able to take advantage of 5-year eligiblity, at least.

I don't know what you mean here. Kids cannot be graduating too early to play 4-5 years. That's only if they then go to play juniors because their clock starts ticking at graduation. Blueblood programs won't have this problem if they're already getting cream of the crop 18-year olds. The teams taking 19 and 20 year olds are ... everyone else, especially ECAC/CCHA/Atlantic teams. They're the ones that have to someone ensure that the kids don't graduate HS until 19 to get 5 years. But if they get them at 20, like they have been, they get them 4. That part in itself is probably not a big deal. The issue for me is how you're going to get kids to not graduate HS until 19. That will be a lot trickier for Canadians than Americans. And why would you want to encourage that if you're the NCAA? Spoiler alert: because they are clueless.

Since the eligibility clock starts ticking at graduation, kids who graduate at 17 and play a couple of years in juniors will only have three years of eligibility. Or those who play one year of juniors will only have four years. That mitigates the downside of the Ivies not getting to use the fifth year of eligibility because most kids won't get five years.

Cornell Hockey '31: Senior and Junior and Sophomore Night.

[adamw]

One more thing - to the extent kids are graduating too early to play 4-5 years, well, that mitigates the downside of the Ivies not being able to take advantage of 5-year eligiblity, at least.

I don't know what you mean here. Kids cannot be graduating too early to play 4-5 years. That's only if they then go to play juniors because their clock starts ticking at graduation. Blueblood programs won't have this problem if they're already getting cream of the crop 18-year olds. The teams taking 19 and 20 year olds are ... everyone else, especially ECAC/CCHA/Atlantic teams. They're the ones that have to someone ensure that the kids don't graduate HS until 19 to get 5 years. But if they get them at 20, like they have been, they get them 4. That part in itself is probably not a big deal. The issue for me is how you're going to get kids to not graduate HS until 19. That will be a lot trickier for Canadians than Americans. And why would you want to encourage that if you're the NCAA? Spoiler alert: because they are clueless.

Since the eligibility clock starts ticking at graduation, kids who graduate at 17 and play a couple of years in juniors will only have three years of eligibility. Or those who play one year of juniors will only have four years. That mitigates the downside of the Ivies not getting to use the fifth year of eligibility because most kids won't get five years.

That assumes other schools won't figure out how to delay the player's HS graduation until 19.

[BearLover]

One more thing - to the extent kids are graduating too early to play 4-5 years, well, that mitigates the downside of the Ivies not being able to take advantage of 5-year eligiblity, at least.

I don't know what you mean here. Kids cannot be graduating too early to play 4-5 years. That's only if they then go to play juniors because their clock starts ticking at graduation. Blueblood programs won't have this problem if they're already getting cream of the crop 18-year olds. The teams taking 19 and 20 year olds are ... everyone else, especially ECAC/CCHA/Atlantic teams. They're the ones that have to someone ensure that the kids don't graduate HS until 19 to get 5 years. But if they get them at 20, like they have been, they get them 4. That part in itself is probably not a big deal. The issue for me is how you're going to get kids to not graduate HS until 19. That will be a lot trickier for Canadians than Americans. And why would you want to encourage that if you're the NCAA? Spoiler alert: because they are clueless.

Since the eligibility clock starts ticking at graduation, kids who graduate at 17 and play a couple of years in juniors will only have three years of eligibility. Or those who play one year of juniors will only have four years. That mitigates the downside of the Ivies not getting to use the fifth year of eligibility because most kids won't get five years.

That assumes other schools won't figure out how to delay the player's HS graduation until 19.

Correct, but you were just saying how this is potentially going to be very difficult.

[stereax]

I think part of it is: delaying graduation would likely lead to a low GPA, which non-Ivy schools won't care about, but Ivies care at least a little.

[Trotsky]

Just make it a flat 5 years

Or, call me crazy, 4?

[Trotsky]

I think part of it is: delaying graduation would likely lead to a low GPA, which non-Ivy schools won't care about, but Ivies care at least a little.

Fewer credits per semester accomplishes the same thing while maintaining your 4.0.  Or you could follow my lead and be 4 credits short of 3 different majors in 3 different colleges after semester 8.

[Trotsky]

That assumes other schools won't figure out how to delay the player's HS graduation until 19.

I don't understand why you don't start the clock at matriculation, full stop.  Guy enters school at 36 and uses hockey to foot the bill for his second career Biology major?  Good!  Encourage continuing education.  The vast majority of males under the age of 21 41 aren't mature enough for college anyway.  Don't waste the experience on overgrown infants.

[stereax]

Just make it a flat 5 years

Or, call me crazy, 4?

Real... (says the person who took 5 years to complete her bachelor's. technically 6. then again, my associate's credit didn't transfer abroad so.)

[stereax]

That assumes other schools won't figure out how to delay the player's HS graduation until 19.

I don't understand why you don't start the clock at matriculation, full stop.  Guy enters school at 36 and uses hockey to foot the bill for his second career Biology major?  Good!  Encourage continuing education.  The vast majority of males under the age of 21 41 aren't mature enough for college anyway.  Don't waste the experience on overgrown infants.

Because football (mostly) - you have guys who've managed to hoodwink the system into nine years of eligibility and there are concerns around whether that's fair - as well as whether you're actually a student at that point.

And for "continuing education", why limit it at bachelor's degrees? I, for one, would love to see a law student D1 hockey player...

[stereax]

I think part of it is: delaying graduation would likely lead to a low GPA, which non-Ivy schools won't care about, but Ivies care at least a little.

Fewer credits per semester accomplishes the same thing while maintaining your 4.0.  Or you could follow my lead and be 4 credits short of 3 different majors in 3 different colleges after semester 8.

I think most high schools require you to take enough credits per semester to graduate within 4 years? But I also didn't go to high school so...

[Trotsky]

Just make it a flat 5 years

Or, call me crazy, 4?

Real... (says the person who took 5 years to complete her bachelor's. technically 6. then again, my associate's credit didn't transfer abroad so.)

You had an exchange rate.

Took me 4.5.

[Trotsky]

That assumes other schools won't figure out how to delay the player's HS graduation until 19.

I don't understand why you don't start the clock at matriculation, full stop.  Guy enters school at 36 and uses hockey to foot the bill for his second career Biology major?  Good!  Encourage continuing education.  The vast majority of males under the age of 21 41 aren't mature enough for college anyway.  Don't waste the experience on overgrown infants.

Because football (mostly) - you have guys who've managed to hoodwink the system into nine years of eligibility and there are concerns around whether that's fair - as well as whether you're actually a student at that point.

And for "continuing education", why limit it at bachelor's degrees? I, for one, would love to see a law student D1 hockey player...

But I mean hold the line at 4 years elapsed from matriculation (with a one-for-one waiver for injuries that cost you a full season). 

[BearLover]

I just want Cornell to win. So I want the system that is most conducive to us winning.