Ivy League lacrosse tournament [& NCAAs 2019]

[scoop85]

Penn wins 12-11.  Army leads Lehigh 9-7 with 4 minutes left. If the committee was looking for ways to choose the other teams in the running, this should give them enough.

[Al DeFlorio]

A Yale win would have knocked Penn (Terps' best win) out of top five RPI and put Towson (Cornell's best) in.  Not to be.  Ierlan beaten 13-11 at X.

Hop has no top 10 wins.  Maryland has one.  Cornell has two.  Likely won't matter.  ACC (Cuse) and B1G vs. Ivy.

[billhoward]

First round May 11-12: 7 of 8 top seeds advance. #6 Towson falls to Maryland in OT 14-13. Duke just gets by Richmond 12-11.

Code Select Expand

[b]NCAA 2019 D1 pairings - 1st round winners in bold[/b]
1 [b]Penn State[/b] vs. [s]Marist[/s]/UMBC — noon Sunday 25-10!
2 [b]Duke[/b] vs. Richmond — 5 p.m. Sunday 12-11 closest non-OT game
3 [b]Virginia[/b] vs. Robert Morris —7:30 p.m. Saturday
4 [b]Penn[/b] vs. Army — 5 p.m. Saturday
5 [b]Yale[/b] vs. Georgetown —2:30 p.m. Saturday
6 Towson vs.  [b]Maryland[/b] — 2:30 p.m. Sunday Only overtime first round game
7 [b]Notre Dame[/b] vs. Johns Hopkins — 7:30 p.m. Sunday
8 [b]Loyola[/b] vs. Syracuse - noon Saturday
 
Saturday 5/19
3-NR  Virginia-Maryland
2-7   Duke-Notre Dame
Sunday
1-8 Penn State-Loyola
4-5 Penn-Yale



[Notes from selection day]

First teams out:
Cornell, Denver, High Point. First time a Bill Tierney Denver team didn't make the tournament.

Maryland most likely the team that beat Cornell for the last spot in. Cornell had more top 10 wins, Maryland more top 20 wins. Hopkins is in with an 8-7 record. Worked out well for the South.

The seeding has Penn and Yale in a (possible) round-of-8 regional rematch in week 2. Only one Ivy can get to championship weekend. Worked out not so good for the North / Ivies.

Had Cornell gotten in instead of the Terps, it might have been re-matched against Towsend, the team Cornell beat 18-11 March 10 when Towson was #1. The low-ranked AQs wind up against the 1-2-3 teams. So ... another year, Cornell on the bubble, Cornell left out.

[rss77]

Not surprised that CU did not make it in.   Annoyed at Selection Committee for potential pairing of Yale and Penn in quarters though.  Would argue that those two are playing as high a level as any team in the country.

[upprdeck]

you cant get top 20 wins if you play all top 10 teams..

we ended up with a ton of games vs seeded teams and won 2.  we didnt play 11-20 teams enough to get those wins. maryland played the JH bubble team twice and lost twice,, that alone should have put them out

[billhoward]

you cant get top 20 wins if you play all top 10 teams..

we ended up with a ton of games vs seeded teams and won 2.  we didnt play 11-20 teams enough to get those wins. maryland played the JH bubble team twice and lost twice,, that alone should have put them out

We wuz good to the neighbors: Agreed to play St. Bonaventure in its D1 coming-out yet. No NCAA credit for that. We have Binghamton off the NYS / nearby PA list hopefully off until they get better. We need to look at picking up Army*.

* "Army West Point" it now is, and be thankful it's not The Army West Point ... which which would be a good acronym.

[Al DeFlorio]

you cant get top 20 wins if you play all top 10 teams..

we ended up with a ton of games vs seeded teams and won 2.  we didnt play 11-20 teams enough to get those wins. maryland played the JH bubble team twice and lost twice,, that alone should have put them out

The problem is there are so many criteria in the selection process that you can pick the team(s) you want to have and then use whichever of the criteria justify your pick(s) while ignoring the criteria that don't.  Top 10 wins won't work?  Then look at top 20.  Head-to-head won't work?  Then how about SOS.  Can justify anything you want.

[billhoward]

Who has the easiest path to final-four weekend? Inside Lacrosse says it's Johns (the South will rise again) Hopkins and Notre Dame. Presuming you believe #2 Duke is overrated.

Easiest Paths
Johns Hopkins — Their quadrant of the bracket doesn't have one of the top seven teams in the country according to my adjusted efficiency numbers; the best team in that quadrant is the unseeded Blue Jays. While Duke is seeded second on the basis of a pair of RPI Top 5 wins and seven wins over RPI Top 20 teams, they haven't exactly been a juggernaut on the field this season. ...

Notre Dame — For a team that comes in outside of the Top 10 in the adjusted efficiency numbers, getting to host a First Round game and then likely play a Quarterfinal game against Duke is about as good a bracket setup as the Irish could have imagined. ... .

Most Difficult Paths
Syracuse — No one is faced with a tougher bracket draw than the Orange.... On the road at Loyola and then a possible Quarterfinals matchup against Penn State would mean needing two wins over the teams that the adjusted efficiency numbers have as the top two teams in the country.

Loyola – ... while they were rewarded with a First Round home game, they got the toughest draw of any seeded team and then a likely Quarterfinals match with top-ranked and seeded Penn State should they win.

Penn State – The ...  consensus No. 1 team ... didn't get any favors from the Selection Committee for their Quarterfinals game. Well, that's assuming the Nittany Lions can win their first NCAA Tournament game over the winner of the Opening Round game between Marist and UMBC. Among the top four seeds, only Penn and Yale, with the chance to face each other, could end up with a tougher Quarterfinals opponent than Penn State is guaranteed to play. https://www.insidelacrosse.com/article/men-s-ncaa-di-tournament-easiest-toughest-paths-to-championship-weekend/54470

[ugarte]

wild that this thread has new entries. move it to JSID.

[billhoward]

More about High Point got screwed than, say, Cornell. Terry Foy says RPI isn't good enough.
It's Time to Change the NCAA Tournament Selection Criteria

[A}ccording to Patrick McEwen's "What Ifs" column ... not only would High Point not have been a lock for at-large selection had they gone 15-1, beaten Virginia and Duke and lost in the SoCon championship, they likely would've been excluded under those conditions, as well. ...  that's evidence of a system as flawed as the one that excluded an undefeated Bucknell team from the NCAA Tournament in 1996 that prompted the institution of the automatic qualifier and bracket expansion from 12 to 16.

Two quick points...:
1. The AQ is a great thing. It has been indirectly responsible for the creation of dozens of new men's and women's lacrosse programs and several conferences. It has increased the competitive balance across the sport's entire landscape. Calls to eliminate conference AQs are... absurd ... Not to mention, short-sighted. In 2020, all but eight teams will have a shot at an AQ. For at least 65 fanbases, the AQ represents, at worst, a life preserver in stormy waters.

2. The men's Division I bracket should not and will not expand, unless and until more teams or conferences are added. When the (then) Atlantic Sun (now Southern Conference), NEC, ACC ... and Big Ten ... all arrived in quick succession, the number of AQs ballooned to 10. An NCAA bylaw, in order to maintain fairness in opportunities for at-large selection, limits the field to 50% AQs. As a result, the NCAA considered permanently expanding the men's DI bracket to 20 teams, or instituting two play-in games. For a variety of reasons, they chose the latter (which has since been reduced to one since the ACC lost its AQ). That choice is justified based on the percentage of men's DI teams that qualify for the tournament compared to other sports; 17 of 73 teams, or 23.2%.

Expanding the bracket and eliminating the AQ would not solve the problem that I'm addressing, and ...  perhaps it wouldn't get High Point into the Tournament. However, now is the time to consider moving the NCAA Selection criteria beyond RPI.

[scoop85]

Loyola scores 7 straight in the 2nd half and beats SU 15-13. I'm good with that.

[Al DeFlorio]

Loyola scores 7 straight in the 2nd half and beats SU 15-13. I'm good with that.

Syracuse was laf's "first team out" at laxbytes, with Cornell comfortably in based on RPI, SOS, and quality wins.  So, in a different way, 'Cuse did become "first team out."

[billhoward]

Loyola scores 7 straight in the 2nd half and beats SU 15-13. I'm good with that.

Syracuse was laf's "first team out" at laxbytes, with Cornell comfortably in based on RPI, SOS, and quality wins.  So, in a different way, 'Cuse did become "first team out."

Schadenfreude

Ten years ago Syracuse had the ball at midfield with 0:03 to play in the title game and managed to tie, then win in OT. This time getting the ball at midfield with 10 seconds to play in the first round wasn't enough to even get one.

I'm at the point, Who should not win the title. Lessee, there's Duke, Hopkins, probably Maryland. The title games I'd like to see all get decided in the East Hartford bracket, Penn-Yale there next week, or Penn-Penn State in the semifinal. (PSU is still not final in round 1 but with 3:00 to play, UMBC needs to win a lot of faceoffs to make up a 25-10 deficit.)

[billhoward]

Round 1 Sunday: Maryland takes down #6 Towson in OT 13-12. I liked Towson because we'd beaten them (when Towson was #1) and because they're not Maryoland. Be still my heart: Richmond is leading Duke early, 2-1 after the first quarter; if they beat Duke I'd not say anything bad about Big Tobacco for a week. I am trying to imagine a scenario where game 3 Sunday, Hopkins-Notre Dame, causes both to both lose, and cannot except where loss of life is involved.

[Al DeFlorio]

Hopkins extends its perfect record (now 0-7) against top 10 RPI teams and finishes at .500.