Generic Off Season Thread

[Jim Hyla]

So yes, some still have these rules in place, but a Bed and Breakfast or a Lodge are places which have these rules typically regardless of location.  If you want to go only for our team though, there are more than enough options that allow for cancellation with as little as 3 days.  And these are only the hotels in Lake Placid, proper.  Once you go SLIGHTLY outside of Lake Placid, they are all refundable.  So the hotel argument to me seems to be invalid.

Not really, you're going to need to know the policy during ECAC week. What they do now doesn't mean what they will do then. Many hotels have different policies for major events. Certainly those were not the policies when the ECAC was there before. Hopefully it will all be explained tomorrow.

What makes you think that it will not be made even better a year later than that and during a weekend when demand will be high?  They will make even MORE money if they are able to make better cancellation policies during that weekend.  Besides, since when have hotels gotten MORE draconian in their policies into the future when it is already almost unheard of for places which are not B&Bs or Resorts.

Ummm.  Past experience?

Life.  Hotels.  Basic common sense?

I'm saying given that we are living in 2012, where social media is incredibly influential in our lives and people are living on the web, that things have likely changed in the last decade.  Things have changed in the last four years and to think that hotel policies are somehow magically free of this is naive.

Look, no one is saying you are wrong, just that the policies in the past were crap and we wait to see if the ECAC has convinced them to change. Maybe they have and you are correct, but we don't have any hard evidence that you are right. Yes things change, they change every year, but they never changed during all the years we were there before. Not even Adam seems able to say that things will be different. Having lived through the past, we don't want to experience it again.

You can give all the reasons that you want, and the seem to be good ones, but that doesn't change our worry. Maybe it will happen in a few more hours.

[Al DeFlorio]

So yes, some still have these rules in place, but a Bed and Breakfast or a Lodge are places which have these rules typically regardless of location.  If you want to go only for our team though, there are more than enough options that allow for cancellation with as little as 3 days.  And these are only the hotels in Lake Placid, proper.  Once you go SLIGHTLY outside of Lake Placid, they are all refundable.  So the hotel argument to me seems to be invalid.

Not really, you're going to need to know the policy during ECAC week. What they do now doesn't mean what they will do then. Many hotels have different policies for major events. Certainly those were not the policies when the ECAC was there before. Hopefully it will all be explained tomorrow.

What makes you think that it will not be made even better a year later than that and during a weekend when demand will be high?  They will make even MORE money if they are able to make better cancellation policies during that weekend.  Besides, since when have hotels gotten MORE draconian in their policies into the future when it is already almost unheard of for places which are not B&Bs or Resorts.

Ummm.  Past experience?

Life.  Hotels.  Basic common sense?

I'm saying given that we are living in 2012, where social media is incredibly influential in our lives and people are living on the web, that things have likely changed in the last decade.  Things have changed in the last four years and to think that hotel policies are somehow magically free of this is naive.

"Naive" is thinking things will "magically" change because you'd like them to.

LP is a one-horse town...and barely that.  When that one horse shows up, they milk attendees for all they can get.  Big difference between a hick place in the boonies like LP and an accessible, attractive city like Providence.

[Trotsky]

LP is a one-horse town...and barely that.  When that one horse shows up, they milk attendees for all they can get.

Doesn't that make it a "one cow town"?

[Aaron M. Griffin]

LP is a one-horse town...and barely that.  When that one horse shows up, they milk attendees for all they can get.

Doesn't that make it a "one cow town"?

I'm not one for mixed metaphors, but I think it would be only a one-cow town if Harvard were the only team in town. Considering in Al's metaphor, the attendees are the cow(s) and hockey is the one "dog and pony show" that Lake Placid can do, according to him.

[Aaron M. Griffin]

The athletic website article references the following in its recent comments about the move to Lake Placid:

The Big Red holds an 11-9 all-time record at Herb Brooks Olympic Arena...

Leaving out the fact that it was not "Herb Brooks Arena" until 2005 when the ECAC was no longer a tenant, what other games account for the alleged 11-9-0 record? The Arena hosted the 1994-2002 ECAC Championships. Cornell did not appear in the ECAC Championships in 1994, 1995, 1998, and 1999. Cornell finished fourth in the ECAC Tournament in 2000, this accounts for a record of 0-2-0 at Lake Placid. Cornell finished second in 2000 and 2001, which accounts for a 2-2-0 record. Cornell won the ECAC Championship in 1996 and 1997, this accounts for a record of 4-0-0. The cumulative record of Cornell in the ECAC Championships during its tenure from 1994 to 2002 would then be 6-4-0. This creates a deficit record of 5-5-0. Now, even if one assumes incorrectly that the 1970 NCAA Championship series that was played in Lake Placid, but played in the Shea Arena from the 1932 Olympic Games, was played in the Herb Brooks Arena, the deficit record would become 3-5-0 for games played in Herb Brooks Arena. When did those eight other games that the athletic site references occur? Or, is it just another error in a post that implies that Cornell appeared in the ECAC Championship game last season?

[Robb]

We also lost a play-in game in 1998 and won a play-in game in 2000, so those are two of the "missing" games.  Not sure about the other 2-4-0 record, though - was there ever a regular season tournament held there?

[kingpin248]

The athletic website article references the following in its recent comments about the move to Lake Placid:

The Big Red holds an 11-9 all-time record at Herb Brooks Olympic Arena...

Leaving out the fact that it was not "Herb Brooks Arena" until 2005 when the ECAC was no longer a tenant, what other games account for the alleged 11-9-0 record? The Arena hosted the 1994-2002 ECAC Championships. Cornell did not appear in the ECAC Championships in 1994, 1995, 1998, and 1999. Cornell finished fourth in the ECAC Tournament in 2000, this accounts for a record of 0-2-0 at Lake Placid. Cornell finished second in 2000 and 2001, which accounts for a 2-2-0 record. Cornell won the ECAC Championship in 1996 and 1997, this accounts for a record of 4-0-0. The cumulative record of Cornell in the ECAC Championships during its tenure from 1994 to 2002 would then be 6-4-0. This creates a deficit record of 5-5-0. Now, even if one assumes incorrectly that the 1970 NCAA Championship series that was played in Lake Placid, but played in the Shea Arena from the 1932 Olympic Games, was played in the Herb Brooks Arena, the deficit record would become 3-5-0 for games played in Herb Brooks Arena. When did those eight other games that the athletic site references occur? Or, is it just another error in a post that implies that Cornell appeared in the ECAC Championship game last season?

The Big Red's record in the 1993-2002 ECAC championships in Lake Placid is actually 7-5. Your accounting omits the 1998 (loss) and 2000 (win) "preliminary games." From 1998 to 2002, five teams advanced to championship weekend, with the two lowest seeds playing off on Thursday night; the loser of the game went home right away. That still does leave one four wins and four losses short.

[Aaron M. Griffin]

We also lost a play-in game in 1998 and won a play-in game in 2000, so those are two of the "missing" games.  Not sure about the other 2-4-0 record, though - was there ever a regular season tournament held there?

The Big Red's record in the 1993-2002 ECAC championships in Lake Placid is actually 7-5. Your accounting omits the 1998 (loss) and 2000 (win) "preliminary games." From 1998 to 2002, five teams advanced to championship weekend, with the two lowest seeds playing off on Thursday night; the loser of the game went home right away. That still does leave one four wins and four losses short.

Thanks for those corrections. The five-team set-up was before my time, so I overlook that historic setup occasionally considering it's not as easy to research/recognize as historic games like national title games or even ECAC Championship games before my time.

I was wondering if there was a regular-season tournament there too in which Cornell participated. I know that RPI and Union have had Halloween and Festivus events there recently, but Cornell did not participate in those in recent years.

[kingpin248]

We also lost a play-in game in 1998 and won a play-in game in 2000, so those are two of the "missing" games.  Not sure about the other 2-4-0 record, though - was there ever a regular season tournament held there?

The Big Red's record in the 1993-2002 ECAC championships in Lake Placid is actually 7-5. Your accounting omits the 1998 (loss) and 2000 (win) "preliminary games." From 1998 to 2002, five teams advanced to championship weekend, with the two lowest seeds playing off on Thursday night; the loser of the game went home right away. That still does leave one four wins and four losses short.

Thanks for those corrections. The five-team set-up was before my time, so I overlook that historic setup occasionally considering it's not as easy to research/recognize as historic games like national title games or even ECAC Championship games before my time.

I was wondering if there was a regular-season tournament there too in which Cornell participated. I know that RPI and Union have had Halloween and Festivus events there recently, but Cornell did not participate in those in recent years.

It would seem there was such a tournament in the early 1980's. From the all-time score archive, the Big Red participated from 1981-82 through 1984-85, going 1-1 in each of those four years - add that to the ECAC Tournament results and you get 11-9.

CHN's story on the move | CHN's column on the move, both authored by Adam.

[bnr24]

So yes, some still have these rules in place, but a Bed and Breakfast or a Lodge are places which have these rules typically regardless of location.  If you want to go only for our team though, there are more than enough options that allow for cancellation with as little as 3 days.  And these are only the hotels in Lake Placid, proper.  Once you go SLIGHTLY outside of Lake Placid, they are all refundable.  So the hotel argument to me seems to be invalid.

Not really, you're going to need to know the policy during ECAC week. What they do now doesn't mean what they will do then. Many hotels have different policies for major events. Certainly those were not the policies when the ECAC was there before. Hopefully it will all be explained tomorrow.

What makes you think that it will not be made even better a year later than that and during a weekend when demand will be high?  They will make even MORE money if they are able to make better cancellation policies during that weekend.  Besides, since when have hotels gotten MORE draconian in their policies into the future when it is already almost unheard of for places which are not B&Bs or Resorts.

Ummm.  Past experience?

Life.  Hotels.  Basic common sense?

I'm saying given that we are living in 2012, where social media is incredibly influential in our lives and people are living on the web, that things have likely changed in the last decade.  Things have changed in the last four years and to think that hotel policies are somehow magically free of this is naive.

Look, no one is saying you are wrong, just that the policies in the past were crap and we wait to see if the ECAC has convinced them to change. Maybe they have and you are correct, but we don't have any hard evidence that you are right. Yes things change, they change every year, but they never changed during all the years we were there before. Not even Adam seems able to say that things will be different. Having lived through the past, we don't want to experience it again.

You can give all the reasons that you want, and the seem to be good ones, but that doesn't change our worry. Maybe it will happen in a few more hours.

My main point (to both Jim and Al) is that we have no reason to think that it will NOT change when so many other things have and to worry about this before we can know anything for certain is pointless.  Those who are going to go will go regardless of the policies, given that it is not a cheap thing to do in the first place.  As someone who wasn't around last time it was played there, I am personally excited to see it go back. ::popcorn::

[css228]

As someone who wasn't alive when the miracle happened, I have to say I'm really excited that we're going to be in LP my senior year if we make the ECAC Final Four. However I'm glad it starts in my senior year because I really don't want to make that trip twice. Well that and I want to be making another trip in the general direction of AC in early April, and not just to see the folks.

[Aaron M. Griffin]

As someone who wasn't alive when the miracle happened, I have to say I'm really excited that we're going to be in LP my senior year if we make the ECAC Final Four. However I'm glad it starts in my senior year because I really don't want to make that trip twice. Well that and I want to be making another trip in the general direction of AC in early April, and not just to see the folks.

Interesting that the newest generation of fans (of which I am part) does not just assume that Cornell is going to the ECAC Championships. Especially considering that Cornell has made it seven out of the last eight seasons.

[bnr24]

As someone who wasn't alive when the miracle happened, I have to say I'm really excited that we're going to be in LP my senior year if we make the ECAC Final Four. However I'm glad it starts in my senior year because I really don't want to make that trip twice. Well that and I want to be making another trip in the general direction of AC in early April, and not just to see the folks.

Frozen Four in Philly?? :-D

[css228]

As someone who wasn't alive when the miracle happened, I have to say I'm really excited that we're going to be in LP my senior year if we make the ECAC Final Four. However I'm glad it starts in my senior year because I really don't want to make that trip twice. Well that and I want to be making another trip in the general direction of AC in early April, and not just to see the folks.

Interesting that the newest generation of fans (of which I am part) does not just assume that Cornell is going to the ECAC Championships. Especially considering that Cornell has made it seven out of the last eight seasons.

It has less to do with my experiences as a Cornell fan than with my lifelong experiences as Philadelphia sports fan. The moment you assume that you've got something in the bag, thats when the sucker punch is coming. Well that or Bud Selig will wait until the Rays tie the game to call a rain delay and you'll have to wait another 3 days to win. But point is I really should have realized when Stevens basically ended Lindros's career (or the useful portion of it at least), that we don't all get to grow up being yankees fans.

[css228]

As someone who wasn't alive when the miracle happened, I have to say I'm really excited that we're going to be in LP my senior year if we make the ECAC Final Four. However I'm glad it starts in my senior year because I really don't want to make that trip twice. Well that and I want to be making another trip in the general direction of AC in early April, and not just to see the folks.

Frozen Four in Philly?? :-D

No, I just really want a cheese steak from Jim's ;-).