Basketball Selection Show

[ugarte]

Announcers felt Temple deserved a 4-seed which if correct makes us in some ways a 13-seed.

You don't mean this, do you? Because if you do, it is the silliest thing you've said on the board in a long, long time.

No, it doesn't in any way "make us a 13 seed". What it means is that Temple got fucked because they SHOULD be playing a 13 seed. FWIW, I think Temple was seeded correctly, so even if the sense that we are a 13 seed is the difficulty of our draw I don't see that either.

[bernie]

current odds have temple as a 4 to 5 point favorite

[billhoward]

Some announcers said Temple felt more like a higher-seed. If they're 4-seed material, we drew the team with the talent to be awarded a 13-seed opponent. So we got screwed, too.

If both our seeds are fair, then play on. The early line has the spread on our game in the middle of the 5-vs.-12 matchups.
Texas A&M 3 over Utah State
Butler 5 over UTEP
Temple 5 over Cornell
Michigan State 12-13 over New Mexico State

[semsox]

Also, if we play Kentucky, John Wall will score 45.

I'm getting way way way way ahead of myself, but I've been hearing this kind of thing alot lately.  I know alot of people have been pooh-poohing Bilas for his comments about us getting to the Elite 8, but of all the #1 seeds, Kentucky is definitely the one I would want to face.  Having watched several of their games this year, and for all the talent and hyper-athleticism that they have, boy do they look pretty bad for long stretches.  Wall turns the ball over way too much and has a propensity to jack up terrible 3's instead of driving the lane like they should.  They're like Kansas except without the leadership and poise of Collins which is pretty much the only reason Kansas pulled the game out versus us.  Give me Kentucky over and of the other 1 seeds any day.

Basically I'm saying Kentucky isn't making it to the final 4.

[Al DeFlorio]

Announcers felt Temple deserved a 4-seed which if correct makes us in some ways a 13-seed.

You don't mean this, do you? Because if you do, it is the silliest thing you've said on the board in a long, long time.

I think this really overly harsh.  Several commentators, including Lunardi, thought Cornell worthy of an 11 seed, and several thought Temple would be a 4.  So to call Bill's posting "the silliest" is simply uncalled for.  If you think Temple and Cornell were seeded correctly, that's all that had to be said.  I don't recall anyone, here or elsewhere, anointing you as the final arbiter of college basketball knowledge.

[KeithK]

Announcers felt Temple deserved a 4-seed which if correct makes us in some ways a 13-seed.

You don't mean this, do you? Because if you do, it is the silliest thing you've said on the board in a long, long time.

I think this really overly harsh. ... [T]o call Bill's posting "the silliest" is simply uncalled for....

Have you read many of Bill's posts here  He's written many sillier things! :-P

[ugarte]

Announcers felt Temple deserved a 4-seed which if correct makes us in some ways a 13-seed.

You don't mean this, do you? Because if you do, it is the silliest thing you've said on the board in a long, long time.

I think this really overly harsh.  Several commentators, including Lunardi, thought Cornell worthy of an 11 seed, and several thought Temple would be a 4.  So to call Bill's posting "the silliest" is simply uncalled for.  If you think Temple and Cornell were seeded correctly, that's all that had to be said.  I don't recall anyone, here or elsewhere, anointing you as the final arbiter of college basketball knowledge.

I didn't ask to be anointed. Despite my lack of noble title, I've stated an opinion.

[ugarte]

min's chart, with scores:

Code Select Expand


                  [b]Cornell             Temple[/b]
St. Joseph's      W 78-66             W 73-46, W @75-67(OT)
La Salle          W @78-75            W 64-52, W @64-53
Pennsylvania      L @64-79, W 68-48   W @60-45
Kansas            L @66-71            L 52-84
Massachusetts     W 74-61             W 76-64
Seton Hall        L 79-89             W @71-65
St. John's        W @71-66            L 48-55


I think the St. John's game is officially a neutral site game but playing St. John's at MSG is effectively a road game.

The highlights for Cornell of this comparison are St. John's and Kansas. It doesn't look as close as I thought it might. Temple played decidedly better vs. St. Joe's, LaSalle, Penn and Seton Hall. UMass was a wash. I still feel good about this draw.

[Jordan 04]

min's chart, with scores:

Code Select Expand


                  [b]Cornell             Temple[/b]
St. Joseph's      W 78-66             W 73-46, W @75-67(OT)
La Salle          W @78-75            W 64-52, W @64-53
Pennsylvania      L @64-79, W 68-48   W @60-45
Kansas            L @66-71            L 52-84
Massachusetts     W 74-61             W 76-64
Seton Hall        L 79-89             W @71-65
St. John's        W @71-66            L 48-55


I think the St. John's game is officially a neutral site game but playing St. John's at MSG is effectively a road game.

The highlights for Cornell of this comparison are St. John's and Kansas. It doesn't look as close as I thought it might. Temple played decidedly better vs. St. Joe's, LaSalle, Penn and Seton Hall. UMass was a wash. I still feel good about this draw.

I had the exact opposite impression. It's difficult going off of final scores, but I thought the comparisons look a lot better than one would have thought for a #5 and a #12. It's not as if they consistently steamrolled teams that we struggled with, or vice versa.  There's a pretty good mix of everything in there.

[ugarte]

min's chart, with scores:

Code Select Expand


                  [b]Cornell             Temple[/b]
St. Joseph's      W 78-66             W 73-46, W @75-67(OT)
La Salle          W @78-75            W 64-52, W @64-53
Pennsylvania      L @64-79, W 68-48   W @60-45
Kansas            L @66-71            L 52-84
Massachusetts     W 74-61             W 76-64
Seton Hall        L 79-89             W @71-65
St. John's        W @71-66            L 48-55


I think the St. John's game is officially a neutral site game but playing St. John's at MSG is effectively a road game.

The highlights for Cornell of this comparison are St. John's and Kansas. It doesn't look as close as I thought it might. Temple played decidedly better vs. St. Joe's, LaSalle, Penn and Seton Hall. UMass was a wash. I still feel good about this draw.

I had the exact opposite impression. It's difficult going off of final scores, but I thought the comparisons look a lot better than one would have thought for a #5 and a #12. It's not as if they consistently steamrolled teams that we struggled with, or vice versa.  There's a pretty good mix of everything in there.

Oh, sure, but I wasn't basing it on the seeds. I was basing it on my own expectations, regardless of seed. They're a 5 and we're a 12 because of SOS, not because Temple has so thoroughly outplayed us this year. You are right that it is pretty close for a 5 vs a 12. That's why I feel good about the draw.

[billhoward]

Have you read many of Bill's posts here  He's written many sillier things! :-P

Exactly.

[Rita]

Steve Donahue was interviewed on Saturday (March 13, 2010) NPR's Only a Game about his views on the Tournament possibly expanding to 96 teams.  Even though a 96 field team would likely mean another IVY League team would get an invite, Coach Donahue is against the idea. (A 96 team field would mean changing the spelling of NC$$ to $$$$).

Also in this episode is a nice interview with Wofford's basketball coach. Wofford is in our pod and playing Wisconsin. With Cornell, Wofford and Duke, the JAX regional site probably has the highest GPA B-].

[Jordan 04]

Even though a 96 field team would likely mean another IVY League team would get an invite,

Would it, though?  While the chances would certainly increase in a strong year, "likely" seems to be pushing it. I don't know the historical RPI's for the non-champions, however.

[Jordan 04]

He didn't give a time, but Mike Francesa is going to have "da Cornell coach" on today.  I'll edit the post if I catch a time.  Interviews are also often available aftewards on WFAN.com.

[CUontheslopes]

Even though a 96 field team would likely mean another IVY League team would get an invite,

Would it, though?  While the chances would certainly increase in a strong year, "likely" seems to be pushing it. I don't know the historical RPI's for the non-champions, however.

I think you just need to look to see how many NIT bids Ivies have gotten. (65+32 = 97, so pretty much the same but scrapping the play-in game) Back in the 90's when the conference was better, we got considerably more teams into the NIT. Of recent, not so much. So perhaps not "likely" but plausible or realistic.