ECAC's moving to Atlantic City in 2011

[ursusminor]

It will be ironic if RPI finally makes it to Albany this year and attendance greatly increases.

[Jordan 04]

[quote RichH][quote bigredtrumpet][quote RichH]
(* Note: 7 of the 12 have to route through NYC traffic)
[/quote]

Not necessarily - outside of the already mentioned train travel, you can avoid NYC by taking the Tappan Zee bridge to the Garden State Parkway and ride that all the way to Atlantic City...[/quote]

My point was that all the driving times I listed are "best cases" because it doesn't take into account the slowing effect of the Metro NY traffic.  Taking a longer route to a bridge that also is often bogged down with traffic doesn't change that.

Look, as hockey crazed alumni, many of us would find a way to go to Phoenix (and bitch about it) if the league moved them there.  Personally, I think I'm looking forward to spending a weekend with gambling and drinking opportunities.  

My main reason for disliking this is that it screws undergrads from around the league, and that's a shame.  Consider the borderline hockey fan who may be on the fence about going to the tournament weekend.   Now you're basically doubling the travel time for just about every student (Princeton has never had an undergrad fanbase).  This location will be a detriment to attendance of all member institutions.  Locals still won't care.  The local media is smaller and less relevant.
[/quote]

Although the travel time will probably negate this, perhaps the drinking and gambling aspect has the potential to draw the borderline hockey fan who previously couldn't have cared less about going to Albany for a weekend. And being that the tournament is held over spring break, possibly even more impetus to head to AC for a weekend.

That said, it does seem awfully illogically to move the tournament even further from the 3 most dedicated local fan bases.  

As a New Yorker, I'm fairly ambivalent. I was always in the camp that was perfectly content with Albany as a venue and physical location, and although AC is equidistant, it has always seemed like more of a schlep than the straight shot up 87.  On the upside, a little luck at the tables can pay for the trip.  On the downside, hotels will be a little pricier, and I hate hate hate hate hate casino cigarette smoke.

[RichH]

[quote Scersk '97]Albany, while potentially charming(?) if you look (hard), is kind of a dump.  [/quote]

Agree, but the same can be said about just about every mid-size Northeastern city.  And really, AC is overall pretty dumpy too.  Once you get away from the Boardwalk (which has seen better days) or the modern Borgata, it's a lot like the seedy part of Niagara Falls.  But if you like the convenience of finding a bailbondsman in Albany, you'll feel right at home.

And the Times-Union Center is definitely a dump.

Disagree.  For an AHL arena, it's pretty good.  I prefer that arena to similar AHL venues in Binghamton, Glens Falls, Worcester, and just a shade better than Hartford.  And it gives the players the experience of getting to play in a "Pro Arena" if not for the memory, but in potential future NCAA Tournament venues.

I looked at the pictures of the AC arena.  It looks like the 1932 Rink in Lake Placid but with fancy lights.  (Not the 1980 Rink, mind you) or even a slightly better Syracuse War Memorial, of which the memories of the S(h)IT still makes me shiver.

I would also think that the hotel (ding-ding-ding) choices will be better.

Whee.  TRUMP welcomes the ECAC.  Anyone bitching about the room rates in Lake Placid will feel nostalgic for all the affordable quality lodging options on Wolf Rd.

Frankly, if they wanted a smaller venue, I think that the Arena at Harbor Yard in Bridgeport would have been adequate.  It's convenient to highways, train, and ferry.  It has hosted NCAA events.  It has a large enough surrounding population (yet close to small communities) to satisfy many fans, and it's in a familiar region to most league fans.

[Jacob '06]

[quote RichH]

Frankly, if they wanted a smaller venue, I think that the Arena at Harbor Yard in Bridgeport would have been adequate.  It's convenient to highways, train, and ferry.  It has hosted NCAA events.  It has a large enough surrounding population (yet close to small communities) to satisfy many fans, and it's in a familiar region to most league fans.[/quote]

And is in an awful area and no one would really want to stay around there.

[Beeeej]

Yeah, I'm a bit appalled.  It'll be nice to have "something to do" in the non-hockey time, but it's going to be a much more expensive proposition to stay anywhere near as close to the games as I enjoyed doing in Albany.  I could use it as an excuse to visit friends an hour's drive away in southern NJ, but then no drinking.  And the travel times from the various schools just boggle my mind.  Lake Placid and Atlantic City have one thing in common, that the roads you have to take to get there are relatively small and can take a long time - but at least Lake Placid is incredibly beautiful and close to some of the member schools.

If the tourney were going to be played during genuinely good boardwalk/beach weather I might feel differently, but it surely won't.

[Jordan 04]

[quote RichH]

Whee.  TRUMP welcomes the ECAC.  Anyone bitching about the room rates in Lake Placid will feel nostalgic for all the affordable quality lodging options on Wolf Rd.[/quote]

Apples and oranges to compare rates at the Trop or Caesars to Wolf Rd. accommodations. AC appears to have its own strip of affordable options by the airport, a few miles drive from the Boardwalk, which would be the proper comparison.

Walkable options will be more expensive than in Albany, but not exorbitantly so.  Rates for walkable hotels in the week leading up to the tournament this year were in the $100-$150 range.  I would expect the AC hotels to run ~$150-$175 per night for the tournament weekend.

Edit: Looks like I'm a bit off on the weekend rates. Next 2 weekends for boardwalk hotels run in the $200-250 range.

[RichH]

[quote Jacob '06][quote RichH]

Frankly, if they wanted a smaller venue, I think that the Arena at Harbor Yard in Bridgeport would have been adequate.  It's convenient to highways, train, and ferry.  It has hosted NCAA events.  It has a large enough surrounding population (yet close to small communities) to satisfy many fans, and it's in a familiar region to most league fans.[/quote]

And is in an awful area and no one would really want to stay around there.[/quote]

So who says you have to stay there?  Didn't I mention the proximity to transportation options for people who are so afraid of the boogieman that they have to run away?  You can go to your posh Fairfield, CT one stop on MetroNorth and live in a Martha Stewart CT world, if that's what you prefer.

They said the same things about Albany when it was moved from Lake Placid.  And you know what?  People stayed all over the place there, too.  See my previous comments about every mid-sized northeastern city.  I live in downtown Hartford, and I get that fear-mongering all the time from people who don't live there.  I heard the same stuff about Bridgeport from people before I went to the NCAA women's basketball tournament, and you know what?  It wasn't as bad as people said.  No, it's not for everyone.  And that's why the suburbs exist.  AC is dumpy as well.

Our options for a league tournament are:

1) Dumpy mid-size city in a minor league arena (which are almost always near the dumpy city centers)

2) Small, expensive, out of the way resort town

3) Playing 2nd fiddle in Boston.

It looks like they found a way to combine #1 and #2 into a fourth option.  I hope AC threw enough cash at the league office to make this worth it.

[Josh '99]

[ugarte]

On a personal level, this move works out well for me. I'm generally pleased with this move. I like poker, I usually don't go to the semis or consy, I have in-laws nearby so I can go watch hockey while my wife and son are visiting family. Plus, Boardwalk Hall isn't a bad venue. It is ~3000 seats smaller than the TUC, which always felt empty whenever it wasn't in the immediate aftermath of a Cornell goal/win.

But it is pretty clear that this will make the weekend more expensive and less convenient for most. I especially think this is a slap to undergrads, since they are mostly too young to gamble and too young to enjoy what passes for entertainment at the hotels.

Still, shuffle up and deal.

[redice]

[quote RichH]
Look, as hockey crazed alumni, many of us would find a way to go to Phoenix [/quote]

Be careful what you say Rich.....   They'll read this and immediately begin considering Phoenix.   After all, what could be better than the sunshiny southwest in March?  Not for me, of course.

[billhoward]

This wasn't, like, originally posted on onion.com?

This is good for alumni fans in the NYC area, of which Cornell has many. Okay, it screws the students who dominate the Lynah fan base. Also alumni in Boston. Al DeFlorio, who lives on Cape Cod, is going to make the Friday faceoff only if he leaves now for the game, or books a cruise ship that calls on Atlantic City.

It's not as far as driving to Boston. Disregarding what you find when you get there.

If you stay away from boardwalk hotels, prices will be okay. You can also book yourself as a Dryden, NY, VFW Bowling League group and get a nice Boardwalk discount plus gambling and drink credits. It works for a year or two before they wise up and learn you're not there to gamble.

Too bad the ECAC couldn't snag Madison Square Garden or Prudential Arena in Newark. Leave the upper level dark and it'd look half full.

Clarkson alum RichS lives in NJ so he's okay, but current Clarkson and St. Lawrence students got screwed. And Clarkson does have fans who love hockey. I almost feel sorry for them.

[slh10]

That SUCKS. I'm sure AC is nice for gambling and the arena may be nice, but it makes no sense to host a tourny so far from most of your fan base.Like it or not, a least Albany was somewhat centrally located. I hope it's a big flop and they choose to move to a better location in the future

[Al DeFlorio]

Providence would have been a better choice.  Nice city, attractive arena, wide choice of places to stay, varied--and many very good--dining options, reasonable travel for Harvard, Yale, Dartmouth, (all in this year's preseason top five), QU, RPI, Union and, not that it matters, Brown, and in an area where college (as well as prep) hockey has a real following.

[marty]

I've decided to look on the bright side of this decision - I may die before 2011 and then it won't make any difference to me.

[Jeff Hopkins '82]

Personally, this is great for me.  I get to save a half-day vacation (2 hours versus 3½ hours drive).  There are much better locations for me to go birdwatching when there's no hockey to watch.  The only downside is having to drive through downtown Philly to get there, but since I'll be doing it at lunchtime, no biggie.

Sucks for the students, tho.