The Athletic Department and Cornell Hockey

[Doug '08]

I think the bottom line is that Athletics takes hockey fans for granted, and just assume that they will always sell out the rink, pay inflated prices for tickets, and put up with anything because they are holding all the cards.  

And when the team is good, and winning, all of these things may be true, but when the team is losing, unfortunately, they aren't; the administration is slowly killing the will of the Lynah Faithful and Big Red Hockey.

[evilnaturedrobot]

[quote Trotsky]As a reminder, it's not the ushers' fault.  They don't set policy and if they  don't follow policy, they lose their jobs.  Be polite and respectful to them and I'm sure they will treat you the same way. [/quote]

Oh, I agree, and I happen to know the two ushers at the A/B entrance fairly well and have never had a problem with them (neither of them has even asked to see my ticket in about 6 months.)  

The times when I have had problems it's been with ushers or athletics officials from outside section A that have come over to harass either me or my friends.  I did not recognize the bearded individual who was staring at me on Saturday.  Last year a fellow from athletics came over and tried to throw me out for swearing during Gary Glitter (which I have never done.)  What saved me in that instance was one of the ushers that I know actually coming down and assuring this man from athletics that I do not swear.  

So it's clearly not a case of the evil ushers trying to suppress student expression, but rather of an overbearing policy.  And I'm sure that the ushers themselves treat students differently depending on whether or not they know them.  That's just human nature.

[evilnaturedrobot]

[quote Doug '08]I think the bottom line is that Athletics takes hockey fans for granted, and just assume that they will always sell out the rink, pay inflated prices for tickets, and put up with anything because they are holding all the cards.  
[/quote]

I agree. And, as I said above, what I find so ridiculous is that Athletics treats its best customers far worse than anyone else.  What other business would offer preferential treatment to people playing $3 while harassing those paying $13?  It just doesn't make any sense.

[KeithK]

[quote evilnaturedrobot][quote Doug '08]I think the bottom line is that Athletics takes hockey fans for granted, and just assume that they will always sell out the rink, pay inflated prices for tickets, and put up with anything because they are holding all the cards.  
[/quote]

I agree. And, as I said above, what I find so ridiculous is that Athletics treats its best customers far worse than anyone else.  What other business would offer preferential treatment to people playing $3 while harassing those paying $13?  It just doesn't make any sense.[/quote]
The fact is that they can ell out the rink even "treating their best customers worse".  It's been this way for years.  Basketball and football have had attendance problems so policing them this closely would probably impact the revenue stream.

Let's be honest though.  The student section at hockey games have more or less "earned" the heightened scrutiny based on their behavior over the years.  Swearing en masse is bound to attract negative attention eventually.

If the basketball team starts to have continued, sustained success and sells out consistently I'm pretty sure the free stuff will stop flowing to Newman and the behavioral controls will become stronger.

The OP asked "How many more years can Athletics ride this wave [of hockey success]?"  I assure you that it will take more than a couple years of 4th and 5th place finishes in the ECAC to end hockey's popularity.  The fact that someone can write that shows a lack of historical perspective.

[CowbellGuy]

Based on hundreds of unsold student season tickets the last couple years, I'd say "a couple years of 4th and 5th place finishes" is more than enough.

[ithacat]

[quote amerks127]My bad...I meant Miami Ohio, not Ohio State.  Miami Ohio, which plays at the brand new Steve Cady Arena, gives away 1,000 student tickets out of 3,200 seats.[/quote]

That's on a FCFS basis. Wouldn't it be nice camping out every week there's home games for a chance to get free tickets? I hope everyone's already in line for this weekend? :-)

I do think the students prices should come down. They're not selling them out...that should tell them something. It'll be interesting to see if the two years of so-so performance and basketball's rise impact townie loyalty next year.

[evilnaturedrobot]

[quote KeithK][quote evilnaturedrobot][quote Doug '08]I think the bottom line is that Athletics takes hockey fans for granted, and just assume that they will always sell out the rink, pay inflated prices for tickets, and put up with anything because they are holding all the cards.  
[/quote]

I agree. And, as I said above, what I find so ridiculous is that Athletics treats its best customers far worse than anyone else.  What other business would offer preferential treatment to people playing $3 while harassing those paying $13?  It just doesn't make any sense.[/quote]
The fact is that they can ell out the rink even "treating their best customers worse".  It's been this way for years.  Basketball and football have had attendance problems so policing them this closely would probably impact the revenue stream.

Let's be honest though.  The student section at hockey games have more or less "earned" the heightened scrutiny based on their behavior over the years.  Swearing en masse is bound to attract negative attention eventually.
[/quote]

I happen to agree with the swearing policy and, with the exception of 2 or 3 times when I've added 'asshole' when I thought the goon really deserved it, I don't swear.  My problem with the policy is the enforcement.  Pulling an entire season's worth of tickets for swearing at a college sporting event?  If you're caught swearing you should be tossed for that game and warned that if you're caught again that your tickets will be revoked. Revoking $250 dollars worth of tickets just for swearing once is draconian and uncalled for.

The only first time offenders that should have their season tickets pulled are the idiots who throw things on the ice at inappropriate times.


Edit:  Because not enough threads on elynah go off topic, I decided to respond too, and subsequently rant about, the other section of KeithK's post:

[quote KeithK]  
The fact is that they can ell out the rink even "treating their best customers worse".  It's been this way for years.  Basketball and football have had attendance problems so policing them this closely would probably impact the revenue stream.
[/quote]

This is true.  THe athletics office makes these sort of decisions based on what they can do, not what they should do, and it really speaks to a larger Cornell policy of just generally trying to nickel and dime it's student body at every opportunity.  I find this especially irksome after transferring in from an institution (in fact a larger and much poorer one) that didn't feel the need to charge it's students for things like bandwidth usage, gym access, or ice skating.  

There is a reason why so many alumni look back upon the university (the administration, not their experience while on the hill) with mixed feelings.  I would hope that the administration would consider this when they make their annual complaint that they don't benefit from alumni contributions in the same way that their peer institutions do.

[redhair34]

[quote evilnaturedrobot] Pulling an entire season's worth of tickets for swearing at a college sporting event?[/quote]

I know this is the stated penalty, but do people have knowledge of them actually adhering to it?  Or is it just a bunch of hot air?

[evilnaturedrobot]

[quote redhair34][quote evilnaturedrobot] Pulling an entire season's worth of tickets for swearing at a college sporting event?[/quote]

I know this is the stated penalty, but do people have knowledge of them actually adhering to it?  Or is it just a bunch of hot air?[/quote]

When the swearing crackdown first took effect (05-06?)  there were more than a few threads started by angry ticketholders that had their tickets revoked (I believe they were also JA'd..)

[redhair34]

[quote evilnaturedrobot][quote redhair34][quote evilnaturedrobot] Pulling an entire season's worth of tickets for swearing at a college sporting event?[/quote]

I know this is the stated penalty, but do people have knowledge of them actually adhering to it?  Or is it just a bunch of hot air?[/quote]

When the swearing crackdown first took effect (05-06?)  there were more than a few threads started by angry ticketholders that had their tickets revoked (I believe they were also JA'd..)[/quote]

Yeah let me clarify--have they been adhering to it this season for instance?

[ebilmes]

[quote KeithK]
The OP asked "How many more years can Athletics ride this wave [of hockey success]?"  I assure you that it will take more than a couple years of 4th and 5th place finishes in the ECAC to end hockey's popularity.  The fact that someone can write that shows a lack of historical perspective.[/quote]

Thank you, Keith. I was waiting for someone to try to discredit me on the basis of my relative youth.

As Age pointed out, this new ticket process has resulted in several hundred unsold student season tickets each of the last couple years. Athletics consistently overestimates demand for hockey tickets. Given the high price and convoluted process of buying tickets, not to mention the team's relative mediocrity, there simply aren't enough undergraduates who want to buy tickets. The article linked earlier about Duke basketball mentioned that the system was changed because (among other reasons) Coach K noticed empty seats in the student sections.

Have you been to Lynah this year? At the beginning of the season, you could see where the unsold seats in G/H were. I wonder if Schafer notices the gaps.

Next year, the senior class ('09) will be the only one that can remember making the NCAA tournament. Or (maybe) even making Albany. You don't think demand for tickets will continue to drop, especially with the basketball team playing next door?

Athletics needs to cultivate hockey fan support so that there will continue to be a large, vocal, supportive fan base even when the team is at .500. You can say I don't have a "historical perspective," but neither will the students who decide whether or not to buy tickets next season.

[evilnaturedrobot]

[quote redhair34][quote evilnaturedrobot][quote redhair34][quote evilnaturedrobot] Pulling an entire season's worth of tickets for swearing at a college sporting event?[/quote]

I know this is the stated penalty, but do people have knowledge of them actually adhering to it?  Or is it just a bunch of hot air?[/quote]

When the swearing crackdown first took effect (05-06?)  there were more than a few threads started by angry ticketholders that had their tickets revoked (I believe they were also JA'd..)[/quote]

Yeah let me clarify--have they been adhering to it this season for instance?[/quote]

I had a friend who got thrown out during the first exhibition game (why he was swearing during an exhibition game is beyond me.)  They (I don't recall if it was gene or one of his underlings) took him in and threatened to revoke his tickets but then relented after he apologized, and on account of it being the first game of the year.  They then made it very clear that this was not a courtesy that would be extended to subsequent offenders.

Whether or not this was hot air I cannot say, as I do not know anyone else that has been kicked out this season.  It is possible that they have eased up on the policy (the less stringent fish enforcement might point to this.)  At the same time, it's quite possible that they are still revoking tickets for first time offenders.  We'll have to find someone who has been ejected during the regular season in order to find out.

What I can say is that my friend has been especially careful since his encounter, a stern warning certainly worked in his case.

[Josh '99]

[quote KeithK]The fact is that they can ell out the rink even "treating their best customers worse".  It's been this way for years.  Basketball and football have had attendance problems so policing them this closely would probably impact the revenue stream.[/quote]But there are two separate parts to this.  Keeping the price high "because they can" makes sense - they make more money that way.  Treating people badly "because they can" doesn't make sense - what's the incentive to treat people badly?

[Jim Hyla]

Let's also remember that it was Coach Schafer who was complaining about the language and the need to clean it up. It's funny how some of us old guys can remember cheering, yelling, and screaming and not having to swear at all.(See signature below) While I think the policy may be too harsh in it's enforcement, I don't see why the policy of not swearing is so hard to understand; nor should it be that hard to follow.

[nr53]

I've never really understood how they can revoke someone's season tickets. It's not that you have to scan the ticket or provide ID when coming in to the rink. I do remember that students put down their ID numbers when buying tickets but it would be really simple to swap with a friend and say that you sold yours at the beginning of the season and then bought random games from friends. Completely unenforceable in my opinion and therefore not a threat I ever took seriously.