How crazy would this have been?

So, while watching the 3OT game, we had kind of a crazy idea. I've been thinking more about it the last few days, and decided to throw it out here, to see how crazy everyone here thinks it would have been. (Don't laugh me off of ELynah, OK?)

So we're going into the third OT. Every player on the ice has played almost three full games in roughly 24 hours. They are all exhausted. The idea of anyone having any spring in their step is long gone.

But what if you had a fresh player on the bench? What if this fresh player hadn't played a single minute in the past week? What if he were an excellent skater and, even some would say, an emotional team-leader?

What might have happened if Schafer had taken the pads off Louis Chabot between the second and third OT, given him a thin stick, put him on a wing, and said "Go for it, Louis?"

Would the fact that Chabot was completely fresh have made up for whatever he lacks in stick-handling ability? Would the simple fact that he was out there on a wing have given everyone else just a tad more of an adrenaline rush?

Obviously I am not second-guessing Schafer on this one. It is a crazy idea. But just how crazy? On a acale of 1-10, where 1 is not at all crazy and 10 is completely absurd, how crazy would this have been? 1 is, say, suddenly discovering you have a third Abbott on the bench, who has been practicing with the team all year, is eligible to play, and has skills similar to his brothers'. A 10 would be completely effing nuts...maybe like yelling up into the stands asking if any Cornell student has ice skated before, and if so, would that student like to take a shot at it.

So on that scale, where does putting Louis on a wing in the third OT fall?
Andy W.

14?

You can't do it. The rules state how many skaters you can have and how many goalies, and a goalie cannot play as a skater. If he goes out in his goalie pads, he cannot cross the red line at center ice. Even if you could do it, it would be pretty crazy.

it would be F***ing Nuts.

let me play devil's advocate with you... what if while louis is trying to not die... McKee breaks an arm??? they don't give you all day to change goalies. Louis wouldn't have time to change. and playing on overtime with no goalie is... well it isn't good for carrying on your season.

I'm curious what made you think a second-string goaltender, even a well-watered and refreshed one, could get past the Wisconsin defense when four lines of skaters could not. They were worn out, not rotting corpses.

Now, Ron Hextall, maybe...

Section A Banshee
I'm curious what made you think a second-string goaltender, even a well-watered and refreshed one, could get past the Wisconsin defense when four lines of skaters could not. They were worn out, not rotting corpses.

Now, Ron Hextall, maybe...

I thought you wanted somebody who could get past a defenseman, not *slash* him.

jmh30

Section A Banshee
I'm curious what made you think a second-string goaltender, even a well-watered and refreshed one, could get past the Wisconsin defense when four lines of skaters could not. They were worn out, not rotting corpses.

Now, Ron Hextall, maybe...

I thought you wanted somebody who could get past a defenseman, not *slash* him.

I admit that "a burning desire to hurt things" was high on my list of criteria for which random goaltender I ought to put in the afterthought.

Aside from the fact that Jacob '06 has pointed out that this can never be, and Section A Banshee's points about the team being tired, but not rotting corpses...

I'd imagine Chabot (or most any goalie) would get completely leveled and injured as soon as they stepped onto the ice. The goalie isn't used to getting checked, and I'm sure an opponent, as tired as they could be, could flatten a backup goalie trying to play forward.

You can't do it. The rules state how many skaters you can have and how many goalies, and a goalie cannot play as a skater. If he goes out in his goalie pads, he cannot cross the red line at center ice.

So are you saying that the rules stipulate a team must dress and play with exactly two or three goalies? No more and no fewer? Or are you suggesting that once Louis steps on the ice in goalie pads during the warm-up, that makes him a goalie for the game, and he can not take the pads off and play a non-goalie position for the rest of that game? If either of the above are correct, I was not aware of a rule like that.

let me play devil's advocate with you... what if while louis is trying to not die... McKee breaks an arm??? they don't give you all day to change goalies. Louis wouldn't have time to change. and playing on overtime with no goalie is... well it isn't good for carrying on your season.

Well, I did say it was crazy. But to address your point, I think in the big scheme of things, the risk of McKee getting hurt, and not having time to get Louis in net is a pretty small one. I mean just how often does a goalie get hurt during a game such that the backup goalie has to take over? In my mind, that just doesn't happen enough to be a major factor in this decision. Also, in the rare instance where this did happen, you'd start changing the pads on Louis as soon as someone started tending to McKee. If McKee were injured badly enough that he needed to come out of the game, it would probably take a good bit of time to get him to the locker room. After that Schafer uses his timeout to gain some more time for Chabot to be padded up. By the end of the timeout I would guess Louis would be pretty close to being ready. And if he wasn't, I'd expect the ref would cut us a little slack.

All this to say there are certainly many, many good reasons to not play Chabot on a wing, but I just don't think the possibility of injury to McKee is one of them.

I'm curious what made you think a second-string goaltender, even a well-watered and refreshed one, could get past the Wisconsin defense when four lines of skaters could not. They were worn out, not rotting corpses.

I'm by no means certain that he could have. But by the third OT, everyone out there was looking pretty darn sluggish. Which is what made me think maybe...

I'd imagine Chabot (or most any goalie) would get completely leveled and injured as soon as they stepped onto the ice. The goalie isn't used to getting checked, and I'm sure an opponent, as tired as they could be, could flatten a backup goalie trying to play forward.

This was something else I wondered about. Clearly not getting Louis injured in a reckless manner is of the utmost importance.

I did say it was a crazy idea...
Andy W.

Josh 03
I'd imagine Chabot (or most any goalie) would get completely leveled and injured as soon as they stepped onto the ice. The goalie isn't used to getting checked, and I'm sure an opponent, as tired as they could be, could flatten a backup goalie trying to play forward.

There are some folks in the Czech Republic who might disagree with you. (See Hasek, Domenic)

andyw2100

You can't do it. The rules state how many skaters you can have and how many goalies, and a goalie cannot play as a skater. If he goes out in his goalie pads, he cannot cross the red line at center ice.

So are you saying that the rules stipulate a team must dress and play with exactly two or three goalies? No more and no fewer? Or are you suggesting that once Louis steps on the ice in goalie pads during the warm-up, that makes him a goalie for the game, and he can not take the pads off and play a non-goalie position for the rest of that game? If either of the above are correct, I was not aware of a rule like that.

There is such a rule. Most of us are not aware of most of the rules, but I looked it up last night after Jacob's response.

SECTION 3. a. At the beginning of each game, the coach of each team shall list the players and goalkeepers who shall be eligible to play in the game. A maximum of 18 players, plus not more than three nor less than two goalkeepers, shall be permitted; and a captain shall be designated. A substitute goalkeeper must be on the bench at the start of the game and shall at all times be fully dressed and equipped and ready to play.

and

SECTION 4. a. Fifteen minutes prior to the start of the game, a list of names and numbers of all eligible players and goalkeepers, including starting lineups, shall be submitted to the official scorer or referee.

So you need two goaltenders and Louis is declared as one. Then there is a rule saying that a goalie can't participate in the play past the red line, which I could quote if you insist

Its still an interesting concept, but its against the rules.

Thanks for looking up and quoting the rule. That's very interesting.

Of particular interest is the fact that this rule makes it sound like when a team chooses to dress three goalies, they are not doing so at the expense of having one fewer position player. (I guess I never counted when I see a team with three goalies.) I had always assumed that the total number of players allowed was fixed, and that by dressing a third goalie, the team was actually playing with one less skater.

You learn something new every day.
Andy W.

I think it would take all of about 11 seconds for the goalie to find a way to get a penalty called on himself for interference, holding, or something.

That being said, I haven't read "The Game" in years, but I seem to remember Dryden played defense in rec league games after he retired from pro hockey.

To continue this completely absurd topic, would Louis get to keep his goalie skates or have to switch to regular ones? I ask because I used to work with a former Cornell goalie who was so used to skating in goalie skates for the last decade, he literally couldn't skate on regular hockey skates. So there's that aspect to consider.

Jerseygirl
To continue this completely absurd topic, would Louis get to keep his goalie skates or have to switch to regular ones? I ask because I used to work with a former Cornell goalie who was so used to skating in goalie skates for the last decade, he literally couldn't skate on regular hockey skates. So there's that aspect to consider.

Well, since at this point we'd be assuming that the rule requiring 2 or 3 goalies does not exist, I guess we can also assume no special rule about goalie skates. So Louis gets to skate in any skates he wants to skate in.
Andy W.

Jerseygirl
To continue this completely absurd topic, would Louis get to keep his goalie skates or have to switch to regular ones? I ask because I used to work with a former Cornell goalie who was so used to skating in goalie skates for the last decade, he literally couldn't skate on regular hockey skates. So there's that aspect to consider.

I didn't realize there was a difference - care to elaborate?

Liz '05

Jerseygirl
To continue this completely absurd topic, would Louis get to keep his goalie skates or have to switch to regular ones? I ask because I used to work with a former Cornell goalie who was so used to skating in goalie skates for the last decade, he literally couldn't skate on regular hockey skates. So there's that aspect to consider.

I didn't realize there was a difference - care to elaborate?

IIRC, goalie skates are shorter - your foot is closer to the ice, and there is little or no arc along the length of the blade, much like speed skaters'. I believe this allows easier 'skimming' from side to side.

Regular skates:
[www.hockeygiant.com]

Goalie skates:
[www.hockeygiant.com]

Goalie skates have a wider blade and are less curved, with a sharper nub on each end. I guess that this is because goalies have to do less high speed precision work and more traction and gripping the ice with their skates work.

All seriousness aside... Mitch Carefoot went out with an injury in the second or third period (I can't recall when), and although there was speculation that he had some kind of concussion, when he came back on the ice well into overtime, I recall thinking, "you know, he's the freshest guy out there..."

Very interesting - thanks, Jerseygirl and Winnebago. I'm an awful skater, which is how I ended up playing goalie for intramurals, but I'd always kinda wondered how the goalies got up and around so quickly...

Section A Banshee
I'm curious what made you think a second-string goaltender, even a well-watered and refreshed one, could get past the Wisconsin defense when four lines of skaters could not. They were worn out, not rotting corpses.

Now, Ron Hextall, maybe...

Dryden played defense in college, you know ... while in law school, on pickup teams.

If ever there's another hockey version of Midgets in the Outfield ... you've got something in script stage already, at least two paragraphs worth.

"Well watered" would be Leggio of Clarkson. We should probably install a spigot at the west end goal for the lad. You hit him hard in the stomach with a strong wrister and he'd probably wet his shorts. I know exercize gurus say to keep yourself well hydrated, but everything has a limit. (I can see a sign in Lynah where Section A keeps taping water bottle silhouettes as he drinks up.)

To answer Andy's subject line: What comes atop "crazy"?

billhoward

Section A Banshee
I'm curious what made you think a second-string goaltender, even a well-watered and refreshed one, could get past the Wisconsin defense when four lines of skaters could not. They were worn out, not rotting corpses.

Now, Ron Hextall, maybe...

Dryden played defense in college, you know ... while in law school, on pickup teams.

If ever there's another hockey version of Midgets in the Outfield ... you've got something in script stage already, at least two paragraphs worth.

"Well watered" would be Leggio of Clarkson. We should probably install a spigot at the west end goal for the lad. You hit him hard in the stomach with a strong wrister and he'd probably wet his shorts. I know exercize gurus say to keep yourself well hydrated, but everything has a limit. (I can see a sign in Lynah where Section A keeps taping water bottle silhouettes as he drinks up.)

To answer Andy's subject line: What comes atop "crazy"?

And another thread likely meets its inscrutible end...

billhoward

Section A Banshee
I'm curious what made you think a second-string goaltender, even a well-watered and refreshed one, could get past the Wisconsin defense when four lines of skaters could not. They were worn out, not rotting corpses.

Now, Ron Hextall, maybe...

Dryden played defense in college, you know ... while in law school, on pickup teams.

All right, well, the point I was trying to make might be better illustrated by this hypothetical question: in a game situation, Cornell player vs. two tired Wisconsin defenders and Brian Elliott, who would you rather have with the puck?

A) Evan Barlow, with six periods of fatigue, a parched throat, seized-up shoulder muscles, dislocated jaw, and two fingers missing from his right hand

or

B) Louis Chabot

Call me crazy, but I'd still choose A.

I almost always play goalie. If I haven't skated out in a few months, it always takes me at least a couple of shifts to get the feel for the sharper, rockered player skates. They are far more maneuverable in the sense that they turn much tighter and the blades are much sharper. The goal skate has a long, flat blade which is stable and easy to slide side-to-side on, but not very good for making sharp cuts, especially on hard ice. I also tend to be more on the balls of my feet in the ready position as a goaltender, so when I start to skate out I tend to start to fall forward until I get used to regular skates again since the blade curves up and does not offer as much support on a player skate. I also tend to catch the edges on player skates since they are sharper. This is kind of like the long vs. short and straight vs. shaped ski discussions some of us had.

[elf.elynah.com]

Of course for Louis to play, he would have to have a full set of player pads and helmet and the right size skates available. I'm sure the team has extra gear at all times, but it might be tough to find skates with a good fit.

billhoward
What comes atop "crazy"?

Tyler Hirsh? (Ok, ok - cheap shot, I know)

And also, how much experience with a regular stick does he have? If it's not much, as I suspect, that could lead to him missing a lot of passes, which in turn would mean a lot of turnovers, which in turn would mean our players would have to spend a lot more time chasing UW down the ice and getting even more tired. So even from a freshness point of view, it could backfire.

Now, if Schafer made a quick call to the University and got himself admitted to a master's program so that he could play on the team as a Cornell student, then maybe you'd have something I would only worry that his frail old bones could quickly turn our "Kill Schafer Kill!" into UW's "Kill Schafer! Kill Schafer!"

Or better yet...

Since this Regional Final OT thing is getting to be a habit, how about Schafer recognized the flow of the game would be a grudge match by early in the 3rd. He sits someone...let's say McCutcheon and double shifts a guy like Mugford or Barlow. By the last 5 minutes of the 2nd OT, when everyone on the ice is sucking for air, out comes a fresher McClutcheon! To power past all the sluggish and weak Badgers! Ridiculously risky to assume you make it that far, of course, but not as crazy as having Chabot lace 'em up.

...........

Now what if Da Big Red were to enter the Indianapolis 500? Uhhh, what would you predict would be the outcome, huh?

How would they compete?

Well, let's say they rode together in a big bus.

Is Schafer driving?

Of course.

Yeah, I gotta go with Da Big Red Bus!

RichH
Or better yet...

Since this Regional Final OT thing is getting to be a habit, how about Schafer recognized the flow of the game would be a grudge match by early in the 3rd. He sits someone...let's say McCutcheon and double shifts a guy like Mugford or Barlow. By the last 5 minutes of the 2nd OT, when everyone on the ice is sucking for air, out comes a fresher McClutcheon! To power past all the sluggish and weak Badgers! Ridiculously risky to assume you make it that far, of course, but not as crazy as having Chabot lace 'em up.

...........

Now what if Da Big Red were to enter the Indianapolis 500? Uhhh, what would you predict would be the outcome, huh?

How would they compete?

Well, let's say they rode together in a big bus.

Is Schafer driving?

Of course.

Yeah, I gotta go with Da Big Red Bus!

But what about Da Big Red versus a hurricane? Wait, wait... the hurricane is named Hurricane Da Big Red.

I am amazed this thread got past three replies. Must be the offseason.

Section A Banshee
Must be the offseason.

Sigh.