Scare tactics email from Gene Nighman

Every time Cornell-Harvard is televised, Athletics tries to convince us they will behead anyone throwing a fish. This year is no different:
[Q]
Dear hockey ticket holder,


An important hockey weekend is upon us! Before the action starts, I
would like to notify you of some important issues.

Harvard game start time
The Saturday game vs. Harvard starts at 5:30 p.m. to facilitate a
live CSTV broadcast.

Fish
Cornell is on notice that if the game vs. Harvard is delayed because
of fish on the ice, or because of other distuptive, unsportsmanlike
fan behavior, the Big Red will be penalized (and the penalty is a
five minute major)! Cornell Police will check everyone at the
entrances to Lynah, and fish will be confiscated. Anyone found with
a fish will lose his or her tickets to the game. As usual, throwing
objects onto the ice is prohibited, and violators will be expelled
from the rink.

Worthy Cause
Instead of wasting money on fish, risking ejection from the rink or
having the team penalized, why not continue a two-year tradition and
donate a toy to the Cops, Kids and Toys program? Leave the fish at
home and make life a little brighter for area children by bringing a
new stuffed toy to the game. Toys that are collected prior to the
announcement of the starting lineups will be donated to the Cops,
Kids and Toys program which benefits over 600 families and 1,600
children in Tompkins County each year.

Use of Profane Language
People shouting obscenities or using threatening language, signs or
gestures will be ejected from the game and lose their playoff
tickets. NO EXCEPTIONS!

Thank you for supporting Big Red hockey in a positive manner!

Sincerely,

Gene M. Nighman '81
[/Q]

Is there even a provision in the rules for a five-minute major for delay of game, and on a first offense at that? Sounds like an escalation of FUD.

I thought it was a two-minute minor bench penalty. Anyone...?

Does it really matter? I'd imagine it's a no-penalty situation because your rink staff always clears whatever you toss on the ice very quickly so the game is not delayed at all. Also, has the Faithful ever let a letter like this stop them before?

Actually, we've been called for delay-of-game several times, but only when fish was thrown later during play, but never during player intros. At any rate, it is a 2 minute minor, and is being discussed in the "Be nice to Harvard" thread.

Throw one for me.

Maybe I'll order some fish at the Sports Depot and hurl it at the TV...

Kyle

Throw everything including the kitchen sink on the ice.

mjh89
Throw everything including the kitchen sink on the ice.

Throw Gene Nighman on the ice and cover him with fish guts.

I think appropriate would be a large fish with "Andy Noel can bite my shiny metal ass" prominently typeset in a repeating pattern on a piece of paper tied to the fish.

Cheers,
Kyle

Aren't parents warned not to make threats they do not plan to carry out? Otherwise the children quickly catch on and no longer listen. I would think falsely warning us about exaggerated penalties would fall into this category.

Gene's reply:

[q]Excuse my ignorance. As you probably know my area of expertise is in wrestling not hockey.[/q]

Sarcastic or not, no comment necessary.

canuck89
I thought it was a two-minute minor bench penalty. Anyone...?

Here's the rule, from this year's NCAA rulebook:

"Interference by Spectators
"SECTION 30. a. In the event that objects that interfere with the progress of the game are thrown onto the ice, the official shall blow the whistle and stop the play; and the puck shall be faced off at the spot where play is stopped.
"Fans are not permitted to throw objects on the ice. At the discretion of the referee, a warning may be issued before the game.
"b. Spectators are not permitted to use artificial noisemakers, air horns, or electronic amplifiers while the game is in progress.
"c. The band(s) shall not be allowed to play while the game is in progress."
"PENALTIES -- a. through c. -- Warning or bench minor against offending fans' team for delay of game.
"It is the referee's discretion, depending on the severity of the action, whether or not a warning is necessary.
"Note: Conferences or the proper disciplinary authority are encouraged to develop policies in this area if necessary."

I've not heard anything about the ECAC or the "proper disciplinary authority" upping this penalty to a major. I'm not even sure they'd be able to do so.

Oops, just saw the post above, oh well. I don't suppose there will be another mass Email saying "minor, not major"?

Here's what I wrote in this week's column on the subject:

What should the policy be on throwing fish this year?

This will probably be published after the official policy is released but if history is any indication, athletics and the administration will probably get it wrong. Throwing fish on the ice when Harvard’s hockey team comes out for the first period is long standing tradition at Lynah. As long as no fish is thrown after that single occasion, the administration and athletics have no justification for not allowing it. The last several years, the only time it happens is at this time and the students have been great at not doing it after the original warning announcement is made. Sure, it delays the game a bit and smells up the rink, but it really does not do any harm. The students have every right to continue this tradition and no one person – not the president of the university, nor the hockey coach, nor the athletic director - is bigger than it. It does not have to be encouraged, but it should be allowed and then the warning be made.
Or here’s another idea. How about Cornell just adopts Colgate’s policy on throwing gum onto the ice and actually encourage it while continually threatening a Colgate penalty should it happen again. Then when more gum is thrown on the ice, officials just send out another warning.

1) Maybe it's a five-minute major for throwing fish below the size limit, two minute bench minor otherwise.

2) Has the team been penalized ever for fish *before* the opening faceoff?

3) Cornell probably thinks the fish-tossing makes us look like a rural agricultural college rather than an Ivy League institution. Which we are. And it's on TV.

4) Has anyone asked Cornell for the list of forbidden phrases considerd obscene or threatening? Perhaps if it were circulated here, that would help fans understand what they should not say, write or think. Isn't "obscene" a variable term without specifics? Or is this a sports extension to our recent hate crime laws?

calgARI '07
Here's what I wrote in this week's column on the subject:

What should the policy be on throwing fish this year?

This will probably be published after the official policy is released but if history is any indication, athletics and the administration will probably get it wrong. Throwing fish on the ice when Harvard’s hockey team comes out for the first period is long standing tradition at Lynah. As long as no fish is thrown after that single occasion, the administration and athletics have no justification for not allowing it. The last several years, the only time it happens is at this time and the students have been great at not doing it after the original warning announcement is made. Sure, it delays the game a bit and smells up the rink, but it really does not do any harm. The students have every right to continue this tradition and no one person – not the president of the university, nor the hockey coach, nor the athletic director - is bigger than it. It does not have to be encouraged, but it should be allowed and then the warning be made.
Or here’s another idea. How about Cornell just adopts Colgate’s policy on throwing gum onto the ice and actually encourage it while continually threatening a Colgate penalty should it happen again. Then when more gum is thrown on the ice, officials just send out another warning.

Well put. I think they send the email just so it looks like they're doing something, but if they really were their checks at the door would be more than a chest pat-down. When it comes time to throw the fish, they always know people have them in there, and just tell you to get it done then and not later.

CowbellGuy
Gene's reply:

[q]Excuse my ignorance. As you probably know my area of expertise is in wrestling not hockey.[/q]

Sarcastic or not, no comment necessary.

Maybe he could MC the hockey games?

For what it's worth, I think they've Nighman sent out a very similar email my first two years here and they didn't end up following through. I'm not going to test the power-hungry ushers in the student sections though.

:
[Q]
Dear hockey ticket holder,


An important hockey weekend is upon us! Before the action starts, I
would like to notify you of some important issues.

Harvard game start time
The Saturday game vs. Harvard starts at 5:30 p.m. to facilitate a
live CSTV broadcast.

Fish
Cornell is on notice that if the game vs. Harvard is delayed because
of fish on the ice, or because of other distuptive, unsportsmanlike
fan behavior, the Big Red will be penalized (and the penalty is a
five minute major)! Cornell Police will check everyone at the
entrances to Lynah, and fish will be confiscated. Anyone found with
a fish will lose his or her tickets to the game. As usual, throwing
objects onto the ice is prohibited, and violators will be expelled
from the rink.

And furthermore you will forfeit all the remaining tickets (0 -zero)
in your season ticket package.

[/Q]

billhoward

3) Cornell probably thinks the fish-tossing makes us look like a rural agricultural college rather than an Ivy League institution. Which we are.

Both!?!

So - if I bring my fish, hide it sufficiently, and throw it ONLY when the Harvard players first go onto the ice, I don't need to worry right? Anyone have advice on how to throw it without the ushers noticing? I really don't want to get kicked out, but I also really would like to participate in the fish throwing

I love the fish-throwing tradition and, as long as it is restricted to the single occasion of the first period entrance of the Harvard team onto the ice, I don't have any problem with it. But it's incorrect to say that neither the university president nor the coach would have any justification in stopping it if they wanted to. Schafer can certainly stop it, and if he were to beg the crowd to do so, I'd hope we would. And the president... well, as was said in Jaws, "I can do anything I want... I'm the Chief of Police."

It's a distinctive tradition which does no harm and people remember it, thus making it a great emotional rallying point. But if they wanted to, the Powers that Be would be perfectly justified in signing it away with a sweep of the pen. Just one more reason to keep it within the bounds of the unspoken agreement we have evolved over the last two decades. Just once, at the right time, then no more.

Throw it when Harvard comes out BEFORE the game. Other than that, the ushers won't do a thing or care. As far as my experience goes, you will not be kicked out. Think Colgate toothpaste X3 or more. There's too much going on for them to enforce/care at that point.

Sandy (or was it Marshall?) threw a dildo on the ice in 1991 (I think it was '91). That was funny. No penalty.

God, I'd have loved to see that. That's hilarious, my dislike of Cornell's tossing stuff on the ice nonwithstanding.

marty
:
[Q]
Dear hockey ticket holder,


An important hockey weekend is upon us! Before the action starts, I
would like to notify you of some important issues.

Harvard game start time
The Saturday game vs. Harvard starts at 5:30 p.m. to facilitate a
live CSTV broadcast.

Fish
Cornell is on notice that if the game vs. Harvard is delayed because
of fish on the ice, or because of other distuptive, unsportsmanlike
fan behavior, the Big Red will be penalized (and the penalty is a
five minute major)! Cornell Police will check everyone at the
entrances to Lynah, and fish will be confiscated. Anyone found with
a fish will lose his or her tickets to the game. As usual, throwing
objects onto the ice is prohibited, and violators will be expelled
from the rink.

And furthermore you will forfeit all the remaining tickets (0 -zero)
in your season ticket package.

[/Q]

Haha, note to Gene: don't just copy and paste last year's warning (with the CSTV mention snuck in).

RatushnyFan
Sandy (or was it Marshall?) threw a dildo on the ice in 1991 (I think it was '91). That was funny. No penalty.

And it was later donated to the [this is the polite version] toys for tots for fund? Now that's charity.

If harvard had fans and they were deticated enough to risk being kicked out of the game couldnt he or she dress as a cornell fan then throw fish late in the third and Cornell would get a penalty? I think that rule is rediculous for that reason.

bigred06
If harvard had fans and they were deticated enough to risk being kicked out of the game couldnt he or she dress as a cornell fan then throw fish late in the third and Cornell would get a penalty? I think that rule is rediculous for that reason.

My guess is that even if it was discovered that it was a Harvard fan, it would take too long to conclude that to stop any penalties, and the refs could use the justification that Cornell was being punished as a whole for letting someone with a fish into the rink.

las224
So - if I bring my fish, hide it sufficiently, and throw it ONLY when the Harvard players first go onto the ice, I don't need to worry right? Anyone have advice on how to throw it without the ushers noticing? I really don't want to get kicked out, but I also really would like to participate in the fish throwing

I've seen the ushers occasionally throw out one or two people to "set an example" - the one thing I might suggest is, if your seat is right by an aisle, try to move a few spots towards the middle of the section before you throw your fish.

i was thrown out last year for not throwing a fish. i sat in sect O and the ushers blamed me for someone 3 rows ahead for throwing something. it was really a frustrating experience, but gene nighman actually sorted the whole thing out, which was good.

A-19
i was thrown out last year for not throwing a fish. i sat in sect O and the ushers blamed me for someone 3 rows ahead for throwing something. it was really a frustrating experience, but gene nighman actually sorted the whole thing out, which was good.

Some of these ushers are totally clueless and my worst nightmare is getting kicked out for not throwing a fish or not swearing.

Will Lynah be like a crowded bar or nightclub?

A fan gets tossed out, one more gets in so long as it's 3836 plus standees, players, coaches, rink officials?

After Moulson's hat trick a few years ago at Lynah East, the Harvard fan threw his hat on the ice about 5 mintues later trying to get a delay of game called on Cornell.

Needless to say the refs didn't bite.

Best way to avoid getting kicked out, tell your section to show up for intros or at least stand with other people. Otherwise, you'll stand out like a sore thumb.

oceanst41
After Moulson's hat trick a few years ago at Lynah East, the Harvard fan threw his hat on the ice about 5 mintues later trying to get a delay of game called on Cornell.

Needless to say the refs didn't bite.

OTOH, during one of my years on the hill, Brock Tredway got a hat trick against Sucks at Lynah. The zebras DID call a delay of game for it. Fortunately we were up something like 9-3 at that point (final was 11-4 as I recall).

Calling a delay of game for delivering hats to the rink after a hat trick is un-American.

This was the headlining image for the no-fish warning on cornellbigred.com--not only is it a stupid graphic, it's OSU on the ice with Cornell.

billhoward
Calling a delay of game for delivering hats to the rink after a hat trick is un-American.

I always thought it was un-Canadian too. But in the spirit of the Olympics I think we should deem it uncivilized on the international level. Let's get a ruling from the UN before throwing hats! Fish on the otherhand are fair game, with or without the appropriate stamp on our license.

CSTV has picked up on this as well...

[www.cstv.com]

billhoward
Calling a delay of game for delivering hats to the rink after a hat trick is un-American.

I got thrown out of MSG for throwing a hat for a Dick Bertrand hat trick in Dec. '69. The hat didn't even hit the ice - Dick caught it on his way back to the bench. I tried to explain to the security guard that it was a hockey tradition. He said "maybe that's okay where you come from." I said "I come from New York." Later that season, they let Ranger fans throw all sorts of crap on the ice (and at Derek Sanderson) during their playoff series with the Bruins. Anyway, it was the 3rd period of the 2nd game of a doubleheader - I walked right back in a different exit and went back to my seat.

marty

billhoward
Calling a delay of game for delivering hats to the rink after a hat trick is un-American.

I always thought it was un-Canadian too. But in the spirit of the Olympics I think we should deem it uncivilized on the international level. Let's get a ruling from the UN before throwing hats! Fish on the otherhand are fair game, with or without the appropriate stamp on our license.

Canada is part of the Americas. Mexico, too, although I dont think they qualified for Torino.

Section A Banshee

438032.jpeg

This was the headlining image for the no-fish warning on cornellbigred.com--not only is it a stupid graphic, it's OSU on the ice with Cornell.

Eh. Two can play that game.

[www.cstv.com] With the stakes so high, Cornell is trying to minimize the risks taken in Saturday's game against the Crimson (5:30 p.m. ET, CSTV). A letter circulated by the Cornell ticket office warned that any delay of game due to the traditional throwing of fish at the Harvard players before the game will result in a five-minute major penalty to the Big Red, while any fan who is seen throwing a fish will be removed from Lynah Rink.


There is no provision in the rulebook for a major for delay of game. The ECACHL office declined to comment for this article, and league supervisor of officials Butch Bellemore could not be reached as of the publishing deadline. However, it is clear that the Big Red is taking every precaution to maximize the team's chances of winning a fifth straight Ivy title and tightening its grip on the ECACHL's top spot.

With the publicity this is getting, such as this CSTV story, what may have been a writer's way to fill a couple paragraphs in his column as deadline approached, now takes on a life of its own. And Cornell may be more inclined to act.

Alternatives to live fish...fish sticks....inflatable fish....plastic fish...how about returning to tradition and placing a live chicken on Sucks net

msphi81
Alternatives to live fish...fish sticks

No, no fish sticks. They aren't good for the ice.

Will

msphi81
Alternatives to live fish...fish sticks

No, no fish sticks. They aren't good for the ice.

Same with Swedish fish. Swedish fish to eat, okay. Swedish fish to toss, not okay.

msphi81
...how about returning to tradition and placing a live chicken on Sucks net

Sure, I happen to have one right here.

I've got no problem with the message of the graphic. It clearly means no fish should be thrown on the ice for games against OSU. Works for me.

If one really wants to embarrass J. Andrew and his idiot cronies, why not just bring some fish to toss on the mats at a wrestling match? However, since the smell would never leave his precious wrestling center, he might blow his next fund raising campaign on another one.

Tom Tone
If one really wants to embarrass J. Andrew and his idiot cronies, why not just bring some fish to toss on the mats at a wrestling match?

That would be fraking hilarious. When do we wrestle Harvard?

I overheard a little mole telling a little bird that at the coach's lunch Schafer said that after getting hit with all the chewing gum two weeks ago, he doesn't care how much fish is thrown tomorrow.

KeithK

Tom Tone
If one really wants to embarrass J. Andrew and his idiot cronies, why not just bring some fish to toss on the mats at a wrestling match?

That would be fraking hilarious. When do we wrestle Harvard?

That would actually be really disgusting. I wouldn't want to wrestle on a mat that just had fish tossed on it. The players don't roll around on the ice scantily clad.

You should read the Ithaca Journal article:

[www.ithacajournal.com]

Direct Quote: "After all, the fish-tossing delays the start of the game and provides a health hazard for the players of both teams."

Based on their attitude in the article, you'd think fans were throwing their own feces or urine.

Tonight (Friday) 7pm...same time as the Dartmouth game

CowbellGuy
I overheard a little mole telling a little bird that at the coach's lunch Schafer said that after getting hit with all the chewing gum two weeks ago, he doesn't care how much fish is thrown tomorrow.

Yee-ha! Let the flounder fly!

Kyle

KeithK

Tom Tone
If one really wants to embarrass J. Andrew and his idiot cronies, why not just bring some fish to toss on the mats at a wrestling match?

That would be fraking hilarious. When do we wrestle Harvard?

People, please. You do NOT want to get a five-minute major during a wrestling match

I'm going to bring Gene a little gift tomorrow night. Not sure what yet. Can of tuna, bag of gummi fish, whatever. If you know Gene or at least recognize him on sight, you should, too.

Go with the can!

This isn't a zero sum game. That the wrestling team does well and has a great facility (albeit still farther removed from campus than Lynah and Bartels) hasn't come at the expense of the hockey team.

Jacob '06
The players don't roll around on the ice scantily clad.

During the game.

billhoward
This isn't a zero sum game. That the wrestling team does well and has a great facility (albeit still farther removed from campus than Lynah and Bartels) hasn't come at the expense of the hockey team.

Personally, I'm thrilled that one of our other nationally-competitive teams got recognized enough by the AD to get their own well-deserved facility. When I was in town for the Clarkson/SLU weekend, I stopped into the wresting facility and had a look around. Very neat.

Now if only the AD could care enough about the far-flung Faithful to get on CSTV's case about the streaming situation. If the game doesn't look beautiful tonight, that means they didn't test it in the two weeks since the last debacle, which means I will be very pissed and they will hear from me come donation time.

Kyle

krose

billhoward
This isn't a zero sum game. That the wrestling team does well and has a great facility (albeit still farther removed from campus than Lynah and Bartels) hasn't come at the expense of the hockey team.

Personally, I'm thrilled that one of our other nationally-competitive teams got recognized enough by the AD to get their own well-deserved facility. When I was in town for the Clarkson/SLU weekend, I stopped into the wresting facility and had a look around. Very neat.


Kyle

Kyle,

i think you may be giving the AD far too much credit for the lovely wrasslin' facility. I heard this faciility's existence has far more to do with a concerned alum and his desire to see the wrestling program survive as opposed to getting axed to keep Cornell title IX compliant.

If this is only a rumor someone feel free to correct me.

Cheers,
WillR

PS: either way fish on the mat would be a laugh.

Jacob '06

KeithK

Tom Tone
If one really wants to embarrass J. Andrew and his idiot cronies, why not just bring some fish to toss on the mats at a wrestling match?

That would be freaking hilarious. When do we wrestle Harvard?

That would actually be really disgusting. I wouldn't want to wrestle on a mat that just had fish tossed on it. The players don't roll around on the ice scantily clad.

Point taken. How about a fish tightly wrapped in layers of cellophane, so it's clear what it is, without making a mess?

mha
I'm going to bring Gene a little gift tomorrow night. Not sure what yet. Can of tuna, bag of gummi fish, whatever. If you know Gene or at least recognize him on sight, you should, too.

canuck89
Go with the can!

Can you throw the can at his head? I'd love to see it I don't know if you want the tuna packed in water, or tuna packed in light oil...I mean, he is greasy enough as it is.
Is my hostility towards the guy a little too obvious?

Also, wasn't Andy a wrestler, too?

And, Kyle, they needed to hear from you two weeks ago about the problems two weeks ago. And they need to hear from you today about the problems last night. Waiting until "donation time" guarantees nothing gets fixed.

mha
Also, wasn't Andy a wrestler, too?

And, Kyle, they needed to hear from you two weeks ago about the problems two weeks ago. And they need to hear from you today about the problems last night. Waiting until "donation time" guarantees nothing gets fixed.

They did hear from me (both Cornell and CSTV), among many others. I'm not going to check up on them every day, but they are on notice.

Kyle

[letsgodu.blogspot.com]

Very good DU fan edit of the article.

Were the Lynah security better at removing the fish or did the CSTV people show just a few fish compared to what was thrown?

Anyone notice ejections for tossing the fish?

Did they collect a lot of stuffed animals or has this decreased, too?

At least one person in B was tossed. I have never seen an usher so angry in my life. Either the fish throwing was a surprise to Mr. Usher or the offender was also threatening to toss a beach ball between periods.

I think their entire plan to prevent the fish was based on scare tactics in the e-mail. That was by far the most lenient search of any Cornell-Harvard game I've attended. The just asked us to open our jackets. No pat downs, no search of bags.

That being said, it seemed to have worked, because there were more fish in previous years.

A figure of biblical proportions made loaves and fishes multiply. Gene has done the opposite. If not an entire testament, perhaps he deserves Faces in the Crowd?

I was in E... didn't see anyone get tossed at the normal fish throwing time, but one kid missed it, so he threw his trout at the end of the game (right before senior night) and was promptly ejected. Anyone know if the two octopi throwers were tossed?

Have to agree, the fish throwing was very lackluster compared to the last couple of years. I thought for sure that the students would throw even more because of the threats. They should make it a competition every year, who can get the most fish past the 5-0 and the ushers, who can get in the biggest fish, etc. The playoff programs should feature the winners. Call it the Lynah Faithful program.

Karlmoose
At least one person in B was tossed. I have never seen an usher so angry in my life. Either the fish throwing was a surprise to Mr. Usher or the offender was also threatening to toss a beach ball between periods.

What is up with the beach ball? Maybe I am the only one bothered by this, but I think beach balls should be reserved for their rightful place at bad outdoor music concerts (something like "Three Dog Night" at the State Fair).

ajec1

Karlmoose
At least one person in B was tossed. I have never seen an usher so angry in my life. Either the fish throwing was a surprise to Mr. Usher or the offender was also threatening to toss a beach ball between periods.

What is up with the beach ball? Maybe I am the only one bothered by this, but I think beach balls should be reserved for their rightful place at bad outdoor music concerts (something like "Three Dog Night" at the State Fair).

You're not the only one. Beach balls belong at Dodger games. I advise the accidental puncturing of each one that falls into your grasp.

ajec1

Karlmoose
At least one person in B was tossed. I have never seen an usher so angry in my life. Either the fish throwing was a surprise to Mr. Usher or the offender was also threatening to toss a beach ball between periods.

What is up with the beach ball? Maybe I am the only one bothered by this, but I think beach balls should be reserved for their rightful place at bad outdoor music concerts (something like "Three Dog Night" at the State Fair).

People who toss fish . . . should they be complaining about people who toss beach balls?

Hey, don't knock Three Dog Night. In an era of bubble gum rock, TDN was probably petty good by comparison. Better them than 1910 Fruit Gum Company or Tony Orlando.

Now if all the students held lighters while the team skated onto the ice, that'd be deja vu all over again except -- lord, let it not be so -- I don't think Lynah in its worst years ever did that.

ajec1

Karlmoose
At least one person in B was tossed. I have never seen an usher so angry in my life. Either the fish throwing was a surprise to Mr. Usher or the offender was also threatening to toss a beach ball between periods.

What is up with the beach ball? Maybe I am the only one bothered by this, but I think beach balls should be reserved for their rightful place at bad outdoor music concerts (something like "Three Dog Night" at the State Fair).

Hate to break it to you, but according to my father who has been going to Cornell hockey games since the 60's said that the beach ball in the student sections has been done since then and has only recently stopped in last few years. Not sure how anybody, specifically the ushers, could possibly be upset by their presence between periods.

As for the fish-tossing, the crackdown by athletics and the administration is an absolute disgrace as far as I'm concerned. It is a tradition that has not harmed anyone and that does not infringe upon the flow of the game (of course the incident in the early 90's that cost the team the game hurt a lot of people). Schafer himself defended the tradition last year by throwing his support to allowing fish to be thrown at the beginning of the game and at obviously no time after. It is ridiculous and embarrassing that the administration and athletics had to resort to lying to the students about the in-game consequences (five minute major) to try to get them to stop from continuing a non-harmful tradtion. Fact of the matter is, the gum at Colgate is a ton worse and nobody gets in trouble over there. And you won't believe it, but the game gets played there fine even with the delays caused by the constant gum throwing. I will go as far as to say that the administration and athletics should be ashamed of themselves for ever infringing upon this tradition that they have absolutely no justification in doing. It's time to stop treating the students like inmates. I'm not saying let them throw multiple beach balls or think about swearing, but fucking let them throw fish and observe tradition.

calgARI '07
It is ridiculous and embarrassing that the administration and athletics had to resort to lying to the students about the in-game consequences (five minute major) to try to get them to stop from continuing a non-harmful tradtion. Fact of the matter is, the gum at Colgate is a ton worse and nobody gets in trouble over there.

Please allow for the possibility that what seems to be dissembling is just plain old lack of accurate information. Or maybe he thought if the fish rips open and spills blood, then it's five minutes. Work with me here.

If you've got a helmet on, so long as you don't trip on either one while skating in warmups, wouldn't you rather get hit on the head with a pack of gum? And be thankful Colgate students are not into chewing tobacco. The stream can travel a long distance -- probably farther than the CSTV stream went Friday night.

calgARI '07
Hate to break it to you, but according to my father who has been going to Cornell hockey games since the 60's said that the beach ball in the student sections has been done since then and has only recently stopped in last few years. Not sure how anybody, specifically the ushers, could possibly be upset by their presence between periods.

I was upset by their presence on the ice. I have no problem with batting a ball around if you can keep it in the stands. Friday night, after the second beach ball went on the ice, I saw some obnoxious kid in O try five or six times before managing to deliberately knock a baloon over the glass and onto the ice. And then they gave it back to him.

billhoward

calgARI '07
It is ridiculous and embarrassing that the administration and athletics had to resort to lying to the students about the in-game consequences (five minute major) to try to get them to stop from continuing a non-harmful tradtion. Fact of the matter is, the gum at Colgate is a ton worse and nobody gets in trouble over there.

Please allow for the possibility that what seems to be dissembling is just plain old lack of accurate information. Or maybe he thought if the fish rips open and spills blood, then it's five minutes. Work with me here.

If you've got a helmet on, so long as you don't trip on either one while skating in warmups, wouldn't you rather get hit on the head with a pack of gum? And be thankful Colgate students are not into chewing tobacco. The stream can travel a long distance -- probably farther than the CSTV stream went Friday night.

Certainly those could be reasons for it and honestly it would make some amount of sense. However, the fact that Schafer endorsed the tradition (I wish I remember where, but it was after last year's game) makes me believe that the hockey concern is not the reason for the crackdown.

jtwcornell91

calgARI '07
Hate to break it to you, but according to my father who has been going to Cornell hockey games since the 60's said that the beach ball in the student sections has been done since then and has only recently stopped in last few years. Not sure how anybody, specifically the ushers, could possibly be upset by their presence between periods.

I was upset by their presence on the ice. I have no problem with batting a ball around if you can keep it in the stands. Friday night, after the second beach ball went on the ice, I saw some obnoxious kid in O try five or six times before managing to deliberately knock a baloon over the glass and onto the ice. And then they gave it back to him.

I'm honestly indifferent to the whole thing and couldn't care less about it. The part that bothers me most is how much the ushers get pissed about it. We always rip into the kids who idiotically hit the balls onto the ice, but it really doesn't seem to be that big of a deal when one hits the ice.

billhoward
Please allow for the possibility that what seems to be dissembling is just plain old lack of accurate information.

Please don't.

[elf.elynah.com]

WillR
i think you may be giving the AD far too much credit for the lovely wrasslin' facility. I heard this faciility's existence has far more to do with a concerned alum and his desire to see the wrestling program survive as opposed to getting axed to keep Cornell title IX compliant.

Andy's a wrestler. He's surrounded by wrestlers. They would cut football to comply with Title IX before they touched wrestling. In fact all the space the football field takes up could be put to better use as a new research building, couldn't it?

Athletic success doesn't have to be a zero sum game, Bill, but I'd happily trade every wrestling win to wipe the smirk of Noel's mug. He represents so much of what's wrong with athletics that I can't take any satisfaction out of the wrestling program's success. I can't even bring myself to go inside the new building.

I couldn't agree more. The balls/balloons are not tossed during play so ultimately no harm done, right? Furthermore, our ushers are the biggest assholes ever. I can't believe they actually support Cornell hockey yet somehow hate the fans.

canuck89
I couldn't agree more. The balls/balloons are not tossed during play so ultimately no harm done, right? Furthermore, our ushers are the biggest assholes ever. I can't believe they actually support Cornell hockey yet somehow hate the fans.

And by "biggest assholes ever" you mean, on Friday, telling me to duck under the railing at the top of B even though I didn't have a ticket so I could see the game and then letting me into Section O (where my seat was) even though I still didn't have the ticket.

Seriously, you guys villify them, but if you're nice to them, they will be nice to you.

Coach Schafer specifically commented that the packs of gum on the ice were a serious potential hazard during warmups at Colgate, so the players couldn't effectively get warmed up. He was furious that Colgate actually handed out the gum to students... then collected it off the ice, put it back in boxes, and handed it out again!

Your situation is the exception. I think most of the current students will agree that the current ushers are far from friendly.

canuck89
Your situation is the exception. I think most of the current students will agree that the current ushers are far from friendly.

I (current student) agree with Liz. It has been my experience that if you are nice to them and treat them with respect they will respond in kind.

Liz '05
Seriously, you guys villify them, but if you're nice to them, they will be nice to you.

Another big agreement from me. I had an usher come ask me to remove a sign from against the glass. I'm not sure if she was upset about the sign being on the glass or what it said, but I promptly did so, apologized, and she thanked me and left.

Granted, I would have preferred NOT to take the sign down, but I was happily surprised by how pleasant the interchange was. From all the complaining that's done on these boards, I would have expected to be kicked out with no chance for an explanation if there was ANY kind of problem.

redhair34

canuck89
Your situation is the exception. I think most of the current students will agree that the current ushers are far from friendly.

I (current student) agree with Liz. It has been my experience that if you are nice to them and treat them with respect they will respond in kind.

True. Talk to Earl right (A/B usher), he'll let you get away with most stuff.

Absolutely. Just smiling and saying hi rather than rushing past them with your head down and your ticket up makes a big difference. Before long, they know who you are, and don't even need to see the ticket.

Right on, Liz. Get there during warmups, say hi to them everynight, comment about the weather. Pretty soon, they'll smile when they see you coming and let you right into the section. Worked for me getting into my old student section with Sec. M tickets over the Yale/Brown weekend.

mha
Absolutely. Just smiling and saying hi rather than rushing past them with your head down and your ticket up makes a big difference. Before long, they know who you are, and don't even need to see the ticket.

For example, if you forget to get a 3rd playoff game ticket (in the event we need three games, which never happened in the last few years ), you can just get a ticket for another section and not even have to show the usher what your ticket says.

there is a time and place for all of this. I think at no point are fish or gum appropriate during a warm up or the game. However when the teams enter onto the ice, i say let the fish,gum, toothpaste fly. As long as you can clean it up and it won't hurt anyone (like no throwing old desk-tops and pistons and RPI), then there really is no harm or potential for harm. Also by winging stuff at the right time we don't effect the ability of the team to properly warm up

I would concur that it is sad that the administration feels the need to try to beat down a tradition and has to resort to lies such as the 5min major to accomplish this dubious goal. Would a pile of fish guts and a copy of the hockey rule at the door of the offending party be an overreaction?

One last thing are boxes of rogaine OK to throw for Harvard?