Cornell at St. Lawrence post-game thread (2/11/06)

Happy with a 1-point weekend? In the wake of Friday's bad showing against Clarkson and falling behind 3-0 Saturday at St. Lawrence, 1 point out of 4 ain't bad. And yet once we got it back to 3-3 it seemed as if we could have won.

As opposed to recalling the final scores, not many people will remember how sick David McKee was this weekend, if reports of the stomach flu were accurate. (I remember wondering Friday night when WHCU announcer Ted Baker repeatedly talked about McKee getting "yanked" that being down 2-0 wasn't really reason to yank a goaltender unless there was something else at play.)

So Cornell's PP looked good, or the results were good (3 of the 4 goals). And on the other hand penalties against us kept the impossible miracle, a 5-4 win, from happening.

From those who were there: Did we have more great breakaways and hit-the-post and coulda-woulda-shoulda chances than St. Lawrence, or that's just our announcer getting excited and needing a cold shower?

Well, we're still up by a point in the ECAC, 25-24-24 over Dartmouth and Colgate.

[edit add] The weekend is more proof that when the definition of MVP means "guy without whom we're hosed," then it's David McKee.

Ryan O'Byrne comes and goes from the lineup. Let's hope he mends by the time playoffs roll around. Better he's in uniform on D than an inspiration for Cornell to take up the slack when he's in civilian clothes.

And Chabot didn't do all that badly. If Troy Davenport hadn't decamped after one semester last year, I wonder if he would have gotten the start Friday night.

For what it's worth, this is the first time Cornell has successfully come back from a three-goal deficit (I know it was a tie, but that still beats a loss) since the first game of the 1999 ECAC playoffs at Princeton, also a 4-4 tie. Hopefully history won't repeat itself, as back then the Big Red proceeded to blow a three-goal lead of its own the following night, losing the series.

And once and for all, what the hey is it with the "stomach flu" and the North Country trip? Does the team have to look into bringing its own food up there now?

If, in September, you gave me Cornell alone in first place after 18 games, I'd have bought.

Onwards to Fish N Fowl.

Jason called it stomach flu but maybe that's just the flu and your stomach is one of the more visibly affected organs.

That would be something: The players getting warned not to toss on the ice.

well, most patients/people call a gastroenteritis the stomach flu. belly pain, +- diarrhea +- vomiting +- nausea. fatigue, muscle aches, feeling crappy... those last three happen in the real flu as well so hence the name.
Unlike Trotsky, I had higher hopes for the point total at this point in the season. but i will take up one point now

Trotsky
If, in September, you gave me Cornell alone in first place after 18 games, I'd have bought.

I s'pose I can't argue with that. Then again, if you had said in September that it would take Cornell 16 games to get there, I'm not sure anyone would have believed you.

Onwards to Fish N Fowl.

It's probably sacrilegious to even suggest this, but the Harvard game is only the second-most important one of the coming weekend. With Dartmouth a mere point behind the Big Red and currently holding the tiebreaker edge thanks to a head-to-head victory, Friday night's game is monstrously huge, in ECAC terms at least (haven't done the math, but it might be a bigger deal PWR-wise as well).

I think we just have to face the fact that this team is a lot different from last year's. We're just not going to have 19-game (or so) unbeaten streaks down the stretch. I can definitely see us losing First Place in the next two weekends. At this point all I'm hoping for is the ECAC tournament title (which we've played well enough to win). When this team plays its best, I like its chances against most any team we face after that in the NCAA.

billhoward
Happy with a 1-point weekend? In the wake of Friday's bad showing against Clarkson and falling behind 3-0 Saturday at St. Lawrence, 1 point out of 4 ain't bad. And yet once we got it back to 3-3 it seemed as if we could have won.

If you look at all the ECAC games this weekend, the home teams did amazingly well: nine wins, two ties, and no losses. In fact, all six home teams won their games on Friday night.

Of course, this does not excuse Cornell's poor/average play at key moments of the last two games. What is hard to stomach (pun intended) was that three SLU goals came at the beginning/end of periods. This is out of character for a Schafer-coached team.

Let's go red.

Really impressive comeback tonight. These guys could have easily packed it in after 3-0 on a Saturday night in Canton after last night's game. They really showed a lot playing through the very difficult circumstnaces surrounding the game. Cornell should have won and definitely would have if not for the most disgraceful officiating I've ever seen.

The officiating was that bad? I couldn't tell from the webcast, but the St. Lawrence announcers were worthless.

calgARI '07
They really showed a lot playing through the very difficult circumstnaces surrounding the game. Cornell should have won and definitely would have if not for the most disgraceful officiating I've ever seen.

Difficult circumstances as in McKee's health and O'Bryne's injury, or the officiating, or some other factor?

Do a little research on how Cornell scored its 4th goal before complaining about officiating. Go to the game recap which basically says that Cornell got away with a blatant hook / trip. Then go to USCHO.com and see how everyone that was at the game can't believe the call was not made which gave Cornell its 4th goal instead of being a man down.

An absolute travesty and horrendously blown call...

bothman
Do a little research on how Cornell scored its 4th goal before complaining about officiating. Go to the game recap which basically says that Cornell got away with a blatant hook / trip. Then go to USCHO.com and see how everyone that was at the game can't believe the call was not made which gave Cornell its 4th goal instead of being a man down.

An absolute travesty and horrendously blown call...

[violin] [/violin]

Yeah because I've never seen SLU fans complain about officiating over at USCHO

Blatant non calls went both ways last night

Totally agreed on the SLU fans, but my point was that the officiating went both ways, and given the way the 4th Cornell goal was directly impacted by a fairly blatant non-call, probably benefited Cornell more than SLU

billhoward
As opposed to recalling the final scores, not many people will remember how sick David McKee was this weekend, if reports of the stomach flu were accurate. (I remember wondering Friday night when WHCU announcer Ted Baker repeatedly talked about McKee getting "yanked" that being down 2-0 wasn't really reason to yank a goaltender unless there was something else at play.)

If it's true, geez. He's a trooper. Two years ago in Florida, the local papers were reporting that he was playing in the Everblades with pneumonia. And that was the year he pitched a shutout against Notre Dame.

Section A Banshee
And that was the year he pitched a shutout against Notre Dame.

With all due respect to McKee, I don't remember him facing too much pressure that game. Still, if he was sick, it was impressive for him to play. I think that was the year of the "forgive me Father, for I'm a sieve" line.

The way Cornell was clicking on the PP, I beg to differ. A few more chances could've made a difference in that game. SLU got more than enough calls in that game as evidenced by their 10 chances.

Now McKee, recovering from whatever he had, played out of this world. He had a few saves that were truly jaw dropping. I was at the opposite end of the ice, but he made a save in the second when he was flat on his chest and was able to knock it out of the air with his glove, reaching back. He kept Cornell in the game in the first and second, and helped them earn the point in the third.

All of that without three of our top D-men, Sasha was out, O'Byrne left early, and Glover was noticeably absent for the third. Especially noticeable when Bitz and Pegs played the point for a stretch during that period.

That is one heckuva team to come back on, because they can transition on you quickly. I'm impressed that they were able to earn that point, with the way that game started off.

Had cornell come out in the first period ready to play, they would have burried SLU!!! Second period through the end of ot big red looked best all year! Still would like to see players set up and ready to take the shot off the pass instead of receive pass, set, then shoot. whats wrong with one-timers and rebounds. go red!!

bothman
Do a little research on how Cornell scored its 4th goal before complaining about officiating. Go to the game recap which basically says that Cornell got away with a blatant hook / trip. Then go to USCHO.com and see how everyone that was at the game can't believe the call was not made which gave Cornell its 4th goal instead of being a man down.

An absolute travesty and horrendously blown call...

If reseach entails me being at the game and watching then I guess I'm alright in regards to the research that you want me to do. I thought the officiating was terrible both ways. However, SLU benefitting a lot more from it than Cornell. Pegoraro was taken down on a 2-on-1 shorthanded and then Cornell gets away with a handpass that isnt called and SLU goes the other way and scores. TWO plays in the same sequence that definitely should have been blown down and they are not. Cornell can't change and SLU scores. Then Seminoff gets called for charging on maybe the worst call of the season mainly because Cornell had just tied up the game and was dominating. Abbott goes in on a breakaway shorthanded getting hooked at the entire time and because he doesn't take a fall or dive and gets his shot, there is no call. O, and a SLU player gets beaten to the puck in overtime, he falls down and they get the call IN OVERTIME. That's fair. That makes sense. In general, there was a ton of interference not called both ways and it was an absolute embarrassment. Why don't you try doing some research buddy.

bothman
Do a little research on how Cornell scored its 4th goal before complaining about officiating. Go to the game recap which basically says that Cornell got away with a blatant hook / trip. Then go to USCHO.com and see how everyone that was at the game can't believe the call was not made which gave Cornell its 4th goal instead of being a man down.

An absolute travesty and horrendously blown call...

What, you mean like how Harvard scored the only goal in the game at Bright last January?

billhoward

calgARI '07
They really showed a lot playing through the very difficult circumstnaces surrounding the game. Cornell should have won and definitely would have if not for the most disgraceful officiating I've ever seen.

Difficult circumstances as in McKee's health and O'Bryne's injury, or the officiating, or some other factor?

All of the above plus a few other players playing with injuries and the fact that they were down 3-0 on the road on a Saturday night during just an awful weekend.

Hats off to Dave McKee great goaltending kept us in the game.

After witnessing the game first hand I will say that Ari is absolutely right regarding the officiating. The biggest no-call of the year was when Pegoraro was taken down on that 2 on 1. I couldn't believe my eyes when I looked at Kotyra and didn't see his arm go up.

I couldn't agree more. I think getting through the ECAC's is going to be a big challenge... But for NCAA, based on the way we seem to play to the level of competition, I like our chances as well.

[Q][Q]Quote:
bothman
Do a little research on how Cornell scored its 4th goal before complaining about officiating. Go to the game recap which basically says that Cornell got away with a blatant hook / trip. Then go to USCHO.com and see how everyone that was at the game can't believe the call was not made which gave Cornell its 4th goal instead of being a man down.
An absolute travesty and horrendously blown call...[/Q]

If reseach entails me being at the game and watching then I guess I'm alright in regards to the research that you want me to do. I thought the officiating was terrible both ways. However, SLU benefitting a lot more from it than Cornell. Pegoraro was taken down on a 2-on-1 shorthanded and then Cornell gets away with a handpass that isnt called and SLU goes the other way and scores. TWO plays in the same sequence that definitely should have been blown down and they are not. Cornell can't change and SLU scores. Then Seminoff gets called for charging on maybe the worst call of the season mainly because Cornell had just tied up the game and was dominating. Abbott goes in on a breakaway shorthanded getting hooked at the entire time and because he doesn't take a fall or dive and gets his shot, there is no call. O, and a SLU player gets beaten to the puck in overtime, he falls down and they get the call IN OVERTIME. That's fair. That makes sense. In general, there was a ton of interference not called both ways and it was an absolute embarrassment. Why don't you try doing some research buddy.[/Q]

Bothman, you just got housed.

do you think the opposition's play had anything to do with the "awful weekend." I haven't seen any mention of that here.

Rich S
do you think the opposition's play had anything to do with the "awful weekend." I haven't seen any mention of that here.

no.

Yeah accepting the fact that our goalie was recovering from the flu and we were short a couple D-men for most of the weekend will suffice.

Plus you forget this team knows how to make their competition look good

Rich S
do you think the opposition's play had anything to do with the "awful weekend." I haven't seen any mention of that here.

I think you raise an important point. No question that Clarkson and SLU were playing at the top of their games - well SLU was for the first half of the game while they were dominating. It's funny how in all sports, the fans of the team that loses usually say they played terribly and the fans of the team that wins says they played great. Last weekend when Colgate was awful on Friday night and Cornell dominated while both teams played at the top of their games (although Cornell was without their top two defensemen) on Saturday night. This weekend, Cornell was beat up but even so, they didn't consistently play at the top of their game while Clarkson was playing extremely well and SLU was as well in the first half. In the second half against SLU, Cornell played really really well while SLU was average.

Jason L

Rich S
do you think the opposition's play had anything to do with the "awful weekend." I haven't seen any mention of that here.

no.

Rich was asking for it.

Rich S
do you think the opposition's play had anything to do with the "awful weekend." I haven't seen any mention of that here.

Actually, Cornell only got one point because you posted on eLynah all week. Way to go!

CM cWo 44
Bothman, you just got housed.

Hosed?

or housed.....

Despite the frustrating quick goals by SLU(t), definitely an uplifting night compared to Friday. We were inconsistent in the 1st, but much better in the 2nd and 3rd. We were able to make break-after-break out of our defensive zone in the 3rd and in OT, leading to many good chances and the 4th goal. The no-call on the 2 on 1 takedown that eventually led to the 2nd SLU(t) goal was very frustrating and a key, but I don't know if I would agree that the overall officiating cost us the game. McKee looked very quick and kept us in the game numerous times. I was sitting almost directly behind him during the 2nd. I don't know his normal routine, but he was drinking during almost every stoppage. His face looked like he was catching a breath and collecting himself almost every time as well. If he felt like he looked, I am amazed he could play as well as he did.

Hopefully this weekend was just an unlucky hic-cup. A couple sitting behind me, who had hosted McKee's parents over the weekend, told me the whole team had the flu going through them over the week. They told me David had not practiced all week. Let's hope this has run its course and the team is back to last week's form for next week. I hope this is the reason the Clarkson forwards were able to skate around our defensemen Friday. That is certainly not something I am used to seeing any team do against us.

O'Byrne looked pretty sore when he went down, but skated off without much help. Any news on his status? Also, any news on Pokoluk?

Here's to their return and a great upcoming weekend! LGR!!!

Here's another one that always drives me batty. When Seminoff got called on the trip when diving for, and getting, the puck on that partial breakaway in the third I felt like strangling someone. The rule reads:

[q]If, in the opinion of a referee, a player on a sweep or hook-check is
unquestionably playing the puck and obtains possession of it, thereby
tripping the puck carrier, a penalty shall not be assessed unless the trip-
ping is flagrant.[/q]

In English, and the way it's always called in the NHL, is if you make a play on the puck and get a piece of it before the opposing player, it's not a penalty. Seminoff got the puck. It shouldn't have been a penalty.

CowbellGuy
Here's another one that always drives me batty. When Seminoff got called on the trip when diving for, and getting, the puck on that partial breakaway in the third I felt like strangling someone. The rule reads:

[q]If, in the opinion of a referee, a player on a sweep or hook-check is
unquestionably playing the puck and obtains possession of it, thereby
tripping the puck carrier, a penalty shall not be assessed unless the trip-
ping is flagrant.[/q]

In English, and the way it's always called in the NHL, is if you make a play on the puck and get a piece of it before the opposing player, it's not a penalty. Seminoff got the puck. It shouldn't have been a penalty.

I forgot all about that ridiculous call. It is truly amazing how often that call is screwed up in college. On the play, Seminoff blatantly got the puck before the player fell. I didn't even think the player was tripped; he just fell after the puck was swept away.

calgARI '07

CowbellGuy
Here's another one that always drives me batty. When Seminoff got called on the trip when diving for, and getting, the puck on that partial breakaway in the third I felt like strangling someone. The rule reads:

[q]If, in the opinion of a referee, a player on a sweep or hook-check is
unquestionably playing the puck and obtains possession of it, thereby
tripping the puck carrier, a penalty shall not be assessed unless the trip-
ping is flagrant.[/q]

In English, and the way it's always called in the NHL, is if you make a play on the puck and get a piece of it before the opposing player, it's not a penalty. Seminoff got the puck. It shouldn't have been a penalty.

I forgot all about that ridiculous call. It is truly amazing how often that call is screwed up in college. On the play, Seminoff blatantly got the puck before the player fell. I didn't even think the player was tripped; he just fell after the puck was swept away.

wasn't this the same interpretation problem that led to the penalty shot a week or two ago?

WillR

calgARI '07

CowbellGuy
Here's another one that always drives me batty. When Seminoff got called on the trip when diving for, and getting, the puck on that partial breakaway in the third I felt like strangling someone. The rule reads:

[q]If, in the opinion of a referee, a player on a sweep or hook-check is
unquestionably playing the puck and obtains possession of it, thereby
tripping the puck carrier, a penalty shall not be assessed unless the trip-
ping is flagrant.[/q]

In English, and the way it's always called in the NHL, is if you make a play on the puck and get a piece of it before the opposing player, it's not a penalty. Seminoff got the puck. It shouldn't have been a penalty.

I forgot all about that ridiculous call. It is truly amazing how often that call is screwed up in college. On the play, Seminoff blatantly got the puck before the player fell. I didn't even think the player was tripped; he just fell after the puck was swept away.

wasn't this the same interpretation problem that led to the penalty shot a week or two ago?

Although I don't remember that exact play off the top of my head, I remember thinking at the time it was a good call. Pokuluk was definitively behind the player and took him down from behind. That player was definitely in the clear too. Seminoff was close to the SLU player - close enough where he could go for the defensive play (sweeping) and he made it.

calgARI '07

CowbellGuy
Here's another one that always drives me batty. When Seminoff got called on the trip when diving for, and getting, the puck on that partial breakaway in the third I felt like strangling someone. The rule reads:

[q]If, in the opinion of a referee, a player on a sweep or hook-check is
unquestionably playing the puck and obtains possession of it, thereby
tripping the puck carrier, a penalty shall not be assessed unless the trip-
ping is flagrant.[/q]

In English, and the way it's always called in the NHL, is if you make a play on the puck and get a piece of it before the opposing player, it's not a penalty. Seminoff got the puck. It shouldn't have been a penalty.

I forgot all about that ridiculous call. It is truly amazing how often that call is screwed up in college. On the play, Seminoff blatantly got the puck before the player fell. I didn't even think the player was tripped; he just fell after the puck was swept away.

The call isn't screwed up in college, it's simply a different rule in the NCAA than it is in the NHL. The interpretations section of the NCAA rule book specifically covers this situation.

"SECTION 58. Tripping
A.R.: Player A1, on a two-on-one, has the puck. Player B1 slides on the ice,
knocking the puck away from A1, but in the process, tripping A1. RULING:
Minor for tripping must be called. Tripping must be called anytime it
occurs, regardless of whether or not contact is made with the puck."

Dart~Ben

calgARI '07

CowbellGuy
Here's another one that always drives me batty. When Seminoff got called on the trip when diving for, and getting, the puck on that partial breakaway in the third I felt like strangling someone. The rule reads:

[q]If, in the opinion of a referee, a player on a sweep or hook-check is
unquestionably playing the puck and obtains possession of it, thereby
tripping the puck carrier, a penalty shall not be assessed unless the trip-
ping is flagrant.[/q]

In English, and the way it's always called in the NHL, is if you make a play on the puck and get a piece of it before the opposing player, it's not a penalty. Seminoff got the puck. It shouldn't have been a penalty.

I forgot all about that ridiculous call. It is truly amazing how often that call is screwed up in college. On the play, Seminoff blatantly got the puck before the player fell. I didn't even think the player was tripped; he just fell after the puck was swept away.

The call isn't screwed up in college, it's simply a different rule in the NCAA than it is in the NHL. The interpretations section of the NCAA rule book specifically covers this situation.

"SECTION 58. Tripping
A.R.: Player A1, on a two-on-one, has the puck. Player B1 slides on the ice,
knocking the puck away from A1, but in the process, tripping A1. RULING:
Minor for tripping must be called. Tripping must be called anytime it
occurs, regardless of whether or not contact is made with the puck."

Guess I stand corrected but I could have sworn the rule was the same in college as it is in the NHL.

Besides, it was on Seminoff. He gets called for everything imaginable. I think by now, the refs just look to dump penalties on him.

Speaking of rules, do they always ban Cornell from shouting "red" during the anthem at Appleton? They even went so far as to say if anyone shouted "red" the band could be removed from the rink, even if they weren't with the band.

Yet once again a drum was allowed to be played during play

The traveling faithful didn't need props anyway, as much fan as thundersticks are.

Don't the Clarkson fans yell "Knight"? And did the Cornell fans yell anyway?

Yes, it's a house rule at Appleton. They ban the Clarkson band from yelling Knights during the anthem, but if the fans yell (a group walked into the arena right after the announcement and yelled this year) they don't kick people out. Honestly, it's always seemed like an empty threat to me, but as a part of the band, I don't tempt fate. If I didn't have a sousaphone on my back, though, I'd have screamed anyway. They didn't kick out the group that yelled this year, they won't next year, or most likely ever.

See above, ugarte

My quote WAS from the NCAA rulebook, not NHL. If that's the case, then the rulebook completely contradicts itself. Wouldn't be the first time.

CowbellGuy
My quote WAS from the NCAA rulebook, not NHL. If that's the case, then the rulebook completely contradicts itself. Wouldn't be the first time.

It isn't contradictory if referees, in practice, distinguish between "obtains possession of the puck" and "knocking the puck away."

Out of respect for the band, the conductor asked if we didn't mind keeping quiet just in case, most people did a silent fist pump

Maybe that's why the team came out flat again, I sure felt wierd afterwards. Once the drunk SLU girl jumped into our section screaming, "Go Saaaaints, Cornell is losers!" the feeling passed and our little section did just fine in the cheering department.

Drifting slightly, I could never understand why Union yells U during the anthem and doesn't yell U C (you see) for Onion College.

the penalty shot was the correct call, no question. any ref could have made that call... even the greenest of green

marty
Drifting slightly, I could never understand why Union yells U during the anthem and doesn't yell U C (you see) for Onion College.

You know, that's a great point. I never thought of that.

jmh30

marty
Drifting slightly, I could never understand why Union yells U during the anthem and doesn't yell U C (you see) for Onion College.

You know, that's a great point. I never thought of that.

They yelled UC when I was there last year (January 2005).

marty
Drifting slightly, I could never understand why Union yells U during the anthem and doesn't yell U C (you see) for Onion College.

I've heard it both ways. More people do just the "U," so that's what comes across more.

Section A Banshee

jmh30

marty
Drifting slightly, I could never understand why Union yells U during the anthem and doesn't yell U C (you see) for Onion College.

You know, that's a great point. I never thought of that.

They yelled UC when I was there last year (January 2005).

Seems like a reasonable defense against the "you SUCK!" that it usually degenerates into.

daredevilcu
Yes, it's a house rule at Appleton. They ban the Clarkson band from yelling Knights during the anthem ...

Whoops. I was confusing Appleton and Cheel. Doesn't seem as hypocritical now.

I was at the top of the steps entering the arena as the anthem was played and had not heard any announcement. I waited to hear if anyone yelled "Red", but was suprised to not hear it at all. Now I know why. I used to enthusiastically yell this, but I have backed off recently. I think it is a cool idea, but at the same time I think it takes away some of the respect deserved of the national anthem. I feel that the anthem signifies our allegiance to our nation, and therefore is obviously far and above any athletic allegiances any of us may have.

jtwcornell91

Section A Banshee

jmh30

marty
Drifting slightly, I could never understand why Union yells U during the anthem and doesn't yell U C (you see) for Onion College.

You know, that's a great point. I never thought of that.

They yelled UC when I was there last year (January 2005).

Seems like a reasonable defense against the "you SUCK!" that it usually degenerates into.

I would think that it just forces people to wait a beat and change it to "sucks."

Not that I condone that sort of thing during the anthem. (Officially.)

cth95
I was at the top of the steps entering the arena as the anthem was played and had not heard any announcement. I waited to hear if anyone yelled "Red", but was suprised to not hear it at all. Now I know why. I used to enthusiastically yell this, but I have backed off recently. I think it is a cool idea, but at the same time I think it takes away some of the respect deserved of the national anthem. I feel that the anthem signifies our allegiance to our nation, and therefore is obviously far and above any athletic allegiances any of us may have.

Pththtp.

Not that you aren't entitled to your own opinion. (Officially.)

oceanst41
Speaking of rules, do they always ban Cornell from shouting "red" during the anthem at Appleton? They even went so far as to say if anyone shouted "red" the band could be removed from the rink, even if they weren't with the band.

Typical Appleton horseshit. Yes, they're within their rights to tell you what to do, but for that matter, they're entitled to ban cheering for the visiting team, but it doesn't make it right.

I know. I am not trying to be a spoilsport. I yell everything else as loud as anyone, and occasionally start cheers at the away games I get to. I want to like the "Red" cheer and used to, and I certainly don't hold anything against anyone else. I just struggle with that one because I feel the national anthem deserves quiet and respect until it finishes with the usual cheering. I do think the cheer sounds best in Albany when so many people do it.

jtwcornell91

oceanst41
Speaking of rules, do they always ban Cornell from shouting "red" during the anthem at Appleton? They even went so far as to say if anyone shouted "red" the band could be removed from the rink, even if they weren't with the band.

Typical Appleton horseshit. Yes, they're within their rights to tell you what to do, but for that matter, they're entitled to ban cheering for the visiting team, but it doesn't make it right.

Well I wouldn't say they banned Cornell cheering, but they heavily restricted it. We were told that we were not allowed to yell T after the S-L-U or the band would be kicked out. I'm pretty sure someone got yelled at for doing the St. Lawrence sucks cheer too. That said, one of my buddy's was yelling Madilldo and SLUT as much as he possibly he could and he didn't get yelled at.

[Q]Well I wouldn't say they banned Cornell cheering, but they heavily restricted it. We were told that we were not allowed to yell T after the S-L-U or the band would be kicked out. I'm pretty sure someone got yelled at for doing the St. Lawrence sucks cheer too. That said, one of my buddy's was yelling Madilldo and SLUT as much as he possibly he could and he didn't get yelled at.[/Q]

Wow, that's just stupid. I hope you yelled all those things anyway, because they don't even try to limit Clarkson fans that harshly. I've never heard of anyone being asked not to yell "T" or "suck" at those games. I really, really hate that arena... FAR more than Lynah.

My friend (who is not a Cornellian but is rapidly becoming a fan) and I loudly added the "T" from our section at the end of the rink. There were many older alumni in our section, and it was a little quiet at first, but as the team started to rally we got a lot more participation. Our section also got much better with simple "Let's Go Red" and "Sieve" cheers as the game went on. I did have to explain to the lady next to me why we were yelling "T".

CowbellGuy
My quote WAS from the NCAA rulebook, not NHL. If that's the case, then the rulebook completely contradicts itself. Wouldn't be the first time.

Can I ask what section you got your quote from? I read both the actual tripping rule and the associated interpretation regarding "the diving sweep check" in back, and didn't see anything like what you quoted.

cth95
My friend (who is not a Cornellian but is rapidly becoming a fan) and I loudly added the "T" from our section at the end of the rink. There were many older alumni in our section, and it was a little quiet at first, but as the team started to rally we got a lot more participation. Our section also got much better with simple "Let's Go Red" and "Sieve" cheers as the game went on. I did have to explain to the lady next to me why we were yelling "T".

I joined in.

Dart~Ben

CowbellGuy
My quote WAS from the NCAA rulebook, not NHL. If that's the case, then the rulebook completely contradicts itself. Wouldn't be the first time.

Can I ask what section you got your quote from? I read both the actual tripping rule and the associated interpretation regarding "the diving sweep check" in back, and didn't see anything like what you quoted.

They "changed" that rule in 2004, deleting the "unquestionably hook-checking" paragraph and replace it with a directive to see the interpretation already cited. USA Hockey still has the "unquestionably hook-checking" paragraph and has always had the interpretation that the situation described (player leaves his feet, trips opponent) is an infraction.

pat

Dart~Ben

CowbellGuy
My quote WAS from the NCAA rulebook, not NHL. If that's the case, then the rulebook completely contradicts itself. Wouldn't be the first time.

Can I ask what section you got your quote from? I read both the actual tripping rule and the associated interpretation regarding "the diving sweep check" in back, and didn't see anything like what you quoted.

They "changed" that rule in 2004, deleting the "unquestionably hook-checking" paragraph and replace it with a directive to see the interpretation already cited. USA Hockey still has the "unquestionably hook-checking" paragraph and has always had the interpretation that the situation described (player leaves his feet, trips opponent) is an infraction.

Sorry, but can you rephrase your response. Which rule used to be, and which is current?

cth95
My friend (who is not a Cornellian but is rapidly becoming a fan) and I loudly added the "T" from our section at the end of the rink. There were many older alumni in our section, and it was a little quiet at first, but as the team started to rally we got a lot more participation. Our section also got much better with simple "Let's Go Red" and "Sieve" cheers as the game went on. I did have to explain to the lady next to me why we were yelling "T".

Apropos of explaining to the impaired, former Miss America - turned - conservative (before flipping the other way) Anita Bryant did a Playboy interview ... her husband sat in ... a reference was made to the digits 6 and 9 ... her (shortly thereafter ex-) husband made a crack about it being beyond her ... and the Playboy interviewer had to illustrate with pencil and paper the significance of the numerals. There was a glimmer of recognition followed by an audible gasp, he wrote.

Bill, that's the kind of stuff people should PM you to hear.

Jim Hyla

cth95
My friend (who is not a Cornellian but is rapidly becoming a fan) and I loudly added the "T" from our section at the end of the rink. There were many older alumni in our section, and it was a little quiet at first, but as the team started to rally we got a lot more participation. Our section also got much better with simple "Let's Go Red" and "Sieve" cheers as the game went on. I did have to explain to the lady next to me why we were yelling "T".

I joined in.

Wow, not even gun shy after the gestapo in Minnesota takes you to the limit. Kudos.

MADILLLLLLLLLLLLLL-DO!!!!!!!!!!!

cth95
I feel the national anthem deserves quiet and respect until it finishes with the usual cheering.

I on the other hand was taught not to applaud the national anthem.

The last time I was there I just shouted "can" and confused some Union fans enough that they missed the UC. If you're going to shout something, I'd encourage shouting can instead of sucks.

Having gone to Union i would venture that yelling U makes more sense. Lets go U is kind of the same as LGR. That said when i was there in '95 i don't recall the shout out as part of the national anthem so i could be wrong. Though if they/we do then i am all in favor of it even if it doesn't hold a candle to the RED part of the national anthem.

-WillR

jtwcornell91
I on the other hand was taught not to applaud the national anthem.

Same here. Clapping at the end of the anthem always makes me think the crowd is saying, "thank Christ it's over -- drop the puck."

oceanst41
Out of respect for the band, the conductor asked if we didn't mind keeping quiet just in case, most people did a silent fist pump

And thanks for helping out. The same demand was made of the band at Brown this year, except the band got bitched out when other people in the crowd (who we clearly weren't affiliated with) still yelled Red. You guys helped avoid a situation.

calgARI '07
Well I wouldn't say they banned Cornell cheering, but they heavily restricted it. We were told that we were not allowed to yell T after the S-L-U or the band would be kicked out.

Ah, I had wondered why we switched to R and then Tau.

KP '06

calgARI '07
Well I wouldn't say they banned Cornell cheering, but they heavily restricted it. We were told that we were not allowed to yell T after the S-L-U or the band would be kicked out.

Ah, I had wondered why we switched to R and then Tau.

Tau. Hehe. Well done

Jim Hyla
Sorry, but can you rephrase your response. Which rule used to be, and which is current?

For the 2003-04 rulebook, they deleted the paragraph which begins, "If, in the opinion of the referee, a player on a sweep or hook-check is unquestionably playing the puck and obtains possession of it..." and added the interpretation which says, "Minor for tripping must be called." This is described in the rule changes with "Interpretation for diving sweep check added."

As ugarte said, even before this change, the standard for "playing the puck and obtain[ing] possession of it" was high.

Guess that's what I get for relying on the NCAA's site. My search only found the 2003 rulebook. I couldn't find anything newer so I figured it was current. Thanks for the clarifications. I stand corrected. Still doesn't mean the game was well-officiated.

KP '06

calgARI '07
Well I wouldn't say they banned Cornell cheering, but they heavily restricted it. We were told that we were not allowed to yell T after the S-L-U or the band would be kicked out.

Ah, I had wondered why we switched to R and then Tau.

M and G were also suggested in the online chat during the game.

jmh30

KP '06

calgARI '07
Well I wouldn't say they banned Cornell cheering, but they heavily restricted it. We were told that we were not allowed to yell T after the S-L-U or the band would be kicked out.

Ah, I had wondered why we switched to R and then Tau.

M and G were also suggested in the online chat during the game.

Doesn't Southard have a story about this?

BTW, for those listening to the SLU webcast, was it Wally Johnson and that other guy? They are usually pretty horrible, and all the more embarrassing since they're professionals and not just students. Completely different from Bob Ahlfeld at Clarkson, who always struck me as a class act on the level of Grady.

jtwcornell91
Doesn't Southard have a story about this?

Probably, but my Swiss-cheese-like mind is imitating a subpoenaed president's right now. I'm pretty sure we went through the alphabet on occasion, my favorite being "SLU(B)" just for the idiocy of it. The key, of course, is to just keep doing whatever you normally but in a more creative fashion--never let them stop you.

For example, they didn't tell you that you couldn't *spell* "RED," as in "broad stripes and bright staRs," "gallantly strEEming," and the "lanD...(fr)ee" (as in "dieeeeeeeeee". And there's always the loophole of everybody *singing* "RED" very loudly rather than actually screaming it. What, are they going to tell you not to sing the national anthem?

My stories from SLU usually revolve around their awful organist and those ushers. Oh, the sweaters...

Scersk '97
For example, they didn't tell you that you couldn't *spell* "RED," as in "broad stripes and bright staRs," "gallantly strEEming," and the "lanD...(fr)ee" (as in "dieeeeeeeeee". And there's always the loophole of everybody *singing* "RED" very loudly rather than actually screaming it. What, are they going to tell you not to sing the national anthem?

I like the sing loudly. I'm going to try it, what does everyone think?

Jim Hyla

Scersk '97
For example, they didn't tell you that you couldn't *spell* "RED," as in "broad stripes and bright staRs," "gallantly strEEming," and the "lanD...(fr)ee" (as in "dieeeeeeeeee". And there's always the loophole of everybody *singing* "RED" very loudly rather than actually screaming it. What, are they going to tell you not to sing the national anthem?

I like the sing loudly. I'm going to try it, what does everyone think?

My response whenever an uppity, holier-than-thou, aging fan of the opponent comes over to preach about how disrespectful we are to the anthem and those that died for this great land is to point out that we know the words and are singing them all, quite proudly. I simultaneously point out that there are members of the opposing student section doing such respectful activities as slouching, keeping their hats on backwards, chomping gum, chatting with their buddy, etc. during the anthem. At least we know the words.

Scersk '97
Probably, but my Swiss-cheese-like mind is imitating a subpoenaed president's right now. I'm pretty sure we went through the alphabet on occasion, my favorite being "SLU(B)" just for the idiocy of it.

I'll say it again. Slux should be a word.

[q]The key, of course, is to just keep doing whatever you normally but in a more creative fashion--never let them stop you.[/q]

Echo that. The real genius of the Faithful is staying one step ahead. There are several other passionate, smart, and clever fan bases, but when it comes to blows, Lynah's crowd can anticipate and counterpunch like no other.

SLUsers: "Long ride home! Long ride home!"

Band: "You have to stay! You have to stay!"

SLUsers: "Long ride home! Long ride home!"

Band: "We'll be drunk! We'll be drunk!"

Baiting the Cornell pep band appears to be a losing proposition for anyone attempting. The band's record against verbal challengers seems even more impressive than Cornell's unbeaten string on ice second semester last year.

Paraphrasing Oscar Wilde:
"I challenge you to a duel. Choose your weapon."
"I choose words, sir. You're dead."

Now wait a second,

At Colgate, being drunk (the 'Gate fans) was bad.

But at Slu, being drunk (your band) was good?

Interesting.

Rich S
At Colgate, being drunk (the 'Gate fans) was bad.

But at Slu, being drunk (your band) was good?

Being drunk during the game is not the same as being drunk after the game.

One of my favorite back-n-forths happened at Lynah with Colgate.

Faithful: "Safety School...Safty School..."
'pasteful: "Suicide School...Suicide School..."
Faithful: "Nursery School...Nursery School..."
'pasteful: "NERDS! NERDS! NERDS! NERDS!"
Faithful: "Mooooooorons....Mooooooorons..."

Each one happened right after the other, and each time, more and more chuckles happened around the stands. I bet section H looked like they were watching a tennis match.

Rich S
Now wait a second,

At Colgate, being drunk (the 'Gate fans) was bad.

But at Slu, being drunk (your band) was good?

Interesting.

It is the difference between being drunk before the game and getting drunk after the game.

Good point by you both.

However, it begs the question, where do cornell fans that I've seen drunk at Lynah during a game fit in?

Rich S
However, it begs the question, where do cornell fans that I've seen drunk at Lynah during a game fit in?

At Lynah. Where they are embraced and respected for being able to hold their liquor.

Rich S
Good point by you both.

However, it begs the question, where do cornell fans that I've seen drunk at Lynah during a game fit in?

They're idiots. Who seem especially likely to make an appearance at this Saturday's game.

I cannot begin to fathom why anyone would want to be drunk during a college hockey game. You're there to watch the damn game! Go party afterwards.

Hence the reason I don't make stops at Club 99 before Clarkson home games. I don't think I've ever been drunk for a Knights home game. I've only been drunk for one away game, and I didn't like it, I couldn't concentrate on the game or anything. Probably never doing that again.

I thought the response to Clarkson's "empty net" point and chant was great.

The Pep Band countered by pointing and chanting "ice..ice...ice" and "lights...lights...lights" over and over to let Clarkson's band know that they were impressed they knew what an empty net looked like. I wonder if Clarkson handed their band treats after the game

now that's an easily impressed band.

I didn't see anyone respecting the drunken slobs who paraded around the Clarkson Pep Band and harrassed visiting Clarkson fans at Lynah a few years ago.

They didn't appear to be holding their liquor well and no one seemed in a hurry to "embrace" them.

Seems fair to say that every venue has at least a few "fans" of this type. And I agree, you're there to watch the game, supposedly. Stay home if you want to get drunk and annoy someone (yourself).

daredevilcu
Hence the reason I don't make stops at Club 99 before Clarkson home games.

I've been there before a game once or maybe twice. RichH and I agreed that it was a nice place to kill an hour or two before a game.