Polls 1/12

[www.uscho.com]

We move up to #5 with two first-place votes, and we now have 4 ECAC teams ranked nationally, with Yale cracking the list at #19, Princeton sliding to #10, and Dartmouth falling to #18.

And for those of you who care, we're up to #3 in the oh-so-crucial INCH Power Rankings:
[insidecollegehockey.com]

The date is 1/12!

If I read the poll correctly, the IVY League has as many teams (4) in the top 20 as the Big 10!

finchphil
If I read the poll correctly, the IVY League has as many teams (4) in the top 20 as the Big 10!

If there was a Big 10 in hockey, I would agree.

Flyers1037

finchphil
If I read the poll correctly, the IVY League has as many teams (4) in the top 20 as the Big 10!

If there was a Big 10 in hockey, I would agree.

Yes, but same can be said for the Ivy League. I think that's the point.

BCrespi

Flyers1037

finchphil
If I read the poll correctly, the IVY League has as many teams (4) in the top 20 as the Big 10!

If there was a Big 10 in hockey, I would agree.

Yes, but same can be said for the Ivy League. I think that's the point.

Point taken, but at least the Ivy League schools all play in the same conference and crown a winner at the end of the season.

Flyers1037
crown a winner at the end of the season.

To the sublime sound of crickets. They simply haven't yet formalized the fact that no one cares.

Apropos of nothing, Pairwise rankings are up, and we're in second, behind (sucks to) BU. I know it's WAY too early to get excited about such things, but it's still nice.

Incidentally, although they're calculating record against TUC's, they're not awarding the point towards comparison for it. This strikes me as weird (especially as it flips our comparison with BU.

Anyone have any insight?

EDIT: Just remembered both teams have to have played 10 TUCs... never mind. :S

ganderson
Apropos of nothing, Pairwise rankings are up, and we're in second, behind (sucks to) BU. I know it's WAY too early to get excited about such things, but it's still nice.

Incidentally, although they're calculating record against TUC's, they're not awarding the point towards comparison for it. This strikes me as weird (especially as it flips our comparison with BU.

Anyone have any insight?

TUC only counts when both teams being compared have played 10 TUC games.

ganderson
Apropos of nothing, Pairwise rankings are up, and we're in second, behind (sucks to) BU. I know it's WAY too early to get excited about such things, but it's still nice.

Incidentally, although they're calculating record against TUC's, they're not awarding the point towards comparison for it. This strikes me as weird (especially as it flips our comparison with BU.

Anyone have any insight?

The Pairwise are only now "up" in the sense that USCHo started posting them. SiouxSports and Whelan have had PWR for a while now. We were #1 a few weeks ago.

Here's my favorite PWR/tournament nightmare. Cornell finishes strong, returns to the tournament and captures a #1 regional seed. But only being ranked #3 or #4 in the PWR behind a couple of other eastern teams they get shipped to Marriucci against a regional field that includes big ice teams UNH and home team Minnesota.

Chris '03

ganderson
Apropos of nothing, Pairwise rankings are up, and we're in second, behind (sucks to) BU. I know it's WAY too early to get excited about such things, but it's still nice.

Incidentally, although they're calculating record against TUC's, they're not awarding the point towards comparison for it. This strikes me as weird (especially as it flips our comparison with BU.

Anyone have any insight?

TUC only counts when both teams being compared have played 10 TUC games.

...not including games between the two teams being compared. Probably won't matter for us, since we *should* have the comparisons against the TUCs we've played (currently Princeton, Dartmouth, No Dak, SCSU, Yale, QU, and SLU) relatively solidly anyway (assuming that our past performance is a predictor of future results, of course).

KeithK

ganderson
Apropos of nothing, Pairwise rankings are up, and we're in second, behind (sucks to) BU. I know it's WAY too early to get excited about such things, but it's still nice.

Incidentally, although they're calculating record against TUC's, they're not awarding the point towards comparison for it. This strikes me as weird (especially as it flips our comparison with BU.

Anyone have any insight?

The Pairwise are only now "up" in the sense that USCHo started posting them. SiouxSports and Whelan have had PWR for a while now. We were #1 a few weeks ago.

Here's my favorite PWR/tournament nightmare. Cornell finishes strong, returns to the tournament and captures a #1 regional seed. But only being ranked #3 or #4 in the PWR behind a couple of other eastern teams they get shipped to Marriucci against a regional field that includes big ice teams UNH and home team Minnesota.

The regional at Manchester is at the Verizon Arena, where the Monarchs play, which means NHL-sized ice.

However, the way the PWR works out this week, if they hold the brakets to 1-16, 2-15, etc., Minny would be on the east coast and in our bracket. Since they need to be at home, would they move the whole bracket to Mariucci to maintain "bracket integrity"? What's more important to the Committee?

However, as others have said many times, there's still a lot of hockey to be played before then.

Jeff Hopkins '82

KeithK

ganderson
Apropos of nothing, Pairwise rankings are up, and we're in second, behind (sucks to) BU. I know it's WAY too early to get excited about such things, but it's still nice.

Incidentally, although they're calculating record against TUC's, they're not awarding the point towards comparison for it. This strikes me as weird (especially as it flips our comparison with BU.

Anyone have any insight?

The Pairwise are only now "up" in the sense that USCHo started posting them. SiouxSports and Whelan have had PWR for a while now. We were #1 a few weeks ago.

Here's my favorite PWR/tournament nightmare. Cornell finishes strong, returns to the tournament and captures a #1 regional seed. But only being ranked #3 or #4 in the PWR behind a couple of other eastern teams they get shipped to Marriucci against a regional field that includes big ice teams UNH and home team Minnesota.

The regional at Manchester is at the Verizon Arena, where the Monarchs play, which means NHL-sized ice.

However, the way the PWR works out this week, if they hold the brakets to 1-16, 2-15, etc., Minny would be on the east coast and in our bracket. Since they need to be at home, would they move the whole bracket to Mariucci to maintain "bracket integrity"? What's more important to the Committee?

However, as others have said many times, there's still a lot of hockey to be played before then.

Of course if this whole regionalization thing goes through and only 4 teams are seeded, and if Cornell is a low 1 behind other eastern teams, they'd get shipped to be the top seed in an otherwise all western regional regardless of bracket integrity.

Jeff Hopkins '82
However, the way the PWR works out this week, if they hold the brakets to 1-16, 2-15, etc., Minny would be on the east coast and in our bracket. Since they need to be at home, would they move the whole bracket to Mariucci to maintain "bracket integrity"? What's more important to the Committee?

However, as others have said many times, there's still a lot of hockey to be played before then.

IIRC (and I may not), in the past they've placed the #1 seeds in their regions, filled out the brackets, and THEN swapped individual teams around to account for hosting and intra-conference matchups. The NC$$ appears to be putting on pressure to make travel considerations a bigger part of the equation, though, so who knows - seems like the selection & seeding criteria/process is never the same two years in a row.

Regardless of how they do it, it sure seems like things are shaping up to have at least 1 (if not 2) eastern teams sent west as #1 seeds, with Notre Dame the only "Western" team in the top 5 of PWR right now.

USA Today poll is out: [www.usatoday.com]

As in the USCHO poll, we're 5th with two first place votes.

My understanding is that that's not what "bracket integrity" means - it means maintaining the #1 through #4 teams as the top seeds, #5 through #8 as the second seeds, etc. It's so that nobody is unfairly advantaged or disadvantaged by their matchup just because it would help prevent first-round intraconference games. So they consider #1 vs. #14 to be proper by this standard (which is what happened to us in 2003), and #4 vs. #16 also would be - but e.g., #1 vs. #12 would not be acceptable, even if #s 13-16 are all in #1's conference.

Finish in the top 2 in PWR and it won't matter.

Beeeej
My understanding is that that's not what "bracket integrity" means - it means maintaining the #1 through #4 teams as the top seeds, #5 through #8 as the second seeds, etc.

I think people refer to maintaining the "sum of 17" (1+16, 2+15, etc) as "competitive equity" or something like that.

Trotsky
Finish in the top 2 in PWR and it won't matter.

Amen. Or, as I like to say, just win the next 22 in a row...

sah67
http://www.uscho.com/rankings/

We move up to #5 with two first-place votes, and we now have 4 ECAC teams ranked nationally, with Yale cracking the list at #19, Princeton sliding to #10, and Dartmouth falling to #18.

And for those of you who care, we're up to #3 in the oh-so-crucial INCH Power Rankings:
[insidecollegehockey.com]

It's interesting that the comments for the top 3 teams on INCH all reflect their strong defensive performance.

Swampy

It's interesting that the comments for the top 3 teams on INCH all reflect their strong defensive performance.

In contrast to USCHO, who, over the weekend, posted a front page headline about Notre Dame being "boring" despite their ridiculous winning streak. Almost like they had some WCHA-fanboy webmaster for a day or something.

If UHN is host team in Manchester and they make the tournament (almost a given), they will play in Manchester.

KeithK

Trotsky
Finish in the top 2 in PWR and it won't matter.

Amen. Or, as I like to say, just win the next 22 in a row...

Al Davis had the right idea. Just win, baby.

Josh '99

KeithK

Trotsky
Finish in the top 2 in PWR and it won't matter.

Amen. Or, as I like to say, just win the next 22 in a row...

Al Davis had the right idea. Just win, baby.

As much as I dislike Al Davis, that saying goes through my head every time we start talking about "What does Cornell have to do to..."

We should make a cheer loosely based on Sarah Palin's rhetoric (drill, baby, drill) .... Win baby Win !

jnachod
We should make a cheer loosely based on Sarah Palin's rhetoric (drill, baby, drill) .... Win baby Win !

Or show up early enough for the warmup drills, and then you can just chant "drill baby drill" straight up.

Or show up early enough for the warmup drills, and then you can just chant "drill baby drill" straight up.

Now that's a great idea.

KeithK
Here's my favorite PWR/tournament nightmare. Cornell finishes strong, returns to the tournament and captures a #1 regional seed. But only being ranked #3 or #4 in the PWR behind a couple of other eastern teams they get shipped to Marriucci against a regional field that includes big ice teams UNH and home team Minnesota.

The first bracketology column is up and Cornell ends up in Grand Rapids even as the number two in PWR. Cornell v. Maine and BC v. Michigan.

nyc94
The first bracketology column is up and Cornell ends up in Grand Rapids even as the number two in PWR. Cornell v. Maine and BC v. Michigan.

USCHO
To be honest, I think Cornell is happier with this arrangement, rather than getting switched with BU, resulting in a UNH-Cornell matchup in Manchester. So we’ll stick with this.

Really? We'd be so hell-bent on playing the presumably "weaker" #14 instead of #13 that we'd rather go the 533 miles to Grand Rapids, Michigan instead of 380 miles to the far more Cornell-northeast-alumni-and-student-base-friendly Manchester, NH?!? Even with Manchester as a de facto home game for UNH?

nyc94

KeithK
Here's my favorite PWR/tournament nightmare. Cornell finishes strong, returns to the tournament and captures a #1 regional seed. But only being ranked #3 or #4 in the PWR behind a couple of other eastern teams they get shipped to Marriucci against a regional field that includes big ice teams UNH and home team Minnesota.

The first bracketology column is up and Cornell ends up in Grand Rapids even as the number two in PWR. Cornell v. Maine and BC v. Michigan.

I'd scream bloody murder if they shipped us west in violation of their "highest seeds closest to home" rule. But there's a lot moer hockey to be played before we could claim a #2 PWR ranking, so it's not worth worrying about now.

Flashbacks to 2001.. This is WAY early but that bracketology column screws Cornell in every way possible. They get seeded in the west AND are forced to play the hardest 4th seed. Followed by a possible Michigan matchup on their ice. Really, this is pretty much the worst selection I can think of.

nyc94

KeithK
Here's my favorite PWR/tournament nightmare. Cornell finishes strong, returns to the tournament and captures a #1 regional seed. But only being ranked #3 or #4 in the PWR behind a couple of other eastern teams they get shipped to Marriucci against a regional field that includes big ice teams UNH and home team Minnesota.

The first bracketology column is up and Cornell ends up in Grand Rapids even as the number two in PWR. Cornell v. Maine and BC v. Michigan.

I think this is the first time I've ever wanted to go to Bridgeport.

Beeeej
Really? We'd be so hell-bent on playing the presumably "weaker" #14 instead of #13 that we'd rather go the 533 miles to Grand Rapids, Michigan instead of 380 miles to the far more Cornell-northeast-alumni-and-student-base-friendly Manchester, NH?!

Anybody else have any idea why we'd supposedly be happier with this?

While I agree that playing UNH "at home" isn't an ideal first round matchup there's no reason to think Cornell would be happier out west in his scenario. Now if the rink in Machester were Olympic size he might have a point but it's not.

Beeeej
Really? We'd be so hell-bent on playing the presumably "weaker" #14 instead of #13 that we'd rather go the 533 miles to Grand Rapids, Michigan instead of 380 miles to the far more Cornell-northeast-alumni-and-student-base-friendly Manchester, NH?!? Even with Manchester as a de facto home game for UNH?

Not to mention following up that game with the possibility of playing the Wolverines in Michigan in the regional championship. No thank you!

Besides, we gotta beat UHN in the NCAAs one of these years...

Robb

Beeeej
Really? We'd be so hell-bent on playing the presumably "weaker" #14 instead of #13 that we'd rather go the 533 miles to Grand Rapids, Michigan instead of 380 miles to the far more Cornell-northeast-alumni-and-student-base-friendly Manchester, NH?!? Even with Manchester as a de facto home game for UNH?

Not to mention following up that game with the possibility of playing the Wolverines in Michigan in the regional championship. No thank you!

Besides, we gotta beat UHN in the NCAAs one of these years...

I think Jayson applied reasonable rationale (Cornell is a higher #1 seed than Northeastern so let's try to put them where they'd prefer to be) but then came to an incorrect conclusion on its basis (they'd rather travel a longer distance to play a non-host team in the first round and potentially a host team in the second round than travel a shorter distance to play a host team in the first round).

I.e., he wasn't trying to screw us, he just made a glaring error.

Technically, Western Michigan is the host team in Grand Rapids. Practically, that's irrelevant - Jason is definitely wrong about what I'd rather see.

Edit: and there's nothing in the seeding procedure that says the committee should try to elucidate what the host teams would "prefer." It says to put them closest to home, in order from 1-4. I'm not sure why he somehow feels that the inevitability of an intra-conference matchup in the first round gives him license to violate that part of the procedure.

The real shame here is that there's no "immunity," so to speak, from getting shipped far away from home one year when it also happened the previous year (or at least the last couple of times a team made the tourney, if it's somewhat recent). They do really have to base their decisions entirely on the current season - but it's remarkable how often that seems to screw Cornell.

If the arena qualifies, Cornell should work with the Syracuse War Memorial to bid for a regional.

Beeeej
They do really have to base their decisions entirely on the current season - but it's remarkable how often that seems to screw Cornell.

Host Albany. It's the only way to be sure.

ugarte
If the arena qualifies, Cornell should work with the Syracuse War Memorial to bid for a regional.

Trotsky
Host Albany.Nuke the site from orbit. It's the only way to be sure.

FYP

Beeeej
They do really have to base their decisions entirely on the current season - but it's remarkable how often that seems to screw Cornell.

Bahloney. The committee can pretty much do whatever the heck it wants as long as they can plausibly fit it within the few rules they have to work with. it's not like there's an appeals process.

I think Jayson has just internalized the extra committee rule - "always find a way to screw Cornell somehow" - and adjusts his bracketology accordingly.

nyc94

KeithK
Here's my favorite PWR/tournament nightmare. Cornell finishes strong, returns to the tournament and captures a #1 regional seed. But only being ranked #3 or #4 in the PWR behind a couple of other eastern teams they get shipped to Marriucci against a regional field that includes big ice teams UNH and home team Minnesota.

The first bracketology column is up and Cornell ends up in Grand Rapids even as the number two in PWR. Cornell v. Maine and BC v. Michigan.

Grand Rapids, MI isn't that far from the hockey hell hole known as IN. I'm probably the only on ELF that would be okay with Cornell ending up in that regional.

But it is still early yet and many games to be played on the ice. As mentioned above by KeithK and others, the committee will find a way to send Cornell to the Twin Cities .

I'm in the same hockey Hell hole (lovely Lafayette), so for selfish reasons I wouldn't mind seeing them in Grand Rapids (and I know of a few Big Red fans in Wisconsin who wouldn't mind either).

I'm just glad we are even having a discussion about Bracketology this year. Let's hope we remain part of the controversy!

scoop85
I'm just glad we are even having a discussion about Bracketology this year. Let's hope we remain part of the controversy!

I'm jes' hopin' we win Friday night.

Trotsky

Beeeej
They do really have to base their decisions entirely on the current season - but it's remarkable how often that seems to screw Cornell.

Host Albany. It's the only way to be sure.

Or Rochester - there's no rule that says the local team has to host in a given city.

Robb
Technically, Western Michigan is the host team in Grand Rapids. Practically, that's irrelevant - Jason is definitely wrong about what I'd rather see.

Edit: and there's nothing in the seeding procedure that says the committee should try to elucidate what the host teams would "prefer." It says to put them closest to home, in order from 1-4. I'm not sure why he somehow feels that the inevitability of an intra-conference matchup in the first round gives him license to violate that part of the procedure.

True on both counts, I'm just pointing out that Jayson didn't seem to have been TRYING to come up with brackets that would screw Cornell.

ftyuv

jnachod
We should make a cheer loosely based on Sarah Palin's rhetoric (drill, baby, drill) .... Win baby Win !

Or show up early enough for the warmup drills, and then you can just chant "drill baby drill" straight up.

I tried chanting that to the rink staffers (both female) who come out with actual drills to drill the post holes after Dave is done resurfacing. Nobody joined and I looked the fool.

Does Lynah have enough seats now to host a regional?

KenP
Does Lynah have enough seats now to host a regional?

I think it's technically yes, realistically not a chance.

sah67
http://www.uscho.com/rankings/

We move up to #5 with two first-place votes, and we now have 4 ECAC teams ranked nationally, with Yale cracking the list at #19, Princeton sliding to #10, and Dartmouth falling to #18.

And for those of you who care, we're up to #3 in the oh-so-crucial INCH Power Rankings:
[insidecollegehockey.com]

According to this Ithaca Journal article [www.theithacajournal.com]

RPI's Coach Seth Appert was responsible for one of our first place votes.

redliner

sah67
http://www.uscho.com/rankings/

We move up to #5 with two first-place votes, and we now have 4 ECAC teams ranked nationally, with Yale cracking the list at #19, Princeton sliding to #10, and Dartmouth falling to #18.

And for those of you who care, we're up to #3 in the oh-so-crucial INCH Power Rankings:
[insidecollegehockey.com]

According to this Ithaca Journal article [www.theithacajournal.com]

RPI's Coach Seth Appert was responsible for one of our first place votes.

He admitted it on the RPI pregame on TW.