NCAA tournament: CU vs Richmond 5/19

RichH

jjanow99
Little to no production from the middies today. Kelleher had zero shots. Need more from them next week.

Dalton. Dalton. Dalton, with the hat-trick was enormous. He and Goldstein are the reasons we're packing for the razor stadium. Ryan more than made up for being shut down last week, other than missing TWO empty cages. Firth had the two points, but I thought he made some key plays in the 4th. Kelleher was surprisingly silent.

Look, Richmond's defense caused a bit of chaos. We had to get big goals from what, 2 or 3 long poles? We just aren't going to see another team like Richmond, thank goodness.

First line did their job today, even though it was the least heralded of the trio who put up the goal numbers. I thought Firth had a really impactful fourth quarter, when he'd dodge from the top and start the defense moving. Despite Kelleher's lack of points, he had an important solo clear when the game was in the balance, getting the ball about 10 yards from the midfield line, and running through/past what seemed like 3-4 Richmond players for the successful clear.

djk26

Scersk '97

djk26
As I walked out of the stadium, I was happy because of the three things: 1) Cornell won, 2) I heard "Davy" rather than "Free Bird", 3) Cornell doesn't have to play Richmond again this year.

Couldn't tell on the broadcast: what was being played after goals and by whom?

(Important info for a "discussion" I'm slowly having.)

After each Cornell goal, it was a PA recording of "Free Bird." After each Richmond goal, it was a PA recording of a rap song. Richmond had a band there, I think. I couldn't tell if Cornell did, and I left right when the game ended, so I couldn't tell who was playing "Davy" after the game ended.

Thanks for the data!

billhoward
Knust was an all-round All-America Saturday.

Did you mean Kirst, Bill?

I thought Firth should have gotten the ball more up high to dodge he seemed to run by his man every time

Scersk '97

djk26

Scersk '97

djk26
As I walked out of the stadium, I was happy because of the three things: 1) Cornell won, 2) I heard "Davy" rather than "Free Bird", 3) Cornell doesn't have to play Richmond again this year.

Couldn't tell on the broadcast: what was being played after goals and by whom?

(Important info for a "discussion" I'm slowly having.)

After each Cornell goal, it was a PA recording of "Free Bird." After each Richmond goal, it was a PA recording of a rap song. Richmond had a band there, I think. I couldn't tell if Cornell did, and I left right when the game ended, so I couldn't tell who was playing "Davy" after the game ended.

Thanks for the data!

From tv and instagram, I could see and hear the Cornell band. It was rag tag with no Waldo shirts. Didn’t see or hear another band.

rss77
Kirst did not seem to moving at the pace he has most of the year. He has taken a ton of shots to the body this season so not sure if we credit Richmond's defense or potential minor injury? I will comment that I amazed at the way Goldstein moves his feet. I think 90% of us would trip over our own feet if we tried to move like him.

The Spider doubled CJ often today, and then hustled back to recover after he passed the ball. Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but there didn't seem to be anything particularly special about what they did. They were well coached, and they worked their tails off. That's how lacrosse defense is supposed to be played. It reminds me of our Ben DeLuca defenses from back in the day.

That’s what I saw too but you know a helluva lot more about the game than me. They reminded me of the Florida Panthers. Swarming. Do spiders swarm?

arugula
That’s what I saw too but you know a helluva lot more about the game than me. They reminded me of the Florida Panthers. Swarming. Do spiders swarm?[/

.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/18/2025 08:01AM by toddlose.

billhoward
Knust was an all-round All-America Saturday.

Knust -> Kirst

This was not one of Knust's better games ...

djk26

Scersk '97

djk26
As I walked out of the stadium, I was happy because of the three things: 1) Cornell won, 2) I heard "Davy" rather than "Free Bird", 3) Cornell doesn't have to play Richmond again this year.

Couldn't tell on the broadcast: what was being played after goals and by whom?

(Important info for a "discussion" I'm slowly having.)

After each Cornell goal, it was a PA recording of "Free Bird." After each Richmond goal, it was a PA recording of a rap song. Richmond had a band there, I think. I couldn't tell if Cornell did, and I left right when the game ended, so I couldn't tell who was playing "Davy" after the game ended.

I don't get it about "Free Bird." OK, so the band's not allowed to play after the team scores. And I suppose they can't find a recording of "Davy" for the PA system. But in the NYC metro area no less, why can't they play "Give My Regards to Broadway" for krise sake?

Swampy

djk26

Scersk '97

djk26
As I walked out of the stadium, I was happy because of the three things: 1) Cornell won, 2) I heard "Davy" rather than "Free Bird", 3) Cornell doesn't have to play Richmond again this year.

Couldn't tell on the broadcast: what was being played after goals and by whom?

(Important info for a "discussion" I'm slowly having.)

After each Cornell goal, it was a PA recording of "Free Bird." After each Richmond goal, it was a PA recording of a rap song. Richmond had a band there, I think. I couldn't tell if Cornell did, and I left right when the game ended, so I couldn't tell who was playing "Davy" after the game ended.

I don't get it about "Free Bird." OK, so the band's not allowed to play after the team scores. And I suppose they can't find a recording of "Davy" for the PA system. But in the NYC metro area no less, why can't they play "Give My Regards to Broadway" for krise sake?

Exactly. I’m slowly trying to get to the bottom of all this, but I’m liking nothing I’m hearing on the way down.

CJ Kirst had three season highs, per Cornell stats:

13  --  Shots (at) goal
 3  --  Caused turnovers
10  --  Ground balls

... 10 GBs? Guy thinks he's a midfielder as well.

Kirst is now at (career) 247 goals, 97 assists, 338 points, 159 GBs, 63 CTs. His first three seasons' shooting percentage was .306, .367, .326 and this year .455, almost .100 better than all other years, This year, nearly half the time he shoots, the ball is in the net.

Scersk '97

Swampy

djk26

Scersk '97

djk26
As I walked out of the stadium, I was happy because of the three things: 1) Cornell won, 2) I heard "Davy" rather than "Free Bird", 3) Cornell doesn't have to play Richmond again this year.

Couldn't tell on the broadcast: what was being played after goals and by whom?

(Important info for a "discussion" I'm slowly having.)

After each Cornell goal, it was a PA recording of "Free Bird." After each Richmond goal, it was a PA recording of a rap song. Richmond had a band there, I think. I couldn't tell if Cornell did, and I left right when the game ended, so I couldn't tell who was playing "Davy" after the game ended.

I don't get it about "Free Bird." OK, so the band's not allowed to play after the team scores. And I suppose they can't find a recording of "Davy" for the PA system. But in the NYC metro area no less, why can't they play "Give My Regards to Broadway" for krise sake?

Exactly. I’m slowly trying to get to the bottom of all this, but I’m liking nothing I’m hearing on the way down.

Can't put a price on first-class research.

I'd love to see (hear) someone do a Post report. It seemed like half of Richmond's goals were hitting the post and in.

The goalie is not supposed to save those.

A silly mm off and those bounce out.

So I don't think the save percentage was as bad as people were saying.

Jim Hyla
I'd love to see (hear) someone do a Post report. It seemed like half of Richmond's goals were hitting the post and in.

The goalie is not supposed to save those.

A silly mm off and those bounce out.

So I don't think the save percentage was as bad as people were saying.

Not a good day but it happens. I just hope it doesn't happen again next weekend.

Any shot that is on goal is a shot that a goaltender will tell you that s/he should save. I have one in my family, so I know the good ones don't make excuses for the shots that get by them.

Jim Hyla
I'd love to see (hear) someone do a Post report. It seemed like half of Richmond's goals were hitting the post and in.

The goalie is not supposed to save those.

A silly mm off and those bounce out.

.

This isn’t really true. A guy can shoot from 30 yards out and even if it goes in off the post, it should have been be stopped. Or, like we saw, a guy can shoot from a horrible angle off the post and in and that too should have been saved.

mike1960
Edit: We also have the greatest college lacrosse player in the galaxy.

Jesus Kirst Superstar begins playing in the background.

I am curious which of the goals people think Knust should have stopped. Very few of the goals looked soft to me. Richmond placed their shots super well. I see no reason to believe Knust won’t have a bounce-back game.

Cornell solidly outplayed Richmond. We almost lost due to bad puck luck but we I believe win that game at least 8 times out of 10, adjusting for luck.

I don’t get the people saying Richmond was a particularly scary opponent. I mean, they’re a very good team, but not scarier than just about any other team in the final 8. Penn State looks tougher on paper.

Must be difficult for the coaches to know what to do if Bozzi and Box aren’t 100%. Tough to feel these things out in the game itself when every possession matters.

That game was about as close to an analogy as you can get in lax to the Cornell-MSU matchup in hockey. A clear favorite with the best player in the country vs a defensive roadblock built to upset superior offensive juggernauts. It felt the playing surface was clearly tilted in one direction, yet there we were, trailing every quarter, and then finding ourselves in the last minute facing a situation where one execution/defensive lapse could cause disaster.

That aside, I was nervous because how many teams can say they held a 5 goal lead against Cornell this year? The potential was clear.

CU2007

Jim Hyla
I'd love to see (hear) someone do a Post report. It seemed like half of Richmond's goals were hitting the post and in.

The goalie is not supposed to save those.

A silly mm off and those bounce out.

.

This isn’t really true. A guy can shoot from 30 yards out and even if it goes in off the post, it should have been be stopped. Or, like we saw, a guy can shoot from a horrible angle off the post and in and that too should have been saved.

So basically you're saying that every shot should be stopped.

Then the logical extension of that is every goal against is the goalies fault.

I just don't buy that.

In lacrosse and hockey a very well placed shot goes in. If it's stopped, we bow to the goalie.

The goalie can't physically cover 100% of the goal 100% of the time. You just can't do that.

You play your angles and your percentages. If the shooter is able to pick that small spot that you can't cover, then it's a great shot.

You forget about it. Go on to the next play, realizing that if you play things correctly, you'll save X% of the shots.

But you can't save all of them.

And not everything is your fault.

Jim Hyla

CU2007

Jim Hyla
I'd love to see (hear) someone do a Post report. It seemed like half of Richmond's goals were hitting the post and in.

The goalie is not supposed to save those.

A silly mm off and those bounce out.

.

This isn’t really true. A guy can shoot from 30 yards out and even if it goes in off the post, it should have been be stopped. Or, like we saw, a guy can shoot from a horrible angle off the post and in and that too should have been saved.

So basically you're saying that every shot should be stopped.

Then the logical extension of that is every goal against is the goalies fault.

I just don't buy that.

In lacrosse and hockey a very well placed shot goes in. If it's stopped, we bow to the goalie.

The goalie can't physically cover 100% of the goal 100% of the time. You just can't do that.

You play your angles and your percentages. If the shooter is able to pick that small spot that you can't cover, then it's a great shot.

You forget about it. Go on to the next play, realizing that if you play things correctly, you'll save X% of the shots.

But you can't save all of them.



And not everything is your fault.

“It’s all your fault”

Here’s my opinion. To start, almost every time someone scores in lacrosse, it has very thin margins. The goal is so small that the shots have to be really well placed so the argument that a bunch of their shots dotted corners or went in off posts does nothing for me, this happens in every single game. You’re not gonna get hit in the chest much as a goalie so you have to make some saves. Next, pretty much all of Richmond’s shots were from outside which is ideal for Knust. By contrast, Cornell had 6 or 7 shots right on the doorstep and the Richmond goalie still ended with a much better save percentage. It’s not that there are a couple of shots that he definitely should have saved (but if you really want me to name one I recall him getting beat low short side on a bad angle) but that he just didn’t make many saves. If you face 20 shots with an expected save percentage of 45%, there’s no one shot that you should stop, but you sure as hell better save a good chunk of them still. That’s pretty much how I feel about Knust’s last game.

I like Knust, he’s been great all season and I don’t want to be the guy reiterating how he had a shit game three days later but it’s pretty ridiculous to say that saving 28 percent on all outside shots isn’t bad. He had a bad game and that’s okay but I’m not sure why some of you feel the need to defend him so aggressively.

chimpfood
I like Knust, he’s been great all season and I don’t want to be the guy reiterating how he had a shit game three days later but it’s pretty ridiculous to say that saving 28 percent on all outside shots isn’t bad. He had a bad game and that’s okay but I’m not sure why some of you feel the need to defend him so aggressively.

Not to mention some shots are made before the release - if the attack takes you out with a head fake, or tic tac toe passing gets you out of position, that's not unreasonable; you aren't going to make the save. If the ball squeezes into a ball-width gap between your basket and the post, you probably should have.

chimpfood
Here’s my opinion. To start, almost every time someone scores in lacrosse, it has very thin margins. The goal is so small that the shots have to be really well placed so the argument that a bunch of their shots dotted corners or went in off posts does nothing for me, this happens in every single game. You’re not gonna get hit in the chest much as a goalie so you have to make some saves. Next, pretty much all of Richmond’s shots were from outside which is ideal for Knust. By contrast, Cornell had 6 or 7 shots right on the doorstep and the Richmond goalie still ended with a much better save percentage. It’s not that there are a couple of shots that he definitely should have saved (but if you really want me to name one I recall him getting beat low short side on a bad angle) but that he just didn’t make many saves. If you face 20 shots with an expected save percentage of 45%, there’s no one shot that you should stop, but you sure as hell better save a good chunk of them still. That’s pretty much how I feel about Knust’s last game.

I like Knust, he’s been great all season and I don’t want to be the guy reiterating how he had a shit game three days later but it’s pretty ridiculous to say that saving 28 percent on all outside shots isn’t bad. He had a bad game and that’s okay but I’m not sure why some of you feel the need to defend him so aggressively.

I totally agree with your premise for evaluating goalies. But in practice I don’t think many shots were from outside (certainly not far outside) and none looked easy to stop. A lot were from tough angles but this isn’t hockey where the goalie takes up enough of the net to totally cut off a bad angle. So I don’t think the expected save % on pretty much any of these shots was high at all. Understood that a goalie should stop a 70% shot 30% of the time but I think you’re understating how difficult a lot of the shots were to stop.

ER

Jim Hyla

CU2007

Jim Hyla
I'd love to see (hear) someone do a Post report. It seemed like half of Richmond's goals were hitting the post and in.

The goalie is not supposed to save those.

A silly mm off and those bounce out.

.

This isn’t really true. A guy can shoot from 30 yards out and even if it goes in off the post, it should have been be stopped. Or, like we saw, a guy can shoot from a horrible angle off the post and in and that too should have been saved.

So basically you're saying that every shot should be stopped.

Then the logical extension of that is every goal against is the goalies fault.

I just don't buy that.

In lacrosse and hockey a very well placed shot goes in. If it's stopped, we bow to the goalie.

The goalie can't physically cover 100% of the goal 100% of the time. You just can't do that.

You play your angles and your percentages. If the shooter is able to pick that small spot that you can't cover, then it's a great shot.

You forget about it. Go on to the next play, realizing that if you play things correctly, you'll save X% of the shots.

But you can't save all of them.



And not everything is your fault.

“It’s all your fault”

It's all your fault, it's all your fault!

Jim Hyla

CU2007

Jim Hyla
I'd love to see (hear) someone do a Post report. It seemed like half of Richmond's goals were hitting the post and in.

The goalie is not supposed to save those.

A silly mm off and those bounce out.

.

This isn’t really true. A guy can shoot from 30 yards out and even if it goes in off the post, it should have been be stopped. Or, like we saw, a guy can shoot from a horrible angle off the post and in and that too should have been saved.

So basically you're saying that every shot should be stopped.

Then the logical extension of that is every goal against is the goalies fault.

I just don't buy that.

In lacrosse and hockey a very well placed shot goes in. If it's stopped, we bow to the goalie.

The goalie can't physically cover 100% of the goal 100% of the time. You just can't do that.

You play your angles and your percentages. If the shooter is able to pick that small spot that you can't cover, then it's a great shot.

You forget about it. Go on to the next play, realizing that if you play things correctly, you'll save X% of the shots.

But you can't save all of them.

And not everything is your fault.

No, I didn’t say that at all. I said that just because a shot hits the post and goes in doesn’t mean in and of itself that the goalie isn’t supposed to save it. For example, it could have been shot from the other end of the field and if nobody bothers to stop it, bounced off the post and gone in.

stereax

ER

Jim Hyla

CU2007

Jim Hyla
I'd love to see (hear) someone do a Post report. It seemed like half of Richmond's goals were hitting the post and in.

The goalie is not supposed to save those.

A silly mm off and those bounce out.

.

This isn’t really true. A guy can shoot from 30 yards out and even if it goes in off the post, it should have been be stopped. Or, like we saw, a guy can shoot from a horrible angle off the post and in and that too should have been saved.

So basically you're saying that every shot should be stopped.

Then the logical extension of that is every goal against is the goalies fault.

I just don't buy that.

In lacrosse and hockey a very well placed shot goes in. If it's stopped, we bow to the goalie.

The goalie can't physically cover 100% of the goal 100% of the time. You just can't do that.

You play your angles and your percentages. If the shooter is able to pick that small spot that you can't cover, then it's a great shot.

You forget about it. Go on to the next play, realizing that if you play things correctly, you'll save X% of the shots.

But you can't save all of them.



And not everything is your fault.

“It’s all your fault”

It's all your fault, it's all your fault!

This is fabulous. Let's adopt this as a new (and original) chant for lacrosse this weekend. And hockey in the fall.

TimV

stereax
It's all your fault, it's all your fault!

This is fabulous. Let's adopt this as a new (and original) chant for lacrosse this weekend. And hockey in the fall.

We could even have the band play Davy beforehand! It’ll be a hoot!

Scersk '97

TimV

stereax
It's all your fault, it's all your fault!

This is fabulous. Let's adopt this as a new (and original) chant for lacrosse this weekend. And hockey in the fall.

We could even have the band play Davy beforehand! It’ll be a hoot!

Oops. Wrong quote. Was looking for "NOT all your fault..."