Cornell lacrosse 2018

Noticed the classy, modest-in-size white C on the red helmets worn against Brown. Big improvement.

mountainred
As long as an ACC school is eligible for the tournament they are on the bubble. Who you lose to is very important in college lacrosse, far more important than actually winning games.

That used to be true, but I think it hasn't been since the change in selection criteria in 2009.

Cornell now #8 on the selection committee's ranking:

[www.ncaa.com]

If the FOGO wins the ball but is immediately stripped of the ball for a turnover, does that count as a faceoff win? What does it look like on the stat sheet?

Yale up 6-2 on Albany with 7:13 in the 2nd. They look really solid. Can't wait for the next meeting between the Big Red and the Elis.

CU77

mountainred
As long as an ACC school is eligible for the tournament they are on the bubble. Who you lose to is very important in college lacrosse, far more important than actually winning games.

That used to be true, but I think it hasn't been since the change in selection criteria in 2009.

Cornell now #8 on the selection committee's ranking:

[www.ncaa.com]

It's better than it was; it used to be that you could name the at-large selections in January (the entire ACC, Hopkins, the Ivy runner-up). Still, strength of schedule is the first criteria the NCAA lists and you'll notice 6-5 Notre Dame is the first team listed as also receiving consideration.

Let's just say, I don't trust the NCAA to do the right thing. Ever.

Swampy

Jeff Hopkins '82

FYI, if you have multiple browsers, you can vote multiple times each day.

I assume this applies to multiple devices: maximum daily votes = sum(device x browsers on device for all devices), with devices = home desktop, work desktop, laptop, tablet, phone, Fire TV, ... .

No, I have two different browsers (Firefox and Opera) on my laptop. It let me vote using each of them, both yesterday and today.

Edit: And I cleared my cookies in Firefox and re-started the browser. It let me vote again.

Albany and Maryland lost. The three teams playing their best lacrosse now are Duke, Yale, and Cornell.

FYI, this year's NCAA selection committee:
[web1.ncaa.org]

mike1960
Albany and Maryland lost. The three teams playing their best lacrosse now are Duke, Yale, and Cornell.

Add 2-10 Dartmouth, playing its best lacrosse, taking #20 Penn to 2 OTs and then losing. If you grade on a curve, they're hot-hot-hot.

mike1960
Albany and Maryland lost. The three teams playing their best lacrosse now are Duke, Yale, and Cornell.

I’d add Bucknell and Loyola to that list, with Navy not too shabby either. The top of the Patriot league is impressive this year.

mike1960
Albany and Maryland lost. The three teams playing their best lacrosse now are Duke, Yale, and Cornell.

Albany loses Connor Fields, their Rob Pannell, to a knee injury. MRI Monday. [www.insidelacrosse.com]

scoop85

mike1960
Albany and Maryland lost. The three teams playing their best lacrosse now are Duke, Yale, and Cornell.

I’d add Bucknell and Loyola to that list, with Navy not too shabby either. The top of the Patriot league is impressive this year.

I would agree with that. It feels like there's a lot of parity this year at the top. Cornell might have as good a shot as anyone.

Did everyone here watch the end of the Navy - Syracuse game? Navy ties the game up with 12 seconds left. The Middie and Orange FOGOs are brothers (and large boys). Navy wins the faceoff, scoops the ball on one hop and sprints downfield. Makes one pass, the guy gets stripped but it bounces right back to the FOGO who picks it up and fires it in with less than a second to play for the upset W.

Incredible ending. Nice for Navy. Was thinking also: Our Quality W over Syracuse is slipping a bit.

billhoward

mike1960
Albany and Maryland lost. The three teams playing their best lacrosse now are Duke, Yale, and Cornell.

Albany loses Connor Fields, their Rob Pannell, to a knee injury. MRI Monday. [www.insidelacrosse.com]

It didn't look good when he went down without contact. It would be a shame if he missed the tournament.

Media poll 4/23 has Cornell #6, Yale #1 [www.insidelacrosse.com]

Cornell #6 in Quint Kessenich's personal top 20 in [www.insidelacrosse.com]

Quint Kessenich
6. Cornell — The Big Red lit up Brown 19-5, blowtorching the Bears while putting 34 shots on cage. Jeff Teat had two goals and eight assists and is on my Tewaraaton short list. A 1-2 finish in the Ivy League is a ticket to the NCAA Tournament — and perhaps a home game. The Big Red keep winning and their RPI keeps dropping, now down to No. 13. How is Peter Milliman coaching status still interim? Sign this man to a real contract! He's done fabulous work.
Midfielder Jordan Dowiak was picked at No. 33 in the MLL draft by Dallas.
Princeton and Michael Sowers host the Big Red on Saturday. If you're a young attackman I suggest you watch Teat and Sowers and take notes.

1. Duke
2. Yale
3. Maryland
4. Denver
5. Albany
6. Cornell
7. Loyola
8. Hopkins
9. Rutgers
10. Virginia

Tough crowd over at the USILA poll. [www.ncaa.com] They jumped Yale from 5 to 2 (and did the reverse to Albany). We clobber Brown and remain stuck at No. 8.

The RPI that could determine our fate is unkind. [www.ncaa.com] We are No. 13. Yale is 4. Syracuse (we beat them) is 9. Penn (we rolled them, 20-13) is just one spot behind. If I read the rules correctly, 11 of the 16 spots go to AQs. (There is a one-game play-in of the two lowest-ranked conference champions.) Yale will go regardless.

The NCAA says this is the criteria [www.ncaa.com]

• Strength of schedule index.
• Results of the RPI.
- Record against ranked teams 1-5; 6-10; 11-15; 16-20; 21+
- Average RPI win (average RPI of all wins)
- Average RPI loss (average RPI of all losses)
• Head-to-head competition:
- Results versus common opponents.
- Significant wins and losses (wins against teams ranked higher in the RPI and losses against teams ranked lower in the RPI).
- Locations of contests.
• Input from the regional advisory committee (comprised [sic] of lacrosse coashes from all AQ conferences).

Odds Cornell makes the final four? 10%? Lower?

Trotsky
Odds Cornell makes the final four? 10%? Lower?

I'd say maybe 15%--but make no mistake we have an excellent team that can play with anyone. Hopefully we'll get a chance to play Yale in the ILT

scoop85

Trotsky
Odds Cornell makes the final four? 10%? Lower?

I'd say maybe 15%--but make no mistake we have an excellent team that can play with anyone. Hopefully we'll get a chance to play Yale in the ILT

So it sounds like they will need a big road upset in round 2 of the NC$$, but only one. Doable, certainly.

Trotsky

scoop85

Trotsky
Odds Cornell makes the final four? 10%? Lower?

I'd say maybe 15%--but make no mistake we have an excellent team that can play with anyone. Hopefully we'll get a chance to play Yale in the ILT

So it sounds like they will need a big road upset in round 2 of the NC$$, but only one. Doable, certainly.

Round 2 would be the quarterfinals on a neutral field, and would not be considered a huge upset IMO

Trotsky

scoop85

Trotsky
Odds Cornell makes the final four? 10%? Lower?

I'd say maybe 15%--but make no mistake we have an excellent team that can play with anyone. Hopefully we'll get a chance to play Yale in the ILT

So it sounds like they will need a big road upset in round 2 of the NC$$, but only one. Doable, certainly.

Could be. A lot will depend on the draw. There aren't a lot of disciplined defenses that can slow down the Big Red. And the defense has had few lapses: it's been incredibly opportunistic, great on ground balls, and brings the slides like hammers. The only thing that concerns me is that this team/coach hasn't been in the pressure cooker of the NCAA tournament, like Duke for example. But sometimes young players don't know their supposed to be nervous and play great.

Trotsky

scoop85

Trotsky
Odds Cornell makes the final four? 10%? Lower?

I'd say maybe 15%--but make no mistake we have an excellent team that can play with anyone. Hopefully we'll get a chance to play Yale in the ILT

So it sounds like they will need a big road upset in round 2 of the NC$$, but only one. Doable, certainly.

There is no dominant team this year, no fear you'll be the second-best team in the tournament but wind up playing the buzzsaw that is No. 1 in the quarterfinals. Also from Kessenich's column today:

Quint Kessenich
There is no super team in 2018. Everybody has been dirtied up. The RPI is for losers, but we're stuck with it. What matters most is how a team is playing...today.

The NCAA Tournament welcomes nine automatic qualifiers and then the best remaining eight at-large selections.

Before Connor Fields went down, I'd say we'd want to avoid Albany because we got crushed on faceoffs. But then we only lost by 2. And if Fields is out for the season, Albany is no longer a top-five team.

If we make the tournament and if we win the first-round game (home would be nice) the quarterfinals are either at Hofstra or Annapolis, no danger of having to get to Indianapolis or someplace silly like that. Semifinals and finals are at Gillette Stadium, where we have had very good luck in the semifinal game.

I think Cornell will need to beat Yale in the ILT final to get a home game in round 1.

Without that, getting in at all is a little dicey. Our best win is over Cuse, but Navy and Rutgers have also beaten Cuse, and they and many others will be in contention for the 8 at-large bids.

Four things still worry me about this team.

1. FO: We currently rank 42nd in the NCAA. True, we started out awful and had a good run after Penn State, winning between 52% (SYR) and 68% (AFA) in the middle of the season. But we won only 28% against Lehigh and 35% against Brown. And now Ras is hurt.
2. We rely on some key people on both D (Pulver) and O (Teat). While I'm confident we can beat most teams even if one or both of them is injured or neutralized by a stud opponent or an opposing coach's strategy, I think they're essential to our continued success against the level of competition that's coming.
3. Similarly, our O is simply the best. OTOH, our D is very good, but not lights out, esp. on man-down. (See Lehigh game).
4. Most troubling for the upcoming tourney stretch, our guys were clearly running out of gas by the end of the Lehigh game. It's understandable because they'd just finished dispatching three tough opponents during one week, with little time for rest and recuperation. But this sounds a lot like ILT and NC$$ Memorial Day weekends: high pressure, great opponents, and short rest between games. Winning teams on May 6 and and May 28 will have to play a full 60 minutes (if they're lucky) and without any excuses that they played tough games only two days earlier.

But if you had told me at the start of the season that we'd be seriously talking about May 6, let alone May 28, I would have been thrilled.

Just win, baby! Go Red!

It's probably fair to say that nearly every champion would not have won its title if its star offensive performer went down, so I wouldn't worry so much about Teat getting hurt. It is worrisome that a great defender might neuter that scorer if you have no other weapons on the field, but is that true of us?

Trotsky
It's probably fair to say that nearly every champion would not have won its title if its star offensive performer went down, so I wouldn't worry so much about Teat getting hurt. It is worrisome that a great defender might neuter that scorer if you have no other weapons on the field, but is that true of us?

You're right. Exception proves rule. I don't think Albany will make a deep run without Connor Fields.

We won the 1971 lax tournament without the All-America goalie Bob Rule (accidental backup goalie of the 1970 hockey championship team) out with a bad knee and replaced by Bob Buhmann (RIP 2014 of brain cancer at 65) although Buhmann was the goalie for Nassau CC the the two years before when it won the junior college tournaments. We also had a deep midfield that year and one of the best pre-Mike French/Eamon McEneaney attackmen in Al Rimmer.

We won the 1970 hockey tournament without Dryden, a player on the order of a Pannell or Teat, and only one All-America, Bruce Lodboa on defense.

Then there were the Eagles without Carson Wentz and the 2018 Super Bowl.

Thanks for the Daily News cover, Bill. It never gets old!

I don't often agree with Quint on much, but I have been wondering myself: When do they take the interim tag off of Milliman?

I was told by a Lehigh alum co-worker that Lehigh has the best FOGO in the country, so that was some of the issue in that game. We may not run into that again, but we damn well need to improve on that front in general. And we'd better fix our EMO defense, too. Without getting better on those, we aren't going to Foxboro, no matter if we have home field in the first round or not.

Jeff Hopkins '82
Thanks for the Daily News cover, Bill. It never gets old!

I don't often agree with Quint on much, but I have been wondering myself: When do they take the interim tag off of Milliman?

I was told by a Lehigh alum co-worker that Lehigh has the best FOGO in the country, so that was some of the issue in that game. We may not run into that again, but we damn well need to improve on that front in general. And we'd better fix our EMO defense, too. Without getting better on those, we aren't going to Foxboro, no matter if we have home field in the first round or not.

I agree with a lot of what you say here, but I'm not as concerned with the EMO defense as I am with the EMO offense. Cornell EMO defense didn't look good against Lehigh, but Lehigh has one of the best EMO offenses in the country. Cornell's EMO offense, on the other hand, has not been that productive and in the games I watched does not appear to have a clear plan. Lehigh works the ball in a way that gives them a slam dunk most of the time. That's what I wish we had.

mike1960

Jeff Hopkins '82
Thanks for the Daily News cover, Bill. It never gets old!
I don't often agree with Quint on much, but I have been wondering myself: When do they take the interim tag off of Milliman?
I was told by a Lehigh alum co-worker that Lehigh has the best FOGO in the country, so that was some of the issue in that game. We may not run into that again, but we damn well need to improve on that front in general. And we'd better fix our EMO defense, too. Without getting better on those, we aren't going to Foxboro, no matter if we have home field in the first round or not.

I agree with a lot of what you say here, but I'm not as concerned with the EMO defense as I am with the EMO offense. Cornell EMO defense didn't look good against Lehigh, but Lehigh has one of the best EMO offenses in the country. Cornell's EMO offense, on the other hand, has not been that productive and in the games I watched does not appear to have a clear plan. Lehigh works the ball in a way that gives them a slam dunk most of the time. That's what I wish we had.

Lehigh scored so fast on EMO, it was almost punitive. Our even strength offense is so good, we almost (barroom talking here) should decline the penalty and play 5x5.

mike1960

Jeff Hopkins '82
Thanks for the Daily News cover, Bill. It never gets old!

I don't often agree with Quint on much, but I have been wondering myself: When do they take the interim tag off of Milliman?

I was told by a Lehigh alum co-worker that Lehigh has the best FOGO in the country, so that was some of the issue in that game. We may not run into that again, but we damn well need to improve on that front in general. And we'd better fix our EMO defense, too. Without getting better on those, we aren't going to Foxboro, no matter if we have home field in the first round or not.

I agree with a lot of what you say here, but I'm not as concerned with the EMO defense as I am with the EMO offense. Cornell EMO defense didn't look good against Lehigh, but Lehigh has one of the best EMO offenses in the country. Cornell's EMO offense, on the other hand, has not been that productive and in the games I watched does not appear to have a clear plan. Lehigh works the ball in a way that gives them a slam dunk most of the time. That's what I wish we had.

I agree. I think a couple of Lehigh's EMO goals were off of rebounds off a defender, and not because of any great offensive plays.

billhoward

mike1960

Jeff Hopkins '82
Thanks for the Daily News cover, Bill. It never gets old!
I don't often agree with Quint on much, but I have been wondering myself: When do they take the interim tag off of Milliman?
I was told by a Lehigh alum co-worker that Lehigh has the best FOGO in the country, so that was some of the issue in that game. We may not run into that again, but we damn well need to improve on that front in general. And we'd better fix our EMO defense, too. Without getting better on those, we aren't going to Foxboro, no matter if we have home field in the first round or not.

I agree with a lot of what you say here, but I'm not as concerned with the EMO defense as I am with the EMO offense. Cornell EMO defense didn't look good against Lehigh, but Lehigh has one of the best EMO offenses in the country. Cornell's EMO offense, on the other hand, has not been that productive and in the games I watched does not appear to have a clear plan. Lehigh works the ball in a way that gives them a slam dunk most of the time. That's what I wish we had.

Lehigh scored so fast on EMO, it was almost punitive. Our even strength offense is so good, we almost (barroom talking here) should decline the penalty and play 5x5.

We actually made that joke in the stands at the game.

Our offense is make multiple passes create lanes and shoot.. you get little of that in 30 sec penalties. we are leading the country in scoring so does it really matter if we dont score EMO. Its more our EMO defense that we need to worry about at times.

upprdeck
Our offense is make multiple passes create lanes and shoot.. you get little of that in 30 sec penalties. we are leading the country in scoring so does it really matter if we dont score EMO. Its more our EMO defense that we need to worry about at times.

It might matter. We were 1-3 in EMO against Yale, and we lost 13-11. We're going to have some seriously close games in the next few weeks.

mike1960

upprdeck
Our offense is make multiple passes create lanes and shoot.. you get little of that in 30 sec penalties. we are leading the country in scoring so does it really matter if we dont score EMO. Its more our EMO defense that we need to worry about at times.

It might matter. We were 1-3 in EMO against Yale, and we lost 13-11. We're going to have some seriously close games in the next few weeks.

Vicious glass-half-empty cycle: The more we score on EMO, the more chances we have to lose ensuing faceoffs.

billhoward

mike1960

upprdeck
Our offense is make multiple passes create lanes and shoot.. you get little of that in 30 sec penalties. we are leading the country in scoring so does it really matter if we dont score EMO. Its more our EMO defense that we need to worry about at times.

It might matter. We were 1-3 in EMO against Yale, and we lost 13-11. We're going to have some seriously close games in the next few weeks.

Vicious glass-half-empty cycle: The more we score on EMO, the more chances we have to lose ensuing faceoffs.

True, but if our EMO defense was a lock, we could deliberately foul when lose the face off and then win the man-down defense.

billhoward

mike1960

upprdeck
Our offense is make multiple passes create lanes and shoot.. you get little of that in 30 sec penalties. we are leading the country in scoring so does it really matter if we dont score EMO. Its more our EMO defense that we need to worry about at times.

It might matter. We were 1-3 in EMO against Yale, and we lost 13-11. We're going to have some seriously close games in the next few weeks.

Vicious glass-half-empty cycle: The more we score on EMO, the more chances we have to lose ensuing faceoffs.

In the Yale game, we won 17 of 28 faceoffs. As I said, it might matter, and get exponentially matterish in close games and overtime situations.

mike1960

billhoward

mike1960

upprdeck
Our offense is make multiple passes create lanes and shoot.. you get little of that in 30 sec penalties. we are leading the country in scoring so does it really matter if we dont score EMO. Its more our EMO defense that we need to worry about at times.

It might matter. We were 1-3 in EMO against Yale, and we lost 13-11. We're going to have some seriously close games in the next few weeks.

Vicious glass-half-empty cycle: The more we score on EMO, the more chances we have to lose ensuing faceoffs.

In the Yale game, we won 17 of 28 faceoffs. As I said, it might matter, and get exponentially matterish in close games and overtime situations.

The folks at lacrosse reference say Cornell has the most efficient offense in the sport but that they take their time on offense. I'll take that over forcing a shot to make the EMO look better. I don't feel like going back through the p-b-p's but there are probably a bunch of EMO chances that came up "empty" but the Red kept possession and scored later in the possession at even strength. The impact -- +1 good guys -- is the same.

And on the man down defense, it really isn't a season long issue. 11 of the 16 man down goals came in three games (Dartmouth, Harvard, Lehigh). It's not like they are giving up 3 man down goals a game.

You keep providing fact-based answers and then we'll have nothing to gripe about.

It is nice if we can beat Yale on faceoffs if it comes down to Yale-Cornell for the Ivy tournament title. I don't know if the worrying about whether we have high enough standing to make the NCAA tournament w/o the title is a real issue or not. So we just win, baby.

[edit add] Princeton did an outstanding job shutting down Jeff Teat and without him, the Cornell offense just didn't click, although we did get good midfielder scoring. Final 14-8. The LSM on Teat, George Baughan #17, is only a freshman; last year Teat had 12 points which is what we needed from him this year, too. Michael Sowers, Princeton's stud attackman, was 1-2--3 and set a Princeton season scoring record, 83 points.

Cornell had a lot of back luck such as hitting pipes. Cornell fans around me thought we got shafted by the refs. Between pipes and the calls, I didn't seven goals worth of bad luck/calls. We did hold Princeton 0x4 on EMO while we were 2x5.

Absolutely fabulous day for the game, nice weather, but not as well attended as Cornell-at-Princeton games in the pat. The small stands across from the main stands had maybe 5 people. (Announced attendance: 1636).


Good reality check before the Ivy tournament. Hopefully we rebound in the semifinal and then play our best game of the year against (presumably) Yale for the autobid. The field is:

1. Yale
2. Cornell
3. Brown
4. Penn

Princeton went into the game knowing it needed to win to have a shot, but that evaporated when winless Dartmouth failed to beat Brown.

No, it wasn't IMO:

CornellBig.Com game story
The game was closer than the final score indicated with the Tigers holding the slim edge in shots (38-33), ground balls (28-25) and face-offs (14-of-24).

--------------

Gonna rain like crazy Friday. But then Saturday in Princeton, 1 p.m. gametime, it's going to be partly sunny and high 60s. Showcasing two of the nation's best attackmen, Jeff Teat and Michael Sowers.

Princeton is one of three teams at 2-3 league along with Harvard and Brown. Princeton has the H2H over Harvard, Harvard (vs. Yale Saturday) has the H2H over Brown, and Brown (vs. winless Dartmouth) has the H2H over Princeton (14-13). Brown has the best chance of winning Saturday since Dartmouth is winless.

Win the next 2 and we are a lock i think. Win the next 1 and I think we are still in without some crazy stuff.. perhaps Albany loses. SU might lose out. ND might lose out and they are both out if that happens. you remove a few of the teams below us and even 2 losses we still might get in.

I know there are clear benefits to being home team in hockey, even at a neutral venue. Any built-in advantages for lax home teams?

mountainred


The folks at lacrosse reference say Cornell has the most efficient offense in the sport but that they take their time on offense. I'll take that over forcing a shot to make the EMO look better. I don't feel like going back through the p-b-p's but there are probably a bunch of EMO chances that came up "empty" but the Red kept possession and scored later in the possession at even strength. The impact -- +1 good guys -- is the same.

And on the man down defense, it really isn't a season long issue. 11 of the 16 man down goals came in three games (Dartmouth, Harvard, Lehigh). It's not like they are giving up 3 man down goals a game.

Cornell is 45th in the country in man down defense. Duke is 10th. Yale is 36th.

[www.ncaa.com]

Lot of good stats on this site.

Another interesting article by Lacrosse Reference on Cornell's offense. The upshot is that the BR are good, not great, on possessions of 30 seconds or less; elite in the 30-60 second range; and best in the nation in possessions over a minute. This offense isn't designed to score quickly but to maximize each possession.

And while I've seen first hand how a statistical argument can go off the rails at Elynah, here's my take on the man down defense. Yeah, 45th isn't good, but even this late in the season we're talking about a pretty small sample size. Remove just the Harvard game (5 goals surrendered on 7 man up situations) and Cornell is flirting with the the top 20 and man down D is a "strength." The Harvard game counts, of course, but when a single bad game makes that much of a difference, the numbers are pretty wonky.

mountainred
Another interesting article by Lacrosse Reference on Cornell's offense. The upshot is that the BR are good, not great, on possessions of 30 seconds or less; elite in the 30-60 second range; and best in the nation in possessions over a minute. This offense isn't designed to score quickly but to maximize each possession.

And while I've seen first hand how a statistical argument can go off the rails at Elynah, here's my take on the man down defense. Yeah, 45th isn't good, but even this late in the season we're talking about a pretty small sample size. Remove just the Harvard game (5 goals surrendered on 7 man up situations) and Cornell is flirting with the the top 20 and man down D is a "strength." The Harvard game counts, of course, but when a single bad game makes that much of a difference, the numbers are pretty wonky.

Facts, facts, facts! Enough with these facts!

I think the big variable is just taking too many penalties.. But it can be argued as well that being aggressive is stopping goals and maybe stopping more chances that are allowed by being a man down.

also under .30 second possession stats can be hard to view.. is it from quick change scores, fast break scores, EMO scores, out of Timeout scores?

you know over 60 sec possessions are not from penalty possessions and they are the same for the most part for all teams.

its interesting to me that the team that has the best offense and maybe the toughest guy to defend and has not had more EMO chances.. look at albany at 57 chances.

mountainred
Another interesting article by Lacrosse Reference on Cornell's offense. The upshot is that the BR are good, not great, on possessions of 30 seconds or less; elite in the 30-60 second range; and best in the nation in possessions over a minute. This offense isn't designed to score quickly but to maximize each possession.

And while I've seen first hand how a statistical argument can go off the rails at Elynah, here's my take on the man down defense. Yeah, 45th isn't good, but even this late in the season we're talking about a pretty small sample size. Remove just the Harvard game (5 goals surrendered on 7 man up situations) and Cornell is flirting with the the top 20 and man down D is a "strength." The Harvard game counts, of course, but when a single bad game makes that much of a difference, the numbers are pretty wonky.

This is a really interesting analysis, but it requires more thought. It emphasizes the standpoint of a defensive coordinator preparing to face quick-scoring vs slow-scoring teams. But here are a few thoughts I'd add to the mix.

• Whether a team tries to score quickly or not depends on the game situation. If an elite team plays several cupcakes, then it's likely to open up substantial leads, which will then lead to running time off the clock before attempting a shot and (because of the opponent's weakness) often scoring. In other words, there's a correlation between a team's schedule and the distribution of scoring efficiency by time of possession. It would therefore be helpful to break down these scoring efficiency ratings by "even strength," "close," "ahead," "behind," etc., as is done in advanced hockey metrics.
• A team that's able to score largely by taking over a minute to set up a high-percentage shot has a severe liability. It will be ineffective in most EMO situations, which are a minute or less, and it will be severely handicapped when it finds itself behind in a game against a comparable team.
• It follows that a good offensive coordinator needs to train for both approaches to offense. A championship team needs to train to score quickly, to take longer but set up high-percentage shots, and to run off clock without sacrificing good scoring chances.

Swampy
This is a really interesting analysis, but it requires more thought. It emphasizes the standpoint of a defensive coordinator preparing to face quick-scoring vs slow-scoring teams. But here are a few thoughts I'd add to the mix.

• Whether a team tries to score quickly or not depends on the game situation. If an elite team plays several cupcakes, then it's likely to open up substantial leads, which will then lead to running time off the clock before attempting a shot and (because of the opponent's weakness) often scoring. In other words, there's a correlation between a team's schedule and the distribution of scoring efficiency by time of possession. It would therefore be helpful to break down these scoring efficiency ratings by "even strength," "close," "ahead," "behind," etc., as is done in advanced hockey metrics.
• A team that's able to score largely by taking over a minute to set up a high-percentage shot has a severe liability. It will be ineffective in most EMO situations, which are a minute or less, and it will be severely handicapped when it finds itself behind in a game against a comparable team.
• It follows that a good offensive coordinator needs to train for both approaches to offense. A championship team needs to train to score quickly, to take longer but set up high-percentage shots, and to run off clock without sacrificing good scoring chances.

Good point. Dominant football teams often gains lots of yards rushing. Because they're ahead and want to wind down the clock. Doesn't mean rushing is the best way to score points.

In the case of dominant Cornell lacrosse (didn't want to cause confusion with Cornell football), Cornell has the sense it's on the way to victory so it takes a 2-minute possession and works for a good shot.

Interesting factoid from Inside Lacrosse's preview of Saturday's game:

"Jeff Teat and Michael Sowers are currently first and second in the nation, scoring 6.69 and 6.58 points per game. If the season were to end while you’re reading this article for some reason, Teat’s average would be the second highest in D1 since 1992, only Lyle Thompson’s 7.11 in 2014 checking in above the sophomore from Ontario."

Imagine if we hadnt had huge leads in the 3rd about 4 times.. have to think he scores 4-5 more pts. 6 more would do it.

8.5 over the next 4 games would get him on top of that total by thompson.. pretty tall order.

Princeton is playing a great defensive game. Their goalie is also making terrific saves. In my opinion, this is a good experience for Cornell. This is the kind of game they'll have to play and win from here on out. We'll see if the coaches can make some adjustments at the half to get more balls in the net.

I love this team, and I know their place in the tournament was secured, but I'm very disappointed in how they came out in the second half. Teat in particular did not rise to the challenge of that freshman defender. He should have made it his personal mission to embarrass him, but instead made ill-advised passes in front of the goal and became frustrated. That defensiveman scored more goals that Teat did. Princeton has given future teams the road map to defeat our offense: blanket and frustrate Teat because a lot of the offense goes through him. I hope Cornell uses this game as an opportunity to work on making teams pay the price if they use this defensive strategy in the future.

Friday, May 4, Columbia's Robert K. Kraft Field at Lawrence A. Wein Stadium (i.e. the very northern tip of Manhattan, there is both parking and subway)
6 pm, #1 Yale vs. #4 Penn (Yale won 12-6 at home March 31)
8:30 p.m., #2 Cornell vs. #3 Brown (Cornell won 19-5 at home April 21)

Championship Sunday 12 noon. No consolation game.

Winner gets NCAA autobid. Cornell w/o winning the title is on the bubble. No other Ivy team [edit add: than Yale, again #1 in the polls] is likely to qualify as an at-large.

Details: [www.gocolumbialions.com]

billhoward
No other Ivy team is likely to qualify as an at-large.

You mean other than Yale, right? The doggies have to be safely in.

A win over Brown and a loss to Yale will make for a very nervous Sunday night.

Cornell's loss to Princeton drops Cornell from 6th to 9th in the weekly media poll. Yale remains #1. [www.insidelacrosse.com]

USILA has Cornell 10th down from 8th [www.usila.org]

Quint Kessenich drops Cornell to #11 in his personal rankings in [www.insidelacrosse.com]

Kessenich
An inexplicable loss to Princeton on Saturday puts their NCAA bid in jeopardy. In my eyes, the Big Red are on the bubble and have work to do. Who is Princeton defender George Baughan? And how did he neutralize Cornell's Jeff Teat?

Their resume includes four losses: Colgate, Albany, Yale and Princeton. Wins are over Penn State, Penn, Syracuse and Lehigh. RPI of 16 is not good. The Big Red face Brown in the Ivy League semifinals on Friday night on ESPNU.

billhoward
Cornell's loss to Princeton drops Cornell from 6th to 9th in the weekly media poll. Yale remains #1. [www.insidelacrosse.com]

Quint Kessenich drops Cornell to #11 in his personal rankings in [www.insidelacrosse.com]

Kessenich
An inexplicable loss to Princeton on Saturday puts their NCAA bid in jeopardy. In my eyes, the Big Red are on the bubble and have work to do. Who is Princeton defender George Baughan? And how did he neutralize Cornell's Jeff Teat?

Their resume includes four losses: Colgate, Albany, Yale and Princeton. Wins are over Penn State, Penn, Syracuse and Lehigh. RPI of 16 is not good. The Big Red face Brown in the Ivy League semifinals on Friday night on ESPNU.

I think the Colgate loss was due to a combination of Ivy League rules making us start late and lack of a real indoor practice facility. Depending on how things turn out, this may be a good argument for scheduling a real cupcake for the first game. Colgate is not going to win the NC, but neither is it in the same shape as USAFA or Bingo.

How big, how fancy should this practice field be? Should we jump the other Ivies and build one with with seating for 2500 and the inflated fabric roof high enough for soccer kicks, or a lacrosse up-in-the-air heave to run out the last 3 seconds against Syracuse? Have inflatable dome fields ever won an architectural award?

billhoward
How big, how fancy should this practice field be? Should we jump the other Ivies and build one with with seating for 2500 and the inflated fabric roof high enough for soccer kicks, or a lacrosse up-in-the-air heave to run out the last 3 seconds against Syracuse? Have inflatable dome fields ever won an architectural award?

I'll bet there is nothing in the rules barring a zero gravity field.

billhoward
Have inflatable dome fields ever won an architectural award?

Close.

billhoward
How big, how fancy should this practice field be? Should we jump the other Ivies and build one with with seating for 2500 and the inflated fabric roof high enough for soccer kicks, or a lacrosse up-in-the-air heave to run out the last 3 seconds against Syracuse? Have inflatable dome fields ever won an architectural award?

Back in the days of yore, we used to play box lacrosse on the field in Bartels. I assume it's still there.

Trotsky

billhoward
How big, how fancy should this practice field be? Should we jump the other Ivies and build one with with seating for 2500 and the inflated fabric roof high enough for soccer kicks, or a lacrosse up-in-the-air heave to run out the last 3 seconds against Syracuse? Have inflatable dome fields ever won an architectural award?

I'll bet there is nothing in the rules barring a zero gravity field.

To hell with a dome. Let's build one in a salt mine.

billhoward
How big, how fancy should this practice field be? Should we jump the other Ivies and build one with with seating for 2500 and the inflated fabric roof high enough for soccer kicks, or a lacrosse up-in-the-air heave to run out the last 3 seconds against Syracuse? Have inflatable dome fields ever won an architectural award?

Start by looking at the ones mentioned here.

Soccer team practices way out behind East Hill Plaza now. Why not build something way out there? Cheap land and kinda hidden if it’s appearance is an issue for some.

CU2007
Soccer team practices way out behind East Hill Plaza now. Why not build something way out there? Cheap land and kinda hidden if it’s appearance is an issue for some.

If Cornell owns the land already, there's zero marginal cost to acquire the land. But you're probably right, there's a shadow price reflecting the accessibility and usefulness of a spot for various uses, such as classes, libraries, etc.

The only downside I can think of for having a facility distant from the existing athletic complex has to do with the team also needing to practice outdoors. One might commit any fall practice and February to an indoor facility, but by March there will be some days to stay inside and others to go outside. Even in the fall and March, there will be a need to be outside, e.g. to prepare for upcoming outdoor games. In such situations one would like the team to have permanent lockers near wherever it's practicing and to allow the coaches to decide on the spur of the moment, depending on weather, to go indoors or outside.

Teat, Pulver and Dowiak earn first-team All-Ivy League selections.

I HATE this strategy of having Teat off to the side and playing five on five. Teat should work and get the ball and score. He should rise the to the challenge.

mike1960
I HATE this strategy of having Teat off to the side and playing five on five. Teat should work and get the ball and score. He should rise the to the challenge.

We just look impotent with Teat sealed off. With a week to prepare, we look completely unprepared.

Al DeFlorio

mike1960
I HATE this strategy of having Teat off to the side and playing five on five. Teat should work and get the ball and score. He should rise the to the challenge.

We just look impotent with Teat sealed off. With a week to prepare, we look completely unprepared.

Good heavens, have our great middies drive the alley and make Teat's man slide.

Cornell tentative, unsettled on the clear. Not playing with confidence at all. Playing scared.

Kevin Reisman seems to have helped Luca Tria at face off. Christian has been really good. Overall the defense has played mistake-free, aggressive defense. FINALLY, Teat gets the ball, is immediately doubled, so someone is wide open. That's a recipe for goals, esp. with Teat's passing skills.

mike1960
Kevin Reisman seems to have helped Luca Tria at face off. Christian has been really good. Overall the defense has played mistake-free, aggressive defense. FINALLY, Teat gets the ball, is immediately doubled, so someone is wide open. That's a recipe for goals, esp. with Teat's passing skills.

But if he gets the ball only twice a half...

Al DeFlorio

mike1960
Kevin Reisman seems to have helped Luca Tria at face off. Christian has been really good. Overall the defense has played mistake-free, aggressive defense. FINALLY, Teat gets the ball, is immediately doubled, so someone is wide open. That's a recipe for goals, esp. with Teat's passing skills.

But if he gets the ball only twice a half...

Let him pick up the ball off the end lines. Set hard off-ball picks for him. A face guard can't see the off-ball picks. As I typed before, have big Connor Fletcher drive the alley in his direction and force his man to slide. There are many ways. Most important, in my view, challenge him to be the best player on the field.

Clearing mistake again, 5-2.

Congratulations to Yale, your 2018 Ivy League men's lacrosse tournament champions.

Fabulous neutral location. Nice all-Cornell pre-game $10 tailgate (not announced until midday Thursday - we knew we were playing at Columbia in 8:30 game 10 days earlier). Great weather around 80 at gametime.

As for the game: Teat was faceguarded all game by Brown's #91, Michael Brown (like Teat a sophomore, so this could be repeated). Nobody in the stands could figure out why Teat didn't just break free, or at least be the guy inbounding the ball, or something. Maybe Cornell figure its offense could beat brown 5x5 as opposed to 6x6.

Brown outshot Cornell 42-32. Christian Knight was really good in goal, 19 saves (82%). Not on the scoresheet is how many loose ball pushes were called against Cornell and how many other close calls went Brown's way including penalties against Cornell. Brown was 2x3 on EMO, Cornell 0x1.

The score should have been 9-3, or 9-2 if you believe one of the penalties against Cornell was bogus. Brown scored an essentially empty-net goal when Knight, away from the cage, made a bad clearing pass. Cornell missed a Q4 point blank shot on a nice feed from Teat which if went would have given him 1G, 3A. The score also could have been Brown 8, Cornell 7 if Knight didn't come through.

If Belichick was coaching (the game was a Robert Kraft Stadium), there would have been more significant halftime adjustments.

Yale blew out Penn 21-6 in the first game, allowing only two second half goals. Cornell has its work cut out.

billhoward


Brown outshot Cornell 42-32. Christian Knight was really good in goal, 19 saves (82%). Not on the scoresheet is how many loose ball pushes were called against Cornell and how many other close calls went Brown's way including penalties against Cornell. Brown was 2x3 on EMO, Cornell 0x1.

Watching the tv broadcast, I saw a few close/questionable calls on out-of-bounds plays (one closer to the line/out of bounds call was very questionable) and maybe a couple of calls/non-calls during loose ball scrums. But the egregious call was the personal foul, illegal body check, 1 minute non-releasable against Cornell. That was not an illegal body check.

Speaking of out of bounds, that reminds me of those two hustle plays by Bobby Knight getting to the end line for possession. Great great plays.

After I read the nine in-game posts from May 4 in this thread, I assumed we lost.

RichH
After I read the nine in-game posts from May 4 in this thread, I assumed we lost.

Well, we didn't crush them so hard their ancestors wept, so in fairness, it was a little short of expectations.

Beeeej

RichH
After I read the nine in-game posts from May 4 in this thread, I assumed we lost.

Well, we didn't crush them so hard their ancestors wept, so in fairness, it was a little short of expectations.

For the first twenty minutes, it looked like Princeton redux. No offense without Teat. Fortunately, Brown has no offense, period. With everyone.

RichH
After I read the nine in-game posts from May 4 in this thread, I assumed we lost.

In my opinion, we did lose -- maybe not the game, but potentially something more important. You never tell your best player to stand on the side while your team battles without him. It's demoralizing.

mike1960

RichH
After I read the nine in-game posts from May 4 in this thread, I assumed we lost.

In my opinion, we did lose -- maybe not the game, but potentially something more important. You never tell your best player to stand on the side while your team battles without him. It's demoralizing.

I trust the Daily Sun, or Ithaca Journal if it's covering Cornell lax this year, will ask that question. It may be we don't understand Cornell's winning tactics. But then there's also the emperor's new clothes theory. All is forgiven if we make the tournament and our first game.

mike1960

RichH
After I read the nine in-game posts from May 4 in this thread, I assumed we lost.

In my opinion, we did lose -- maybe not the game, but potentially something more important. You never tell your best player to stand on the side while your team battles without him. It's demoralizing.

Wait, what happened?

BearLover

mike1960

RichH
After I read the nine in-game posts from May 4 in this thread, I assumed we lost.

In my opinion, we did lose -- maybe not the game, but potentially something more important. You never tell your best player to stand on the side while your team battles without him. It's demoralizing.

Wait, what happened?

A Brown long pole faceguarded Teat, so we completely gave in to Brown's strategy by having Teat stand at the midline while the rest of the team played 5 on 5 against a zone (outside shots against the best goalie in the Ivies). We took one of the best players in the country out of play because of a simple faceguard.

Imagine asking Paul Rabil or Paul Gait or Casey Powell to park near the midline because he was faceguarded. Imagine their response.

I feel like if it ended in a W they'd be fine.

The Sun Says basically the same things.

The Red’s star player sophomore attack Jeff Teat was a non-factor for much of the game, as Brown defenseman Michael Brown held the Ontario native to just three points.

“I think we did a good job just playing without [Teat],” Petterson said. “Obviously he’s one of the best players in the country, so it’s going to be tough to get the goals up there without being able to utilize him.”

The Red responded by having Teat lead his defender away from the play, leaving the offense in a five-on-five situation for much of the first half.

“We went to five on five to create more space for us,” Petterson said. “If Jeff and the person that’s locking him off are standing there in the middle, it kind of clogs things up for us a bit … [But] the principles of our offense stay the same. We stay disciplined, we try to work for the best shot.”

Maybe the coach thought the team could win like this and wanted to guard his plans for getting Teat free until the team is playing Yale?

Or maybe all the talk of removing the “Interim” tag mid season was premature after all?

RichH
After I read the nine in-game posts from May 4 in this thread, I assumed we lost.

Remember, on this forum you have to translate every post from Angry Old Man before you read it.

JasonN95
Maybe the coach thought the team could win like this and wanted to guard his plans for getting Teat free until the team is playing Yale?

I hope he didn't think this way. Cornell could easily have lost that game. In the fourth, they were up only 6-4, facing a non-releasable 1-minute penalty and two timeouts. Season on the line.

#2 seed (in the league) Johns Hopkins beats #1 seed Maryland 13-10 for the Big Ten title. Maryland controlled the last 2 minutes of play and did a very nice job of passing the ball around without getting many shots off. Finally got goal 10 with :07 left. Hopkins led by a very-well-fed-looking Pietramala, Cornell coach 1998-2000, Maryland by John Tillman '91. Big Ten announcers said not to worry about Maryland because the Terps save their best lacrosse for May. Sure. They won the NCAA tournament last year and then the previous one was 1975. 3-12 in NCAA title games. They believe Maryland still gets the 1-seed in the tournament draw.

Others:
CAA - UMass over Towson
Big East, Georgetown over Denver (#3 USILA poll)
NEC, Robbie Morris over St Jospeh
MAAC, Canisius over Detroit Mercy

Georgetown was #18 in the polls and probably would not have made it to the NCAAs without the win. Denver will grab one of the at large spots. So that is one less spot should Cornell need at an-large bid. Cornell was 12 in RPI going into the Brown game.

If Cornell loses to Yale, it's going to be very tight for an at-large bid. Here are the final RPI numbers, assuming Yale beats Cornell and Duke beats BU (the only other remaining game):

1. Maryland 0.6546
2. Albany 0.6467 AQ
3. Yale 0.6428 AQ
4. Johns Hopkins 0.6351 AQ
5. Notre Dame 0.6292
6. Duke 0.6287
7. Loyola 0.6257 AQ
8. Denver 0.6044
9. Virginia 0.5863
10. Syracuse 0.5842
11. Villanova 0.5782
12. Penn 0.5771 ineligible
13. Georgetown 0.5755 AQ
14. Cornell 0.5729
15. Rutgers 0.5707
16. Bucknell 0.5687
17. Navy 0.5604
18. Ohio State 0.5594
19. Robert Morris 0.5579 AQ
20. Vermont 0.5533

If we go by straight RPI, #14 Cornell would be the last at-large team. But Bucknell has wins over #3 Yale (at Yale) and over #7 Loyola. Cornell's best win is over #10 Syracuse, and (in this scenario) they will have lost twice to Yale, at home and at a neutral field. So Bucknell could well get the nod.

CU77
3

If we go by straight RPI, #14 Cornell would be the last at-large team. But Bucknell has wins over #3 Yale (at Yale) and over #7 Loyola. Cornell's best win is over #10 Syracuse, and (in this scenario) they will have lost twice to Yale, at home and at a neutral field. So Bucknell could well get the nod.

Bucknell lost to Richmond, Navy, Penn, and Boston U. Yes, they beat Yale and Loyola, but those losses . . .

Looking on the bright side: a win over Yale would not only secure the AQ, but also move Cornell all the way up to #9 in RPI, which would open up the possibility of a home game. I can see Cornell, with their wins over #6 Yale and #10 Cuse, getting the nod for a home game over #8 Denver, whose best win is over #12 Nova in this scenario.

CU77
Looking on the bright side: a win over Yale would not only secure the AQ, but also move Cornell all the way up to #9 in RPI, which would open up the possibility of a home game. I can see Cornell, with their wins over #6 Yale and #10 Cuse, getting the nod for a home game over #8 Denver, whose best win is over #12 Nova in this scenario.

Our defense and goalie are playing outstanding lacrosse. If the O can get back in rhythm and light it up, I really like our chances tomorrow!

End of the first quarter. Great game! Both teams are playing well. One thought: Double Reeves! Make him a passer at least. Those goals are too easy.

Score updates?

KenP
Score updates?

Cornell is up 6-5at the half

Cornell now up 12-6

Congrats to the 2018 Ivy League Lacrosse Champions: The Big Red of Cornell University!

ugarte
Congrats to the 2018 Ivy League Lacrosse Champions: The Big Red of Cornell University!

That was beautiful. So many great performances today, especially Christian Knight in goal. Congrats to this wonderful team!

ugarte
Congrats to the 2018 Ivy League Lacrosse Champions: The Big Red of Cornell University!

Ivy League Lacrosse Tournament champions

Ivy champsionhip game: 14-8 Cornell thanks to a 9-1 run after a 6-5 halftime lead. Big Red no longer on the tournament bubble. Fabulous game on D all around and especially by Christian Knight. He wasn't doing bupkes a couple games back, maybe slow injury recovery, now it's great he stuck around for this year.

NCAA no longer can screw Cornell out of a tournament berth. Maybe send us on the road to Denver?

Cornell got scoring from 12 players including Jake Pulver into an open net from behind midfield, Yale from 4. Ben Reeves was 5-0--5; Jeff Teat for was 1-5--6. Yale goalie Jack Starr was 2x16, or 12.5%. (See Sieve.) Tournament MVP Christian Knight was 16x24, 66.7%, following Friday's 19x23.

Attendance was reported at 2609 following Friday's 2454. The Big Ten final at Michigan drew about 1,200. Columbia is a nice place for the tournament, sort of like the Switzerland of lacrosse. <Insert punchline about all the bankers in both places.>

SCORE BY PERIOD	1	2	3	4	FINAL
 
Cornell	3	3	2	6	14
Yale	3	2	1	2	8

Cornell SCORING: GOALS: Colton Rupp 2 ; Jonathan Donville 1 ; Jake Mcculloch 1 ; Matt Licciardi 1 ; Jordan Dowiak 2 ; Connor Fletcher 1 ; Jake Pulver 1 ; Clarke Petterson 3 ; Brandon Salvatore 1 ; Jeff Teat 1 . 
ASSISTS: Jake Mcculloch 1 ; John Piatelli 1 ; Cooper Telesco 1 ; Clarke Petterson 1 ; Jeff Teat 5 .

Yale SCORING: GOALS: Ben Reeves 5 ; Tyler Warner 1 ; Jackson Morrill 1 ; Jack Tigh 1 . 
ASSISTS: Jackson Morrill 1 .

SHOTS BY PERIOD	1	2	3	4	TOTAL
 
Cornell	7	5	3	7	22
Yale	10	8	5	12	35

GROUND BALLS BY PRD	1	2	3	4	TOTAL
 
Cornell	6	2	7	11	26
Yale	5	9	7	9	30

FACE-OFFS BY PRD	1	2	3	4	TOTAL
 
Cornell	3-7	1-6	2-4	4-9	10-26
Yale	4-7	5-6	2-4	5-9	16-26

CLEARS	1	2	3	4	TOTAL
 
Cornell	1-1	6-6	3-6	9-9	19-22
Yale	2-2	4-4	5-6	5-6	16-18


SAVES BY PERIOD	1	2	3	4	TOTAL
 
Cornell	3	6	2	5	16
Yale	0	1	0	1	2

TURNOVERS BY PRD	1	2	3	4	TOTAL
 
Cornell	2	3	7	5	17
Yale	1	3	4	3	11 

Wonder if an interim coach has ever been coach of the year?