Odds that Donahue stays?

cth95

Jordan 04

YankeeLobo

Jordan 04
So we can be reminded how badly the Lobos got routed?

I already acknowledged that on another thread.

Oh, so we shouldn't mention it incessantly for the next 2 months like a loss to Penn?

Considering the Lobos' early flameout, maybe they should be looking for a new coach.

Seeing that it would be a step backwards for him, I highly doubt Donahue would be interested though.

LOL yeah, Donahue would definitely not jump at the opportunity to make over $1 million a year and live in one of the best climates in the country : )

YankeeLobo

cth95

Jordan 04

YankeeLobo

Jordan 04
So we can be reminded how badly the Lobos got routed?

I already acknowledged that on another thread.

Oh, so we shouldn't mention it incessantly for the next 2 months like a loss to Penn?

Considering the Lobos' early flameout, maybe they should be looking for a new coach.

Seeing that it would be a step backwards for him, I highly doubt Donahue would be interested though.

LOL yeah, Donahue would definitely not jump at the opportunity to make over $1 million a year and live in one of the best climates in the country : )

You just confirmed the reason for many of our responses to your posts. Notice the ?

Personally, I would rather live in Ithaca. I have been to New Mexico. It is very pretty, but it is too hot in the summer and there is not much variation in the seasons. Once it gets to about Thanksgiving, I like to see snow until almost April. I live in Vermont now, which is colder than Ithaca but a little less cloudy in the winter. As nice as it is out west, there is just something about the green we have in the northeast that seems more vibrant too me. The brown in arid regions gets old. Granted my preference is different than most, but maybe Donahue feels the same way.

Not even going to bother...

Re: Donahue, I think it's a moot point anyway. I'm not a huge fan of Alford, but most UNM fans are in love with the guy and I think he'll be here for a while. He has done wonders with the program, but he also did wonders at Iowa for a couple years before things headed South. We'll see.

YankeeLobo
Re: Donahue, I think it's a moot point anyway. I'm not a huge fan of Alford, but most UNM fans are in love with the guy and I think he'll be here for a while. He has done wonders with the program, but he also did wonders at Iowa for a couple years before things headed South. We'll see.

My earlier post was a joke, hence the smiley face.

I was also just playing devil's advocate about New Mexico. It is actually one of my favorite places in the country. You seem to take a lot of things a little too seriously.

I just happen to like very green summers (I do live in the Green Mountain State) in which the temperature doesn't get much above 80 with rain some days and sun others. I hope for the right balance for crops to grow and enjoy not having to rely on irrigation while praying the aquifers and rivers won't be dry in 50 years. I also like having snowbanks along my sidewalk and driveway, snowshoeing and crosscountry skiing in the fields and trails near my house, skating on outdoor ponds, and having at least 10 ski areas within 2 hours of my house.

Believe it or not, One of my favorite things is going out and walking around on a cold, still night with the moon shining off the snow so brightly that I don't even need a light to walk around. A full moon on a good snowpack is bright enough to go hiking up a mountain without a headlamp. The best nights are those still, clear nights when the temperature is below zero, the snow squeaks under your feet, and you can feel the hairs freezing in your nose.

cth95

YankeeLobo
Re: Donahue, I think it's a moot point anyway. I'm not a huge fan of Alford, but most UNM fans are in love with the guy and I think he'll be here for a while. He has done wonders with the program, but he also did wonders at Iowa for a couple years before things headed South. We'll see.

My earlier post was a joke, hence the smiley face.

I was also just playing devil's advocate about New Mexico. It is actually one of my favorite places in the country. You seem to take a lot of things a little too seriously.

I just happen to like very green summers (I do live in the Green Mountain State) in which the temperature doesn't get much above 80 with rain some days and sun others. I hope for the right balance for crops to grow and enjoy not having to rely on irrigation while praying the aquifers and rivers won't be dry in 50 years. I also like having snowbanks along my sidewalk and driveway, snowshoeing and crosscountry skiing in the fields and trails near my house, skating on outdoor ponds, and having at least 10 ski areas within 2 hours of my house.

Believe it or not, One of my favorite things is going out and walking around on a cold, still night with the moon shining off the snow so brightly that I don't even need a light to walk around. A full moon on a good snowpack is bright enough to go hiking up a mountain without a headlamp. The best nights are those still, clear nights when the temperature is below zero, the snow squeaks under your feet, and you can feel the hairs freezing in your nose.

My post was as well, it also had a smiley face. I don't understand the love for Ithaca though. I spent 4 years there and me and most of my friends would not want to endure another winter in upstate New York. Personal preference I guess!

Thanks for the equally descriptive response

Vermont's really nice too. Has the same problem as New Mexico though, not enough going on there for a younger person to spend too much of his 20s there unless settling for a lower salary, like I'm currently doing in New Mexico.

yankeelobo
My post was as well, it also had a smiley face. I don't understand the love for Ithaca though. I spent 4 years there and me and most of my friends would not want to endure another winter in upstate New York. Personal preference I guess!

Thanks for the equally descriptive response

The problem with Ithaca is that it is not cold enough. Central NY is also too cloudy from October through April since you get constant moisture coming off of Lake Ontario. Sleet and freezing rain suck.

If the temperature stays below freezing almost the entire winter, most of the precipitation will be snow and you can stay dry when you go outside. Snow-covered ground is pretty, while bare ground in winter is just bleak and depressing. You can also find many ways to play in snow. It is not much fun to do things outdoors when it is damp with temps between 30 and 45. Cold, sunny days can be very pretty and refreshing. Cold, cloudy days are ok, but they get old after awhile. If I had to live any further south than I do, I would probably move to the southwest.

I grew up in SE Connecticut where a normal winter day is in the high 30's. I love that area, but I can't stand the winters. The 10 degree days here feel warmer than the 30 degree days near the ocean where I grew up, because it is very difficult to keep the dampness from seeping through your clothes.

Al DeFlorio

jeff '84
From the post game press conference:

(Could you describe the moment afterwards going into the crowd and being with your family? I don't know who the guy was
that you hugged, I assume he was the athletic director at Cornell?)

“Yeah, that's Andy Noel, who stood by our program for the first seven, eight years when we really didn't do much (tearing up)
and had great belief in what we were doing. It doesn't happen a lot in college basketball in particular that someone sticks by a
coach for this long, and I'm very fortunate that I was able to reward him for all of his patience.”

Video of the entire post-game Cornell press conference is here: [ivybbn.com]

Worthwhile viewing just to see the emotion with which Donahue spoke the above quote.

Thanks Al, I was looking for that before bed last night.

Al DeFlorio

jeff '84
From the post game press conference:

(Could you describe the moment afterwards going into the crowd and being with your family? I don't know who the guy was
that you hugged, I assume he was the athletic director at Cornell?)

“Yeah, that's Andy Noel, who stood by our program for the first seven, eight years when we really didn't do much (tearing up)
and had great belief in what we were doing. It doesn't happen a lot in college basketball in particular that someone sticks by a
coach for this long, and I'm very fortunate that I was able to reward him for all of his patience.”

Video of the entire post-game Cornell press conference is here: [ivybbn.com]

Worthwhile viewing just to see the emotion with which Donahue spoke the above quote.

That was nice to see. Thanks for posting the link, Al.

Al DeFlorio

jeff '84
From the post game press conference:

(Could you describe the moment afterwards going into the crowd and being with your family? I don't know who the guy was
that you hugged, I assume he was the athletic director at Cornell?)

“Yeah, that's Andy Noel, who stood by our program for the first seven, eight years when we really didn't do much (tearing up)
and had great belief in what we were doing. It doesn't happen a lot in college basketball in particular that someone sticks by a
coach for this long, and I'm very fortunate that I was able to reward him for all of his patience.”

Video of the entire post-game Cornell press conference is here: [ivybbn.com]

Worthwhile viewing just to see the emotion with which Donahue spoke the above quote.

Indeed - thanks!

Al DeFlorio

jeff '84
From the post game press conference:

(Could you describe the moment afterwards going into the crowd and being with your family? I don't know who the guy was
that you hugged, I assume he was the athletic director at Cornell?)

“Yeah, that's Andy Noel, who stood by our program for the first seven, eight years when we really didn't do much (tearing up)
and had great belief in what we were doing. It doesn't happen a lot in college basketball in particular that someone sticks by a
coach for this long, and I'm very fortunate that I was able to reward him for all of his patience.”

Video of the entire post-game Cornell press conference is here: [ivybbn.com]

Worthwhile viewing just to see the emotion with which Donahue spoke the above quote.

Like everyone else, Al, thanks. But now you got me thinking. Are any schools out there looking for a new AD AND a new coach? Would any dump their AD to land a targeted coach? Maybe this thread should be titled "Odds that Donahue & Noel stay."

Apparently St. John's offered Billy Donovan $3 million a year, and he turned it down.

Willy '06
Apparently St. John's offered Billy Donovan $3 million a year, and he turned it down.

Is that one of the entry level jobs you are offering? I'll take it!

No, but we can give you the position as an unpaid internship with the possibility of a transition to a permanent position in 12-18 months.

Willy '06
Apparently St. John's offered Billy Donovan $3 million a year, and he turned it down.

Isn't that "tampering" if its done during the season, or is there no such thing in college sports?

Trotsky

Willy '06
Apparently St. John's offered Billy Donovan $3 million a year, and he turned it down.

Isn't that "tampering" if its done during the season, or is there no such thing in college sports?

Florida's season is over.

Found a great blog post on the NCAA Hoops Head Coach Meat Market

[thesportseconomist.com]

Willy '06
Found a great blog post on the NCAA Hoops Head Coach Meat Market

[thesportseconomist.com]

"At St. John’s, they’re not getting certain types of players because they’re doing things the right way.”

They made great sport of this on WFAN. Essentially, St. John's fired its coach for being ethical.

Trotsky

Willy '06
Found a great blog post on the NCAA Hoops Head Coach Meat Market

[thesportseconomist.com]

"At St. John’s, they’re not getting certain types of players because they’re doing things the right way.”

They made great sport of this on WFAN. Essentially, St. John's fired its coach for being ethical.

I read that in the Daily News and gagged. The good news is that this probably means Donahue is a poor fit for SJU, though $3 million can buy a whole lot of ethical flexibility. As we just learned, though, $3.5 million buys even more.

Trotsky

Willy '06
Found a great blog post on the NCAA Hoops Head Coach Meat Market

[thesportseconomist.com]

"At St. John’s, they’re not getting certain types of players because they’re doing things the right way.”

They made great sport of this on WFAN. Essentially, St. John's fired its coach for being ethical.

They fired him because he didn't win games. I would say the majority of university administrations don't care how you win as long as you win, it's basically a Don't Ask, Don't Tell policy and that goes for college fooball and basketball. Think about it, Kentucky hired John Calipari for God's sake! A guy who has had 80 wins and 2 final fours vacated! They don't care about ethics, in fact they like guys like Calipari because they HAVE the connections to all the crooked people that pay off kids to go to their schools.

There's big money at stake in both sports, so naturally human beings are going to do unethical things to get their hands on it. It's the same reason why handing the government the power to spend trillions of dollars is akin to asking for politicians to be crooked, their $150K salary isn't enough to satisfy their greed or their ill-gotten lifestyle, the same way it's tough for a poor high school basketball player to turn down $30K from a college booster. It's too easy to entice recruits with under the table offers that are a lot to them, but amount to peanuts in the big picture of college sports money.

Similar to politics, the only sure way to keep (crooked) money out of big time college sports is to take the money out of college sports (tickets, TV, endorsements). Horse, barn door, etc.

KeithK
Similar to politics, the only sure way to keep (crooked) money out of big time college sports is to take the money out of college sports (tickets, TV, endorsements). Horse, barn door, etc.

Taking the money out of politics makes sense, taking it out of sports doesn't. Sports is something people actually want and are willing to consume. Politics is the opposite, more of it = you have less to spend. One way to fix it is implementing massive penalties for breaking the rules - i.e. lifetime ban from the sport if you're proven to have violated the rules. I'm sure fewer baseball players would use HGH if they knew getting caught meant the end of their careers. Instead, they get a slap on the wrist. The performance increase from using it, and corresponding financial benefits, make it a smart economic decision to use it for many of them (i.e. Albert Pujols, do you really think the guy is clean?)

Provide people the right economic incentives/disincentives and, unless they're stupid, they act in accordance with the rules. Economics 101. Calipari should have been banned from coaching a long time ago.

The New York Times weighs in: [thequad.blogs.nytimes.com]

Here is a dumb question:

Why doesn't Cornell just offer Donahue a bigger salary next season?

The indirect financial benefit to Cornell by having a successful BBall program would more than make up for the cost.

YankeeLobo

KeithK
Similar to politics, the only sure way to keep (crooked) money out of big time college sports is to take the money out of college sports (tickets, TV, endorsements). Horse, barn door, etc.

Taking the money out of politics makes sense, taking it out of sports doesn't. Sports is something people actually want and are willing to consume. Politics is the opposite, more of it = you have less to spend. One way to fix it is implementing massive penalties for breaking the rules - i.e. lifetime ban from the sport if you're proven to have violated the rules. I'm sure fewer baseball players would use HGH if they knew getting caught meant the end of their careers. Instead, they get a slap on the wrist. The performance increase from using it, and corresponding financial benefits, make it a smart economic decision to use it for many of them (i.e. Albert Pujols, do you really think the guy is clean?)

Provide people the right economic incentives/disincentives and, unless they're stupid, they act in accordance with the rules. Economics 101. Calipari should have been banned from coaching a long time ago.

We could get money out of college athletics if schools decided to put athletics at the priority level that it is in D3. People would still be able to "consume" sports through professional leagues, where there's a lot less corruption because the owners are up front about the fact that they're doing it for the money.

I'm not saying that college sports should go all the way to a D3 philosophy, though as a supporter of the no scholarship rule in the Ivies I would prefer some movement in that direction. I just don't see it happening. Thus "Horse, barn door, etc.".

An analogy (sports/politics) doesn't have to be perfect to be instructive.

Mark Cannizzaro of the New York Post weighs in: [www.nypost.com]

Roy 82
Here is a dumb question:

Why doesn't Cornell just offer Donahue a bigger salary next season?

The indirect financial benefit to Cornell by having a successful BBall program would more than make up for the cost.

I have no doubt that Cornell will try to increase his salary to retain him. But it's not clear to me that there's a huge financial benefit. Are you increasing your annual giving because the team went to the sweet sixteen? If not, who is?

Cornell research has actually shown that increased winning for sports teams doesn't necessarily increase giving:

[www.johnson.cornell.edu]

mnagowski

Roy 82
Here is a dumb question:

Why doesn't Cornell just offer Donahue a bigger salary next season?

The indirect financial benefit to Cornell by having a successful BBall program would more than make up for the cost.

I have no doubt that Cornell will try to increase his salary to retain him. But it's not clear to me that there's a huge financial benefit. Are you increasing your annual giving because the team went to the sweet sixteen? If not, who is?

Cornell research has actually shown that increased winning for sports teams doesn't necessarily increase giving:

[www.johnson.cornell.edu]

By winning 2 games, Cornell has won $2.4 million for the Ivy League. That money is distributed to the member schools, though I'm not sure if it is distributed evenly or if there is a winner's bonus. There are a lot of ways to spend that money, but a competitive raise for the guy who earned it isn't a bad one.

At the same time, if it comes to a bidding war, an Ivy League school will lose. The Athletic Department budget, much less the budget for just basketball, isn't nearly as large as those in the major conferences. If you asked Andy Noel - who I'm sure wants to retain Donahue - if he would match a $2 million offer from St. John's, he would smile, decline and say "I hope he at least buys dinner when I'm in town to watch the hockey team at MSG."

Thanks, Al, for the Post article, which includes this quote:

Andy Noel
"I would be shocked if there weren't a lot of offers after this season because there were a lot of offers the past two seasons...I'm thrilled for Steve. He deserves attention he receives, but I certainly don't want to lose him. I'll do anything and everything in my power to make Cornell as attractive a job as it can possibly be for him with hopes he can stay many years and become the Pete Carril for Cornell.

So, at least we know that he's being selective and LIKES coaching Cornell. That's reassuring, but not totally reassuring because I think the offers this year will blow the last two years out of the water. That said, like Coach Donahue, I'm going to enjoy this run and not think about "replacements" until I hear that someone has stolen him away.

ugarte

mnagowski

Roy 82
Here is a dumb question:

Why doesn't Cornell just offer Donahue a bigger salary next season?

The indirect financial benefit to Cornell by having a successful BBall program would more than make up for the cost.

I have no doubt that Cornell will try to increase his salary to retain him. But it's not clear to me that there's a huge financial benefit. Are you increasing your annual giving because the team went to the sweet sixteen? If not, who is?

Cornell research has actually shown that increased winning for sports teams doesn't necessarily increase giving:

[www.johnson.cornell.edu]

By winning 2 games, Cornell has won $2.4 million for the Ivy League. That money is distributed to the member schools, though I'm not sure if it is distributed evenly or if there is a winner's bonus. There are a lot of ways to spend that money, but a competitive raise for the guy who earned it isn't a bad one."

My understanding is that the Ivy League doesn't give any of that money to its member schools. They keep it for their own staff salaries, etc.

[cornellsun.com]

The third component of income for Cornell Athletics is the financial payment that teams receive if they qualify for the NCAA basketball tournament. However, according to Quant, the Ivy League conference office keeps the payment to help fund operations. Cornell does not receive the extra money directly, whereas in other conferences the schools may benefit from the payments.

Although it might be different if you win a game or two.

mnagowski
My understanding is that the Ivy League doesn't give any of that money to its member schools. They keep it for their own staff salaries, etc.

[cornellsun.com]

The third component of income for Cornell Athletics is the financial payment that teams receive if they qualify for the NCAA basketball tournament. However, according to Quant, the Ivy League conference office keeps the payment to help fund operations. Cornell does not receive the extra money directly, whereas in other conferences the schools may benefit from the payments.

Although it might be different if you win a game or two.

Providence Journal article says the same: [www.projo.com]

Fordham apparently has offered Hofstra's Tom Pecora the job (as per ESPN), so that's one less place he could land.

scoop85
Fordham apparently has offered Hofstra's Tom Pecora the job (as per ESPN), so that's one less place he could land.

That is huge, I bet Donahue stays now, because that was the one place I could see him getting an offer from and accepting. None of these Big East schools like St Johns who offered Billy Donovan $3 mil or Depaul or Seton Hall will want Donahue since they are willing to offer too much money, they will want a bigger name guy.

This Sweet 16 run might be what keeps Donahue here because it kept him off the coaching market for an extra week

Northern Iowa just locked up their coach for 10 years.

[sports.espn.go.com]

Though giving may not increase due to team success, the purchasing of school branded merchandise and applications certainly increase and are direct sources of revenue to the school. I'm not sure how many t-shirts the school would have to sell to offset at $2m raise, but I'm sure someone with time can figure that number out...

Luke 05
Though giving may not increase due to team success, the purchasing of school branded merchandise and applications certainly increase and are direct sources of revenue to the school. I'm not sure how many t-shirts the school would have to sell to offset at $2m raise, but I'm sure someone with time can figure that number out...

If the T-shirts were free to make and sold for $15 then we're talking about 133,333 shirts. That's roughly one shirt for every two living Cornell alums.

Willy '06
Northern Iowa just locked up their coach for 10 years.

[sports.espn.go.com]

Eh, they signed a 10yr contract but there's a buyout clause in his contract that any Big 6 school could pay easily. He may not leave this year but if his success at UNI continues, there's no way he finishes that contract.

YankeeLobo

Willy '06
Northern Iowa just locked up their coach for 10 years.

[sports.espn.go.com]

Eh, they signed a 10yr contract but there's a buyout clause in his contract that any Big 6 school could pay easily. He may not leave this year but if his success at UNI continues, there's no way he finishes that contract.

I'm glad that somebody said this. The 10 year contract makes it expensive for UNI to fire him but not that expensive for Iowa State to steal him.

Maybe Caril can get this message to Donahue:

But Hall of Fame coach Pete Carril, who stayed at Princeton for 29 years instead of moving on to other opportunities, cautioned Donahue to be careful what he wishes for. "I had a chance to leave Princeton myself several times, and I thought a lot about the word happiness," he said. "You may get more money, you may get more prestige, you might be part of ESPN and all that, but, on the other hand, you've got an outstanding number of pressures that are hard to defend, and a system where the athletes aren't a part of the regular student body. "If he's a happy guy enjoys going to work every day and enjoys the team he coaches, that's a challenge right there," Carril added. "Especially the way the world is turning today, things are moving so fast. . . . How can you take it more than one day at a time?"

Willy '06
Northern Iowa just locked up their coach for 10 years.

Hmmm. Incarceration. I didn't think of that. Is it legal? How could we do it for away games?

mnagowski

Roy 82
Here is a dumb question:

Why doesn't Cornell just offer Donahue a bigger salary next season?

The indirect financial benefit to Cornell by having a successful BBall program would more than make up for the cost.

I have no doubt that Cornell will try to increase his salary to retain him. But it's not clear to me that there's a huge financial benefit. Are you increasing your annual giving because the team went to the sweet sixteen? If not, who is?

Cornell research has actually shown that increased winning for sports teams doesn't necessarily increase giving:

[www.johnson.cornell.edu]

I hate when people ruin a perfectly good argument with facts.

Actually, you can read the article about the report and its conclusions two ways. The editor chose to emphasize that the effect was small. But the report itself does note that there is a short spike in benefits to the university based on athletic success. Depending on the size and duration of the spike, a few hundred thousand per year in salary could be offset.

Roy 82

mnagowski

Roy 82
Here is a dumb question:

Why doesn't Cornell just offer Donahue a bigger salary next season?

The indirect financial benefit to Cornell by having a successful BBall program would more than make up for the cost.

I have no doubt that Cornell will try to increase his salary to retain him. But it's not clear to me that there's a huge financial benefit. Are you increasing your annual giving because the team went to the sweet sixteen? If not, who is?

Cornell research has actually shown that increased winning for sports teams doesn't necessarily increase giving:

[www.johnson.cornell.edu]

I hate when people ruin a perfectly good argument with facts.

Actually, you can read the article about the report and its conclusions two ways. The editor chose to emphasize that the effect was small. But the report itself does note that there is a short spike in benefits to the university based on athletic success. Depending on the size and duration of the spike, a few hundred thousand per year in salary could be offset.

I did get an email today from Andy asking for a $75 donation in light of all the success last weekend. Maybe the bump is bigger if they harass you and ask for it.

Jacob '06

Roy 82

mnagowski

Roy 82
Here is a dumb question:

Why doesn't Cornell just offer Donahue a bigger salary next season?

The indirect financial benefit to Cornell by having a successful BBall program would more than make up for the cost.

I have no doubt that Cornell will try to increase his salary to retain him. But it's not clear to me that there's a huge financial benefit. Are you increasing your annual giving because the team went to the sweet sixteen? If not, who is?

Cornell research has actually shown that increased winning for sports teams doesn't necessarily increase giving:

[www.johnson.cornell.edu]

I hate when people ruin a perfectly good argument with facts.

Actually, you can read the article about the report and its conclusions two ways. The editor chose to emphasize that the effect was small. But the report itself does note that there is a short spike in benefits to the university based on athletic success. Depending on the size and duration of the spike, a few hundred thousand per year in salary could be offset.

I did get an email today from Andy asking for a $75 donation in light of all the success last weekend. Maybe the bump is bigger if they harass you and ask for it.

Admittedly, the report was for your average state school, and not a school like Cornell. I could actually see there being a large financial benefit if Cornell was able to communicate the current situation in a clear and effective manner.

The fact is that Cornell appears to be increasingly losing out on a lot of students, not just athletes, because the financial aid isn't there relative to some of the Ivies and other selective schools. Harvard and Princeton's financial aid will soon be good enough so that most of their athletes will be on full rides, just not for athletics. And the University just had its hand slapped by the Ivy office for trying to offer some students (read: athletes) need-based financial-aid on par with the other Ivies.

More here: [www.metaezra.com]

Somewhere the alumni body needs to hear, "If you want us to continue having athletic (and other) successes, we will need your help in increasing the endowment for financial aid." Either that message is being lost, or it's just not getting out there for anybody but the major donors to hear.

Donahue mentioned in this article re St. John's failed attempt to get GA Tech coach.
[sports.espn.go.com]

Jacob '06
I did get an email today from Andy asking for a $75 donation in light of all the success last weekend. Maybe the bump is bigger if they harass you and ask for it.

$75? You got off easy. I was asked for $250. I wonder if the difference is the graduation year or the MD after my name.

Greenberg '97

Jacob '06
I did get an email today from Andy asking for a $75 donation in light of all the success last weekend. Maybe the bump is bigger if they harass you and ask for it.

$75? You got off easy. I was asked for $250. I wonder if the difference is the graduation year or the MD after my name.

Based on my limited experience with Cornell fundraising, the amount is usually based on your previous gifts.

The New York Times today says that Donahue is being vetted for the St. John's position.

dbilmes
The New York Times today says that Donahue is being vetted for the St. John's position.

The St. Johns AD had said they were looking for a guy who coached at a power conference and had success at the highest levels. While I think Donahue would be a good hire for any program, he certainly doesn't meet those criteria. But I guess St. Johns is getting a dose of reality that the school is no longer as plum a job as it used to be.

Not only a mention, but the article gives an idea of the salaries being paid to coaches these days.

SJU is one place I wouldn't mind seeing Donahue move on to. If he could rebuild the "home town" program, that might even be more impressive than what he's done at Cornell.

Jordan 04
SJU is one place I wouldn't mind seeing Donahue move on to. If he could rebuild the "home town" program, that might even be more impressive than what he's done at Cornell.

Counterintuitive as it might be, since they'd be stealing the coach of my real favorite team, I'd start paying attention to the Johnnies again if Donahue were to take over.

I dont see them hiring Donahue, they are just offering too much money, probably 10 times his current salary. They are now interviewing BC's coach, they would probably rather hire a mediocre BCS coach since he has at least coached at the BCS level than hiring Donahue who has only ever been in the Ivy league

dbilmes
The New York Times today says that Donahue is being vetted for the St. John's position.

What newspapers does he read?

Roy 82

dbilmes
The New York Times today says that Donahue is being vetted for the St. John's position.

What newspapers does he read?

All of them, of course.

I dont think we have to worry about St Johns but Seton Hall might be much more willing to hire him as they would only be roughly doubling his salary and after their former coach Gonzalez's antics they really want a much more classy coach

[www.nypost.com]

The report by Frank is another self serving piece by an academic who would prefer that all sports were abolished. I don't think the sports boom at major state Universities in this nation would be occurring if there wasn't money in those fields!

Email from Coach Donahue
Dear Big Red Basketball Fans,

I know we were called the underdog, the Cinderella, the long shot, the feel-good story of the Sweet Sixteen. Well, we may have been all those things. But first and foremost, we were, and of course still are, Cornellians. And that is what made us great on and off the court--it was that Big Red spirit and work ethic that got us to the Sweet Sixteen.

I just want to thank you all for your tremendous support throughout the season and into the amazing post-season. I read your texts and Facebook postings, your emails and letters. It was so motivating and inspiring to know that so many thousands of alumni were behind us. I can't describe how grateful I am that you took the time to cheer us on. I also heard that you all gathered in 90 cities around the world to watch the game together, and I know we had hundreds of alumni travel thousands of miles to watch us play in Syracuse. To all of you, I say thank you, thank you, thank you. We could not have come as far as we did without you.

Now I hope you'll join me in cheering for our tremendous hockey team as they play in their NCAA tournament up in Albany, and I'll look forward to next year's Big Red basketball season!

Coach Steve Donahue

I was going to post about that, but I figured it's probably meaningless. All coaches who leave say they forward to the next season.

Jordan 04
I was going to post about that, but I figured it's probably meaningless. All coaches who leave say they forward to the next season.

This is true.

laxman
The report by Frank is another self serving piece by an academic who would prefer that all sports were abolished. I don't think the sports boom at major state Universities in this nation would be occurring if there wasn't money in those fields!

Yeah, and there was tons of money in subprime mortgages as well.

Frank clearly states that there are lots of non-pecuniary benefits to inter-college athletics. He obviously doesn't want them abolished. Consistent with most of his work, he questions the value of the arms race.

No way Donahue goes to Penn but this is bizarre:

[blogs.dailypennsylvanian.com]

They are looking at 6 D-I coaches
1 D-I assistant
2 NBA assistants

I guess Allen is not the clear candidate

Parts of this discussion seems to think that Steve Donahue is only suited to coaching Ivy Leaguers, that he might not be able to coach students lacking 1300 SATs, that the other schools want someone who's paid his dues at a better than mid-major school. I hope he stays. I think he's qualified to coach most anywhere.

billhoward
Parts of this discussion seems to think that Steve Donahue is only suited to coaching Ivy Leaguers, that he might not be able to coach students lacking 1950 SATs, that the other schools want someone who's paid his dues at a better than mid-major school. I hope he stays. I think he's qualified to coach most anywhere.

FYP. The SAT has had a maximum score of 2400 since 2005. In fact, 1300 might be the score John Wall or DeMarcus Cousins got.

“I’m incredibly excited about how well Cornell has done in the NCAA,” Cornell alum Sandy Weill told Business Week. “The players and the coach have handled themselves very well and it shows that you can go to incredible heights with teamwork.” Weil graduated with a bachelor’s degree from Cornell in 1955. He retired as Citigroup chief executive in 2003 and as chairman in 2006. During the last decade, he and his wife have donated more than $500 million dollars to Cornell University. Weil, who attended the Sweet Sixteen game, said that the Cornell basketball team's success probably will help fundraising for the program. “Pride and good feelings always moves the needle,” Weill said.

Maybe he can donate enough to keep Donahue here

phillysportsfan
“I’m incredibly excited about how well Cornell has done in the NCAA,” Cornell alum Sandy Weill told Business Week. “The players and the coach have handled themselves very well and it shows that you can go to incredible heights with teamwork.” Weil graduated with a bachelor’s degree from Cornell in 1955. He retired as Citigroup chief executive in 2003 and as chairman in 2006. During the last decade, he and his wife have donated more than $500 million dollars to Cornell University. Weil, who attended the Sweet Sixteen game, said that the Cornell basketball team's success probably will help fundraising for the program. “Pride and good feelings always moves the needle,” Weill said.

Maybe he can donate enough to keep Donahue here

Even if alums would donate specifically to pay enough to keep Donahue from being lured elsewhere, I wonder if the University would be comfortable having one coach earn significantly more than the other coaches on campus (and admittedly, I have no idea what the relative pay is now, but I imagine the coaches of the "big" sports are in the same zip code).

Siena's coach McCaffery is off to Iowa, I could see Donahue going to Siena

phillysportsfan
Siena's coach McCaffery is off to Iowa, I could see Donahue going to Siena

Don't see it. If he goes anywhere, it's to a team in a power conference

scoop85

phillysportsfan
Siena's coach McCaffery is off to Iowa, I could see Donahue going to Siena

Don't see it. If he goes anywhere, it's to a team in a power conference

If he goes anywhere it will be because a boatload of cash has been thrown at him by a school in a city his family wouldn't mind living in. Let's not complicate this. It is entirely possible that Siena has throwing-around money because they've been very good at bringing in good coaches on their way to helming schools in the power conferences.

It is unlikely Donahue can jump right to a Big East school, Dunphy was at Penn for all those years with all that success and the best he could do was the A10 with Temple. It is hard for Ivy league coaches to jump to a Power 6 conference school, the exceptions such as John Thompson 3rd got the Georgetown job because of his father and Craig Robinson at Oregon St because of his relation to Obama. Donahue would have to go to Siena, a good mid major and have success in order to jump to a Power 6 school as Siena's former coach just did

But your right at the end of the day it is all about money, if someone offers to more than double your current salary most likely you take the job

phillysportsfan
... Craig Robinson at Oregon St because of his relation to Obama...

You're sticking with this, eh?

One difference between Dunphy and Donahue: Dunphy only one 1 post-season game (even losing the one game playoff with P-ton in 1995) in 17 seasons at Penn. He never proved he could coach with the big six conferences. Donahue has a better post-season record and has been by far more visible than Dunphy ever was thus making him a better target for a BCS conference.

ugarte

phillysportsfan
... Craig Robinson at Oregon St because of his relation to Obama...

You're sticking with this, eh?

Yeah because he turned Brown around in 2 years to get 19 wins and make the CBI, never made an NCAA tournament and yet still got a job at a PAC10 school. Oregon St is not a good program but they are still in he PAC10. Donahue coached here 8 years, made 2 NCAA tournaments and the best offer he got last year was from BU. Dunphy coached at Penn for 17 years, made all those NCAA tournaments, and the best offer he got was Temple, an A10 school.

Seton Hall hires Iona coach Kevin Willard

phillysportsfan

ugarte

phillysportsfan
... Craig Robinson at Oregon St because of his relation to Obama...

You're sticking with this, eh?

Yeah because he turned Brown around in 2 years to get 19 wins and make the CBI, never made an NCAA tournament and yet still got a job at a PAC10 school. Oregon St is not a good program but they are still in he PAC10. Donahue coached here 8 years, made 2 NCAA tournaments and the best offer he got last year was from BU. Dunphy coached at Penn for 17 years, made all those NCAA tournaments, and the best offer he got was Temple, an A10 school.

The best offer he got or the best offer he took? Dunphy is a Philly guy. He grew up in Malverne and played at LaSalle. Temple - the top coaching position in Pennsylvania (yeah, much better than the Big 10's Penn State) - was probably his dream job. Why would he go anyplace else? Not everyone is constantly trying to climb the ladder. Do you think nobody ever offered Pete Carrill a more lucrative gig than Princeton?

"Helming"? Are you sure you weren't a sportswriter in a previous life?

Alright so Dunphy probably is not the best example because your right he is a Philly guy but you would agree that as of last year Donahue accomplished more than Robinson and the best offer he got was BU which is definitely less of an offer than Oregon St. And honestly getting Brown to a 2nd place Ivy finish was not that big of a deal anyway, Miller had gotten Brown to a 2nd place Ivy finish 3 times in his 7 years there an a NIT appearance. I just dont see how one good year out of two years with a CBI appearance gets a coach a PAC10 job coming from an Ivy league school unless the coach happens to be related to the president or there is some other connection

phillysportsfan
I just dont see how one good year out of two years with a CBI appearance gets a coach a PAC10 job coming from an Ivy league school unless the coach happens to be related to the president or there is some other connection

Perhaps some other connection you should be referring to is his 6 years as an assistant at Northwestern. Certainly assistants have a very large hand in recruiting. That gives him recruiting in a major conference as well as head coaching experience prior to the OSU job. But who knows, Obama has gotten blamed/credited for worse....

semsox

phillysportsfan
I just dont see how one good year out of two years with a CBI appearance gets a coach a PAC10 job coming from an Ivy league school unless the coach happens to be related to the president or there is some other connection

Perhaps some other connection you should be referring to is his 6 years as an assistant at Northwestern. Certainly assistants have a very large hand in recruiting. That gives him recruiting in a major conference as well as head coaching experience prior to the OSU job. But who knows, Obama has gotten blamed/credited for worse....

HAHA if you honestly believe that he got that job because he was an assistant at Northwestern (traditionally, one of the worst basketball programs in the country and one of a handful to NEVER have made the NCAA Tournament) then I have some swamp land in Florida to sell you that you can build on when the tide goes out...

Exactly experience at Northwestern is not something to list on your resume

All I'm saying is it's big conference experience, even if it is Northwestern. OSU wasn't exactly a great job either. 3 other coaches turned it down before Robinson. So yea, being Michelle's brother probably helped, but it's not as if he's completely unqualified.

semsox
All I'm saying is it's big conference experience, even if it is Northwestern. OSU wasn't exactly a great job either. 3 other coaches turned it down before Robinson. So yea, being Michelle's brother probably helped, but it's not as if he's completely unqualified.

Well I guess this whole time we agreed, I am not saying he was completely unqualified just that he would not have gotten the job if he wasnt Michelle's brother

[www.nydailynews.com]

St Johns is meeting with Lavin today, hopefully they hire him because Donahue might be their next choice.

Article actually says below that Donahue reached out to them:

"Monasch also may interview Cornell coach Steve Donohue this week. Sources told the Daily News that representatives for Donohue have reached out to express his interest in the St. John's position since the Big Red got bounced in the Sweet 16 of the NCAA Tournament on Thursday night."

phillysportsfan

semsox
All I'm saying is it's big conference experience, even if it is Northwestern. OSU wasn't exactly a great job either. 3 other coaches turned it down before Robinson. So yea, being Michelle's brother probably helped, but it's not as if he's completely unqualified.

Well I guess this whole time we agreed, I am not saying he was completely unqualified just that he would not have gotten the job if he wasnt Michelle's brother

And just how is it that you know this? What insider information do you have on the situation? Whom have you spoken to that was privy to Oregon State's decision-making process?

ugarte

phillysportsfan

ugarte

phillysportsfan
... Craig Robinson at Oregon St because of his relation to Obama...

You're sticking with this, eh?

Yeah because he turned Brown around in 2 years to get 19 wins and make the CBI, never made an NCAA tournament and yet still got a job at a PAC10 school. Oregon St is not a good program but they are still in he PAC10. Donahue coached here 8 years, made 2 NCAA tournaments and the best offer he got last year was from BU. Dunphy coached at Penn for 17 years, made all those NCAA tournaments, and the best offer he got was Temple, an A10 school.

The best offer he got or the best offer he took? Dunphy is a Philly guy. He grew up in Malverne and played at LaSalle. Temple - the top coaching position in Pennsylvania (yeah, much better than the Big 10's Penn State) - was probably his dream job. Why would he go anyplace else? Not everyone is constantly trying to climb the ladder. Do you think nobody ever offered Pete Carrill a more lucrative gig than Princeton?

Actually, the top Bball coaching job in PA is currently filled by Jay Wright. Temple is probably #2.

But you're right, Penn State is irrelevant.

Oh St. Joe's, how quickly they forget...

Trotsky
Oh St. Joe's, how quickly they forget...

#3 for St. Joe's (good catch, Jeff). One great run with Jameer Nelson and Delonte West doesn't surpass what Cheney did over decades while at Temple, just like Cornell won't be the plum Ivy job if Donahue leaves.

How does the issue that Donahue may have lost other job opportunities while he was coaching Cornell to the Sweet 16 factor into this? Will Donahue get a raise from Cornell if he stays? Can Cornell make more money by charging students for tickets to basketball and not using the money from the student activity fee towards basketball?

Al DeFlorio

phillysportsfan

semsox
All I'm saying is it's big conference experience, even if it is Northwestern. OSU wasn't exactly a great job either. 3 other coaches turned it down before Robinson. So yea, being Michelle's brother probably helped, but it's not as if he's completely unqualified.

Well I guess this whole time we agreed, I am not saying he was completely unqualified just that he would not have gotten the job if he wasnt Michelle's brother

And just how is it that you know this? What insider information do you have on the situation? Whom have you spoken to that was privy to Oregon State's decision-making process?

I think you guys are really missing what I am saying and we are sort of arguing about the same thing. All I am saying is that being related to Obama got Robinson much more attention than the average coach would after making the CBI in 2 years at Brown. And at that point Oregon St decided to take a look at him. Do you really think this played no factor in their decision to hire him?

ugarte

Trotsky
Oh St. Joe's, how quickly they forget...

#3 for St. Joe's (good catch, Jeff). One great run with Jameer Nelson and Delonte West doesn't surpass what Cheney did over decades while at Temple, just like Cornell won't be the plum Ivy job if Donahue leaves.

I'd go with Pitt above St. Joe's; they've had a run of pretty good success in the last decade or so, including an Elite Eight last year. Also they play in the Big East and get the attendant media exposure.

Donahue already interviewed with Seton Hall and did not impress them, from the NY post:

Willard emerged as the Hall's top choice after Fran McCaffery took the Iowa job and Cornell coach Steve Donahue didn't blow away the brass during an interview with the Pirates yesterday morning.

Donahue apparently is also interested in Siena, from ESPN:
Donahue has expressed a strong interest in the job, and would be a slam-dunk hire for the small private school in upstate New York

srg1
How does the issue that Donahue may have lost other job opportunities while he was coaching Cornell to the Sweet 16 factor into this? Will Donahue get a raise from Cornell if he stays? Can Cornell make more money by charging students for tickets to basketball and not using the money from the student activity fee towards basketball?

10 home games * 1,000 students per game * $5 additional ticket price = $50,000 a year

And that's assuming 10 home games when students are on campus. I think this year there were only 8.

At a certain ticket price students aren't going to show up. (See hockey.) So you're going to need to make Donahue's salary increase come from somewhere else.

mnagowski

srg1
How does the issue that Donahue may have lost other job opportunities while he was coaching Cornell to the Sweet 16 factor into this? Will Donahue get a raise from Cornell if he stays? Can Cornell make more money by charging students for tickets to basketball and not using the money from the student activity fee towards basketball?

10 home games * 1,000 students per game * $5 additional ticket price = $50,000 a year

And that's assuming 10 home games when students are on campus. I think this year there were only 8.

At a certain ticket price students aren't going to show up. (See hockey.) So you're going to need to make Donahue's salary increase come from somewhere else.

Yeah there are so few home games it is not really even worth it for them to charge, hockey at least has the history and tradition that gets students to pay for it. Charging for basketball could easily destroy the basketball fan base

phillysportsfan

mnagowski

srg1
How does the issue that Donahue may have lost other job opportunities while he was coaching Cornell to the Sweet 16 factor into this? Will Donahue get a raise from Cornell if he stays? Can Cornell make more money by charging students for tickets to basketball and not using the money from the student activity fee towards basketball?

10 home games * 1,000 students per game * $5 additional ticket price = $50,000 a year

And that's assuming 10 home games when students are on campus. I think this year there were only 8.

At a certain ticket price students aren't going to show up. (See hockey.) So you're going to need to make Donahue's salary increase come from somewhere else.

Yeah there are so few home games it is not really even worth it for them to charge, hockey at least has the history and tradition that gets students to pay for it. Charging for basketball could easily destroy the basketball fan base

A smart administrator would make sure there is a strong fan base before trying to milk it for cash. There's been a big upswing in interest in the bball team lately, deservedly so We'll see how well it weathers the likely drop off in results next year. Hopefully it will.

phillysportsfan

Al DeFlorio

phillysportsfan

semsox
All I'm saying is it's big conference experience, even if it is Northwestern. OSU wasn't exactly a great job either. 3 other coaches turned it down before Robinson. So yea, being Michelle's brother probably helped, but it's not as if he's completely unqualified.

Well I guess this whole time we agreed, I am not saying he was completely unqualified just that he would not have gotten the job if he wasnt Michelle's brother

And just how is it that you know this? What insider information do you have on the situation? Whom have you spoken to that was privy to Oregon State's decision-making process?

I think you guys are really missing what I am saying and we are sort of arguing about the same thing. All I am saying is that being related to Obama got Robinson much more attention than the average coach would after making the CBI in 2 years at Brown. And at that point Oregon St decided to take a look at him. Do you really think this played no factor in their decision to hire him?

But I don't think you stated it well. My assumption after reading it was that you 'knew" some input that someone from Michelle Obama's circle had on the process. Not just that his name was now better known.

Jim Hyla

phillysportsfan

Al DeFlorio

phillysportsfan

semsox
All I'm saying is it's big conference experience, even if it is Northwestern. OSU wasn't exactly a great job either. 3 other coaches turned it down before Robinson. So yea, being Michelle's brother probably helped, but it's not as if he's completely unqualified.

Well I guess this whole time we agreed, I am not saying he was completely unqualified just that he would not have gotten the job if he wasnt Michelle's brother

And just how is it that you know this? What insider information do you have on the situation? Whom have you spoken to that was privy to Oregon State's decision-making process?

I think you guys are really missing what I am saying and we are sort of arguing about the same thing. All I am saying is that being related to Obama got Robinson much more attention than the average coach would after making the CBI in 2 years at Brown. And at that point Oregon St decided to take a look at him. Do you really think this played no factor in their decision to hire him?

But I don't think you stated it well. My assumption after reading it was that you 'knew" some input that someone from Michelle Obama's circle had on the process. Not just that his name was now better known.

I guess I wasnt clear then, I dont think anyone from Michelle Obama's circle said to Oregon St you should hire this guy, I am just saying he had more exposure than the average Ivy league coach as a result of his family and so he was able to make the Ivy to Big 6 conference jump

kingpin248

ugarte

Trotsky
Oh St. Joe's, how quickly they forget...

#3 for St. Joe's (good catch, Jeff). One great run with Jameer Nelson and Delonte West doesn't surpass what Cheney did over decades while at Temple, just like Cornell won't be the plum Ivy job if Donahue leaves.

I'd go with Pitt above St. Joe's; they've had a run of pretty good success in the last decade or so, including an Elite Eight last year. Also they play in the Big East and get the attendant media exposure.

Goddammit. I only said "Pennsylvania" so I could make fun of Penn State basketball. You're right, of course.

phillysportsfan

Jim Hyla

phillysportsfan

Al DeFlorio

phillysportsfan

semsox
All I'm saying is it's big conference experience, even if it is Northwestern. OSU wasn't exactly a great job either. 3 other coaches turned it down before Robinson. So yea, being Michelle's brother probably helped, but it's not as if he's completely unqualified.

Well I guess this whole time we agreed, I am not saying he was completely unqualified just that he would not have gotten the job if he wasnt Michelle's brother

And just how is it that you know this? What insider information do you have on the situation? Whom have you spoken to that was privy to Oregon State's decision-making process?

I think you guys are really missing what I am saying and we are sort of arguing about the same thing. All I am saying is that being related to Obama got Robinson much more attention than the average coach would after making the CBI in 2 years at Brown. And at that point Oregon St decided to take a look at him. Do you really think this played no factor in their decision to hire him?

But I don't think you stated it well. My assumption after reading it was that you 'knew" some input that someone from Michelle Obama's circle had on the process. Not just that his name was now better known.

I guess I wasnt clear then, I dont think anyone from Michelle Obama's circle said to Oregon St you should hire this guy, I am just saying he had more exposure than the average Ivy league coach as a result of his family and so he was able to make the Ivy to Big 6 conference jump

Ah, so ... totally unfounded speculation instead of TeaPartyish conspiracy. That's better, I guess.

ugarte

kingpin248

ugarte

Trotsky
Oh St. Joe's, how quickly they forget...

#3 for St. Joe's (good catch, Jeff). One great run with Jameer Nelson and Delonte West doesn't surpass what Cheney did over decades while at Temple, just like Cornell won't be the plum Ivy job if Donahue leaves.

I'd go with Pitt above St. Joe's; they've had a run of pretty good success in the last decade or so, including an Elite Eight last year. Also they play in the Big East and get the attendant media exposure.

Goddammit. I only said "Pennsylvania" so I could make fun of Penn State basketball. You're right, of course.

It does point out the irrelevance of Penn State basketball that 1) nobody thought you were joking or teasing and 2) Nobody cares that you were joking or teasing.

Speaking of Penn St basketball, we are playing them next year at Penn St

I guess I should post this in case you didnt notice, looks like another road warrior schedule although South Carolina is coming to play here, wonder how that happened
[cornellbasketball.blogspot.com]


at Penn State
at Seton Hall
at Syracuse
vs. South Carolina
at Lehigh
at Albany
at Binghamton
at VCU Tournament (with New Hampshire and Norfolk State)
at Boston University
vs. Bucknell
14 Ivy League Games

Not sure whether to trust anything the Post or News reports, but at least we now know that Donahue is serious about other jobs but no one is biting. He seems like a helluva coach but maybe he's just a poor interviewer. I don't know how the Iona coach got the job over Donahue. Donahue would've gotten a 5x raise, the ex-Iona guy will be making $1 million per year. Wow.