Ticket Line Procedures

[David Harding \'72]

This was unquestionably a big screw-up, but not one has to be careful what one wishes for.  Duke basketball has been mentioned as a model.  Visiting there a couple of years ago, we were told a few things that make the situation different.  For undergraduates, the tickets were free and only available on a game-by-game basis.  That removed some of the pressure of a season ticket sale.  To handle the frequent campouts, there were big tents set up essentially permanantly to handle the crowds - they call it Krzyzewski-ville.  
http://tieguy.org/tent/spring98/espn2-26-98.html  
http://www.duke.edu/~bbp2/kville.htm  
http://www.hamptonroads.com/pilotonline/sports/sp0216qna.html
If I recall correctly, there was electricity and even internet connections available, but I may be romanticising.  After the student allocation is given out, that's it.  The priority of the non-student season ticket holders is paramount.  Empty seats go unfilled.
http://www.cavalierdaily.com/CVArticle.asp?ID=6875&pid=664

Duke graduate students can purchase season tickets in an interesting system apparently run by the Graduate and Professional Student Council.
http://www.duke.edu/gpsc/bball/2003_BBall_policy.pdf

Other places have their problems, too.
http://www.inform.umd.edu/News/Diamondback/archives/2002/02/13/news1.html

[Cornell Fan]

After visiting the line last night around 1:30 AM and having a chat with the door/number check guys, I learned of several other ways athletics is totally screwing the whole process up:

- Everyone was free to leave and go home at midnight if they desired, and by the looks of it most people did.  I talked to my friend who was lucky enough to get a line number, and he said about 3/4 of the people went home for the night.  There were no number checks from midnight until 8 AM.

- Supposedly they are going to end the line early tonight at 6 instead of going all the way until 11 PM.  I didn't get a chance to double verify this info, but I don't see any reason why the staff guy would lie to me, unless he was just mistaken.  So basically they are softening the overall time commitment and in the process making it easier for more casual fans to get tickets.

- When I was asking the guy if there was any chance of them handing out new line numbers if people got kicked out/lost their number (which, by the way, the answer was no), I commented on how it was unfair how they said people would not be permitted to line up prior to 4:45 and how the people who broke that rule were the ones who ended up getting line numbers.  The guy's response, and this is a verbatim quote: "They lie every year."  At least now we know what to expect next year from the organizers....

[dsr11]

Something which Judy pointed out and that Cornell Fan pointed out:

No matter what the athletic department says, just go there as early as you can.  Evidently, this rule was made to be broken.  Not that I'm encouraging civil disobedience, but the haphazard way this rule has been enforced in years past has shown that it will not be enforce.  You may be sent home, but you can show up 30 mins later, get in the "unofficial/official" line and get tickets.

So show up 2 or 3 days in advance, and keep going back until things are made official, regardless of what the official line up time is.

BTW, when I brought up Duke basketball, it was just the first thing that came to mind.  Other schools have wildly popular athletic teams and a limited number of tickets, after spending some time in Austin, UT football comes to mind as well.  I don't know how other schools handle it aside from Duke, but it's gotta be better than what Cornell is doing for hockey.

And I also see no problem with erecting a Schafer-ville outside of Lynah :-)



Post Edited (09-13-03 15:28)

[Bjammin 03]

Mark,

First, athletics charges students 1/2 the price (or there about) of a normal ticket that "townies" purchase. There is no way they will give up that revenue.

Second, Lynah seats approximately 4,000 when you include standing room along the rail, not 2,500.

Lastly, I have friends that have played for both Yale and Maine that have played a game(s) @ Lynah and told me without a doubt they think Lynah, as is, the BEST college hockey rink they have ever stepped foot into. If what the other (older, sorry ya'll have just been around longer than I have) Faithful have told me holds true, then the problem of supply and demand and  Cornell hockey fans are not new to one another. The line procedures published by Athletics just make it more obvious when the "rules" are not adhered to.

[Section A]

Interesting that you brought up the issue of possibly having a rope to make the line along the fence single-file. Students in the line thought of this well before the line got out of hand. They asked the Athletics personnel on hand for rope AS they were putting up the rope on the south end of the fence for the "official" line." The answer was "no."

[Will]

Ben Doyle '03 wrote:
First, athletics charges students 1/2 the price (or there about) of a normal ticket that "townies" purchase. There is no way they will give up that revenue.

I always thought it was about 1/3rd.  Nevertheless, doesn't the rest of the total cost per ticket (i.e., what the "townies", for lack of a better term, pay) get covered by each student's student activities fee?  I could be wrong, but I was always under the impression that that's how they could afford to give tickets to students for 'cheaper'.

Lastly, I have friends that have played for both Yale and Maine that have played a game(s) @ Lynah and told me without a doubt they think Lynah, as is, the BEST college hockey rink they have ever stepped foot into. If what the other (older, sorry ya'll have just been around longer than I have) Faithful have told me holds true, then the problem of supply and demand and  Cornell hockey fans are not new to one another.

Personally, I agree.  I can't say each opposing player who has ever played at Lynah will agree 100%, but I have to imagine Lynah ranks among their personal best (well, maybe most intimidating/hardest to play in) college hockey rinks across the nation.  Sure, it isn't a huge rink like some other bigger name schools, but it doesn't have to be.  It's a big barn, but that's what helps the Lynah Faithful turn that barn into the greatest college hockey rink EVER! :-D

Also, crowds come and go.  It's natural to assume that lines are busier and longer in years following seasons of increasing success, like last year.  It's probably more a combination of that and how well relevant line information is advertised (and, of course, enforced).  If this year's team sucks, I expect next year will probably not have 1,000 people get told to 'go home'.

[French Rage]

A few thoughts:

- Avash made a good point for people who won't get tickets.  Go to Bartels or Lyanh before the games and there will usually be people selling extra tickets, wither in the student section or elsewhere.  Ma freshmen year, I got a ticekt for the exhibition game, and then every single game after that I was outside buying tickets from those who were selling.  Sure you'll pay closer to townie prices than student prices, but hey, the games are worth way more than what we have to pay.  I think there will be plenty of tickets this year because, to me, a significant number of peoplein Bartels seemed like facetimers and will stop going when the team, as most predict, does not have as great a success as last year (but hey, here's hoping!).

- judy made yet another good point.  Don't believe a thing the athletic office says about policing until the official line time.  Come as early as you can, and check back regularly, because you never know when the line that becomes the official line is gonna form.

- The lack time requirements once people got in Bartel's was a joke.  Letting people go homefrom 11 pm to 8 am was complete and utter bullshit.  If anyone couldn't have stayed the night, there were 1000+ people who didn't get line numbers who I'm sure would be more than happy to do so.  Further, ending the line checks over an hour early only does more of the same.  Getting in Bartel's shouldn't be the end of the process; really, it should only be the beginning - once outside, the fans are supposed to show that they're committed enough to get heir tickets.

- Expanding Lynah, that is the question.  On one hand, this type of crowd shows that the current 1500 seats aren't nearly enough, as least this year.  But what if the team faces a few down years, will the demand still outpace the supply?  Further, how many people are going to come to EVERY game, as opposed to just Harvard and a few others?  While it would be nice to have the type of rink other high-ranked programs do, Lynah has a character of its own, a character I have grown accustomed to, and would not like to see leave.

- Did that plant sale annoy anyone else? C'mon, which is more important, some octogenerians who need some new shrubs or the hockey fans?!?!

Anyways, here's hoping that everyone here - the true committed fans - can get tickets and that the team has a great year.

[sockralex]

First I'd like to apologize to everyone who didn't get tickets this year because I was one of the many people who didn't follow the "rules" and came early.  
I read the rules and told myself, "If they send me home, then I'll come back at 4:45."  I showed up around 7:30am on Friday and signed the "list."  Number 80.  After about 2 hours a CUPD officer came and told us to take a hike.  After sitting at the Ag Quad for about 3-4 hours I saw a great commotion happen when dozens of people near the Biotech building made a mad rush for the practice fence.  (This happened less than an hour after I saw a kid run into a blue Vovlvo?? with the "list.") I quickly gathered my belongings and ran for the fence.  I got there and estimated about 150-200 people ahead of me.  As the afternoon strethced closer to 4:45 and more people gathered around the fence, huge bulges begand to develop ahead of me.  People were clearly cutting and screwing other fellow Cornellians out of their position in line.  This got worse as it got closer to the "official line" time.
Long story short: I got a number in the 300's and am happy just to get it after seeing how many people got screwed.
BTW, expect to see season tickets go on sale from scalpers as I did hear several people estimating the profits they are going to make from having more season tickets than they need and even from students (as one had told me) that didn't like hockey but got in line to sell the tickets for a $300 profit.
Again, sorry if you got screwed over and if I have an extra ticket become available from my group of friends it will go on sale here for face value so that a Faithful can get it.

[Cornell Fan]

Alex Kushnir '06 wrote:

BTW, expect to see season tickets go on sale from scalpers as I did hear several people estimating the profits they are going to make from having more season tickets than they need and even from students (as one had told me) that didn't like hockey but got in line to sell the tickets for a $300 profit.

That is sickening that there are people who were able to get tickets with the sole intent of scalping them for a huge profit, while a large percentage of true fans didn't even have a chance in the line.  Yet another sign of Gene and athletics' incompetency to organize distribution. I hope to god the police are informed of this and put a stop to any price-inflated scalping that happens.  People shouldn't try to fuck over their "fellow" faithful (truly a misnomer, since these scumbags should never be considered to be part of the faithful).

[Cornell Fan]

One of the guys who got revenge on Volonnino wrote:

Also, crowds come and go.  It's natural to assume that lines are busier and longer in years following seasons of increasing success, like last year.  It's probably more a combination of that and how well relevant line information is advertised (and, of course, enforced).  If this year's team sucks, I expect next year will probably not have 1,000 people get told to 'go home'.

Unfortunately, there won't be a "next year" for some of us...

[Bjammin 03]

I sure hope they didn't sell the "Lynah Faithful ... I did my time in line" shirts. . . ::screwy::

[Section A]

Anyone know how the seat selection went for those in the 600+ category, specifically those between 760-800? When I was there this morning, at number 234, all of B was basically gone, most of the left side of A, and D was just beginning to fill up.

[Jordan]

I was just told that around 600 top parts of F and pretty much all of G was still open.

[DeltaOne81]

[Q]BTW, expect to see season tickets go on sale from scalpers as I did hear several people estimating the profits they are going to make from having more season tickets than they need and even from students (as one had told me) that didn't like hockey but got in line to sell the tickets for a $300 profit.[/Q]

I've never been able to sell tickets for more than they're worth. Hell, half the time I couldn't even give my spare away to friends. That kid's psycho and he deserves to probably lose money on the deal.

You want to know what the problem is... and I'm not saying I know how to fix it. But sleeping over had turned into something that the hardcore fans do into "the thing to do". I also think Athletics unintentionally encourages this by trying to set a limit on when you can get there. By mentioning 4:45 on Friday, they make that the new goal, rather than a few years back when all they said were line numbers will be distributed at 10 am Saturday.

Here's my new proposal, based on the good point of concert ticket sales above.

The Athletic's web page and maybe a handout by the ticket office say: "Season tickets go on sale at 8 pm on (a Saturday in late September). The line will form behind Bartels Hall. Line numbers will be given out as soon as you arrive and random line checks will be performed."

No mention of anything earlier so that no one gets the idea in their head, and only the true faithful show up a day or two before. Line numbers given out immediately so that no cutting can occur. The AD hasn't advertised anything early, so they don't put themselves directly in the wrath of the administration.

At 8 pm on Saturday seat selection occurs. You may pay anytime during Saturday, and then get your tickets as soon as you've selected your seats, or you may pay after you've selected your seats, or you may return on Sunday to pay and get your tickets.



Post Edited (09-14-03 13:26)

[Will]

Avash '05 wrote:

Anyone know how the seat selection went for those in the 600+ category, specifically those between 760-800? When I was there this morning, at number 234, all of B was basically gone, most of the left side of A, and D was just beginning to fill up.

I have good news: everyone who had numbers (i.e., up to 800) who didn't miss line checks got the number of tickets they wanted.  Hooray!

As I believe I said before, my group of friends was in that final group rounding out at 800.  We got there at 1PM (for the 600-800 group's prescribed time), and naturally, we saw the number of the people there and the number of apparent available seats, and began to figuratively sh!t our pants.  However, around the time #750 or so was selecting seats, we looked at the board and our hopes rose, although we couldn't see precisely how many seats were left available from the line.  All we knew was that we'd end up in G, which was pretty much what we figured would happen anyway if we were lucky enough to get tickets.  So, our numbers came around and we ended up claiming chunks of rows 6 and 7 (and maybe 8, I don't recall) in G.  Unfortunately, these seats are all in the "no standing" portion of G.  (Yes, now they're actually delineating that in advance.)  All things considered, though, it could have been much worse.

The good news for those who didn't get tickets because they were in the totally screwed group of 1000 or so that was told to go home on Friday is that there are still a handful of seats in G left, I believe mostly or all in the "no standing" portion.  I don't know what Athletics is going to do with these seats, though.  I thought I heard that small group of people who were behind us in line (those would have ended up being 801-8xx) signed a piece of paper to give themselves numbers, but I have no idea if Athletics will honor that list or not.  In any case, those of the *real* faithful who got screwed on Friday should be on the lookout, in case they want to get seats (albeit somewhat crappy seats) at face value directly from Athletics.