Tech 4 Cornell 2 (Post-Game Thread)

[daredevilcu]

I do have to admit that it is pretty amusing.  And a friend and I were just discussing how we don't understand why teams allow him to play -- pretty soon he's going to be flipping burgers somewhere.  Or in prison.

[CowbellGuy]

He was just so endearing...

[French Rage]

I'm sure this is all part of Nickerson's strategy, next thing you know he will be in the NHL and have a celebrated 20 year career.  Rich S will back me up on this.

[sah67]

[quote daredevilcu]I do have to admit that it is pretty amusing.  And a friend and I were just discussing how we don't understand why teams allow him to play -- pretty soon he's going to be flipping burgers somewhere.  Or in prison.[/quote]

Whatever happens to him, I think "He chased TPS-winger Teemu Laine around the ice and tried to abuse him." should be on his gravestone.

[lynah80]

Scott's skills didn't complement the rest of his line very well when he was skating with Gallagher and Roeszler or Gallagher and Devin.  Scott, Kennedy, and Sawada seem to have an intuitive sense for eachother's games and we've all seen how well that has worked out.

[amerks127]

I don't think maturity and experience have as great an impact on this team as pure lack of talent.  I agree with you that the team is young, but at the same time how much of a difference is it making with our seniors and juniors?  Sawada is setting up plays, but for all his experience he still is only 1+7.  What kind of seasons are Jared Seminoff, Taylor Davenport, Doug Krantz, or Tyler Mugford having?  Up until the New Year, Mike Kennedy wasn't having an outstanding season, and Evan Barlow's play has definitely dropped off the table since the beginning of the season.  Few of the guys on the team with maturity and experience are making big impacts, the one exception obviously being Topher Scott.

There is a huge amount of disparity on this team between the few players who have real hockey skills, senses, and abilities, namely Riley Nash, Colin Greening, and maybe Scott and those players who just don't have the talent to lead this team past Albany.  The team works hard, but maturity and experience aren't what we're lacking; it's players with abilities to make plays, be creative, move the puck, find shooting lanes, and most importantly capitalize on opportunities.

[Jim Hyla]

[quote amerks127]I don't think maturity and experience have as great an impact on this team as pure lack of talent.  I agree with you that the team is young, but at the same time how much of a difference is it making with our seniors and juniors?  Sawada is setting up plays, but for all his experience he still is only 1+7.  What kind of seasons are Jared Seminoff, Taylor Davenport, Doug Krantz, or Tyler Mugford having?  Up until the New Year, Mike Kennedy wasn't having an outstanding season, and Evan Barlow's play has definitely dropped off the table since the beginning of the season.  Few of the guys on the team with maturity and experience are making big impacts, the one exception obviously being Topher Scott.

There is a huge amount of disparity on this team between the few players who have real hockey skills, senses, and abilities, namely Riley Nash, Colin Greening, and maybe Scott and those players who just don't have the talent to lead this team past Albany.  The team works hard, but maturity and experience aren't what we're lacking; it's players with abilities to make plays, be creative, move the puck, find shooting lanes, and most importantly capitalize on opportunities.[/quote]

I think you missed the point. You say it's not youth but lack of talent. You then show how our mature players are not doing it. That's the point. Our most talented players are young. Young players have a lot more ups and downs than more mature players (at least you hope they learn that). Riley Nash can say that they didn't bring their A game to the first period of the Clarkson game, but you hope when he's a junior or senior he won't have that problem. Time will tell.

[min]

[quote sah67]
Whatever happens to him, I think "He chased TPS-winger Teemu Laine around the ice and tried to abuse him." should be on his gravestone.[/quote]

I believe this is the video clip of the incident:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tp6IADzXndU

Does anyone speak Finnish? I'd be interested in understanding some the comments.

[Dafatone]

I graduated, and so the only game I saw was the Thanksgiving BU debacle...

But I want to point out that Seminoff looked great that game.  He's the best one on one shutdown defender I've seen at Cornell, when he's out of the penalty box.

Maybe he's regressed, and just had a good game?

[oceanst41]

Well this game was not all that dissimilar from the BU debacle, with the quick 3-0 lead that Cornell tried to chip away at. I would say though that most night Seminoff is Cornell's best d-man.

I mean Cornell laid an egg in the first period, but at least they didn't quit on the game. They played until the final whistle, which is encouraging that a young team didn't give up and/or get chippy. They have a stretch of games coming up that they should be able to win, and three of these are at home. Like many have said they are not in bad shape within the conference, and Albany is absolutely a possibility. Not bad for a young and inexperienced team.

[Cactus12]

I agree with Jim. The fact that the upperclassmen aren't stepping up their games isn't reflective of the young talent, which IMO is fine. I think you'd be hard-pressed to find many (if any) teams across the ECAC with higher skill levels in the younger classes. Yes this is certainly bolstered by Riley Nash and Greening, but there's still talent. I do think the Schafer system is based on a level of puck control, which I'm not sure the smaller, faster players can achieve (Scott is an exception). Alternatively, they may just require more time to settle in.

Also, I think the success of the teams in the past few years bends perceptions of individual skill level. A team playing a system very well makes everyone look good. I will say, however, that I found those teams to be more diverse- penalty killers, assist guys, heavy shots, big guys, fast guys, etc. I have a hard time differentiating a bunch of this years players from one another, and I think it hurts things such as the transition game. The opponent doesn't have to adjust.

[BCrespi]

[quote Jim Hyla]
Riley Nash can say that they didn't bring their A game to the first period of the Clarkson game, but you hope when he's a junior or senior he won't have that problem. Time will tell.[/quote]

I just hope he will be a junior or senior and we have the pleasure of worrying about it.  Time will tell.

[amerks127]

I think we are all in agreement that the talent on this team is focused in the younger players.  My point, however, is that the talent on this team does not run deep.  Past the top one or two recruiting prospects, neither the freshmen nor the sophomore class show outstanding potential.  There is potential among our upperclassmen.  Sawada, Kennedy, Seminoff, Krantz, Barlow, Mugford, etc. all have the ability to be great players, but they just don't bring it every game.  This team has leadership, certainly much more than Bitz ever brought last season, but they just can't seem to play consistent, solid hockey most weekends of the season.  It's not asking a lot for passes to be crisp and for us to not turn it over in the defensive zone on a 3-on-1 breakout play.

My point is that we have maturity and experience, but it isn't put to good use.  It doesn't matter to me that Nash is a freshman and Greening is a 21 year-old sophomore.  They play as, if not more, consistent than everyone else on the team.  I am not overly optimistic that our freshman and sophomore classes suddenly gaining 2 years of experience would factor much into this team.

Patrick Kennedy, Riley Nash (who will definitely not be here for his senior year, let alone his junior one), Colin Greening, Brendon Nash, Blake Gallagher (all of 5 points), and maybe Mike Devin all show good potential.  But hypothetically if we gave all the freshman and sophomores two more years experience, how much better off would this team be?  With players like Roeszler, Johnston, Krueger's play of late, Scali, Berk, Joe Devin, and Nicholls filling crucial roles, I wouldn't bet the house.  They may play a little smarter, but I don't think their games are going to make substantial improvements.

You are obviously still free to disagree, but the fact of the matter is maturity and experience can only get you so far.  You need talent to win championships.  Our talent being stuck in semi-consistent freshman and sophomores is not the problem.  The problem is that there are serious disparities on this team between the very few players with great talent and players without.  I hear our next recruiting classes look promising in positions, among others, goaltending, and hopefully they will complement the underclassmen we have now.

[marty]

[quote amerks127]
My point is that we have maturity and experience, but it isn't put to good use.  It doesn't matter to me that Nash is a freshman and Greening is a 21 year-old sophomore.  They play as, if not more, consistent than everyone else on the team.  I am not overly optimistic that our freshman and sophomore classes suddenly gaining 2 years of experience would factor much into this team.[/quote]

I'm glad I don't have the same overly negative outlook.  It's a lot more fun to go to the games and expect that players will improve during their years at school.  All won't - many do - and some who seem totally inept as freshmen can grow into scoring aces whose shorthanded heroics can put a smile on my face (when reminiscing ;-) ) for the rest of my life.

http://elf.elynah.com/read.php?1,15508,15508#msg-15508

[amerks127]

Okay before bed, let me clarify myself one last time... I'm talking specifically about this year's team.  As I implied in my first statement, this team can find its identity and perform well, but all players must be committed to winning and playing their best.  If we don't come out and play 100% of the game, the team will not win against quality teams.  We've seen what happens when we fall asleep at the wheel...3 goals against BU and Clarkson twice, as well as that comeback against Lowell.  When we're on, we can compete with teams such as UMass.  It takes a complete game of solid hockey for this team to have a chance at winning.  I'm happy with our ECAC results this season...but I think we can all agree that the ECAC is remarkably mediocre this season.

I'm excited for future seasons because our talent is concentrated in the younger players, and I hope that the next two season's of recruitments can complement the underclassmen we currently have.  I'm not saying that one of the current underclassmen won't breakthrough...certainly that Iggy comment speaks to that...but the play of the freshmen and sophomores is not encouraging at this point in the season.  The fact that Riley Nash will leave early, and Greening might not stay 4 years is also a dark cloud considering we don't have the depth of teams past.

I'm just a sophomore, I haven't been spoiled by the 2003-2006 runs.  I want to be here when the team at least makes the NCAA's, and while I can be optimistic about that, I also have to be realistic about the current state of the team.