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General Category => Other Sports => Topic started by: rss77 on October 24, 2024, 09:47:37 PM

Title: Cornell-Brown varsity football 10/26/24
Post by: rss77 on October 24, 2024, 09:47:37 PM
Starting the thread.   Offensive fireworks?
Title: Re: Cornell-Brown varsity football 10/26/24
Post by: Ken711 on October 25, 2024, 10:49:39 AM
Brown ranks #28 in total yards averaging 395 yards per game.  Cornell is #33 averaging 393 yards per game.  Brown has a better defense though.
Title: Re: Cornell-Brown varsity football 10/26/24
Post by: Jeff Hopkins '82 on October 25, 2024, 10:31:04 PM
I just watched a high school football game with the final score of 63-55.  The two running backs for the school that scored the 63 had over 530 yards rushing between them - one with over 300 yds and the other with about 230 yds.

Hard to top that in tomorrow's game but it would be fun to see them try!
Title: Re: Cornell-Brown varsity football 10/26/24
Post by: Ken711 on October 26, 2024, 09:07:24 AM
Quote from: Jeff Hopkins '82I just watched a high school football game with the final score of 63-55.  The two running backs for the school that scored the 63 had over 530 yards rushing between them - one with over 300 yds and the other with about 230 yds.

Hard to top that in tomorrow's game but it would be fun to see them try!

Makes me remember the tremendous records that Ed Marinaro established playing at Cornell.

Quote"When you think of records, think of Ed Marinaro. He played 27 games for Cornell, 1969-1971, and averaged 174.6 rushing yards per game. That tops O. J. Simpson, Herschel Walker, Tony Dorsett and many other great running backs. Marinaro had 10 games in which he exceeded 200 yards; this includes, in 1969, 245 against Rutgers, 281 against Harvard; in 1970, 260 against Lehigh; in 1971, 272 against Columbia, 260 against Colgate. In 1971, his average was 209 a game, an NCAA record that lasted 10 years. That year he led the nation in scoring, rushing and all-purpose running."
Title: Re: Cornell-Brown varsity football 10/26/24
Post by: ugarte on October 26, 2024, 01:16:53 PM
Noon start, not 1. 7-3 good guys with 10 seconds left in the first half. Cornell let Brown get close enough for a long FG try and... the kick will be ~48 yards and Cornell tries to ice the kicker... and it "works" - no good. 7-3 at the half.
Title: Re: Cornell-Brown varsity football 10/26/24
Post by: mike1960 on October 26, 2024, 01:38:15 PM
Quote from: ugarteNoon start, not 1. 7-3 good guys with 10 seconds left in the first half. Cornell let Brown get close enough for a long FG try and... the kick will be ~48 yards and Cornell tries to ice the kicker... and it "works" - no good. 7-3 at the half.

I missed the first half because of the start time! So far, so good.
Title: Re: Cornell-Brown varsity football 10/26/24
Post by: ugarte on October 26, 2024, 02:07:09 PM
Quote from: mike1960
Quote from: ugarteNoon start, not 1. 7-3 good guys with 10 seconds left in the first half. Cornell let Brown get close enough for a long FG try and... the kick will be ~48 yards and Cornell tries to ice the kicker... and it "works" - no good. 7-3 at the half.

I missed the first half because of the start time! So far, so good.
Cornell got an interception on Brown's opening drive of the half then used the short field to take a 14-3 lead on a one-yard Wang run. Cornell (same DB, actually) just picked off Brown for the second time in the half on a deep shot. Wang ran for a first down to get the Red out of the shadow of their own end zone.
Title: Re: Cornell-Brown varsity football 10/26/24
Post by: ugarte on October 26, 2024, 02:11:55 PM
A third interception for Cornell in the second half! (under review for whether he's in bounds... CONFIRMED!)
Title: Re: Cornell-Brown varsity football 10/26/24
Post by: mike1960 on October 26, 2024, 02:12:01 PM
Wow! Is that three oskies on the day?
Title: Re: Cornell-Brown varsity football 10/26/24
Post by: ugarte on October 26, 2024, 02:17:08 PM
Another great catch by Doryn Smith after the interception for ~50 then a DPI on a deep shot to Kurtz. Back in the red zone... oh man Zoller wide open in the end zone but Wang misses him. Then a sloppy pass on a screen to Musungu, who had room to run.

Third down pass is perfect and Woodring catches the post in the end zone. Kick is good and Cornell is up 21-3.
Title: Re: Cornell-Brown varsity football 10/26/24
Post by: ugarte on October 26, 2024, 02:24:21 PM
Deep pass for a Brown TD, beating Doryn Smith. Kick good, 21-10 with 2:20 left in Q3.
Title: Re: Cornell-Brown varsity football 10/26/24
Post by: mike1960 on October 26, 2024, 02:28:42 PM
Momentum is turning. We need defensive stop here.

Edit: That excellent punt and coverage really helps!
Title: Re: Cornell-Brown varsity football 10/26/24
Post by: ugarte on October 26, 2024, 02:29:49 PM
Cornell has to punt but it's a beauty. Downed at the 2 with just under a minute left in the quarter.
Title: Re: Cornell-Brown varsity football 10/26/24
Post by: Al DeFlorio on October 26, 2024, 02:30:29 PM
Should have used up 3rd period clock.  Some strange play-calling.
Title: Re: Cornell-Brown varsity football 10/26/24
Post by: mike1960 on October 26, 2024, 02:32:05 PM
Quote from: Al DeFlorioShould have used up 3rd period clock.  Some strange play-calling.

Not much run game today. 54 yards total so far.
Title: Re: Cornell-Brown varsity football 10/26/24
Post by: ugarte on October 26, 2024, 02:34:35 PM
Quote from: Al DeFlorioShould have used up 3rd period clock.  Some strange play-calling.
The third period clock is not a meaningful thing, imo.

In any event, Brown QB evades a sack in the end zone, throws up a duck ... and a Brown WR outjumps the coverage for a 30 yard gain before the end of the quarter.
Title: Re: Cornell-Brown varsity football 10/26/24
Post by: mike1960 on October 26, 2024, 02:37:08 PM
Not sure why the refs didn't call targeting there.
Title: Re: Cornell-Brown varsity football 10/26/24
Post by: mike1960 on October 26, 2024, 02:37:54 PM
The zero blitz is giving the Brown QB lots of trouble.
Title: Re: Cornell-Brown varsity football 10/26/24
Post by: ugarte on October 26, 2024, 02:41:50 PM
Quote from: mike1960Not sure why the refs didn't call targeting there.
imobecause the contact was more glancing than devastating.

ugh cornell allows a 4th down conversion, another deep sideline pass then a qb scramble to the pyl... no, stepped out at the 1. First and goal Brown, though.

EDIT: Run up the middle for an easy score, Brown goes for 2 ... and false starts. Now they are kicking... 21-17 Cornell. Potentially huge penalty.
Title: Re: Cornell-Brown varsity football 10/26/24
Post by: Al DeFlorio on October 26, 2024, 02:42:58 PM
Quote from: ugarte
Quote from: Al DeFlorioShould have used up 3rd period clock.  Some strange play-calling.
The third period clock is not a meaningful thing, imo.

In any event, Brown QB evades a sack in the end zone, throws up a duck ... and a Brown WR outjumps the coverage for a 30 yard gain before the end of the quarter.
It is when the wind is in your face and you want it in the opponent's.
Title: Re: Cornell-Brown varsity football 10/26/24
Post by: mike1960 on October 26, 2024, 02:44:34 PM
Since the Big Red don't have a run game today, they can't really run down the clock. Their mindset will probably be to go down and score a touchdown through the air and put this game to bed.
Title: Re: Cornell-Brown varsity football 10/26/24
Post by: ugarte on October 26, 2024, 02:45:33 PM
Quote from: Al DeFlorio
Quote from: ugarte
Quote from: Al DeFlorioShould have used up 3rd period clock.  Some strange play-calling.
The third period clock is not a meaningful thing, imo.

In any event, Brown QB evades a sack in the end zone, throws up a duck ... and a Brown WR outjumps the coverage for a 30 yard gain before the end of the quarter.
It is when the wind is in your face and you want it in the opponent's.
Wind is being talked about a lot but doesn't seem to be affecting anything. If anything, everyone is throwing more than you'd expect on a windy day.
Title: Re: Cornell-Brown varsity football 10/26/24
Post by: Al DeFlorio on October 26, 2024, 02:46:57 PM
Quote from: mike1960Since the Big Red don't have a run game today, they can't really run down the clock. Their mindset will probably be to go down and score a touchdown through the air and put this game to bed.
You're smarter than that.  You don't snap the ball with 25 seconds still on the play clock.
Title: Re: Cornell-Brown varsity football 10/26/24
Post by: Trotsky on October 26, 2024, 02:47:09 PM
NESN carrying this so I can watch it on the idiot box.  LGR!
Title: Re: Cornell-Brown varsity football 10/26/24
Post by: ugarte on October 26, 2024, 02:49:39 PM
Quote from: TrotskyNESN carrying this so I can watch it on the idiot box.  LGR!
Maybe that explains the noon start. Boomer is at the game but no Olbermann.

Cornell penalty on the kickoff return, but a 16 yard pass to the 31 follows. Wang overthrew an open Woodring on a skinny post then underthrows Musungu. Our receivers are getting open and Wang has to do a better job here.

On third down another overthrow and a very generous DPI bails out Cornell. No! They pick up the flag, probably for an uncatchable ball.
Title: Re: Cornell-Brown varsity football 10/26/24
Post by: mike1960 on October 26, 2024, 02:50:53 PM
That was interference! He had a handful of jersey!
Title: Re: Cornell-Brown varsity football 10/26/24
Post by: mike1960 on October 26, 2024, 02:51:49 PM
Defense needs to win the game for us today right here.
Title: Re: Cornell-Brown varsity football 10/26/24
Post by: ugarte on October 26, 2024, 02:52:17 PM
Damn another great punt. 68 yards but the bounce is just a bit too strong and it goes into the end zone.
Title: Re: Cornell-Brown varsity football 10/26/24
Post by: Scersk '97 on October 26, 2024, 02:53:27 PM
Unfathomable play calling up 4 in the early part of the 4th quarter. You run the ball and also direct your offense to slow down the snap count.

The clock is your friend. Why ignore your friend?

Doesn't matter if your run game is not great. You have to eat clock. Run delay quarterback runs or something.
Title: Re: Cornell-Brown varsity football 10/26/24
Post by: mike1960 on October 26, 2024, 02:55:19 PM
That crossing route is wide open almost every time Brown runs it.
Title: Re: Cornell-Brown varsity football 10/26/24
Post by: ugarte on October 26, 2024, 02:56:32 PM
You people are nuts. You can't eat clock on offense in a one-score game when your defense isn't doing anything. If Brown scores here, the clock you're wasting is your own! At least Al was making an argument about the wind, which I disagree with but is debatable.
Title: Re: Cornell-Brown varsity football 10/26/24
Post by: mike1960 on October 26, 2024, 02:59:57 PM
I'm shocked Brown isn't going for it.
Title: Re: Cornell-Brown varsity football 10/26/24
Post by: ugarte on October 26, 2024, 03:01:24 PM
Wow the penalty on the 2-point conversion really a big deal as the Cornell defense sort of holds and it's 21-20 with ~5 minutes left in the game. Need to eat clock but reallllly need to convert some first downs and make Brown use their time outs.
Title: Re: Cornell-Brown varsity football 10/26/24
Post by: mike1960 on October 26, 2024, 03:01:51 PM
Cornell can score here. The receivers have been open all second half. Jameson just needs to throw some accurate balls.
Title: Re: Cornell-Brown varsity football 10/26/24
Post by: Scersk '97 on October 26, 2024, 03:03:43 PM
Quote from: ugarteYou people are nuts. You can't eat clock on offense in a one-score game when your defense isn't doing anything. If Brown scores here, the clock you're wasting is your own! At least Al was making an argument about the wind, which I disagree with but is debatable.

Quote from: ugarteWow the penalty on the 2-point conversion really a big deal as the Cornell defense sort of holds and it's 21-20 with ~5 minutes left in the game. Need to eat clock but reallllly need to convert some first downs and make Brown use their time outs.

Of course, a foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds.
Title: Re: Cornell-Brown varsity football 10/26/24
Post by: Al DeFlorio on October 26, 2024, 03:04:48 PM
Quote from: Scersk '97Unfathomable play calling up 4 in the early part of the 4th quarter. You run the ball and also direct your offense to slow down the snap count.

The clock is your friend. Why ignore your friend?

Doesn't matter if your run game is not great. You have to eat clock. Run delay quarterback runs or something.
Where have zi read this before?
Title: Re: Cornell-Brown varsity football 10/26/24
Post by: ugarte on October 26, 2024, 03:05:22 PM
Quote from: mike1960Cornell can score here. The receivers have been open all second half. Jameson just needs to throw some accurate balls.
Would be nice to run more routes with a margin for error but I agree (and have been writing) that he's been wild.

First down a run into the line by Pope for nothing. Option run... for 3. I guess we're running clock now but we need the first down on 3d and 6. Brown still has 3 time outs. And... another horrible overthrow and the clock stops and we have to punt with 3:59 left.
Title: Re: Cornell-Brown varsity football 10/26/24
Post by: mike1960 on October 26, 2024, 03:06:34 PM
Didn't like the play calling there. Two running plays were almost guaranteed to lead to 3rd and long. We are a passing team. Let's go to our strength.
Title: Re: Cornell-Brown varsity football 10/26/24
Post by: mike1960 on October 26, 2024, 03:07:17 PM
Our defense wins or loses the game for us right here.
Title: Re: Cornell-Brown varsity football 10/26/24
Post by: ugarte on October 26, 2024, 03:07:31 PM
Quote from: Scersk '97
Quote from: ugarteYou people are nuts. You can't eat clock on offense in a one-score game when your defense isn't doing anything. If Brown scores here, the clock you're wasting is your own! At least Al was making an argument about the wind, which I disagree with but is debatable.

Quote from: ugarteWow the penalty on the 2-point conversion really a big deal as the Cornell defense sort of holds and it's 21-20 with ~5 minutes left in the game. Need to eat clock but reallllly need to convert some first downs and make Brown use their time outs.

Of course, a foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds.
1) You don't think the game circumstances are different? 2) the decision to sort of run clock in the abstract pales in comparison to the need to actually get first downs, which i think i said pretty clearly. the ineffective running by Cornell burned about a minute of clock and Brown still has plenty of time as long as they can move the ball.

There's a difference between looking backwards and thinking that wasting more time would have been good (after all of the passes fall incomplete) or whether it is strategically wise to run ineffectively a couple of times when your defense still has to hold for the majority of the 4th quarter.
Title: Re: Cornell-Brown varsity football 10/26/24
Post by: Al DeFlorio on October 26, 2024, 03:09:00 PM
Quote from: ugarteYou people are nuts. You can't eat clock on offense in a one-score game when your defense isn't doing anything. If Brown scores here, the clock you're wasting is your own! At least Al was making an argument about the wind, which I disagree with but is debatable.
Not late in the third period with a three and then two-score lead.
Title: Re: Cornell-Brown varsity football 10/26/24
Post by: ugarte on October 26, 2024, 03:11:12 PM
Quote from: Al DeFlorio
Quote from: ugarteYou people are nuts. You can't eat clock on offense in a one-score game when your defense isn't doing anything. If Brown scores here, the clock you're wasting is your own! At least Al was making an argument about the wind, which I disagree with but is debatable.
Not late in the third period with a three and then two-score lead.
The most time you could have wasted there was ~30 seconds with 15 minutes to play. You're the only person thinking that's a clock management decision.
Title: Re: Cornell-Brown varsity football 10/26/24
Post by: ugarte on October 26, 2024, 03:13:35 PM
Huge 4th and 4 decision... Brown going to go for it instead of kicking for 47... converts but :35 seconds left and still a long attempt.
Title: Re: Cornell-Brown varsity football 10/26/24
Post by: Al DeFlorio on October 26, 2024, 03:15:00 PM
Quote from: ugarte
Quote from: Al DeFlorio
Quote from: ugarteYou people are nuts. You can't eat clock on offense in a one-score game when your defense isn't doing anything. If Brown scores here, the clock you're wasting is your own! At least Al was making an argument about the wind, which I disagree with but is debatable.
Not late in the third period with a three and then two-score lead.
The most time you could have wasted there was ~30 seconds with 15 minutes to play. You're the only person thinking that's a clock management decision.
No, you're the only person in the world who'd rather punt and pass into a strong wind rather than with it at your back.  Context, man, don't they teach that in law school? I was posting that THEN, not now.
Title: Re: Cornell-Brown varsity football 10/26/24
Post by: mike1960 on October 26, 2024, 03:15:21 PM
Quote from: ugarteHuge 4th and 4 decision... Brown going to go for it instead of kicking for 47... converts but :35 seconds left and still a long attempt.

Zero blitz and the Brown QB handled it. But the reason the Brown Bears are successful today is that they ran the ball well on us late in the game.
Title: Re: Cornell-Brown varsity football 10/26/24
Post by: ugarte on October 26, 2024, 03:16:11 PM
Brown running pretty effectively and gets the ball to the 16 with 25 seconds to go.
Title: Re: Cornell-Brown varsity football 10/26/24
Post by: ugarte on October 26, 2024, 03:17:20 PM
Quote from: Al DeFlorio
Quote from: ugarte
Quote from: Al DeFlorio
Quote from: ugarteYou people are nuts. You can't eat clock on offense in a one-score game when your defense isn't doing anything. If Brown scores here, the clock you're wasting is your own! At least Al was making an argument about the wind, which I disagree with but is debatable.
Not late in the third period with a three and then two-score lead.
The most time you could have wasted there was ~30 seconds with 15 minutes to play. You're the only person thinking that's a clock management decision.
No, you're the only person in the world who'd rather punt and pass into a strong wind rather than with it at your back.  Context, man, don't they teach that in law school? I was posting that THEN, not now.
I already said that the wind explanation made sense, even if I disagree because it doesn't actually seem to be affecting anything!
Title: Re: Cornell-Brown varsity football 10/26/24
Post by: ugarte on October 26, 2024, 03:19:29 PM
Almost a pick in the end zone AND almost a touchdown but it's incomplete, then a run up the middle and Brown almost forgets to call time out before the clock expires lol.

Well, one second left and an attempt from 29... and Cornell tries to ice the kicker again... good and Brown is rushing the field for some reason. Homecoming, I guess?
Title: Re: Cornell-Brown varsity football 10/26/24
Post by: ugarte on October 26, 2024, 03:21:23 PM
This was a very winnable game but Wang's passing touch is ... I don't know where. Not great. His receivers and tight ends are so good, too.
Title: Re: Cornell-Brown varsity football 10/26/24
Post by: Al DeFlorio on October 26, 2024, 03:21:40 PM
Quote from: ugarte
Quote from: Al DeFlorio
Quote from: ugarte
Quote from: Al DeFlorio
Quote from: ugarteYou people are nuts. You can't eat clock on offense in a one-score game when your defense isn't doing anything. If Brown scores here, the clock you're wasting is your own! At least Al was making an argument about the wind, which I disagree with but is debatable.
Not late in the third period with a three and then two-score lead.
The most time you could have wasted there was ~30 seconds with 15 minutes to play. You're the only person thinking that's a clock management decision.
No, you're the only person in the world who'd rather punt and pass into a strong wind rather than with it at your back.  Context, man, don't they teach that in law school? I was posting that THEN, not now.
I already said that the wind explanation made sense, even if I disagree because it doesn't actually seem to be affecting anything!
Did you know it wasn't affecting anything with minutes left in the third quarter?  It sure affected the two Cornell punts that put Brown on Cornell's side of the 50.
Title: Re: Cornell-Brown varsity football 10/26/24
Post by: mike1960 on October 26, 2024, 03:21:41 PM
A very disappointing loss. Our run defense has been a problem all year. We're getting moved off the line of scrimmage way too often.
Title: Re: Cornell-Brown varsity football 10/26/24
Post by: David Harding on October 26, 2024, 03:23:15 PM
Quote from: ugarteThis was a very winnable game but Wang's passing touch is ... I don't know where. Not great. His receivers and tight ends are so good, too.
It couldn't have anything to do with the oft-mentioned wind, could it?
Title: Re: Cornell-Brown varsity football 10/26/24
Post by: Scersk '97 on October 26, 2024, 03:23:49 PM
Quote from: ugarte
Quote from: Scersk '97
Quote from: ugarteYou people are nuts. You can't eat clock on offense in a one-score game when your defense isn't doing anything. If Brown scores here, the clock you're wasting is your own! At least Al was making an argument about the wind, which I disagree with but is debatable.

Quote from: ugarteWow the penalty on the 2-point conversion really a big deal as the Cornell defense sort of holds and it's 21-20 with ~5 minutes left in the game. Need to eat clock but reallllly need to convert some first downs and make Brown use their time outs.

Of course, a foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds.
1) You don't think the game circumstances are different? 2) the decision to sort of run clock in the abstract pales in comparison to the need to actually get first downs, which i think i said pretty clearly. the ineffective running by Cornell burned about a minute of clock and Brown still has plenty of time as long as they can move the ball.

There's a difference between looking backwards and thinking that wasting more time would have been good (after all of the passes fall incomplete) or whether it is strategically wise to run ineffectively a couple of times when your defense still has to hold for the majority of the 4th quarter.

My point is that if you waste time the first time you have the chance, Brown has far less time at the end of the game to march down the field for a winning field goal.

Or, perhaps Brown goes for it on 4th and 5 (due to time pressure) instead of kicking the first (of the last two) field goals and blows it.

Either way, we lost the game because we can't run the ball and Brown can. That's what has to change.
Title: Re: Cornell-Brown varsity football 10/26/24
Post by: ugarte on October 26, 2024, 03:25:55 PM
Quote from: Scersk '97
Quote from: ugarte
Quote from: Scersk '97
Quote from: ugarteYou people are nuts. You can't eat clock on offense in a one-score game when your defense isn't doing anything. If Brown scores here, the clock you're wasting is your own! At least Al was making an argument about the wind, which I disagree with but is debatable.

Quote from: ugarteWow the penalty on the 2-point conversion really a big deal as the Cornell defense sort of holds and it's 21-20 with ~5 minutes left in the game. Need to eat clock but reallllly need to convert some first downs and make Brown use their time outs.

Of course, a foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds.
1) You don't think the game circumstances are different? 2) the decision to sort of run clock in the abstract pales in comparison to the need to actually get first downs, which i think i said pretty clearly. the ineffective running by Cornell burned about a minute of clock and Brown still has plenty of time as long as they can move the ball.

There's a difference between looking backwards and thinking that wasting more time would have been good (after all of the passes fall incomplete) or whether it is strategically wise to run ineffectively a couple of times when your defense still has to hold for the majority of the 4th quarter.

My point is that if you waste time the first time you have the chance, Brown has far less time at the end of the game to march down the field for a winning field goal.

Or, perhaps Brown goes for it on 4th and 5 (due to time pressure) instead of kicking the first (of the last two) field goals and blows it.

Either way, we lost the game because we can't run the ball and Brown can. That's what has to change.
Butterfly flapping it's wings, man. You don't waste time when you don't know what it means.

As for Wang's passing, if the coaches thought the wind was a problem they probably would have stopped dialing up plays that required 20 yard throws. He was just spraying the ball. Willcox certainly didn't have a problem hitting  his receivers and he was the one throwing into the problematic wind.
Title: Re: Cornell-Brown varsity football 10/26/24
Post by: Scersk '97 on October 26, 2024, 03:33:33 PM
Quote from: ugarte
Quote from: Scersk '97My point is that if you waste time the first time you have the chance, Brown has far less time at the end of the game to march down the field for a winning field goal.

Or, perhaps Brown goes for it on 4th and 5 (due to time pressure) instead of kicking the first (of the last two) field goals and blows it.

Either way, we lost the game because we can't run the ball and Brown can. That's what has to change.
Butterfly flapping it's wings, man. You don't waste time when you don't know what it means.

Perhaps valid early, but I think in the 4th you know what time means already. If you're ahead, you burn clock; in this particular case, you burn clock because you're ahead and Brown is mostly depending on the run.

Exactly zero of these games will (or should) turn into an ACC-style (or old Pac-12 After Dark-style) score-fest, because our team doesn't have the offensive skill to trade scores.
Title: Re: Cornell-Brown varsity football 10/26/24
Post by: Ken711 on October 26, 2024, 04:00:04 PM
In my view the two weak areas are a running game and DL line play, Cornell needs develop a somewhat balanced running game which they appear to be addressing with some potentially impactful RBs in this years recruiting class.  They have the smallest DL in the Ivy League by far, and again assuming they can keep the recruits they have on this years recruiting class list committed, they have some big DL recruits coming in as well.
Title: Re: Cornell-Brown varsity football 10/26/24
Post by: upprdeck on October 26, 2024, 04:09:33 PM
I think letting Brown run a 100 plays with the offense playing so poorly in the 2nd half led to the D failing down the stretch
Title: Re: Cornell-Brown varsity football 10/26/24
Post by: scoop85 on October 26, 2024, 04:16:43 PM
Quote from: Ken711In my view the two weak areas are a running game and DL line play, Cornell needs develop a somewhat balanced running game which they appear to be addressing with some potentially impactful RBs in this years recruiting class.  They have the smallest DL in the Ivy League by far, and again assuming they can keep the recruits they have on this years recruiting class list committed, they have some big DL recruits coming in as well.

Yeah, that's pretty much how I see it. Pope won't scare anyone, and I'm surprised we don't have a better option. The DL does get pushed back on pretty much any running play. But for today's game, I think the play calling in the fourth Q got away from what had been working, and our execution was just a bit off. No other way to say it but it was a blown opportunity.
Title: Re: Cornell-Brown varsity football 10/26/24
Post by: ugarte on October 26, 2024, 05:14:41 PM
Quote from: Al DeFlorio
Quote from: ugarte
Quote from: Al DeFlorio
Quote from: ugarte
Quote from: Al DeFlorio
Quote from: ugarteYou people are nuts. You can't eat clock on offense in a one-score game when your defense isn't doing anything. If Brown scores here, the clock you're wasting is your own! At least Al was making an argument about the wind, which I disagree with but is debatable.
Not late in the third period with a three and then two-score lead.
The most time you could have wasted there was ~30 seconds with 15 minutes to play. You're the only person thinking that's a clock management decision.
No, you're the only person in the world who'd rather punt and pass into a strong wind rather than with it at your back.  Context, man, don't they teach that in law school? I was posting that THEN, not now.
I already said that the wind explanation made sense, even if I disagree because it doesn't actually seem to be affecting anything!
Did you know it wasn't affecting anything with minutes left in the third quarter?  It sure affected the two Cornell punts that put Brown on Cornell's side of the 50.
Yes, the two punts that were probably affected by the wind were from the shadow of the end zone. On the other hand, attached are the two drives to close the quarter. The Cornell drive that you think should have been more time consuming started with 2:20 left. After the receivers were let down by their quarterback, we had to punt from around midfield. Our punter dropped a beauty, the ball checked up inside the 10 and was downed on the 2. Brown had the wind for :59. They ran once, passed once (a near safety, a wobbly ball, but complete anyway for 27 yards). Then they ran again.

I'm apparently not the only one who wasn't all that concerned with the direction of the wind at that point in the game.
Title: Re: Cornell-Brown varsity football 10/26/24
Post by: rss77 on October 27, 2024, 12:20:11 PM
Watching the game-some observations:

It all comes down to execution-the missed pass on the 4th and 1 in the 1st qtr, the off target passes in the 2nd half-if the had pulled those off Cornell wins the game (IMO).
Also-the one overturned call-should that at least been defensive holding?  Also-there were a couple of borderline horse collar tackles on Wang (How do the officials define a horse collar tackle?)
Offensive Line could not create openings on traditional run plays and would not have mattered who carried the ball. Looked at total yardage and time of possession for Brown-the 4th quarter definitely a killer.
Title: Re: Cornell-Brown varsity football 10/26/24
Post by: mike1960 on October 27, 2024, 12:39:20 PM
Quote from: rss77Watching the game-some observations:

It all comes down to execution-the missed pass on the 4th and 1 in the 1st qtr, the off target passes in the 2nd half-if the had pulled those off Cornell wins the game (IMO).
Also-the one overturned call-should that at least been defensive holding?  Also-there were a couple of borderline horse collar tackles on Wang (How do the officials define a horse collar tackle?)
Offensive Line could not create openings on traditional run plays and would not have mattered who carried the ball. Looked at total yardage and time of possession for Brown-the 4th quarter definitely a killer.

Agreed. The refs didn't call the egregious pass interference. If we scored there, the game may have been much different.

The bottom line is that we need to stop the run. Any defensive coordinator will say that's job one. Our d-linemen need to grab and rip and find the ball. You don't to be an NFL prospect to do the fundamentals.

LGR!!
Title: Re: Cornell-Brown varsity football 10/26/24
Post by: Swampy on October 28, 2024, 12:42:19 AM
Quote from: mike1960
Quote from: rss77Watching the game-some observations:

It all comes down to execution-the missed pass on the 4th and 1 in the 1st qtr, the off target passes in the 2nd half-if the had pulled those off Cornell wins the game (IMO).
Also-the one overturned call-should that at least been defensive holding?  Also-there were a couple of borderline horse collar tackles on Wang (How do the officials define a horse collar tackle?)
Offensive Line could not create openings on traditional run plays and would not have mattered who carried the ball. Looked at total yardage and time of possession for Brown-the 4th quarter definitely a killer.

Agreed. The refs didn't call the egregious pass interference. If we scored there, the game may have been much different.

The bottom line is that we need to stop the run. Any defensive coordinator will say that's job one. Our d-linemen need to grab and rip and find the ball. You don't to be an NFL prospect to do the fundamentals.

LGR!!

I had the impression that we lost the game on our lines -- both offensive & defensive. Offensively, we couldn't run the ball, and Brown did a good job keeping our running backs bottled up. They also put substantial pressure on Wang when he tried to pass. Defensively, we couldn't stop Brown's running game during the second half. According to the Ivy League (https://ivyleague.com/boxscore.aspx?id=7ltyipP022aUJKmSgYVs3wXi7up73ghniwD5ElWyd07J7BNseBaMQePf0fY%2F3yUPXaFieFsm97j66k9PVxiMmJ5vlmnmPWyK%2BEjoZPC%2BceE1wEO4ctEgTbMtzf%2B0f2A2SWZil5omUfPh50kxzSvh2gtPAdzeEE3D0r7ktWhGfJI%3D&path=football), we managed to rush for 58 yards, and Brown rushed for 214. Passing was a bit closer, with us gaining 265 yards, and Brown gaining 316.

The statistics are partly influenced by the 21-3 lead we established in the first half. Nonetheless, it's hard to view the statistics and not come away feeling that the better team won.

IIRC, at the game someone said we have the lightest offensive & defensive lines in the Ivy League. Can someone please confirm this?

It would be instructive to compare the weights and size of the offensive & defensive linemen on this year's team with that of the recruits reportedly coming next fall. We have to get bigger & stronger.
Title: Re: Cornell-Brown varsity football 10/26/24
Post by: Ken711 on October 28, 2024, 08:56:04 AM
Quote from: Swampy
Quote from: mike1960
Quote from: rss77Watching the game-some observations:

It all comes down to execution-the missed pass on the 4th and 1 in the 1st qtr, the off target passes in the 2nd half-if the had pulled those off Cornell wins the game (IMO).
Also-the one overturned call-should that at least been defensive holding?  Also-there were a couple of borderline horse collar tackles on Wang (How do the officials define a horse collar tackle?)
Offensive Line could not create openings on traditional run plays and would not have mattered who carried the ball. Looked at total yardage and time of possession for Brown-the 4th quarter definitely a killer.

Agreed. The refs didn't call the egregious pass interference. If we scored there, the game may have been much different.

The bottom line is that we need to stop the run. Any defensive coordinator will say that's job one. Our d-linemen need to grab and rip and find the ball. You don't to be an NFL prospect to do the fundamentals.

LGR!!

I had the impression that we lost the game on our lines -- both offensive & defensive. Offensively, we couldn't run the ball, and Brown did a good job keeping our running backs bottled up. They also put substantial pressure on Wang when he tried to pass. Defensively, we couldn't stop Brown's running game during the second half. According to the Ivy League (https://ivyleague.com/boxscore.aspx?id=7ltyipP022aUJKmSgYVs3wXi7up73ghniwD5ElWyd07J7BNseBaMQePf0fY%2F3yUPXaFieFsm97j66k9PVxiMmJ5vlmnmPWyK%2BEjoZPC%2BceE1wEO4ctEgTbMtzf%2B0f2A2SWZil5omUfPh50kxzSvh2gtPAdzeEE3D0r7ktWhGfJI%3D&path=football), we managed to rush for 58 yards, and Brown rushed for 214. Passing was a bit closer, with us gaining 265 yards, and Brown gaining 316.

The statistics are partly influenced by the 21-3 lead we established in the first half. Nonetheless, it's hard to view the statistics and not come away feeling that the better team won.

IIRC, at the game someone said we have the lightest offensive & defensive lines in the Ivy League. Can someone please confirm this?

It would be instructive to compare the weights and size of the offensive & defensive linemen on this year's team with that of the recruits reportedly coming next fall. We have to get bigger & stronger.

I wouldn't say our OL is the smallest weight wise in the OL, but Cornell's DL most definitely is.  As for the DL recruits coming in, we have a 270 and a 320 pound DL recruits so far.
Title: Re: Cornell-Brown varsity football 10/26/24
Post by: mike1960 on October 28, 2024, 11:46:38 AM
You don't have to be a huge defensive lineman to be effective, although some size is critical. They have to have work on the proper techniques to shed the blocker, clog the lanes, and find the ball -- proper alignment, hips, hands, rip, all that stuff.
Title: Re: Cornell-Brown varsity football 10/26/24
Post by: Local Motion on October 30, 2024, 02:28:46 PM
Similar to some of our other losses, Brown ran the ball for 218 yards and Cornell logged only 58 yards, with most of them coming from our Quarterback.  As a result we lost time of possession and our defense just tired out in the 2nd half.   Our three running backs combined rushing was only 8 carries for 17 yards.   Jameson Wang had a good day with 49 passing attempts for 299 yards, but statisticaly when you throw the ball that many times most teams lose the game. This was a winnable game with just a couple of rushing first downs in the second half would have burned enough clock and kept our defense off the field, and the score is 21-20 in favor of the Big Red.

If you look at the history of Cornell football, all three Ivy League titles (we only have three shared titles) were the result of a strong running game with guys like Marinaro, Malaga, and McNiff/Oliaro.   Ask any offensive lineman, it's a lot more fun to run block than pass block.  If you have less talent on the OL, it's also easier to run block than pass block.   It's not rocket science just football 101.  Go Big Red!