First Round (Single Game):
12 Dartmouth at 5 Colgate
11 Brown at 6 Clarkson
10 Yale at 7 RPI
9 Princeton at 8 Union
Friday or Saturday?
they look to be Sat games,
I can see Yale and/or Princeton pulling off upsets.
Although Colgate has had a razorblade to the nuts of a February. Playing the same schedule as we did, their last regulation win (https://www.uscho.com/scoreboard/colgate/mens-hockey/) was 1/21 -- the weekend we both beat Q and gave them their only two losses in the ECAC.
Colagate at home
Beat brown/yale
Beat Dart/Harv
Beat Princ/Quin
Lost Union/RPI
Beat Cornell
Beat STL/Clark
so 4 OT/extra time wins out of 9..
So
if the higher seeds advance, the quarterfinals become:
1 Quinnipiac hosts 9 Princeton at 8 Union
2 Harvard hosts 10 Yale at 7 RPI
3 Cornell hosts 11 Brown at 6 Clarkson
4 St Lawrence hosts 12 Dartmouth at 5 Colgate
ECAC schedule shows all first-round games, single-elimination, as Saturday 3/4 at 7 pm.
Quote from: billhowardSo if the higher seeds advance, the quarterfinals become:
1 Quinnipiac hosts 9 Princeton at 8 Union
2 Harvard hosts 10 Yale at 7 RPI
3 Cornell hosts 11 Brown at 6 Clarkson
4 St Lawrence hosts 12 Dartmouth at 5 Colgate
ECAC schedule shows all first-round games, single-elimination, as Saturday 3/4 at 7 pm.
I'm seeing this for first-round games:
No. 12 Dartmouth at No. 5 Colgate - Friday, March 3 @ 7 PM
No. 11 Brown at No. 6 Clarkson - Saturday, March 4 @ 4 PM
No. 10 Yale at No. 7 Rensselaer - Saturday, March 4 @ 7 PM
No. 9 Princeton at No. 8 Union - Saturday, March 4 @ 4 PM
Site: https://ecachockey.com/sports/2023/1/31/2023championshipinfo.aspx
Colgate game could be friday
colgate.edu and UScho show the game as a friday game
College hockey shows it as sat.
Quote from: upprdeckColgate game could be friday
colgate.edu and UScho show the game as a friday game
College hockey shows it as sat.
Maybe someone forgot to tell them it isn't best of three anymore.
Quote from: TrotskyFirst Round (Single Game):
12 Dartmouth at 5 Colgate
11 Brown at 6 Clarkson
10 Yale at 7 RPI
9 Princeton at 8 Union
So all four matchups are Ivy at Empire.
Quote from: jtwcornell91Quote from: TrotskyFirst Round (Single Game):
12 Dartmouth at 5 Colgate
11 Brown at 6 Clarkson
10 Yale at 7 RPI
9 Princeton at 8 Union
So all four matchups are Ivy at Empire.
And it's the third time the bottom 4 of 12 were all Ivy (2014, 2022).
Quote from: TrotskyQuote from: jtwcornell91Quote from: TrotskyFirst Round (Single Game):
12 Dartmouth at 5 Colgate
11 Brown at 6 Clarkson
10 Yale at 7 RPI
9 Princeton at 8 Union
So all four matchups are Ivy at Empire.
And it's the third time the bottom 4 of 12 were all Ivy (2014, 2022).
Can we use this data to predict the number of times the bottom 4 will be all Ivy from 2024 through 2033? ;-)
Yale is 17-3 in its last 20 games against RPI.
Yep, the host-team schedules also show the times you report. Don't know why the Colgate-Dartmouth is Friday. Unless everybody's on break, that's an additional lost day of class. Unecessarily. It also puts the Colgate women's ECAC game versus Quinnipiac opposite the men.
Doing a Saturday 4 pm men's game does allow the team to travel home after the game, same day, with less late-night travel.
Quote from: billhowardSo if the higher seeds advance, the quarterfinals become:
1 Quinnipiac hosts 9 Princeton at 8 Union
2 Harvard hosts 10 Yale at 7 RPI
3 Cornell hosts 11 Brown at 6 Clarkson
4 St Lawrence hosts 12 Dartmouth at 5 Colgate
Third time's the charm, but I still wish we'd finished second.
.
Quote from: dbilmesYale is 17-3 in its last 20 games against RPI.
So, according to Garp's Law (https://youtu.be/GTqz4duPdYQ), the chances of RPI losing yet again are miniscule. ::idea::
Go Dartmouth. Not looking too good so far thoguh
Colgate up on Dartmouth 2-1 in a game that can only be described as indescribably boring.
Quote from: TrotskyColgate up on Dartmouth 2-1 in a game that can only be described as indescribably boring.
Wouldn't be if the old Greene coache was still fuming behind the bench.
"Throw your clipboard." Now 3-1, Dartmouth looks like roadkill.
Quote from: Trotsky"Throw your clipboard." Now 3-1, Dartmouth looks like roadkill.
Doesn't impact us unless Clarkson also goes down. Right now my mind's more on lacrosse and sending Penn State to the showers.
Has anyone ever discovered how to search ESPN+ effectively?
Quote from: billhowardQuote from: Trotsky"Throw your clipboard." Now 3-1, Dartmouth looks like roadkill.
Doesn't impact us unless Clarkson also goes down.
Sure it would. If Colgate loses then all the 1R survivors move up a slot. Dartmouth to Hamden, Clarkson goes to Canton instead of Ithaca, and we get RPI or, if they lose, then Union/Princeton.
But it's moot because Colgate is now up 4-1 and Dartmouth has given up.
Colgate will go to Canton, and we will almost surely get Clarkson.
Quote from: TrotskyHas anyone ever discovered how to search ESPN+ effectively?
I think at some point mid-season, men's hockey vanished from the espn+ search function.
Either I'm missing something or the entire capability is worse than useless. How hard would it be to have "Dartmouth" in the search pane followed by enter filter the results according to, you know, Dartmouth. Instead you only have a limited number of choices from a pick list: Dartmouth football and M and W hoops. Otherwise, you're fucked.
The only way to get to the game from their search is to go to the sports list, then scroll to hockey, then scroll through all the hockey matches and hope this game actually comes up.
Quote from: TrotskyEither I'm missing something or the entire capability is worse than useless. How hard would it be to have "Dartmouth" in the search pane followed by enter filter the results according to, you know, Dartmouth. Instead you only have a limited number of choices from a pick list: Dartmouth football and M and W hoops. Otherwise, you're fucked.
The only way to get to the game from their search is to go to the sports list, then scroll to hockey, then scroll through all the hockey matches and hope this game actually comes up.
The easiest way is to go through the school teams' schedules and then click on the link that leads to the specific ESPN+ feed for a particular game. At some point during the season, it became basically impossible to search for college hockey games directly
of course they like to not show the game thats the most current in the search results as well. and sometimes games show up in one search and not another.. too bad ESPN is so poor they cant devote any time to indexing the database.
Quote from: TrotskyHas anyone ever discovered how to search ESPN+ effectively?
don't search, ctrl-F https://www.espn.com/watch/schedule/_/type/live
If you subscribe to Hulu, you can watch any games that are on ESPN Plus on that. I've been watching Cornell games there, since it's easier to find them.
I had no problem finding it on my "coming up" list. If that doesn't work, I find it under Ice hockey.
Quote from: dbilmesIf you subscribe to Hulu, you can watch any games that are on ESPN Plus on that. I've been watching Cornell games there, since it's easier to find them.
Or Roku
Brown has 49.2 seconds to get 2 goals.
Clarkson wins, we get them.
ND lost to MSU.. Need another in game 3 to help is there.
Now NDak beating Omaha would be nice and a Linderood miracle as well
Merrimack also in play tonight
Minn st/ Lake Sup.
Quote from: TrotskyClarkson wins, we get them.
We were so close to avoiding this—going up against the fourth best team in the ECAC in the quarterfinals—but now Cornell is stuck with this reality and we'll just have to win (likely 2-0, if we want an NCAA bid).
We played them twice
game one out shot them. 22-17 Went 0-6 while they went 2-5 and lost 4-1
Game Two out shot them. 27-19 Went 1-5 while they went 2-4 and lost 4-3
If we are gonna lose the STs game again we wont win..
If we are not going to beat clarkson in a series we can complaing about not getting into the NCAA
whether going 2-1 and then losing will knock us out is hard to tell. if ND loses they wont pass us but will someone else.
1-11 vs 4-9 is not going to get it done and considering PP has been solid most of the yr maybe that turns around if it was 2-11 and 2-9 we dont get swept.. Not too big an ask hopefully.. if it was 4-11 and 1-9 the other way we sweep and finish 2nd.
Yale at Quinnipiac
Princeton at Harvard
Clarkson at Cornell
Colgate at St. Lawrence
Yale is now 18-3 against RPI in their last 21 games. Their record against Q over that span is much worse. But at least they won't have far to travel.
I could see harvard losing to princeton
Quote from: dbilmesYale is now 18-3 against RPI in their last 21 games. Their record against Q over that span is much worse. But at least they won't have far to travel.
Well, socially it's a step down, they're thinking.
If we can get to Lake Placid, it's going to be our crowd and Q's.
Quote from: Ron FogartyPre-game game from CHN
"It's an awful setup... It is the worst decision ever made in our conference. The Ivy League teams are already restricted to 29 games because of their rules.
"Making a quick move like this is for a one and out is a difficult one, especially for a team that ends up tied as a four seed. They could see a great body of work go down the drain if a goalie gets hot. The system was great before, because you had to earn it to get to the next level. There will be four upset coaches after this."
From the Albany Times Union
In past seasons, Union still would have had more hockey, but the ECAC changed its first-round playoff matchups from a best-of-three series to single-game elimination. So just before 6:30 on Saturday evening, Josh Hauge saw his first year as Union coach end with a 14-19-2 record.
"It's not right," winning coach Ron Fogarty said of the new format. "I feel bad for coach Hauge. He's done a tremendous job with the team. The goalie (Hudson Falls native Connor Murphy) is one of the best goalies in the country. He showed he's a leader for this team. As much as I'm happy for our team, there's a little bit of a sad part there."
At least Cashman couldn't possibly have been as upset as his predecessor.
in a perfect world all the series would be best of 3.
Quote from: upprdeckin a perfect world all the series would be best of 3.
The 1R and QF, in both the conferences and NC$$, at campus sites.
But the Frozen Fours should be single game one weekend at a true neutral site.
1-1 ND MSU. I think MSU is a slightly better option for the win but still want Minn to beat either one next week.
Anything that gives us some more RPI room is good.
I see AHC is going best of 3/best of 3 then 1 game final
ND goes down. Alaska is probably locked in.
MState will be out losing to Minnesote
Merrimack/NE both have to win to get close to us and one will lose that next rd .
lots of chaos left.
....
From BigRedTox email:
Ticket Information for ECAC Hockey Quarterfinals vs. Clarkson
Our ticketing vendor, AudienceView, has currently suspended platform-based sales due to the discovery of further attempts to breach the security of its system. In an abundance of caution, ticket sales via AudienceView remain unavailable until further notice.
Due to the suspension of ticket sales, the Men's Ice Hockey ECAC Quarterfinal ticket release, which was previously scheduled for Tuesday, March 7th at 10:00AM, has been postponed to Thursday, March 9th at 10:00AM. Please note that all details regarding the Men's Ice Hockey ticket release are subject to change. We encourage fans to continually check cornellbigred.com for the most up-to-date, reliable information on tickets to this weekend's athletic events.
With questions regarding the tickets for the Men's Ice Hockey ECAC Quarterfinal games vs. Clarkson, we encourage you to reach out to the Cornell Athletic Ticketing Office at bigredtix@cornell.edu.
I was thinking i bought the ECACs with my season tickets. of course with no paper i have no idea and the site is down to even check..
The latest email regarding tickets:
Ticket Information for ECAC Hockey Quarterfinals vs. Clarkson
Our ticketing vendor, AudienceView, has currently suspended platform-based sales due to the discovery of further attempts to breach the security of its system. In an abundance of caution, ticket sales via AudienceView remain unavailable until further notice.
Due to the suspension of ticket sales, the Men's Ice Hockey ECAC Quarterfinal ticket release, which was previously rescheduled for Thursday, March 9th at 10:00AM has been postponed to Friday, March 10th at 7:00AM. Please note that all details regarding the Men's Ice Hockey ticket release are subject to change. We encourage fans to continually check cornellbigred.com for the most up-to-date, reliable information on tickets to this weekend's athletic events.
With questions regarding the tickets for the Men's Ice Hockey ECAC Quarterfinal games vs. Clarkson, we encourage you to reach out to the Cornell Athletic Ticketing Office at bigredtix@cornell.edu.
gonna be free soon..
When you sell out something you used to do yourself to the lowest bidder, don't be surprised when shit happens beyond your control.
Yay capitalism and middle men.
Quote from: RichHWhen you sell out something you used to do yourself to the lowest bidder, don't be surprised when shit happens beyond your control.
Yay capitalism and middle men.
I have no clue about the university's IT or procurement organizations, but this kind of stuff is exactly why vendor risk management programs exist.
Quote from: IcebergQuote from: RichHWhen you sell out something you used to do yourself to the lowest bidder, don't be surprised when shit happens beyond your control.
Yay capitalism and middle men.
I have no clue about the university's IT or procurement organizations, but this kind of stuff is exactly why vendor risk management programs exist.
If Cornell ran the ticket office and was similarly hacked the MMQ"s would be apoplectic that athletics hadn't farmed out the sale of tickets.
there is a reason they have been trying to get out of using this vendor for several years but no money was allowed to be spent.
Quote from: upprdeckthere is a reason they have been trying to get out of using this vendor for several years but no money was allowed to be spent.
At least it wasn't a more...crucial vendor to the university. Lol
Tickets will go on sale Monday morning.
Is there room for a thread, Ticketology?
Gee, when I said tickets go on sale Monday it was meant to be a joke. The online ticketing is still not functioning even though they said tickets would go on sale at 7am.
seems to be up now
Did you get a confirmation email if you ordered tickets? I see the credit charge went through, I have an order number, but no confirmation email or text. And when I click on my order it says Oops An Error Occurred.
Anyone?
i was able to look at my season ticket or just to confirm the playoff games came with it. did you look at the order under your profile or in some other way?
Quote from: margolismGee, when I said tickets go on sale Monday it was meant to be a joke. The online ticketing is still not functioning even though they said tickets would go on sale at 7am.
I misread the email and thought it said they were going to be on sale at 7pm Friday, but I guess that was too farcical to be true.
SLU wearing their weirdo 1970s Cleveland Browns jerseys.
Yale got 5 SOG tonight in Hamden.
They didn't win.
Quote from: TrotskySLU wearing their weirdo 1970s Cleveland Browns jerseys.
don't hate it! SLU camera has a low ice angle that gives you the feeling that you have great seats but it's very disorienting watching on TV when i kind of want to feel like I'm watching TV
Quote from: ugarteQuote from: TrotskySLU wearing their weirdo 1970s Cleveland Browns jerseys.
don't hate it! SLU camera has a low ice angle that gives you the feeling that you have great seats but it's very disorienting watching on TV when i kind of want to feel like I'm watching TV
They are nice up close, I'll give them that.
I love the low angle.
Quote from: TrotskyQuote from: ugarteQuote from: TrotskySLU wearing their weirdo 1970s Cleveland Browns jerseys.
don't hate it! SLU camera has a low ice angle that gives you the feeling that you have great seats but it's very disorienting watching on TV when i kind of want to feel like I'm watching TV
They are nice up close, I'll give them that.
I love the low angle.
I DON'T love the low angle. Too hard to see what's going on around the goalmouth
Saints have some profoundly ugly playoff facial hair.
Quote from: ugarteQuote from: TrotskySLU wearing their weirdo 1970s Cleveland Browns jerseys.
don't hate it! SLU camera has a low ice angle that gives you the feeling that you have great seats but it's very disorienting watching on TV when i kind of want to feel like I'm watching TV
Appleton is a great place to watch a game in person. TV angles are one of the worst.
Glad to see the pbp guy doesn't have to do this game by himself like he did vs CU. But oy is his color guy a chucklehead.
Fuckin Colton Young. Tough choke by SLU.
Quote from: RichHBut oy is his color guy a chucklehead.
(https://y.yarn.co/ecd96a76-d6bd-4232-925b-ba743eec3f3a_screenshot.jpg)
Besides the fact that Yale's 5 SOG were the fewest by a team in a D-1 game in 20 years, things got nasty toward the end of the Yale-Q game. A Q player and a Yale player (Allain's son) received game misconducts (for kneeing and cross-checking), and Allain was given a 10-minute major for "abuse of officials."
Quote from: dbilmesBesides the fact that Yale's 5 SOG were the fewest by a team in a D-1 game in 20 years, things got nasty toward the end of the Yale-Q game. Two Yale players, including Allain's son, received game misconducts (for kneeing and cross-checking), and Allain was given a 10-minute major for "abuse of officials."
Please have punched out Rand.
Pleeeeeeeeeeease.
Quote from: TrotskyQuote from: dbilmesBesides the fact that Yale's 5 SOG were the fewest by a team in a D-1 game in 20 years, things got nasty toward the end of the Yale-Q game. Two Yale players, including Allain's son, received game misconducts (for kneeing and cross-checking), and Allain was given a 10-minute major for "abuse of officials."
Please have punched out Rand. Pleeeeeeeeeeease.
They should give a conference award for that.
Quote from: dbilmesBesides the fact that Yale's 5 SOG were the fewest by a team in a D-1 game in 20 years, things got nasty toward the end of the Yale-Q game. Two Yale players, including Allain's son, received game misconducts (for kneeing and cross-checking), and Allain was given a 10-minute major for "abuse of officials."
If you look at the shot stats, Yale made only 20 shot attempts all game long and Quinnipiac blocked 9. Yikes!
Quote from: dbilmesBesides the fact that Yale's 5 SOG were the fewest by a team in a D-1 game in 20 years, things got nasty toward the end of the Yale-Q game. Two Yale players, including Allain's son, received game misconducts (for kneeing and cross-checking), and Allain was given a 10-minute major for "abuse of officials."
It was a QU player for kneeing and Allain for the retaliatory cross-check. Kneeing is pretty awful, so I'll give Sonny that one.
Quote from: Scersk '97Quote from: dbilmesBesides the fact that Yale's 5 SOG were the fewest by a team in a D-1 game in 20 years, things got nasty toward the end of the Yale-Q game. Two Yale players, including Allain's son, received game misconducts (for kneeing and cross-checking), and Allain was given a 10-minute major for "abuse of officials."
It was a QU player for kneeing and Allain for the retaliatory cross-check. Kneeing is pretty awful, so I'll give Sonny that one.
I went back and looked. Typical QU lazy/malicious knee in the latter stages of a game they have in hand. BS call for the matching
major on Allain. Should have been at most a minor, and Yale should've had a three-minute power play.
I don't know why QU would risk it, TBH. Pecknold is a jerk but he's Christian Horner -- his jerkiness always has a reason. I see no upside for Q fucking with a speedbump on their way to an NC$$ 1-seed.
Quote from: dbilmesBesides the fact that Yale's 5 SOG were the fewest by a team in a D-1 game in 20 years, things got nasty toward the end of the Yale-Q game. A Q player and a Yale player (Allain's son) received game misconducts (for kneeing and cross-checking), and Allain was given a 10-minute major for "abuse of officials."
FYI - it was tied for the lowest in the last 20 years, tied with a game from last season. There's no records in our database beyond 20 years back, which is the "20 years comes from" - but it's not the lowest in 20 years.
3-2 with 2 minutes left at StLu.
All series are sweeps.
Quarterfinals
#1 Quinnipiac defeats #10 Yale, 3-0, 6-2
#2 Harvard defeats #9 Princeton, 6-1, 6-1
#3 Cornell defeats #6 Clarkson, 2-1, 3-1
#5 Colgate upsets #4 St. Lawrence, 4-3 (ot), 3-2
Semifinals
Quinnipiac vs Colgate
Cornell vs Harvard
"The same again (http://www.tbrw.info/?/games/cornell_Harvard_PS.html)."
Playoff status is updating faster these days.
Qpc .81 .48
Hvd .60 .30
Cor .40 .16
Cgt .19 .06
Quote from: adamwQuote from: dbilmesBesides the fact that Yale's 5 SOG were the fewest by a team in a D-1 game in 20 years, things got nasty toward the end of the Yale-Q game. A Q player and a Yale player (Allain's son) received game misconducts (for kneeing and cross-checking), and Allain was given a 10-minute major for "abuse of officials."
FYI - it was tied for the lowest in the last 20 years, tied with a game from last season. There's no records in our database beyond 20 years back, which is the "20 years comes from" - but it's not the lowest in 20 years.
I stand corrected! Thanks for the fact-checking.
Planning on going to Lake Placid? My stepson and and his wife own a beautiful, fully-furnished lodge in Minerva, NY, about 80 minutes from Lake Placid and 15 minutes from Gore Mountain skiing. Sleeps 15 (6 bdrms) responsible Big Red fans. Check it out on Vrbo: [t.vrbo.io] If interested, you can email shannonsadik(at)gmail(dot)com.
I'm attending a grandson's wedding, or else I'd be there. LGR!
.
Quote from: George64Planning on going to Lake Placid? My stepson and and his wife own a beautiful, fully-furnished lodge in Minerva, NY, about 80 minutes from Lake Placid and 15 minutes from Gore Mountain skiing. Sleeps 15 (6 bdrms) responsible Big Red fans. Check it out on Vrbo: [t.vrbo.io] If interested, you can email shannonsadik(at)gmail(dot)com.
I'm attending a grandson's wedding, or else I'd be there. LGR!
.
The nerve of your grandson having a wedding during the ECAC championships ;-)
I won't be there either, as my daughter is running a 1/2 marathon in NYC. Too bad, since it's always a good time.
People scheduling life events opposite the ECACs and NC$$s. Priorities, people.
Quote from: TrotskyPeople scheduling life events opposite the ECACs and NC$$s. Priorities, people.
Exactly. As much as I travel, I never schedule overseas trips in late March / early April.
CU in LP!
For next weekend at Lake Placid, will the ice surface be 100' x 200' or 85' x 200'?
Thank you
Quote from: iceFor next weekend at Lake Placid, will the ice surface be 100' x 200' or 85' x 200'?
Thank you
According to one of the broadcasts (had both on last night) it is no longer Olympic size. While Cornell never seemed to have a problem with the wide ice I'm glad they renovated the rink.
Quote from: martyQuote from: iceFor next weekend at Lake Placid, will the ice surface be 100' x 200' or 85' x 200'?
Thank you
According to one of the broadcasts (had both on last night) it is no longer Olympic size. While Cornell never seemed to have a problem with the wide ice I'm glad they renovated the rink.
I beg to differ that Cornell hasn't had much problem with the Olympic size sheet. It can't really be quantified but I think it usually undermines the key strengths of Schafer teams—ability to physically dominate play along the boards and generate offense out of the corners. Schafer has been famously vocal about his distaste for Olympic sheets. Perhaps it's cost us a few results up in Lake Placid; we'll never know.
2002 finals against Harvard for sure.
If USCHO is to be believed, Friday 3/17 game times are:
4:00 Colgate vs Quinnipiac
7:30 Cornell vs Harvard
Quote from: TrotskyIf USCHO is to be believed, Friday 3/17 game times are:
4:00 Colgate vs Quinnipiac
7:30 Cornell vs Harvard
Probably a bit optimistic for the late game start, but otherwise, that seems about right.
Quote from: shaferQuote from: martyQuote from: iceFor next weekend at Lake Placid, will the ice surface be 100' x 200' or 85' x 200'?
Thank you
According to one of the broadcasts (had both on last night) it is no longer Olympic size. While Cornell never seemed to have a problem with the wide ice I'm glad they renovated the rink.
I beg to differ that Cornell hasn't had much problem with the Olympic size sheet. It can't really be quantified but I think it usually undermines the key strengths of Schafer teams—ability to physically dominate play along the boards and generate offense out of the corners. Schafer has been famously vocal about his distaste for Olympic sheets. Perhaps it's cost us a few results up in Lake Placid; we'll never know.
Current team has a much different set of strengths than in the past. We have so much skating and puck movement on offense the Olympic sheet would play to that strength. All that extra width would give more space and paths to the goal
we made a ton of nice passes sat.. none that led to a goal though
Still, if there is one team I would not like to meet on a wide sheet it's Harvard. Remember the 3x3 in Ithaca (shivers). I don't need to see Coronato and Farrell with open ice.
In the metaverse they may be on sale.
Quote from: TrotskyIf USCHO is to be believed, Friday 3/17 game times are:
4:00 Colgate vs Quinnipiac
7:30 Cornell vs Harvard
This is what the ECAC site says, note the precision of the state times ( https://ecachockey.com/sports/2023/1/31/2023championshipinfo.aspx ):
Quote from: The ECACEVENT
2023 ECAC Men's Hockey Championship
LOCATION (SEMIFINALS & FINALS)
1980 Rink - Herb Brooks Arena
2634 Main St.
Lake Placid, NY 12946
518-523-1655
info@orda.org
TICKETS
Tickets for championship weekend are on sale NOW. Fans can purchase tickets online HERE.
TICKET PRICES
All-Session = $70 + $5.23 (processing fees)
Daily = $50 + $4.04 (processing fees)
Student All-Session* = $40 + $2.46 (processing fees)
Student Daily* = $20 + $1.25 (processing fees)
Group tickets are available via box office.
*Students Tickets will be available on campuses for the participating schools for the championship and at a designated student window at the Olympic Center Box Office.
16354
GAME SCHEDULE
Semifinal 1: Friday, March 17 - 4:02 pm - No. 1 Quinnipiac vs. No. 5 Colgate
Semifinal 2: Friday, March 17 - 7:32 pm - No. 2 Harvard vs. No. 3 Cornell
Championship: Saturday, March 18 (7:30 pm)
not for nothing but I wonder if the team can even practice tomorrow with campus closed. Might not be anyone around to clean the ice surface or turn on the lights.
Quote from: upprdecknot for nothing but I wonder if the team can even practice tomorrow with campus closed. Might not be anyone around to clean the ice surface or turn on the lights.
In case anybody else wondered, 9-18 inches, holy shit (https://www.ithaca.com/news/ithaca/cornell-university-will-close-tuesday-march-14-due-to-the-approaching-winter-storm/article_34a9c56a-c1f5-11ed-b658-b3629fdbd6fe.html).
yup.. snow and high winds.. gonna be a nasty day.
Leave tonight, guys... ::drive::
FYI from Cornell ticket site:
"Cornell fans are encouraged to purchase tickets in Section 3 - which can be accessed by visiting the Lake Placid Olympic Center ticketing site, clicking the lock icon on the top of the screen and entering the access code 'CORNELL23'"
You also save $10 using the code.
Quote from: jfeath17FYI from Cornell ticket site:
"Cornell fans are encouraged to purchase tickets in Section 3 - which can be accessed by visiting the Lake Placid Olympic Center ticketing site, clicking the lock icon on the top of the screen and entering the access code 'CORNELL23'"
You also save $10 using the code.
That code's not working for me. (shrug) Oh, well.
Quote from: HeafDogQuote from: jfeath17FYI from Cornell ticket site:
"Cornell fans are encouraged to purchase tickets in Section 3 - which can be accessed by visiting the Lake Placid Olympic Center ticketing site, clicking the lock icon on the top of the screen and entering the access code 'CORNELL23'"
You also save $10 using the code.
That code's not working for me. (shrug) Oh, well.
When I had purchased tickets on Saturday night there was a field displaying to enter a code that is not the correct place to enter the code. As the post above indicates, there is a small icon near the top of the screen, that on my phone is a white lock on a black background. It is just to the left of the login option. When you click on that you'll bring up a field that accepts CORNELL23 as the code, and you should then have the option of purchasing $60 all session tickets in Section 3. I just tested it shortly before 7:00 PM on 3/16 and it works. Still lots of good seats available in Section 3. (Guessing the last four rows closer to Section 4 is blocked for the band.)
Looks like weather will be fine after all.
If Colgate loses to Q or in the finals, we basically clinch a ncaa bid, right?
Quote from: DuncIf Colgate loses to Q or in the finals, we basically clinch a ncaa bid, right?
Yes. I'm not like 100% sure on that, but I'm 99% sure.
Seems to be a lack of excitement about this game today. I understand it's a tall order, but Harvard Sucks and Let's Go Red!::banana::
we played quin 6 periods and had 1 bad period
we played Harv 6 periods and had 1 bad period
The interesting thing is the Harv bad period we gave up 3 goals while actually out posessing them and out shooting them 14-8
Zero PP goals vs Harvard on 2 games on only 3 chances.. Need to do something there today
We're on a playoff revenge tour of teams that beat us during the regular season. Clarkson down, Well get Harvard today and hopefully BU in the NCAAs
Colgate jumps out to a 1-0 lead
BU - PC scoreless after 1
Why is Mo Rocca doing the color commentary for the 'gate-Q semifinal on espn+?
st cloud /denver/ quin/ bu
tonights favs we want to see win.
Quote from: upprdeckst cloud /denver/ quin/ bu
tonights favs we want to see win.
I don't think I can hold my nose tightly enough to root for Quinnipiac.
Didnt say it was gonna be easy or fun.
Quote from: jtwcornell91Quote from: upprdeckst cloud /denver/ quin/ bu
tonights favs we want to see win.
I don't think I can hold my nose tightly enough to root for Quinnipiac.
It's a lighter nose-hold than tomorrow night will be if everything goes poorly today.
Too bad the games werent in the order to make it easier on knowing who to root for..
But who trusts BU to win twice anyway
Misconduct on Brind'amour, 5 minute major for Colgate.
Quote from: ugarteMisconduct on Brind'amour, 5 minute major for Colgate.
major killed, brind'amour obvs still gone. Young, who got kneed and had to take a powder, back. Still 1-0 with 2 minutes left in the second.
Don't know how Q didn't score in the last two minutes. They still have about a minute of PP to start the third.
BU - PC still scoreless after 2.
Bu with a great effort tonight 12 shots on goal with 3 min left
QU-Gate goes to OT.
PC up 1-0 with time running out for BU.
Overtime in Placid.
BU just tied PC with 2:32 left in regulation in Boston.
CC scores first against Denver and is up 1-0 late in the second.
imagine if CC and NDak win with BU losing and people would be wishing they rooted for Quin this game.
If Colgate wins today, the NCAA bid could very well come down to them having to lose the ECAC Final, whether it's against us or against Harvard.
But the model said Cornell had a 99.7% chance of making the NCAAs, how could this be happening??????
The announcer for this Colgate Q game just said that Q, Harvard, and Cornell are all in.
So we're doomed, right?
Can't make this shit up: even the ECAC Hockey tournament announcers think Cornell is a lock to make the tournament. They just said so on the broadcast.
seeding is also an issue.. if teams like ndak get in who knows where we end up of we make it.
Want to avoid Fargo i suspect vs denver/minn?
Q draws an OT penalty and has their worst PP of the year until getting a shot in the waning seconds. End this, Ticks!
BU wins
at least now even if all the bad things happen tonight we still got 2 shots to get in.
2ot.. so at best our game probably starts 8:15-8:30
Quote from: BearLoverBut the model said Cornell had a 99.7% chance of making the NCAAs, how could this be happening??????
110% you'd point that out.
Is this a sophisticated attempt at anti-woofing?
so down goes denver.. they had beaten CC 11 in a row.
I started the afternoon rooting for Colgate but have switched allegiances — go Deerticks!
Quote from: upprdeckso down goes denver.. they had beaten CC 11 in a row.
Holy crap is CC on an improbable roll
5 outcomes left that help us.
CC 1-0 over Denver
Another Q penalty in the second OT.
Peretz gives up a rebound for a tap-in and Colgate wins 2-1 in 2OT.
Colgate wins
LGR
Quote from: BMacColgate wins
Deservedly so. I thought they were the better team most of the game, and certainly in the 2nd OT
4 left..
if anyone is posting from LP, can you please let the rest of us know when our game will start? Thanks
does Merrimack - Lowell matter? (other than "it depends on whether you know which one beats BU")
Quote from: dag14if anyone is posting from LP, can you please let the rest of us know when our game will start? Thanks
~8:37
this is why you root for Quin.
we had 6 things that could happen to get in after this game we are down to 3 and one requires St cloud to win twice.
Quote from: jfeath17Quote from: dag14if anyone is posting from LP, can you please let the rest of us know when our game will start? Thanks
~8:37
Thank you!
if we dont get in that means the
2-3-5-6-7 teams all lose this weekend.. that would have been a nice ML parlay.
and if Mich loses to Min its 2-3-4-5-6-7..
Kovich is playing and DeSantis isn't dressed. I'm assuming he was injured last weekend, or in practice during the week.
We look tight so far.
DeSantis is in the lineup (https://twitter.com/JoshSeguin24/status/1636845423716433921) as the extra forward.
Quote from: upprdeckthis is why you root for Quin.
we had 6 things that could happen to get in after this game we are down to 3 and one requires St cloud to win twice.
Yes but isn't one of them Colgate losing even tomorrow night? If we win tonight but lose to Colgate are we out? Always so hard to know but that one weekend where we lost both a few weeks back could haunt us
Quote from: PghasQuote from: upprdeckthis is why you root for Quin.
we had 6 things that could happen to get in after this game we are down to 3 and one requires St cloud to win twice.
Yes but isn't one of them Colgate losing even tomorrow night? If we win tonight but lose to Colgate are we out? Always so hard to know but that one weekend where we lost both a few weeks back could haunt us
Yeah, we'd be out, if BU also loses tomorrow and SCSU doesn't win tonight and tomorrow.
Quote from: DafatoneQuote from: PghasQuote from: upprdeckthis is why you root for Quin.
we had 6 things that could happen to get in after this game we are down to 3 and one requires St cloud to win twice.
Yes but isn't one of them Colgate losing even tomorrow night? If we win tonight but lose to Colgate are we out? Always so hard to know but that one weekend where we lost both a few weeks back could haunt us
Yeah, we'd be out, if BU also loses tomorrow and SCSU doesn't win tonight and tomorrow.
Last question - should we lose tonight but colgate loses tomorrow are we in?
Quote from: PghasQuote from: DafatoneQuote from: PghasQuote from: upprdeckthis is why you root for Quin.
we had 6 things that could happen to get in after this game we are down to 3 and one requires St cloud to win twice.
Yes but isn't one of them Colgate losing even tomorrow night? If we win tonight but lose to Colgate are we out? Always so hard to know but that one weekend where we lost both a few weeks back could haunt us
Yeah, we'd be out, if BU also loses tomorrow and SCSU doesn't win tonight and tomorrow.
Last question - should we lose tonight but colgate loses tomorrow are we in?
Yup. I believe we are in unless Colgate wins, BU doesn't win, and SCSU doesn't win.
How does a playoff overtime impact pwr? Half a win?
Go Saint Cloud. Now tied 2-2.
We're hanging in, but our possession metrics tonight is probably rather scary looking.
Well, shit.
That's as close as a game gets. They should be proud. Hopefully toothpaste loses and we're not done this year.
FYI - we move down 1 spot on PWR with this OTL
Edit: I guess we already did from the QPac loss? We are at 13 on PWR after factoring in this game.
We did a nice job all night limiting their skill from taking over the game, but Harvard played a sound defensive game, and we missed the net too often on most of the few good chances we had. Shane was great tonight, but it was just not enough.
It just seems we so rarely have the elite skill guys who can make a great offensive play when we need it. Like, forever. I don't know if he doesn't recruit that way or those kids don't come here because they think we're the 1995 New Jersey Devils.
Still seems likely we make the tournament anyway and maybe make some noise there. And Lynah sure was a blast last weekend!
Wish Cornell could get the type of talent Harvard has. Schafer did the best he could with the players he has.
So we need any one of:
St. Cloud scores in OT and beats CC
Harvard over Colgate - Hey Trotsky where ya at on this?
BU over whoever wins UML/Merrimack
Right?
Is there no consolation game anymore?
Quote from: ERIs there no consolation game anymore?
Nope, did away with that probably about 7-8 years ago
Quote from: ugarteSo we need any one of:
St. Cloud scores in OT and beats CC
Harvard over Colgate - Hey Trotsky where ya at on this?
BU over whoever wins UML/Merrimack
Right?
Right. Harvard and BU will be the favorites, so we have a pretty good shot.
The 99.7% number from the CHN model was a complete joke. I'll keep harping on it until people stop citing it. It was cited by the Cornell Daily Sun, the ELynah twitter account, the popular "Everything College Hockey" social media account, and the literal commentators of tonight's game. Publishing this model is doing everyone a disservice. It isn't calibrated to reality. It isn't backwards-tested. No one made any attempt to check whether weighting by KRACH yields accurate predictions. But they publish the model anyway and people keep referring to it.
This absolutely blows. 0-3 vs Harvard on the season and we might lose our tournament bid. Terrible.
Quote from: scoop85We did a nice job all night limiting their skill from taking over the game, but Harvard played a sound defensive game, and we missed the net too often on most of the few good chances we had. Shane was great tonight, but it was just not enough.
For my money, this all goes back to losing to SLU and Clarkson late at home. Not being the "home" team is quite a disadvantage.
Quote from: BearLoverQuote from: ugarteSo we need any one of:
St. Cloud scores in OT and beats CC
Harvard over Colgate - Hey Trotsky where ya at on this?
BU over whoever wins UML/Merrimack
Right?
Right. Harvard and BU will be the favorites, so we have a pretty good shot.
The 99.7% number from the CHN model was a complete joke. I'll keep harping on it until people stop citing it. It was cited by the Cornell Daily Sun, the ELynah twitter account, the popular "Everything College Hockey" social media account, and the literal commentators of tonight's game. Publishing this model is doing everyone a disservice. It isn't calibrated to reality. It isn't backwards-tested. No one made any attempt to check whether weighting by KRACH yields accurate predictions. But they publish the model anyway and people keep referring to it.
I have thoughts on the probabilities, but I'm gonna wait til after tomorrow to share them. Wrath of the whatever from high atop the thing and all.
St. Cloud wins !!!!
Now being reviewed for offside ????
St. Cloud still wins !!!!
I said it before and I'll say it again, there is a ridiculous talent disparity between Harvard and the rest of the league. Cornell had better hope that a large number of Harvard's 15 draft picks leave for the pros, and that something happens in the coming years to close the talent gap. This isn't tenable. Cornell has a solid team and played as well defensively as they reasonable could have, but even though Cornell did its best to contain Harvard's offense, Harvard's top two lines were creating changes far more dangerous than anything Cornell could put forth. It felt like a matter of time before Farrell, Coronato, Lafferierre, or any number of other uber-talented players potted the winning goal. If you put Michigan in the CCHA you'd have the same effect.
Quote from: jkahnSt. Cloud wins !!!!
wow you were way ahead of the radio stream i was listening to. let's go huskies.
we need any one of three favorites to win tomorrow and i ran some numbers and there's roughly a 99.7% chance it happens.
love that BU's opponent tomorrow is now in 2OT i hope it goes 6 and ends at 2am
well, despite how much I want to think of the players and graduating seniors in particular getting a chance to play in the NCAA tournament
I think I am just too petty to cheer for Harvard to win, even though Colgate winning would reduce the number of at-large bids available
Quote from: ugartewe need any one of three favorites to win tomorrow and i ran some numbers and there's roughly a 99.7% chance it happens.
:-P
Quote from: ugarteQuote from: jkahnSt. Cloud wins !!!!
wow you were way ahead of the radio stream i was listening to. let's go huskies. .
Game was on the CBS Sports Network, and final will be on there tomorrow.
Quote from: ugarteQuote from: jkahnSt. Cloud wins !!!!
wow you were way ahead of the radio stream i was listening to. let's go huskies.
we need any one of three favorites to win tomorrow and i ran some numbers and there's roughly a 99.7% chance it happens.
So Cornell has three shots now, and we're on the side of the favorite in all of them.
Quote from: BearLoverQuote from: ugarteQuote from: jkahnSt. Cloud wins !!!!
wow you were way ahead of the radio stream i was listening to. let's go huskies.
we need any one of three favorites to win tomorrow and i ran some numbers and there's roughly a 99.7% chance it happens.
So Cornell has three shots now, and we're on the side of the favorite in all of them.
that's what i said!
Quote from: ugarteQuote from: BearLoverQuote from: ugarteQuote from: jkahnSt. Cloud wins !!!!
wow you were way ahead of the radio stream i was listening to. let's go huskies.
we need any one of three favorites to win tomorrow and i ran some numbers and there's roughly a 99.7% chance it happens.
So Cornell has three shots now, and we're on the side of the favorite in all of them.
that's what i said!
Oh sorry I missed that. Should be an approximately three-in-one-thousand chance we miss the NCAAs by my calculations.
Even if Merrimack loses tomorrow would they even fall behind us after this?
Quote from: ugarteQuote from: jkahnSt. Cloud wins !!!!
wow you were way ahead of the radio stream i was listening to. let's go huskies.
we need any one of three favorites to win tomorrow and i ran some numbers and there's roughly a 99.7% chance it happens.
I like those odds. And 99.7% of eLynah agrees. (We also have 99.7% fewer cavities but I forget why.)
Quote from: DafatoneQuote from: BearLoverQuote from: ugarteSo we need any one of:
St. Cloud scores in OT and beats CC
Harvard over Colgate - Hey Trotsky where ya at on this?
BU over whoever wins UML/Merrimack
Right?
Right. Harvard and BU will be the favorites, so we have a pretty good shot.
The 99.7% number from the CHN model was a complete joke. I'll keep harping on it until people stop citing it. It was cited by the Cornell Daily Sun, the ELynah twitter account, the popular "Everything College Hockey" social media account, and the literal commentators of tonight's game. Publishing this model is doing everyone a disservice. It isn't calibrated to reality. It isn't backwards-tested. No one made any attempt to check whether weighting by KRACH yields accurate predictions. But they publish the model anyway and people keep referring to it.
I have thoughts on the probabilities, but I'm gonna wait til after tomorrow to share them. Wrath of the whatever from high atop the thing and all.
I am not gonna wait. Even if all three games that matter were just toss-ups, the odds of all three going wrong would be .5*.5*.5 = .125 = 12.5%
If you give favorites a 60% chance to win, then the odds of three upsets would be .4 * .4 * .4 = .064 = 6.4%
So, even after all the bad results today, the odds that Cornell makes the tournament are still in the 93.6% to 87.5% range.
I know it might not feel right, but trust the math.
Throwing your hands up and saying that it must be wrong makes me think that you are the guy who loses the bet, not believing that in a room of 40 people, the odds are overwhelming that two have the same birthday. This also feels like it can't possibly be right, but it is.
Quote from: nshapiroQuote from: DafatoneQuote from: BearLoverQuote from: ugarteSo we need any one of:
St. Cloud scores in OT and beats CC
Harvard over Colgate - Hey Trotsky where ya at on this?
BU over whoever wins UML/Merrimack
Right?
Right. Harvard and BU will be the favorites, so we have a pretty good shot.
The 99.7% number from the CHN model was a complete joke. I'll keep harping on it until people stop citing it. It was cited by the Cornell Daily Sun, the ELynah twitter account, the popular "Everything College Hockey" social media account, and the literal commentators of tonight's game. Publishing this model is doing everyone a disservice. It isn't calibrated to reality. It isn't backwards-tested. No one made any attempt to check whether weighting by KRACH yields accurate predictions. But they publish the model anyway and people keep referring to it.
I have thoughts on the probabilities, but I'm gonna wait til after tomorrow to share them. Wrath of the whatever from high atop the thing and all.
I am not gonna wait. Even if all three games that matter were just toss-ups, the odds of all three going wrong would be .5*.5*.5 = .125 = 12.5%
If you give favorites a 60% chance to win, then the odds of three upsets would be .4 * .4 * .4 = .064 = 6.4%
So, even after all the bad results today, the odds that Cornell makes the tournament are still in the 93.6% to 87.5% range.
I know it might not feel right, but trust the math.
Throwing your hands up and saying that it must be wrong makes me think that you are the guy who loses the bet, not believing that in a room of 40 people, the odds are overwhelming that two have the same birthday. This also feels like it can't possibly be right, but it is.
Huh? I agree with your odds (for the most part—I think weighting for the favorites is closer than 60/40). I don't agree with the 99.7% number ever being correct, though. The 99.7% number wasn't based on 60/40 weighting for favorites. Rather, it was based on completely absurd weighting based on KRACH, which gave Q something like a 90% chance of beating Colgate.
Quote from: nshapiroQuote from: DafatoneQuote from: BearLoverQuote from: ugarteSo we need any one of:
St. Cloud scores in OT and beats CC
Harvard over Colgate - Hey Trotsky where ya at on this?
BU over whoever wins UML/Merrimack
Right?
Right. Harvard and BU will be the favorites, so we have a pretty good shot.
The 99.7% number from the CHN model was a complete joke. I'll keep harping on it until people stop citing it. It was cited by the Cornell Daily Sun, the ELynah twitter account, the popular "Everything College Hockey" social media account, and the literal commentators of tonight's game. Publishing this model is doing everyone a disservice. It isn't calibrated to reality. It isn't backwards-tested. No one made any attempt to check whether weighting by KRACH yields accurate predictions. But they publish the model anyway and people keep referring to it.
I have thoughts on the probabilities, but I'm gonna wait til after tomorrow to share them. Wrath of the whatever from high atop the thing and all.
I am not gonna wait. Even if all three games that matter were just toss-ups, the odds of all three going wrong would be .5*.5*.5 = .125 = 12.5%
If you give favorites a 60% chance to win, then the odds of three upsets would be .4 * .4 * .4 = .064 = 6.4%
So, even after all the bad results today, the odds that Cornell makes the tournament are still in the 93.6% to 87.5% range.
I know it might not feel right, but trust the math.
Throwing your hands up and saying that it must be wrong makes me think that you are the guy who loses the bet, not believing that in a room of 40 people, the odds are overwhelming that two have the same birthday. This also feels like it can't possibly be right, but it is.
My thoughts roughly echo yours. Was even gonna say some numbers if every game were a coin flip.
But again, the whatever and the thing.
There are 3 finals that matter tomorrow - CCHA, ECAC and NCHC, unless the 3 underdogs win all three, we are in NCAA
Quote from: CU2007There are 3 finals that matter tomorrow - CCHA, ECAC and NCHC, unless the 3 underdogs win all three, we are in NCAA
When was the last time the ECAC had four teams in the tourney?
Quote from: BearLoverQuote from: nshapiroQuote from: DafatoneQuote from: BearLoverQuote from: ugarteSo we need any one of:
St. Cloud scores in OT and beats CC
Harvard over Colgate - Hey Trotsky where ya at on this?
BU over whoever wins UML/Merrimack
Right?
Right. Harvard and BU will be the favorites, so we have a pretty good shot.
The 99.7% number from the CHN model was a complete joke. I'll keep harping on it until people stop citing it. It was cited by the Cornell Daily Sun, the ELynah twitter account, the popular "Everything College Hockey" social media account, and the literal commentators of tonight's game. Publishing this model is doing everyone a disservice. It isn't calibrated to reality. It isn't backwards-tested. No one made any attempt to check whether weighting by KRACH yields accurate predictions. But they publish the model anyway and people keep referring to it.
I have thoughts on the probabilities, but I'm gonna wait til after tomorrow to share them. Wrath of the whatever from high atop the thing and all.
I am not gonna wait. Even if all three games that matter were just toss-ups, the odds of all three going wrong would be .5*.5*.5 = .125 = 12.5%
If you give favorites a 60% chance to win, then the odds of three upsets would be .4 * .4 * .4 = .064 = 6.4%
So, even after all the bad results today, the odds that Cornell makes the tournament are still in the 93.6% to 87.5% range.
I know it might not feel right, but trust the math.
Throwing your hands up and saying that it must be wrong makes me think that you are the guy who loses the bet, not believing that in a room of 40 people, the odds are overwhelming that two have the same birthday. This also feels like it can't possibly be right, but it is.
Huh? I agree with your odds (for the most part—I think weighting for the favorites is closer than 60/40). I don't agree with the 99.7% number ever being correct, though. The 99.7% number wasn't based on 60/40 weighting for favorites. Rather, it was based on completely absurd weighting based on KRACH, which gave Q something like a 90% chance of beating Colgate.
To add to this, here are the probabilities based on "weighting by KRACH":
SCSU has a 75% chance of beating CC
BU has a 59% chance of beating Merrimack
Harvard has a 75% chance of beating Colgate
The chances of all three of those things failing is 2.6%, quite a bit lower than the 6.4% or 12.5% from
nshapiro's numbers.
Again, we see here that, when "weighting by KRACH," the further apart two teams' KRACH scores, the more extreme(ly wrong) the probabilities are. As I have previously mentioned, according to this method, Minnesota would beat Dartmouth 97% of the time.
Here's the thing, though—this discussion shouldn't even be happening, because the burden on proof isn't on random laypeople to disprove the methodology. Rather, the burden of proof is on the people publishing these models to show how and why weighting by KRACH yields predictive outcomes. To my knowledge, no one has put forth any argument why these models should be trusted. People just pick whatever random inputs they want, publish a model, and then everyone else eats it right up.
Maybe I am getting too tired, but YATC is now showing Merrimack ahead of us even if they lose, so we might need one of two favorites to win, Hahvahd or St. Cloud, not one of three.
Quote from: nshapiroMaybe I am getting too tired, but YATC is now showing Merrimack ahead of us even if they lose, so we might need one of two favorites to win, Hahvahd or St. Cloud, not one of three.
I'm getting Cornell ahead of them when I do it
Quote from: BearLoverQuote from: nshapiroMaybe I am getting too tired, but YATC is now showing Merrimack ahead of us even if they lose, so we might need one of two favorites to win, Hahvahd or St. Cloud, not one of three.
I'm getting Cornell ahead of them when I do it
me too. every possible combination of underdogs except BU and we're still in on USCHO's doohickey.
Quote from: andyw2100When was the last time the ECAC had four teams in the tourney?
Four years ago; Cornell and Quinnipiac lost in the second round, Harvard and Clarkson in the first.
Quote from: kingpin248Quote from: andyw2100When was the last time the ECAC had four teams in the tourney?
Four years ago; Cornell and Quinnipiac lost in the second round, Harvard and Clarkson in the first.
Thanks!
Quote from: arugulaHow does a playoff overtime impact pwr? Half a win?
I thought 5x5 OT results counted the same as regulation. Do they not?
Quote from: BearLoverNo one made any attempt to check whether weighting by KRACH yields accurate predictions.
Yes, we have: https://arxiv.org/abs/2001.04226
Quote from: jtwcornell91Quote from: BearLoverNo one made any attempt to check whether weighting by KRACH yields accurate predictions.
Yes, we have: https://arxiv.org/abs/2001.04226
Figure 8 in particular is related to a previous eLynah discussion about whether probabilities too close to 1 are inaccurate.
Bu winning helps in a couple ways.
It gets us in and it stops Merrimack from jumping over us which would keep us from playing a #1 seed someplace potentially,
N Mich helps us there too. All the Favs and NMich and we have 4 teams behind us n the PW before they start moving teams around.
But if that all happens there will be a bunch of moving any way
Ugh--so this weekend is the double torture of losing to Harvard--and then having to root for them in the next game.::pain::
Quote from: jtwcornell91Quote from: BearLoverNo one made any attempt to check whether weighting by KRACH yields accurate predictions.
Yes, we have: https://arxiv.org/abs/2001.04226
Wow, this is amazing. I had no idea! You are one of the authors? I'm going to try my best to read this as a non-math major. (Though feel free to offer the cliff notes if you'd like.)
BU's top center Skoog is suspended tonight due to a boarding penalty last night
Quote from: djk26Ugh--so this weekend is the double torture of losing to Harvard--and then having to root for them in the next game.::pain::
Root for them to tie us in number of ECAC titles? Sorry-can't do it.
I'll be there rooting for Colgate and hoping that BU or Saint Cloud get it done.
Quote from: andyw2100Quote from: djk26Ugh--so this weekend is the double torture of losing to Harvard--and then having to root for them in the next game.::pain::
Root for them to tie us in number of ECAC titles? Sorry-can't do it.
I'll be there rooting for Colgate and hoping that BU or Saint Cloud get it done.
BU starts a half hour earlier. Hopefully they can put up a half dozen in the first and make rooting a bit more comfortable.
So I get criticized for rooting against our conference rivals in the NCAA tournament, yet there are people on here actively rooting for outcomes that would cost us a bid in the NCAA tournament. Damn...
Quote from: BearLoverSo I get criticized for rooting against our conference rivals in the NCAA tournament, yet there are people on here actively rooting for outcomes that would cost us a bid in the NCAA tournament. Damn...
If it came down to us being out if Colgate wins, that would almost certainly have me rooting differently. But that's not the situation.
Plus we have a 99.7% chance of getting in, so why root for Harvard? :)
Quote from: andyw2100Root for them to tie us in number of ECAC titles? Sorry-can't do it.
Not only that, it would give Ted Donato his fifth title, tying him with Mike Schafer and Joe Marsh for the most in ECAC history.
Not to mention pushing him past Ned Harkness.
No. The world is not ready for that.
Quote from: DafatoneQuote from: andyw2100Quote from: djk26Ugh--so this weekend is the double torture of losing to Harvard--and then having to root for them in the next game.::pain::
Root for them to tie us in number of ECAC titles? Sorry-can't do it.
I'll be there rooting for Colgate and hoping that BU or Saint Cloud get it done.
BU starts a half hour earlier. Hopefully they can put up a half dozen in the first and make rooting a bit more comfortable.
BU and Colgate both winning is definitely the best scenario since we get in along with there other ECAC teams.
Quote from: BMacWell, shit.
That's as close as a game gets. They should be proud. Hopefully toothpaste loses and we're not done this year.
Interesting that Cornell wanted an off-side call to negate the goal. Also that Coach in his post game comments said a player fell down.
I watched the replay and didn't see anyone fall. What am I missing?
Pretty funny in the St cloud game it ended and they reviewed it for offsides but the replay was of a play going the wrong direction so people thought it was offsides until the realized it...
Merrimack scores first, to torture us. .3 looming large!
could be as much as .4 - Colgate scores first too.
BU will be on a 5 on 3 power play to start the 2nd. But with Colgate's start and BU's offense, rooting for Colgate now is like rooting for them to get an NCAA bid instead of Cornell.
BU ties it on the 5 on 3.
BU looking good, many more chances and has hit 2 posts.
Happy for those of you that rooted for Colgate yesterday. SMH.
Merrimack now up 2-1, 4:50 left in 2nd period
Quote from: chimpfoodEven if Merrimack loses tomorrow would they even fall behind us after this?
Yes.
Harvard scores one. So does NMU.
Colgate up 2-1.
What's the challenge?
Quote from: Al DeFlorioColgate up 2-1.
3-1
OK, here's what I see.
If BU beats Merrimack, we finish at #12. If Merrimack beats BU, we finish at #13.
Then it all comes down to other bid stealers. If we're #13, we need at least one favorite to win or our season's over.
Quote from: ugarteQuote from: Al DeFlorioColgate up 2-1.
3-1
Always funny how Harvard's defense and goaltender seemingly play poorly against any of the other top 4 finishers in the league (at least most of the season in the case of Colgate)
BU ties it with 10:58 left in 3rd.
Quote from: jkahnBU ties it with 10:58 left in 3rd.
I'm hitting refresh on the CHN scoreboard at a deranged rate and you're still ahead of me.
Quote from: DafatoneQuote from: jkahnBU ties it with 10:58 left in 3rd.
I'm hitting refresh on the CHN scoreboard at a deranged rate and you're still ahead of me.
So am I ::scared::
Whew. Finally updated!
St Cloud leads Colorado College 1-0 after 1.
Mankato scores two goals in the last 3 minutes of the third to tie NMU at 2-2.
And it's going to OT.
And BU - Merrimack also going to OT.
Quote from: Jeff Hopkins '82And BU - Merrimack also going to OT.
BU wins! Go 'Gate!
Mankato wins (per USCHO).
We're in.
And just for fun, Michigan leading the Goofers (4-3) with about 7 mins left.
Quote from: Jeff Hopkins '82And BU - Merrimack also going to OT.
BU wins!
So we'll get Michigan first round, correct?
woooooooooooo
And Colgate wins. ECAC gets 4 in.
never in doubt imo
turn on espn and watch yianni go for his 4th straight title RIGHT NOW
Quote from: chimpfoodSo we'll get Michigan first round, correct?
If they hold on to beat Minnesota, probably. If Minnesota comes back to win, then we likely get BU.
It's awfully nice that Harvard lost.
Thanks, Colgate.
Quote from: DafatoneIt's awfully nice that Harvard lost.
Thanks, Colgate.
+1
Quote from: DafatoneIt's awfully nice that Harvard lost.
Thanks, Colgate.
Yeah honestly this is the best result we could've asked for across the board (except us winning the ecac title of course)
Michigan wins.
Quote from: Jeff Hopkins '82Quote from: chimpfoodSo we'll get Michigan first round, correct?
If they hold on to beat Minnesota, probably. If Minnesota comes back to win, then we likely get BU.
With all conference championship games now complete, the final Pairwise (teams in
italics are NCAA automatic qualifiers):
1. Minnesota
2. Quinnipiac
3. Michigan4. Denver
5. BU6. St. Cloud7. Harvard
8. Penn State
9. Ohio State
10. Michigan Tech
11. Minnesota State12. Western Michigan
13. Cornell
14. Merrimack
25. Colgate41. CanisiusMichigan wins its PWC with Denver, and thus the no. 3 overall ranking, by having a tiny advantage in RPI (.578907 to .578905, per CHN).
I want denver over mich. Go St. Cloud.
This is Trotsky. I cou"d be wrong but I do not think we are in. I think if St. Cloud loses we're out. 3 dark horses already in (AH, ECAC, CCHA). CC wins and we're dead. Prove me wrong. Please.
Quote from: toddloseHappy for those of you that rooted for Colgate yesterday. SMH.
Today in the rink at the start of the 3rd Janice asked me if we root for Sucks. My reply was that I was rooting for BU and Denver. If Cornell was knocked out by Colgate winning do the hockey gods care who rooted for them?
We could ask Dionne Warwick (https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=iGK7FNK5YBI) and the Psychic Friends Network but even poor Dionne grew weary of the razzing she endured for that move.
YMMV!
Let's Go Red.
Quote from: Anne 85This is Trotsky. I cou"d be wrong but I do not think we are in. I think if St. Cloud loses we're out. 3 dark horses already in (AH, ECAC, CCHA). CC wins and we're dead. Prove me wrong. Please.
Minn state won the CCHA and is ahead of us in the pairwise. We're in.
we are in with 3 teams behind us. its just whether CC makes it or Merrimack now.
so we would play mich/denv most likely before they start messing with brackets
Never mind. Mankato ahead of us. We're in.
Quote from: Anne 85Never mind. Mankato ahead of us. We're in.
Had Mankato lost, they would've fallen behind us. So, they weren't gonna matter anyway.
bets news is we avoided Minn in Fargo and Quin in Bridgeport most likely
Mich/Den who goes to Allentown/PSU and who goes to Manchester
So when did cutting up hockey nets after a championship become a thing? I was pretty surprised when Colgate took scissors to the net they defended twice and started hacking away.
Quote from: upprdeckbets news is we avoided Minn in Fargo and Quin in Bridgeport most likely
Mich/Den who goes to Allentown/PSU and who goes to Manchester
We were never gonna play Q in the first round. Can't play the same conference in round 1.
Barring a last minute comeback, St. Cloud will win, meaning Merrimack would be the last team in. Wild season when you have 4 ECAC teams and Merrimack getting into the NCAA's as an at-large bid
I feel kinda badly for Alaska. 7th best record in the NCAAs and they're on the outside looking in.
Weak schedule, but on par with ours.
So, Allentown and we play Denver or Michigan, I presume.
Is that Th or Fr?
With all the games now complete (my previous post with the final Pairwise edited to reflect that), adamw's final bracket projection (https://www.collegehockeynews.com/news/2023/03/18_Bracket-ABCs-Final-NCAA-.php) — CHN has us in Manchester playing DU, with BU-Western Michigan the other matchup in that regional.
Fargo and Manchester are Thursday/Saturday; Allentown and Bridgeport are Friday/Sunday.
Quote from: Anne 85So, Allentown and we play Denver or Michigan, I presume.
Is that Th or Fr?
Not sure if it's Allentown or Manchester.
Manchester is Thursday. Allentown is Friday.
Quote from: Jeff Hopkins '82Quote from: upprdeckbets news is we avoided Minn in Fargo and Quin in Bridgeport most likely
Mich/Den who goes to Allentown/PSU and who goes to Manchester
We were never gonna play Q in the first round. Can't play the same conference in round 1.
i wasnt talking first rd. just in general..
Quote from: Anne 85So, Allentown and we play Denver or Michigan, I presume.
Is that Th or Fr?
I think maybe Michigan in Manchester. PennState can't play tOSU. Which to move? If you move PSU to Allentown and St Cloud to Fargo...
Quote from: kingpin248With all the games now complete (my previous post with the final Pairwise edited to reflect that), adamw's final bracket projection (https://www.collegehockeynews.com/news/2023/03/18_Bracket-ABCs-Final-NCAA-.php) — CHN has us in Manchester playing DU, with BU-Western Michigan the other matchup in that regional.
Fargo and Manchester are Thursday/Saturday; Allentown and Bridgeport are Friday/Sunday.
I came up with the same bracket as Adam's first one.
Quote from: Jeff Hopkins '82Quote from: kingpin248With all the games now complete (my previous post with the final Pairwise edited to reflect that), adamw's final bracket projection (https://www.collegehockeynews.com/news/2023/03/18_Bracket-ABCs-Final-NCAA-.php) — CHN has us in Manchester playing DU, with BU-Western Michigan the other matchup in that regional.
Fargo and Manchester are Thursday/Saturday; Allentown and Bridgeport are Friday/Sunday.
I came up with the same bracket as Adam's first one.
I like Adam's first bracket too. But I'm wondering if Cornell might possibly be placed in Allentown instead of Manchester. For attendance it might work out better. Flip Cornell with Colgate to achieve this.
With regard to the first bracket, is it possible that the committee will favor it because it places the 4 Big10 teams in 2 locations. Thus at most there would be only 2 Big10 teams in Tampa.
I can't be the only person who thinks they were fortunate a bit more than deserving to have 4 in the top 14 computer ranked spots.
Quote from: martyQuote from: Jeff Hopkins '82Quote from: kingpin248With all the games now complete (my previous post with the final Pairwise edited to reflect that), adamw's final bracket projection (https://www.collegehockeynews.com/news/2023/03/18_Bracket-ABCs-Final-NCAA-.php) — CHN has us in Manchester playing DU, with BU-Western Michigan the other matchup in that regional.
Fargo and Manchester are Thursday/Saturday; Allentown and Bridgeport are Friday/Sunday.
I came up with the same bracket as Adam's first one.
I like Adam's first bracket too. But I'm wondering if Cornell might possibly be placed in Allentown instead of Manchester. For attendance it might work out better. Flip Cornell with Colgate to achieve this.
With regard to the first bracket, is it possible that the committee will favor it because it places the 4 Big10 teams in 2 locations. Thus at most there would be only 2 Big10 teams in Tampa.
I can't be the only person who thinks they were fortunate a bit more than deserving to have 4 in the top 14 computer ranked spots.
I would love it if we ended up in Allentown. After all, I live about 3 miles from the rink.
As to the Big 10 deserving 4 slots, it's an aspect (weakness) of the pairwise. If one team does very well out of conference, all the teams in conference get a bonus. That's especially true if the teams play each other 4 times, like they do in the Big 10. And take a look at Penn State. They went 0.500 in the Big 10, but played all their out of conference games against AHA or Alaska and won them all.
WTF I love the model now
Seems to me like Cornell pretty much has to get Denver.
#1 Minnesota vs #16 Canisius is a given.
Then you have #2 Q and #15 Colgate, so you need to split them up.
The only thing that makes sense is Q vs #14 Merrimack, Colgate vs #3 Michigan.
Which leaves #4 Denver vs #13 Cornell.
If for the sake of argument Cornell got Michigan, then who does Colgate get? Denver? Then you'd be breaking bracket integrity for no reason—you'd have #15 vs #4 and #13 vs #3 rather than #15 vs #3 and #13 vs #4. So I don't see how Cornell doesn't end up playing Denver. I'm sure the committee will figure out some way to screw Cornell by giving them Michigan though. (Not saying Denver is easy, just easier than Michigan.)
Quote from: BearLoverI said it before and I'll say it again, there is a ridiculous talent disparity between Harvard and the rest of the league. Cornell had better hope that a large number of Harvard's 15 draft picks leave for the pros, and that something happens in the coming years to close the talent gap. This isn't tenable.
I've thought about this and laughed to myself multiple times over the past couple days.
"This isn't tenable." Please spare me this.
It's always been this way, going back to the 50s where Harvard had a huge head start until 1963, when Ned started fighting back with recruiting strategies that had an internationally renowned university such as Harvard relying on jingoistic nationalism to call foul on our "foreigners."
Harvard players won 3 Hobeys in the 80s and were absolutely loaded with talent the entire decade. Clearly got his NC in OT in '89 and cranked out a teams who loaded the US national/Olympic rosters of that era and had lots of players go to the nhl. Yet they only won 2 league championships from the Divorce to the end of the Cleary / beginning of the Schafer eras. We had our lowest points during that time period.
Yet who still is winning the race in head-to-head record, in ECACs championships, and in Ivy titles? Cornell has somehow overcome the recruiting and geographic advantages Harvard has now, has always had, and always will have in this rivalry. The players they get are of a different type than the ones we get. They have always had more "blue chippahs" than us. Yet, we still have the record book to point to.
But hey draft picks... wait, sorry, you said "ridiculous talent disparity" had us taking them to OT, in 2 of 3 games. Both teams are top 10 in offensive output. Both are top 10 in defense. There is simply not a "ridiculous disparity" there. The ridiculous talent disparity between them and the rest of the league sure was on display against Colgate, wasn't it?
It's tenable. And I don't expect either team to fade anytime soon.
Quote from: djk26Ugh--so this weekend is the double torture of losing to Harvard--and then having to root for them in the next game.::pain::
I guess yesterday was the best of all possible results--four ECAC teams (apparently) in the NCAA tournament, and most importantly, Cornell is one of them. We can talk about how it would have been nice to have an easier path to the Frozen Four, but the fact is, we had some bad losses this year and any at large can't complain about where they are placed.
It did make the cheers more complicated yesterday...
"Screw BU, Harvard too, but only to the extent that either result will not hurt Cornell's relative placement in the Pair Wise Rankings."
Hard to chant.
Let's go Red! ::uptosomething::
A Denver matchup would also put us "against" Ben Scrivens, who's their current team manager.
Agree with Rich. The rivalry is fairly even with each team having short runs of success before the balance tips back. Although we lost three times this year (two of which were winnable), we won some hardware and they did not. And no they are not going to win the NCAA trophy.
In 1986 my apartment mate and I watched Letterman then hopped in his Honda and drove all night to Newark and hopped on a Peoples Express flight to Dallas. Barely made our connection to Denver. Went to the the chapter of his fraternity (can't recall which one) at the Colorado School of Mines in Golden. They were on spring break and the boys graciously allowed this non-member to crash at their place and even fed us. We went to the NCAA quarterfinals at DU's old place. Nasty fans iirc. We lose game 1, 4-2 in a two game total goal set. We take a 4-1 lead in game two but end up "winning" 4-3. Not good enough in Dadswell's last game. Great weekend even if disappointing end. Recall people tho king we were Cornell College in Iowa. Ego deflating.
Quote from: arugulaIn 1986 my apartment mate and I watched Letterman then hopped in his Honda and drove all night to Newark and hopped on a Peoples Express flight to Dallas. Barely made our connection to Denver. Went to the the chapter of his fraternity (can't recall which one) at the Colorado School of Mines in Golden. They were on spring break and the boys graciously allowed this non-member to crash at their place and even fed us. We went to the NCAA quarterfinals at DU's old place. Nasty fans iirc. We lose game 1, 4-2 in a two game total goal set. We take a 4-1 lead in game two but end up "winning" 4-3. Not good enough in Dadswell's last game. Great weekend even if disappointing end. Recall people tho king we were Cornell College in Iowa. Ego deflating.
I was a senior. My future first wife and I were skiing in Vermont for spring break. I remember finding a newspaper with the scores, and, of course, being annoyed at how the total goals format had screwed us.
Better than a one and done though. It was sae at Colorado school of mines. Thanks to SAE many years later.
Interesting thing about that series was that, unlike now, we were way smaller than our opponent. I recall virtually their entire roster was over six feet and maybe 2-3 of our guys were-Nieuwendyk of course. Schafer's last game.
Playing thurs-sat.
I wonder how that messes with attendance?
Its one thing to get out on Thursday to play friday but now people may have to miss 2-3 days of work to watch this thing.
Quote from: upprdeckPlaying thurs-sat.
I wonder how that messes with attendance?
Its one thing to get out on Thursday to play friday but now people may have to miss 2-3 days of work to watch this thing.
Putting an off-day in the regionals was the worst possible idea anyone could have come up with.
Quote from: RichHQuote from: BearLoverI said it before and I'll say it again, there is a ridiculous talent disparity between Harvard and the rest of the league. Cornell had better hope that a large number of Harvard's 15 draft picks leave for the pros, and that something happens in the coming years to close the talent gap. This isn't tenable.
I've thought about this and laughed to myself multiple times over the past couple days.
"This isn't tenable." Please spare me this.
It's always been this way, going back to the 50s where Harvard had a huge head start until 1963, when Ned started fighting back with recruiting strategies that had an internationally renowned university such as Harvard relying on jingoistic nationalism to call foul on our "foreigners."
Harvard players won 3 Hobeys in the 80s and were absolutely loaded with talent the entire decade. Clearly got his NC in OT in '89 and cranked out a teams who loaded the US national/Olympic rosters of that era and had lots of players go to the nhl. Yet they only won 2 league championships from the Divorce to the end of the Cleary / beginning of the Schafer eras. We had our lowest points during that time period.
Yet who still is winning the race in head-to-head record, in ECACs championships, and in Ivy titles? Cornell has somehow overcome the recruiting and geographic advantages Harvard has now, has always had, and always will have in this rivalry. The players they get are of a different type than the ones we get. They have always had more "blue chippahs" than us. Yet, we still have the record book to point to.
But hey draft picks... wait, sorry, you said "ridiculous talent disparity" had us taking them to OT, in 2 of 3 games. Both teams are top 10 in offensive output. Both are top 10 in defense. There is simply not a "ridiculous disparity" there. The ridiculous talent disparity between them and the rest of the league sure was on display against Colgate, wasn't it?
It's tenable. And I don't expect either team to fade anytime soon.
Well I'm certainly honored to hear that my forum posts carry enough weight to occupy so large a space in your mind that you'll think about a single post multiple times over a span of days.
Your argument essentially boils down to: Harvard has always had these same recruiting advantages, but we've been more successful than them anyway. Maybe, but that's not responding to the crux of my post. By "not tenable," I'm talking about current trends, not history from 50 years ago. Current trends clearly suggest that Harvard is going to pass us in ECAC titles and NCAA success soon and Cornell's route to an ECAC championship is going to remain as narrow as it has been for over a decade now.
The fact we're still ahead in the metrics you cited (head-to-head, Ivy titles, ECAC championships) just isn't persuasive. That's like saying Georgetown basketball shouldn't worry about Villanova because they win the historical head-to-head, have more league titles, etc. If Harvard wins the Ivy and ECAC next year and ties us in both categories, will you change your tune?
I could just as easily cherry-pick historical stats to show Harvard has surpassed us. Their most recent national championship is 19 years more recent than our last one. Their most recent frozen four is 14 years more recent than our last one. They've won three ECAC titles since we last won one. I don't find these arguments which rely on one-off events persuasive either, but at least they speak to recent trends rather than old history.
The biggest problem with your point that Harvard has always had these advantages is that you speak only to the direction of the advantage, but not to the degree. Yes, Harvard has for many decades held a recruiting advantage. But in the Schafer era that advantage has never been as large as it is now. 15 draft picks for them to 3 for us. 9 Harvard players on NHL opening night rosters as compared to 1 Cornell player (with Farrell and Coronato soon to follow). This isn't a point about direction of the talent disparity, it's a point about degree.
Cornell will continue to compete for NCAA bids and ECAC titles into the future. But Harvard has lapped us in recruiting and is frankly just a more successful program overall right now (with no signs of slowing down whatsoever).
Quote from: BearLoverWTF I love the model now
hard to argue when it's proven accurate
Just wrote in the incoming recruit thread that Cornell's recent recruiting seems outstanding. Next year brings 2 drafted players & the 2nd highest scoring F & 4th highest scoring D in the USHL. Plus Cornell has 4 other ranked prospects in the NHL's Central Scouring midterm draft rankings.
So now that the stress is over, here's what I was gonna day about the math.
If all the games going into this weekend were coin flips, our odds of getting in were 29/32. That's over 90%. And we wanted favorites to win in each case.
What were the actual odds Colgate beat Q? Well, if Q was 30-3-3 and Colgate right around .500, that suggests Q beats an average team (like Colgate) something like 31.5 out of 36 games. That's a little under 8 out of 9 times.
Now it doesn't actually work this way. Teams get hot and cold. When you get towards the end of the conference tournaments, the only teams left are teams playing well. Colorado College was outright bad this year, but they beat some very good teams.
Still, the odds favored the favorites, as they do. Vegas odds last night had Harvard at something like -210 to win, which I think translates to just over 66%. I'm not saying Vegas odds are perfect, but if they were systematically off in a given direction, someone out there would be getting rich off of it.
All in all, I bet our odds were actually quite high. 99.7%? Probably not. But the 97 or 98 percent thrown out as a suggestion sounds right to me.
A lot more went wrong than right and we still got in with an extra spot to spare.
Quote from: CU2007Putting an off-day in the regionals was the worst possible idea anyone could have come up with.
... for the fans.
Giving the players an extra day to recuperate, that's not so bad.
Making two day trips to Allentown or Bridgeport is cheaper than hotel rooms for metro NY fans. To Manchester, it's either get a hotel room or watch the broadcast.
and not for nothing..
Scheduling the finals to go against the Masters and on Easter weekend is also not gonna play well with people traveling or watching on TV for ratings. They would have been better served to add a week to the season and start playoffs a week later.
The off day seems overwhelmingly likely to diminish attendance. Especially when the games on a Thursday start at 2pm for whatever reason.
I understand the motivation behind the off day. Teams playing long overtimes and then again on short rest probably diminish the quality of the product. But if we're moving to off days, can we go back to two regionals? Run them Thursday through Sunday with 8 teams at each site. Make it more worth the while of a college hockey fan to go.
At each of the east and west sites:
Thursday: bracket a semis
Friday: bracket b semis
Sat: bracket a final
Sun: bracket b final
(If the Fri games were early starts, may even make the bracket b final the back end of two on Saturday and run the whole thing in three days.)
I don't like the idea of campus sites but that feels inevitable if four regionals with off days lead to mostly empty buildings.
but they play all yr with back 2 back games.. and not every game goes to OT so they occasional one might cause an issue but thats the way it goes.
Quote from: BearLoverWell I'm certainly honored to hear that my forum posts carry enough weight to occupy so large a space in your mind that you'll think about a single post multiple times over a span of days.
Hey, don't sell yourself short. You usually come here with a sledgehammer pounding away at the same takes over and over and over and over, and tend to refuse to just say your peace and let things go. You've proven to be a dominant and persistent personality here, so you're pretty hard to ignore. You're clearly knowledgeable and strongly opinionated, and while you participate here in good faith, to me you're often a little over the top in the "LISTEN TO ME, I'M RIGHT" sense. No biggie, but when I do think about the positioning of this program we love, yes, your takes are going to come up in my thoughts. No need to be snarkily modest.
I'll only say that you misunderstood the point of my hazy late-night post. The point I was trying to make wasn't "we've won a lot in the past so therefore we're just as successful." It was "people have been saying exactly what you're saying now for literally decades, and the pendulum always seems to swing back." Can I guarantee we won't fall off or tread water as Harvard zooms off to become the BC of the 2020s? Nope, but I can't guarantee the opposite, either. It's easy outside this fanbase to forget that Cornell was one of the 2-3 favorites to win the National Championship exactly 3 years ago just when the world shuttered on our dreams. (Men *and* Women). I'd argue that this isn't even Harvard's best team in the past 5
years seasons, despite your precious draft-pick boner metric.
People were saying this about Allan and Yale just 10 years ago. They are the future of the league, and the Schafer is stuck in his past ways unable to adapt to a new style, etc etc etc. Well, Yale got their NC, yes, but the Yale program is back to the punching bag division. Coach Mike has adapted his recruiting and style subtly, and still is grabbing at-large bids on the regular.
If Harvard is so far ahead of the league, I ask again, where are those results? Yes, they're in the top tier of our league. But they haven't been as dominant as you're selling them. Their top line can dismantle most patsies, but they are taken to OT by lesser teams an awful lot, and the OT rules simply favor having a top line built like that.
This is one of those eras where both Cornell and Harvard happen to be in an "up" period. The pendulum always seems to swing to and fro, and I don't expect that to change. It's always been a great rivalry for that reason.
OK, fair enough. I agree by the way that Harvard's 2017 team was better.
Quote from: billhowardQuote from: CU2007Putting an off-day in the regionals was the worst possible idea anyone could have come up with.
... for the fans.
Giving the players an extra day to recuperate, that's not so bad.
Making two day trips to Allentown or Bridgeport is cheaper than hotel rooms for metro NY fans. To Manchester, it's either get a hotel room or watch the broadcast.
Or crash at your sister's place in Mass. Which is my plan.
Quote from: upprdeckand not for nothing..
Scheduling the finals to go against the Masters and on Easter weekend is also not gonna play well with people traveling or watching on TV for ratings. They would have been better served to add a week to the season and start playoffs a week later.
NCAA basketball is designed to end around April 1. NCAA hockey is assigned its finals weekend for the next weekend. I don't think the NCAA worries a lot about the Masters draining away hockey viewers and the hockey title game tips off a couple hours after the third round of the Masters has ended. Easter? Well, you catch it next year.
Quote from: billhowardQuote from: upprdeckand not for nothing..
Scheduling the finals to go against the Masters and on Easter weekend is also not gonna play well with people traveling or watching on TV for ratings. They would have been better served to add a week to the season and start playoffs a week later.
NCAA basketball is designed to end around April 1. NCAA hockey is assigned its finals weekend for the next weekend. I don't think the NCAA worries a lot about the Masters draining away hockey viewers and the hockey title game tips off a couple hours after the third round of the Masters has ended. Easter? Well, you catch it next year on Sunday morning.
FYP
Quote from: BearLoverQuote from: RichHQuote from: BearLoverI said it before and I'll say it again, there is a ridiculous talent disparity between Harvard and the rest of the league. Cornell had better hope that a large number of Harvard's 15 draft picks leave for the pros, and that something happens in the coming years to close the talent gap. This isn't tenable.
I've thought about this and laughed to myself multiple times over the past couple days.
"This isn't tenable." Please spare me this.
It's always been this way, going back to the 50s where Harvard had a huge head start until 1963, when Ned started fighting back with recruiting strategies that had an internationally renowned university such as Harvard relying on jingoistic nationalism to call foul on our "foreigners."
Harvard players won 3 Hobeys in the 80s and were absolutely loaded with talent the entire decade. Clearly got his NC in OT in '89 and cranked out a teams who loaded the US national/Olympic rosters of that era and had lots of players go to the nhl. Yet they only won 2 league championships from the Divorce to the end of the Cleary / beginning of the Schafer eras. We had our lowest points during that time period.
Yet who still is winning the race in head-to-head record, in ECACs championships, and in Ivy titles? Cornell has somehow overcome the recruiting and geographic advantages Harvard has now, has always had, and always will have in this rivalry. The players they get are of a different type than the ones we get. They have always had more "blue chippahs" than us. Yet, we still have the record book to point to.
But hey draft picks... wait, sorry, you said "ridiculous talent disparity" had us taking them to OT, in 2 of 3 games. Both teams are top 10 in offensive output. Both are top 10 in defense. There is simply not a "ridiculous disparity" there. The ridiculous talent disparity between them and the rest of the league sure was on display against Colgate, wasn't it?
It's tenable. And I don't expect either team to fade anytime soon.
Well I'm certainly honored to hear that my forum posts carry enough weight to occupy so large a space in your mind that you'll think about a single post multiple times over a span of days.
Your argument essentially boils down to: Harvard has always had these same recruiting advantages, but we've been more successful than them anyway. Maybe, but that's not responding to the crux of my post. By "not tenable," I'm talking about current trends, not history from 50 years ago. Current trends clearly suggest that Harvard is going to pass us in ECAC titles and NCAA success soon and Cornell's route to an ECAC championship is going to remain as narrow as it has been for over a decade now.
The fact we're still ahead in the metrics you cited (head-to-head, Ivy titles, ECAC championships) just isn't persuasive. That's like saying Georgetown basketball shouldn't worry about Villanova because they win the historical head-to-head, have more league titles, etc. If Harvard wins the Ivy and ECAC next year and ties us in both categories, will you change your tune?
I could just as easily cherry-pick historical stats to show Harvard has surpassed us. Their most recent national championship is 19 years more recent than our last one. Their most recent frozen four is 14 years more recent than our last one. They've won three ECAC titles since we last won one. I don't find these arguments which rely on one-off events persuasive either, but at least they speak to recent trends rather than old history.
The biggest problem with your point that Harvard has always had these advantages is that you speak only to the direction of the advantage, but not to the degree. Yes, Harvard has for many decades held a recruiting advantage. But in the Schafer era that advantage has never been as large as it is now. 15 draft picks for them to 3 for us. 9 Harvard players on NHL opening night rosters as compared to 1 Cornell player (with Farrell and Coronato soon to follow). This isn't a point about direction of the talent disparity, it's a point about degree.
Cornell will continue to compete for NCAA bids and ECAC titles into the future. But Harvard has lapped us in recruiting and is frankly just a more successful program overall right now (with no signs of slowing down whatsoever).
Harvard hasn't had 15 picks on their team every year. More picks than us? Yes. But not this many. That begs a few questions:
Is 15 a blip or a trend? It's more likely a high blip than anything permanent.
What is Harvard doing to get such big classes with draftees? Is it business as usual or has something changed?
Let's not forget that Ted Donato spent 12 years in the nhl. That's a big selling point we can't remotely match. If you're a high end talent and you want to get to the show, a coach who's been there and knows all the ins and outs etc should be a big help to your development.
Playing that long, and being ~55yo, gives donato
an interesting demographic edge as well. He will have played with a slew of guys who's kids are recruiting age. So that network effect might grab Harvard a few more kids of NHLers.
Let's also not forget that geography wise we're screwed. If you look at the hockey hotbeds around the country, we get very few of those kids. Michigan, Minnesota, Boston schools as a group, etc...they all get their pick of the locals. (Not to mention that there's a lot less effort involved when you are scouting and recruiting kids within a couple hour drive of campus as opposed to going after guys in nainamo.). Can we find some pockets or under recruited areas? Possibly. But we will always be at a disadvantage because there's no local base.
half the places we are trying to recruit you cant even fly too
Quote from: upprdeckhalf the places we are trying to recruit you cant even fly to
To be fair, you can barely fly to Ithaca.
Quote from: upprdeckhalf the places we are trying to recruit you cant even fly too
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nanaimo_Airport
Quote from: Jeff Hopkins '82Quote from: upprdeckhalf the places we are trying to recruit you cant even fly to
To be fair, you can barely fly to Ithaca.
Compañía Panameña de Aviación, S.A., the flag carrier of Panama, flies direct to Ithaca from Lima and Bogota.
Quote from: TrotskyQuote from: Jeff Hopkins '82Quote from: upprdeckhalf the places we are trying to recruit you cant even fly to
To be fair, you can barely fly to Ithaca.
Compañía Panameña de Aviación, S.A., the flag carrier of Panama, flies direct to Ithaca from Lima and Bogota.
This sounds like something that should be investigated by the campus Greek Council.
Quote from: ugarteQuote from: TrotskyQuote from: Jeff Hopkins '82Quote from: upprdeckhalf the places we are trying to recruit you cant even fly to
To be fair, you can barely fly to Ithaca.
Compañía Panameña de Aviación, S.A., the flag carrier of Panama, flies direct to Ithaca from Lima and Bogota.
This sounds like something that should be investigated by the campus Greek Council.
Or the DEA.
Quote from: BearLoverQuote from: jtwcornell91Quote from: BearLoverNo one made any attempt to check whether weighting by KRACH yields accurate predictions.
Yes, we have: https://arxiv.org/abs/2001.04226
Wow, this is amazing. I had no idea! You are one of the authors? I'm going to try my best to read this as a non-math major. (Though feel free to offer the cliff notes if you'd like.)
Yeah notice who else's name is on there :) (though really, I had little to do with it besides providing data and moral support)
I can't believe we're still talking about this - and complaining over the difference between like 99.7% and 98% - especially when it came true. But here we are.
As I said - I am planning to make additions/alterations to the calc for next season, if I can figure out how. But I also tried to explain -- the point of the Matrix is not to project winners per se. It's to outline - in an automated way, and better than using 50/50 - the number of scenarios in which a team places in certain places in the Pairwise. Because doing so in other ways is arduous, and probably even less accurate. You need to be able to distinguish the difference, and ascertain what the point of it is before complaining about it 472 times every March.
nevermind
Quote from: adamwQuote from: BearLoverQuote from: jtwcornell91Quote from: BearLoverNo one made any attempt to check whether weighting by KRACH yields accurate predictions.
Yes, we have: https://arxiv.org/abs/2001.04226
Wow, this is amazing. I had no idea! You are one of the authors? I'm going to try my best to read this as a non-math major. (Though feel free to offer the cliff notes if you'd like.)
Yeah notice who else's name is on there :) (though really, I had little to do with it besides providing data and moral support)
I can't believe we're still talking about this - and complaining over the difference between like 99.7% and 98% - especially when it came true. But here we are.
As I said - I am planning to make additions/alterations to the calc for next season, if I can figure out how. But I also tried to explain -- the point of the Matrix is not to project winners per se. It's to outline - in an automated way, and better than using 50/50 - the number of scenarios in which a team places in certain places in the Pairwise. Because doing so in other ways is arduous, and probably even less accurate. You need to be able to distinguish the difference, and ascertain what the point of it is before complaining about it 472 times every March.
Just as long as you and John can get this predicting the future thing figured out by 2026 (https://www.knightsonice.com/news/2020/10/14/21516519/las-vegas-to-host-2026-ncaa-frozen-four-t-mobile-arena-hockey-landscape-changing) I'm sure BearLover will forgive you.
Quote from: TrotskyQuote from: Jeff Hopkins '82Quote from: upprdeckhalf the places we are trying to recruit you cant even fly to
To be fair, you can barely fly to Ithaca.
Compañía Panameña de Aviación, S.A., the flag carrier of Panama, flies direct to Ithaca from Lima and Bogota.
Actually, Copa is a decent airline. I've flown them many times. And PTY is a nice airport,too.