Since no one else has started the game thread.
Mitchell was on the ice for warmups.
Whoa, we came out hot.
Nice catch by Schafer, there. Let's cash in.
Narrator: we did.
Penalty at 07:31
Max Andreev Gabriel Seger Sam Malinski PPG 08:59
Dalton Bancroft Max Andreev Sam Malinski PPG 11:40
Ondrej Psenicka Travis Mitchell Travis Mitchell PPG 11:51
Nick DeSantis Ben Berard Travis Mitchell PPG 12:02
Dalton Bancroft Travis Mitchell 12:34 (3 seconds after penalty expired)
That's what we need more of on the power play. Work the puck low to pass it back up high.
Score: Schafer 3 Cornell 1 Union 0
Holy shit. This must have been what 1967 was like.
4 goals in 54 seconds, 4 goals on a major, 1 second from 5.
Jaysus
We have 6 goals.
Union has 0 shots.
Connor Murphy tonight:
25.05 GAA
.375 Sv%
Jack O'Brien sighting.
Jimmy Rayhill still waiting.
"Zach is better!" chant.
Quote from: TrotskyNice catch by Schafer, there. Let's cash in.
How did two refs miss a high stick to the head?
Quote from: George64Quote from: TrotskyNice catch by Schafer, there. Let's cash in.
How did two refs miss a high stick to the head?
My guess is they were watching the shot.
Quote from: TrotskyHoly shit. This must have been what 1967 was like.
I thought I remembered such games, but I've been over at TBRW, and all I can find is a few 4-goal first periods. Do you know of any 6-goal first- or other periods? Or have we just witnessed a record-setting, historically significant period?
::banana::::banana::::banana::::banana::::banana::::banana::
I am pretty sure there was a 9-0 first period v. Yale I think, under Bertrand in the Brock Tredway era. I remember because he pulled the goalie with a faceoff in the defensive zone, claiming he wanted the players to practice that play.
Quote from: dag14I am pretty sure there was a 9-0 first period v. Yale I think, under Bertrand in the Brock Tredway era. I remember because he pulled the goalie with a faceoff in the defensive zone, claiming he wanted the players to practice that play.
Correct.
January 21, 1978.
Quote from: dag14I am pretty sure there was a 9-0 first period v. Yale I think, under Bertrand in the Brock Tredway era. I remember because he pulled the goalie with a faceoff in the defensive zone, claiming he wanted the players to practice that play.
http://www.tbrw.info/seasons/1978/box19780121.pdf
Quote from: dag14I am pretty sure there was a 9-0 first period v. Yale I think, under Bertrand in the Brock Tredway era. I remember because he pulled the goalie with a faceoff in the defensive zone, claiming he wanted the players to practice that play.
We scored 11 against RPI last year, so we must've had an equivalent period (I'm too lazy to check TBRW)
7 against Colgate (http://www.tbrw.info/seasons/1967/box19670119.pdf) in 1967
I believe our record is 9 for any one period (http://www.tbrw.info/seasons/1968/box19680127.pdf), against Yale in 1968.
Note how rare second assists were. Not sure if that was the nature of the goals or if it was just not usual to give 2 assists back then.
Quote from: Trotsky7 against Colgate (http://www.tbrw.info/seasons/1967/box19670119.pdf) in 1967
And the Colgate goalie wasn't pulled in that one
Sorry; I wasn't clear. Bertrand pulled the goalie looking for #10....
Quote from: dag14Sorry; I wasn't clear. Bertrand pulled the goalie looking for #10....
"Dick Bertrand before he dicks you."
Andreev 1 on 3 and he holds his own.
Quote from: scoop85Quote from: dag14I am pretty sure there was a 9-0 first period v. Yale I think, under Bertrand in the Brock Tredway era. I remember because he pulled the goalie with a faceoff in the defensive zone, claiming he wanted the players to practice that play.
We scored 11 against RPI last year, so we must've had an equivalent period (I'm too lazy to check TBRW)
We had 5 in the first in that game.
Gate is losing to RPI.
Quote from: TrotskyI believe our record is 9 for any one period (http://www.tbrw.info/seasons/1968/box19680127.pdf), against Yale in 1968.
Note how rare second assists were. Not sure if that was the nature of the goals or if it was just not usual to give 2 assists back then.
IIRC, we were much faster than many teams made up of mostly Usonians. So we scored on lots of breakaways and 2-on-1's.
Yet another 11-goal weekend.
Shouldn't they pull Shane now that the shutout chance is gone, and give the backup some time?
Quote from: nshapiroShouldn't they pull Shane now that the shutout chance is gone, and give the backup some time?
Yes, probably a good chance we may see Keopple get the 3rd.
Scary thing is, Union's second goalie is actually playing well.
Quote from: scoop85Quote from: nshapiroShouldn't they pull Shane now that the shutout chance is gone, and give the backup some time?
Yes, probably a good chance we may see Keopple get the 3rd.
I would be for that.
Quote from: TrotskyQuote from: scoop85Quote from: nshapiroShouldn't they pull Shane now that the shutout chance is gone, and give the backup some time?
Yes, probably a good chance we may see Keopple get the 3rd.
I would be for that.
Hell, give McInchak some time.
Quote from: TrotskyQuote from: dag14I am pretty sure there was a 9-0 first period v. Yale I think, under Bertrand in the Brock Tredway era. I remember because he pulled the goalie with a faceoff in the defensive zone, claiming he wanted the players to practice that play.
http://www.tbrw.info/seasons/1978/box19780121.pdf
Take a look at who was in goal for Yale...
SOG given up by Cornell, last 3 periods:
2. 2. 3.
Quote from: dag14I am pretty sure there was a 9-0 first period v. Yale I think, under Bertrand in the Brock Tredway era. I remember because he pulled the goalie with a faceoff in the defensive zone, claiming he wanted the players to practice that play.
I can verify this. I was at that game.
Dartmouth led Q 1-0 after 1. No update since.
I believe the 1968 Yale game was in New Haven, and was essentially Cornell's revenge for breaking Cornell's 7 year(?) winning streak at Lynch with a 3-2 win the prior year. This game ended up 18-1, Cornell.
Quote from: hypotenuseI believe the 1968 Yale game was in New Haven, and was essentially Cornell's revenge for breaking Cornell's 7 year(?) winning streak at Lynch with a 3-2 win the prior year. This game ended up 18-1, Cornell.
It was in New Haven. We beat them 6-0 in Ithaca. But Cornell's home winning streak started *after* the Yale loss.
Quote from: nshapiroShouldn't they pull Shane now that the shutout chance is gone, and give the backup some time?
I agree. In 1970, Ned put the late, great Bob Rule in, replacing Brain Cropper (who's he?) in a 11-5 game at Princeton. Schafer has substituted a few times in blowouts, but more frequently he's gone with the horse that brought him.
Why is Shane still in the game?
Surprised Schafer didn't give Keopple a period.
Quote from: scoop85Surprised Schafer didn't give Keopple a period.
Mildly, though Mike does not often do that. (Granted, we are not often up by 7 (http://www.tbrw.info/index.html?/games/cornell_7_Goal_Games.html).)
Quote from: hypotenuseI believe the 1968 Yale game was in New Haven, and was essentially Cornell's revenge for breaking Cornell's 7 year(?) winning streak at Lynch with a 3-2 win the prior year. This game ended up 18-1, Cornell.
19-1
I wonder whether Malinski has any shot at ECAC POTY.
RPI up on Colgate 2-1 with 41 seconds to go.
Mcinchak not Koepple. Hmmmm
Quote from: TrotskyRPI up on Colgate 2-1 with 41 seconds to go.
RPI won its first road game of the season. :)
Largest margin of victory in Schafer's coaching career.
Quote from: ursusminorQuote from: TrotskyRPI up on Colgate 2-1 with 41 seconds to go.
RPI won its first road game of the season. :)
Thank you very much! ::banana::
Quote from: TrotskyI wonder whether Malinski has any shot at ECAC POTY.
For him to do what he's doing is nuts. A 10-game point streak and consistent goal scoring to boot? The guy is literally an offensive threat anytime he's on the ice. I can't think of any Cornell D who has given me that feeling in the past 10-15 years. As good as Kaldis was, Malinski is on another level offensively.
And with all that we dropped to 12 in the Pairwise for the moment.
Quote from: IcebergQuote from: TrotskyI wonder whether Malinski has any shot at ECAC POTY.
For him to do what he's doing is nuts. A 10-game point streak and consistent goal scoring to boot? The guy is literally an offensive threat anytime he's on the ice. I can't think of any Cornell D who has given me that feeling in the past 10-15 years. As good as Kaldis was, Malinski is on another level offensively.
19 points in those 10 games. Now free and clear leading ECAC D'men in scoring, and 5th overall.
Winning. It does not suck.
A thing I did not expect to see.
Leading power play percentage, NCAA:
1. .3247 Cornell
2. .3243 North Dakota
3. .3000 UMass
4. .2688 UNO
5. .2323 Minn-Mankato
or the fact that the top 2 are about .10 better than even 5th place.
At the risk of sounding like a Luddite or an idiot, we win 10-1 and drop in the PWR. This suggests that what other teams do is more important than what you do. SMH
Cornell 1969-70 44x122 .3607
Quote from: arugulaAt the risk of sounding like a Luddite or an idiot, we win 10-1 and drop in the PWR. This suggests that what other teams do is more important than what you do. SMH
It seems dumb but what it means is we beat somebody bad so we didn't get very much credit for it. Also, some other stuff probably happened to shift around our SOS.
I know I just wish I could see from the scores what that would be.
Quote from: arugulaI know I just wish I could see from the scores what that would be.
UMD lost, that probably didn't help.
Quote from: TrotskyQuote from: arugulaAt the risk of sounding like a Luddite or an idiot, we win 10-1 and drop in the PWR. This suggests that what other teams do is more important than what you do. SMH
It seems dumb but what it means is we beat somebody bad so we didn't get very much credit for it. Also, some other stuff probably happened to shift around our SOS.
It's a little more complicated than that. It would help if I could find the pairwise from before tonight's games. But what I think happened is this:
There's us, Michigan Tech, and Harvard. We had the best RPI, which is the tiebreaker. Then Harvard, then Michigan Tech. Cause Harvard beat us twice they win their comparison to us. And we lose ours with Minnesota Duluth as well. Harvard wound up 1st of the three and two comparisons ahead of us, then we were tied with Tech, so we were ahead cause of the tiebreaker.
Tonight, Tech passed Harvard in RPI and flipped that comparison. Now they're each one comparison ahead of us and tied with each other, and Tech wins that tiebreak. So it's Tech, Harvard, us.
We have a good chance of flipping the Harvard comparison back if we either play well enough to win the common opponent category or beat Harvard head to head. UMD, oh well, that ship has sailed.
But we are 10th in RPI, which is a good place to be in.
that Michigan Tech passed Harvard in RPI and leapfrogged us because they flipped their pairwise with Harvard.
We are also on the wrong end of a weird situation. PWR tracks almost perfectly with RPI, but we are behind not just Harvard but also Michigan Tech in PWR despite being ahead of them in RPI. We are actually #10 in RPI.
Quote from: arugulaAt the risk of sounding like a Luddite or an idiot, we win 10-1 and drop in the PWR. This suggests that what other teams do is more important than what you do. SMH
Not really. First of all, score differential doesn't factor in. Second, our RPI improved. That creates more separation between us and the teams below us, which makes it more likely we qualify for the NCAAs. After tonight we are more likely to make the NCAAs than we were before tonight.
We dropped in the PWR because we win fewer "comparisons" than Michigan Tech and Harvard, who are tied for #10, despite us having better RPI than them both. They each win 50 comparisons and we win 49. The reason for this is that we lost two games to Harvard and two to Minnesota-Duluth, so we lose comparisons to those teams.
There will be weird fluctuations in the Pairwise for the rest of the season. It definitely isn't great that we lost to Harvard and Duluth twice. But if we maintain our current level of winning, we will make the NCAAs. We are in good position now, with quite a bit of RPI separation between us and the teams below us.
(jinx)
Can we play well down the stretch.. we should be top 4..
So that means 5 home games left, need them all.
then road vs colg/brown/yale..
Colgate has played us tough lately.
Brown/Yale 2 of the bottom 3 with little to play for, can we be mentally tough to end the yr.
if we got 7-1 to get to the ECAC final 4 we should be in good shape.
Quote from: BearLoverWe are in good position now, with quite a bit of RPI separation between us and the teams below us.
We are actually closer to 9 than 11 and to 8 than 12 in RPI:
08 .562 +.007 St. Cloud
09 .558 +.003 Western Michigan
[color=#FF0000]10 .555 Cornell[/color]
11 .550 -.005 Michigan Tech
12 .547 -.008 Harvard
Based on the idea that our opponents doing well should help our PWR, I get why UMD and Clarkson faltering hurts us, but shouldn't BU and Q winning help us? Doesn't seem to. I'm just exasperated. I know theres logic to this but the logic seems to always go the other way.
Quote from: arugulaBased on the idea that our opponents doing well should help our PWR, I get why UMD and Clarkson faltering hurts us, but shouldn't BU and Q winning help us? Doesn't seem to. I'm just exasperated. I know theres logic to this but the logic seems to always go the other way.
Q winning doesn't help because it's in conference against a team we have played the same number of times. So robbing Peter pays Paul.
Quote from: arugulaBased on the idea that our opponents doing well should help our PWR, I get why UMD and Clarkson faltering hurts us, but shouldn't BU and Q winning help us? Doesn't seem to. I'm just exasperated. I know theres logic to this but the logic seems to always go the other way.
In-conference games are basically a wash since we play both the loser and the winner. As mentioned above, our RPI, which is a function of win% and SOS, improved tonight. The Pairwise is largely RPI, but not exactly (the difference was summarized earlier in this thread, but there are also more involved primers on the ranking that can be found online). We are in better position to make the NCAAs now than we were before tonight, because our RPI improved and we avoided a bad loss. Don't pay too much attention to small fluctuations in the Pairwise or you will miss the forest for the trees.
Got it. Still doesn't explain why BU shooting up the ratings hasn't helped. Or perhaps it has just not as much as other factors have hurt us.
The idea that the conference games are a wash supports the idea that we should schedule as strong an OOC slate as possible. We had this debate a few years ago and the perspective was decidedly split. I guess UMD is theoretically an opponent to strengthen that aspect but they have had a down year. Instead of AIC and SHU perhaps Hockey East opponents? Otoh you want to win the OOC games. Science!
Quote from: BearLoverDon't pay too much attention to small fluctuations in the Pairwise or you will miss the forest for the trees.
PWR is one of those things that has meaning for any given reading, but has no meaning when you look at local fluctuations around a given reading. I'm sure there is a clever word for this in metrics.
Quote from: arugulaGot it. Still doesn't explain why BU shooting up the ratings hasn't helped. Or perhaps it has just not as much as other factors have hurt us.
The idea that the conference games are a wash supports the idea that we should schedule as strong an OOC slate as possible. We had this debate a few years ago and the perspective was decidedly split. I guess UMD is theoretically an opponent to strengthen that aspect but they have had a down year. Instead of AIC and SHU perhaps Hockey East opponents? Otoh you want to win the OOC games. Science!
I don't think anybody opposes strong NC opponents, per se. The question is whether scheduling them early when we have had far fewer (or no) games under our belt is wise.
As for swapping weaker for stronger teams, it's not that easy -- it's about finding a dance partner with the same hole in their schedule. I'm sure we would have LOVED to play that pair against North Dakota or BC or Penn State rather than AIC, but we can't dictate who has their evenings free.
True. H has the advantage of many strong, local, non-league teams they can easily fit in without a long trip, plus the Beanpot always provides two quality losses. For us I guess the closest strong non league program would be Penn State.
I agree it would be worth our while to develop Pedo State as a rival, if they have any interest at all. It looks like they are going to be a consistently good program, there are commonalities in our university missions, and they aren't far.
RIT is super close, but they aren't consistent and they have Loser Conference stank. I guess the next likely suspect is... back to Burlington? (except they suck) or UConn.
Quote from: TrotskyHoly shit. This must have been what 1967 was like.
That's just what I told my wife during the first intermission.
The real solution is for CMU to go D-1 and join the ECAC. Tartans is an awesome nickname and they'd slot in between Cornell, RPI, and Clarkson for an Eng school, and we could kick out Q. Add RIT and kick out Union and now we're talking.
Anyone have a link to video of the scoring breakout?
Take a look at Penn State's non-conference schedule -- against which it went 9-0
Quote from: TrotskyThe real solution is for CMU to go D-1 and join the ECAC. Tartans is an awesome nickname and they'd slot in between Cornell, RPI, and Clarkson for an Eng school, and we could kick out Q. Add RIT and kick out Union and now we're talking.
Is there any rumor of CMU fielding a team, or did you just pick them? I suppose they could be Princeton's travel partner.
Quote from: DLAnyone have a link to video of the scoring breakout?
This! (https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=zG1W9Peu_PY)
Quote from: adamwTake a look at Penn State's non-conference schedule -- against which it went 9-0
Very weak and a lot of close games. All AHA or independent.
Quote from: ursusminorQuote from: TrotskyThe real solution is for CMU to go D-1 and join the ECAC. Tartans is an awesome nickname and they'd slot in between Cornell, RPI, and Clarkson for an Eng school, and we could kick out Q. Add RIT and kick out Union and now we're talking.
Is there any rumor of CMU fielding a team, or did you just pick them? I suppose they could be Princeton's travel partner.
None at all. I was fantasizing.
Quote from: arugulaGot it. Still doesn't explain why BU shooting up the ratings hasn't helped. Or perhaps it has just not as much as other factors have hurt us.
The idea that the conference games are a wash supports the idea that we should schedule as strong an OOC slate as possible. We had this debate a few years ago and the perspective was decidedly split. I guess UMD is theoretically an opponent to strengthen that aspect but they have had a down year. Instead of AIC and SHU perhaps Hockey East opponents? Otoh you want to win the OOC games. Science!
Another thing to remember is that a lot of teams play each other. So BU doing well helps us some, but it also helps a bunch of other teams. And Hockey East teams play BU twice, so it helps them more than us.
Quote from: dag14Sorry; I wasn't clear. Bertrand pulled the goalie looking for #10....
Given how hockey was then I am actually surprised Yale didn't start the second period with four successive line brawls (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wpecBkdpiK4).
I was late to start watching; when I clicked it on, it was 1-0 and the refs were conferring to decide if there had been a major penalty. What a sequence- Union's feet were just stuck in the mud as Cornell skated by at will for the full 5 min.
Quote from: TrotskyQuote from: ursusminorQuote from: TrotskyThe real solution is for CMU to go D-1 and join the ECAC. Tartans is an awesome nickname and they'd slot in between Cornell, RPI, and Clarkson for an Eng school, and we could kick out Q. Add RIT and kick out Union and now we're talking.
Is there any rumor of CMU fielding a team, or did you just pick them? I suppose they could be Princeton's travel partner.
None at all. I was fantasizing.
A day in Pittsburgh. I'm a bit worried about your fantasies, man.
(They do have a club team (https://athletics.cmu.edu/recreation/clubs/icehockey).)
Quote from: arugulaQuote from: adamwTake a look at Penn State's non-conference schedule -- against which it went 9-0
Very weak and a lot of close games. All AHA or independent.
Which I guess is the point. Penn State doesn't want any decent opponents outside their league.
Quote from: arugulaQuote from: arugulaQuote from: adamwTake a look at Penn State's non-conference schedule -- against which it went 9-0
Very weak and a lot of close games. All AHA or independent.
Which I guess is the point. Penn State doesn't want any decent opponents outside their league.
Or they have the same problem we do.
Quote from: Give My RegardsQuote from: TrotskyQuote from: ursusminorQuote from: TrotskyThe real solution is for CMU to go D-1 and join the ECAC. Tartans is an awesome nickname and they'd slot in between Cornell, RPI, and Clarkson for an Eng school, and we could kick out Q. Add RIT and kick out Union and now we're talking.
Is there any rumor of CMU fielding a team, or did you just pick them? I suppose they could be Princeton's travel partner.
None at all. I was fantasizing.
A day in Pittsburgh. I'm a bit worried about your fantasies, man.
Pittsburgh has had a pretty good tech industry seeding in the past couple of decades (proximity to CMU certainly helps), and with that a lot of good things happening there. I know I had a lot of fun there for the Frozen Four, and you'd be hard pressed to find another city that inspires such fervent civic pride amongst its regional natives.
I dont know I never realized that the major becomes a new PP after a goal is scored.. Maybe its because we never seemed to score on them..
did anyone look up fastest 4 goal stretches.. 4 in a min is pretty crazy
Quote from: upprdeckI dont know I never realized that the major becomes a new PP after a goal is scored.. Maybe its because we never seemed to score on them..
did anyone look up fastest 4 goal stretches.. 4 in a min is pretty crazy
Three goals in 22 seconds might be a Cornell record for fastest 3 goals. The Cornell Hockey Record Book (image attached) shows 3 goals in 24 seconds in a game back in 1976, but the Record Book only goes through the 1986-87 season, and I don't have the means (or the desire) to check the intervening 36 years.
I've never researched fastest 4 goals. I do recall Carlo Ugolini scoring 4 goals in 53 seconds in a freshman game, though.
Quote from: martyQuote from: DLAnyone have a link to video of the scoring breakout?
This! (https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=zG1W9Peu_PY)
Thanks! Shame it was just highlights instead of full play time surrounding the goals, considering how short it was.
I rewatched the first period -that was fun- and picking up on something Grady said I rewound and watched goals two through six. I believe those five goals were scored on five shots. There's several shot attempts between goals two and three but I don't think any would be official shots as they were wide or never made it to the net.
Quote from: DLQuote from: martyQuote from: DLAnyone have a link to video of the scoring breakout?
This! (https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=zG1W9Peu_PY)
Thanks! Shame it was just highlights instead of full play time surrounding the goals, considering how short it was.
13 minutes and 13 seconds (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bOhBbMZ-Oig) for your entertainment.
Fastest 4 in NHL is apparently 80 seconds during this fascinating game (https://www.nhl.com/gamecenter/nyr-vs-bos/1945/01/21/1944020088#game=1944020088,game_state=final), during which Boston also had 3 goals in a different 51 second interval.
Quote from: RichHQuote from: Give My RegardsQuote from: TrotskyQuote from: ursusminorQuote from: TrotskyThe real solution is for CMU to go D-1 and join the ECAC. Tartans is an awesome nickname and they'd slot in between Cornell, RPI, and Clarkson for an Eng school, and we could kick out Q. Add RIT and kick out Union and now we're talking.
Is there any rumor of CMU fielding a team, or did you just pick them? I suppose they could be Princeton's travel partner.
None at all. I was fantasizing.
A day in Pittsburgh. I'm a bit worried about your fantasies, man.
Pittsburgh has had a pretty good tech industry seeding in the past couple of decades (proximity to CMU certainly helps), and with that a lot of good things happening there. I know I had a lot of fun there for the Frozen Four, and you'd be hard pressed to find another city that inspires such fervent civic pride amongst its regional natives.
Cleveland? Buffalo?
Quote from: ACMQuote from: upprdeckI dont know I never realized that the major becomes a new PP after a goal is scored.. Maybe its because we never seemed to score on them..
did anyone look up fastest 4 goal stretches.. 4 in a min is pretty crazy
Three goals in 22 seconds might be a Cornell record for fastest 3 goals. The Cornell Hockey Record Book (image attached) shows 3 goals in 24 seconds in a game back in 1976, but the Record Book only goes through the 1986-87 season, and I don't have the means (or the desire) to check the intervening 36 years.
I've never researched fastest 4 goals. I do recall Carlo Ugolini scoring 4 goals in 53 seconds in a freshman game, though.
Carlo Ugolini '73, nickname The Magician, was a classic Harkness-era recruit, scrappy if not big (I loved how at 5-foot-7 I could look him straight in the eyes) and, legend has it, he talked his way into a number of second assists and possibly one when he was in the penalty box. (Hey, if Uri Geller could bend a spoon with his nose...) Sixty-nine points senior year, didn't even make the All-America team. Cornell played fewer games then but we beat a lot of early-season opponents by 9-4, 7-1 kinds of scores.
John Fumio the same era, same size and energy -- think Topher Scott size, but in the era of plaid slacks and leather coats -- who took a shot in the face, lost a tooth, and I'm trying to recall if he finished the game. This is the era before dental implants made human teeth more expendable.
Arthur, about Record Book stats from the Harkness-Bertrand-McCutcheon-Reycroft coaching era, there is -- will? -- always be someone with a desire to better capture history. When he was at Cornell, Donald Kagan History wrote *four volumes* on the outbreak of the Peloponnesian War. One of these is more important.
a database would make this pretty easy to figure out and compute without having to go look for stuff. I know we have something here is listed even if it doesnt work.
Quote from: upprdeckI dont know I never realized that the major becomes a new PP after a goal is scored.. Maybe its because we never seemed to score on them.
* Which makes 2023 a nice outlier
* There can never be a perfect (eg 4 goals, or 5) five-minute powerplay. If even one tick of the five-minute timer is left, there's a one-second PP opportunity that you don't score on.
* On the plus side, a team that can't score on a 5-minute power play is oh-for-one, not oh-for-2.5.
Quote from: billhowardQuote from: upprdeckI dont know I never realized that the major becomes a new PP after a goal is scored.. Maybe its because we never seemed to score on them.
* Which makes 2023 a nice outlier
* There can never be a perfect (eg 4 goals, or 5) five-minute powerplay. If even one tick of the five-minute timer is left, there's a one-second PP opportunity.
But, cf,
Union v Colgate, 2/3/2023
Carnegie Mellon did have a team - for 3 years - just prior to WW II. When it was known as Carnegie Tech.
Pitt also had a team - first when it was known as "Western University of Pennsylvania", even before 1900 ... and then two of the same three years CM had a team.
https://www.collegehockeynews.com/reports/teamHistory/Pittsburgh/431
Done quite a bit of research on all the Pittsburgh area schools. Things were quite active a few years with them, and teams in Ohio. And Ivies would go to Pittsburgh and play tournaments.
Quote from: upprdecka database would make this pretty easy to figure out and compute without having to go look for stuff. I know we have something here is listed even if it doesnt work.
Even if there was a database of every goal, its time and game -- computing "fastest in xx span" is not easy. I know because I have this data dating back to 2002 for all of college hockey, and the entire NHL, and I haven't gotten around to writing a method for computing it yet, because it's challenging. And I do this for a living. Game level spans are hard enough - "for any floating x game span" ... I've done it for NHL. Haven't done it yet for NCAA.
Official box score (https://cornellbigred.com/mens-ice-hockey/2022-23/boxscore/vs-union-college/52903/pdf) confirms: Cornell's 5 goals were scored on 5 shots with nothing else occurring in between except for the 4 faceoffs and 2 wide Cornell shots between goals 2 and 3. There were not only no other shots, there were no other stoppages. Holy hell.
Quote from: upprdecka database would make this pretty easy to figure out and compute without having to go look for stuff. I know we have something here is listed even if it doesnt work.
I actually built a database with every Cornell (and opponent) goal since the program restart.
I could write a query and test this. But I have never actually written a query that walks through the data that way (if I did that I could do *a lot* of analysis). Maybe in retirement.
Quote from: TrotskyOfficial box score (https://cornellbigred.com/mens-ice-hockey/2022-23/boxscore/vs-union-college/52903/pdf) confirms: Cornell's 5 goals were scored on 5 shots with nothing else occurring in between except for the 4 faceoffs and 2 wide Cornell shots between goals 2 and 3. There were not only no other shots, there were no other stoppages. Holy hell.
We only had four shots on goal in an entire major? Cmon, get it together team.
I feel nerdsniped.
Can I get the schema for the db?
I think it's something like:
For each game order the CU goals by time and generate a row_number
For each game, compute the shortest period between two goals by self-joining on row_number = row_number + 1 and subtracting the timestamps, then taking the min of the results.
Do the same for 2, 3, 4, etc up to the max number of goals in a game. Use a left join to prevent joins beyond the number of possible goals. It's a manual query build but it's ok since there's what 12-15 max goals in a game?
If you get me a schema I'll try it....
Quote from: BMacI feel nerdsniped.
Can I get the schema for the db?
I think it's something like:
For each game order the CU goals by time and generate a row_number
For each game, compute the shortest period between two goals by self-joining on row_number = row_number + 1 and subtracting the timestamps, then taking the min of the results.
Do the same for 2, 3, 4, etc up to the max number of goals in a game. Use a left join to prevent joins beyond the number of possible goals. It's a manual query build but it's ok since there's what 12-15 max goals in a game?
If you get me a schema I'll try it....
I'll give you the whole db, it's Access. I have been happily giving it away for years and strongly suspect it is why the SID's records got a lot better (without acknowledgement because TRADITION!).
Quote from: BMacI feel nerdsniped.
Can I get the schema for the db?
I think it's something like:
For each game order the CU goals by time and generate a row_number
For each game, compute the shortest period between two goals by self-joining on row_number = row_number + 1 and subtracting the timestamps, then taking the min of the results.
Do the same for 2, 3, 4, etc up to the max number of goals in a game. Use a left join to prevent joins beyond the number of possible goals. It's a manual query build but it's ok since there's what 12-15 max goals in a game?
If you get me a schema I'll try it....
There's fancier ways to do this - with WINDOW functions. But if I told you, I'd have to kill you.
If you can figure out the right way to do this with a window function, good on you. I spent a little time thinking about it and figured it was easier to just build progressive CTEs manually for each goal amount since we don't need more than 12-15ish....
I'm sure it's possible though. I've even done regressive sql before and felt like a golden god
I'm in favor of having all stats dating to Beebe Lake days being digitized and query-able. By somebody else. I'm sort of in favor of handing them off to Chatbot GPT.
There is a danger that people having to write a Wednesday hockey column or fill dead air while there's yet another video replay will clamp onto a numerical pattern that has been calculated to several decimal places yet has no actual value: Say, Cornell's record in one-goal games played after Coach has come back from an illness or game suspension, when Cornell is wearing white jerseys in Friday road games. You hear NFL announcers discussing whether to go for it on fourth down when the team has been 3 of 5 on recent non-punting fourth downs with less than 2 yards to go as if 60% odds guarantee the next one will work.
I did like the magic of the Celtics Bill Russell speaking to the mystery of whether the game clock reading :02 (pre-tenths on the clock) has 2.1 seconds or 2.9 seconds and you're down by one. That was poetry, not data.
Quote from: billhowardI'm in favor of having all stats dating to Beebe Lake days being digitized and query-able. By somebody else. I'm sort of in favor of handing them off to Chatbot GPT.
I'm working on it, dammit.
I dont think anyway its designed is gonna be that big a deal.
just ball park it say 75 yrs at 30 games so 2000 games at like at best 4 goals a game so 8000 rows.
any query for fastest 4 goals can ignore all the non 4+ goal games so probably cuts it by 1/2 - 2/3
just store the goals in order and go 1 to 4, 2 to 5, stop with x+3 greater than max goals..
probably could run thru it for any number of goals in a few seconds.
a query with a sub query for the +y.
The goals are already ordered. There are 7,103 of them for Cornell.
I had no intention of using database queries to do the work, I was planning on outputting the records to a data file and then writing a simple C++ program to do it. (Yes, I know, I'm old, be happy it's not PL/1 and get away from me with your heathen post-1983 data structures).
I was assuming I would run through them all, create a table and for each row record count n the # of uninterrupted Cornell goals it was and then dump the time elapsed for the prior 1, 2, ... n-1 Cornell goals into a linked list.
Then take that table and do the simple metrics.
I like thorough solutions. With 7k records the run time will be trivial.
So sure has been discussed before but is there any chance in relatively near future that UPenn and Columbia get D-I hockey programs and Ivy can form a new 8-team conference with an autobid? Then Atlantic and ECAC can maybe merge and improve?
Hello, new poster here '05 grad now in Boston. 2003 was my sophomore year, had season tix. Thought that is how things were and would make Frozen Four every few years lol. Was in Buffalo for the national semifinal loss. Been at Lynah East, Brown & MSG games for most years since. Was at Placid last time Red there few years ago, sat next to Vanderlaans dad for that loss. Happy to join you all here on eLynah!
Welcome.
There has never been any talk of Columbia going above club level.
Penn has a great barn. It used to be a perennial suggestion that they might restore their program, which was still active in the mid-70s, but other than a very dedicated and tiny Penn hockey cult I know of no serious measure.
IMO it is more likely Brown drops D-1 someday than Penn adds.
Penn brings back hockey.. does not rejoin the ivy because they want to have scholies. they become decent as an independent because they are located close to so many. This forces the ivies to get out of the dark ages
Quote from: 617BigRedSo sure has been discussed before but is there any chance in relatively near future that UPenn and Columbia get D-I hockey programs and Ivy can form a new 8-team conference with an autobid?!
Pretty sure you only need 6 teams in a conference for the auto-bid.
I guess that leads to the modified question of why the ECAC doesn't split into two conferences so they get two auto-bids. Teams could still play exactly the same regular season schedule - calling ivy vs. non-ivy games OOC, just hold two post-season tournaments
doesnt it take a yr or 2 for this to happen though
Quote from: BMacIf you can figure out the right way to do this with a window function, good on you. I spent a little time thinking about it and figured it was easier to just build progressive CTEs manually for each goal amount since we don't need more than 12-15ish....
I'm sure it's possible though. I've even done regressive sql before and felt like a golden god
I've done it with Window functions. Just not on the event level. Only on a game level (i.e. most goals in any 20-game rolling span). In fact, this is (half)-implemented on College Hockey News right now. I say half, because it's finding X-game spans from beginning or end of season -- which is slightly easier than ANY rolling x-game span, though has its own challenges.
Event level would be the same thing, in essence.
Quote from: martyQuote from: DLQuote from: martyQuote from: DLAnyone have a link to video of the scoring breakout?
This! (https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=zG1W9Peu_PY)
Thanks! Shame it was just highlights instead of full play time surrounding the goals, considering how short it was.
13 minutes and 13 seconds (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bOhBbMZ-Oig) for your entertainment.
What a rush. Thank you!
Quote from: DLQuote from: martyQuote from: DLQuote from: martyQuote from: DLAnyone have a link to video of the scoring breakout?
This! (https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=zG1W9Peu_PY)
Thanks! Shame it was just highlights instead of full play time surrounding the goals, considering how short it was.
13 minutes and 13 seconds (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bOhBbMZ-Oig) for your entertainment.
What a rush. Thank you!
I didn't see Nick Young put up his dukes to incur the penalty - I was in section L on Saturday. But I had seen someone else belt one of the Cornell players earlier in the period in a similar move. Couldn't feel bad for Union after realizing that at least one of the soon to be formerly known as Dutchman was getting a well deserved penalty.
Quote from: adamwQuote from: upprdecka database would make this pretty easy to figure out and compute without having to go look for stuff. I know we have something here is listed even if it doesnt work.
Even if there was a database of every goal, its time and game -- computing "fastest in xx span" is not easy. I know because I have this data dating back to 2002 for all of college hockey, and the entire NHL, and I haven't gotten around to writing a method for computing it yet, because it's challenging. And I do this for a living. Game level spans are hard enough - "for any floating x game span" ... I've done it for NHL. Haven't done it yet for NCAA.
Serious suggestion, not trolling.
Ask ChatGPT to write the code (or do the task)
From https://platform.openai.com/docs/guides/code/best-practices
Using source data to write database functions.
Just as a human programmer would benefit from understanding the database structure and the column names, Codex can use this data to help you write accurate query requests. In this example we insert the schema for a database and tell Codex what to query the database for.
# Table albums, columns = [AlbumId, Title, ArtistId]
# Table artists, columns = [ArtistId, Name]
# Table media_types, columns = [MediaTypeId, Name]
# Table playlists, columns = [PlaylistId, Name]
# Table playlist_track, columns = [PlaylistId, TrackId]
# Table tracks, columns = [TrackId, Name, AlbumId, MediaTypeId, GenreId, Composer, Milliseconds, Bytes, UnitPrice]
# Create a query for all albums by Adele
Quote from: TrotskyQuote from: billhowardI'm in favor of having all stats dating to Beebe Lake days being digitized and query-able. By somebody else. I'm sort of in favor of handing them off to Chatbot GPT.
I'm working on it, dammit.
You think that if you retire or scale back to half-time, you'll have time. Except you'll do things such as sleep 'til eleven that suck up your day.
My plan was to organize a million photos -- paper, film, slide, old diplomas and yearbooks -- which I started in 2014 while working full-time, I did maybe 10,000 images and in that period added ~50K digital images. Organizing hockey stats or photos takes a stable personality. More correctly, an Augean Stable personality.
Quote from: upprdeckPenn brings back hockey.. does not rejoin the ivy because they want to have scholies. they become decent as an independent because they are located close to so many. This forces the ivies to get out of the dark ages
Hand around that joint. If there's any left.
The Pennsylvania Class of 1923 (mostly them) funded the rink that opened in 1970. The rink Wiki page notes it holds 2,500 (for "hockey / indoor football") and further notes it is the second largest college rink in the state behind only Penn State's Pegula Arena (6,014). By 1978 men's varsity hockey was gone. Penn made a bunch of spending cuts that year, many were rescinded, not hockey.
Penn has a women's 'student organization' hockey team; that seems to sound like club hockey.
If hockey came back, it'd have to be two teams, not one. It's not impossible. The NHL is as far south as Florida, Arizona, California. Other than Arizona State, Princeton sits at 40 degrees North latitude, Lindenwood (I had to look it up) in St. Lous at 39 degrees. So it's not crazy that Penn wouldn't at some day come back. Maybe Maryland and Rutgers would give it a good in the Big10. If I was a Class of '23 at Penn, I'd be pissed my donation mattered for less than a decade. IIRC, there was a donor-VIP box, glassed in, on stilts (?), at the rink.
More stats is sort of good. But there's other historical-more-than-statisical stuff: when Clarkson sweaters went from okay to terrible, the year Union players allegedly got in some sort of racist/religious mischief, the highest temperatures in visitor locker rooms (did Harkness retire that award), the longest road trips by bus, attendance vs. rink capcity, the geo-center of the ECAC (I tried that once drawing lines and the center is pretty close to Albany), etcetera. Also which rinks have and which viewer feeds get overhead goal cam views.
Quote from: billhowardAlso which rinks have and which viewer feeds get overhead goal cam views.
This just reminded me. RPI used to have 2 over each goal. One official cam and one RPI TV cam.
Maybe Ursaminor can comment, but did the RPI TV free live feed die? Are they allowed to archive the games?
Quote from: nshapiroI guess that leads to the modified question of why the ECAC doesn't split into two conferences so they get two auto-bids.
It's ready to be split:
- 6 in the Ivy Division
- 6 in the Safety Division
If the Bobcats had a sense of humor -- they do or did have the Ed McMahon School of Broadcasting -- fan T-shirts would say
The Last Shall Be First.
Quote from: martyQuote from: billhowardAlso which rinks have and which viewer feeds get overhead goal cam views.
This just reminded me. RPI used to have 2 over each goal. One official cam and one RPI TV cam.
Maybe Ursaminor can comment, but did the RPI TV free live feed die? Are they allowed to archive the games?
Probably. Fricking
students were embarrassing professional video crews.
Quote from: martyQuote from: billhowardAlso which rinks have and which viewer feeds get overhead goal cam views.
This just reminded me. RPI used to have 2 over each goal. One official cam and one RPI TV cam.
Maybe Ursaminor can comment, but did the RPI TV free live feed die? Are they allowed to archive the games?
The free feed died because the league demanded it. I heard that they did archive games, but the website is under maintenance, so I can't check. They are not on their You-Tube channel.
Quote from: ursusminorQuote from: martyQuote from: billhowardAlso which rinks have and which viewer feeds get overhead goal cam views.
This just reminded me. RPI used to have 2 over each goal. One official cam and one RPI TV cam.
Maybe Ursaminor can comment, but did the RPI TV free live feed die? Are they allowed to archive the games?
The free feed died because the league demanded it. I heard that they did archive games, but the website is under maintenance, so I can't check. They are not on their You-Tube channel.
ESPN Minus
Quote from: DLQuote from: martyQuote from: DLQuote from: martyQuote from: DLAnyone have a link to video of the scoring breakout?
This! (https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=zG1W9Peu_PY)
Thanks! Shame it was just highlights instead of full play time surrounding the goals, considering how short it was.
13 minutes and 13 seconds (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bOhBbMZ-Oig) for your entertainment.
What a rush. Thank you!
Seriously, thank you for the highlight reel!
Quote from: martyQuote from: ursusminorQuote from: martyQuote from: billhowardAlso which rinks have and which viewer feeds get overhead goal cam views.
This just reminded me. RPI used to have 2 over each goal. One official cam and one RPI TV cam.
Maybe Ursaminor can comment, but did the RPI TV free live feed die? Are they allowed to archive the games?
The free feed died because the league demanded it. I heard that they did archive games, but the website is under maintenance, so I can't check. They are not on their You-Tube channel.
ESPN Minus
To Fail Sports Fans. Anytime. Anywhere
Quote from: The RancorQuote from: DLQuote from: martyQuote from: DLQuote from: martyQuote from: DLAnyone have a link to video of the scoring breakout?
This! (https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=zG1W9Peu_PY)
Thanks! Shame it was just highlights instead of full play time surrounding the goals, considering how short it was.
13 minutes and 13 seconds (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bOhBbMZ-Oig) for your entertainment.
What a rush. Thank you!
Seriously, thank you for the highlight reel!
It's always nice to see Union playing to its potential. ::popcorn::
Quote from: ursusminorQuote from: The RancorQuote from: DLQuote from: martyQuote from: DLQuote from: martyQuote from: DLAnyone have a link to video of the scoring breakout?
This! (https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=zG1W9Peu_PY)
Thanks! Shame it was just highlights instead of full play time surrounding the goals, considering how short it was.
13 minutes and 13 seconds (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bOhBbMZ-Oig) for your entertainment.
What a rush. Thank you!
Seriously, thank you for the highlight reel!
It's always nice to see Union playing to its potential. ::popcorn::
OTOH (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PDAoCQyvTbE).
Quote from: The RancorQuote from: DLQuote from: martyQuote from: DLQuote from: martyQuote from: DLAnyone have a link to video of the scoring breakout?
This! (https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=zG1W9Peu_PY)
Thanks! Shame it was just highlights instead of full play time surrounding the goals, considering how short it was.
13 minutes and 13 seconds (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bOhBbMZ-Oig) for your entertainment.
What a rush. Thank you!
Seriously, thank you for the highlight reel!
Booooo. Fail at properly tagging the YouTube content.
I wanted to save that video to my watch later or other list for future viewing, but I can't because Marty tagged the video as "content made for kids". That's not a made for kids video.
https://support.google.com/youtube/answer/9684541?hl=en#zippy=%2Chow-do-i-know-if-my-content-is-not-made-for-kids
Quote from: abmarksQuote from: The RancorQuote from: DLQuote from: martyQuote from: DLQuote from: martyQuote from: DLAnyone have a link to video of the scoring breakout?
This! (https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=zG1W9Peu_PY)
Thanks! Shame it was just highlights instead of full play time surrounding the goals, considering how short it was.
13 minutes and 13 seconds (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bOhBbMZ-Oig) for your entertainment.
What a rush. Thank you!
Seriously, thank you for the highlight reel!
Booooo. Fail at properly tagging the YouTube content.
I wanted to save that video to my watch later or other list for future viewing, but I can't because Marty tagged the video as "content made for kids". That's not a made for kids video.
https://support.google.com/youtube/answer/9684541?hl=en#zippy=%2Chow-do-i-know-if-my-content-is-not-made-for-kids
Fixed
Quote from: martyFixed
Excellent. Tx!
Quote from: martyQuote from: ursusminorQuote from: martyQuote from: billhowardAlso which rinks have and which viewer feeds get overhead goal cam views.
This just reminded me. RPI used to have 2 over each goal. One official cam and one RPI TV cam.
Maybe Ursaminor can comment, but did the RPI TV free live feed die? Are they allowed to archive the games?
The free feed died because the league demanded it. I heard that they did archive games, but the website is under maintenance, so I can't check. They are not on their You-Tube channel.
ESPN Minus
QuoteRobert Iger announced the news in his first earnings call since returning as chief executive. In the wide-ranging call, Mr. Iger outlined plans for significant changes to the company's slate of movies and television shows, the reinstatement of Disney's dividend and possible changes in pricing for the company's streaming video services, among other things.
"It's time for another transformation," Mr. Iger said. He said the changes would reshape the company around creativity, reduce expenses and lead to profits in its streaming business.
Minus redux.
"It's time for another transformation,"
(https://i.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/newsfeed/001/820/102/370)
Quote from: martyQuote from: martyQuote from: ursusminorQuote from: martyQuote from: billhowardAlso which rinks have and which viewer feeds get overhead goal cam views.
This just reminded me. RPI used to have 2 over each goal. One official cam and one RPI TV cam.
Maybe Ursaminor can comment, but did the RPI TV free live feed die? Are they allowed to archive the games?
The free feed died because the league demanded it. I heard that they did archive games, but the website is under maintenance, so I can't check. They are not on their You-Tube channel.
ESPN Minus
QuoteRobert Iger announced the news in his first earnings call since returning as chief executive. In the wide-ranging call, Mr. Iger outlined plans for significant changes to the company's slate of movies and television shows, the reinstatement of Disney's dividend and possible changes in pricing for the company's streaming video services, among other things.
"It's time for another transformation," Mr. Iger said. He said the changes would reshape the company around creativity, reduce expenses and lead to profits in its streaming business.
Minus redux.
I guess this is the first bitch session I've seen about the ESPN service. Personally, I've been trying to really savor what we have now. A huge majority of all ECAC games live and archived for on-demand watching for a small monthly charge? And we can cancel during the off-season? I rarely have technical glitches, unlike the days of RedCast (or whatever that was). Or Ivy Network.
This is the glory days — what we always dreamed of when we were huddled around a stammering RealPlayer audio feed. Or when it was Age vs the AD as he ran cables from the press box to a server. Just to get things online for us far-flung folks.
But hey, sure "more like ESPN minus, har har." You're nuts if you don't appreciate this era.
With the big streaming services starting to wobble, and worries about profitability getting louder, I'm starting to get nervous about what happens to this little passion of ours if dominoes start to fall and we lose it. Yeah, the price has nearly doubled recently, but it's been worth every cent I've spent on it so far. Kudos to the league heads for getting a broadcast contract this good in place. Bonus: I get some NHL and other things.
I agree wholeheartedly. My family watches a month's worth of Cornell athletic events for less than the price of one hockey ticket.
Quote from: dag14I agree wholeheartedly. My family watches a month's worth of Cornell athletic events for less than the price of one hockey ticket.
Not to mention lacrosse & basketball. Whoops, I just did.
And with the Dizzy Bundle, I can also watch Godfather of Harlem.
Quote from: dag14I agree wholeheartedly. My family watches a month's worth of Cornell athletic events for less than the price of one hockey ticket.
I do appreciate what we have. Old codgers at RPI who lost the free service might disagree.
My posts are simply pointing out that the price will be higher next year. We are getting more than a fair price.
As soon as it was offerred I paid for ESPN+ and was very happy. Last year my daughter-in-law decided she needed a hotspot on her Verizon account. I pay for 5 lines of unlimited cell service plus a cell based landline and her hotspot at the reasonable total cost of $221.
The hotspot included bundled Hulu, ESPN+ and Disney+ access. I don't know why they made the service so cheap. I don't know why they let me use ESPN+ in a city 150 miles north of my son and his family.
The minus is that this was all too good to be true and it won't be the same sometime soon.
Cornell hockey season tickets for two are the same as a Devils game with parking and refreshments. Beer at Prudential Center is $16 which is a lot, whereas Lynah is n/a. Or BYO.
Quote from: TrotskyFastest 4 in NHL is apparently 80 seconds during this fascinating game (https://www.nhl.com/gamecenter/nyr-vs-bos/1945/01/21/1944020088#game=1944020088,game_state=final), during which Boston also had 3 goals in a different 51 second interval.
Carlo Ugolini had 4 goals in 51 seconds in a freshmen game my senior year. Two of those were unassisted, where he won the faceoff to himself and skated up ice and scored. If I recall correctly, the opponent was the Dixie Beehives Jr. B team from Ontario, who was a regular opponent at freshmen games back then.
Edit Note: I posted this after reading part way through this thread and seeing a discussion of quick goals in succession. I now see that Bill already mentioned Carlo's feat. I was an eye witness to these 4 goals, which were in 51 seconds.
nm.
Yale is charging $25 a head (!!!) for their Senior Night game at the end of this month when Cornell visits, which was a bit of a shock for me. Actually, many tickets for that game have already been sold
Quote from: IcebergYale is charging $25 a head (!!!) for their Senior Night game at the end of this month when Cornell visits, which was a bit of a shock for me. Actually, many tickets for that game have already been sold
Yale traditionally draws well and games with Cornell very often sell out. Harvard charged $35 for the cheapest seat for the Cornell game so suddenly $25 sounds cheap.
Quote from: martyQuote from: dag14I agree wholeheartedly. My family watches a month's worth of Cornell athletic events for less than the price of one hockey ticket.
I do appreciate what we have. Old codgers at RPI who lost the free service might disagree.
Sure do. :-D