ELynah Forum

The good news is Shonn Miller is back and looks healthy.  Shonn is a defensive force (rebounding, protecting the rim) who can single-handedly move the Big Red from horrific on defense (#350 of 351 last season if you believe Ken Pomeroy) to merely bad.  At bad you have a chance of staying in games you just didn't have when the other team was scoring 1.2 points per possession.

Ivy hoops online did a pretty good player-by-player breakdown:  http://ivyhoopsonline.com/2014/10/27/cornell-roster-preview-2014-15-edition/.  There is some talent on this team, but not enough unless this freshman class is truly special or the sophomores make significant jumps.

KenPom starts the Big Red out at #318 in the nation, which is last in the Ivys by a fairly wide margin.  His computer is projecting 8 wins and a 3-11 league record.  That's probably about right.  10/11 wins and 5-9 in the league is probably the best case scenario; worst case is around 5 wins and 2-12.  (It is hard not to win five games in a full d1 season).

Maybe hard not to win 5 games, but we managed to last year.  Interesting we had players transfer from last year's 1 D-1 win team, who now are playing at Vandy and Cal.

Quote from: CASMaybe hard not to win 5 games, but we managed to last year.  Interesting we had players transfer from last year's 1 D-1 win team, who now are playing at Vandy and Cal.

Even really bad teams should be able to luck into 5 wins.  Only 3 D1 squads failed to reach that standard last season.  Last year's team was just flat out brutal on the defensive end; Shonn's return should help a lot.

For those who don't know, Nolan Cressler transferred to Vandy.  He was the best offensive weapon on last year's team and earned honorable mention all-Ivy.  He'll be missed, but I have a feeling the returning guards are more than willing to increase their shot totals (that's not a compliment).

Dwight Tarwater graduated and is on Cal's roster this season.  Dwight gave full effort for the Big Red and seems like a good guy, but in reality he was never more than "generic Ivy League forward."  He would have been behind Miller at strong forward this season, so why not graduate and let Cal pay for the first year of grad school?  I'd be surprised if he gets much playing time, though I wish him nothing but the best, and I imagine he's a great locker room presence.

FWIW - Harvard is ranked in the nations top 25.

http://www.bostonglobe.com/sports/2014/11/04/harvard-welcomes-scrutiny-that-comes-with-top-ranking/D9xVMsfZRjYH0ToYF0YlVO/story.html

Quote from: CASInteresting we had players transfer from last year's one D-1 win team, who now are playing at Vandy and Cal.

It's the system?

Quote from: billhoward

Quote from: CASInteresting we had players transfer from last year's one D-1 win team, who now are playing at Vandy and Cal.

It's the system?

They didn't like the system/coach at Cornell?

As down as I was on these guys, I need to step up and say that's a nice win to start the season.  68-60 over George Mason.  Beating an A-10 team, even a bad one, hasn't happened since December 2009.  {Edit:  Temple is A-10, so March 2010 in the NCAA Tournament.}  Miller makes a huge difference and he and David Onuorah down low take away many of easy shots we gave up last season.  When Hatter is on, he's a difference-maker, but the question is going to be how often is he on.

In candor, I have to say George Mason looked awful and not ready to play.  But after last season, a win is a win.

I can't believe it. Amaaaaaazing.

Quote from: ugarteI can't believe it.

Neither could the George Mason announcers.  They weren't insulting or obnoxious -- they remember Courtney fondly from his time down there -- but over and over they would say "I can't believe that shot didn't fall."

Quote from: mountainredIn candor, I have to say George Mason looked awful and not ready to play.  But after last season, a win is a win.

And a road win. Miller was 4-6 from 3, hopefully he doesnt get to comfortable taking those 3's. Mason just beat Princeton so maybe we will be somewhat competitive during league play. They will probably be just good enough for Courtney not to get fired which after last season isnt a good thing

Free Feed for Loyola game: http://www.loyolagreyhounds.com/multimedia/patriot-league-network-m-basketball.html

Quote from: phillysportsfanFree Feed for Loyola game: http://www.loyolagreyhounds.com/multimedia/patriot-league-network-m-basketball.html

"Free."  What a novel idea!

3 for 19 from behind the line was the killer

Quote from: Al DeFlorio3 for 19 from behind the line was the killer

Yeah, I thought on more than one occasion what a difference Cressler would have made today

OVERRATED! SUCKS lose 58-57 to Holy Cross, so much for being in the top 25

Quote from: phillysportsfanOVERRATED! SUCKS lose 58-57 to Holy Cross, so much for being in the top 25

Holy Cross pressed them out of the gate and forced 25 turnovers (give or take).  Saunders, Chambers and Moundou-Missi are very good, but there is nothing backing them up right now.  (Not that I'm complaining).

Quote from: Al DeFlorio3 for 19 from behind the line was the killer

A five point loss on the road with a glaring statistical anomaly (IT BETTER BE AN ANOMALY) makes me think that this season won't be the horrible disaster last year was. Not that we'll be GOOD or challenge for the conference title or anything, but at least we'll be run-of-the-mill bad instead of the-subject-of-national-derision bad.

The problem was more the 19 than the 3. Been saying it for 4 years now, they take too many 3's especailly this year without Cressler. Hatter can be streaky and Pat Smith is supposed to be a good shooter but he is still hurt. What is Miller doing taking 5 3's, he should take at most 1 a game? Miller reminds me of Peck sometimes, all the athletic talent in the world but isnt willing to get beat up inside and use it, would rather take a junk 3pt shot with 30s left on the shot clock. I dont get why Courtney allows him to do that. If they only took 10 3's they probably would have won

I dont see Courtney ever taking them anywhere, he can recruit but cant coach at all. Its the last year of his contract, I wonder what it would take for him to do this year for them to resign him, I would hope another losing season which should be guarenteed and he would be gone. Whoever they bring in cant be a worse game day coach

3 for 19 is probably the same kind of statistical anomaly as 9 for 18 was on Friday.  Shooting regressed to the mean very quickly.

The Courtney offense is take 3s or try to dribble penetrate for a circus lay-up and/or draw a foul.  The only year it has worked was his first because he had Wrobo, Ferry and Groebe bombing away at a 40% clip.

I think ugarte has pegged our level.  We're bad, but that's it.  Unless Shonn goes down, in which case it will get really ugly fast.

I'm not even sold on Bill as a recruiter.  There is some talent on the roster but too many guys with the same skill set of more athlete than basketball player.  I do wonder what James Jones would do with this roster.

Quote from: mountainred3 for 19 is probably the same kind of statistical anomaly as 9 for 18 was on Friday.  Shooting regressed to the mean very quickly.

The Courtney offense is take 3s or try to dribble penetrate for a circus lay-up and/or draw a foul.  The only year it has worked was his first because he had Wrobo, Ferry and Groebe bombing away at a 40% clip.

I think ugarte has pegged our level.  We're bad, but that's it.  Unless Shonn goes down, in which case it will get really ugly fast.

I'm not even sold on Bill as a recruiter.  There is some talent on the roster but too many guys with the same skill set of more athlete than basketball player.  I do wonder what James Jones would do with this roster.

I also have little patience with Courtney's coaching style.  I hope he proves me wrong this year with better talent to work with, but am not holding my breath.

Ugly game, but nice comeback:  Cornell 58  Colgate 52.  Big Red trailed by 17 early.

We're basically a playground team, but the playground moves can be fun to watch.  The defense is much better, especially if the other team is easily rattled.

Cornell was down by 11 when I peeked about half an hour ago.

They won by 5.  Already won more D1 games than last season.

Amazingly, 10 wins looks very doable.  There's the D3 game and games with bottom 50 squads Bingo, UMass-Lowell and Howard.  That's six.  Win at home versus Dartmouth (we even did that last year) and Penn (they are brutal), eight.  You only need 2-17 against the rest of the league slate and 5 games against so-so squads like St. Peter's and Canisius.

Interesting to note that last year, Cornell lost to Colgate by 28 points.

Quote from: margolismInteresting to note that last year, Cornell lost to Colgate by 28 points.

Imagine what the Colgate message boards are saying about their coach.

Quote from: billhoward

Quote from: margolismInteresting to note that last year, Cornell lost to Colgate by 28 points.

Imagine what the Colgate message boards are saying about their coach.

Probably nothing.  It's all a discussion of the free pizza.

South Carolina with a pretty easy win over the Big Red, but that was to be expected.  Next up tomorrow is Penn State, which will be tough.  On Sunday, it will be either Drexel or Southern Cal who are both rated in the bottom half of D1.

Quote from: mountainredSouth Carolina with a pretty easy win over the Big Red, but that was to be expected.  Next up tomorrow is Penn State, which will be tough.  On Sunday, it will be either Drexel or Southern Cal who are both rated in the bottom half of D1.

At least we catch Penn State the day after they went to double OT.

Cornell got very unlucky to lose on a buzzer beater 73-72 to Penn State.

4 point lead with 15 seconds left, Cornell gets a block, but the ball goes to Penn State who passes it for a 3 with 4.5 seconds left. A Penn State player tried to call a time out (which should have been a technical) but his coach stepped on to the court to stop him (which should have been a technical) but there was no call. Cornell couldn't get the ball in, Penn State stole the inbounds and got a couple of passes for a baseline drive and got the shot off with 0.2 left for the win.

I don't dislike this team.

"Well, it's late, but I'll keep watching this game.  It's not like Cornell will throw the game away in ridiculously brutal fashion at literally the last second."

Wow. Tough loss.

Ugh.  The only thing missing was Havlicek making the steal.

On the bright side, it wasn't like Cornell was close because of freakish three point shooting.  We shot well, okay 22 of 23 from line won't be repeated, but not anything absurd.  We played good D.  That looked like two evenly-matched teams.  Ivy teams are going hate playing Cornell.

Quote from: mountainredUgh.  The only thing missing was Havlicek making the steal.

it reminded me of the lax final against syracuse but without any of the stakes.

Quote from: ugarteI don't dislike this team.

I'm torn on these guys.  They play hard and to the buzzer.  Shoot, they played hard in most games last season.  I enjoy watching the defense go at it.  I hate watching the playground offense, though that could just be my biases of what's "good basketball."  

Excuse me, I have to go tell some kids to get off my lawn.

Quote from: ugarte

Quote from: mountainredUgh.  The only thing missing was Havlicek making the steal.

it reminded me of the lax final against syracuse but without any of the stakes.

I almost said the exact same thing, except that they never played a lax final in 2009.

there are multiple winnable games coming up. lets see if the can win 3-4

Quote from: ugarte

Quote from: mountainredUgh.  The only thing missing was Havlicek making the steal.

it reminded me of the lax final against syracuse but without any of the stakes.

+1

Quote from: upprdeckthere are multiple winnable games coming up. lets see if the can win 3-4

At the half, the Big Red leads Drexel 26-17.  It hasn't been pretty, but it's been effective so far.

Not as effective in the second half and Drexel rallies to win 61-59.  Too many turnovers late.  Next three games (Canisius, at Bingo and UMass Lowell) are all winnable.

2 games in a row cornell had leads with under 2 to go..

Quote from: upprdeck2 games in a row cornell had leads with under 2 to go..

This was infuriating to follow. They weren't just winning, they were dominating. And then they fell apart at the end again. Goddamn.

Quote from: ugarte

Quote from: upprdeck2 games in a row cornell had leads with under 2 to go..

This was infuriating to follow. They weren't just winning, they were dominating. And then they fell apart at the end again. Goddamn.

Lack of coaching.

Win #3.  Cornell 67 Canisius 60.

It wasn't pretty and the Big Red was rather fortunate that the Griffs did not capitalize on a ton of chances down the stretch.  But after last season (and the Penn State game), the guys were due some luck.

Nice game for Daryl Smith:  13 points.  He's not as flashy as our starters, but he makes better decisions.

Quote from: mountainredWin #3.  Cornell 67 Canisius 60.

I saw that we had the lead and then refused to follow. No way. They had to win one before I started paying close attention again.

Quote from: ugarte

Quote from: mountainredWin #3.  Cornell 67 Canisius 60.

I saw that we had the lead and then refused to follow. No way. They had to win one before I started paying close attention again.

The last three minutes were pretty frustrating, so I'm not sure they solved anything.  3 turnovers and 5 fouls in the last three minutes.  But it didn't matter because Canisius missed 5 FT's and a bunch of lay-ups down the stretch.

Quote from: mountainred

Quote from: ugarte

Quote from: mountainredWin #3.  Cornell 67 Canisius 60.

I saw that we had the lead and then refused to follow. No way. They had to win one before I started paying close attention again.

The last three minutes were pretty frustrating, so I'm not sure they solved anything.  3 turnovers and 5 fouls in the last three minutes.  But it didn't matter because Canisius missed 5 FT's and a bunch of lay-ups down the stretch.

Sounds like the Sixers. Bill Courtney is tanking for a draft pick.

Things to be thankful for:

- Only one blowout loss (thus far)
- 3 of 4 losses by 5 points (2 possessions) or less
- Perfect at home
- Already more W than last season

3 senior starters on team.  Frosh haven't contributed much yet.

Quote from: CAS3 senior starters on team.  Frosh haven't contributed much yet.

Yeah, if Miller graduates and takes his fourth year somewhere else, Cornell will have to replace more than half of its minutes.  Yikes!

On the bright side, Princeton, Brown, Dartmouth and Penn are a combined 2-15 so far this season.

Who would have thought that Cornell would have more wins than Princeton, Brown, Dartmouth, and Penn combined, at this point?

props for another win..

Quote from: upprdeckprops for another win..

Agreed.  KenPom has Cornell up another dozen or so places and is now projecting 13-17, 5-9 in the league.

I will be pretty surprised if we only manage 5 league wins. We'd be favored in all 4 games against Penn/Dartmouth. Call me crazy, but if everything breaks right, I could honestly see us competing for 2nd in the league.

harvard lost to Holy cross and watching HC play against SU they are a scrappy team with no size and poor shooters. I think harvard is only marginally better than 2-3 teams in the ivy.

It's crazy. Our team should be 6-2 with wins over Penn State and Drexel on our record. This team isn't trash. I like it. Going to have to see them at Columbia and I was thinking about blowing it off this year.

Quote from: semsoxI will be pretty surprised if we only manage 5 league wins. We'd be favored in all 4 games against Penn/Dartmouth. Call me crazy, but if everything breaks right, I could honestly see us competing for 2nd in the league.

You're crazy, unless "everything breaking right" includes Justin Sears and Javier Duren quitting basketball to become Whiffenpoofs.  Yale is a very solid team.

This team isn't trash and could compete for the top half of the league.  They've caught a few breaks:  Brown is floundering, Penn is a mess and both Princeton and Columbia have been hit with injuries.  That's not Cornell's problem and after last year they were due a few breaks.

The thing is, the margin for error for these guys is very small.  They aren't a good offensive team; they turn the ball over too much, don't shoot well and grab surprisingly few offensive rebounds.  They are going to need to make 65 or so points stand up.  They're winning because opponents are shooting around 40% from 2 point range, and just 30% from behind the arc.  If the guys can maintain that, they'll be fine.  But that's pretty elite territory.

Quote from: ugarte

Quote from: upprdeck2 games in a row cornell had leads with under 2 to go..

This was infuriating to follow. They weren't just winning, they were dominating. And then they fell apart at the end again. Goddamn.

HOW DID WE BLOW THE LEAD IN THIS GAME TO THIS TEAM http://www.sbnation.com/lookit/2014/12/4/7337737/university-of-the-sciences-beats-drexel-first-non-di-team-to-beat-di

Quote from: ugarte

Quote from: ugarte

Quote from: upprdeck2 games in a row cornell had leads with under 2 to go..

This was infuriating to follow. They weren't just winning, they were dominating. And then they fell apart at the end again. Goddamn.

HOW DID WE BLOW THE LEAD IN THIS GAME TO THIS TEAM http://www.sbnation.com/lookit/2014/12/4/7337737/university-of-the-sciences-beats-drexel-first-non-di-team-to-beat-di

Certainly not good for the KenPom rating ::wtf::

Quote from: scoop85

Quote from: ugarte

Quote from: ugarte

Quote from: upprdeck2 games in a row cornell had leads with under 2 to go..

This was infuriating to follow. They weren't just winning, they were dominating. And then they fell apart at the end again. Goddamn.

HOW DID WE BLOW THE LEAD IN THIS GAME TO THIS TEAM http://www.sbnation.com/lookit/2014/12/4/7337737/university-of-the-sciences-beats-drexel-first-non-di-team-to-beat-di

Certainly not good for the KenPom rating ::wtf::

Will it even factor in? They don't count D-II wins, but is there a penalty for the shocking loss to a D-II team?

Yale beat UConn tonight. Ivy race is going to be interesting.

Another MBB win.  Undefeated at home.  Beat a team that had won six in a row coming into today's game.

Look out, Syracuse (Dec. 31 at Syracuse). NJIT in the heart of resurgent Newark took down #17 Michigan yesterday, 72-70. NJIT suffered an 0-51 spell about 10 years ago. http://scores.espn.go.com/ncb/recap?gameId=400598837

December 8:
Basketball, 5-4
Ice hockey, 5-5-1

Quote from: billhowardDecember 8:
Basketball, 5-4
Ice hockey, 5-5-1

I wasn't aware it was a competition.

See fierce competition above to dump on the coach. Basketball was 2-26 last year, lost players to transfer, lost recruits who saw a disaster zone, and yet is 5-4 and 3 points shy of being 7-3. Hockey is performing about as expected or a tad under, basketball is way outperforming.

What would it take for folks to feel the BB coach should stay / have contract extended?

Quote from: margolismWhat would it take for folks to feel the BB coach should stay / have contract extended?

Pigs flying over Schoellkopf.:-P

Quote from: margolismWhat would it take for folks to feel the BB coach should stay / have contract extended?

.500 or close to it in-conference.

Quote from: TimV

Quote from: margolismWhat would it take for folks to feel the BB coach should stay / have contract extended?

Pigs flying over Schoellkopf.:-P

There's a Pink Floyd reference if I ever heard one!

Quote from: ugarte

Quote from: margolismWhat would it take for folks to feel the BB coach should stay / have contract extended?

.500 or close to it in-conference.

I think 7-7 in the Ivies is a minimum requirement given that 3 of our top guys (Miller, Cancer and Cherry) are seniors.  I personally think Noel should require at least a winning record in the league given the poor track record.

Cornell crushes DIII Alfred State 107-29. The 78-point margin of victory is the largest in school history.

http://www.cornellbigred.com/news/2015/1/10/MBB_0110155355.aspx

Quote from: jeff '84Cornell crushes DIII Alfred State 107-29. The 78-point margin of victory is the largest in school history.

http://www.cornellbigred.com/news/2015/1/10/MBB_0110155355.aspx

What's the point of scheduling D3 programs other than to pad the win column?

Quote from: Ken711

Quote from: jeff '84Cornell crushes DIII Alfred State 107-29. The 78-point margin of victory is the largest in school history.

http://www.cornellbigred.com/news/2015/1/10/MBB_0110155355.aspx

What's the point of scheduling D3 programs other than to pad the win column?

We schedule one a year. I know that Donohue was a D-III guy, and I think he started the tradition. but I'm not sure if it preceded him.

Quote from: Ken711What's the point of scheduling D3 programs other than to pad the win column?

It gives the D3 team that comes to Ithaca a chance to cash in on a big payday.

Princeton women up to 19 in AP. (http://espn.go.com/womens-college-basketball/rankings)  With nothing but Ivies left, they could enter the tourney 30-0.

Two of the main issues with Cornell basketball this season is lack of a true point guard and lack of another inside scorer to complement Shonn Miller.  Devin Cherry is giving his best effort out there but lacks the vision to be a good point man and unfortunately don't see any other options at the point beyond Galal Cancer.  Basically Cherry is a 2 guard playing out of position.  IMO recruiting a good point guard is harder than finding a good big man. The defense has been reasonably effective especially yesterday in the effort against Columbia which brought about the comeback (Special props to Robert Hatter for his defense on Maddie Lo).  I am yet hopeful that the team can make it to 7-7 in Ivies.  They'll go as far as Shonn can take them.

Quote from: rss77Two of the main issues with Cornell basketball this season is lack of a true point guard and lack of another inside scorer to complement Shonn Miller.  Devin Cherry is giving his best effort out there but lacks the vision to be a good point man and unfortunately don't see any other options at the point beyond Galal Cancer.  Basically Cherry is a 2 guard playing out of position.  IMO recruiting a good point guard is harder than finding a good big man. The defense has been reasonably effective especially yesterday in the effort against Columbia which brought about the comeback (Special props to Robert Hatter for his defense on Maddie Lo).  I am yet hopeful that the team can make it to 7-7 in Ivies.  They'll go as far as Shonn can take them.

And when Miller leaves, where are we then? Probably still no point guard and no inside game, unless Stone Getting is a player.  But can't expect too much from a Freshman.

Miller, Cherry, and Cancer are all seniors.  Little scoring and rebounding returns for next year.

This team's personality is pretty clear.  They don't give up good looks at the basket; they are #18 in the nation in defending the two point shot.  They rebound fairly well so they don't give up a ton of second shots.  And they need every bit of that defense, because statistically the offense is worse than last year.

My worry is that this is the high-water mark under Courtney.  55% of our minutes are seniors, as are three of four guys who can generate any offense.  We are very similar to Penn's team in 2012 when Zach Rosen covered up a lot of flaws. This season is a Shonn Miller production.

Quote from: mountainredThis team's personality is pretty clear.  They don't give up good looks at the basket; they are #18 in the nation in defending the two point shot.  They rebound fairly well so they don't give up a ton of second shots.  And they need every bit of that defense, because statistically the offense is worse than last year.

My worry is that this is the high-water mark under Courtney.  55% of our minutes are seniors, as are three of four guys who can generate any offense.  We are very similar to Penn's team in 2012 when Zach Rosen covered up a lot of flaws. This season is a Shonn Miller production.

I agree, could be a steep drop-off next year in what should be Courtney's last year (I hope).

Being as this is the final year on Courtney's contract, I think a lot of people hope this year is his last.

Quote from: semsoxBeing as this is the final year on Courtney's contract, I think a lot of people hope this year is his last.[/quote


That would be nice. :-D

Another win. 57-49 over Brown. This season is a pleasant surprise despite the Penn State and Drexel games.

Quote from: ugarteAnother win. 57-49 over Brown. This season is a pleasant surprise despite the Penn State and Drexel games.

Seems as if the only pleasant surprise the rest of the lynch mob wants is the coach gone. But didn't Donahue build slowly, and fans' expectations then was an Ivy title (tie) maybe every 10, 15 years?

Quote from: billhoward

Quote from: ugarteAnother win. 57-49 over Brown. This season is a pleasant surprise despite the Penn State and Drexel games.

Seems as if the only pleasant surprise the rest of the lynch mob wants is the coach gone. But didn't Donahue build slowly, and fans' expectations then was an Ivy title (tie) maybe every 10, 15 years?

Donohue caught lightning in a bottle and got lucky with a freak recruiting class. Wittman was injured as a senior and his stock plummeted; Dale was undersized and unrecruited and Foote ended up here purely because of the Gant injury. I have no idea if Courtney should be back. This is a pretty good year, though.

Quote from: ugarte

Quote from: billhoward

Quote from: ugarteAnother win. 57-49 over Brown. This season is a pleasant surprise despite the Penn State and Drexel games.

Seems as if the only pleasant surprise the rest of the lynch mob wants is the coach gone. But didn't Donahue build slowly, and fans' expectations then was an Ivy title (tie) maybe every 10, 15 years?

Donohue caught lightning in a bottle and got lucky with a freak recruiting class. Wittman was injured as a senior and his stock plummeted; Dale was undersized and unrecruited and Foote ended up here purely because of the Gant injury.

Those three guys made Donahue look good.  Until they arrived on his doorstep, he was an ordinary coach at best.  He got lucky...was offered a high-paying gig...and failed.

Cornell lost to a good Yale team last nite. Courtney is 47-88 in his career at Cornell, with several wins over D-3 teams.  Yes this year's 9-10 record against D-1 teams is better than last year's 1-26, but this year's team features 3 senior starters who average about 2/3 of the team's points. Not sure what next year's team will look like.

Donahue had winning Ivy records his last 6 years at Cornell, going a combined 63-21.  Courtney is currently 21-39 in the Ivies.

Quote from: CASCornell lost to a good Yale team last nite. Courtney is 47-88 in his career at Cornell, with several wins over D-3 teams.  Yes this year's 9-10 record against D-1 teams is better than last year's 1-26, but this year's team features 3 senior starters who average about 2/3 of the team's points. Not sure what next year's team will look like.

That's the scary part, unless there's some outstanding freshman he's recruited that project as starters, there could be a big drop off next year.

This year's freshmen have played little, and have scored a combined total of 74 points in the 20 games played.

Quote from: CASThis year's freshmen have played little, and have scored a combined total of 74 points in the 20 games played.

But I think the Freshmen are going to be solid players. Just stuck behind upperclassmen now.

Quote from: CASDonahue had winning Ivy records his last 6 years at Cornell, going a combined 63-21.  Courtney is currently 21-39 in the Ivies.

As has been said several times in this thread, he was gifted three All-Ivy players for those last four years.  Prior to that he was ordinary at best.  Let's stop lionizing him.  His first five years Donahue was 23-47 in the Ivies.

Quote from: Al DeFlorio

Quote from: CASDonahue had winning Ivy records his last 6 years at Cornell, going a combined 63-21.  Courtney is currently 21-39 in the Ivies.

As has been said several times in this thread, he was gifted three All-Ivy players for those last four years.  Prior to that he was ordinary at best.  Let's stop lionizing him.  His first five years Donahue was 23-47 in the Ivies.

Fairly or unfairly, context matters, and Courtney has put up his first 5 years in the wake of the most successful run in Cornell basketball history, coming off of a Sweet 16. Now if you think it's fair to do a direct apples-to-apples comparison between Bill and Steve's first several years, be my guest.

The truth is that in the wake of that success, with our basketball profile as high as we're likely to see, and having used that profile to recruit several players that are much more athletically gifted than Wittman/Dale/Foote were, we're topping out at .500 in the Ivies with a senior-laden team. The defense has been there this year, but the offense, as it has been for the duration of BC's tenure, is simply not competitive in today's college basketball landscape.

Quote from: semsox

Quote from: Al DeFlorioAs has been said several times in this thread, he was gifted three All-Ivy players for those last four years.  Prior to that he was ordinary at best.  Let's stop lionizing him.  His first five years Donahue was 23-47 in the Ivies.

Fairly or unfairly, context matters, and Courtney has put up his first 5 years in the wake of the most successful run in Cornell basketball history, coming off of a Sweet 16. Now if you think it's fair to do a direct apples-to-apples comparison between Bill and Steve's first several years, be my guest.

The truth is that in the wake of that success, with our basketball profile as high as we're likely to see, and having used that profile to recruit several players that are much more athletically gifted than Wittman/Dale/Foote were, we're topping out at .500 in the Ivies with a senior-laden team. The defense has been there this year, but the offense, as it has been for the duration of BC's tenure, is simply not competitive in today's college basketball landscape.

Oh, please.  Four of Donahue's starters graduated, leaving only Wroblewski.  And don't make me laugh by saying recruits were more gifted than Dale, Wittman, and Foote.

My point is that Donahue was an ordinary coach until three extraordinary players found their way to Cornell with minimum effort from him. One even had to personally mail a tape of his high school playing.  I'm not comparing Courtney to Donahue.  I'm saying Donahue was ordinary until three terrific Ivy-level players found their way to his team.  "Be my guest" if you want to disagree, but Donahue was nothing special until they arrived.  And I agree Courtney is not a good half-court coach.  Neither was--or is--Donahue.

Tough loss to Penn.

I didn't see the game but I was following the live stats. We had an 8 point lead at the half, 5 point lead with around 1:44 left IIRC. Penn hit a 3 to take its first lead in forever with around 40 seconds left, we tied it with a free throw (after missing one - a real problem as we went 1 for 2 on a bunch of late Penn fouls), and Penn hit the game winning jumper with 4 seconds left.

Booooo.

That pretty much sums up the Courtney era: crumbling in crunch time.

Quote from: ithacatThat pretty much sums up the Courtney era: crumbling in crunch time.

Even without watching I'm not sure this one's on Courtney. Penn kept fouling and we kept going 1 for 2 from the line when we could have put the game away. That game was lost at the stripe not on the whiteboard.

They may not all be on Coutney, but it doesn't change the fact that one of the calling cards of his teams is folding under pressure.

Quote from: ithacatThey may not all be on Coutney, but it doesn't change the fact that one of the calling cards of his teams is folding under pressure.

OK (http://scores.espn.go.com/ncb/recap?gameId=400591265)

Quote from: ugarte

Quote from: ithacatThey may not all be on Coutney, but it doesn't change the fact that one of the calling cards of his teams is folding under pressure.

OK (http://scores.espn.go.com/ncb/recap?gameId=400591265)

Why are you bringing up weather in a discussion about climate?

Quote from: Robb

Quote from: ugarte

Quote from: ithacatThey may not all be on Coutney, but it doesn't change the fact that one of the calling cards of his teams is folding under pressure.

OK (http://scores.espn.go.com/ncb/recap?gameId=400591265)

Why are you bringing up weather in a discussion about climate?

lol

Skimming the final scores, a quick tally shows Cornell has yet to win a game where the margin was 5 or less. If we split those, we'd be 14-8.

Cornell losing margins after Penn/Princeton Feb. 6-7. Lost by:
0 (tied end regulation, lost by 7 OT)
1
2 twice
3
5
8
>10 four times

Cornell winning margins. Won by:
6
7
8 three times
10 twice
>10 four times

Maybe there's a solid reason like Cornell doesn't have the bench depth of opponents.

Last nite our 3 senior starters combined for all but 6 of Cornell's points in a 62-51 loss to Yale.

Another Courtney collapse. I'm shocked.

Quote from: ithacatAnother Courtney collapse. I'm shocked.

Brown 57, Cornell 56 on a shot with 2 seconds to play. Cornell led the game for 39:28 of the 40 minutes. Leaving Cornell at, I believe, either just one or two games won where the margin of victory was 5 points or less, or it went to OT.

Quote from: billhoward

Quote from: ithacatAnother Courtney collapse. I'm shocked.

Brown 57, Cornell 56 on a shot with 2 seconds to play. Cornell led the game for 39:28 of the 40 minutes. Leaving Cornell at, I believe, either just one or two games won where the margin of victory was 5 points or less, or it went to OT.

11 point lead at the half. 17 point lead in the second half...this isn't the only time this season, and this isn't the only season of it either. Penn State, Drexel, Penn come to mind this season.

I feel bad for Courtney. He seems like a good guy and he has brought in better athletes than program has probably ever had. I just wish he could coach them.

Quote from: ithacatAnother Courtney collapse. I'm shocked.

I was at the hockey game and the announced the b-ball score.  We had a 5 or 6 point lead.  I found myself thinking "I hope they don't blow it again."

Then I heard that they did.

Quote from: ithacat

Quote from: billhoward

Quote from: ithacatAnother Courtney collapse. I'm shocked.

Brown 57, Cornell 56 on a shot with 2 seconds to play. Cornell led the game for 39:28 of the 40 minutes. Leaving Cornell at, I believe, either just one or two games won where the margin of victory was 5 points or less, or it went to OT.

11 point lead at the half. 17 point lead in the second half...this isn't the only time this season, and this isn't the only season of it either. Penn State, Drexel, Penn come to mind this season.

I feel bad for Courtney. He seems like a good guy and he has brought in better athletes than program has probably ever had. I just wish he could coach them.

Maybe the talent is mostly the starting five, and the bench is short (more ways than one) and not same caliber. Some would Syracuse caught up to Cornell in the 2009 lax title game because we wore out the first midfield in the first three quarters. 'course, it wasn't worn out players that didn't call a time-out with 3 seconds to play.

Courtney has one more year on his contract? A .500 coach (more or less) is not going to be let go with a year left.

I've read this is the last year of a 5-year contract.  Courtney's teams are 23-43 in the Ivies, and 4-6 this year.

Quote from: CASI've read this is the last year of a 5-year contract.  Courtney's teams are 23-43 in the Ivies, and 4-6 this year.

I think he's in the last year as well.

Quote from: billhoward

Quote from: ithacat

Quote from: billhoward

Quote from: ithacatAnother Courtney collapse. I'm shocked.

Brown 57, Cornell 56 on a shot with 2 seconds to play. Cornell led the game for 39:28 of the 40 minutes. Leaving Cornell at, I believe, either just one or two games won where the margin of victory was 5 points or less, or it went to OT.

11 point lead at the half. 17 point lead in the second half...this isn't the only time this season, and this isn't the only season of it either. Penn State, Drexel, Penn come to mind this season.

I feel bad for Courtney. He seems like a good guy and he has brought in better athletes than program has probably ever had. I just wish he could coach them.

Maybe the talent is mostly the starting five, and the bench is short (more ways than one) and not same caliber. Some would Syracuse caught up to Cornell in the 2009 lax title game because we wore out the first midfield in the first three quarters. 'course, it wasn't worn out players that didn't call a time-out with 3 seconds to play.

Courtney has one more year on his contract? A .500 coach (more or less) is not going to be let go with a year left.

I think this is the final season of his current contract. It wouldn't surprise me if he receives an extension.

Quote from: ithacat

Quote from: billhoward

Quote from: ithacat

Quote from: billhoward

Quote from: ithacatAnother Courtney collapse. I'm shocked.

Brown 57, Cornell 56 on a shot with 2 seconds to play. Cornell led the game for 39:28 of the 40 minutes. Leaving Cornell at, I believe, either just one or two games won where the margin of victory was 5 points or less, or it went to OT.

11 point lead at the half. 17 point lead in the second half...this isn't the only time this season, and this isn't the only season of it either. Penn State, Drexel, Penn come to mind this season.

I feel bad for Courtney. He seems like a good guy and he has brought in better athletes than program has probably ever had. I just wish he could coach them.

Maybe the talent is mostly the starting five, and the bench is short (more ways than one) and not same caliber. Some would Syracuse caught up to Cornell in the 2009 lax title game because we wore out the first midfield in the first three quarters. 'course, it wasn't worn out players that didn't call a time-out with 3 seconds to play.

Courtney has one more year on his contract? A .500 coach (more or less) is not going to be let go with a year left.

I think this is the final season of his current contract. It wouldn't surprise me if he receives an extension.

That seems to be the scuttlebutt, although few coaches would be less deserving on an extension based on his team's 5-year performance.

Quote from: scoop85

Quote from: ithacat

Quote from: billhoward

Quote from: ithacat

Quote from: billhoward

Quote from: ithacatAnother Courtney collapse. I'm shocked.

Brown 57, Cornell 56 on a shot with 2 seconds to play. Cornell led the game for 39:28 of the 40 minutes. Leaving Cornell at, I believe, either just one or two games won where the margin of victory was 5 points or less, or it went to OT.

11 point lead at the half. 17 point lead in the second half...this isn't the only time this season, and this isn't the only season of it either. Penn State, Drexel, Penn come to mind this season.

I feel bad for Courtney. He seems like a good guy and he has brought in better athletes than program has probably ever had. I just wish he could coach them.

Maybe the talent is mostly the starting five, and the bench is short (more ways than one) and not same caliber. Some would Syracuse caught up to Cornell in the 2009 lax title game because we wore out the first midfield in the first three quarters. 'course, it wasn't worn out players that didn't call a time-out with 3 seconds to play.

Courtney has one more year on his contract? A .500 coach (more or less) is not going to be let go with a year left.

I think this is the final season of his current contract. It wouldn't surprise me if he receives an extension.

That seems to be the scuttlebutt, although few coaches would be less deserving on an extension based on his team's 5-year performance.

If Steve was given more time then Bill seems deserving of the same opportunity. Their records after 5 years are comparable, even including last season's debacle. If Miller wasn't hurt last year I suspect Bill's record over 5 years would be much better than Steve's was. Bill certainly benefitted from the base that Steve built so it isn't an entirely fair comparison. Steve also showed his program was slowly improving while Bill's seems to be stuck in the same spot, though this could turn out to be his best season.

Steve
7–20 3–11 T–7th
5–22 2–12 7th
9–18 4–10 T–5th
11–16 6–8 T–5th
13–14 8–6 2nd

[b]45-90   23-47[/b]

Bill
10–18 6–8 T–5th
12–16 7–7 5th
13–18 5–9 T–6th
2–26 1–13 8th
13-14 5-6     T-4th

[b]50-92   24-43[/b]


Comparing Bill's record to Steve's is a bit unfair to both.  Bill took over a program in much better shape than Steve did. On the other hand, the Ivy League is much better and deeper now than it was at any point in Steve's tenure.

The case for keeping Bill:  He is all by all accounts a very good person whom the players like and respect.  They played harder than many teams would have down the stretch of last season.  The players stay out of trouble and graduate; that still matters at an Ivy (or at least it should).  Other than last year's debacle, we've been competitive in an Ivy League that is much deeper than it ever has been.  Now that Bill has his players, you see the kind of defense the Big Red will play.  Top 100 defenses will be "the new normal" and with any offense, we can go to the post-season (CIT or CBI, if not the big show).  Sure, we lose six seniors from this team, but other than Shonn they are replaceable.  In short, Bill is fine considering our basketball pedigree and he takes care of the bigger picture stuff.

The case to move on:  Last season, he oversaw literally the worst season of Cornell basketball in the school's history; that shouldn't be glossed over.  His record over the last three years with Shonn Miller in the line-up is 26-29, without Shonn it's 2-30.  We don't have Shonn next year.  Seniors account for approximately 60 percent of the minutes and two-thirds of the points on this year's team.  Maybe none of the non-Shonn seniors are irreplaceable, but no one on the bench has made a case for more PT. The defensive work is a "flash in the pan" and unsustainable without Miller. Even if it were sustainable, the offense has regressed so that it is worse than last year.  The only time we've had a decent offense under Bill is when 'ski was running the point.  This program has needed an "X and O guy" for years and he's not found one.  He's a great guy, but not a head coach.

I've made my feeling known for a while, but I wouldn't be surprised if Andy gives him an extension because basketball is a low priority and Bill is low maintenance.  Unless there is another Shonn Miller in this year's class, doing so will look like a mistake in three years.

Quote from: mountainredComparing Bill's record to Steve's is a bit unfair to both.  Bill took over a program in much better shape than Steve did. On the other hand, the Ivy League is much better and deeper now than it was at any point in Steve's tenure.

The case for keeping Bill:  He is all by all accounts a very good person whom the players like and respect.  They played harder than many teams would have down the stretch of last season.  The players stay out of trouble and graduate; that still matters at an Ivy (or at least it should).  Other than last year's debacle, we've been competitive in an Ivy League that is much deeper than it ever has been.  Now that Bill has his players, you see the kind of defense the Big Red will play.  Top 100 defenses will be "the new normal" and with any offense, we can go to the post-season (CIT or CBI, if not the big show).  Sure, we lose six seniors from this team, but other than Shonn they are replaceable.  In short, Bill is fine considering our basketball pedigree and he takes care of the bigger picture stuff.

The case to move on:  Last season, he oversaw literally the worst season of Cornell basketball in the school's history; that shouldn't be glossed over.  His record over the last three years with Shonn Miller in the line-up is 26-29, without Shonn it's 2-30.  We don't have Shonn next year.  Seniors account for approximately 60 percent of the minutes and two-thirds of the points on this year's team.  Maybe none of the non-Shonn seniors are irreplaceable, but no one on the bench has made a case for more PT. The defensive work is a "flash in the pan" and unsustainable without Miller. Even if it were sustainable, the offense has regressed so that it is worse than last year.  The only time we've had a decent offense under Bill is when 'ski was running the point.  This program has needed an "X and O guy" for years and he's not found one.  He's a great guy, but not a head coach.

I've made my feeling known for a while, but I wouldn't be surprised if Andy gives him an extension because basketball is a low priority and Bill is low maintenance.  Unless there is another Shonn Miller in this year's class, doing so will look like a mistake in three years.

Good analysis. It would give hope going forward if there were some outstanding underclassmen returning, but that as you point out is not the case.

Quote from: Ken711

Quote from: mountainredComparing Bill's record to Steve's is a bit unfair to both.  Bill took over a program in much better shape than Steve did. On the other hand, the Ivy League is much better and deeper now than it was at any point in Steve's tenure.

The case for keeping Bill:  He is all by all accounts a very good person whom the players like and respect.  They played harder than many teams would have down the stretch of last season.  The players stay out of trouble and graduate; that still matters at an Ivy (or at least it should).  Other than last year's debacle, we've been competitive in an Ivy League that is much deeper than it ever has been.  Now that Bill has his players, you see the kind of defense the Big Red will play.  Top 100 defenses will be "the new normal" and with any offense, we can go to the post-season (CIT or CBI, if not the big show).  Sure, we lose six seniors from this team, but other than Shonn they are replaceable.  In short, Bill is fine considering our basketball pedigree and he takes care of the bigger picture stuff.

The case to move on:  Last season, he oversaw literally the worst season of Cornell basketball in the school's history; that shouldn't be glossed over.  His record over the last three years with Shonn Miller in the line-up is 26-29, without Shonn it's 2-30.  We don't have Shonn next year.  Seniors account for approximately 60 percent of the minutes and two-thirds of the points on this year's team.  Maybe none of the non-Shonn seniors are irreplaceable, but no one on the bench has made a case for more PT. The defensive work is a "flash in the pan" and unsustainable without Miller. Even if it were sustainable, the offense has regressed so that it is worse than last year.  The only time we've had a decent offense under Bill is when 'ski was running the point.  This program has needed an "X and O guy" for years and he's not found one.  He's a great guy, but not a head coach.

I've made my feeling known for a while, but I wouldn't be surprised if Andy gives him an extension because basketball is a low priority and Bill is low maintenance.  Unless there is another Shonn Miller in this year's class, doing so will look like a mistake in three years.

Good analysis. It would give hope going forward if there were some outstanding underclassmen returning, but that as you point out is not the case.

Thanks.  It's too early to write-off this year's freshman class, but most of Bill's recruits have shown how good they will be during their freshman year.  I wouldn't surprised if Pat Smith and Jordan Abdur-Ra'oof are contributors going forward, but neither looks like a future all-Ivy.  We have six incoming freshman, but the only one who is rated by ESPN is Stone Gettings (#65 PF).  ESPN describes his game as: "He can step out and knock in the 17-foot jump shot as he fits that pick-and-pop 4-man description to a tee."  That sounds like a perfect Donahue player -- a Jon Jacques clone -- but an awful fit for Courtney's system.  Here's hoping some other guys emerge from the class.

The New York Times writes about Shonn Miller and the possibilities for his final season of eligibility. Tommy Amaker and Bill Courtney both say he could play for a major.
http://www.nytimes.com/2015/03/04/sports/ncaabasketball/shonn-miller-to-play-a-fifth-year-but-it-cant-be-at-cornell.html

Quote from: WederTommy Amaker and Bill Courtney both say he could play for a major.

There's not much question he could play for a big time program; he's really that good.  But it's not as unusual as you seem to think.  Nolan Cressler transferred to Vandy.  Errick Peck played 15 minutes a game in a post graduate year at Purdue.  Dwight Tarwater has earned a starting gig in a post-graduate year at Cal (which is more PT than I figured, nicely done Dwight).  So we had four guys on 2012-13 squad who play, played or very likely will play for a power 5 program.  At the risk of antagonizing Bill, that team finished 13-18 and tied for 6th in the league.  Yeah, Miller missed the last four games that season (all losses) but the other three guys played all season.

Quote from: mountainred

Quote from: WederTommy Amaker and Bill Courtney both say he could play for a major.

There's not much question he could play for a big time program; he's really that good.  But it's not as unusual as you seem to think.  Nolan Cressler transferred to Vandy.  Errick Peck played 15 minutes a game in a post graduate year at Purdue.  Dwight Tarwater has earned a starting gig in a post-graduate year at Cal (which is more PT than I figured, nicely done Dwight).  So we had four guys on 2012-13 squad who play, played or very likely will play for a power 5 program.  At the risk of antagonizing Bill, that team finished 13-18 and tied for 6th in the league.  Yeah, Miller missed the last four games that season (all losses) but the other three guys played all season.

I was just trying to give more detail about what's in the story. I don't think it's unusual at all.

Quote from: Weder

Quote from: mountainred

Quote from: WederTommy Amaker and Bill Courtney both say he could play for a major.

There's not much question he could play for a big time program; he's really that good.  But it's not as unusual as you seem to think.  Nolan Cressler transferred to Vandy.  Errick Peck played 15 minutes a game in a post graduate year at Purdue.  Dwight Tarwater has earned a starting gig in a post-graduate year at Cal (which is more PT than I figured, nicely done Dwight).  So we had four guys on 2012-13 squad who play, played or very likely will play for a power 5 program.  At the risk of antagonizing Bill, that team finished 13-18 and tied for 6th in the league.  Yeah, Miller missed the last four games that season (all losses) but the other three guys played all season.

I was just trying to give more detail about what's in the story. I don't think it's unusual at all.

Sorry, read too much into your comment.

Cornell hoops getting crushed by last-place Penn. Red will finish 5-9 in Ivies. Btw Penn has fired their coach Jerome Allen.

In his 5 years at Cornell, Courtney is 24-46 in the Ivies.

Final at Penn 79-72.  We finish 13-17, 5-9 (t-5th).

Penn fired Jerome Allen with 2 years left on his contract, requiring a $650,000 buyout. They want to win.

Not the best closing argument for Bill, as the team finishes on a 1-6 streak.  Of course, the win was over Harvard.

One bright note from the Penn game, Freshman Wil Bathurst had 20 points and 8 rebounds.  Most of that production was after Penn took a 20 point lead, but someone will need to score on next year's team (whether the coach is Bill or someone else).

Yup the team limped to the finish, losing to the other 6 Ivies by an average of 11 points

Quote from: CASPenn fired Jerome Allen with 2 years left on his contract, requiring a $650,000 buyout. They want to win.

Hopefully Donahue doesnt end up there. Courtney has to go, someone new cant possibly do worse, should be able to get at least 1 over 0.500 season in 5 years

Harvard must have made a deal with devil, Yale had the game to clinch the bid last night against Dartmouth locked up and after some missed free throws Dartmouth wins it off an out of bounds play with 0.5 left. Playoff on Saturday at Penn

Quote from: phillysportsfan

Quote from: CASPenn fired Jerome Allen with 2 years left on his contract, requiring a $650,000 buyout. They want to win.

Hopefully Donahue doesnt end up there. Courtney has to go, someone new cant possibly do worse, should be able to get at least 1 over 0.500 season in 5 years

Harvard must have made a deal with devil, Yale had the game to clinch the bid last night against Dartmouth locked up and after some missed free throws Dartmouth wins it off an out of bounds play with 0.5 left. Playoff on Saturday at Penn

They hired Tommy, so, yes, they made a deal with the devil.  Yale was up 5 with about 20 seconds to go and couldn't close the deal.  This is going to be a miserable week of practice in New Haven.

Quote from: mountainred

Quote from: phillysportsfan

Quote from: CASPenn fired Jerome Allen with 2 years left on his contract, requiring a $650,000 buyout. They want to win.

Hopefully Donahue doesnt end up there. Courtney has to go, someone new cant possibly do worse, should be able to get at least 1 over 0.500 season in 5 years

Harvard must have made a deal with devil, Yale had the game to clinch the bid last night against Dartmouth locked up and after some missed free throws Dartmouth wins it off an out of bounds play with 0.5 left. Playoff on Saturday at Penn

They hired Tommy, so, yes, they made a deal with the devil.  Yale was up 5 with about 20 seconds to go and couldn't close the deal.  This is going to be a miserable week of practice in New Haven.

Will be rooting hard for Yale on Saturday, Harvard has had enough success recently

Any news whether Courtney will continue, or there will new leadership for hoops?

Andy...

To paraphrase the Rolling Stones...
Andy, Andy, When will those clouds all disappear?

Quote from: CASAndy...

I think I said roughly this last year too but Andy's eyes are on St. Louis at the moment.

Quote from: Chris '03

Quote from: CASAndy...

I think I said roughly this last year too but Andy's eyes are on St. Louis at the moment.

It was true then and it is true now.

It should be noted that Shonn Miller was a unanimous first-team all-ivy selection.  He is just the 5th Cornellian to make two first team all-ivy squads in basketball.

Was but 5 years ago when under Steve Donahue we went to the Sweet 16.  We've won 1/3 of our Ivy games since.

Quote from: CASWas but 5 years ago when under Steve Donahue we went to the Sweet 16.  We've won 1/3 of our Ivy games since.

Which is why you should be glad if you made it to Syracuse for the Sweet 16 game. This bus doesn't come along that often.

Agree we can't expect to win NCAA games.  Nor should we accept losing. You play to win the games.

Quote from: billhoward

Quote from: CASWas but 5 years ago when under Steve Donahue we went to the Sweet 16.  We've won 1/3 of our Ivy games since.

Which is why you should be glad if you made it to Syracuse for the Sweet 16 game. This bus doesn't come along that often.

I hate basketball, but even I'm glad I made it to that game.

Quote from: CASAgree we can't expect to win NCAA games.  Nor should we accept losing. You play to win the games.

This nicely sums up why Courtney has to go. We should be able to at least be competitive in the Ivy league at least once in 5 years. How can Andy bring this guy back?

Quote from: http://cornellbasketball.blogspot.com/2015/03/news-and-notes-tuesday-edition.htmlCornell is now the only Ivy League team to not have participated in the postseason since the 2010-2011 season. See the Valley News on Dartmouth's invite to the CIT. Other low points for Cornell in the last five seasons include the following:
Last year, Cornell (2-26 in 2013-2014) suffered its worst season in program history, dating back to 1898;
Cornell has suffered five consecutive seasons under .500 overall;
Cornell has suffered five consecutive seasons in the "lower division" of the Ivy League;
Cornell has suffered five consecutive overall losing seasons;
Cornell has suffered four of its last five seasons under .500 in Ivy League play.

 And even worse the blog guy is saying Courtney is going to get one more year which is just delaying the inevitable: https://twitter.com/Cornell_BB_Blog/status/576025377157591040

+1

The author of the Cornell BB Blog wrote today, "Haven't felt this helpless despair following Cornell MBB since Al Walker era" - early-mid '90's.

Quote from: CASThe author of the Cornell BB Blog wrote today, "Haven't felt this helpless despair following Cornell MBB since Al Walker era" - early-mid '90's.

that guy kept defending Courtney to no end, even when it was clear during his first season that he flat out couldn't coach

Even CBB has seen the light

Quote from: CASThe author of the Cornell BB Blog wrote today, "Haven't felt this helpless despair following Cornell MBB since Al Walker era" - early-mid '90's.

That's about right.  But even Al didn't waste a talent like Shonn Miller.

Quote from: mountainred

Quote from: CASThe author of the Cornell BB Blog wrote today, "Haven't felt this helpless despair following Cornell MBB since Al Walker era" - early-mid '90's.

That's about right.  But even Al didn't waste a talent like Shonn Miller.

True enough, though Shonn proved to be his own biggest obstacle. It'll be interesting to see what a big time coach does wth him next season.

Quote from: underskill

Quote from: CASThe author of the Cornell BB Blog wrote today, "Haven't felt this helpless despair following Cornell MBB since Al Walker era" - early-mid '90's.

that guy kept defending Courtney to no end, even when it was clear during his first season that he flat out couldn't coach

Yeah cant believe he has seen the light yet somehow Andy has not

Harvard wins playoff 53-51, Yale misses tip in at the buzzer, tough to be Yale, bad luck to Harvard in the tournament

If Bill Courtney is not retained, maybe start a separate thread "Courtney out / who replaces?" We've had a week of beating up on Courtney (actually, a year) and no real news. I'm about done with this thread. I suppose if over 24 hours there are two dozen posts, it's either a coaching change or somebody mentioned a Prius and the thread turned 90 degrees toward mass transit in Ithaca and why profs should walk a mile to class.

I don't believe any of the criticism has been unfair. You are what your record is. Compare the criticism of Courtney with that of Schafer, who has had 4 losing seasons out of 20.

Quote from: CASI don't believe any of the criticism has been unfair. You are what your record is. Compare the criticism of Courtney with that of Schafer, who has had 4 losing seasons out of 20.

More criticism of the sports lots of fans are passionate about. Not much said about crew or polo having a bad or good year.

Quote from: billhoward

Quote from: CASI don't believe any of the criticism has been unfair. You are what your record is. Compare the criticism of Courtney with that of Schafer, who has had 4 losing seasons out of 20.

More criticism of the sports lots of fans are passionate about. Not much said about crew or polo having a bad or good year.

Don't get me going about polo...that chuck and duck style is killing us.

Steve Donahue to be next Penn coach.  Discuss amongst yourselves.

Quote from: CASSteve Donahue to be next Penn coach.  Discuss amongst yourselves.

well he wasn't going to return to Ithaca anyways, so good for Penn really.

Do you know if he was asked whether he would return to Ithaca?

Quote from: CASDo you know if he was asked whether he would return to Ithaca?

why would he make a move backwards like that? there's no way he could match that sweet 16 standard again anyways.

There are examples of coaches returning to their prior schools, after not succeeding at big-time programs (e.g. Buddy Teevens back to Dartmouth). Tho I doubt the call was made...

Quote from: CASSteve Donahue to be next Penn coach.  Discuss amongst yourselves.

Far from a shock. Where he wanted to be years ago.

Quote from: Chris '03

Quote from: CASSteve Donahue to be next Penn coach.  Discuss amongst yourselves.

Far from a shock. Where he wanted to be years ago.

Exactly. He wanted Philadelphia (he grew up, went to Ursinus in the suburbs), he wanted a Catholic school. Penn is one out of two. He could finish his career there. Be nice to have another Ivy be competitive again. Donahue's ideal job would be Villanova but Jay Wright has been there since 2001, since 2005 has advanced in the NCAAs most every year and if Wright hasn't succumbed to bigger money after FF and Elite 8 rounds, why would he leave now at 53 ... and why would Donahue get the Villanova job after not moving BC up the ladder? We ought to wish him well, except twice a year.

Only Ivy I'd like to be competitive again is Cornell.

Can it get any worse for Cornell basketball, are you alive Andy? Wow that was fast, never thought Donahue would go back there

http://www.espnithaca.com/common/page.php?id=4391

Quote from: http://www.thedp.com/blog/buzz/2015/03/cornell-coach-bill-courtney-on-penn-hiring-steve-donahueAnd we had an idea that we'd be a lot better this year and we'd have a chance to compete in our league and we were able to do that. We'd have liked to have won some more games but we knew we'd be able to compete and we certainly feel that our program is heading in the right direction and we're on our way up.

Courtney is out there giving delusional interviews so I guess he is back, what a joke, 5-9 in conference is not competing. Next year with no Miller they will be lucky to get 10 wins

'What a joke' indeed.

Quote from: billhoward

Quote from: Chris '03

Quote from: CASSteve Donahue to be next Penn coach.  Discuss amongst yourselves.

Far from a shock. Where he wanted to be years ago.

Exactly. He wanted Philadelphia (he grew up, went to Ursinus in the suburbs), he wanted a Catholic school. Penn is one out of two. He could finish his career there. Be nice to have another Ivy be competitive again. Donahue's ideal job would be Villanova but Jay Wright has been there since 2001, since 2005 has advanced in the NCAAs most every year and if Wright hasn't succumbed to bigger money after FF and Elite 8 rounds, why would he leave now at 53 ... and why would Donahue get the Villanova job after not moving BC up the ladder? We ought to wish him well, except twice a year.

Count me as a group of 1 that has doubts he well be Penn's return to glory. It should be easier than at Cornell, and probably easier than BC. However I'm still doubting, we'll see.

The biggest problem with Courtney is that he continues to run his offensive and defensive "systems" (and I hesitate to use the word since it usually implies some sort of underlying framework). I wouldn't even mind BC coming back if he actually hired an assistant coach who could bring in some structure to our offensive and defensive sets. I (like many others) have no qualms with Bill as a recruiter or as a person, but the brand of basketball he's teaching these kids is not, has not, and will not be effective.

We went 2-30 the last 3 years without Miller. What's the over/under for D-1 wins next year?  The Cornell Basketball Blog is predicting a season similar to 2013-4 (1-26 vs D-1 teams).

Quote from: Jim Hyla

Quote from: billhoward

Quote from: Chris '03

Quote from: CASSteve Donahue to be next Penn coach.  Discuss amongst yourselves.

Far from a shock. Where he wanted to be years ago.

Exactly. He wanted Philadelphia (he grew up, went to Ursinus in the suburbs), he wanted a Catholic school. Penn is one out of two. He could finish his career there. Be nice to have another Ivy be competitive again. Donahue's ideal job would be Villanova but Jay Wright has been there since 2001, since 2005 has advanced in the NCAAs most every year and if Wright hasn't succumbed to bigger money after FF and Elite 8 rounds, why would he leave now at 53 ... and why would Donahue get the Villanova job after not moving BC up the ladder? We ought to wish him well, except twice a year.

Count me as a group of 1 that has doubts he well be Penn's return to glory. It should be easier than at Cornell, and probably easier than BC. However I'm still doubting, we'll see.

He cant do worse than Allen did, they'll at least be more competitive and probably compete for the league title in a few years. I dont think they will return to the absolute dominance their alumni except as Harvard and Amaker arent going anywhere and more teams in the league have started to care since our sweet 16 run. It is just tough to see Donahue go there while we spin in circles

Quote from: phillysportsfan

Quote from: Jim Hyla

Quote from: billhoward

Quote from: Chris '03

Quote from: CASSteve Donahue to be next Penn coach.  Discuss amongst yourselves.

Far from a shock. Where he wanted to be years ago.

Exactly. He wanted Philadelphia (he grew up, went to Ursinus in the suburbs), he wanted a Catholic school. Penn is one out of two. He could finish his career there. Be nice to have another Ivy be competitive again. Donahue's ideal job would be Villanova but Jay Wright has been there since 2001, since 2005 has advanced in the NCAAs most every year and if Wright hasn't succumbed to bigger money after FF and Elite 8 rounds, why would he leave now at 53 ... and why would Donahue get the Villanova job after not moving BC up the ladder? We ought to wish him well, except twice a year.

Count me as a group of 1 that has doubts he well be Penn's return to glory. It should be easier than at Cornell, and probably easier than BC. However I'm still doubting, we'll see.

He cant do worse than Allen did, they'll at least be more competitive and probably compete for the league title in a few years. I dont think they will return to the absolute dominance their alumni except as Harvard and Amaker arent going anywhere and more teams in the league have started to care since our sweet 16 run. It is just tough to see Donahue go there while we spin in circles

If it makes you feel any better, he probably would have left Cornell for this opportunity had he not gone to BC in 2010. He's a Philly guy through and through.

I don't think he'll oversee a bunch of 14-0 Penn teams because the traditional Penn advantages have been eroded by, among other things, the financial aid opportunities at the wealthier Ivies.  Yale, longtime also rans in hockey and basketball, just pulled off a rare combination: MIH & MBB Ivy titles in the same season. Ivy talent doesn't all run through the Ps anymore.

I hate Penn but I wish Coach D luck.  He's a good guy. Hopefully he can make some noise in the Big 5 and help raise the Ivy League's reputation.

Quote from: semsoxI wouldn't even mind BC coming back if he actually hired an assistant coach who could bring in some structure to our offensive and defensive sets.

Hmmm.  Sounds to me an awful lot like what a head coach does. Why would you look for an assistant to do that unless you were grooming him to eventually BE the head coach?

And has our recruiting actually been good?  Has Courtney recruited an all-Ivy player other than Miller?  Courtney said Miller was his very first recruit, who committed in the wake of 3 consecutive Ivy titles and the Sweet Sixteen year under Donahue.

Quote from: Chris '03

Quote from: phillysportsfan

Quote from: Jim Hyla

Quote from: billhoward

Quote from: Chris '03

Quote from: CASSteve Donahue to be next Penn coach.  Discuss amongst yourselves.

Far from a shock. Where he wanted to be years ago.

Exactly. He wanted Philadelphia (he grew up, went to Ursinus in the suburbs), he wanted a Catholic school. Penn is one out of two. He could finish his career there. Be nice to have another Ivy be competitive again. Donahue's ideal job would be Villanova but Jay Wright has been there since 2001, since 2005 has advanced in the NCAAs most every year and if Wright hasn't succumbed to bigger money after FF and Elite 8 rounds, why would he leave now at 53 ... and why would Donahue get the Villanova job after not moving BC up the ladder? We ought to wish him well, except twice a year.

Count me as a group of 1 that has doubts he well be Penn's return to glory. It should be easier than at Cornell, and probably easier than BC. However I'm still doubting, we'll see.

He cant do worse than Allen did, they'll at least be more competitive and probably compete for the league title in a few years. I dont think they will return to the absolute dominance their alumni except as Harvard and Amaker arent going anywhere and more teams in the league have started to care since our sweet 16 run. It is just tough to see Donahue go there while we spin in circles

If it makes you feel any better, he probably would have left Cornell for this opportunity had he not gone to BC in 2010. He's a Philly guy through and through.

I don't think he'll oversea a bunch of 14-0 Penn teams because the traditional Penn advantages have been eroded by, among other things, the financial aid opportunities at the wealthier Ivies.  Yale, longtime also rans in hockey and basketball, just pulled off a rare combination: MIH & MBB Ivy titles in the same season. Ivy talent doesn't all run through the Ps anymore.

I hate Penn but I wish Coach D luck.  He's a good guy. Hopefully he can make some noise in the Big 5 and help raise the Ivy League's reputation.

I wish Steve the best and think he will do okay at Penn; there are still selling points for Penn basketball and Steve is a good, though probably not great, coach.  He'll get the Quakers out of the league cellar, but I agree he won't oversee a bunch of 14-0 Penn teams.

Quote from: CASAnd has our recruiting actually been good?  Has Courtney recruited an all-Ivy player other than Miller?  Courtney said Miller was his very first recruit, who committed in the wake of 3 consecutive Ivy titles and the Sweet Sixteen year under Donahue.

To answer your first question, consider that in BC's first two years, using Steve's holdovers who were ill-suited to run Courtney's system, the Big Red won 13 league games.  In his last three seasons, using mainly his recruits, there have been 11 league wins.  That's not a testament to good recruiting.

As far as your second question, Cressler was HM all-Ivy as a Soph.  My guess is that Hatter will be scoring 20+ points a night next year and will make at least HM all-Ivy, though he may set a school record for shots to get there.

Courtney has recruited more athletic guys than Donahue ever did but while occasionally they make amazing plays they are often inconsistent/undisciplined. He never really implemented his "system"

Annoyed seeing these "Giving Day" emails go out while Andy doesnt do his job and fire Courtney

Totally agree Philly.  It really is an outrage that Andy has apparently given an extension to a coach who took the basketball program from first to worst. Penn fires a coach and hires Donahue. Columbia fires a coach and hires Bagnoli. And we...

Quote from: CASAnd we...

Are more interested in churn than the school is.

Quote from: Chris '03I hate Penn but I wish Coach D luck.  He's a good guy. Hopefully he can make some noise in the Big 5 and help raise the Ivy League's reputation.

If every Ivy team is more competitive in a sport - competitive meaning a chance to make the NCAAs - it's easier to recruit better players at every school.

Wonder if part of the reason they are keeping Courtney are the financial problems on East Hill.  The $57 million in cuts that have to be made across the board definitely affects athletics.  Doanhue will do well at Penn.  There is always an element of luck in recruiting.  Yes-Dale, Wittman, and Foote fell into his lap but he had other pieces in place in the supporting cast in players like Jon Jacques, Adam Wire, Errick Peck, etc.  He was also able to get quality transfers like Mark Coury from Kentucky who gave quality back-up minutes to Foote and Max Groebe from UMass. After the first 5 years of his reign he gradually upgraded the talent with his recruiting template.

So glad Harvard lost. Whew.

Courtney's contract concluded. Can't understand why he's still the head coach.

Guess Andy doesn't care about men's hoops

Quote from: CASCourtney's contract concluded. Can't understand why he's still the head coach.

We won't be over .500 in winning games with Courtney, book it.

Quote from: Ken711

Quote from: CASCourtney's contract concluded. Can't understand why he's still the head coach.

We won't be over .500 in winning games with Courtney, book it.

"Over .500?"

"I don't think I'll ever get over .500."

Quote from: Trotsky

Quote from: Ken711

Quote from: CASCourtney's contract concluded. Can't understand why he's still the head coach.

We won't be over .500 in winning games with Courtney, book it.

"Over .500?"

"I don't think I'll ever get over .500."

As in win more than 50% of the games he coaches, no I don't see it. ;-)

Quote from: Ken711

Quote from: Trotsky

Quote from: Ken711

Quote from: CASCourtney's contract concluded. Can't understand why he's still the head coach.

We won't be over .500 in winning games with Courtney, book it.

"Over .500?"

"I don't think I'll ever get over .500."

As in win more than 50% of the games he coaches, no I don't see it. ;-)

Those wounds...run deep. (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wBq4ma7oByM)

Quote from: http://cornellbball.proboards.com/post/22022/threadI believe it is neither. IMO, Andy extended Bill when the program appeared to be moving in the right direction, but now it is clear it is not.

I don't have any details. I am just told that there is a very small inner circle that is involved. Bill will be back next year and from what I am told, next year is the last year absent a demonstration the program is moving forward.

My hunch is that a one year extension was probably given early this season.

Can only hope this is true as we should be horrible next year losing Miller, Cancer, Cherry. We would be horrible no matter who the next coach is so as was said before it may work out well since new coach wont be stuck with that rough year on his resume. Problem then is Andy needs to hire a better coach than before when the program is at a much worse position than it was 5 years ago. Too bad Spiker probably wont be available, hurts to think where we would be if that Army job didnt open late fall 2009, Spiker would have been the no brainer replacement for Donahue

Quote from: phillysportsfan

Quote from: http://cornellbball.proboards.com/post/22022/threadI believe it is neither. IMO, Andy extended Bill when the program appeared to be moving in the right direction, but now it is clear it is not.

I don't have any details. I am just told that there is a very small inner circle that is involved. Bill will be back next year and from what I am told, next year is the last year absent a demonstration the program is moving forward.

My hunch is that a one year extension was probably given early this season.

Can only hope this is true as we should be horrible next year losing Miller, Cancer, Cherry. We would be horrible no matter who the next coach is so as was said before it may work out well since new coach wont be stuck with that rough year on his resume. Problem then is Andy needs to hire a better coach than before when the program is at a much worse position than it was 5 years ago. Too bad Spiker probably wont be available, hurts to think where we would be if that Army job didnt open late fall 2009, Spiker would have been the no brainer replacement for Donahue

A one year extension seems like a really odd decision.  Put aside the issue of whether BC should stay or go, next year is going to be complete reboot.  We lose three starters (including one of the best players in school history) and need to replace over 60% of our minutes and our scoring.  The only two rising seniors on the roster are guys who have never been part of the rotation and are, at best, lottery tickets to contributing meaningful minutes next season.  As Philly said, next year is likely going to be tough regardless of the coach.  I guess you keep the large recruiting class intact and get to see if Bill found a transformative class, but otherwise it just seems like a punt.

Sounds more like cost certainty to me.

So is there a suggestion that we extended a coach who took a program from first to worst, because we know his salary?  Is this how far we have fallen?

Quote from: CASSo is there a suggestion that we extended a coach who took a program from first to worst, because we know his salary?  Is this how far we have fallen?

Pure speculation here.  If budgets are tight doing a search for a coach in a high profile (nationally) sport puts thosebudgets at risk.

Is this how far we've fallen?  It feels like we've just returned to the historic norm for Cornell basketball.  (I'm not a fan of the sport so I'm being a little callous about this.)

Courtney had an expiring contract. Would a new coach have cost more than what the extension calls for?  I'm not expecting Calipari to come here. Donahue's last 6 teams all had winning Ivy records. Should we just accept/expect losing in basketball?  Why field a team then?

Quote from: CASCourtney had an expiring contract. Would a new coach have cost more than what the extension calls for?  I'm not expecting Calipari to come here. Donahue's last 6 teams all had winning Ivy records. Should we just accept/expect losing in basketball?  Why field a team then?

Following the ideals of intercolliegate athletics one could argue that the purpose of competing is the competition, etc. not the winning. Frequent losing in a sport doesn't necessaily mean we should cancel the program.

From a practical standpoint a school has limited resources and sometimes has to accept a lower standard for one sport in order to promote another that is deemed of more importance.  I don't know if that'swhat is happening here but it's possible.  Or maybe Courtney just made a really good argument to stay on the job and Andy was so busy and happy following wrestling that he deciding to keep the coach on.

I would think a new coach might cost less as they will likely have less experience than Courtney. Frequent losing is one thing, not trying to start winning is another. After that Sweet 16 run you would think Men's BB would be more of a priority, no other sport at our level provides that national exposure

+1 philly

I wonder if Kevin App might make sense down the road? He's a former CU basketball captain ('07), and he just landed the Head Coach job at Williams (http://ephsports.williams.edu/sports/mbkb/2013-14/releases/201407197xkmzl) last summer after Assistant positions at Cornell and Army (under Spiker). His first season went okay, going 15-10 overall and 5-5 and in conference. It's probably a little early, but if Courtney gets fired after next season and App has a good season at Williams, I could see him as a solid choice.

Quote from: Willy '06I wonder if Kevin App might make sense down the road? He's a former CU basketball captain ('07), and he just landed the Head Coach job at Williams (http://ephsports.williams.edu/sports/mbkb/2013-14/releases/201407197xkmzl) last summer after Assistant positions at Cornell and Army (under Spiker). His first season went okay, going 15-10 overall and 5-5 and in conference. It's probably a little early, but if Courtney gets fired after next season and App has a good season at Williams, I could see him as a solid choice.

I have no idea of anything that happened this season at Williams (they may have had a ton of injuries), but Williams has lately been a D3 power and their pre-season rank was #5. So, 15-10 isn't that hot (again, there may be a very good reason).  Kevin may be a great choice one day, but he's probably a few seasons from being ready.

http://www.californiagoldenblogs.com/2015/3/28/8305587/cal-marquette-uconn-michigan-illinois-boston-college-basketball-shonn-miller

https://mobile.twitter.com/jeffborzello/status/581806055606390784

Miller getting heavily recruited by Mich St, UConn, Marquette, Cal, BC, Mich, Illinois, just to name a few of 30 schools. Good for him, hope he lands on a NCAA tournament team next year. Has to be the dumbest Ivy league rule that grad students cannot play sports, its anti academics if anything

http://www.leftydriesell.com/

He also was nominated for national defensive player of the year

Quote from: CASShould we just accept/expect losing in basketball?  Why field a team then?

Two thoughts:

1.)  Why not accept/expect losing in basketball?  We do in football.::screwy::

2.)  If we DIDN'T field BOTH basketball and football, could we pour the savings into hockey and lacrosse?::cheer::::cheer::::cheer::
         Ok, maybe a few shekels for wrestling.  But only a few.:-D

Quote from: TimV

Quote from: CASShould we just accept/expect losing in basketball?  Why field a team then?

Two thoughts:

1.)  Why not accept/expect losing in basketball?  We do in football.::screwy::

2.)  If we DIDN'T field BOTH basketball and football, could we pour the savings into hockey and lacrosse?::cheer::::cheer::::cheer::
         Ok, maybe a few shekels for wrestling.  But only a few.:-D

I suspect the Ivies make you compete in hoops and football as a condition of membership.  Clearly this is not true of all sports. (http://www.cuhockey.net/index.do)

Quote from: Trotsky

Quote from: TimV

Quote from: CASShould we just accept/expect losing in basketball?  Why field a team then?

Two thoughts:

1.)  Why not accept/expect losing in basketball?  We do in football.::screwy::

2.)  If we DIDN'T field BOTH basketball and football, could we pour the savings into hockey and lacrosse?::cheer::::cheer::::cheer::
         Ok, maybe a few shekels for wrestling.  But only a few.:-D

I suspect the Ivies make you compete in hoops and football as a condition of membership.  Clearly this is not true of all sports. (http://www.cuhockey.net/index.do)

Participate, maybe.  We haven't competed in football in a while.

Quote from: Jeff Hopkins '82

Quote from: Trotsky

Quote from: TimV

Quote from: CASShould we just accept/expect losing in basketball?  Why field a team then?

Two thoughts:

1.)  Why not accept/expect losing in basketball?  We do in football.::screwy::

2.)  If we DIDN'T field BOTH basketball and football, could we pour the savings into hockey and lacrosse?::cheer::::cheer::::cheer::
         Ok, maybe a few shekels for wrestling.  But only a few.:-D

I suspect the Ivies make you compete in hoops and football as a condition of membership.  Clearly this is not true of all sports. (http://www.cuhockey.net/index.do)

Participate, maybe.  We haven't competed in football in a while.

Tss (https://batdoc.files.wordpress.com/2012/02/archer-1-rimshot.jpg).

Quote from: Jeff Hopkins '82

Quote from: Trotsky

Quote from: TimV

Quote from: CASShould we just accept/expect losing in basketball?  Why field a team then?

Two thoughts:

1.)  Why not accept/expect losing in basketball?  We do in football.::screwy::

2.)  If we DIDN'T field BOTH basketball and football, could we pour the savings into hockey and lacrosse?::cheer::::cheer::::cheer::
         Ok, maybe a few shekels for wrestling.  But only a few.:-D

I suspect the Ivies make you compete in hoops and football as a condition of membership.  Clearly this is not true of all sports. (http://www.cuhockey.net/index.do)

Participate, maybe.  We haven't competed in football in a while.

So when do we start competing in hockey?

Nice uniforms.  But the numbers should be darker for contrast- won't show up well for TV.

Quote from: phillysportsfanMiller getting heavily recruited by Mich St, UConn, Marquette, Cal, BC, Mich, Illinois, just to name a few of 30 schools. Good for him, hope he lands on a NCAA tournament team next year. Has to be the dumbest Ivy league rule that grad students cannot play sports, its anti academics if anything

He chose UConn: http://www.courant.com/sports/uconn-mens-basketball/hc-uconn-men-shonn-miller-0419-20150418-story.html

QuoteIf it were possible, Miller said, he would have stayed at Cornell.

"I don't know why that's the rule in the first place," he said. "but I had no control over that situation."

...

Miller, who is from Euclid, Ohio, will graduate from Cornell on May 24, and he plans to begin summer courses at UConn soon after that. He said he is not sure what he will study at UConn.

I haven't been able to find out what his Cornell major is. His bio on the CU Athletics site (http://www.cornellbigred.com/roster.aspx?rp_id=37345) just says "He is enrolled in the College of Agriculture and Life Sciences."

As Columbia gets a top recruit, Cornell sinks lower.

http://nypost.com/2015/05/13/columbia-hoops-terrific-catch-could-put-them-over-the-top-in-ivy/

Quote from: Ken711As Columbia gets a top recruit, Cornell sinks lower.

http://nypost.com/2015/05/13/columbia-hoops-terrific-catch-could-put-them-over-the-top-in-ivy/

I hope he has a better experience at Columbia then the current German student at Columbia who's at the center of the "Mattress Girl" travesty.

Basketball problem solved: new assistant coach for recruiting. He replaces Marlon Sears, who accepted the head coaching position at Montclair (NJ) State last month.

Craig Carter [Rutgers '92] Named Assistant Men's Basketball Coach (http://www.cornellbigred.com/news/2015/6/17/MBB_0617151631.aspx)

Quote from: billhowardBasketball problem solved: new assistant coach for recruiting. He replaces Marlon Sears, who accepted the head coaching position at Montclair (NJ) State last month.

Craig Carter [Rutgers '92] Named Assistant Men's Basketball Coach (http://www.cornellbigred.com/news/2015/6/17/MBB_0617151631.aspx)

Holy cow. Craig Carter was the superstar basketball player as a senior when I was a freshman at Bronx Science. I don't know if we've had a scholarship D-I Men's basketball player since.

He looks more like a football player.::bolt::

Meanwhile Harvard keeps bringing in 4 star recruits.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2499170-why-a-4-star-f-decided-to-play-basketball-at-harvard-over-michigan-ohio-state

Quote from: Ken711Meanwhile Harvard keeps bringing in 4 star recruits.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2499170-why-a-4-star-f-decided-to-play-basketball-at-harvard-over-michigan-ohio-state

Back door into the Crimson Chemical Engineering program, no doubt.

Quote from: Ken711Meanwhile Harvard keeps bringing in 4 star recruits.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2499170-why-a-4-star-f-decided-to-play-basketball-at-harvard-over-michigan-ohio-state

Well, congratulations to the kid. It's nice to see someone have a good perspective on the value of college. He could have ended up with a good degree from OSU or UM, but he chose a different route. Overall it could help elevate the Ivies in other recruits eyes, but we (CU) may not be able to capitalize on it.

Quote from: Jim Hyla

Quote from: Ken711Meanwhile Harvard keeps bringing in 4 star recruits.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2499170-why-a-4-star-f-decided-to-play-basketball-at-harvard-over-michigan-ohio-state

Well, congratulations to the kid. It's nice to see someone have a good perspective on the value of college. He could have ended up with a good degree from OSU or UM, but he chose a different route. Overall it could help elevate the Ivies in other recruits eyes, but we (CU) may not be able to capitalize on it.

Agreed, my snarky comments about their engineering programs aside, I hope he makes the most of his time at Harvard.

Quote from: marty

Quote from: Jim Hyla

Quote from: Ken711Meanwhile Harvard keeps bringing in 4 star recruits.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2499170-why-a-4-star-f-decided-to-play-basketball-at-harvard-over-michigan-ohio-state

Well, congratulations to the kid. It's nice to see someone have a good perspective on the value of college. He could have ended up with a good degree from OSU or UM, but he chose a different route. Overall it could help elevate the Ivies in other recruits eyes, but we (CU) may not be able to capitalize on it.

Agreed, my snarky comments about their engineering programs aside, I hope he makes the most of his time at Harvard.

The quotations from the kid are terrific. Doesn't sound as if he needed a back door anywhere. Every year there must be a few really smart, academically qualified, 4-star recruits. Harvard seems to be cornering the market, while Cornell seems painted into a corner.

Quote from: Swampy

Quote from: marty

Quote from: Jim Hyla

Quote from: Ken711Meanwhile Harvard keeps bringing in 4 star recruits.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2499170-why-a-4-star-f-decided-to-play-basketball-at-harvard-over-michigan-ohio-state

Well, congratulations to the kid. It's nice to see someone have a good perspective on the value of college. He could have ended up with a good degree from OSU or UM, but he chose a different route. Overall it could help elevate the Ivies in other recruits eyes, but we (CU) may not be able to capitalize on it.

Agreed, my snarky comments about their engineering programs aside, I hope he makes the most of his time at Harvard.

The quotations from the kid are terrific. Doesn't sound as if he needed a back door anywhere. Every year there must be a few really smart, academically qualified, 4-star recruits. Harvard seems to be cornering the market, while Cornell seems painted into a corner.

We've gotten some pretty talented kids (we did beat Harvard this year), but it's the abysmal game coaching that holds us back more than anything.

Men's basketball picked to finish last in Ivy media poll.

Quote from: CASMen's basketball picked to finish last in Ivy media poll.

Good! This way I won't get my hopes up. ::bang::

Quote from: CASMen's basketball picked to finish last in Ivy media poll.

Bookend to the football program.

did anyone figure out if Courtney got a contract extension or what the deal is?

Quote from: Swampy

Quote from: CASMen's basketball picked to finish last in Ivy media poll.

Good! This way I won't get my hopes up. ::bang::

Never have; never would.

Back to the good old days!