Arena's men take the pitch on Monday

For those of you in need of another sport to be fanatical about -- at least for a month -- World Cup soccer starts this Friday. The US (FIFA #5) takes on the Czech Republic (#2) Monday, then Italy (#13) on the 17th. As many of you know, the team is coached by Cornell alum Bruce Arena (http://www.news.cornell.edu/stories/May06/Arena_profile.ak.html).

I'll be in Germany for the US-Ghana game, and can't wait!

Let's go USA!

Good luck Team USA! It's going to be a tough road ahead, but I believe that Arena has prepared his players well.
I for one will certainly watch all 64 matches...

How do I keep forgetting that Arena is a Cornell alum?

You might want to after that. =/

So, when do the players take the field? For the second game, maybe? Yecch.

ugarte
So, when do the players take the field? For the second game, maybe? Yecch.

Well the one plus is our team stayed standing on the field, whereas a slight breeze caused any Czech player to writhe on the ground in pain.

That certainly was a disappointing first showing. Let's hope our guys can find some desire to win against Italy. Reyna and Johnson were the only players who looked like they wanted to win. Our midfield did some nice work with the ball, but that was about it. Our strikers and offensive middies were completely ineffective, particularly with Beasley being knocked around like a pinball all game.

I'd like to see Johnson start against Italy, maybe throw Chris Albright in there for a bit more attack from the defense.

Keeping the faith for the Italy game...

kfish
Keeping the faith for the Italy game...

At this point, I think I'd be happy not to finish 24th again like in '98.

Jeff Hopkins '82

kfish
Keeping the faith for the Italy game...

At this point, I think I'd be happy not to finish 24th again like in '98.

I believe 1998 was the debut of the 32 team field and the US was in fact 32nd.

nyc94

Jeff Hopkins '82

kfish
Keeping the faith for the Italy game...

At this point, I think I'd be happy not to finish 24th again like in '98.

I believe 1998 was the debut of the 32 team field and the US was in fact 32nd.

Bad math on my part. I should have said "dead last." But you still got the point.

French Rage

ugarte
So, when do the players take the field? For the second game, maybe? Yecch.

Well the one plus is our team stayed standing on the field, whereas a slight breeze caused any Czech player to writhe on the ground in pain.

You say that as if "writhing in pain" isn't SOP in World Cup play. That was just another thing that the Czechs did better than the US.

If you absolutely have to play Beasley, put him on the left side, and if he continues to play like a total weenie, then yank him within the first twenty minutes.

The Mastroeni red card was a joke. This post is also a day late.

Also late: I expected a HOPP SCHWEIZ 90 minutes ago.

ugarte
The Mastroeni red card was a joke. This post is also a day late.

Also late: I expected a HOPP SCHWEIZ 90 minutes ago.

Agreed on the Mastroeni card. Horrible make-up call for the legit call on the Italian's blatant elbow.

Hopp Schwiitz! 2-0

(auf Schweizerdeutsch, oder "Schwiitzertuutsch", you have to say it right )

Polo Hofer, a Swiss pop-rock star from the 80's, has a song with this as a title. It is a very lively and fun tune about everything he likes about Switzerland (and all his songs are in Swiss-German except for a few French ones).

I spent the week in the Netherlands. Before our group went to dinner Friday, we assembled in a town square for cocktails (well, beer) in downtown Amsterdam an hour before the Dutch and Ivory Coast kicked off. Basically, take 3X the Lynah crowd (for that town square alone), put them in orange (it takes some getting used to), take away the handful of visitors, pour no cup of beer less than a half-liter, add air horns, add 75-degree weather ... and oh, yes, the whole city and country is rooting for your team. There was no need to watch TV to know the score.

We went in to dinner before the game ended. Our host explained, well-behaved as the Dutch out, it can be a little spooky after a World Cup game in three instances: when the Dutch lose ... sometimes when they win ... sometimes when they tie. One would not want to be in England after a match in any of those circumstances.

Hmmm.... As someone who suffered a cleats-out tackle like that in a HS soccer game and had to sit out with cast for 4 months, I feel no sympathy for Mastroeni or his red card.

However, it was great to see team USA putting up a tough fight against an overcondifent but often predictable Italy.

Edit:
Judge for yourselves. See the (IMO, reckless) Mastroeni tackle here:

min
Hmmm.... As someone who suffered a cleats-out tackle like that in a HS soccer game and had to sit out with cast for 4 months, I feel no sympathy for Mastroeni or his red card.

However, it was great to see team USA putting up a tough fight against an overcondifent but often predictable Italy.

Edit:
Judge for yourselves. See the (IMO, reckless) Mastroeni tackle here:

Yes, but isn't a sliding tackle, especially as a first time offense, a yellow card at worst?

My high school German tells me that the announcer, an apparently unbiased German, has the comments I can understand translated as follows:

"A red card!"

"Direct to a red card?? Yellow, yes... red??"

"A ______ naturally, but directly to red??"

I can't tell what he says after the replay, maybe he changed his mind, and perhaps JTW can fill us in, but I get:
"Yes, late... I think the red card is ______"


Btw, I think the one thing that turns Americans off from soccer most is the absolute theater of being 'injured'. Virutally anyone whos knocked over is pulled off on a stretcher writhing in agony, only to get the 'magic spray', and be running around fine 30 seconds later. Maybe a minute or two later tops.

Grow a pair, would ya. Soccer needs a diving call, or an 'excessive injury' call like (american footballs) excessive celebration.

I'm not sure if you mean it or not, delta, but the presumption (held by even veteran soccer analysts) that a player must receive a yellow (or a verbal caution) before getting a red card is mistaken. A reckless tackle is a reckless tackle is a reckless tackle. I don't blame the ref for making that call.

The truth is, Mastroeni didn't have to foul that Italian player. If I remember correctly, the play was still far away from the box and US just picked up some tempo in their game.

min
I'm not sure if you mean it or not, delta, but the presumption (held by even veteran soccer analysts) that a player must receive a yellow (or a verbal caution) before getting a red card is mistaken. A reckless tackle is a reckless tackle is a reckless tackle. I don't blame the ref for making that call.

The truth is, Mastroeni didn't have to foul that Italian player. If I remember correctly, the play was still far away from the box and US just picked up some tempo in their game.

First, I'm far from a soccer expert. I've watched a few world cup games every 4 years and I played in Park & Rec when I was in elementary school. Thats about my qualifications.

But I am basing what I'm saying off of the announcers during the game, the guys back in the studio afterwards, *including* an Italian commentator they had, and what I can understand of the German announcer in the video clip in this thread. It seems to be that they thought that straight to a red was too far too fast.

Yes, I understand that there's no requirement to have a yellow before a red - say, if you elbow someone in the face and leave them bleeding - but it does seem to me that it should be something of a 'flagrant foul' to go straight to a red. A slide tackle, while dangerous, appears not to meet that qualification from what I can discern of the people who know more than me.

If I wasn't at work for 95% of the matches, I'd watch and see what slide tackles usually draw. If slide tackles draw red in other game 50% of the time or so, fine. If they typically draw at least one yellow first, then the standards is that game were unfair.


P.S. I'm pretty sure had an Italian player been elbowed in the face, he would have collapsed on the field, they would have brought out a stretcher, and then an ambulance, with a few tries with the defibrilators to make a good show. After driving him to the side line and announcing a time of death, they would use some of their magic spray and he'd be back on the field 30 seconds later.

I agree with you about the theatrics. I played soccer through high school, and our team was continually one of the top-ranked in CT, winning the State Championship one year. One big reason we won all the time is because we were tougher than the other teams. We ran through everyone to win all of the 50/50 balls and sucked it up if we got hit. I will never forget one of our fullbacks catching a rocket of a freekick in the groin and actually playing the ball out before he collapsed (not saying I could ever do that or would expect anyone to). Once he caught his breath he was right back playing again. If one of us had ever acted like these crybabies our coach would probably have made us run laps while the game was still going on.

I think soccer is a great sport, and I want to enjoy watching the games, but every time a player acts like they are done for the season after a little trip or slide-tackle, I feel like shutting off the TV. If the hockey players who just finished playing for the Stanley Cup acted like many of these soccer players, there would never be more than a couple players skating at a time as the rest of them lie scattered about the ice lot carnage from a bomb blast.

The only somewhat acceptable reason I can think of for this ridiculuous behavior is because there are almost no subs in international soccer. I imagine the players take a break whenever they can. I have never been able to figure out why subs are limited, and wonder if the game would be faster with more vertical play if 8 of the players didn't have to pace themselves for the whole game.

cth95
The only somewhat acceptable reason I can think of for this ridiculuous behavior is because there are almost no subs in international soccer. I imagine the players take a break whenever they can. I have never been able to figure out why subs are limited, and wonder if the game would be faster with more vertical play if 8 of the players didn't have to pace themselves for the whole game.

Well, in soccer when you get the red card you're gone for the game and you don't get replaced unlike a two or five minute power play.

[q]DeltaOne81

Yes, but isn't a sliding tackle, especially as a first time offense, a yellow card at worst?

My high school German tells me that the announcer, an apparently unbiased German, has the comments I can understand translated as follows:

"A red card!"

"Direct to a red card?? Yellow, yes... red??"

"A ______ naturally, but directly to red??"

I can't tell what he says after the replay, maybe he changed his mind, and perhaps JTW can fill us in, but I get:
"Yes, late... I think the red card is ______"[/q]


Btw, I think the one thing that turns Americans off from soccer most is the absolute theater of being 'injured'. Virutally anyone whos knocked over is pulled off on a stretcher writhing in agony, only to get the 'magic spray', and be running around fine 30 seconds later. Maybe a minute or two later tops.
I think the TV channel shown is Swiss, so I would think the announcer is unbiased (or neutral?, sorry, I couldn't resist). I can't get every word, but on the first replay he twice says "Yeah, sure it was a hard tackle" with an inflection indicating he still doesn't think it deserved red. On the last replay though, where there is a better view of the cleats hitting the Italian's shins (which I hadn't seen in previous replays), the announcer changes his mind and inflection and says "Yeah, doch (after all), I guess red is zutreffen? (correct)"

nyc94

cth95
The only somewhat acceptable reason I can think of for this ridiculuous behavior is because there are almost no subs in international soccer. I imagine the players take a break whenever they can. I have never been able to figure out why subs are limited, and wonder if the game would be faster with more vertical play if 8 of the players didn't have to pace themselves for the whole game.

Well, in soccer when you get the red card you're gone for the game and you don't get replaced unlike a two or five minute power play.

I was just referring to subs in general. They are only allowed 3 per game so at least 8 guys have to play the whole game. I have no problem with the yellow and red card rules as long as they are given out legitimately. I'm sure, because of the harsh effect on a team of losing a player for the entire game, players embellish the fouls to try to get stronger calls. I just think that doing it is a bunch of crap. Maybe they could start giving yellow cards for exaggeration and delay of game.

Yeah, I've watched the youtube clip, which was definitely from a Swiss TV station, and the commentator was amazed that the card was red and not yellow at first, but after he saw the replay, AFAICT, he admitted the red card was called for (although I could also not make out that last adjective).

cth95
players embellish the fouls to try to get stronger calls. I just think that doing it is a bunch of crap. Maybe they could start giving yellow cards for exaggeration and delay of game.

Am I the only one that thinks Wisconsin hockey watches game film of international soccer matches?

DeltaOne81

min
Soccer needs a diving call, or an 'excessive injury' call like (american footballs) excessive celebration.

There is in fact a rule that any player diving gets a yellow card. The problem is the ref's don't use it often enough. If they were stronger with it, the game would be a lot more enjoyable. Watching the teams that don't roll around and cover their faces after the slightest touch has been much more fun than the other games.

I forget where I read it (though I think it was SkySports' website) but apparently the refs were told before the tournament to clamp down and give reds for any two-footed spikes up tackle and that's why the call on Mastroeni was made. Sure it was a makeup call, but I think most foreigners view that call as correct.

cth95
Maybe they could start giving yellow cards for exaggeration and delay of game.

They already do. Players who dive repeatedly, especially inside the penalty area, are given yellow cards.
Delay of game calls are usually given to goalkeepers, when they take their time in kicking off after the ball has gone out. However, these and other delays are normally compensated by the stoppage time that is added at the end of regulation.

Having reffed soccer for 30 years locally and played for about 30 years IMHO the "Red" was a good call - Paulo is a pro and this was way up in our offensive zone and he was obviously late and then went into the tackle with both feet cleats on and into the opposing player with no, even marginal attempt to play the ball only to take out the man - - at least in hind sight - and if you notice the referee is within 5-8 yards of the play and had a fine view and had no hesitation at all on the call!

There are occasssions where dual yellows are given one for the foul and one for the acting, diving on the same occassion. Unless overly done the diving call is one of the hardest to determine from an officials point of view.

Hope we play even better today ! GO USA!

See, its not the 'diving' so much - the fall is real. Its the acting after the fall. The writhing the pain, the bringing out of the stretcher, the being *strapped down on the stretcher*.

The fall is legit, its not a dive. Its acting up a storm afterwards though.

Short of issuing yellow cards for it, I think there should be a rule that if a person doesn't walk off the field under their own power, they must stay out of the game for 2 minutes. If they are carried off (as opposed to walking off with assistance), then they must stay off for 10 minutes. And they cannot be subbed for during that time frame (or if they are they can't return - I think thats true of subs anyway, maybe?).

That way, if you're going to act like a baby and be carried off strapped to a stretcher for a scratch, you better really need it. Otherwise, you're hurting your team.

I also think its interesting insight that perhaps they use it as an excuse to get some rest. If thats so, they should really reconsider the subbing rules, as the players are making a mockery of sport to get a time out.


Italy leads the Czech Republic 1-0, but we trail Ghana 1-0.

US ties it at 1 in the 43rd minute. Our first goal that wasn't another team's own-goal this tournament.

But Ghanna strikes back in stoppege time, apparently on a penalty kick (I assume thats what 'PEN' means)

Scores at the half:
ITA 1 0 CZE
GHA 2 1 USA

The US has 10 minutes to score 2 goals... see ya in 2010?

Bleh.

What an effin disaster. So many defensive meltdowns by so many different guys -- not just today, but the whole group stage plus all the horrific friendlies leading up to the finals. Totally depressing.

Heja Sverige!

I hate to be one of those people that blames the refs for everything, but there were so many phantom calls in that game, the worst of which was the penalty kick. No way in hell that was a good call.

At the end of the match, Ghana was taking every opportunity to drag their asses slowly off the ground. Sure they were tired, but it was excessive, and got a yellow card for it, too (not that it carries over). It's hard to blame them since they were able to get away with it, as everyone is. Instead of getting card-happy, maybe FIFA should look at improving flow to the game. The US was playing fairly well at the end but couldn't keep any momentum. At any rate, too little, too late.

Speaking of those theatrics, I think the reason everyone fell in love with that Cameroon team from 1990 is they didn't dive, didn't act, and just kept playing. Sure, they didn't know any better, but it actually made them more fun to watch.

CowbellGuy
I hate to be one of those people that blames the refs for everything

Paging Got6

redhair34

CowbellGuy
I hate to be one of those people that blames the refs for everything

Paging Got6

The ECAC sent refs to Deutschland?

Scheisse!

I like your ideas. Soccer is a physical sport with a lot of contact leading to legitimate falls, but the show many of these players put on after they go down would put them up for awards on the best soap operas. That's the crap that makes me want to change the channel.

CowbellGuy
I hate to be one of those people that blames the refs for everything...

That call sucked, but there's no need to stop there. Blame Bocanegra for clumsily booting the ball from the sideline all the way to the side of his own friggin box -- and then compounding the goof by heading his own dumbass clearing attempt right to the top of the box, where the foul took place. Unbelievable.

cth95
Scheisse!

Hopp Scheisse!

ugarte

cth95
Scheisse!

Hopp Scheisse!

wäg mit däm schiisdräck!

jtwcornell91

ugarte

cth95
Scheisse!

Hopp Scheisse!

wäg mit däm schiisdräck!

Babel Fish [babelfish.altavista.com] and I need a little

Babel Fish's German to English translation "balance with daem schiisdraeck"

"daem schiisdraeck"???

Danke!

Rita

jtwcornell91

ugarte

cth95
Scheisse!

Hopp Scheisse!

wäg mit däm schiisdräck!

Babel Fish [babelfish.altavista.com] and I need a little

Babel Fish's German to English translation "balance with daem schiisdraeck"

"daem schiisdraeck"???

Danke!

It's Schweitzerdeutsch, not "pure" German. I suspect Babelfish isn't designed for that.

I think it means "Away with the shit!" or more losely translated "Get this shit out of here!"

Right, John?

Jeff Hopkins '82

Rita

jtwcornell91

ugarte

cth95
Scheisse!

Hopp Scheisse!

wäg mit däm schiisdräck!

Babel Fish [babelfish.altavista.com] and I need a little

Babel Fish's German to English translation "balance with daem schiisdraeck"

"daem schiisdraeck"???

Danke!

It's Schweitzerdeutsch, not "pure" German. I suspect Babelfish isn't designed for that.

I think it means "Away with the shit!" or more losely translated "Get this shit out of here!"

Right, John?

Basically. I intended something like "Knock that shit off." Guess I could have said "hör uuf" instead of "wäg". And actually, I meant to say "huureschiisdräck". One of my favorite Swiss sentences was uttered by a baseball player who noticed that the outfield fence had been erected awfully far from home plate: "z'fäud isch huurelang!"

Just got back from Germany, I'm still jazzed so beware of excessive writing below.

The US team's showing was disappointing, to say the least. We were at the Ghana game, which I really thought the US could win. However, it seems we lost the gusto that we found against Italy. Our defense is too inconsistent, and our finishers (Donovan, Beasley, even McBride) couldn't finish. Also, it would have helped if the team hadn't waited until the last 15 minutes to discover Eddie Lewis almost always free on the left flank. He was behind almost all of our final, really good plays at the end of the game. The penalty call was a joke -- one German guy even apologized to another American we met, because the ref was German.

We didn't deserve to move on, which is what is most disappointing given the potential this team had. Hopfully, they'll learn a few lessons from this experience. Thank goodness for yummy, huge mugs of Bavarian Weissbier to drown away my sorrows.

A couple notes on ref'ing and diving. They both suck! The refs really should hand out way more yellow cards for the ridiculous dives. Even if they don't, they shouldn't believe everything they see. It was pretty obvious that a number of fouls were called simply as the result of good acting. That's one thing I can be be proud our team does little of (except Reyna after the Ghana goal). McBride just never stops regardless of the abuse thrown at him! I think the ref'ing in general has been pretty poor, although I certainly couldn't do better. In two games, in particular, the refs lost complete control: US vs Italy and Netherlands vs Portugal. Basically, the refs just started throwing cards left and right in failed attempts to regain control. It certainly seems as though the physical play of soccer at this level has gone from controlled and within the rules of soccer to no holds barred. Throwing elbows should not be the default when going up for a header.

Finally, the atmosphere in Germany was amazing and beyond description! We went to the fan fest in Berlin for the US/Italy and Germany/Ecuador games. The latter game was out of control. A mile stretch of area in the city park, with four GIANT screen TV's, 1/2 million fans, beer flowing freely, and me in my Ecuador shirt catching lots of s___ (smart). Almost every restaurant was showing the games in every town we visited, everyone was wearing soccer jerseys, and each night fans from the winning teams were screaming, singing, and honking their car horns like crazy. As a life-long soccer player and fan, I was in absolute heaven! Wish I were there for the semi's and final.

On diving:

Wouldn't it be pretty simple for FIFA to video review the games afterwards and start looking for players grabbing their heads when they haven't gotten elbowed and grabbing their shins when they haven't gotten slide tackled? Oh, that's right, FIFA is institutionally against any sort of video replay for games. The thing is, a few yellows handed out *after* games, causing players to miss the next game for accumulation of cards, would still have the desired effect.

Boy am I glad the f-ing Argentinians are gone. Their game with the Netherlands was a joke. England, without Owen, just didn't have the quality striking to make it through, so feel glad for the Portuguese that their usually woefully inconsistent team has finally put a run together. (It'd be like Scotland making it to the semis, in my mind.) And, finally, where did that French team all of a sudden come from? They sleep-walk their way through the first stage and then blitz Spain and pretty well dominate Brazil. Quite impressive.

Sorry, but what was about the Argentine team play at this World Cup that you didn't like? Their display of soccer was pretty remarkable (see their game against Serbia), and on numerous occasions they played much better than the other soccer powerhouses. Argentina just ran into the host team, played to their equal for 120 minutes, but did not have the instinct or the confidence to win the game at the end.

In my case, I'm glad to see that teams that didn't play well at all exit the World Cup (e.g. England, Brazil). Argentina -and to a degree Spain and Netherlands- fielded good enough teams to be in the final four, but history/God/luck/(fill in blank here) was surely not on their side.

I'm not a huge fan of Argentina, but I don't understand why their game with the Netherlands was a joke. That was simply a case of both teams making it to the next round so they sat their best players,

You may be referring to the card-fest that the Netherlands played against Portugal in the round of 16. Portugal in my mind is a mess and I'll be rooting hard against them the rest of the way- at least in the game against England, the referee caught most of the theatrics and called a fair game.

Yep, I switched the teams around for the quick comment. It was Portugal vs. los Paises Bajos that I was in a tizzy about instead. I did feel that the Argentines were doing a lot of diving and whining vs. Mexico, whom I felt had the better of play on the day and was sad to see lose.

On England vs. Portugal I quite agree: both sides were a mess and it was more a contest to see who would avoid losing. "min" above is certainly correct that neither Brazil nor England really deserved to advance, and, no matter how much it pains me to say, I was kind of glad to see a (crippled) England go. (I mean, really, Crouch as a lone striker? Laughable.) Of the ENG/POR/ECU/NED quartet, I do feel that the Dutch would've put up much more of a resistance to the French, who really dominated the game with Portugal despite the 1:0 score.

France continues to impress and I'll be rooting for them on Sunday.