OT: John Spencer :-(

Oh my lord...

[www.cnn.com]

I'm really going to miss him. The West Wing episode "Bartlet for America", which focused on Leo's alcoholism, is one of my favorites of the series.

So the place you felt this needed to go was eLF? Really? The eLynah Forum. Usually the [OT] tag means something not related to Cornell Hockey, but they usually can be somewhat germane to Cornell, hockey, Ivy League sports, or maybe Ithaca. But you heard this news about some TV actor dying, and decided the place for this was a thread on the CU hockey board.

Cool. How about some movie reviews? Or what you ate for breakfast? How about the year of a dime you found on the ground yesterday? The last thing I want on this board is the USCHO Cafe.

Sorry, I don't want to be mean about it, but c'mon.

However indelicately he may have presented his viewpoint, Rich is right. I'm a big West Wing fan, but one can't assume that the eLF is populated with West Wing fans. Basically, you should run your topic by a checklist of sorts before you post:

Does your topic regard:

1) Cornell hockey? Fire away.

2) ECAC hockey? Normally appropriate for this forum, but maybe try USCHO.

3) College hockey in general? More likely appropriate for USCHO.

3) Some other facet of Cornell? Better be important. (Use [OT].)

4) Other hockey, e.g., the NHL, juniors, or world cup? Better be important. (Use [OT].)

5) Something other than hockey or Cornell? Go somewhere else.

I suggest you head over to [forums.televisionwithoutpity.com] where John Spencer's death is being discussed and mourned at length.

Hey, we've discussed all sorts of things on here. This is a community. If you don't care, don't read or don't respond. I'm a big fan, I was shocked by it, and I thought some people might want to know and share their thoughts.

We're discussed all sorts of incredibly OT things on here. I page back there's a discussion on satellite radio. VoIP questions have been asked without rebuke. There was an "extremely OT: chuck norris facts". Sometimes we share things that are funny, or things that effect us. Or whatever went. I marked it appropriately and I don't think you could be more wrong. At the very least I think I deserve an apology for the incredibly uncalled for rude, nasty response.

He marked it OT. If you don't like the topic line, don't read the thread. It's not that difficult, folks.

A great actor, I am sad to see him pass.

As for Scersk '97 and RichH: this is not your personal forum.

How about cricket?

[Q]DeltaOne81 Wrote:
At the very least I think I deserve an apology for the incredibly uncalled for rude, nasty response.[/q]
The apology is included in my original post.

[Q]We're discussed all sorts of incredibly OT things on here. I page back there's a discussion on satellite radio. VoIP questions have been asked without rebuke. There was an "extremely OT: chuck norris facts". Sometimes we share things that are funny, or things that effect us. Or whatever went. I marked it appropriately and I don't think you could be more wrong. [/Q]
Well, I think I'm right. I have the right to my opinion, and I've expressed it. Yes, I was snarky about it, and that's what my prior apology covered. The other topics you've mentioned have bothered me as well, but your thread just happened to push me over the edge to finally say something...unlucky for you. What I have said is just that: an opinion. If my opinion really hurts you that much personally, I suggest you grow some thicker skin.

For the record: I am ridiculously against having any kind of eLynah Forum censor or "topic police." The only time I ever would like Age to delete posts/threads or have any kind of censorship is when this site is spammed or harassed to the detriment of the forum itself. DeltaOne81, you have certainly added many many MANY positive opinions relating to Cornell hockey to this forum, and I hope you continue to do so. Heck, I know I've met you personally, and have enjoyed chatting with you on the IRC channel. I just happen to disagree that discussions SO "off-topic" really belong here. There have been hundreds/thousands of "off-topic" asides within topical threads...lord knows I've contributed mightily to "thread drift." But I just couldn't see the point of starting this particular thread in this forum. If this is an unpopular opinion, so be it. I'll just lose an argument, and I'm mentally sturdy enough for that.

[Q]Hey, we've discussed all sorts of things on here. This is a community. If you don't care, don't read or don't respond. I'm a big fan, I was shocked by it, and I thought some people might want to know and share their thoughts.[/Q]
First, you're absolutely correct that I don't have to read or respond to anything I happen to think is irrelevant. I can't possibly argue that point successfully. This is an open forum, and people can and will post anything anonymously, and I support that right 100%.

But my point is that I come here for discussion about Cornell Hockey. I can get other news/discussion in countless other places on the web. If you want to conduct commentary and discussion about other things, you could create a blog. You could direct your friends here to that blog using your signature. There's a reason I don't go to the USCHO Cafe, and I don't care about what's in the HG-YBI areas. I go to the D-I USCHO Forum every so often, and I know what to expect there. Yet I've always preferred Kyle's old CHDF and now Age's eLF because the talk here stayed topical, intelligent, and there hasn't been this exclusive-community feel where "newbies" were insulted constantly and inside jokes were thrown about all the time. That's the danger of valuing the "community" over the content: the exclusivity. It's what has been hinted at by Sun writers, Tulane externs, and posters with the handle "Facetimer."

For all I care, someone could populate this forum with threads discussing Winnie the Pooh's favorite digital camera brand, or Tony Blair's preferred scone recipe. And they could label them all OT. That's great. I'll just lose interest in coming here and find some other means of tickling my CU hockey obsession. Heck...I'll say it: Age could create a "Cafe" forum here for such things. I'd even participate in it, most likely. But when the reality happened to deviate from the expectation, I decided to say something. Vilify me for it if you will, but that's how I feel. I'm pretty sure I'm not alone. Minority, maybe. But alone, no.

Heck, I'll reveal that I'm a "West Wing" fan myself. I liked John Spencer and his work a great deal. I was effected even more by the deaths of Ray Charles and Richard Pryor. But did I come to say that to my friends on eLF?

[Q]Ben Rocky 04 Wrote:
RichH: this is not your personal forum.[/Q]
Fair enough. I don't think I'm demanding or even suggesting it to be. But nor is it anyone's personal blog space.

I'll finish this much-too-long billhoward-esque post defending my position with the following parallel: How many times here on this very forum have people complained about the hated "facetimers" in Lynah turning around from the action and talking about upcoming parties, who is hooking up with whom, and what he/she said to her/him? Well, if this is e-Lynah, then I'm complaining about that exact same thing e-happening. That's all.

Firstly, Spencer played the running mate of Cornellian Jimmy Smits.


Secondly....

But my point is that I come here for discussion about Cornell Hockey.

that must explain the posts on bases-loaded walks and Fernando Tatis, Conan O'Brien's commencement speech, New York State alcohol laws, the Yankees/Red Sox baseball rivalry, the chances of the Eagles beating the Patriots, the trade of Eric Lindros, etc.

Many of us, Rich included, occasionally post on things here that are completely unrelated to the normal fare of eLF. We all concurrently understand the board's main purpose: to talk about Cornell hockey, and on the fringes, to discuss other Cornell sports, etc., as Rich outlined in his original post. But lastly, we realize that OT talk should be kept to a minimum, and that occasional interjections -- whether it's Rich wishing to do so re: Red Sox/Yanks or Fred re: John Spencer -- won't ruin the eLF.

[Q]Jordan 04 Wrote:
that must explain the posts on bases-loaded walks and Fernando Tatis, Conan O'Brien's commencement speech, New York State alcohol laws, the Yankees/Red Sox baseball rivalry, the chances of the Eagles beating the Patriots, the trade of Eric Lindros, etc.[/Q]
[Q]RichH Wrote:
There have been hundreds/thousands of "off-topic" asides within topical threads...lord knows I've contributed mightily to "thread drift." But I just couldn't see the point of starting this particular thread in this forum.[/Q]
Off-topic threads, not individual posts, are under scrutiny here. Rich isn't arguing against inevitable thread drift, but against discussions that are completely, from beginning to end, off-topic.

And, Ben Rocky 04, pardon me for trying to give the discussion a more rational edge. Call the ACLU and rat on me for trying to curtail your unfettered discourse.

The posts were on threads that were dedicated OT threads. Seems to me like responding would be an endorsement of said threads.

Anyway, this is stupid. Going to watch football. Tiki for President.

[Q]Jordan 04 Wrote:
The posts were on threads that were dedicated OT threads.
[/Q]
I'm not willing to do that much research into Rich's posting history, so you may be right.
[Q]
Anyway, this is stupid.
[/q]
Perhaps, but that's a little off-topic...

[Q]Jordan 04 Wrote:

Tiki for President.[/q]

I'm just getting back from the game, and Amen to that! Hey, you think Tiki could be elected President on West Wing? (full circle)

While it must be delightfully fun to call me a ACLU-hugging liberal, I have a better idea: why don't you not read threads you're not interested in, instead of telling people to be silent or take their thoughts elsewhere?

[Q]Ben Rocky 04 Wrote:
Why don't you not read threads you're not interested in, instead of telling people to be silent or take their thoughts elsewhere?[/q]

But I am interested in this thread. I said that already, above. In fact, it was through this thread that I first heard the news about Spencer's death. I'm a fan.

I'm also a fan of the the separation of information sources. When I come to eLynah, I expect to read specifically about Cornell hockey and, through reasonable off-topic extension and thread drift, about Cornell and hockey in general. I don't expect to come across news of a famous actor's death, a scree regarding national politics, or a study of urban land-use issues. I have other sources for those types of information. If I want the unmediated firehose, I go to Google news.

My friends will tell you that I'm a bit too easily distracted. This post on Spencer's death led me to obituaries, which got me thinking about the IMDB, etc., etc. A simple urge to see what was going on in hockey land led to a colossal waste of time. I may not be alone in this.

So, to sum up, I'm going to continue to tell people to "take their thoughts elsewhere," but I have never told people to "be silent." There are appropriate places to discuss The West Wing. I directed people towards a good place to discuss the show and Spencer's death. There, fans of the show can interact with a group of other people that are fans of the show; here, you interact with a group of people who are fans of Cornell hockey. This forum is one of the few appropriate places to discuss Cornell hockey without distraction. Let's keep it that way.

[Q]Ben Rocky 04 Wrote:
While it must be delightfully fun to call me a ACLU-hugging liberal...[/q]Well, but... you ARE an ACLU-hugging liberal.

Well.... yes..... but..... but.....

[Q]Scersk '97 Wrote:


My friends will tell you that I'm a bit too easily distracted. This post on Spencer's death led me to obituaries, which got me thinking about the IMDB, etc., etc. A simple urge to see what was going on in hockey land led to a colossal waste of time. I may not be alone in this.





Edited 1 times. Last edit at 12/18/05 02:57AM by Scersk '97.[/q]

So we're supposed to take your "attention issues" into account when choosing what we post? Geesh. How about some simple impusle control...if you can't afford "a colossal waste of time" STEP AWAY FROM THE KEYBOARD.

[Q]DisplacedCornellian Wrote:

Scersk '97 Wrote:

My friends will tell you that I'm a bit too easily distracted. This post on Spencer's death led me to obituaries, which got me thinking about the IMDB, etc., etc. A simple urge to see what was going on in hockey land led to a colossal waste of time. I may not be alone in this.


Edited 1 times. Last edit at 12/18/05 02:57AM by Scersk '97.[/Q]
So we're supposed to take your "attention issues" into account when choosing what we post? Geesh. How about some simple impusle control...if you can't afford "a colossal waste of time" STEP AWAY FROM THE KEYBOARD.
[/q]
No, all you need to consider is the point of the community. There are thousands of general interest websites and West Wing specific websites where a post about the death of Leo McGarry is appropriate (NB: He'll always be Mullaney to me). This isn't that place.

In all seriousness, how many people do you need to share this with, how many fora do you have to discuss this in, how badly do you need to get this out of you that the place you elect to do it is eLynah? Isn't there maybe a phone call you could make*? The ultimate question to ask about OOOOT postings is "Who is really the person with impulse control issues?"

* Special to Fred: I don't want you to feel that I am attacking you personally. This one post doesn't bother me all that much. I think that Rich, Scersk and I are more concerned with getting a policy established while it is a minor annoyance to some of us before it becomes a really big problem. If this becomes a general interest forum that also happens to discuss Cornell hockey, I'll walk away and wait until one of the many folks here with the web-savvy to do it starts a new, dedicated forum. Save the "no great loss" reply. I have no illusions that it would be.

 

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