Cornell vs. RPI 1/7/23

1-0 Cornell after Kempf gets his first collegiate goal

RPI video color mix is excellent. Clear distinction between cherry and Carnellian.

Iceberg
1-0 Cornell after Kempf gets his first collegiate goal

Set up by a perfect DeSantis pass as he continues to have an MVP weekend.

Best goal chance on the RPI penalty is Max Andreev.

On the other hand, the camera work is Mr. Toad's wild ride.

More DeSantis passing magic, 2-0.

Berard from Seger. Berard starting to look like he did last season. 2-0.

Q up on Harvard 2-0 already.

Jack Malone making friends.

Dirven had been having a bit of rough game anyway, but that certainly doesn't help

Seb gone, 5 minute pp for RPI.

Sebastian Dirven done for the night with game misconduct following hit to RPI player's head

Other than this, overall a great period for us

Iceberg
Dirven had been having a bit of rough game anyway, but that certainly doesn't help

Tough call for him. Dirven was going for a routine check and the RPI guy seemed to fall into him head first.

So 2 RPI goals on the 5 min PP and still over 2 minutes to go. Less than ideal.

Wow, I can’t remember us giving up 3 on a 5 min PP.

The ref didn't hesitate on that call. I guess there was nothing between him and the goaltender

scoop85
Wow, I can’t remember us giving up 3 on a 5 min PP.

I saw UNH get 4 and hit the post in a game against BU, but this is the only time I can remember us allowing 3.

I still really like us in this game, we are more crisp and we are winning the hustle battles.

Trotsky
I still really like us in this game, we are more crisp and we are winning the hustle battles.

Complete domination 5 x 5. DeSantis’ passing has been superb.

If they actually called Mitchell for closing his hand on the puck as he was about to drop and play it...Lol

This Malinski, Smolinski confusion by the announcers is hilarious

I gues Malinski is a "S. Malinski"

Iceberg
If they actually called Mitchell for closing his hand on the puck as he was about to drop and play it...Lol

Preposterous call

And we've gotten them all back.

Composite goaltending in the second period: 8 saves, 6 goals allowed.

DeSantis and Berard have both figured on every goal tonight except Zach's penalty shot.

Iceberg
The ref didn't hesitate on that call. I guess there was nothing between him and the goaltender

First successful penalty shot since the 80's or maybe the 70's??

marty

Iceberg
The ref didn't hesitate on that call. I guess there was nothing between him and the goaltender

First successful penalty shot since the 80's or maybe the 70's??

Alex Rauter in Madison Square Garden.

RPI sending 4 in, this score is going to change very soon one way or the other.

marty

Iceberg
The ref didn't hesitate on that call. I guess there was nothing between him and the goaltender

First successful penalty shot since the 80's or maybe the 70's??

History.

Donaldson on the wrap around to give us a 6-3 cushion. RPI’s defense is awful.

Before tonight, we were very successful on our penalty kill. How does having three goals scored on a major penalty affect our penalty kill rate? Not germane tonight, but in general, how is killing a five minute major accounted for? The same as a minor?
.

George64
Before tonight, we were very successful on our penalty kill. How does having three goals scored on a major penalty affect our penalty kill rate? Not germane tonight, but in general, how is killing a five minute major accounted for? The same as a minor?
.

Start with one power play opportunity. Scoring a goal starts another opportunity. So giving up 3 goals would be considered 3 goals in 4 opportunities.

Strange decision by Smith not to pull his goaltender given how RPI has looked better with a man up.

lol...

George64
Before tonight, we were very successful on our penalty kill. How does having three goals scored on a major penalty affect our penalty kill rate? Not germane tonight, but in general, how is killing a five minute major accounted for? The same as a minor?
.

Final game statistics only show RPI 1-4 on power plays! Is that the answer?
.

scoop85
Donaldson on the wrap around to give us a 6-3 cushion. RPI’s defense is awful.

Between them and Union some of the worst I've seen this year. Almost half the teams in the league seem to be plagued with defensive issues, so it'll be interesting to see how the team matches up next weekend against a BU team that should have more sound blueliners

Iceberg

scoop85
Donaldson on the wrap around to give us a 6-3 cushion. RPI’s defense is awful.

Between them and Union some of the worst I've seen this year. Almost half the teams in the league seem to be plagued with defensive issues, so it'll be interesting to see how the team matches up next weekend against a BU team that should have more sound
blueliners

Both Union and RPI backed up into the zone and let our skaters have free reign. And when we got puck deep, we were able to dominate possession.

Only negative was the PK and Shane giving up 4 goals on 14 shots. Hopefully an aberration.

George64

George64
Before tonight, we were very successful on our penalty kill. How does having three goals scored on a major penalty affect our penalty kill rate? Not germane tonight, but in general, how is killing a five minute major accounted for? The same as a minor?
.

Final game statistics only show RPI 1-4 on power plays! Is that the answer?
.

RPI game stats are screwed up. The major penalty doesn't show up at all.

ACM

George64

George64
Before tonight, we were very successful on our penalty kill. How does having three goals scored on a major penalty affect our penalty kill rate? Not germane tonight, but in general, how is killing a five minute major accounted for? The same as a minor?
.

Final game statistics only show RPI 1-4 on power plays! Is that the answer?
.

RPI game stats are screwed up. The major penalty doesn't show up at all.

I think they said on WHCU that RPI was 4 for 7 on the PP.

Jeff Hopkins '82

ACM

George64

George64
Before tonight, we were very successful on our penalty kill. How does having three goals scored on a major penalty affect our penalty kill rate? Not germane tonight, but in general, how is killing a five minute major accounted for? The same as a minor?
.

Final game statistics only show RPI 1-4 on power plays! Is that the answer?
.

RPI game stats are screwed up. The major penalty doesn't show up at all.

I think they said on WHCU that RPI was 4 for 7 on the PP.

Should be 4 x 8. We took 4 non-coincidental minors, each of which counts as 1 power-play opportunity, and RPI scored once, on the last minor. We also took the Dirven major, on which RPI scored 3 PPG, which counts as 3 goals in 4 opportunities.

ACM

Jeff Hopkins '82

ACM

George64

George64
Before tonight, we were very successful on our penalty kill. How does having three goals scored on a major penalty affect our penalty kill rate? Not germane tonight, but in general, how is killing a five minute major accounted for? The same as a minor?
.

Final game statistics only show RPI 1-4 on power plays! Is that the answer?
.

RPI game stats are screwed up. The major penalty doesn't show up at all.

I think they said on WHCU that RPI was 4 for 7 on the PP.

Should be 4 x 8. We took 4 non-coincidental minors, each of which counts as 1 power-play opportunity, and RPI scored once, on the last minor. We also took the Dirven major, on which RPI scored 3 PPG, which counts as 3 goals in 4 opportunities.

OK, that works.

never saw a good view of he major.. seemed like it was more a result of the guy having his head 4 ft off the ice than anything Dirven did..

upprdeck
never saw a good view of he major.. seemed like it was more a result of the guy having his head 4 ft off the ice than anything Dirven did..

That’s what I thought too.

Must be fun to play us and think, "OK, who's their scorer so we can stop him?"

5 (1) DeSantis
4 (5) Bancroft, Mitchell, Psenicka, Seger, Tupker
3 (5) Andreev, Berard, Mack, Malone, Penney
2 (6) Donaldson, Malinski, O'Leary, Rego, Stienburg, Wallace
1 (4) Dirven, Kempf, Kovich, Lagerstrom
0 (5) McInchak, Muzyka, O'Brien, Rayhill, Suda

21 of 26 guys have scored, and of the 5 non-scorers 3 haven't played.

Some interesting stats courtesy of Cornell:
1) First time we scored six-plus goals in consecutive games in 5 years
2) First time we had consecutive 11-goal weekends in 31 years
3) Berard is first player with four consecutive multi-point games since Barron did it to open 2019-20 season
4) On the negative side, first time we gave up four power-play goals since we gave up five to Harvard in 2006 ECAC Championship game

A few other random thoughts:
1) When was the last time we had back-to-back games where the opposing coach had to pull the starting goalie?
2) If you could combine the Union announcers and the RPI production crew you would have a great hockey broadcast!

dbilmes
Some interesting stats courtesy of Cornell:
1) First time we scored six-plus goals in consecutive games in 5 years
2) First time we had consecutive 11-goal weekends in 31 years
3) Berard is first player with four consecutive multi-point games since Barron did it to open 2019-20 season
4) On the negative side, first time we gave up four power-play goals since we gave up five to Harvard in 2006 ECAC Championship game

A few other random thoughts:
1) When was the last time we had back-to-back games where the opposing coach had to pull the starting goalie?
2) If you could combine the Union announcers and the RPI production crew you would have a great hockey broadcast!

If you look at the USCHO box it seems RPI might not have had but 1 (or 0) shot on goal in the 3rd until the Andreev penalty.

At the 15 minute mark or so I was thinking RPI might not get another SOG. The 3rd vs RPI was reminiscent of the previous night at Union.

That was a perfect weekend if you take out The Unfortunate Incident.

One of the only qualms I had about The System^TM was that with so few goals for we were always just a screw up or a fluke bounce or two away from allowing bad teams back in our games. This is No Longer the Case. This team is still quite capable of playing shut down D with a late lead, but they have enough offense to get some breathing room (or as we just saw recover from a lousy stretch). I have confidence we can win when we are favored and get ourselves to the 50/50 games in the tournies (Harvard at Placid, the NCAA 1R match up). It may not help us against clearly superior teams (Quinnipiac) but it gets us to where we need to be to exploit a bad night for them or a career performance by Shane.

I continue to be heartened and surprised that Schafer was able to retool our approach while still retaining responsible defense in all three zones, adding speed and skill to give us legitimate offensive capability. He's just a really good coach and we should appreciate these last few decades and our Silver Age.

Trotsky
One of the only qualms I had about The System^TM was that with so few goals for we were always just a screw up or a fluke bounce or two away from allowing bad teams back in our games. This is No Longer the Case. This team is still quite capable of playing shut down D with a late lead, but they have enough offense to get some breathing room (or as we just saw recover from a lousy stretch). I have confidence we can win when we are favored and get ourselves to the 50/50 games in the tournies (Harvard at Placid, the NCAA 1R match up). It may not help us against clearly superior teams (Quinnipiac) but it gets us to where we need to be to exploit a bad night for them or a career performance by Shane.

I continue to be heartened and surprised that Schafer was able to retool our approach while still retaining responsible defense in all three zones, adding speed and skill to give us legitimate offensive capability. He's just a really good coach and we should appreciate these last few decades and our Silver Age.

I was in the same boat with Schafer. It does seem like we have enough skill now that these types of games are much less stressful.

For this season specifically I'm not sure we're good/skilled enough score against the really good teams and the PP remains what I call "2 Minutes of Sadness", but the trajectory is good and I think we'll get there soon enough (at least at 5v5).

coz

Trotsky
One of the only qualms I had about The System^TM was that with so few goals for we were always just a screw up or a fluke bounce or two away from allowing bad teams back in our games. This is No Longer the Case. This team is still quite capable of playing shut down D with a late lead, but they have enough offense to get some breathing room (or as we just saw recover from a lousy stretch). I have confidence we can win when we are favored and get ourselves to the 50/50 games in the tournies (Harvard at Placid, the NCAA 1R match up). It may not help us against clearly superior teams (Quinnipiac) but it gets us to where we need to be to exploit a bad night for them or a career performance by Shane.

I continue to be heartened and surprised that Schafer was able to retool our approach while still retaining responsible defense in all three zones, adding speed and skill to give us legitimate offensive capability. He's just a really good coach and we should appreciate these last few decades and our Silver Age.

I was in the same boat with Schafer. It does seem like we have enough skill now that these types of games are much less stressful.

For this season specifically I'm not sure we're good/skilled enough score against the really good teams and the PP remains what I call "2 Minutes of Sadness", but the trajectory is good and I think we'll get there soon enough (at least at 5v5).

The PP seems to act like getting the puck to the doorstep or the center slot is itself the goal. These are high scoring places, but if the goalie is prepare and the center slot is covered, it's not like they're automatic. We pass around the outside and to the corners until there's a clear line to the crease, but unless there a cross-crease pass open, the goalie can block off that line.

We need to do a little more skating the puck from high to low and moving without the puck to make life difficult for defenders,

dbilmes
2) First time we had consecutive 11-goal weekends in 31 years

Well, AIC wasn't exactly a weekend (Thu-Fri), but hey, I'll take it.

Trotsky
I continue to be heartened and surprised that Schafer was able to retool our approach while still retaining responsible defense in all three zones, adding speed and skill to give us legitimate offensive capability. He's just a really good coach and we should appreciate these last few decades and our Silver Age.

I agree but there are two fantastic assistant coaches that need some love too.

When you listen to Jason's post game interviews with Ben and Sean it's easy to imagine a coherent team that is on a great ride together.

marty

Trotsky
I continue to be heartened and surprised that Schafer was able to retool our approach while still retaining responsible defense in all three zones, adding speed and skill to give us legitimate offensive capability. He's just a really good coach and we should appreciate these last few decades and our Silver Age.

I agree but there are two fantastic assistant coaches that need some love too.

When you listen to Jason's post game interviews with Ben and Sean it's easy to imagine a coherent team that is on a great ride together.

Do these ever get posted online anywhere?

Dafatone

coz

Trotsky
One of the only qualms I had about The System^TM was that with so few goals for we were always just a screw up or a fluke bounce or two away from allowing bad teams back in our games. This is No Longer the Case. This team is still quite capable of playing shut down D with a late lead, but they have enough offense to get some breathing room (or as we just saw recover from a lousy stretch). I have confidence we can win when we are favored and get ourselves to the 50/50 games in the tournies (Harvard at Placid, the NCAA 1R match up). It may not help us against clearly superior teams (Quinnipiac) but it gets us to where we need to be to exploit a bad night for them or a career performance by Shane.

I continue to be heartened and surprised that Schafer was able to retool our approach while still retaining responsible defense in all three zones, adding speed and skill to give us legitimate offensive capability. He's just a really good coach and we should appreciate these last few decades and our Silver Age.

I was in the same boat with Schafer. It does seem like we have enough skill now that these types of games are much less stressful.

For this season specifically I'm not sure we're good/skilled enough score against the really good teams and the PP remains what I call "2 Minutes of Sadness", but the trajectory is good and I think we'll get there soon enough (at least at 5v5).

The PP seems to act like getting the puck to the doorstep or the center slot is itself the goal. These are high scoring places, but if the goalie is prepare and the center slot is covered, it's not like they're automatic. We pass around the outside and to the corners until there's a clear line to the crease, but unless there a cross-crease pass open, the goalie can block off that line.

We need to do a little more skating the puck from high to low and moving without the puck to make life difficult for defenders,

We have been having some guys try to run the backdoor play or cycle down and then cross ice to the opposite side of the goalie. Bancroft has been pretty good at that. I can't remember if Donaldson is getting pp minutes but he seems to try to run that type of play too.

We always cheat back to make sure we don't give up the counter on a block, and blocked shots are such a huge part of today's game I think that's prudent. What we are missing is the Immovable Object who can convert those pucks that slide back into the low crease after the first chance. Max is the obvious candidate and it's not for lack of trying but he hasn't been able to convert many. We may also be suffering from Stienburg Withdrawal.

Going into the RPI game we had the #1 PP in ECAC games..

The NHL record for number of goals given up during a five-minute major is 4.

Anyone know the college hockey record?

upprdeck
Going into the RPI game we had the #1 PP in ECAC games..

And 15th nationally.

abmarks

upprdeck
Going into the RPI game we had the #1 PP in ECAC games..

And 15th nationally.

And against what I would consider our toughest opponents so far (UMD, QU, Clarkson, UConn, and Sucks) we are a cool 1 for 22. Now you can argue that was early in the season and they've gotten into a groove as they've gotten more comfortable, but the PP has to start showing up in games that we're not already dominating 5v5.


All this to say, I'll take a mediocre PP if we're consistently winning the possession battle which under Schafer we always have even when we weren't skilled enough to take advantage.

Effective special teams are a necessity when we get deep into the tourneys, though, because the great teams will find a way to exploit weakness there, and then that will live in our heads and affect our game style.

margolism
The NHL record for number of goals given up during a five-minute major is 4.

Anyone know the college hockey record?

Not sure, but I do know the record for shorthanded goals during the same penalty (3, a natural hat trick by CJ Young of Harvard, although the period break was between the first and second ones).

He set an NCAA record for the fastest three goals when he scored a hat trick in just 49 seconds, all shorthanded, in a 10-0 win over Dartmouth on December 12, 1988.

Trotsky
Effective special teams are a necessity when we get deep into the tourneys, though, because the great teams will find a way to exploit weakness there, and then that will live in our heads and affect our game style.

I meant as more of an either or choice but yeah I obviously want our PP to be good. I'm just dubious that it is.

coz

Trotsky
Effective special teams are a necessity when we get deep into the tourneys, though, because the great teams will find a way to exploit weakness there, and then that will live in our heads and affect our game style.

I meant as more of an either or choice but yeah I obviously want our PP to be good. I'm just dubious that it is.

The puck movement and tempo are solid against weak teams, but it evaporates against tough ones.

Trotsky

coz

Trotsky
Effective special teams are a necessity when we get deep into the tourneys, though, because the great teams will find a way to exploit weakness there, and then that will live in our heads and affect our game style.

I meant as more of an either or choice but yeah I obviously want our PP to be good. I'm just dubious that it is.

The puck movement and tempo are solid against weak teams, but it evaporates against tough ones.

They've had games where they can't even get the puck in the zone let alone set up. I know they've looked better recently, but the schedule has been charmin soft.

I also think that except when Barron was here I've never felt truly confident in the PP. He was a weapon who bent the shape of opposing PKs and opened up space for both himself and his teammates. We have a lot of good skilled players, but no one currently that the other team constantly has to be aware of. EDIT: Rego seems to think he's that guy sometimes but I don't think he is.

"That guy" is supposed to be Berard.

The last time we had a dominating power play was the Gallagher-Greening juggernaut. We have been flailing about since then, without consistency. It's certainly been a missing piece.

I love that we give and go now and don't always retreat behind the net. As you said, we had been getting trapped trying to move out by aggressive forechecks because we gave the opponent time to set up. We have been moving skates and getting out faster and you can see it really freaks out some teams, while others just join the battle. It makes for much better hockey to watch.

This is a much more fun team to watch than some Schafer teams of the past who had an even higher winning percentage.

Trotsky
"That guy" is supposed to be Berard.

The last time we had a dominating power play was the Gallagher-Greening juggernaut. We have been flailing about since then, without consistency. It's certainly been a missing piece.

I love that we give and go now and don't always retreat behind the net. As you said, we had been getting trapped trying to move out by aggressive forechecks because we gave the opponent time to set up. We have been moving skates and getting out faster and you can see it really freaks out some teams, while others just join the battle. It makes for much better hockey to watch.

This is a much more fun team to watch than some Schafer teams of the past who had an even higher winning percentage.

Vanderlaan and Angello's freshman year seemed like the catalyst or the first part of change in direction, that maybe not all offense is bad, just opponents offense.

Trotsky
"That guy" is supposed to be Berard.

Connor Bedard isn't eligible.

Trotsky
Effective special teams are a necessity when we get deep into the tourneys, though, because the great teams will find a way to exploit weakness there, and then that will live in our heads and affect our game style.

Our pk is phenomenal even after the 3 goal major pk Saturday. We're 3rd in the country at 90.6% behind only Dartmouth and Ohio State who are tied with 90.9%.

Plus we're ranked around 15th for fewest pim/g

I think one issue being over looked is that we have been having a new guy injured like every week it seemed. And swapping guys in and out of things like the PP are never good.. If the lineup of the core guys stays steady for awhile it probably helps

The problem with the offense, especially on the power play, is a lack of playmaking ability and vision. Positionally we are fine, we have guys who can get to the net and we have guys who can shoot it. Physically we can hold on to the puck. And we can run plays to get guys open in the slot and backdoor. But there is is so much fluidity in hockey, so many unpredictable variables, and we do not have the vision or creativity to make plays on the fly. This comes up on fast breaks, on exploiting defensive breakdowns, and all the time on the power play where there is always time and space and an open man. Other than Andreev and DeSantis, I haven’t seen much creativity and vision this year. That’s nothing new for a Cornell team; there haven’t been too many Ryan Vesces, Riley Nashes, or Cam Donaldsons over the years. But the difference is stark when you compare the crispness of our passing and the quickness of our decisionmaking with that of Harvard. Our passes all take a split second longer to get off, they’re all a little less on the tape. There are other ways to score, but they’re going to be tougher and dirtier than tic-tac-toe.

upprdeck
I think one issue being over looked is that we have been having a new guy injured like every week it seemed. And swapping guys in and out of things like the PP are never good.. If the lineup of the core guys stays steady for awhile it probably helps

That's a good point. Even though he's not having a great season, I'd rather see Stienburg getting regular ice time, for example, than someone like Kovich.

upprdeck
I think one issue being over looked is that we have been having a new guy injured like every week it seemed.

Half the time that guy is Stienburg. Very few players have been as hampered by so many different injuries.

But we did get through an entire weekend without anybody getting hurt. Bâby steps.

is creativity the real issue on the PP.. I saw a ton of nice plays this weekend on the PP. Not that the all lead to goals or chances. But we passed around very little, we changed direction, we swapped spots.. we went back door we went cross ice, we passed thru the middle.

Again how much of any PP success is good offense vs bad defense? without comparing puck movement to other teams, which very few watch outside of our own games, how do we know ours is bad. We have several games with great movement and chances and no scores, sometimes we miss chances and sometimes the D makes a good play and sometimes its us being bad, and sometimes the goalie just makes a good save. .. Great movement doesnt always mean the goalie is not going to do his job.

On creativity and movement i like what i see so far from bancroft, seger and, tbh, o'leary who i am surprised sits as much as he does. Andreev would be better if he tried to do less himself and used his skating to set up passes but this has been true for years and imo his injuries have really hurt his development.

BearLover
Other than Andreev and DeSantis, I haven’t seen much creativity and vision this year

Bancroft has made some slick, creative passes. He's one to watch creativity wise