Polls

this is all the short term goal.. if these sports become about the 10-15 who can actually win it then why do the others bother to play the game and when that happens 90% of the kids lose scholies and chances to perform and make pro money.

While even now NCAAF is really about the top 10 who can win it all there are still 20-30 who can compete but given the non level playing field that NIL creates how long before they decide to bail. And then all the investment in stadiums and all the TV Money goes away.

In hockey you have the top few but even the bottom 30% can still win games and a team like Colgate can get to the playoffs.

I just want to hear a few players sing the East Hill Car Wash jingle on whcu. Is that so wrong?

Dafatone
I just want to hear a few players sing the East Hill Car Wash jingle on whcu. Is that so wrong?

THIS

upprdeck
because thats now how NIL is working

a person playing for Cornell might have X value promoting NIL but if a booster wants cornell to win he spends Y value to bring in a better player(s). There is no attempt to recoop the NIL value.

the satisfaction of winning IS the NIL value

yup.. so team like mich/osu/tex/ok that are spending 5-10-15 million on NIL how long does that go on.. I suppose with enough money it goes on for awhile..

shafer

Dafatone
I just want to hear a few players sing the East Hill Car Wash jingle on whcu. Is that so wrong?

THIS

Yeah I mean ignoring the actual moral/financial/other-meaningful implications of NIL stuff, I would probably feel a lot different about it if it meant a LOT more college players involved in low-budget local commercials nationwide, rather than just a bunch of NIL collectives where they don't do anything appearance-wise for it.

French Rage

shafer

Dafatone
I just want to hear a few players sing the East Hill Car Wash jingle on whcu. Is that so wrong?

THIS

Yeah I mean ignoring the actual moral/financial/other-meaningful implications of NIL stuff, I would probably feel a lot different about it if it meant a LOT more college players involved in low-budget local commercials nationwide, rather than just a bunch of NIL collectives where they don't do anything appearance-wise for it.

Jake from State Farm and his NFL/NBA buddies are East Hill Car Wash on a larger stage. The stupefying dullness of onetime sports legends, current legends, annoying people (Flo, the Mayhem Guy, the Farmers' Insurance man in brown), the Lemu Emu, they all say: Insurance is a commodity, may as well shop on price and fallback to having a lawyer ready if a major claim doesn't get paid.

billhoward

French Rage

shafer

Dafatone
I just want to hear a few players sing the East Hill Car Wash jingle on whcu. Is that so wrong?

THIS

Yeah I mean ignoring the actual moral/financial/other-meaningful implications of NIL stuff, I would probably feel a lot different about it if it meant a LOT more college players involved in low-budget local commercials nationwide, rather than just a bunch of NIL collectives where they don't do anything appearance-wise for it.

Jake from State Farm and his NFL/NBA buddies are East Hill Car Wash on a larger stage. The stupefying dullness of onetime sports legends, current legends, annoying people (Flo, the Mayhem Guy, the Farmers' Insurance man in brown), the Lemu Emu, they all say: Insurance is a commodity, may as well shop on price and fallback to having a lawyer ready if a major claim doesn't get paid.

The Mayhem Guy doesn't belong in that list. He's the best.

TimV

billhoward

French Rage

shafer

Dafatone
I just want to hear a few players sing the East Hill Car Wash jingle on whcu. Is that so wrong?

THIS

Yeah I mean ignoring the actual moral/financial/other-meaningful implications of NIL stuff, I would probably feel a lot different about it if it meant a LOT more college players involved in low-budget local commercials nationwide, rather than just a bunch of NIL collectives where they don't do anything appearance-wise for it.

Jake from State Farm and his NFL/NBA buddies are East Hill Car Wash on a larger stage. The stupefying dullness of onetime sports legends, current legends, annoying people (Flo, the Mayhem Guy, the Farmers' Insurance man in brown), the Lemu Emu, they all say: Insurance is a commodity, may as well shop on price and fallback to having a lawyer ready if a major claim doesn't get paid.

The Mayhem Guy doesn't belong in that list. He's the best.

Maybe it's generational. I like him, too. And yet I've been of the belief that Allstate is a borderline criminal enterprise. Great timing and a great face for the role.

TimV
The Mayhem Guy doesn't belong in that list. He's the best.

Lifetime pass for being in John Wick.

Numerous D-1 college athletic programs have ignored academic standards while enrolling athletes, yet their school's academic programs have survived. College athletes generate piles of cash to fund higher education, and seldom is there any mention of academic failure of students recruited for their physical rather than mental ability.

TimV
The Mayhem Guy doesn't belong in that list. He's the best.

Agreed!
.

osorojo
Numerous D-1 college athletic programs have ignored academic standards while enrolling athletes, yet their school's academic programs have survived. College athletes generate piles of cash to fund higher education, and seldom is there any mention of academic failure of students recruited for their physical rather than mental ability.

But the Ivies fetishized it.

Anybody who taught or even TAed at Duke and Stanford knows how laughable their claims are that their athletes are serious students. They survive in large part because the gen pop does not care and ESPN et al willingly repeat bullshit stories of them "doing it the right way" uncritically because, again, they don't care.

The Ivies have a lot less room because undercutting their athletes is a tangible part of their designer label. It would be much harder for us to get away with cheating because, unlike those other factory schools, there is a lot of media interest in catching us out when we are hypocritical.

Which is good. It just makes it harder for us to sneak absolute derps through our athletic programs.

Not that we haven't -- we just do it maybe 20% of the time as opposed to the "quality" schools where it's 50% or the SEC where it's an admission requirement.

Mostly we cheat for daddy's money, not a blue chippah slap shot. Dammit.

osorojo
Numerous D-1 college athletic programs have ignored academic standards while enrolling athletes, yet their school's academic programs have survived. College athletes generate piles of cash to fund higher education, and seldom is there any mention of academic failure of students recruited for their physical rather than mental ability.

I'm not sure how accurate this is. University of Florida's football team's budget is over $90M, yet ordinary students complain about their facilities:

https://www.alligator.org/article/2022/09/football-complex
Olivia Giovenco, a 19-year-old English sophomore, recalls hearing about the horrors of living in disheveled dorms like Rawlings Hall. In her view, it’s unfair that the university prioritizes the well-being of a small percentage of students over the entire student body, she said.

And to extrapolate Trotsky's statement about Duke and Stanford, anybody who's even sat it a classroom at a factory school that's not among the so-called "elite," like Duke or Stanford -- "weathervane schools," for example -- knows how laughable their claims are that even the majority of their ordinary students are serious students.

The quality or lack of in Olivia Giovenco's dorm at U Florida is not going to lure prospective students. There were problems with mold related sickness. Other students said they were happy with that diagnosis b/c it meant: We don't have Covid.

Maybe Gov. DiSantis can allocate more funds for better residential living there.

Swampy
And to extrapolate Trotsky's statement about Duke and Stanford, anybody who's even sat it a classroom at a factory school that's not among the so-called "elite," like Duke or Stanford -- "weathervane schools," for example -- knows how laughable their claims are that even the majority of their ordinary students are serious students.

OTOH, the most serious students I've ever seen at any school are Community College students, because they're paying out of their own pocket. If you're studying Philosophy at a CC it's because you fucking want it. it's not just a credential you're picking up between frat parties on your way to working at Dad's firm.

Trotsky
OTOH, the most serious students I've ever seen at any school are Community College students, because they're paying out of their own pocket. If you're studying Philosophy at a CC it's because you fucking want it. it's not just a credential you're picking up between frat parties on your way to working at Dad's firm.

I can think of quite a few people at Cornell who came from a CC, were fine students, and are doing quite well for themselves now

Iceberg

Trotsky
OTOH, the most serious students I've ever seen at any school are Community College students, because they're paying out of their own pocket. If you're studying Philosophy at a CC it's because you fucking want it. it's not just a credential you're picking up between frat parties on your way to working at Dad's firm.

I can think of quite a few people at Cornell who came from a CC, were fine students, and are doing quite well for themselves now

I was gonna say, another reason CCs are full of serious students is that many of them are working up to transfer to a four-year college for the last two years of a bachelor's degree.

jtwcornell91

Iceberg

Trotsky
OTOH, the most serious students I've ever seen at any school are Community College students, because they're paying out of their own pocket. If you're studying Philosophy at a CC it's because you fucking want it. it's not just a credential you're picking up between frat parties on your way to working at Dad's firm.

I can think of quite a few people at Cornell who came from a CC, were fine students, and are doing quite well for themselves now

I was gonna say, another reason CCs are full of serious students is that many of them are working up to transfer to a four-year college for the last two years of a bachelor's degree.

It's also really smart from a financial standpoint!

Trotsky

Swampy
And to extrapolate Trotsky's statement about Duke and Stanford, anybody who's even sat it a classroom at a factory school that's not among the so-called "elite," like Duke or Stanford -- "weathervane schools," for example -- knows how laughable their claims are that even the majority of their ordinary students are serious students.

OTOH, the most serious students I've ever seen at any school are Community College students, because they're paying out of their own pocket. If you're studying Philosophy at a CC it's because you fucking want it. it's not just a credential you're picking up between frat parties on your way to working at Dad's firm.

Do you think this is also true of someone studying marketing?

Swampy

Trotsky

Swampy
And to extrapolate Trotsky's statement about Duke and Stanford, anybody who's even sat it a classroom at a factory school that's not among the so-called "elite," like Duke or Stanford -- "weathervane schools," for example -- knows how laughable their claims are that even the majority of their ordinary students are serious students.

OTOH, the most serious students I've ever seen at any school are Community College students, because they're paying out of their own pocket. If you're studying Philosophy at a CC it's because you fucking want it. it's not just a credential you're picking up between frat parties on your way to working at Dad's firm.

Do you think this is also true of someone studying marketing?

No. They suck.

so many myths in this thread ...

at the risk of being accused of being a shill for the NCAA ... the average NCAA athlete's academic performance is superior to the general population.

As I've said high and wide everywhere I can and will continue to say it ...

Those advocating for "students rights" and "fu** those who have been hoarding the money" -- ought to be VERY careful what they wish for. The entire system of college sports is about to fall apart -- in particular once the Supreme Court rules that athletes are "employees" ... a preposterous notion to me. You may say "great, the NCAA sucks" -- except that it doesn't suck for 99% of the athletes across all sports and divisions whose programs aren't making any money, and whose student-athletes are getting great opportunities.

If you want that all to go away in the name of "students rights to make money"" -- have at it. But know what you're wishing for.

adamw
the average NCAA athlete's academic performance is superior to the general population.

Huh. Where there is great institutional pressure to keep athletes eligible, they get better grades than other students. Go figure.

Next you'll be saying Prep School kids get better grades than students at public high schools. I just cannot imagine why.

adamw
so many myths in this thread ...

at the risk of being accused of being a shill for the NCAA ... the average NCAA athlete's academic performance is superior to the general population.

As I've said high and wide everywhere I can and will continue to say it ...

Those advocating for "students rights" and "fu** those who have been hoarding the money" -- ought to be VERY careful what they wish for. The entire system of college sports is about to fall apart -- in particular once the Supreme Court rules that athletes are "employees" ... a preposterous notion to me. You may say "great, the NCAA sucks" -- except that it doesn't suck for 99% of the athletes across all sports and divisions whose programs aren't making any money, and whose student-athletes are getting great opportunities.

If you want that all to go away in the name of "students rights to make money"" -- have at it. But know what you're wishing for.

On one hand, I'm generally on the side you describe. At the very least, I think we don't need rules for what students can do, and if that means the richest schools shovel piles of money at the best athletes, so be it. Cracking down on students because they tried to release a rap album or whatever is bad.

On the other hand, as I understand it, the NCAA isn't really a "thing." They're just the schools. Every time you hear someone describing the NCAA as greedy, they're just talking about the schools. I don't think there's a big vault full of cash that belongs to the NCAA.

Dafatone
On the other hand, as I understand it, the NCAA isn't really a "thing." They're just the schools. Every time you hear someone describing the NCAA as greedy, they're just talking about the schools. I don't think there's a big vault full of cash that belongs to the NCAA.

I think of it as an industry lobby like the AMA, NRA, or the Chamber of Commerce. The NC$$ was formed to evade federal regulation, and like any trade organization they exist to further the interests of their most powerful brokers while fucking the life out of everyone else involved. So while it's true that the NC$$ is not itself a thing that is getting rich, it is the sock puppet of those who are getting very rich. And as such an entity, it is utterly without conscience or morals or any other guidance than the benefit of those who can swing it as a cudgel.

Dafatone
On the other hand, as I understand it, the NCAA isn't really a "thing." They're just the schools. Every time you hear someone describing the NCAA as greedy, they're just talking about the schools. I don't think there's a big vault full of cash that belongs to the NCAA.

I agree - I tell people this all the time as well. "The NCAA" is shorthand. If you know it's shorthand, it's fine. When people seem to think there's some "college sports poobah out there doing evil things" - that's when it's wrong.

Trotsky

adamw
the average NCAA athlete's academic performance is superior to the general population.

Huh. Where there is great institutional pressure to keep athletes eligible, they get better grades than other students. Go figure.

Next you'll be saying Prep School kids get better grades than students at public high schools. I just cannot imagine why.

This is all true. It doesn't take away from the point, however.

TimV

billhoward

French Rage

shafer

Dafatone
I just want to hear a few players sing the East Hill Car Wash jingle on whcu. Is that so wrong?

THIS

Yeah I mean ignoring the actual moral/financial/other-meaningful implications of NIL stuff, I would probably feel a lot different about it if it meant a LOT more college players involved in low-budget local commercials nationwide, rather than just a bunch of NIL collectives where they don't do anything appearance-wise for it.

Jake from State Farm and his NFL/NBA buddies are East Hill Car Wash on a larger stage. The stupefying dullness of onetime sports legends, current legends, annoying people (Flo, the Mayhem Guy, the Farmers' Insurance man in brown), the Lemu Emu, they all say: Insurance is a commodity, may as well shop on price and fallback to having a lawyer ready if a major claim doesn't get paid.

The Mayhem Guy doesn't belong in that list. He's the best.

Can we all just agree that the Geico Hump Day commercial is one of the greatest of all time? It makes me laugh everytime. Hump Daaaaay!

Roy 82

TimV

billhoward

French Rage

shafer

Dafatone
I just want to hear a few players sing the East Hill Car Wash jingle on whcu. Is that so wrong?

THIS

Yeah I mean ignoring the actual moral/financial/other-meaningful implications of NIL stuff, I would probably feel a lot different about it if it meant a LOT more college players involved in low-budget local commercials nationwide, rather than just a bunch of NIL collectives where they don't do anything appearance-wise for it.

Jake from State Farm and his NFL/NBA buddies are East Hill Car Wash on a larger stage. The stupefying dullness of onetime sports legends, current legends, annoying people (Flo, the Mayhem Guy, the Farmers' Insurance man in brown), the Lemu Emu, they all say: Insurance is a commodity, may as well shop on price and fallback to having a lawyer ready if a major claim doesn't get paid.

The Mayhem Guy doesn't belong in that list. He's the best.

Can we all just agree that the Geico Hump Day commercial is one of the greatest of all time? It makes me laugh everytime. Hump Daaaaay!

The best part is they didn't beat it to death. One commercial, one gag. No sequels.