Vote Barron for Hobey

Fan voting doesn't count for a ton, but it's worth a try.

[www.hobeybaker.com]

"Barron has reached 30 points in each of his first three seasons."

Nope.

I am trying not to get excited by this.

Trotsky
I am trying not to get excited by this.

so-youre-telling-me-theres-a-chance-34480127.png

wouldn't he have the option of free agency if he doesn't sign and returns to school? can't see the Rangers letting him get that far given his upside as a cheap depth player for them.

He should come back, win the national title and the Hobey, and write his own ticket. I am only thinking entirely of his benefit...

Trotsky
I am trying not to get excited by this.

so-youre-telling-me-theres-a-chance-34480127.png

Interesting tidbit in that article:.
"One area that Barron, a center, needs to work on is faceoffs. This season, he won only 103 of 284 draws, a mediocre 36% success ratio. In fact, in 30 games he never won more draws than he lost."

abmarks


Interesting tidbit in that article:.
"One area that Barron, a center, needs to work on is faceoffs. This season, he won only 103 of 284 draws, a mediocre 36% success ratio. In fact, in 30 games he never won more draws than he lost."

Very interesting, considering:
1. We only played 29 games this season.
2. According to the stats handed out at the Clarkson game, Barron's faceoff record in the season's first 28 games was 95 wins, 73 losses, for a .565 percentage. (He was 2x5 vs. Clarkson, so final totals of 97-76, .561.)
3. Barron's a left wing, not a center.

ACM

abmarks


Interesting tidbit in that article:.
"One area that Barron, a center, needs to work on is faceoffs. This season, he won only 103 of 284 draws, a mediocre 36% success ratio. In fact, in 30 games he never won more draws than he lost."

Very interesting, considering:
1. We only played 29 games this season.
2. According to the stats handed out at the Clarkson game, Barron's faceoff record in the season's first 28 games was 95 wins, 73 losses, for a .565 percentage. (He was 2x5 vs. Clarkson, so final totals of 97-76, .561.)
3. Barron's a left wing, not a center.

Best to you Art,

How is Wegman's holding up? I will order a virtual Sui in an attempt to keep the Shortstop open. Also feeling bad for The Boathouse and The Antlers.

ACM

abmarks


Interesting tidbit in that article:.
"One area that Barron, a center, needs to work on is faceoffs. This season, he won only 103 of 284 draws, a mediocre 36% success ratio. In fact, in 30 games he never won more draws than he lost."

Very interesting, considering:
1. We only played 29 games this season.
2. According to the stats handed out at the Clarkson game, Barron's faceoff record in the season's first 28 games was 95 wins, 73 losses, for a .565 percentage. (He was 2x5 vs. Clarkson, so final totals of 97-76, .561.)
3. Barron's a left wing, not a center.

other than that, though,

These kinds of articles pop up a lot when players are negotiating contracts. The articles usually aren't signed.

osorojo
These kinds of articles pop up a lot when players are negotiating contracts. The articles usually aren't signed.

Exactly.

Stan Fischler (PBUH) made an entire career out of laundering stuff like this for the clubs.

Trotsky

osorojo
These kinds of articles pop up a lot when players are negotiating contracts. The articles usually aren't signed.

Exactly.

Stan Fischler (PBUH) made an entire career out of laundering stuff like this for the clubs.

Ok, I looked up PBUH. Why the reference to Fischler?

scoop85

Trotsky

osorojo
These kinds of articles pop up a lot when players are negotiating contracts. The articles usually aren't signed.

Exactly.

Stan Fischler (PBUH) made an entire career out of laundering stuff like this for the clubs.

Ok, I looked up PBUH. Why the reference to Fischler?

He is one of the Rushmore figures of hockey journalism. A friend of mine (and a once contributor here in fact) PA'ed for him and he really was A Giant Who Shat Marble.

He was the classic Annoying, Irascible New York Jew, making Larry David look friendly, and he churned out metric tons of stuff which means 90% of it was crap (hey, I had a musicologist tell me 90% of Mozart is elevator music cuz that's what you get for a penny a word). And as mentioned he fellated the owners for his daily bread -- access journalism. A complex guy. Certainly one of the greats, but not without faults.

As are we all.

Trotsky

scoop85

Trotsky

osorojo
These kinds of articles pop up a lot when players are negotiating contracts. The articles usually aren't signed.

Exactly.

Stan Fischler (PBUH) made an entire career out of laundering stuff like this for the clubs.

Ok, I looked up PBUH. Why the reference to Fischler?

He is one of the Rushmore figures of hockey journalism. A friend of mine (and a once contributor here in fact) PA'ed for him and he really was A Giant Who Shat Marble.

He was the classic Annoying, Irascible New York Jew, making Larry David look friendly, and he churned out metrics tons of stuff which means 90% of it was crap (hey, I had a musicologist tell me 90% of Mozart is elevator music cuz that's what you get for a penny a word). And as mentioned he fellated the owners for his daily bread -- access journalism. A complex guy. Certainly one of the greats, but not without faults.

As are we all.

Never one of my favorite hockey writers. He seemed more impressed with himself than the people he wrote about.

Jeff Hopkins '82

Trotsky

scoop85

Trotsky

osorojo
These kinds of articles pop up a lot when players are negotiating contracts. The articles usually aren't signed.

Exactly.

Stan Fischler (PBUH) made an entire career out of laundering stuff like this for the clubs.

Ok, I looked up PBUH. Why the reference to Fischler?

He is one of the Rushmore figures of hockey journalism. A friend of mine (and a once contributor here in fact) PA'ed for him and he really was A Giant Who Shat Marble.

He was the classic Annoying, Irascible New York Jew, making Larry David look friendly, and he churned out metrics tons of stuff which means 90% of it was crap (hey, I had a musicologist tell me 90% of Mozart is elevator music cuz that's what you get for a penny a word). And as mentioned he fellated the owners for his daily bread -- access journalism. A complex guy. Certainly one of the greats, but not without faults.

As are we all.

Never one of my favorite hockey writers. He seemed more impressed with himself than the people he wrote about.

Have you met:

Keith Obermann
Erin Andrews
Dan Shaughnessy
Bob Ryan
Dick Young
Peter Gammons
Tony Kornheiser
Bryant Gumbel
Michael Wilbon
David Brooks
George Will
Stephen A. Smith
Marv Albert
Mitch Albom
Peter King
Chris Berman

The entire industry has NPD. Fischler was a prick, too, but at least he did the work.

Trotsky

scoop85

Trotsky

osorojo
These kinds of articles pop up a lot when players are negotiating contracts. The articles usually aren't signed.

Exactly.

Stan Fischler (PBUH) made an entire career out of laundering stuff like this for the clubs.

Ok, I looked up PBUH. Why the reference to Fischler?

He is one of the Rushmore figures of hockey journalism. A friend of mine (and a once contributor here in fact) PA'ed for him and he really was A Giant Who Shat Marble.

He was the classic Annoying, Irascible New York Jew, making Larry David look friendly, and he churned out metric tons of stuff which means 90% of it was crap (hey, I had a musicologist tell me 90% of Mozart is elevator music cuz that's what you get for a penny a word). And as mentioned he fellated the owners for his daily bread -- access journalism. A complex guy. Certainly one of the greats, but not without faults.

As are we all.

AFAIK Fischler is still alive and kicking

Trotsky

Jeff Hopkins '82

Trotsky

scoop85

Trotsky

osorojo
These kinds of articles pop up a lot when players are negotiating contracts. The articles usually aren't signed.

Exactly.

Stan Fischler (PBUH) made an entire career out of laundering stuff like this for the clubs.

Ok, I looked up PBUH. Why the reference to Fischler?

He is one of the Rushmore figures of hockey journalism. A friend of mine (and a once contributor here in fact) PA'ed for him and he really was A Giant Who Shat Marble.

He was the classic Annoying, Irascible New York Jew, making Larry David look friendly, and he churned out metrics tons of stuff which means 90% of it was crap (hey, I had a musicologist tell me 90% of Mozart is elevator music cuz that's what you get for a penny a word). And as mentioned he fellated the owners for his daily bread -- access journalism. A complex guy. Certainly one of the greats, but not without faults.

As are we all.

Never one of my favorite hockey writers. He seemed more impressed with himself than the people he wrote about.

Have you met:

Keith Obermann
Erin Andrews
Dan Shaughnessy
Bob Ryan
Dick Young
Peter Gammons
Tony Kornheiser
Bryant Gumbel
Michael Wilbon
David Brooks
George Will
Stephen A. Smith
Marv Albert
Mitch Albom
Peter King
Chris Berman

The entire industry has NPD. Fischler was a prick, too, but at least he did the work.

Fisch-face was being a dick long before most of those guys could write.

Jeff Hopkins '82

Trotsky

Jeff Hopkins '82

Trotsky

scoop85

Trotsky

osorojo
These kinds of articles pop up a lot when players are negotiating contracts. The articles usually aren't signed.

Exactly.

Stan Fischler (PBUH) made an entire career out of laundering stuff like this for the clubs.

Ok, I looked up PBUH. Why the reference to Fischler?

He is one of the Rushmore figures of hockey journalism. A friend of mine (and a once contributor here in fact) PA'ed for him and he really was A Giant Who Shat Marble.

He was the classic Annoying, Irascible New York Jew, making Larry David look friendly, and he churned out metrics tons of stuff which means 90% of it was crap (hey, I had a musicologist tell me 90% of Mozart is elevator music cuz that's what you get for a penny a word). And as mentioned he fellated the owners for his daily bread -- access journalism. A complex guy. Certainly one of the greats, but not without faults.

As are we all.

Never one of my favorite hockey writers. He seemed more impressed with himself than the people he wrote about.

Have you met:

Keith Obermann
Erin Andrews
Dan Shaughnessy
Bob Ryan
Dick Young
Peter Gammons
Tony Kornheiser
Bryant Gumbel
Michael Wilbon
David Brooks
George Will
Stephen A. Smith
Marv Albert
Mitch Albom
Peter King
Chris Berman

The entire industry has NPD. Fischler was a prick, too, but at least he did the work.

Fisch-face was being a dick long before most of those guys could write.

Half of them still can't.

Obermann (one of the few who can) is excellent in Bojack Horseman, apropos of nothing.

Trotsky

Jeff Hopkins '82

Trotsky

Jeff Hopkins '82

Trotsky

scoop85

Trotsky

osorojo
These kinds of articles pop up a lot when players are negotiating contracts. The articles usually aren't signed.

Exactly.

Stan Fischler (PBUH) made an entire career out of laundering stuff like this for the clubs.

Ok, I looked up PBUH. Why the reference to Fischler?

He is one of the Rushmore figures of hockey journalism. A friend of mine (and a once contributor here in fact) PA'ed for him and he really was A Giant Who Shat Marble.

He was the classic Annoying, Irascible New York Jew, making Larry David look friendly, and he churned out metrics tons of stuff which means 90% of it was crap (hey, I had a musicologist tell me 90% of Mozart is elevator music cuz that's what you get for a penny a word). And as mentioned he fellated the owners for his daily bread -- access journalism. A complex guy. Certainly one of the greats, but not without faults.

As are we all.

Never one of my favorite hockey writers. He seemed more impressed with himself than the people he wrote about.

Have you met:

Keith Obermann
Erin Andrews
Dan Shaughnessy
Bob Ryan
Dick Young
Peter Gammons
Tony Kornheiser
Bryant Gumbel
Michael Wilbon
David Brooks
George Will
Stephen A. Smith
Marv Albert
Mitch Albom
Peter King
Chris Berman

The entire industry has NPD. Fischler was a prick, too, but at least he did the work.

Fisch-face was being a dick long before most of those guys could write.

Half of them still can't.

Obermann (one of the few who can) is excellent in Bojack Horseman, apropos of nothing.

Olbermann, FWIW.

Trotsky

osorojo
These kinds of articles pop up a lot when players are negotiating contracts. The articles usually aren't signed.

Exactly.

Stan Fischler (PBUH) made an entire career out of laundering stuff like this for the clubs.

I remember listening to an interview with Fischler on WBZ radio in Boston the night of the Esposito for Ratelle and Park trade (I was living in Southern NH at the time, have moved there in July for NY). Fischler went on and on about what a steal the trade was for the Rangers and how Boston get fleeced in the deal. At that point it became obvious to me that he likes to talk and has no clue what's really happening on the ice. Esposito was a great scorer but had little inclination to worry about the defensive half of the ice. Ratelle was a better skater, better passer and a two-way player, and even if he wasn't as good as Espo, Brad Park was arguably the 2nd best defensemen in the league to Bobby Orr. I told my co-workers, particularly the Bruins fans that were bemoaning the loss of Espo, that they would find out they easily got the best of the deal. After hearing that interview, I never took Fischler seriously.

As a footnote: I think Orr and Park only played about 5 games together, as Orr was hurt most of that season, and the Orr got traded to the Blackhawks where he barely played for a couple of seasons before having to retire.

Fischler has merely been around the New York hockey media scene for a long time. I never got the impresssion that he was a seriously knowledgeable hockey analyst, but in NYC there hasn't historically been a high standard in that regard.

Beeeej
Olbermann, FWIW.

That you, Keith?

Alex Whelan (RW) of Quinnipiac signed with the Rangers organization. Perhaps Barron will stay? 0.0?

blackwidow
Alex Whelan (RW) of Quinnipiac signed with the Rangers organization. Perhaps Barron will stay? 0.0?

Here's hoping!!

its not as long as shot as some might think.

If I were him, no rush to make up my mind since there isn't anywhere to play at the moment.

If by the end of the summer the pro teams are ready to play again, I'd assume he goes pro.

But if it looks like no hockey restarts anywhere until January 1 (and assuming there is still an NCAA season to be played) it could be a much different choice.

abmarks
If I were him, no rush to make up my mind since there isn't anywhere to play at the moment.

If by the end of the summer the pro teams are ready to play again, I'd assume he goes pro.

But if it looks like no hockey restarts anywhere until January 1 (and assuming there is still an NCAA season to be played) it could be a much different choice.

Smartest thought so far. Why leave school if you don't have anywhere else to go? Even if he signs up for the fall term and then the pros start, he can leave.

The only thing that could change the thoughts for me would be if his situation, draft, Rangers, etc. would change with time.

I don't know enough about the pro draft and signings to know whether his situation changes over time.

Anyone out there know the rules enough to help me?

Jim Hyla

abmarks
If I were him, no rush to make up my mind since there isn't anywhere to play at the moment.

If by the end of the summer the pro teams are ready to play again, I'd assume he goes pro.

But if it looks like no hockey restarts anywhere until January 1 (and assuming there is still an NCAA season to be played) it could be a much different choice.

Smartest thought so far. Why leave school if you don't have anywhere else to go? Even if he signs up for the fall term and then the pros start, he can leave.

The only thing that could change the thoughts for me would be if his situation, draft, Rangers, etc. would change with time.

I don't know enough about the pro draft and signings to know whether his situation changes over time.

Anyone out there know the rules enough to help me?

If Barron doesn't sign before the end of his senior season he becomes a free agent. So if the Rangers see him as a likely part of their future, they have real incentive to sign him before his senior year.

if you trust you will get better then you can stay as a FA and get a better deal. If you dont and Pro means more than a shot at a NC with your friends then you go.

There are times where its clear he is the best player on the ice.. But there are also those periods where you wonder did he even skate a shift.

It may also depend on just what kind of deal he had for Aid at Cornell.. How much debt is he in.

We dont know even know if there will be real school next yr at this point

scoop85

Jim Hyla

abmarks
If I were him, no rush to make up my mind since there isn't anywhere to play at the moment.

If by the end of the summer the pro teams are ready to play again, I'd assume he goes pro.

But if it looks like no hockey restarts anywhere until January 1 (and assuming there is still an NCAA season to be played) it could be a much different choice.

Smartest thought so far. Why leave school if you don't have anywhere else to go? Even if he signs up for the fall term and then the pros start, he can leave.

The only thing that could change the thoughts for me would be if his situation, draft, Rangers, etc. would change with time.

I don't know enough about the pro draft and signings to know whether his situation changes over time.

Anyone out there know the rules enough to help me?

If Barron doesn't sign before the end of his senior season he becomes a free agent. So if the Rangers see him as a likely part of their future, they have real incentive to sign him before his senior year.

True although conversely this also starts to work for Barron staying at a certain point. Say we're in October, the 2020-21 season is on hold, the Rangers are probably starting to run into a little cash crunch. Up to then the only thing they've invested in Barron is the pick. Do they sink enough into an offer to dissuade him from playing out his senior year and hitting FA?

Barron would be a Hobey finalist who didn't win poised to return and possibly win it this time. That would be worth something on the market.

I dunno. It starts to seem possible but the timing has to be perfect: long enough to make it worth his while, but not so long that it then wipes out the 2021 season too.

A good read.

redice
A good read.

Nice to see Brandon getting more and more traction, he deserves it.

But can we please kill that childish windowed presentation gimmick? It was cool once. Now it's simply irritating and juvenile. Maybe it's better on iPacifiers but on a PC at work, where we should all be surfing, it's insufferably cutesy.

Trotsky

redice
A good read.

Nice to see Brandon getting more and more traction, he deserves it.

But can we please kill that childish windowed presentation gimmick? It was cool once. Now it's simply irritating and juvenile. Maybe it's better on iPacifiers but on a PC at work, where we should all be surfing, it's insufferably cutesy.

"get off my lawn"

scoop85

Trotsky

redice
A good read.

Nice to see Brandon getting more and more traction, he deserves it.

But can we please kill that childish windowed presentation gimmick? It was cool once. Now it's simply irritating and juvenile. Maybe it's better on iPacifiers but on a PC at work, where we should all be surfing, it's insufferably cutesy.

"get off my lawn"

Certainly.

upprdeck
if you trust you will get better then you can stay as a FA and get a better deal. If you dont and Pro means more than a shot at a NC with your friends then you go.

There are times where its clear he is the best player on the ice.. But there are also those periods where you wonder did he even skate a shift.

It may also depend on just what kind of deal he had for Aid at Cornell.. How much debt is he in.

We dont know even know if there will be real school next yr at this point

I know nothing about his personal finances, but in his case, I don't think money will be that big an issue. First, I'm sure Coach Schafer has encouraged him to get insurance. A career-ending injury can happen anywhere, but a good insurance policy makes things less urgent. Second, by the same token, there's sure to be many sources that would invest in Barron futures. Not necessarily as a Stanley Cup winner, but as someone who'll earn a decent NHL salary. This would be particularly so if he holds off and goes the FA route. Third, he's probably in a position to declare his independence from his parents. Unless they're paying Cornell hockey players big bucks these days, he'd probably qualify for need-based financial aid. And there must be a ton of people, from Coach Schafer to faculty to alumni, who'll put in a good word for him.

If everyone is looking out for his welfare, then the best thing would be to make the decision as easy as possible, either way.

The only thing is the Rangers seem to have been treating him really well, as has Cornell and Cornell Hockey. As others have mentioned, if he comes back and goes the FA route in 2021, he could enter the market with a NC & Hobey. (Even without him, I think we're going to be really good next year, if we ever get the chance to play.)

scoop85

If Barron doesn't sign before the end of his senior season he becomes a free agent. So if the Rangers see him as a likely part of their future, they have real incentive to sign him before his senior year.

I'm pretty sure this is wrong. The Rangers get a certain amount of time after Barron leaves school to sign him before the FA kicks in. That's what happened with Jimmy Vesey, who graduated on May 26th, 2016, but didn't become a free agent until August 15. Vesey did notify the Predators he intended to pursue free agency, and the Preds even traded his rights to the Sabres before the deadline, but Vesey was intent on testing the market, and eventually signed with the Rangers.

If Barron decides to come back for his Senior year, the Rangers will still have ample opportunity to sign him after April 2021. I wanted to make that clear before this conversation continued much further.

Swampy
The only thing is the Rangers seem to have been treating him really well, as has Cornell and Cornell Hockey. As others have mentioned, if he comes back and goes the FA route in 2021, he could enter the market with a NC & Hobey. (Even without him, I think we're going to be really good next year, if we ever get the chance to play.)

I thought I understood the article to say that his draft status applied to the end of his senior year. I'm understanding that to mean that he could play his senior season, then go to the Rangers as their draft pick.

Am I wrong on this?

redice

Swampy
The only thing is the Rangers seem to have been treating him really well, as has Cornell and Cornell Hockey. As others have mentioned, if he comes back and goes the FA route in 2021, he could enter the market with a NC & Hobey. (Even without him, I think we're going to be really good next year, if we ever get the chance to play.)

I thought I understood the article to say that his draft status applied to the end of his senior year. I'm understanding that to mean that he could play his senior season, then go to the Rangers as their draft pick.

Am I wrong on this?

Section 8.6(c)(i) of the NHL’s Collective Bargaining Agreement:

If a Player drafted at age 18 or 19 is a bona fide college student at the time of his selection in the Entry Draft, or becomes a bona fide college student prior to the first June 1 following his selection in the Entry Draft, and remains a bona fide college student through the graduation of his college class, his drafting Club shall retain the exclusive right of negotiation for his services through and including the August 15 following the graduation of his college class. The Club need not make a Bona Fide Offer to such Player to retain such rights.

RichH is not only cute; he's correct.

Iceberg
Fischler has merely been around the New York hockey media scene for a long time. I never got the impresssion that he was a seriously knowledgeable hockey analyst, but in NYC there hasn't historically been a high standard in that regard.

I had the impression Fischler was an old guy - an ancient, I thought - when I was getting the Hockey News circa 1980, but then when you're 18-30 your idea of ancient is somebody in his 50s. He exemplified the flowery writing that allowed newspaper writers (sometimes turned magazine-weekly writers) to make 150 words of thought expand into a 400-word daily column. Fischler turns 88 next week (3/31/32). This is the lede to his most recent piece that pops up in THN:

Stan Fischler
Without any fear of contradiction, I will firmly and unequivocally state that Leonard ‘Red’ Kelly was the most unique, underrated and undervalued superstar I have ever seen.

Grantland Rice penned this and it worked, in 1924, and then for half a century we read pale imitations:

Grantland Rice, New York Herald Tribune
Outlined against a blue-gray October sky, the Four Horsemen rode again. In dramatic lore they are known as Famine, Pestilence, Destruction and Death. These are only aliases. Their real names are Stuhldreher, Miller, Crowley and Layden. They formed the crest of the South Bend cyclone before which another fighting Army football team was swept over the precipice at the Polo Grounds yesterday afternoon as 55,000 spectators peered down on the bewildering panorama spread on the green plain below.”

Rebuttal.

Trotsky
Rebuttal.

Good article.

As to over-wrought metaphors, leave me "The frozen tundra of Lambeau Field". You can have the rest, including most of Rice's.

Trotsky

redice

Swampy
The only thing is the Rangers seem to have been treating him really well, as has Cornell and Cornell Hockey. As others have mentioned, if he comes back and goes the FA route in 2021, he could enter the market with a NC & Hobey. (Even without him, I think we're going to be really good next year, if we ever get the chance to play.)

I thought I understood the article to say that his draft status applied to the end of his senior year. I'm understanding that to mean that he could play his senior season, then go to the Rangers as their draft pick.

Am I wrong on this?

Section 8.6(c)(i) of the NHL’s Collective Bargaining Agreement:

If a Player drafted at age 18 or 19 is a bona fide college student at the time of his selection in the Entry Draft, or becomes a bona fide college student prior to the first June 1 following his selection in the Entry Draft, and remains a bona fide college student through the graduation of his college class, his drafting Club shall retain the exclusive right of negotiation for his services through and including the August 15 following the graduation of his college class. The Club need not make a Bona Fide Offer to such Player to retain such rights.

RichH is not only cute; he's correct.

Remember Matt Moulson? Drafted by Pittsburgh. Didn't sign with them. Became a free agent. Signed with LA as a free agent.

He was on freaking deadline. For his era, that was decent sportswriting.

Jeff Hopkins '82

Trotsky
Rebuttal.

Good article.

As to over-wrought metaphors, leave me "The frozen tundra of Lambeau Field". You can have the rest, including most of Rice's.

the Penguins had much draft remorse... let him go. Can't call them fools, with their hardware, but I felt it was their loss. Scouts I talked to didn't think so.

I dont think anyone thought Matt was gonna have a solid a career as he did.

upprdeck
I dont think anyone thought Matt was gonna have a solid a career as he did.

I love Matt but his "solid career" was getting paired up with John Tavares.

Trotsky

upprdeck
I dont think anyone thought Matt was gonna have a solid a career as he did.

I love Matt but his "solid career" was getting paired up with John Tavares.

Playing with Tavares was huge, but it's not like Matt brought no skills to the table. I remember looking into this a few years ago and he put up as many, if not more, points and goals in his best couple years as any other linemate of Tavares. It's not like every single winger would put up 30 goals and 60 points alongside Tavares. Plenty had worse years than that.

And it makes sense, given that Matt's best talent was a nose for the net when put into good scoring positions.

Does this mean Barron is leading the race?

He may have been leading when you clicked on that link but sometimes the early lead is the kiss of death in fan voting. Fans from other schools may now jump in to move their guy up. Let's just hope there are many Barron fans who have not yet voted.

yup, Mr. Kawaguchi has overtaken Barron. Barron was 2.1 percent ahead when i made that post above but just in a matter of few hours, the UND was able to mobilize their entire community. Their surge has been incredible.

Jack Dugan of Providence is sitting under 4% in fan voting.

billhoward
Jack Dugan of Providence is sitting under 4% in fan voting.

Small school. Terrific player.

Do any of you actually think he was the best player in the country last season?

Seriously?

abmarks
Do any of you actually think he was the best player in the country last season?

Seriously?

Nope, not me. I see multiple people on the list that i found more impressive than Barron lol

abmarks
Do any of you actually think he was the best player in the country last season?

Seriously?

Barron was a dominant force in every game I watched this season. Others voting for him likely feel the same way. And few if any of us have studied Jack Dugan's and Jordan Kawaguchi's tape such that we could say with any degree of confidence that someone out there was better than Barron. Given all your late nights in the film room watching tape of all ten Hobey finalists, please enlighten us on who was clearly better than Barron.

You could also argue that we played against very few players in games that were of the elite level and for the most part our top D line took them all out of their game..

Much like the Clarkson Goalie had great numbers but not against us.

If a guy scored 2 goals a game all season and we shut him down he still had a great season.

To me Barron was the best player on the ice in most of the games, but he didnt dominate with pts which is what many people look at.

abmarks
Do any of you actually think he was the best player in the country last season?

Seriously?

Ixne on the uthtre.

Trotsky

abmarks
Do any of you actually think he was the best player in the country last season?

Seriously?

Ixne on the uthtre.

Pig Latin wasn't my major. I seriously have no idea what that translates to

abmarks

Trotsky

abmarks
Do any of you actually think he was the best player in the country last season?

Seriously?

Ixne on the uthtre.

Pig Latin wasn't my major. I seriously have no idea what that translates to

Kids.

Some girls in our high school had a better form of gibberish that since they spit it out quickly, almost no one could follow.

They put egg in the middle of every peggiece sheggit theggey seggaid.
Had to be one of these.

marty

abmarks

Trotsky

abmarks
Do any of you actually think he was the best player in the country last season?

Seriously?

Ixne on the uthtre.

Pig Latin wasn't my major. I seriously have no idea what that translates to

Kids.

Some girls in our high school had a better form of gibberish that since they spit it out quickly, almost no one could follow.

They put egg in the middle of every peggiece sheggit theggey seggaid.
Had to be one of these.

thus solving a 25+ year mystery.thank you!!

The Rancor

marty

abmarks

Trotsky

abmarks
Do any of you actually think he was the best player in the country last season?

Seriously?

Ixne on the uthtre.

Pig Latin wasn't my major. I seriously have no idea what that translates to

Kids.

Some girls in our high school had a better form of gibberish that since they spit it out quickly, almost no one could follow.

They put egg in the middle of every peggiece sheggit theggey seggaid.
Had to be one of these.

thus solving a 25+ year mystery.thank you!!

Pig Latin or Egg Latin?

BearLover

abmarks
Do any of you actually think he was the best player in the country last season?

Seriously?

Barron was a dominant force in every game I watched this season. Others voting for him likely feel the same way. And few if any of us have studied Jack Dugan's and Jordan Kawaguchi's tape such that we could say with any degree of confidence that someone out there was better than Barron. Given all your late nights in the film room watching tape of all ten Hobey finalists, please enlighten us on who was clearly better than Barron.

Here are two we saw. Dugan and Farrance.

The eyeball test alone should put Dugan over Barron immediately. But if that's not enough, look at the stats.

Both Dugan and Farrance outscored Barron (Dugan by a LOT) in ppg. And Farrance is a *defenseman* on top of that.

Cornell scored 3.6 gpg while both Providence and BU scored only 3.0 while playing tougher schedules (per sos stats)

Lesser offenses, tougher schedule, played on average teams at best (weaker supporting cast) but more points?


-dominant force in every game? No way. There were some games you didn't even notice he was playing.

abmarks

BearLover

abmarks
Do any of you actually think he was the best player in the country last season?

Seriously?

Barron was a dominant force in every game I watched this season. Others voting for him likely feel the same way. And few if any of us have studied Jack Dugan's and Jordan Kawaguchi's tape such that we could say with any degree of confidence that someone out there was better than Barron. Given all your late nights in the film room watching tape of all ten Hobey finalists, please enlighten us on who was clearly better than Barron.

Here are two we saw. Dugan and Farrance.

The eyeball test alone should put Dugan over Barron immediately. But if that's not enough, look at the stats.

Both Dugan and Farrance outscored Barron (Dugan by a LOT) in ppg. And Farrance is a *defenseman* on top of that.

Cornell scored 3.6 gpg while both Providence and BU scored only 3.0 while playing tougher schedules (per sos stats)

Lesser offenses, tougher schedule, played on average teams at best (weaker supporting cast) but more points?


-dominant force in every game? No way. There were some games you didn't even notice he was playing.

I only saw Dugan play in Vegas, but I'd be willing to posit that Morgan Barron is a much better defensive forward than Dugan. I didn't vote in Trotsky's poll, but if I had I would have voted Barron as most improved, as I think he's really become a great defensive forward while still maintaining his offensive prowess.

abmarks

BearLover

abmarks
Do any of you actually think he was the best player in the country last season?

Seriously?

Barron was a dominant force in every game I watched this season. Others voting for him likely feel the same way. And few if any of us have studied Jack Dugan's and Jordan Kawaguchi's tape such that we could say with any degree of confidence that someone out there was better than Barron. Given all your late nights in the film room watching tape of all ten Hobey finalists, please enlighten us on who was clearly better than Barron.

Here are two we saw. Dugan and Farrance.

The eyeball test alone should put Dugan over Barron immediately. But if that's not enough, look at the stats.

Both Dugan and Farrance outscored Barron (Dugan by a LOT) in ppg. And Farrance is a *defenseman* on top of that.

Cornell scored 3.6 gpg while both Providence and BU scored only 3.0 while playing tougher schedules (per sos stats)

Lesser offenses, tougher schedule, played on average teams at best (weaker supporting cast) but more points?


-dominant force in every game? No way. There were some games you didn't even notice he was playing.

My comment is more about the logic here than where the three players stand relative to each other.

A really good player on an extremely good and balanced team does not have to score points at a record-breaking pace for the team to be successful. Depending on the player's skill set, his contribution might be keeping opponents' top checking line on the ice for long periods or himself playing on a line that shuts down opponents' top lines.

Barron can score and play defense. Watching games late in the season, I had the feeling that the resurgence of our power play partly resulted from Barron acting as a decoy and attracting other teams' top defenders, while the rest of the power play unit moved the puck and scored.

Sort of like when our counter to SOT strategies in lacrosse worked really well, only better.

abmarks
Do any of you actually think he was the best player in the country last season?

Seriously?

I have bad news for you about MLB's All-Star fan balloting.

marty

The Rancor

marty

abmarks

Trotsky

abmarks
Do any of you actually think he was the best player in the country last season?

Seriously?

Ixne on the uthtre.

Pig Latin wasn't my major. I seriously have no idea what that translates to

Kids.

Some girls in our high school had a better form of gibberish that since they spit it out quickly, almost no one could follow.

They put egg in the middle of every peggiece sheggit theggey seggaid.
Had to be one of these.

thus solving a 25+ year mystery.thank you!!

Pig Latin or Egg Latin?

egg latin

RichH

abmarks
Do any of you actually think he was the best player in the country last season?

Seriously?

I have bad news for you about MLB's All-Star fan balloting.

Could care less about any selections in any sport that are made entirely by fan ballots.

Besides, I gave most people here more credit than that. It's one thing to stuff the ballot box for your own guy, it's another to stuff it and proclaim he's actually the best when he isn't.

abmarks
Besides, I gave most people here more credit than that. It's one thing to stuff the ballot box for your own guy, it's another to stuff it and proclaim he's actually the best when he isn't.

He's probably not the best, but plenty of guys have won "meritocratic" awards who weren't the best so fuck it, let's get some!

The Rancor

marty

The Rancor

marty

abmarks

Trotsky

abmarks
Do any of you actually think he was the best player in the country last season?

Seriously?

Ixne on the uthtre.

Pig Latin wasn't my major. I seriously have no idea what that translates to

Kids.

Some girls in our high school had a better form of gibberish that since they spit it out quickly, almost no one could follow.

They put egg in the middle of every peggiece sheggit theggey seggaid.
Had to be one of these.

thus solving a 25+ year mystery.thank you!!

Pig Latin or Egg Latin?

egg latin

We haven't cured cancer yet but the internet.

abmarks

RichH

abmarks
Do any of you actually think he was the best player in the country last season?

Seriously?

I have bad news for you about MLB's All-Star fan balloting.

Could care less about any selections in any sport that are made entirely by fan ballots.

Besides, I gave most people here more credit than that. It's one thing to stuff the ballot box for your own guy, it's another to stuff it and proclaim he's actually the best when he isn't.

I'm certain in your divine wisdom you have determined, beyond any and all doubt, who is, in fact, "best." Pray tell us the answer and your unchallengeable, infallible reasoning for determining this.

Al DeFlorio

abmarks

RichH

abmarks
Do any of you actually think he was the best player in the country last season?

Seriously?

I have bad news for you about MLB's All-Star fan balloting.

Could care less about any selections in any sport that are made entirely by fan ballots.

Besides, I gave most people here more credit than that. It's one thing to stuff the ballot box for your own guy, it's another to stuff it and proclaim he's actually the best when he isn't.

I'm certain in your divine wisdom you have determined, beyond any and all doubt, who is, in fact, "best." Pray tell us the answer and your unchallengeable, infallible reasoning for determining this.

Doesn’t matter now. The final 3 candidates are from Duluth, North Dakota, and the goaltender with the 14th best GAA.

RichH
The final 3 candidates are from Duluth, North Dakota, and the goaltender with the 14th best GAA.

McKay didn't make the final? The fuck?

Vote Barron for Hobey in 2021?

Thursday evening's online town hall with Mike Schafer, Yanni Kaldis and Jeff Malott - great event - left unclear what Morgan Barron will be doing for his senior year. Schafer said Barron is pondering the choice of returning for senior year or going pro, and "we support Morgan" whichever choice he makes.

Be nice to see him back to take care of unfinished business. But life is not a Hallmark movie where people keep coming back to the small town.

But, man, it would be nice. There's unfinished business in Ithaca.

Swayman faces 65% more shots with a save percentage .003 less than McKay's ... We had Swayman 1st Team All-CHN - and I voted for him for the Richter Award.

Also - annual reminder that the Hobey Hat Trick is NOT the "final 3 candidates" ... the winner is already known. The 3 represent the top 3 vote getters. There is no further voting.

adamw
Swayman faces 65% more shots with a save percentage .003 less than McKay's ... We had Swayman 1st Team All-CHN - and I voted for him for the Richter Award.

Also - annual reminder that the Hobey Hat Trick is NOT the "final 3 candidates" ... the winner is already known. The 3 represent the top 3 vote getters. There is no further voting.

I've never really understood why GAA is seen as a goalie metric rather than a team metric.

Al DeFlorio

abmarks

RichH

abmarks
Do any of you actually think he was the best player in the country last season?

Seriously?

I have bad news for you about MLB's All-Star fan balloting.

Could care less about any selections in any sport that are made entirely by fan ballots.

Besides, I gave most people here more credit than that. It's one thing to stuff the ballot box for your own guy, it's another to stuff it and proclaim he's actually the best when he isn't.

I'm certain in your divine wisdom you have determined, beyond any and all doubt, who is, in fact, "best." Pray tell us the answer and your unchallengeable, infallible reasoning for determining this.

I don't know who's best. But I do know that it's not Barron, and outlined why two of our opponents were better than Barron in an earlier post.

And before you quibble, consider best to the player that best satisfied the award criteria. If there were a Selke for college hockey there a be a good argument for Barron, but this is an award for most outstanding player.

Dafatone

adamw
Swayman faces 65% more shots with a save percentage .003 less than McKay's ... We had Swayman 1st Team All-CHN - and I voted for him for the Richter Award.

Also - annual reminder that the Hobey Hat Trick is NOT the "final 3 candidates" ... the winner is already known. The 3 represent the top 3 vote getters. There is no further voting.

I've never really understood why GAA is seen as a goalie metric rather than a team metric.

Which other metric would you prefer? Which other available metric is superior? Are you suggesting McKay is better than Swayman? By what criteria?

adamw

Dafatone

adamw
Swayman faces 65% more shots with a save percentage .003 less than McKay's ... We had Swayman 1st Team All-CHN - and I voted for him for the Richter Award.

Also - annual reminder that the Hobey Hat Trick is NOT the "final 3 candidates" ... the winner is already known. The 3 represent the top 3 vote getters. There is no further voting.

I've never really understood why GAA is seen as a goalie metric rather than a team metric.

Which other metric would you prefer? Which other available metric is superior? Are you suggesting McKay is better than Swayman? By what criteria?

I'm agreeing with you, mostly. McKay has a slightly better sv% and a much better GAA. Swayman has faced a ton more shots, which makes his numbers more impressive.

Some people seemed to be saying that the wide gap in GAA reflects poorly on Swayman, which I don't really get. It's not his fault his team gave up about 50% more shots than McKay's.

Don't the stats also say all shots are not created equal? Cornell shows the model. limit the quality shots.

adamw
Also - annual reminder that the Hobey Hat Trick is NOT the "final 3 candidates" ... the winner is already known. The 3 represent the top 3 vote getters. There is no further voting.

Huh. Did not know this. Thank you.

upprdeck
Don't the stats also say all shots are not created equal? Cornell shows the model. limit the quality shots.

All shots are definitely not created equal. Unfortunately, in NCAA, we don't have shot location data. So SV% is the best we have.

As for GAA as a measure of excellence in tending goal what do the goalies themselves think about it being a critical measure of talent in goal?