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Injuries

Posted by Chris '03 
Injuries
Posted by: Chris '03 (---.sub-174-199-8.myvzw.com)
Date: February 06, 2018 05:49PM



 
___________________________
"Mark Mazzoleni looks like a guy whose dog just died out there..."
 
Re: Injuries
Posted by: RatushnyFan (74.118.218.---)
Date: February 06, 2018 05:51PM

Huge bummer for him. Wishing him the best.
 
Re: Injuries
Posted by: scoop85 (---.nyc.biz.rr.com)
Date: February 06, 2018 06:09PM

Oh man, that is a blow.

How's our club team doing? The way guys are falling we may need to bring up someone asap scared
 
Re: Injuries
Posted by: Trotsky (---.dc.dc.cox.net)
Date: February 06, 2018 06:22PM

It just says RS. Where there's life there's hope.

Note that people should be extremely circumspect about posting anything to this thread that is not public information, for obvious reasons.
Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 02/06/2018 06:23PM by Trotsky.
 
Re: Injuries
Posted by: scoop85 (---.sub-70-209-128.myvzw.com)
Date: February 06, 2018 06:45PM

Trotsky
It just says RS. Where there's life there's hope.

Note that people should be extremely circumspect about posting anything to this thread that is not public information, for obvious reasons.

Glad you pointed out "regular" season. I'd glossed over that. Let's hope he'll be back for the playoffs
 
Re: Injuries
Posted by: upprdeck (---.syrcny.east.verizon.net)
Date: February 06, 2018 07:01PM

if we get the bye that means 5 weeks of recovery at a min.
 
Re: Injuries
Posted by: andyw2100 (---.twcny.res.rr.com)
Date: February 06, 2018 07:37PM

Trotsky
Note that people should be extremely circumspect about posting anything to this thread that is not public information, for obvious reasons.

Would you consider information on injuries from Coach Schafer, sent to whatever his e-mail distribution list is, to be "public" enough to post? I imagine many of us received an email message from him this afternoon which has the same information about Vanderlaan, and some additional information. I was going to share that info here, with a comment on the above, but will wait to make sure the consensus here (or just Greg's opinion) is that it is OK to do so.
 
Re: Injuries
Posted by: scoop85 (---.hvc.res.rr.com)
Date: February 06, 2018 07:50PM

andyw2100
Trotsky
Note that people should be extremely circumspect about posting anything to this thread that is not public information, for obvious reasons.

Would you consider information on injuries from Coach Schafer, sent to whatever his e-mail distribution list is, to be "public" enough to post? I imagine many of us received an email message from him this afternoon which has the same information about Vanderlaan, and some additional information. I was going to share that info here, with a comment on the above, but will wait to make sure the consensus here (or just Greg's opinion) is that it is OK to do so.

If it came from Schafer in a general distribution e-mail, I see no reason it cannot be shared in this Forum (and yes, I am a lawyer)
 
Re: Injuries
Posted by: andyw2100 (---.twcny.res.rr.com)
Date: February 06, 2018 08:01PM

scoop85
andyw2100
Trotsky
Note that people should be extremely circumspect about posting anything to this thread that is not public information, for obvious reasons.

Would you consider information on injuries from Coach Schafer, sent to whatever his e-mail distribution list is, to be "public" enough to post? I imagine many of us received an email message from him this afternoon which has the same information about Vanderlaan, and some additional information. I was going to share that info here, with a comment on the above, but will wait to make sure the consensus here (or just Greg's opinion) is that it is OK to do so.

If it came from Schafer in a general distribution e-mail, I see no reason it cannot be shared in this Forum (and yes, I am a lawyer)

I don't think Greg was concerned about the legality of sharing information here, but rather whether or not opposing coaching staffs might have access to the information or not.
 
Re: Injuries
Posted by: CAS (---.hsd1.nj.comcast.net)
Date: February 06, 2018 08:02PM

Will sharing the info here be sharing it with Clarkson & SLU, who probably aren’t on Schafer’s distribution list?
 
Re: Injuries
Posted by: andyw2100 (---.twcny.res.rr.com)
Date: February 06, 2018 08:06PM

CAS
Will sharing the info here be sharing it with Clarkson & SLU, who probably aren’t on Schafer’s distribution list?

I guess that's kind of what I am asking.

On the one hand, if opposing teams really are interested in that information it is not ridiculous to think they would have someone check sites like this. It's also not ridiculous to think that if they really want the information, they could get an address into the distribution list, and get the information directly. I just don't know, but would prefer to err on the side of caution, since Greg was clearly concerned about the original post.
 
Re: Injuries
Posted by: Trotsky (---.washdc.fios.verizon.net)
Date: February 06, 2018 08:28PM

andyw2100
I don't think Greg was concerned about the legality of sharing information here, but rather whether or not opposing coaching staffs might have access to the information or not.

Two concerns:

1. Spies. Spies, everywhere. MY PRECIOUS!!!

2. Respect for the player's privacy.

I was not concerned about OP -- a public tweet by a news organization. I would worry about RUMINT, and also about insider trading.

My personal view on a Schafer-shared email to the Cornell community is I wouldn't post it to a public site. But I am hardly The Director of Ethics of eLynah so of course use your own discretion. I merely wished to put an oar in the water.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/06/2018 08:31PM by Trotsky.
 
Re: Injuries
Posted by: redice (---.stny.res.rr.com)
Date: February 06, 2018 08:44PM

I cannot imagine that Mike would divulge confidential injury info to a mailing list, of any sort, expecting complete confidentiality. Out of that entire list, Mike has to know that somebody will divulge that secret. He would NEVER take that chance!!

 
___________________________
"If a player won't go in the corners, he might as well take up checkers."

-Ned Harkness
 
Re: Injuries
Posted by: Beeeej (Moderator)
Date: February 06, 2018 08:49PM

redice
I cannot imagine that Mike would divulge confidential injury info to a mailing list, of any sort, expecting complete confidentiality. Out of that entire list, Mike has to know that somebody will divulge that secret. He would NEVER take that chance!!

I tend to agree with you. But that fact doesn't necessarily mean that we should post that information here.

 
___________________________
Beeeej, Esq.
Tundra British Columbia Headhunters Circus
Tucson or Bust!

"Cornell isn't an organization. It's a loose affiliation of independent fiefdoms united by a common hockey team."
- Steve Worona
 
Re: Injuries
Posted by: scoop85 (---.hvc.res.rr.com)
Date: February 06, 2018 08:50PM

redice
I cannot imagine that Mike would divulge confidential injury info to a mailing list, of any sort, expecting complete confidentiality. Out of that entire list, Mike has to know that somebody will divulge that secret. He would NEVER take that chance!!

Yes, that’s my thought too. If Mike send out an e-mail to a general e-Mail list it’s hard to imagine he would reasonably expect the information would be kept “secret.” That being said I can understand why someone would elect not to post the information on a public forum.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/06/2018 08:55PM by scoop85.
 
Re: Injuries
Posted by: Trotsky (---.washdc.fios.verizon.net)
Date: February 06, 2018 08:54PM

redice
I cannot imagine that Mike would divulge confidential injury info to a mailing list, of any sort, expecting complete confidentiality. Out of that entire list, Mike has to know that somebody will divulge that secret. He would NEVER take that chance!!
Well then think of it this way. If Mike wants to share it with a select few rather than with the press, why flaunt that?
 
Re: Injuries
Posted by: dbilmes (32.218.127.---)
Date: February 06, 2018 09:04PM

The Cornell Sun has just posted a story online. Apparently, Schafer divulged the information during his "media availability day." Regardless of what is posted on this listserv, it's difficult to imagine that any upcoming opponents who want to get this type of information before they play us will have trouble finding it. Schafer also talked about injuries to at least three other players, including one who is expected to return to the lineup this weekend.
 
Re: Injuries
Posted by: BearLover (---.nycmny.fios.verizon.net)
Date: February 06, 2018 09:28PM

andyw2100
CAS
Will sharing the info here be sharing it with Clarkson & SLU, who probably aren’t on Schafer’s distribution list?

I guess that's kind of what I am asking.

On the one hand, if opposing teams really are interested in that information it is not ridiculous to think they would have someone check sites like this. It's also not ridiculous to think that if they really want the information, they could get an address into the distribution list, and get the information directly. I just don't know, but would prefer to err on the side of caution, since Greg was clearly concerned about the original post.
I think there's a pretty stark ethical contrast between checking a public forum and actively signing up for a non-public mailing list. I'm also a little bit surprised Schafer would go public with this information. He is usually tight-lipped about injuries, but maybe that is more the result of nobody asking than it is him concealing information from the opposition. I still think we shouldn't discuss anything that isn't public.
 
Re: Injuries
Posted by: andyw2100 (---.twcny.res.rr.com)
Date: February 06, 2018 11:10PM

Based on what people have been posting, I think it is probably safe to share the following.

Below is an excerpt from the email message I mentioned, with the names of players who have not yet been mentioned in this thread redacted.

"It got even tougher as we lost <--PLAYER--, with some additional descriptive text> and <--PLAYER--, with some additional descriptive text> and our captain Mitch Vanderlaan who will be out for the rest of the regular season. These injuries will hurt but others will need to step up."

When I first read that I couldn't tell whether or not all three players were out through the end of the regular season or whether Schafer was just referring to Vanderlaan being out that long. I thought it was almost certainly the latter, but I really wasn't certain. So I was relieved when I saw the first post in this thread, since I already knew about Vanderlaan.
 
Re: Injuries
Posted by: ugarte (---.dyn.optonline.net)
Date: February 06, 2018 11:25PM

this discussion is ridiculous. if schafer sent the invitation to the mailing list of course you can post it here and you should. there is no real ethics point you are making by holding back what is essentially public information in any rational sense of the word and there is literally no competitive advantage because anything you think you're preserving is certainly known to whoever you are keeping it from.

whatever the cause, this really sucks about vanderlaan. i don't even remember the play that knocked him out of the RPI game.

 
___________________________
Jokes and stuff

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/06/2018 11:26PM by ugarte.
 
Re: Injuries
Posted by: Trotsky (---.washdc.fios.verizon.net)
Date: February 06, 2018 11:37PM

ugarte
this discussion is ridiculous. if schafer sent the invitation to the mailing list of course you can post it here and you should. there is no real ethics point you are making by holding back what is essentially public information in any rational sense of the word and there is literally no competitive advantage because anything you think you're preserving is certainly known to whoever you are keeping it from.
We're on to you, joecct!
 
Re: Injuries
Posted by: French Rage (---.hsd1.ca.comcast.net)
Date: February 07, 2018 12:06AM

Trotsky
ugarte
this discussion is ridiculous. if schafer sent the invitation to the mailing list of course you can post it here and you should. there is no real ethics point you are making by holding back what is essentially public information in any rational sense of the word and there is literally no competitive advantage because anything you think you're preserving is certainly known to whoever you are keeping it from.
We're on to you, joecct!

LOL

 
___________________________
03/23/02: Maine 4, Harvard 3
03/28/03: BU 6, Harvard 4
03/26/04: Maine 5, Harvard 4
03/26/05: UNH 3, Harvard 2
03/25/06: Maine 6, Harvard 1
 
Re: Injuries
Posted by: Jim Hyla (---.239.191.68.cl.cstel.com)
Date: February 07, 2018 09:50AM

ugarte
this discussion is ridiculous. if schafer sent the invitation to the mailing list of course you can post it here and you should. there is no real ethics point you are making by holding back what is essentially public information in any rational sense of the word and there is literally no competitive advantage because anything you think you're preserving is certainly known to whoever you are keeping it from.

whatever the cause, this really sucks about vanderlaan. i don't even remember the play that knocked him out of the RPI game.

Totally agree. Coach said this and the Sun reported it. It's hard to get more public than that. And even if the NC schools didn't find out, they will soon know when he's not on the game roster. If they do know, they don't know how we're going to adapt to it, so no real competitive advantage.

To me this whole "controversy" is laughable. If it's on twitter, the news, or from the coach, it's public.

 
___________________________
"Cornell Fans Made the Timbers Tremble", Boston Globe, March/1970
Cornell lawyers stopped the candy throwing. Jan/2005
 
Re: Injuries
Posted by: andyw2100 (---.twcny.res.rr.com)
Date: February 07, 2018 11:06AM

Jim Hyla
ugarte
this discussion is ridiculous. if schafer sent the invitation to the mailing list of course you can post it here and you should. there is no real ethics point you are making by holding back what is essentially public information in any rational sense of the word and there is literally no competitive advantage because anything you think you're preserving is certainly known to whoever you are keeping it from.

whatever the cause, this really sucks about vanderlaan. i don't even remember the play that knocked him out of the RPI game.

Totally agree. Coach said this and the Sun reported it. It's hard to get more public than that. And even if the NC schools didn't find out, they will soon know when he's not on the game roster. If they do know, they don't know how we're going to adapt to it, so no real competitive advantage.

To me this whole "controversy" is laughable. If it's on twitter, the news, or from the coach, it's public.

"The Cornell Daily Sun" tweeted about Vanderlaan, but not any other players, at least as far as I know. Greg and Beeeej, long-time eLynah members whose opinion I respect (just as I respect yours, Jim) suggested caution with respect to posting information here, so I chose not to include names of players that I had not seen publicized anywhere other than Schafer's email message.

I don't think anyone was concerned about the posting of the Vanderlaan information.
 
Re: Injuries
Posted by: Trotsky (---.dc.dc.cox.net)
Date: February 07, 2018 11:11AM

My original comments seem to have been phrased poorly as they have led to much misunderstanding, so please let me try again.

(clears throat)

Hey, everybody? How we all doing today? Good?

That's good.

Hey, I just wanted to suggest that maybe when discussing things like injuries -- and hey I'm embarrassed to even bring this up because you know we're all adults here and obviously we're all just trying to do the right things, so take that as read -- but I'm just suggesting, for my own piece of mind, you understand, and no aspersions on you you know, that we maybe just take a second before posting and






















USE SOME FUCKING COMMON SENSE.







That OK with everybody? We still all good?

That's good.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/07/2018 11:12AM by Trotsky.
 
Re: Injuries
Posted by: Swampy (---.ri.ri.cox.net)
Date: February 07, 2018 11:56AM

Lots of good information here: [cornellsun.com]

Very clear that V is out for RS but might be back afterwards.
 
Re: Injuries
Posted by: Trotsky (---.dc.dc.cox.net)
Date: February 07, 2018 12:24PM

Swampy
Lots of good information here: [cornellsun.com]

Very clear that V is out for RS but might be back afterwards.
That's a good article.

I wonder if Nick Foles can skate?
 
Re: Injuries
Posted by: Jeff Hopkins '82 (---.37.26.69.virtela.net)
Date: February 07, 2018 12:34PM

Trotsky
Swampy
Lots of good information here: [cornellsun.com]

Very clear that V is out for RS but might be back afterwards.
That's a good article.

I wonder if Nick Foles can skate?

He's ours...you can't have him. Take Malcolm Butler.
 
Re: Injuries
Posted by: ugarte (---.177.169.163.ipyx-102276-zyo.zip.zayo.com)
Date: February 07, 2018 02:07PM

Trotsky

USE SOME FUCKING COMMON SENSE.
OK, here we go: it is not common sense to speculate, or to share information that you have received illicitly. It is also common sense to say "we have learned X from an email that was sent around." It is not common sense to dance around X and pretend you're protecting classified information.

 
___________________________
Jokes and stuff

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/07/2018 02:09PM by ugarte.
 
Re: Injuries
Posted by: Jim Hyla (---.239.191.68.cl.cstel.com)
Date: February 07, 2018 02:12PM

ugarte
Trotsky

USE SOME FUCKING COMMON SENSE.
OK, here we go: it is not common sense to speculate, or to share information that you have received illicitly. It is also common sense to say "we have learned X from an email that was sent around." It is not common sense to dance around X and pretend you're protecting classified information.

Thank you!!!!!!!!!

 
___________________________
"Cornell Fans Made the Timbers Tremble", Boston Globe, March/1970
Cornell lawyers stopped the candy throwing. Jan/2005
 
Re: Injuries
Posted by: ugarte (---.177.169.163.ipyx-102276-zyo.zip.zayo.com)
Date: February 07, 2018 03:20PM

ugarte
Trotsky

USE SOME FUCKING COMMON SENSE.
OK, here we go: it is not common sense to speculate, or to share information that you have received illicitly. It is also common sense to say "we have learned X from an email that was sent around." It is not common sense to dance around X and pretend you're protecting classified information.
It has been brought to my attention that the amount of information in the email different from the information in the Sun is "nothing." So this has been a very strange discussion.

 
___________________________
Jokes and stuff
 
Re: Injuries
Posted by: billhoward (---.nwrk.east.verizon.net)
Date: February 07, 2018 03:48PM

ugarte
It has been brought to my attention that the amount of information in the email different from the information in the Sun is "nothing." So this has been a very strange discussion.
In a note to some longtime friends/supporters of Cornell hockey, Schafer mentioned the loss of three players. He mentioned Vanderlaan is out for the rest of the RS. Depending on how you read punctuation into what he wrote, you might believe all three are out for the rest of the RS or Vanderlaan only. Schafer is positively Belichickian in imparting little to no news you don't already know, nothing actionable by the other side. "It's on to Potsdam."
 
Re: Injuries
Posted by: Cop at Lynah (---.twcny.res.rr.com)
Date: February 07, 2018 04:30PM

They loose Vanderlaan, Donaldson and Smith and they get Mallot back.Not ideal, but now is the chance for the depth to step up an maintain the level of play. Still plenty of quality players that will be suiting up this weekend
 
Re: Injuries
Posted by: Trotsky (---.dc.dc.cox.net)
Date: February 07, 2018 04:55PM

Cop at Lynah
They loose Vanderlaan, Donaldson and Smith and they get Mallot back.Not ideal, but now is the chance for the depth to step up an maintain the level of play. Still plenty of quality players that will be suiting up this weekend

I'm guessing we see Tschantz stay in for Cam, Mallot swap with Mitch, and we see Cairns for Smith. Unless Murphy earns a look -- I'd like to see him back in at some point, his enthusiasm last year was wonderful.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/07/2018 04:56PM by Trotsky.
 
Re: Injuries
Posted by: Swampy (---.163.128.131.dhcp.uri.edu)
Date: February 07, 2018 04:55PM

andyw2100

"It got even tougher as we lost <--PLAYER--, with some additional descriptive text> and <--PLAYER--, with some additional descriptive text> and our captain Mitch Vanderlaan who will be out for the rest of the regular season. These injuries will hurt but others will need to step up."
There is some ambiguity in this quotation: Is the "who" singular or plural? But the following from the Daily Sun article clears things up:


Schafer said he hopes to have the captain back for the playoffs.

This would imply that Smith and Donaldson could be back at any time, before or after the playoffs.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/07/2018 04:56PM by Swampy.
 
Re: Injuries
Posted by: Cop at Lynah (---.twcny.res.rr.com)
Date: February 07, 2018 05:26PM

Locke,Angello and Malott would be a formidable line
 
Re: Injuries
Posted by: Cop at Lynah (---.twcny.res.rr.com)
Date: February 07, 2018 05:31PM

He blocked a shot with his shin or foot not exactly sure which.
 
Re: Injuries
Posted by: Jeff Hopkins '82 (---.102.128.104.res-cmts.sm.ptd.net)
Date: February 07, 2018 11:23PM

Cop at Lynah
He blocked a shot with his shin or foot not exactly sure which.

Judging by the sound, I think it was his foot or his ankle. Certainly something unpadded.
 
Re: Injuries
Posted by: upprdeck (---.fs.cornell.edu)
Date: February 08, 2018 09:20AM

Stewart dress last weekend so thats a good sign for at least him getting back on the ice.
 
Re: Injuries
Posted by: Swampy (---.ri.ri.cox.net)
Date: February 08, 2018 09:32AM

Jeff Hopkins '82
Cop at Lynah
He blocked a shot with his shin or foot not exactly sure which.

Judging by the sound, I think it was his foot or his ankle. Certainly something unpadded.

From my experience, a sprained ankle could fit the description and timeline. Maybe one of the MD's on this list could offer an opinion.
 
Re: Injuries
Posted by: KenP (137.75.68.---)
Date: February 08, 2018 10:16AM

How much do you think Schafer is "playing it safe" given our record? I know all the catch phrases like we need to take it one game at a time, first goal is the regular season, blah blah. Would he sideline a marginally ready skater so they are closer to 100% for post-season??

What would you do if your player was just over the cusp of being ready to play tomorrow given there are (hopefully) four weeks of increasingly difficult post-season weekends on the horizon?
 
Re: Injuries
Posted by: Trotsky (---.dc.dc.cox.net)
Date: February 08, 2018 10:22AM

KenP
How much do you think Schafer is "playing it safe" given our record? I know all the catch phrases like we need to take it one game at a time, first goal is the regular season, blah blah. Would he sideline a marginally ready skater so they are closer to 100% for post-season??

What would you do if your player was just over the cusp of being ready to play tomorrow given there are (hopefully) four weeks of increasingly difficult post-season weekends on the horizon?
That's always a hard call. The 3-point cushion over Clarkson takes a little of the urgency out of that game. The other two things working in that theory's favor are: (1) the next men up on both F (Tschantz) and D (Cairns) are hardly incompetent, and (2) we really do not have a margin for another extended injury at either position as the full roster is permanently short 1 F (Hoffman) and 2 Ds (Shore, Bliss).
Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 02/08/2018 10:24AM by Trotsky.
 
Re: Injuries
Posted by: BearLover (---.sub-70-214-96.myvzw.com)
Date: February 08, 2018 11:28AM

I would play it safe given that we have nearly clinched a r1 bye and NCAA bid. I unfortunately think there is still quite a gap between our 6th D when everyone is healthy (probably Haiskanen) and Cairns. I am confident Cairns will develop into a good player but at the moment he looks pretty shaky in his positioning and in his spot passing (i.e. it seems he hasn't grasped The System especially well).

Also, re: ethics, I think the only ethical grey area here is whether there is something problematic about signing up for an opposing team's mailing list just to glean injury information.

Whether to post about injuries mentioned in Schafer's weekly letter is a practical, not ethical, issue: we don't want other teams finding out. Obviously Schafer stating the injury situation/the Sun publishing it renders this conversation moot, but I have gotten the sense that when Schafer says something in the weekly email or at a Coach's Club meeting, but doesn't disclose it outside of that, he means for it to stay private (i.e., we probably shouldn't post about it here).
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/08/2018 11:31AM by BearLover.
 
Re: Injuries
Posted by: marty (---.sub-70-209-135.myvzw.com)
Date: February 08, 2018 11:40AM

BearLover
Obviously Schafer stating the injury situation/the Sun publishing it renders this conversation moot, but I have gotten the sense that when Schafer says something in the weekly email or at a Coach's Club meeting, but doesn't disclose it outside of that, he means for it to stay private (i.e., we probably shouldn't post about it here).

I think coach releases what he is comfortable releasing. Notice he didn't give a clinical description of what the injury is and how severe it is. If someone were Vanderlaan's roommate and disclosed it was a bruised C3 vertebrae, that would be treasonous. Once Schafer has gone public, I consider it public.

And if he does regret mentioning it in the email, in this instance, I assume he won't did it again.

P.S. My phone has apparently learned Vanderlaan's name so that I can swipe it into a message. I am fairly certain I didn't add it to the dictionary.
wow
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/08/2018 11:44AM by marty.
 
Re: Injuries
Posted by: ugarte (---.177.169.163.ipyx-102276-zyo.zip.zayo.com)
Date: February 08, 2018 12:12PM

BearLover
Whether to post about injuries mentioned in Schafer's weekly letter is a practical, not ethical, issue: we don't want other teams finding out. Obviously Schafer stating the injury situation/the Sun publishing it renders this conversation moot, but I have gotten the sense that when Schafer says something in the weekly email or at a Coach's Club meeting, but doesn't disclose it outside of that, he means for it to stay private (i.e., we probably shouldn't post about it here).
There is nothing - literally nothing - that Schafer puts in the alumni newsletter or says in a group setting - that he doesn't expect to show up in the IJ.

 
___________________________
Jokes and stuff
 
Re: Injuries
Posted by: Swampy (---.163.128.131.dhcp.uri.edu)
Date: February 08, 2018 12:39PM

BearLover
Also, re: ethics, I think the only ethical grey area here is whether there is something problematic about signing up for an opposing team's mailing list just to glean injury information.

A bigger ethical issue is letting a player start playing again who's not 100%. It the player's injury could be made worse, or it might cause the player to have a lifetime of pain or other disability, then I would argue the player should not play, even if this costs the team a trophy.
 
Re: Injuries
Posted by: Weder (---.mycingular.net)
Date: February 08, 2018 02:04PM

ugarte
BearLover
Whether to post about injuries mentioned in Schafer's weekly letter is a practical, not ethical, issue: we don't want other teams finding out. Obviously Schafer stating the injury situation/the Sun publishing it renders this conversation moot, but I have gotten the sense that when Schafer says something in the weekly email or at a Coach's Club meeting, but doesn't disclose it outside of that, he means for it to stay private (i.e., we probably shouldn't post about it here).
There is nothing - literally nothing - that Schafer puts in the alumni newsletter or says in a group setting - that he doesn't expect to show up in the IJ.

And as a team alum, Casey Jones is almost certainly getting those emails.
 
Re: Injuries
Posted by: nshapiro (192.148.195.---)
Date: February 08, 2018 02:15PM

Jeff Hopkins '82
Trotsky
Swampy
Lots of good information here: [cornellsun.com]

Very clear that V is out for RS but might be back afterwards.
That's a good article.

I wonder if Nick Foles can skate?

He's ours...you can't have him. Take Malcolm Butler.


Take Beau Allen - an Eagles free agent from Minn. who was apparently a dominating hockey player before football became his only sport.
 
Re: Injuries
Posted by: CU2007 (---.sub-70-214-76.myvzw.com)
Date: February 08, 2018 02:37PM

Swampy
BearLover
Also, re: ethics, I think the only ethical grey area here is whether there is something problematic about signing up for an opposing team's mailing list just to glean injury information.

A bigger ethical issue is letting a player start playing again who's not 100%. It the player's injury could be made worse, or it might cause the player to have a lifetime of pain or other disability, then I would argue the player should not play, even if this costs the team a trophy.

Depends on the potential for injury and the player himself. There was a D3 (I think) college football player a few years back who had his damn pinky amputated so he could play in his team’s playoffs. You could probably find the story by googling.

Side note: Personally, no idea what he was thinking.
 
Re: Injuries
Posted by: KenP (---.mycingular.net)
Date: February 08, 2018 05:05PM

CU2007
Swampy
BearLover
Also, re: ethics, I think the only ethical grey area here is whether there is something problematic about signing up for an opposing team's mailing list just to glean injury information.

A bigger ethical issue is letting a player start playing again who's not 100%. It the player's injury could be made worse, or it might cause the player to have a lifetime of pain or other disability, then I would argue the player should not play, even if this costs the team a trophy.

Depends on the potential for injury and the player himself. There was a D3 (I think) college football player a few years back who had his damn pinky amputated so he could play in his team’s playoffs. You could probably find the story by googling.

Side note: Personally, no idea what he was thinking.
[www.espn.com]
 
Re: Injuries
Posted by: BigRedHockeyFan (---.apn.wlan.upenn.edu)
Date: February 09, 2018 05:00AM

Gotta wonder how many Clarkson players are hurting. They have slacked off, starting with the Harvard tie.
Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 02/09/2018 05:01AM by BigRedHockeyFan.
 
Re: Injuries
Posted by: BearLover (---.nycmny.fios.verizon.net)
Date: February 09, 2018 09:22AM

ugarte
BearLover
Whether to post about injuries mentioned in Schafer's weekly letter is a practical, not ethical, issue: we don't want other teams finding out. Obviously Schafer stating the injury situation/the Sun publishing it renders this conversation moot, but I have gotten the sense that when Schafer says something in the weekly email or at a Coach's Club meeting, but doesn't disclose it outside of that, he means for it to stay private (i.e., we probably shouldn't post about it here).
There is nothing - literally nothing - that Schafer puts in the alumni newsletter or says in a group setting - that he doesn't expect to show up in the IJ.
And you know this how? Does it ever actually show up in the IJ?
 
Re: Injuries
Posted by: Trotsky (---.dc.dc.cox.net)
Date: February 09, 2018 09:26AM

BigRedHockeyFan
Gotta wonder how many Clarkson players are hurting. They have slacked off, starting with the Harvard tie.
On the flip side we caught SLU before with half their lineup out and all those guys are back now.

I would not be heartbroken to get out of this weekend with 2 points.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/09/2018 09:27AM by Trotsky.
 
Re: Injuries
Posted by: scoop85 (---.nyc.biz.rr.com)
Date: February 09, 2018 09:38AM

Trotsky
BigRedHockeyFan
Gotta wonder how many Clarkson players are hurting. They have slacked off, starting with the Harvard tie.
On the flip side we caught SLU before with half their lineup out and all those guys are back now.

I would not be heartbroken to get out of this weekend with 2 points.

Same here. Interesting that SLUt is playing better since Ben Finkelstein, arguably their best player, left the team. May be a case of addition by subtraction.
 
Re: Injuries
Posted by: Al DeFlorio (---.hsd1.ma.comcast.net)
Date: February 09, 2018 09:51AM

scoop85
Trotsky
BigRedHockeyFan
Gotta wonder how many Clarkson players are hurting. They have slacked off, starting with the Harvard tie.
On the flip side we caught SLU before with half their lineup out and all those guys are back now.

I would not be heartbroken to get out of this weekend with 2 points.

Same here. Interesting that SLUt is playing better since Ben Finkelstein, arguably their best player, left the team. May be a case of addition by subtraction.
Like the Brattons and Virginia lacrosse.

 
___________________________
Al DeFlorio '65
 
Re: Injuries
Posted by: ugarte (---.177.169.163.IPYX-102276-ZYO.zip.zayo.com)
Date: February 09, 2018 10:04AM

BearLover
ugarte
BearLover
Whether to post about injuries mentioned in Schafer's weekly letter is a practical, not ethical, issue: we don't want other teams finding out. Obviously Schafer stating the injury situation/the Sun publishing it renders this conversation moot, but I have gotten the sense that when Schafer says something in the weekly email or at a Coach's Club meeting, but doesn't disclose it outside of that, he means for it to stay private (i.e., we probably shouldn't post about it here).
There is nothing - literally nothing - that Schafer puts in the alumni newsletter or says in a group setting - that he doesn't expect to show up in the IJ.
And you know this how?
Because he's not a fucking moron.

 
___________________________
Jokes and stuff
 
Re: Injuries
Posted by: CU2007 (---.sub-70-214-64.myvzw.com)
Date: February 09, 2018 10:14AM

ugarte
BearLover
ugarte
BearLover
Whether to post about injuries mentioned in Schafer's weekly letter is a practical, not ethical, issue: we don't want other teams finding out. Obviously Schafer stating the injury situation/the Sun publishing it renders this conversation moot, but I have gotten the sense that when Schafer says something in the weekly email or at a Coach's Club meeting, but doesn't disclose it outside of that, he means for it to stay private (i.e., we probably shouldn't post about it here).
There is nothing - literally nothing - that Schafer puts in the alumni newsletter or says in a group setting - that he doesn't expect to show up in the IJ.
And you know this how?
Because he's not a fucking moron.

YIKES. It’s true though. If Schafer were trying to keep secrets, he wouldn’t put anything in some mailing list, nor blab about it at a luncheon. He’d keep it a secret.
 
Re: Injuries
Posted by: Trotsky (---.dc.dc.cox.net)
Date: February 09, 2018 10:21AM

CU2007
YIKES. It’s true though. If Schafer were trying to keep secrets, he wouldn’t put anything in some mailing list, nor blab about it at a luncheon. He’d keep it a secret.

No. That's just what they'll be expecting us to do.


Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 02/09/2018 10:23AM by Trotsky.

 
Re: Injuries
Posted by: Jim Hyla (---.239.191.68.cl.cstel.com)
Date: February 09, 2018 10:35AM

ugarte
BearLover
ugarte
BearLover
Whether to post about injuries mentioned in Schafer's weekly letter is a practical, not ethical, issue: we don't want other teams finding out. Obviously Schafer stating the injury situation/the Sun publishing it renders this conversation moot, but I have gotten the sense that when Schafer says something in the weekly email or at a Coach's Club meeting, but doesn't disclose it outside of that, he means for it to stay private (i.e., we probably shouldn't post about it here).
There is nothing - literally nothing - that Schafer puts in the alumni newsletter or says in a group setting - that he doesn't expect to show up in the IJ.
And you know this how?
Because he's not a fucking moron.

+1

 
___________________________
"Cornell Fans Made the Timbers Tremble", Boston Globe, March/1970
Cornell lawyers stopped the candy throwing. Jan/2005
 
Re: Injuries
Posted by: toddlose (---.hsd1.nj.comcast.net)
Date: February 09, 2018 10:36AM

Jim Hyla
ugarte
BearLover
ugarte
BearLover
Whether to post about injuries mentioned in Schafer's weekly letter is a practical, not ethical, issue: we don't want other teams finding out. Obviously Schafer stating the injury situation/the Sun publishing it renders this conversation moot, but I have gotten the sense that when Schafer says something in the weekly email or at a Coach's Club meeting, but doesn't disclose it outside of that, he means for it to stay private (i.e., we probably shouldn't post about it here).
There is nothing - literally nothing - that Schafer puts in the alumni newsletter or says in a group setting - that he doesn't expect to show up in the IJ.
And you know this how?
Because he's not a fucking moron.

+1

+2
 
Re: Injuries
Posted by: BearLover (---.nycmny.fios.verizon.net)
Date: February 09, 2018 11:08AM

ugarte
BearLover
ugarte
BearLover
Whether to post about injuries mentioned in Schafer's weekly letter is a practical, not ethical, issue: we don't want other teams finding out. Obviously Schafer stating the injury situation/the Sun publishing it renders this conversation moot, but I have gotten the sense that when Schafer says something in the weekly email or at a Coach's Club meeting, but doesn't disclose it outside of that, he means for it to stay private (i.e., we probably shouldn't post about it here).
There is nothing - literally nothing - that Schafer puts in the alumni newsletter or says in a group setting - that he doesn't expect to show up in the IJ.
And you know this how?
Because he's not a fucking moron.
Yeah, but you edited out my follow-up question: Does it ever actually show up in the IJ? Or anywhere? I've been following CU hockey for a decade and I can't remember a single instance where something Schafer said at a luncheon or in an email ended up in an article. Most of the time Schafer will reveal injury information at the Coach's Club lunch that never even makes it into the email, let alone a newspaper. Unless you believe spies from other teams are paying $1000 for a Coach's Club membership and attending Schafer's lunches, there's no basis for what you're saying. I don't know why Schafer went public with the information this time, but he almost never does (and Brandon Thomas on Twitter has been equally tight-lipped about it when asked), despite lunch attendees being told the status of hurt players.
 
Re: Injuries
Posted by: CAS (---.dia.static.qwest.net)
Date: February 09, 2018 11:13AM

+1 (BearLover)
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/09/2018 11:14AM by CAS.
 
Re: Injuries
Posted by: ugarte (---.177.169.163.ipyx-102276-zyo.zip.zayo.com)
Date: February 09, 2018 11:34AM

BearLover
ugarte
BearLover
ugarte
BearLover
Whether to post about injuries mentioned in Schafer's weekly letter is a practical, not ethical, issue: we don't want other teams finding out. Obviously Schafer stating the injury situation/the Sun publishing it renders this conversation moot, but I have gotten the sense that when Schafer says something in the weekly email or at a Coach's Club meeting, but doesn't disclose it outside of that, he means for it to stay private (i.e., we probably shouldn't post about it here).
There is nothing - literally nothing - that Schafer puts in the alumni newsletter or says in a group setting - that he doesn't expect to show up in the IJ.
And you know this how?
Because he's not a fucking moron.
Yeah, but you edited out my follow-up question: Does it ever actually show up in the IJ? Or anywhere? I've been following CU hockey for a decade and I can't remember a single instance where something Schafer said at a luncheon or in an email ended up in an article. Most of the time Schafer will reveal injury information at the Coach's Club lunch that never even makes it into the email, let alone a newspaper. Unless you believe spies from other teams are paying $1000 for a Coach's Club membership and attending Schafer's lunches, there's no basis for what you're saying. I don't know why Schafer went public with the information this time, but he almost never does (and Brandon Thomas on Twitter has been equally tight-lipped about it when asked), despite lunch attendees being told the status of hurt players.
My answer to this is if the coach is giving out info to insiders that the insiders manage against all odds to keep quiet. do not come to eLF and brag that you have insider information that discretion keeps you from revealing.

 
___________________________
Jokes and stuff
 
Re: Injuries
Posted by: Dafatone (---.sub-174-217-18.myvzw.com)
Date: February 09, 2018 11:40AM

I wonder if any of us could get a chance to actually ask Schafer if he considers those emails private.
 
Re: Injuries
Posted by: RichH (---.hsd1.ct.comcast.net)
Date: February 09, 2018 11:45AM

Dafatone
I wonder if any of us could get a chance to actually ask Schafer if he considers those emails private.

If only there were a sticky thread on this very forum. (edit: yeah, nothing really came of that Q&A, since it says it would happen at the beginning of this season. Or maybe those responsible just got too busy.)
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/09/2018 11:47AM by RichH.
 
Re: Injuries
Posted by: Swampy (---.163.128.131.dhcp.uri.edu)
Date: February 09, 2018 01:27PM

Dafatone
I wonder if any of us could get a chance to actually ask Schafer if he considers those emails private.

But even if he considers the emails private, other coaches still could learn what's in them by cheating.
 
Re: Injuries
Posted by: andyw2100 (---.twcny.res.rr.com)
Date: February 09, 2018 02:40PM

ugarte
do not come to eLF and brag that you have insider information that discretion keeps you from revealing.

I feel like this was directed at me and I don't feel like that's what I did.

Here's what I said in my first post, in response to Greg's post:

andyw2100
Trotsky
Note that people should be extremely circumspect about posting anything to this thread that is not public information, for obvious reasons.

Would you consider information on injuries from Coach Schafer, sent to whatever his e-mail distribution list is, to be "public" enough to post? I imagine many of us received an email message from him this afternoon which has the same information about Vanderlaan, and some additional information. I was going to share that info here, with a comment on the above, but will wait to make sure the consensus here (or just Greg's opinion) is that it is OK to do so.

I stated, and believed, that many members of eLynah had probably received the same email message that I did. That wasn't "bragging." I wanted to share the information, but when I read Greg's post thought that I better check first.
 
Re: Injuries
Posted by: daredevilcu (---.static.optonline.net)
Date: February 09, 2018 03:43PM

BigRedHockeyFan
Gotta wonder how many Clarkson players are hurting. They have slacked off, starting with the Harvard tie.

Per Casey Jones, the Knights have had similar illness issues that Cornell has had the last couple weeks. I can say from personal experience that the flu has run rampant through Potsdam. A large contingent of alumni were up for the Brown/Yale weekend, half of us got the flu including me. I'm still shaking it off two weeks later, and it's a brutal one. The team was hit with it a couple weeks prior, so hopefully they were able to have a full week of practice this week and start getting back on track. The fatigue at the end of the weekend the last 3 weeks has been noticeable, and it wasn't like that at any point in the first semester.
 
Re: Injuries
Posted by: scoop85 (---.nyc.biz.rr.com)
Date: February 09, 2018 05:31PM

daredevilcu
BigRedHockeyFan
Gotta wonder how many Clarkson players are hurting. They have slacked off, starting with the Harvard tie.

Per Casey Jones, the Knights have had similar illness issues that Cornell has had the last couple weeks. I can say from personal experience that the flu has run rampant through Potsdam. A large contingent of alumni were up for the Brown/Yale weekend, half of us got the flu including me. I'm still shaking it off two weeks later, and it's a brutal one. The team was hit with it a couple weeks prior, so hopefully they were able to have a full week of practice this week and start getting back on track. The fatigue at the end of the weekend the last 3 weeks has been noticeable, and it wasn't like that at any point in the first semester.

It is a tough grind, and both of our teams are seeing the effects of that.
 

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