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Frozen Four

Posted by Jim Hyla 
Frozen Four
Posted by: Jim Hyla (---.syrcny.fios.verizon.net)
Date: April 02, 2015 10:44AM

Poll
Who are you rooting for?
This poll has expired. Voting is no longer possible.
48 votes were received.
Boston University 14
 
29%
Nebraska-Omaha 11
 
23%
North Dakota 2
 
4%
Providence 15
 
31%
All of the above 1
 
2%
None of the above 5
 
10%



My choice is BU. Although they are a rival, I've always enjoyed watching them, and for some reason they are my favorite HE team.

 
___________________________
"Cornell Fans Made the Timbers Tremble", Boston Globe, March/1970
Cornell lawyers stopped the candy throwing. Jan/2005
 
Re: Frozen Four
Posted by: Trotsky (---.dc.dc.cox.net)
Date: April 02, 2015 01:37PM

Man, that's tough. Maybe the toughest choice ever.

I guess... Providence? I guess?

Jeez, I dunno. I thought I could at least kick UNO out, but the idea of the national champion coming from Nebraska is too funny to dismiss casually.

I think this will be one of those times where I figure it out midway through the game, like in the regional in the 90's where I found myself rooting for Harvard even though I thought that was impossible.
 
Re: Frozen Four
Posted by: gjp84 (---.hfc.comcastbusiness.net)
Date: April 02, 2015 02:24PM

Providence - mainly due to fondness for the battles we had with them from '78-81 and admiration for the style of hockey they played then, but not really anything they've done since. Their current team, though, reminds me of their teams from that era. Plus the Jankowski connection; he would have looked good in Red.
 
Re: Frozen Four
Posted by: RichH (134.223.230.---)
Date: April 02, 2015 02:35PM

Trotsky
Man, that's tough. Maybe the toughest choice ever.

Nah. 2005 all-WCHA. In Ohio. After a bitter OT loss. Bleah. I needed had a lot of Grain Belts to get through that one.



I think this will be one of those times where I figure it out midway through the game, like in the regional in the 90's where I found myself rooting for Harvard even though I thought that was impossible.

The heart wants what it wants.

I'll learn what that is come next Thursday, but let's go through the rationalization exercise:

Boston University
Eh. I'm OK with them winning it. They're like our HEA cousin. Our more successful cousin. Their fans are more like us and infinitely more tolerable than BC SuperFans. Uncle Jack no longer behind the bench. Downside: too much Eichel talk.

Providence College
A program that has lurked in the shadows of the HEA powers for so long. I don't know why they don't have more fans (basketball school? Hockey is option 2?). I like Gillies as a player, and there will be more opportunity for 1985 Chris Terreri (and by induction, 1985 RPI) highlights. I've always liked their jerseys. It would piss off Brown announcers fans, if they existed. Still theoretical.

Nebraska-Omaha
Haha, Nebraska. Well, it would be interesting if hockey got a mention in the Lincoln media. I usually want a program to pay its tournament dues before success (which could also apply to PC).

North Dakota
Sigh. Again? Their fans are everywhere. Like Wisconsin's, but indescribably more annoying. Fans will always wear the old logo as if they're fighting for something righteous. Return to the status quo? I hate green mylar wigs.


Eh. I want to see something memorable, like 2009. And I don't really care whose souls and dreams are crushed in the process.
Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 04/02/2015 02:42PM by RichH.
 
Re: Frozen Four
Posted by: marty (---.sub-70-209-139.myvzw.com)
Date: April 02, 2015 02:51PM

Providence with Kevin Sneddon getting an assist for helping them play at home or North Dakota as a kick to the NCAA for making them drop the mascot, because it will be 10 or 20 years before they drop the mascot.
 
Re: Frozen Four
Posted by: Trotsky (---.dc.dc.cox.net)
Date: April 02, 2015 03:13PM

marty
North Dakota as a kick to the NCAA for making them drop the mascot, because it will be 10 or 20 years before they drop the mascot.
They're never really dropping it. It's their green barchetta.

I love how they talk about the "no name" and then pan the crowd and 100% of the fans are still wearing it.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/02/2015 03:14PM by Trotsky.
 
Re: Frozen Four
Posted by: Dafatone (---.pols.usd.edu)
Date: April 02, 2015 04:08PM

Trotsky
marty
North Dakota as a kick to the NCAA for making them drop the mascot, because it will be 10 or 20 years before they drop the mascot.
They're never really dropping it. It's their green barchetta.

I love how they talk about the "no name" and then pan the crowd and 100% of the fans are still wearing it.

You know how some states have strange logos for their state highways? They still use a silhoutte of a similar headress thing on all their highway signs.
 
Re: Frozen Four
Posted by: Jeff Hopkins '82 (204.27.156.---)
Date: April 02, 2015 04:17PM

I still remember when we played BU as a real rival. Can't root for them.

I don't really have much against UNO or UND. But the concept of the NCHC rubs me the wrong way. Every other conference is regional and they're "National." A little self-important, IMO.

So, Providence by default.

But part of me also wants to see all of the Sioux uniforms in the crowd, just to thumb their noses at the NC$$. So let's make it a PC vs non-PC final. dribble
 
Re: Frozen Four
Posted by: scoop85 (---.nyc.biz.rr.com)
Date: April 02, 2015 04:27PM

Providence by process of elimination
 
Re: Frozen Four
Posted by: Scersk '97 (---.hsd1.ct.comcast.net)
Date: April 02, 2015 04:31PM

Dafatone
Trotsky
marty
North Dakota as a kick to the NCAA for making them drop the mascot, because it will be 10 or 20 years before they drop the mascot.
They're never really dropping it. It's their green barchetta.

I love how they talk about the "no name" and then pan the crowd and 100% of the fans are still wearing it.

You know how some states have strange logos for their state highways? They still use a silhoutte of a similar headress thing on all their highway signs.

What, you mean like this?


 
Re: Frozen Four
Posted by: Trotsky (---.dc.dc.cox.net)
Date: April 02, 2015 04:35PM

Scersk '97
Dafatone
Trotsky
marty
North Dakota as a kick to the NCAA for making them drop the mascot, because it will be 10 or 20 years before they drop the mascot.
They're never really dropping it. It's their green barchetta.

I love how they talk about the "no name" and then pan the crowd and 100% of the fans are still wearing it.

You know how some states have strange logos for their state highways? They still use a silhoutte of a similar headress thing on all their highway signs.

What, you mean like this?

Their state highway signs are awesome.
 
Re: Frozen Four
Posted by: Dafatone (---.pols.usd.edu)
Date: April 02, 2015 05:05PM

Trotsky
Scersk '97
Dafatone
Trotsky
marty
North Dakota as a kick to the NCAA for making them drop the mascot, because it will be 10 or 20 years before they drop the mascot.
They're never really dropping it. It's their green barchetta.

I love how they talk about the "no name" and then pan the crowd and 100% of the fans are still wearing it.

You know how some states have strange logos for their state highways? They still use a silhoutte of a similar headress thing on all their highway signs.

What, you mean like this?

Their state highway signs are awesome.

It may seem like a meaningless designation, but keeping headdresses out of these things is relatively important, from what I understand. So, somehow, the Southern Tier Expressway sign is better. Slightly.
 
Re: Frozen Four
Posted by: ACM (---.twcny.res.rr.com)
Date: April 02, 2015 08:28PM

For me, the hierarchy is pretty clear:

BU - Brian Kelley, BU's AAD for Communications, is an IC grad, and a former assistant director of athletic communications at Cornell, and an all-around good guy who I'd be happy to have associated with a national championship. And it's the only chance we'll have next year to knock off the defending national champions, when we play BU at the Garden.

Providence - Len Jankowski, Mark Jankowski's dad, played at Cornell. Nate Leaman is a former ECAC coach, a former Spencer Penrose winner as national coach-of-the year, and a two-time winner of ECAC coach-of-the year.

UNO - we played them earlier in the season, so if they win, we have a chance to move from like 33rd to 32nd in KVETCH or Crotch, or whatever your favorite metric for ranking mediocre teams is.

UND - nothing whatsoever.
 
Re: Frozen Four
Posted by: Bahnstorm (---.twcny.res.rr.com)
Date: April 04, 2015 10:41PM

ACM
For me, the hierarchy is pretty clear:

BU - Brian Kelley, BU's AAD for Communications, is an IC grad, and a former assistant director of athletic communications at Cornell, and an all-around good guy who I'd be happy to have associated with a national championship. And it's the only chance we'll have next year to knock off the defending national champions, when we play BU at the Garden.

Providence - Len Jankowski, Mark Jankowski's dad, played at Cornell. Nate Leaman is a former ECAC coach, a former Spencer Penrose winner as national coach-of-the year, and a two-time winner of ECAC coach-of-the year.

UNO - we played them earlier in the season, so if they win, we have a chance to move from like 33rd to 32nd in KVETCH or Crotch, or whatever your favorite metric for ranking mediocre teams is.

UND - nothing whatsoever.

That is pretty much my feelings on this one right down the line, particularly the UND part. I have perhaps the added incentive (for household harmony) to pull for BU as the significant other is a BU hockey fan and BU alum first followed by CU fan and CU alum later. (Though the degrees in the house are still 4-2 CU to BU, the Red Hot hockey game has been contentious) Mostly I just want exciting games.
Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 04/05/2015 12:53PM by Bahnstorm.
 
Re: Frozen Four
Posted by: billhoward (---.hsd1.nj.comcast.net)
Date: April 08, 2015 09:32PM

I'm rooting for BU on account of our son is one of the penalty box doorkeepers there, a paying job for students where at Cornell the same job is done by an associate vice president. I'm rooting for BU or Providence because I'd like to see the East win 4 in a row and 7 of the last 8. So much for that western supremacy crap (10 of 12) preceding the East's 2008-2014 run.
 
Re: Frozen Four
Posted by: Trotsky (---.hsd1.md.comcast.net)
Date: April 08, 2015 10:32PM

billhoward
where at Cornell the same job is done by an associate vice president.
Seems about right.
 
Re: Frozen Four
Posted by: ACM (---.twcny.res.rr.com)
Date: April 09, 2015 10:17AM

billhoward
... where at Cornell the same job is done by an associate vice president.

Not since 2009.
 
Re: Frozen Four
Posted by: Beeeej (Moderator)
Date: April 09, 2015 10:52AM

Trotsky
marty
North Dakota as a kick to the NCAA for making them drop the mascot, because it will be 10 or 20 years before they drop the mascot.
They're never really dropping it. It's their green barchetta.

I love how they talk about the "no name" and then pan the crowd and 100% of the fans are still wearing it.

I would've put the estimate at closer to 115%.

 
___________________________
Beeeej, Esq.

"Cornell isn't an organization. It's a loose affiliation of independent fiefdoms united by a common hockey team."
- Steve Worona
 
Re: Frozen Four
Posted by: Chuck Henderson (---.twcny.res.rr.com)
Date: April 09, 2015 08:58PM

I've never been bothered by BU's winning in recent times. They are/were a big rival but a good one. The relationship Arthur mentions also counts a little. UNO seems so irrelevant to Cornell in terms of recruiting that I don't care; holding our own against them this season is a slight plus if they win. UND wins so much that it doesn't change anything if they win again. I've never liked Providence.

gjp84
Providence - mainly due to fondness for the battles we had with them from '78-81 and admiration for the style of hockey they played then, but not really anything they've done since.

While those Providence teams had some good players (Korn), I always thought they were the epitome of a clutch and grab team for that era.

 
___________________________
Chuck Henderson '64
 
Re: Frozen Four
Posted by: Dafatone (64.122.145.---)
Date: April 10, 2015 01:17AM

Man was it nice to see UND lose.

I don't really care too much between BU and Providence. I would have liked to see UNO win, but I wasn't exactly invested.
 
Re: Frozen Four
Posted by: Trotsky (---.dc.dc.cox.net)
Date: April 10, 2015 09:21AM

With an all-East final, this will be the first string of 4 consecutive East champions in history.
 
Re: Frozen Four - BU 5, ND 3
Posted by: billhoward (---.hsd1.nj.comcast.net)
Date: April 10, 2015 10:21AM

Shades of 1973 NCAA semifinal in old Boston Garden: Cornell up by 3 in the third period on Wisconsin, Wisconsin chips away and gets it to 5-4 late. Where Jack Eichel last night sank the empty netter to keep ND from tying, Cornell gave up the tying goal and then lost 6-5 in OT. Saddest Cornell game I saw until Syracuse-Cornell lax in 2009.
 
Re: Frozen Four - "students come last" ticket allocations
Posted by: billhoward (---.hsd1.nj.comcast.net)
Date: April 10, 2015 10:26AM

USCHO on more lip service to the NCAA being for and about students and student athletes. [www.uscho.com]

Brian Sullivan, USCHO
BOSTON — There are 17,565 sellable seats for each hockey game at Boston’s TD Garden. The Bruins tend to fill them all, and the NCAA was pleased to put a body on every cushion this weekend as well. Yet, with a capacity greater than the total undergraduate enrollment at any of the four participating schools, fewer than 400 of those 17,565 tickets — 2.3 percent — ever made their way to actual students.
 
Re: Frozen Four - BU 5, ND 3
Posted by: Trotsky (---.dc.dc.cox.net)
Date: April 10, 2015 10:41AM

billhoward
Shades of 1973 NCAA semifinal in old Boston Garden: Cornell up by 3 in the third period on Wisconsin, Wisconsin chips away and gets it to 5-4 late. Where Jack Eichel last night sank the empty netter to keep ND from tying, Cornell gave up the tying goal and then lost 6-5 in OT. Saddest Cornell game I saw until Syracuse-Cornell lax in 2009.
This is the closest I can come up with to an analogy since 1981. It was the second game of a best-of-two where the first game was tied in virtually identical fashion with the roles reversed. The stakes, of course, were far lower.
 
Re: Frozen Four
Posted by: BMac (72.22.181.---)
Date: April 10, 2015 11:03AM

The UNO-Providence game was merely ok, but made better by sitting right in front of the PC band.

BU-NoDak was a great game. My BU friends were super surprised at coming out strong in the first, then biting their nails for the third period. Exact opposite of every other BU game this year, where they've been flat in the first and strong in the third.

My first Frozen Four was a fun experience- wish I'd known to wear my Cornell jersey. Had a lot of fun playing hockey-school bingo in my head (finding one of every school). I even found the Harvard fan.
 
Re: Frozen Four
Posted by: billhoward (---.hsd1.nj.comcast.net)
Date: April 10, 2015 11:27AM

BMac
My first Frozen Four was a fun experience- wish I'd known to wear my Cornell jersey. Had a lot of fun playing hockey-school bingo in my head (finding one of every school). I even found the Harvard fan.
Frozen Four is one place where it's nice, a gathering of all the hockey faithful, and you don't get harrassed for wearing your team's jersey.

Did you sense there were not many students from the four schools in the arena? The USCHO said very few tickets were allocated for students, though students could buy in through other means. On TV you could closeups of all-UND cheering section(s) or BU.
 
Re: Frozen Four
Posted by: BMac (72.22.181.---)
Date: April 10, 2015 12:55PM

Yeah, the student sections were pretty thin. BU had a whole section on the balcony that looked about the same size as their section for the HEA semis, but smaller than what you'd see at Agganis.

UNO had a band and some cheerleaders. I heard that they brought three buses from Omaha full of students. $250 for travel, hotel and tickets. I can't imagine that ride back.

PC had really small representation. I did love their goal celebration: "Yes! Yes! Yes! Yes! Yes! Yes!" Apparently it's some WWE thing.

NoDak travels welllll. I was impressed with their huge section down below. A TON of people, and real loud. Plus their band was impressively loud and mean. I... liked them? One funny observation: the adults below would start "Let's Go Sioux" cheers all the time; the band never ever said the word "Sioux." I wonder if they've been gagged. They really should just change it to the "Fighting Susans."
 
Re: Frozen Four
Posted by: Trotsky (---.dc.dc.cox.net)
Date: April 10, 2015 01:04PM

BMac
They really should just change it to the "Fighting Susans."
Wisco refers to them as "the Fighting Snot."
 
Re: Frozen Four
Posted by: Al DeFlorio (---.hsd1.ma.comcast.net)
Date: April 10, 2015 02:45PM

Trotsky
With an all-East final, this will be the first string of 4 consecutive East champions in history.
And seven of the last eight. Real progress from three of the first 22 (with two of those three Ned's).

 
___________________________
Al DeFlorio '65
 
Re: Frozen Four
Posted by: tominvb (---.hsd1.fl.comcast.net)
Date: April 11, 2015 09:07AM

That 73 semi versus Wisconsin still sticks in my craw. Up by 3 and Coach Bertrand leaves the first line in 6 plus minutes of the last 8. Hate Bertrand - Hate Wisconsin. Did enjoy beating them up in Jaxs a few years ago in the March Madness tournement.

Better Days are coming as they say. Enjoy the summer folks.
Tom in Vero
 
Re: Frozen Four
Posted by: RichH (---.hsd1.ct.comcast.net)
Date: April 11, 2015 10:52AM

One of the more personally depressing things is the order the school championship banners are hung in the arena. Every other year, they've gone alphabetical, and we've enjoyed a nice spot around center-ice. This year, they're in order of most recent championship.

Thank goodness for Colorado College.
Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 04/11/2015 10:53AM by RichH.
 
Re: Frozen Four
Posted by: BMac (107.77.70.---)
Date: April 11, 2015 01:54PM

Ha, I made the exact same post on facebook, down to the "thank goodness for CC"

Here's the pic for everyone else's commiseration

[imgur.com]
 
Re: Frozen Four
Posted by: billhoward (---.hsd1.nj.comcast.net)
Date: April 11, 2015 06:58PM

tominvb
That 73 semi versus Wisconsin still sticks in my craw. Up by 3 and Coach Bertrand leaves the first line in 6 plus minutes of the last 8. Hate Bertrand - Hate Wisconsin. Did enjoy beating them up in Jaxs a few years ago in the March Madness tournement.

Better Days are coming as they say. Enjoy the summer folks.
Tom in Vero
I still recall how bleeping hot, steamy hot, the arena was. Also, at the time the press box was at the very front edge of the balcony. When fans stamped, the upper deck moved, especially the unattached edge. You could see whitecaps in the coffee. You gotta admit Wisconsin fans were every bit as insanely passionate about hockey as we were. The year before, virtually every fan showed up to root for Wisconsin over Denver (the team we demolished 7-2 before running into the BU buzzsaw the second week in a row in Boston Garden) in the consolation game. Yes, there were consolation games, and the last five minutes Wisconsin fans played a looping tape: "Best in the West! [stomp feet]"

I am about to don a Cornell jersey to watch the game and hear the dulcet tones of Barry Melrose. Rooting for BU since it'll be all the sweeter if we can unbuckle the championship belt from them in MSG next Thanksgiving.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/11/2015 07:00PM by billhoward.
 
Re: Frozen Four
Posted by: Iceberg (---.nycmny.fios.verizon.net)
Date: April 11, 2015 10:07PM

This game has gotten very...interesting.
 
Re: Frozen Four
Posted by: Trotsky (---.hsd1.md.comcast.net)
Date: April 11, 2015 10:21PM

Congratulations to Providence on their first national championship.
 
Re: Frozen Four - Providence 4 BU 3
Posted by: billhoward (---.hsd1.nj.comcast.net)
Date: April 11, 2015 10:28PM

Trotsky
Congratulations to Providence on their first national championship.
Sympathies to Bill Buckner's son in goal at the other end.
 
Re: Frozen Four
Posted by: ugarte (---.dyn.optonline.net)
Date: April 11, 2015 10:34PM

Just. Get. In.

 
 
Re: Frozen Four
Posted by: Trotsky (---.hsd1.md.comcast.net)
Date: April 11, 2015 10:44PM

ugarte
Just. Get. In.
Boy, I'll say. That's 2 of the last 3 where a team barely scraped in and then got hot.

I wonder if Nate Leaman would like another challenge..?
 
Re: Frozen Four
Posted by: Give My Regards (---.twcny.res.rr.com)
Date: April 11, 2015 10:49PM

Providence wins their first NCAA championship, the third first-time winner in a row after Yale in 2013 and Union last year. This is the first time there have been three consecutive first-time championship winners since Michigan, Boston College, and Colorado College turned the trick in 1948-50, which were the first three NCAA championships played.

 
___________________________
If you lead a good life, go to Sunday school and church, and say your prayers every night, when you die, you'll go to LYNAH!
 
Re: Frozen Four
Posted by: Swampy (---.ri.ri.cox.net)
Date: April 12, 2015 12:24AM

BMac
Ha, I made the exact same post on facebook, down to the "thank goodness for CC"

Here's the pic for everyone else's commiseration

[imgur.com]

Gawd! Cornell hockey's national dominance is becoming almost as antiquarian as Cornell football's.
 
Re: Frozen Four
Posted by: Swampy (---.ri.ri.cox.net)
Date: April 12, 2015 12:29AM

Trotsky
ugarte
Just. Get. In.
Boy, I'll say. That's 2 of the last 3 where a team barely scraped in and then got hot.

I wonder if Nate Leaman would like another challenge..?

If not him, the Associate Coach Miller apparently played a major role in PC's ascension and at Denver before that.
 
Re: Frozen Four
Posted by: BearLover (---.wrls.harvard.edu)
Date: April 12, 2015 02:33AM

ugarte
Just. Get. In.
If only the ECAC still sucked...
 
Re: Frozen Four
Posted by: Al DeFlorio (---.hsd1.ma.comcast.net)
Date: April 12, 2015 04:28AM

BearLover
ugarte
Just. Get. In.
If only the ECAC still sucked...
Utter nonsense.

 
___________________________
Al DeFlorio '65
 
Re: Frozen Four
Posted by: jtwcornell91 (Moderator)
Date: April 12, 2015 04:45AM

Al DeFlorio
BearLover
ugarte
Just. Get. In.
If only the ECAC still sucked...
Utter nonsense.
Yeah, I haven't checked but I'm pretty sure the title has never been won by a team that needed an auto bid to qualify since they went to 16 (probably 12 and maybe even 8) teams.

 
___________________________
JTW

Enjoy the latest hockey geek tools at [www.elynah.com]
 
Re: Frozen Four
Posted by: BMac (---.mycingular.net)
Date: April 12, 2015 10:21AM

Good picture, but this one's even better:

 
Re: Frozen Four
Posted by: BMac (---.mycingular.net)
Date: April 12, 2015 10:42AM

Speaking of luck: Trevor Mingoia transferred from Union to PC, watched his teammates win the championship, and yesterday got to win his own.

[www.bostonherald.com]
 
Re: Frozen Four
Posted by: BearLover (---.wrls.harvard.edu)
Date: April 12, 2015 01:16PM

jtwcornell91
Al DeFlorio
BearLover
ugarte
Just. Get. In.
If only the ECAC still sucked...
Utter nonsense.
Yeah, I haven't checked but I'm pretty sure the title has never been won by a team that needed an auto bid to qualify since they went to 16 (probably 12 and maybe even 8) teams.
Cornell almost never needed an auto bid to qualify when the ECAC sucked. (Only in '96 and '97, right?)

And y'all can think whatever you want, and let's not have this discussion again, but I've seen nothing good for Cornell come from the ECAC's improvement. Objectively, they've been winning less games and making the tournament less--that much is not debatable.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/12/2015 01:19PM by BearLover.
 
Re: Frozen Four
Posted by: RichH (---.hsd1.ct.comcast.net)
Date: April 12, 2015 02:21PM

BearLover
And y'all can think whatever you want,

Ugh. I hate the word "y'all" and it's explosion in educated social media circles. Stop with the folksy.



and let's not have this discussion again,

Hahaha, good one. You do know where you're posting, right? But I agree, this argument is really tired, especially when it's 2 vs. everybody else.



but I've seen nothing good for Cornell come from the ECAC's improvement. Objectively, they've been winning less games and making the tournament less--that much is not debatable.

I tend to respect your opinion, after a lot of thought, and I even think you even make solid points with this quixotic mission. But I don't agree. Two things keep bringing me back: recruiting and SOS. The league had been trending to being lumped in with the MAAC/AHA as a minor conference. Teams like Denver, North Dakota, and Michigan State...would they want to waste their trips East on a league that has a pedigree on par with Sacred Heart and AIC? Would top recruits want to look at schools that are viewed as the analogue of Holy Cross or a BC-level schedule?

The ECAC was a punchline. Now, it's relevant in the national conversation. That only attracts better talent and better opponents to Cornell.

Do you think BU, Providence, North Dakota, and UNO were unhappy they all had to play in strong conferences? Were they successful because of the competition they faced, or in spite of it?

Time travel to 1977 or 1989 or 2000 and your comment about "winning (fewer) games and making the tournament less" also holds, but the conference was just as strong as when Cornell WAS winning. Your argument isn't passing the causality test with me.
 
Re: Frozen Four
Posted by: Kyle Rose (---.c3-0.smr-ubr2.sbo-smr.ma.static.cable.rcn.com)
Date: April 12, 2015 08:19PM

RichH
BearLover
And y'all can think whatever you want,

Ugh. I hate the word "y'all" and it's explosion in educated social media circles. Stop with the folksy.

Yeah, BearLover: it's "all y'all". Get it right.

 
___________________________
[ home | FB ]
 
Re: Frozen Four
Posted by: redice (---.stny.res.rr.com)
Date: April 12, 2015 08:48PM

I'll say this about the FF: The BU fans were a disgrace!! Going into the FF, one would consider them the local team. That's not how the crowd noise made it seem from within the arena. If the BU fans came to the TD Garden to sit on their hands, rather than cheer their team on to victory, why didn't they just stay home. Were Cornell in the tournement, the Lynah Faithful would have easily screamed this lame BU bunch into oblivion. The PC fans were wonderful!!

 
___________________________
"If a player won't go in the corners, he might as well take up checkers."

-Ned Harkness
 
Re: Frozen Four
Posted by: Chris '03 (---.dyn.optonline.net)
Date: April 12, 2015 09:18PM

redice
I'll say this about the FF: The BU fans were a disgrace!! Going into the FF, one would consider them the local team. That's not how the crowd noise made it seem from within the arena. If the BU fans came to the TD Garden to sit on their hands, rather than cheer their team on to victory, why didn't they just stay home. Were Cornell in the tournement, the Lynah Faithful would have easily screamed this lame BU bunch into oblivion. The PC fans were wonderful!!

The building was probably 50/50 with everyone but BU partisans pulling for PC.

For what it's worth, I remember being underwhelmed by the Cornell fans at the '03 FF. It's hard to be cohesive in that setting.

 
___________________________
"Mark Mazzoleni looks like a guy whose dog just died out there..."
 
Re: Frozen Four
Posted by: jtwcornell91 (Moderator)
Date: April 13, 2015 09:21AM

BearLover
jtwcornell91
Al DeFlorio
BearLover
ugarte
Just. Get. In.
If only the ECAC still sucked...
Utter nonsense.
Yeah, I haven't checked but I'm pretty sure the title has never been won by a team that needed an auto bid to qualify since they went to 16 (probably 12 and maybe even 8) teams.
Cornell almost never needed an auto bid to qualify when the ECAC sucked. (Only in '96 and '97, right?)

I went back and checked. Cornell needed the auto bid to qualify in 1996 (they were #13 in the PWR with #6 Maine ineligible, but #18 Providence won Hockey East so #12 Bowling Green was the last team out), but not in 1997, when they were tied for #8, with #7 Maine ineligible. But Cornell didn't come close to winning it all either of those years. The point here is that 2013 Yale and 2015 Providence managed to make the tournament at #15 (last at-large bid) and win the title, but they didn't qualify by winning a weak conference. Compare 2010 RIT at #25 and 2009 Bemidji State at #26, who only made the tournament because of their auto-bids, and ended up in the Frozen Four.

1996 Pairwise Comparisons
 1 Boston Univ    18 .621   CCMiLSMnMeWMVtMSCkMLBGCrDUSLCgNDPvMD
 2 CO College     17 .615 __  MiLSMnMeWMVtMSCkMLBGCrDUSLCgNDPvMD
 3 Michigan       16 .616 ____  LSMnMeWMVtMSCkMLBGCrDUSLCgNDPvMD
 4 Lake Superior  15 .605 ______  MnMeWMVtMSCkMLBGCrDUSLCgNDPvMD
 5 Minnesota      14 .603 ________  MeWMVtMSCkMLBGCrDUSLCgNDPvMD
 6 Maine          11 .598 __________  WM__MS__MLBGCrDUSLCgNDPvMD
 7 Western Mich   11 .582 ____________  VtMSCk__BGCrDUSLCgNDPvMD
 8 Vermont        11 .581 __________Me__  __CkMLBGCrDUSLCgNDPvMD
 9 Mich State     10 .582 ______________Vt  Ck__BGCrDUSLCgNDPvMD
10 Clarkson       10 .576 __________Me______  MLBGCrDUSLCgNDPvMD
11 Mass-Lowell    10 .569 ____________WM__MS__  BGCrDUSLCgNDPvMD
12 Bowling Green   7 .560 ______________________  CrDUSLCgNDPvMD
13 Cornell         6 .558 ________________________  DUSLCgNDPvMD
14 Denver U        4 .541 __________________________  SLCgND__MD
15 St Lawrence     4 .535 ____________________________  CgNDPvMD
16 Colgate         3 .522 ______________________________  NDPvMD
17 North Dakota    2 .494 ________________________________  PvMD
18 Providence      2 .549 __________________________DU______  MD
19 Minn-Duluth     0 .502 ____________________________________

1997 Pairwise Comparisons
 1 Michigan       20 .628   CkNDMnBUNHMeCrVtMmDUMSCCRPSCUnPnMDCgBGLS
 2 Clarkson       19 .599 __  NDMnBUNHMeCrVtMmDUMSCCRPSCUnPnMDCgBGLS
 3 North Dakota   18 .588 ____  MnBUNHMeCrVtMmDUMSCCRPSCUnPnMDCgBGLS
 4 Minnesota      16 .581 ______  BU__MeCrVtMmDUMSCCRPSCUnPnMDCgBGLS
 5 Boston Univ    15 .578 ________  NH__CrVtMmDUMSCCRPSCUnPnMDCgBGLS
 6 New Hampshire  15 .592 ______Mn__  MeCr__MmDUMSCCRPSCUnPnMDCgBGLS
 7 Maine          14 .565 ________BU__  __VtMmDUMSCCRPSCUnPnMDCgBGLS
 8 Cornell        13 .567 ____________Me  Vt__DUMSCCRPSCUnPnMDCgBGLS
 9 Vermont        13 .578 __________NH____  MmDUMSCCRPSCUnPnMDCgBGLS
10 Miami          11 .577 ______________Cr__  __MSCCRPSCUnPnMDCgBGLS
11 Denver U       10 .554 __________________Mm  MS__RPSCUnPnMDCgBGLS
12 Mich State      9 .548 ______________________  CCRPSCUnPnMDCgBGLS
13 CO College      9 .557 ____________________DU__  RPSCUnPnMDCgBGLS
14 RPI             7 .538 __________________________  SCUnPnMDCgBGLS
15 St Cloud        6 .540 ____________________________  UnPnMDCgBGLS
16 Union           5 .522 ______________________________  PnMDCgBGLS
17 Princeton       4 .535 ________________________________  MDCgBGLS
18 Minn-Duluth     2 .500 __________________________________  CgBG__
19 Colgate         2 .513 ____________________________________  BGLS
20 Bowling Green   1 .494 ______________________________________  LS
21 Lake Superior   1 .525 __________________________________MD____

 
___________________________
JTW

Enjoy the latest hockey geek tools at [www.elynah.com]
 
Re: Frozen Four
Posted by: jkahn (---.whitingcorp.com)
Date: April 13, 2015 10:48AM

ACM
For me, the hierarchy is pretty clear:

BU - Brian Kelley, BU's AAD for Communications, is an IC grad, and a former assistant director of athletic communications at Cornell, and an all-around good guy who I'd be happy to have associated with a national championship. And it's the only chance we'll have next year to knock off the defending national champions, when we play BU at the Garden.

We will have a chance to knock off the champions. We open the Florida tournament with Providence.

 
___________________________
Jeff Kahn '70 '72
 
Re: Frozen Four
Posted by: Jim Hyla (---.syrcny.fios.verizon.net)
Date: April 15, 2015 07:29AM

Oops, slight, what'll happen with PU?

 
___________________________
"Cornell Fans Made the Timbers Tremble", Boston Globe, March/1970
Cornell lawyers stopped the candy throwing. Jan/2005
 
Re: Frozen Four
Posted by: RichH (134.223.230.---)
Date: April 15, 2015 04:29PM

Jim Hyla
Oops, slight, what'll happen with PU?

I assume you mean PC.

Somebody commented that the BU team didn't go to the White House for their 2009 championship, and they won it in Washington DC. I've never really paid any attention to this perk, so I have no idea if it's standard or not for the hockey champions to get an invite.
 
Re: Frozen Four
Posted by: Scersk '97 (---.hsd1.ct.comcast.net)
Date: April 15, 2015 04:45PM

jtwcornell91
I went back and checked [the PWR for '96 and '97].

Speaking of which, I've been meaning to ask: how did you come up with those? If you recalculated them, did you happen to run a KRACH for those years? Always have been very curious as to how strong the league was in those days. It certainly seemed strong.
 
Re: Frozen Four
Posted by: jtwcornell91 (Moderator)
Date: April 15, 2015 05:41PM

Scersk '97
jtwcornell91
I went back and checked [the PWR for '96 and '97].

Speaking of which, I've been meaning to ask: how did you come up with those? If you recalculated them, did you happen to run a KRACH for those years? Always have been very curious as to how strong the league was in those days. It certainly seemed strong.

I had to re-run the 1996 pairwise, since I had the script lying around but not the output. Here's the KRACH file I have for 1996

 1 CO College    37.11- 4.89-11 .804 0.00000 -0.00000
 2 Michigan      35.05- 6.95-11 .765 0.00000 0.00000
 3 Minnesota     34.99- 7.01-11 .764 0.00000 0.00000
 4 Lake Superior 34.21- 7.79-11 .749 -0.00000 0.00000
 5 Boston Univ   31.71-10.29-11 .702 0.00000 0.00000
 6 Mich State    31.55-10.45-11 .699 -0.00000 0.00000
 7 Western Mich  31.22-10.78-11 .693 0.00000 0.00000
 8 Denver U      30.34-11.66-11 .676 -0.00000 0.00000
 9 Maine         29.02-12.98-11 .651 0.00000 -0.00000
10 Bowling Green 28.87-13.13-11 .649 0.00000 0.00000
11 Vermont       27.70-14.30-11 .626 -0.00000 0.00000
12 Minn-Duluth   27.17-14.83-11 .617 0.00000 -0.00000
13 Michigan Tech 26.90-15.10-11 .611 0.00000 0.00000
14 Mass-Lowell   26.83-15.17-11 .610 -0.00000 0.00000
15 North Dakota  26.80-15.20-11 .609 0.00000 0.00000
16 Clarkson      26.46-15.54-11 .603 0.00000 0.00000
17 Wisconsin     26.10-15.90-11 .596 0.00000 0.00000
18 Providence    24.07-17.93-11 .558 0.00000 -0.00000
19 St Cloud      24.02-17.98-11 .557 0.00000 0.00000
20 Cornell       24.01-17.99-11 .557 0.00000 0.00000
21 St Lawrence   22.20-19.80-11 .523 0.00000 -0.00000
22 AK-Anchorage  21.28-20.72-11 .505 0.00000 0.00000
23 Boston Coll   20.78-21.22-11 .496 0.00000 0.00000
24 Miami         19.95-22.05-11 .480 0.00000 -0.00000
25 Colgate       19.58-22.42-11 .473 0.00000 0.00000
26 Ferris State  18.75-23.25-11 .458 0.00000 0.00000
27 New Hampshire 18.34-23.66-11 .450 0.00000 0.00000
28 Ohio State    18.21-23.79-11 .447 0.00000 -0.00000
29 Notre Dame    17.25-24.75-11 .429 0.00000 -0.00000
30 Northern Mich 16.28-25.72-11 .411 -0.00000 0.00000
31 AK-Fairbanks  14.72-27.28-11 .382 0.00000 -0.00000
32 Mass-Amherst  14.44-27.56-11 .376 0.00000 -0.00000
33 Northeastern  14.21-27.79-11 .372 0.00000 0.00000
34 Harvard       13.14-28.86-11 .352 -0.00000 0.00000
35 Brown         11.24-30.76-11 .316 -0.00000 0.00000
36 Merrimack     11.02-30.98-11 .312 -0.00000 0.00000
37 RPI            9.13-32.87-11 .276 0.00000 0.00000
38 Dartmouth      8.70-33.30-11 .268 0.00000 0.00000
39 Army           7.97-34.03-11 .254 -0.00000 0.00000
40 Princeton      7.79-34.21-11 .251 0.00000 0.00000
41 Union          7.34-34.66-11 .242 -0.00000 -0.00000
42 Yale           5.03-36.97-11 .199 0.00000 0.00000
43 Air Force      1.55-40.45-11 .133 -0.00000 0.00000

                         CMMLBMWDMBVMMMNCWPSCSABMCFNONNAMNHBMRDAPUYA
Team          KRACH RRWP CinSUSMUeGtDTLDkivCrLACmgSHStMkAEanrParnnaF
CO College     1142 .804 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Michigan      733.9 .765 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Minnesota     725.3 .764 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Lake Superior 627.2 .749 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Boston Univ   415.0 .702 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Mich State    405.2 .699 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Western Mich  385.2 .693 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Denver U      338.6 .676 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Maine         281.1 .651 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Bowling Green 275.5 .649 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Vermont       234.8 .626 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Minn-Duluth   219.2 .617 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Michigan Tech 211.3 .611 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Mass-Lowell   209.4 .610 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
North Dakota  208.6 .609 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Clarkson      199.5 .603 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Wisconsin     190.5 .596 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Providence    147.0 .558 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
St Cloud      146.0 .557 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Cornell       145.9 .557 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
St Lawrence   116.2 .523 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
AK-Anchorage  103.5 .505 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Boston Coll   97.22 .496 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Miami         87.59 .480 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Colgate       83.55 .473 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Ferris State  75.22 .458 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
New Hampshire 71.37 .450 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Ohio State    70.22 .447 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Notre Dame    61.96 .429 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Northern Mich 54.50 .411 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
AK-Fairbanks  44.11 .382 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Mass-Amherst  42.43 .376 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Northeastern  41.09 .372 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Harvard       35.20 .352 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Brown         26.43 .316 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Merrimack     25.52 .312 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
RPI           18.54 .276 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Dartmouth     17.17 .268 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Army          14.95 .254 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Princeton     14.44 .251 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Union         13.19 .242 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Yale          7.745 .199 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Air Force     2.059 .133 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
   AA
AA  ~

Group AA

Group 1:
Ratings and intra-group HHWPs:
              RRWP KRACH  CC   Mi   Mn   LS   BU   MS   WM   DU   Me   BG   Vt   MD   MT   ML   ND   Ck   Wi   Pv   SC   Cr   SL   AA   BC   Mm   Cg   FS   NH   OS   Nt   NM   Ak   MA   NE   Ha   Bn   Mr   RP   Da   Ar   Pn   Un   Ya   AF 
CO College    .804  1142 .--- .609 .611 .645 .733 .738 .748 .771 .802 .806 .829 .839 .844 .845 .846 .851 .857 .886 .887 .887 .908 .917 .922 .929 .932 .938 .941 .942 .949 .954 .963 .964 .965 .970 .977 .978 .984 .985 .987 .988 .989 .993 .998
Michigan      .765 733.9 .391 .--- .503 .539 .639 .644 .656 .684 .723 .727 .758 .770 .776 .778 .779 .786 .794 .833 .834 .834 .863 .876 .883 .893 .898 .907 .911 .913 .922 .931 .943 .945 .947 .954 .965 .966 .975 .977 .980 .981 .982 .990 .997
Minnesota     .764 725.3 .389 .497 .--- .536 .636 .642 .653 .682 .721 .725 .755 .768 .774 .776 .777 .784 .792 .831 .832 .832 .862 .875 .882 .892 .897 .906 .910 .912 .921 .930 .943 .945 .946 .954 .965 .966 .975 .977 .980 .980 .982 .989 .997
Lake Superior .749 627.2 .355 .461 .464 .--- .602 .608 .620 .649 .691 .695 .728 .741 .748 .750 .750 .759 .767 .810 .811 .811 .844 .858 .866 .877 .882 .893 .898 .899 .910 .920 .934 .937 .939 .947 .960 .961 .971 .973 .977 .977 .979 .988 .997
Boston Univ   .702 415.0 .267 .361 .364 .398 .--- .506 .519 .551 .596 .601 .639 .654 .663 .665 .665 .675 .685 .738 .740 .740 .781 .800 .810 .826 .832 .847 .853 .855 .870 .884 .904 .907 .910 .922 .940 .942 .957 .960 .965 .966 .969 .982 .995
Mich State    .699 405.2 .262 .356 .358 .392 .494 .--- .513 .545 .590 .595 .633 .649 .657 .659 .660 .670 .680 .734 .735 .735 .777 .797 .806 .822 .829 .843 .850 .852 .867 .881 .902 .905 .908 .920 .939 .941 .956 .959 .964 .966 .968 .981 .995
Western Mich  .693 385.2 .252 .344 .347 .380 .481 .487 .--- .532 .578 .583 .621 .637 .646 .648 .649 .659 .669 .724 .725 .725 .768 .788 .798 .815 .822 .837 .844 .846 .861 .876 .897 .901 .904 .916 .936 .938 .954 .957 .963 .964 .967 .980 .995
Denver U      .676 338.6 .229 .316 .318 .351 .449 .455 .468 .--- .546 .551 .590 .607 .616 .618 .619 .629 .640 .697 .699 .699 .744 .766 .777 .794 .802 .818 .826 .828 .845 .861 .885 .889 .892 .906 .928 .930 .948 .952 .958 .959 .963 .978 .994
Maine         .651 281.1 .198 .277 .279 .309 .404 .410 .422 .454 .--- .505 .545 .562 .571 .573 .574 .585 .596 .657 .658 .658 .707 .731 .743 .762 .771 .789 .798 .800 .819 .838 .864 .869 .872 .889 .914 .917 .938 .942 .949 .951 .955 .973 .993
Bowling Green .649 275.5 .194 .273 .275 .305 .399 .405 .417 .449 .495 .--- .540 .557 .566 .568 .569 .580 .591 .652 .654 .654 .703 .727 .739 .759 .767 .786 .794 .797 .816 .835 .862 .867 .870 .887 .912 .915 .937 .941 .949 .950 .954 .973 .993
Vermont       .626 234.8 .171 .242 .245 .272 .361 .367 .379 .410 .455 .460 .--- .517 .526 .529 .530 .541 .552 .615 .617 .617 .669 .694 .707 .728 .738 .757 .767 .770 .791 .812 .842 .847 .851 .870 .899 .902 .927 .932 .940 .942 .947 .968 .991
Minn-Duluth   .617 219.2 .161 .230 .232 .259 .346 .351 .363 .393 .438 .443 .483 .--- .509 .511 .512 .523 .535 .599 .600 .600 .653 .679 .693 .714 .724 .745 .754 .757 .780 .801 .832 .838 .842 .862 .892 .896 .922 .927 .936 .938 .943 .966 .991
Michigan Tech .611 211.3 .156 .224 .226 .252 .337 .343 .354 .384 .429 .434 .474 .491 .--- .502 .503 .514 .526 .590 .591 .592 .645 .671 .685 .707 .717 .738 .748 .751 .773 .795 .827 .833 .837 .857 .889 .892 .919 .925 .934 .936 .941 .965 .990
Mass-Lowell   .610 209.4 .155 .222 .224 .250 .335 .341 .352 .382 .427 .432 .471 .489 .498 .--- .501 .512 .524 .588 .589 .589 .643 .669 .683 .705 .715 .736 .746 .749 .772 .794 .826 .832 .836 .856 .888 .891 .919 .924 .933 .936 .941 .964 .990
North Dakota  .609 208.6 .154 .221 .223 .250 .335 .340 .351 .381 .426 .431 .470 .488 .497 .499 .--- .511 .523 .587 .588 .588 .642 .668 .682 .704 .714 .735 .745 .748 .771 .793 .825 .831 .835 .856 .888 .891 .918 .924 .933 .935 .941 .964 .990
Clarkson      .603 199.5 .149 .214 .216 .241 .325 .330 .341 .371 .415 .420 .459 .477 .486 .488 .489 .--- .512 .576 .577 .578 .632 .658 .672 .695 .705 .726 .737 .740 .763 .785 .819 .825 .829 .850 .883 .887 .915 .921 .930 .933 .938 .963 .990
Wisconsin     .596 190.5 .143 .206 .208 .233 .315 .320 .331 .360 .404 .409 .448 .465 .474 .476 .477 .488 .--- .564 .566 .566 .621 .648 .662 .685 .695 .717 .728 .731 .755 .778 .812 .818 .823 .844 .878 .882 .911 .917 .927 .930 .935 .961 .989
Providence    .558 147.0 .114 .167 .169 .190 .262 .266 .276 .303 .343 .348 .385 .401 .410 .412 .413 .424 .436 .--- .502 .502 .558 .587 .602 .627 .638 .662 .673 .677 .703 .730 .769 .776 .782 .807 .848 .852 .888 .895 .908 .911 .918 .950 .986
St Cloud      .557 146.0 .113 .166 .168 .189 .260 .265 .275 .301 .342 .346 .383 .400 .409 .411 .412 .423 .434 .498 .--- .500 .557 .585 .600 .625 .636 .660 .672 .675 .702 .728 .768 .775 .780 .806 .847 .851 .887 .895 .907 .910 .917 .950 .986
Cornell       .557 145.9 .113 .166 .168 .189 .260 .265 .275 .301 .342 .346 .383 .400 .408 .411 .412 .422 .434 .498 .500 .--- .557 .585 .600 .625 .636 .660 .672 .675 .702 .728 .768 .775 .780 .806 .847 .851 .887 .895 .907 .910 .917 .950 .986
St Lawrence   .523 116.2 .092 .137 .138 .156 .219 .223 .232 .256 .293 .297 .331 .347 .355 .357 .358 .368 .379 .442 .443 .443 .--- .529 .544 .570 .582 .607 .620 .623 .652 .681 .725 .733 .739 .768 .815 .820 .862 .871 .886 .889 .898 .938 .983
AK-Anchorage  .505 103.5 .083 .124 .125 .142 .200 .203 .212 .234 .269 .273 .306 .321 .329 .331 .332 .342 .352 .413 .415 .415 .471 .--- .516 .542 .553 .579 .592 .596 .626 .655 .701 .709 .716 .746 .797 .802 .848 .858 .874 .878 .887 .930 .980
Boston Coll   .496 97.22 .078 .117 .118 .134 .190 .194 .202 .223 .257 .261 .293 .307 .315 .317 .318 .328 .338 .398 .400 .400 .456 .484 .--- .526 .538 .564 .577 .581 .611 .641 .688 .696 .703 .734 .786 .792 .840 .850 .867 .871 .881 .926 .979
Miami         .480 87.59 .071 .107 .108 .123 .174 .178 .185 .206 .238 .241 .272 .286 .293 .295 .296 .305 .315 .373 .375 .375 .430 .458 .474 .--- .512 .538 .551 .555 .586 .616 .665 .674 .681 .713 .768 .774 .825 .836 .854 .858 .869 .919 .977
Colgate       .473 83.55 .068 .102 .103 .118 .168 .171 .178 .198 .229 .233 .262 .276 .283 .285 .286 .295 .305 .362 .364 .364 .418 .447 .462 .488 .--- .526 .539 .543 .574 .605 .654 .663 .670 .704 .760 .766 .818 .830 .848 .853 .864 .915 .976
Ferris State  .458 75.22 .062 .093 .094 .107 .153 .157 .163 .182 .211 .214 .243 .255 .262 .264 .265 .274 .283 .338 .340 .340 .393 .421 .436 .462 .474 .--- .513 .517 .548 .580 .630 .639 .647 .681 .740 .747 .802 .814 .834 .839 .851 .907 .973
New Hampshire .450 71.37 .059 .089 .090 .102 .147 .150 .156 .174 .202 .206 .233 .246 .252 .254 .255 .263 .272 .327 .328 .328 .380 .408 .423 .449 .461 .487 .--- .504 .535 .567 .618 .627 .635 .670 .730 .737 .794 .806 .827 .832 .844 .902 .972
Ohio State    .447 70.22 .058 .087 .088 .101 .145 .148 .154 .172 .200 .203 .230 .243 .249 .251 .252 .260 .269 .323 .325 .325 .377 .404 .419 .445 .457 .483 .496 .--- .531 .563 .614 .623 .631 .666 .727 .733 .791 .804 .824 .829 .842 .901 .972
Notre Dame    .429 61.96 .051 .078 .079 .090 .130 .133 .139 .155 .181 .184 .209 .220 .227 .228 .229 .237 .245 .297 .298 .298 .348 .374 .389 .414 .426 .452 .465 .469 .--- .532 .584 .594 .601 .638 .701 .708 .770 .783 .806 .811 .825 .889 .968
Northern Mich .411 54.50 .046 .069 .070 .080 .116 .119 .124 .139 .162 .165 .188 .199 .205 .206 .207 .215 .222 .270 .272 .272 .319 .345 .359 .384 .395 .420 .433 .437 .468 .--- .553 .562 .570 .608 .673 .681 .746 .760 .785 .791 .805 .876 .964
AK-Fairbanks  .382 44.11 .037 .057 .057 .066 .096 .098 .103 .115 .136 .138 .158 .168 .173 .174 .175 .181 .188 .231 .232 .232 .275 .299 .312 .335 .346 .370 .382 .386 .416 .447 .--- .510 .518 .556 .625 .633 .704 .720 .747 .753 .770 .851 .955
Mass-Amherst  .376 42.43 .036 .055 .055 .063 .093 .095 .099 .111 .131 .133 .153 .162 .167 .168 .169 .175 .182 .224 .225 .225 .267 .291 .304 .326 .337 .361 .373 .377 .406 .438 .490 .--- .508 .547 .616 .624 .696 .712 .739 .746 .763 .846 .954
Northeastern  .372 41.09 .035 .053 .054 .061 .090 .092 .096 .108 .128 .130 .149 .158 .163 .164 .165 .171 .177 .218 .220 .220 .261 .284 .297 .319 .330 .353 .365 .369 .399 .430 .482 .492 .--- .539 .609 .617 .689 .705 .733 .740 .757 .841 .952
Harvard       .352 35.20 .030 .046 .046 .053 .078 .080 .084 .094 .111 .113 .130 .138 .143 .144 .144 .150 .156 .193 .194 .194 .232 .254 .266 .287 .296 .319 .330 .334 .362 .392 .444 .453 .461 .--- .571 .580 .655 .672 .702 .709 .727 .820 .945
Brown         .316 26.43 .023 .035 .035 .040 .060 .061 .064 .072 .086 .088 .101 .108 .111 .112 .112 .117 .122 .152 .153 .153 .185 .203 .214 .232 .240 .260 .270 .273 .299 .327 .375 .384 .391 .429 .--- .509 .588 .606 .639 .647 .667 .773 .928
Merrimack     .312 25.52 .022 .034 .034 .039 .058 .059 .062 .070 .083 .085 .098 .104 .108 .109 .109 .113 .118 .148 .149 .149 .180 .198 .208 .226 .234 .253 .263 .267 .292 .319 .367 .376 .383 .420 .491 .--- .579 .598 .631 .639 .659 .767 .925
RPI           .276 18.54 .016 .025 .025 .029 .043 .044 .046 .052 .062 .063 .073 .078 .081 .081 .082 .085 .089 .112 .113 .113 .138 .152 .160 .175 .182 .198 .206 .209 .230 .254 .296 .304 .311 .345 .412 .421 .--- .519 .554 .562 .584 .705 .900
Dartmouth     .268 17.17 .015 .023 .023 .027 .040 .041 .043 .048 .058 .059 .068 .073 .075 .076 .076 .079 .083 .105 .105 .105 .129 .142 .150 .164 .170 .186 .194 .196 .217 .240 .280 .288 .295 .328 .394 .402 .481 .--- .535 .543 .566 .689 .893
Army          .254 14.95 .013 .020 .020 .023 .035 .036 .037 .042 .051 .051 .060 .064 .066 .067 .067 .070 .073 .092 .093 .093 .114 .126 .133 .146 .152 .166 .173 .176 .194 .215 .253 .261 .267 .298 .361 .369 .446 .465 .--- .509 .531 .659 .879
Princeton     .251 14.44 .012 .019 .020 .023 .034 .034 .036 .041 .049 .050 .058 .062 .064 .064 .065 .067 .070 .089 .090 .090 .111 .122 .129 .142 .147 .161 .168 .171 .189 .209 .247 .254 .260 .291 .353 .361 .438 .457 .491 .--- .523 .651 .875
Union         .242 13.19 .011 .018 .018 .021 .031 .032 .033 .037 .045 .046 .053 .057 .059 .059 .059 .062 .065 .082 .083 .083 .102 .113 .119 .131 .136 .149 .156 .158 .175 .195 .230 .237 .243 .273 .333 .341 .416 .434 .469 .477 .--- .630 .865
Yale          .199 7.745 .007 .010 .011 .012 .018 .019 .020 .022 .027 .027 .032 .034 .035 .036 .036 .037 .039 .050 .050 .050 .062 .070 .074 .081 .085 .093 .098 .099 .111 .124 .149 .154 .159 .180 .227 .233 .295 .311 .341 .349 .370 .--- .790
Air Force     .133 2.059 .002 .003 .003 .003 .005 .005 .005 .006 .007 .007 .009 .009 .010 .010 .010 .010 .011 .014 .014 .014 .017 .020 .021 .023 .024 .027 .028 .028 .032 .036 .045 .046 .048 .055 .072 .075 .100 .107 .121 .125 .135 .210 .---
All teams in the group have undefined HHWPs with:

 
___________________________
JTW

Enjoy the latest hockey geek tools at [www.elynah.com]

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/15/2015 05:42PM by jtwcornell91.
 
Re: Frozen Four
Posted by: Scersk '97 (---.hsd1.ct.comcast.net)
Date: April 16, 2015 02:29PM

Thanks, John. Observations:

(1) Is that output for '97 rather than '96? 'Cause I don't see UIC.
(2) 43 teams! One forgets…
(3) Boy, another great illustration of why it's PWR rather than KRACH. Wouldn't have been much of a national tournament that year. Good 'ol "last 20" criterion.
 
Re: Frozen Four
Posted by: jtwcornell91 (Moderator)
Date: April 17, 2015 03:44AM

Scersk '97
Thanks, John. Observations:

(1) Is that output for '97 rather than '96? 'Cause I don't see UIC.
(2) 43 teams! One forgets…
(3) Boy, another great illustration of why it's PWR rather than KRACH. Wouldn't have been much of a national tournament that year. Good 'ol "last 20" criterion.

Well, the file is called "1996", so I suspect the problem is that the script I used to generate it 15-ish years ago didn't include IC in its list of known teams (since I wasn't running the ranking codes until 1998). I should really use my old results files to generate KRACH again at some point. If I were really enterprising I would put up DIY pages and scripts going back to 1996, but I fear I don't have the time these days.

As for point 3, I've always said that if you want to ensure conference balance in the field, you should impose that as a selection criterion, rather than using a rating system that makes it look like there is more parity than there really is. (OTOH, KRACH with a fictitious team, as Ken Butler originally implemented it, may be a better approach for that anyway.)

BTW, if you look in the Hockey-L archives, you should be able to find Ken's posting of KRACH back in the 90s.

 
___________________________
JTW

Enjoy the latest hockey geek tools at [www.elynah.com]
 
Re: Frozen Four
Posted by: Scersk '97 (---.hsd1.ct.comcast.net)
Date: April 17, 2015 09:21AM

jtwcornell91
If I were really enterprising I would put up DIY pages and scripts going back to 1996, but I fear I don't have the time these days.

If I were really enterprising, I'd get off my ass and write something to do this myself! But then, I'm lazy. And, hell, I don't even know where one might find historical result composites——collegehockeystats.net has back to 2001, methinks, but I've never found anything further back.

jtwcornell91
BTW, if you look in the Hockey-L archives, you should be able to find Ken's posting of KRACH back in the 90s.

I've looked before, and I'll try again, but I've never been able to find it. For some reason, the last easily found posting from Ken Butler regarding KRACH comes at the end of the 1995 season; he returns to post more at the beginning of the 2000 season. Perhaps he took it to info-hockey-l, which isn't archived as far as I know, in the interim? There are some isolated references to KRACH by other posters, but no obvious posting to the list.
 

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