Polls 2013-14
Posted by Jim Hyla
Re: Polls 2013-14
Posted by: Trotsky (---.raytheon.com)
Date: February 24, 2014 09:54AM
I've always worried about the "can't be punished for a win" fudge creating different outcomes strictly based on game order. Say for instance Yale and Harvard play the same schedule with exactly the same results (their h2hs are ties) except Yale plays UAH (1-31-1) the first game of the season and Harvard plays them the last. Does the fudge factor mean that Harvard will have a better Modified RPI because they aren't allowed to drop, while Yale doesn't get the benefit because, having played UAH first, their proportionately smaller bump is not counted as a "drop"?
(I hate the "can't be 'punished'" epicycle anyway, since it rests on an emotional misperception of "punishment". I'd much prefer building the impossibility of losing value by winning or gaining value by losing into a continuous function rather than creating an artificial stepwise "floor." )
(I hate the "can't be 'punished'" epicycle anyway, since it rests on an emotional misperception of "punishment". I'd much prefer building the impossibility of losing value by winning or gaining value by losing into a continuous function rather than creating an artificial stepwise "floor." )
Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 02/24/2014 09:58AM by Trotsky.
Re: Polls 2013-14
Posted by: Trotsky (---.raytheon.com)
Date: February 24, 2014 12:19PM
Cornell is 11 in the USCHO poll:
US PW Team
03 03 Union
08 07 Quinnipiac
11 11 Cornell
15 18 Yale
16 13 Colgate
24 24 Clarkson
-- 25 RPI
-- 31 SLU
-- 32 Brown
-- 40 Harvard
-- 45 Dartmouth
-- 55 Princeton
Re: Polls 2013-14
Posted by: Jim Hyla (---.arthritishealthdoctors.com)
Date: February 24, 2014 12:25PM
Trotsky
I've always worried about the "can't be punished for a win" fudge creating different outcomes strictly based on game order. Say for instance Yale and Harvard play the same schedule with exactly the same results (their h2hs are ties) except Yale plays UAH (1-31-1) the first game of the season and Harvard plays them the last. Does the fudge factor mean that Harvard will have a better Modified RPI because they aren't allowed to drop, while Yale doesn't get the benefit because, having played UAH first, their proportionately smaller bump is not counted as a "drop"?
(I hate the "can't be 'punished'" epicycle anyway, since it rests on an emotional misperception of "punishment". I'd much prefer building the impossibility of losing value by winning or gaining value by losing into a continuous function rather than creating an artificial stepwise "floor." )
I would hope that the system would come out the same for both of them. The only way for that to happen would be to figure out the RPI without UAH in the schedule for both teams, regardless of when they played them.
___________________________
"Cornell Fans Made the Timbers Tremble", Boston Globe, March/1970
Cornell lawyers stopped the candy throwing. Jan/2005
"Cornell Fans Made the Timbers Tremble", Boston Globe, March/1970
Cornell lawyers stopped the candy throwing. Jan/2005
Re: Polls 2013-14
Posted by: ugarte (207.239.110.---)
Date: February 24, 2014 12:59PM
Pretty sure what it means is that midseason RPI is a work-in-progress. While the games might have a different affect on RPI at the time of the game, they will have the exact same weight in the final result. If you play a team that is 5-0 and they finish the season 5-25, your final RPI treats the game as one against a 5-25 team. Basically you aren't punished for having played UAH in your hypothetical, regardless of when the game was.Jim Hyla
Trotsky
I've always worried about the "can't be punished for a win" fudge creating different outcomes strictly based on game order. Say for instance Yale and Harvard play the same schedule with exactly the same results (their h2hs are ties) except Yale plays UAH (1-31-1) the first game of the season and Harvard plays them the last. Does the fudge factor mean that Harvard will have a better Modified RPI because they aren't allowed to drop, while Yale doesn't get the benefit because, having played UAH first, their proportionately smaller bump is not counted as a "drop"?
(I hate the "can't be 'punished'" epicycle anyway, since it rests on an emotional misperception of "punishment". I'd much prefer building the impossibility of losing value by winning or gaining value by losing into a continuous function rather than creating an artificial stepwise "floor." )
I would hope that the system would come out the same for both of them. The only way for that to happen would be to figure out the RPI without UAH in the schedule for both teams, regardless of when they played them.
This has to be right, right?
___________________________
quality tweets | bluesky (twitter 2) | ALAB Series podcast | Other podcasts and writing
quality tweets | bluesky (twitter 2) | ALAB Series podcast | Other podcasts and writing
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/24/2014 01:02PM by ugarte.
Re: Polls 2013-14
Posted by: KeithK (---.external.lmco.com)
Date: February 24, 2014 01:33PM
I'm pretty sure this is right because the selection committee isn't tracking RPI (or PWR) throughout the season the way we do. They look at the results after the dust has settled on March 23. Hopefully the various sites that calculate the metrics during the season use the same approach: calculating ratings using the entire season to date to get today's rankng.ugarte
Pretty sure what it means is that midseason RPI is a work-in-progress. While the games might have a different affect on RPI at the time of the game, they will have the exact same weight in the final result. If you play a team that is 5-0 and they finish the season 5-25, your final RPI treats the game as one against a 5-25 team. Basically you aren't punished for having played UAH in your hypothetical, regardless of when the game was.Jim Hyla
Trotsky
I've always worried about the "can't be punished for a win" fudge creating different outcomes strictly based on game order. Say for instance Yale and Harvard play the same schedule with exactly the same results (their h2hs are ties) except Yale plays UAH (1-31-1) the first game of the season and Harvard plays them the last. Does the fudge factor mean that Harvard will have a better Modified RPI because they aren't allowed to drop, while Yale doesn't get the benefit because, having played UAH first, their proportionately smaller bump is not counted as a "drop"?
(I hate the "can't be 'punished'" epicycle anyway, since it rests on an emotional misperception of "punishment". I'd much prefer building the impossibility of losing value by winning or gaining value by losing into a continuous function rather than creating an artificial stepwise "floor." )
I would hope that the system would come out the same for both of them. The only way for that to happen would be to figure out the RPI without UAH in the schedule for both teams, regardless of when they played them.
This has to be right, right?
The fact that there's a percieved need for a fudge factor simply points to the limits of RPI as a ranking system. But we've covered that ground many, many times through the years.
Re: Polls 2013-14
Posted by: Jim Hyla (---.arthritishealthdoctors.com)
Date: February 24, 2014 07:35PM
USCHO.com Division I Men's Poll February 24, 2014 Team (First) Record Points Last Poll 1 Boston College (49) 25- 4-4 999 1 2 Minnesota ( 1) 21- 4-5 946 2 3 Union 22- 6-4 901 3 4 Ferris State 23- 7-3 834 6 5 St. Cloud State 18- 7-5 781 4 6 Wisconsin 19- 9-2 732 8 7 Massachusetts-Lowell 20- 8-4 679 7 8 Quinnipiac 21- 8-5 650 5 9 Northeastern 18-10-4 588 9 10 North Dakota 18- 9-3 575 11 11 Cornell 14- 7-5 479 13 12 Providence 17- 9-6 450 12 13 Michigan 15-10-3 372 10 14 Notre Dame 19-12-2 326 15 15 Yale 14- 8-5 300 14 16 Colgate 16-11-5 269 19 17 Vermont 17-11-3 261 16 18 Maine 15-11-4 141 17 19 Minnesota State 19-13-0 86 NR 20 Denver 14-12-6 30 18 Others receiving votes: Ohio State 25, New Hampshire 23, Minnesota-Duluth 15, Clarkson 13, Western Michigan 12, Air Force 7, Mercyhurst 6. Read more: [www.uscho.com]
USA Rank School Last Week 1. Boston College,(33) 509 1 2. Minnesota, (1) 477 2 3. Union, 435 3 4. Ferris State, 405 5 5. St. Cloud State, 364 4 6. Wisconsin, 325 8 7. Quinnipiac, 287 6 8. UMass Lowell, 280 7 9. Northeastern, 232 9 10. North Dakota, 230 11 11. Cornell, 163 13 12. Providence, 103 12 13. Michigan, 94 10 14. Yale, 51 14 15. Colgate, 46 RV Others receiving votes: Notre Dame, 42; Vermont, 27; Maine, 4; Minnesota State, 4.
USCHO.com Division I Women's Poll February 24, 2014 Team (First) Record Points Last Poll 1 Minnesota (15) 32- 1-1 150 1 2 Wisconsin 25- 5-2 133 2 3 Clarkson 25- 4-5 120 4 4 Boston College 25- 5-3 100 5 5 Harvard 21- 4-4 85 5 6 Cornell 20- 5-4 81 3 7 Quinnipiac 20- 5-9 52 9 8 Mercyhurst 22- 7-4 43 8 9 North Dakota 17-11-4 27 7 10 Robert Morris 24- 7-3 24 9 Others receiving votes: Boston University 6, Northeastern 4. Read more: [www.uscho.com]PWR Previously Posted
___________________________
"Cornell Fans Made the Timbers Tremble", Boston Globe, March/1970
Cornell lawyers stopped the candy throwing. Jan/2005
"Cornell Fans Made the Timbers Tremble", Boston Globe, March/1970
Cornell lawyers stopped the candy throwing. Jan/2005
Re: Polls 2013-14
Posted by: Jim Hyla (---.arthritishealthdoctors.com)
Date: March 03, 2014 06:12PM
USCHO.com Division I Men's Poll March 03, 2014 Team (First) Record Points Last Poll 1 Minnesota (37) 23- 4-5 987 2 2 Boston College (12) 25- 5-4 951 1 3 Union ( 1) 24- 6-4 912 3 4 St. Cloud State 19- 8-5 806 5 5 Wisconsin 19- 9-2 786 6 6 Quinnipiac 22- 8-6 709 8 7 Ferris State 23- 9-3 693 4 8 Massachusetts-Lowell 21- 9-4 680 7 9 North Dakota 19-10-3 608 10 10 Providence 19- 9-6 559 12 11 Notre Dame 20-12-2 446 14 12 Michigan 16-10-4 426 13 13 Cornell 15- 8-5 397 11 14 Northeastern 18-12-4 374 9 15 Vermont 18-12-3 258 17 16 Yale 15- 9-5 242 15 17 Minnesota State 21-13-0 228 19 18 Colgate 17-12-5 227 16 19 Minnesota-Duluth 15-13-4 72 NR 20 Maine 15-13-4 28 18 Others receiving votes: Denver 27, Clarkson 17, Ohio State 17, New Hampshire 16, Air Force 10, Mercyhurst 8, Western Michigan 8, Nebraska-Omaha 6, Alaska 2. Read more: [www.uscho.com]
USA Rank School Last Week 1. Minnesota, (27) 503 2 2. Boston College,(7) 480 1 3. Union, 427 3 4. St. Cloud State, 391 5 5. Wisconsin, 376 6 6. Quinnipiac, 307 7 7. Ferris State, 304 4 8. UMass Lowell, 278 8 9. North Dakota, 235 10 10. Providence, 210 12 11. Michigan, 148 13 12. Notre Dame, 144 RV 13. Cornell, 119 11 14. Northeastern, 92 9 15. Yale, 27 14 Others receiving votes: Minnesota State, 14; Vermont, 13; Colgate, 10; Alaska, 2.
CHN PWR Rk Team PCWs RPI Rk preRPI QWB-† W-L-T Win % Wgtd Win % - ‡ 1 Minnesota 58 .6012 2 .5922 .0090 23-4-5 .7969 .7872 2 Boston College 57 .6012 1 .5932 .0080 25-5-4 .7941 .8047 3 Union 55 .5818 3 .5772 .0046 24-6-4 .7647 .7688 4 St. Cloud State 55 .5602 4 .5546 .0055 19-8-5 .6719 .6606 5 Wisconsin 54 .5586 5 .5538 .0048 19-9-2 .6667 .6538 6 Ferris State 53 .5584 6 .5576 .0008 23-9-3 .7000 .7246 7 Quinnipiac 52 .5542 8 .5496 .0046 22-8-6 .6944 .6903 8 Mass.-Lowell 51 .5546 7 .5506 .0040 21-9-4 .6765 .6766 9 North Dakota 50 .5516 9 .5487 .0030 19-10-3 .6406 .6369 10 Notre Dame 49 .5458 10 .5399 .0059 20-12-2 .6176 .5975 11 Providence 47 .5456 11 .5417 .0039 19-9-6 .6471 .6404 12 Michigan 46 .5430 12 .5393 .0037 16-10-4 .6000 .6069 13 Cornell 45 .5407 13 .5388 .0019 15-8-5 .6250 .6259 14 Vermont 45 .5392 14 .5366 .0026 18-12-3 .5909 .5833 15 Northeastern 44 .5387 15 .5324 .0063 18-12-4 .5882 .5901 16 Colgate 43 .5351 17 .5277 .0074 17-12-5 .5735 .5632
USCHO.com Division I Women's Poll March 03, 2014 Team (First) Record Points Last Poll 1 Minnesota (15) 34- 1-1 150 1 2 Wisconsin 27- 6-2 126 2 3 Clarkson 27- 4-5 125 3 4 Boston College 26- 5-3 104 4 5 Cornell 22- 5-4 87 6 6 Harvard 23- 5-4 76 5 7 Quinnipiac 22- 5-9 50 7 8 Mercyhurst 22- 7-4 45 8 9 North Dakota 19-11-4 33 9 10 Robert Morris 24- 7-3 23 10 Others receiving votes: Boston University 3, Northeastern 2, Minnesota-Duluth 1. Read more: [www.uscho.com]
Women’s Division I PairWise Rankings Rank Team PWR W-L-T Win % Win % RPI RPI Rank Rank 1 Minnesota 16 34-1-1 .9583 1 .6738* 1 2 Wisconsin 15 27-6-2 .8000 4 .6049* 2 3 Clarkson 14 27-4-5 .8194 2 .6019* 3 4 Cornell 13 22-5-4 .7742 6 .5966* 4 5 Boston College 12 26-5-3 .8088 3 .5928* 5 6 Harvard 11 23-5-4 .7812 5 .5889* 6 7 Robert Morris 10 24-7-3 .7500 7 .5638* 8 8 Mercyhurst 9 22-7-4 .7273 9 .5626* 9 9 Quinnipiac 8 22-5-9 .7361 8 .5661* 7 10 North Dakota 7 19-11-4 .6176 12 .5516 10 11t Boston Univ 5 22-12-1 .6429 10 .5381 11 11t Northeastern 5 19-13-2 .5882 14 .5225 12 13t Minnesota-Duluth4 15-14-6 .5143 18 .5196 13 13t Syracuse 4 20-13-3 .5972 13 .5176 14 15 Ohio State 2 15-17-5 .4730 19 .5027 16 16 Princeton 1 14-13-4 .5161 17 .5113 15 17 Vermont 0 18-13-4 .5714 15 .5027 17 Read more: [www.uscho.com]
___________________________
"Cornell Fans Made the Timbers Tremble", Boston Globe, March/1970
Cornell lawyers stopped the candy throwing. Jan/2005
"Cornell Fans Made the Timbers Tremble", Boston Globe, March/1970
Cornell lawyers stopped the candy throwing. Jan/2005
Re: Polls 2013-14
Posted by: Jim Hyla (---.arthritishealthdoctors.com)
Date: March 03, 2014 06:32PM
So who are the better prognosticators?
Coaches’ preseason poll Ended 1. Yale (4) - 103 6 2. Rensselaer (2) - 102 7 3. Quinnipiac (2) - 93 3 Union (2) - 93 1 5. Cornell (1) - 89 4 6. Harvard - 67 11 7. Dartmouth (1) - 64 10 8. Brown - 46 9 9. Colgate - 44 2 10. St. Lawrence - 43 8 11. Princeton - 26 12 12. Clarkson - 22 5 ECAC Hockey Media Association's 2013-14 preseason poll Ended 1. Rensselaer (18) - 367 7 2. Yale (5) - 224 6 3. Quinnipiac (6) - 292 3 4. Union (3) - 287 1 5. Cornell (1) - 238 4 Dartmouth - 238 10 7. St. Lawrence - 212 8 8. Brown - 188 9 9. Colgate - 125 2 10.Harvard - 108 11 11.Princeton - 102 12 12.Clarkson - 83 5
Preseason Final Season Pts Coaches Media 1 Union 37 4 4 2 Colgate 29 9 9 3 Quinnipiac 28 3 3 4 Cornell 26 5 5 5 Clarkson 24 12 12 Yale 24 1 2 7 Rensselaer 21 2 1 8 St. Lawrence 18 10 7 9 Brown 17 8 8 10 Dartmouth 16 7 6 Harvard 16 6 10 12 Princeton 8 11 11
___________________________
"Cornell Fans Made the Timbers Tremble", Boston Globe, March/1970
Cornell lawyers stopped the candy throwing. Jan/2005
"Cornell Fans Made the Timbers Tremble", Boston Globe, March/1970
Cornell lawyers stopped the candy throwing. Jan/2005
Re: Polls 2013-14
Posted by: KeithK (---.external.lmco.com)
Date: March 03, 2014 08:30PM
Whichever coach picked Dartmouth to finish first is clearly the worst prognosticator.
Re: Polls 2013-14
Posted by: French Rage (---.hsd1.ca.comcast.net)
Date: March 04, 2014 12:29AM
Jim Hyla
So who are the better prognosticators?Coaches’ preseason poll Ended 1. Yale (4) - 103 6 2. Rensselaer (2) - 102 7 3. Quinnipiac (2) - 93 3 Union (2) - 93 1 5. Cornell (1) - 89 4 6. Harvard - 67 11 7. Dartmouth (1) - 64 10 8. Brown - 46 9 9. Colgate - 44 2 10. St. Lawrence - 43 8 11. Princeton - 26 12 12. Clarkson - 22 5 ECAC Hockey Media Association's 2013-14 preseason poll Ended 1. Rensselaer (18) - 367 7 2. Yale (5) - 224 6 3. Quinnipiac (6) - 292 3 4. Union (3) - 287 1 5. Cornell (1) - 238 4 Dartmouth - 238 10 7. St. Lawrence - 212 8 8. Brown - 188 9 9. Colgate - 125 2 10.Harvard - 108 11 11.Princeton - 102 12 12.Clarkson - 83 5Preseason Final Season Pts Coaches Media 1 Union 37 4 4 2 Colgate 29 9 9 3 Quinnipiac 28 3 3 4 Cornell 26 5 5 5 Clarkson 24 12 12 Yale 24 1 2 7 Rensselaer 21 2 1 8 St. Lawrence 18 10 7 9 Brown 17 8 8 10 Dartmouth 16 7 6 Harvard 16 6 10 12 Princeton 8 11 11
Well, who is? Eyeball test says the media by a hair, but neither did great, and I can't so a sum of squares in my head.
___________________________
03/23/02: Maine 4, Harvard 3
03/28/03: BU 6, Harvard 4
03/26/04: Maine 5, Harvard 4
03/26/05: UNH 3, Harvard 2
03/25/06: Maine 6, Harvard 1
03/23/02: Maine 4, Harvard 3
03/28/03: BU 6, Harvard 4
03/26/04: Maine 5, Harvard 4
03/26/05: UNH 3, Harvard 2
03/25/06: Maine 6, Harvard 1
Re: Polls 2013-14
Posted by: gatefan (---.ipcom.comunitel.net)
Date: March 04, 2014 07:17AM
French Rage
Jim Hyla
So who are the better prognosticators?Coaches’ preseason poll Ended 1. Yale (4) - 103 6 2. Rensselaer (2) - 102 7 3. Quinnipiac (2) - 93 3 Union (2) - 93 1 5. Cornell (1) - 89 4 6. Harvard - 67 11 7. Dartmouth (1) - 64 10 8. Brown - 46 9 9. Colgate - 44 2 10. St. Lawrence - 43 8 11. Princeton - 26 12 12. Clarkson - 22 5 ECAC Hockey Media Association's 2013-14 preseason poll Ended 1. Rensselaer (18) - 367 7 2. Yale (5) - 224 6 3. Quinnipiac (6) - 292 3 4. Union (3) - 287 1 5. Cornell (1) - 238 4 Dartmouth - 238 10 7. St. Lawrence - 212 8 8. Brown - 188 9 9. Colgate - 125 2 10.Harvard - 108 11 11.Princeton - 102 12 12.Clarkson - 83 5Preseason Final Season Pts Coaches Media 1 Union 37 4 4 2 Colgate 29 9 9 3 Quinnipiac 28 3 3 4 Cornell 26 5 5 5 Clarkson 24 12 12 Yale 24 1 2 7 Rensselaer 21 2 1 8 St. Lawrence 18 10 7 9 Brown 17 8 8 10 Dartmouth 16 7 6 Harvard 16 6 10 12 Princeton 8 11 11
Well, who is? Eyeball test says the media by a hair, but neither did great, and I can't so a sum of squares in my head.
I'd say the coaches did worst, mainly because of Harvard. Year after year, they keep picking Harvard in the top half, and except in 2011-12 (I actually think they didn't pick them top half) they have been disappointing since losing that first round series to Brown in 2009.
Re: Polls 2013-14
Posted by: marty (---.albyny.fios.verizon.net)
Date: March 04, 2014 07:34AM
gatefan
French Rage
Jim Hyla
So who are the better prognosticators?Coaches’ preseason poll Ended 1. Yale (4) - 103 6 2. Rensselaer (2) - 102 7 3. Quinnipiac (2) - 93 3 Union (2) - 93 1 5. Cornell (1) - 89 4 6. Harvard - 67 11 7. Dartmouth (1) - 64 10 8. Brown - 46 9 9. Colgate - 44 2 10. St. Lawrence - 43 8 11. Princeton - 26 12 12. Clarkson - 22 5 ECAC Hockey Media Association's 2013-14 preseason poll Ended 1. Rensselaer (18) - 367 7 2. Yale (5) - 224 6 3. Quinnipiac (6) - 292 3 4. Union (3) - 287 1 5. Cornell (1) - 238 4 Dartmouth - 238 10 7. St. Lawrence - 212 8 8. Brown - 188 9 9. Colgate - 125 2 10.Harvard - 108 11 11.Princeton - 102 12 12.Clarkson - 83 5Preseason Final Season Pts Coaches Media 1 Union 37 4 4 2 Colgate 29 9 9 3 Quinnipiac 28 3 3 4 Cornell 26 5 5 5 Clarkson 24 12 12 Yale 24 1 2 7 Rensselaer 21 2 1 8 St. Lawrence 18 10 7 9 Brown 17 8 8 10 Dartmouth 16 7 6 Harvard 16 6 10 12 Princeton 8 11 11
Well, who is? Eyeball test says the media by a hair, but neither did great, and I can't so a sum of squares in my head.
I'd say the coaches did worst, mainly because of Harvard. Year after year, they keep picking Harvard in the top half, and except in 2011-12 (I actually think they didn't pick them top half) they have been disappointing since losing that first round series to Brown in 2009.
They are trying to fool the AD at Harvard into thinking that Teddy is worth keeping on the Cantab's payroll.
Re: Polls 2013-14
Posted by: Trotsky (---.raytheon.com)
Date: March 04, 2014 08:44AM
French Rage
Well, who is? Eyeball test says the media by a hair, but neither did great, and I can't so a sum of squares in my head.
I can't either, but I'll tell you this -- it aint TBRW. It picked Colgate 12th. Nothing like a 100 cell value (greater than many entire league runs) to ruin your prediction.
Media wins by a smidge.
Coach Media TBRW Coach Media TBRW 1 Uni 4 4 3 3 3 2 2 Col 9 9 12 7 7 10 3 Qpc 3 3 2 0 0 -1 4 Cor 5 5 5 1 1 1 5 Clk 12 12 10 7 7 5 6 Yal 1 2 7 -5 -4 1 7 RPI 2 1 1 -5 -6 -6 8 SLU 10 7 4 2 -1 -4 9 Brn 8 8 6 -1 -1 -3 10 Drt 7 6 8 -3 -4 -2 11 Hvd 6 10 9 -5 -1 -2 12 Prn 11 11 11 -1 -1 -1 198 180 202
Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 03/04/2014 08:52AM by Trotsky.
Re: Polls 2013-14
Posted by: marty (---.albyny.fios.verizon.net)
Date: March 04, 2014 09:48AM
Trotsky
French Rage
Well, who is? Eyeball test says the media by a hair, but neither did great, and I can't so a sum of squares in my head.
I can't either, but I'll tell you this -- it aint TBRW. It picked Colgate 12th. Nothing like a 100 cell value (greater than many entire league runs) to ruin your prediction.
Media wins by a smidge.
Coach Media TBRW Coach Media TBRW 1 Uni 4 4 3 3 3 2 2 Col 9 9 12 7 7 10 3 Qpc 3 3 2 0 0 -1 4 Cor 5 5 5 1 1 1 5 Clk 12 12 10 7 7 5 6 Yal 1 2 7 -5 -4 1 7 RPI 2 1 1 -5 -6 -6 8 SLU 10 7 4 2 -1 -4 9 Brn 8 8 6 -1 -1 -3 10 Drt 7 6 8 -3 -4 -2 11 Hvd 6 10 9 -5 -1 -2 12 Prn 11 11 11 -1 -1 -1 198 180 202
You do get points for picking Clarkson tenth rather than twelfth.
Re: Polls 2013-14
Posted by: Trotsky (---.raytheon.com)
Date: March 04, 2014 09:57AM
This year's good prediction was that Yale would regress, which was projected from Yale's 2013 ECAC upset loss and second half drop, and the loss of their goaltending and a substantial amount of their offense.marty
You do get points for picking Clarkson tenth rather than twelfth.
Then again, the other team that was supposed to crater by those metrics was... Colgate. Oh well.
The teams possibly in trouble in 2014-15 based on loss of senior scoring will be: Clarkson (losing 4 of their top 5 scorers), Princeton (4/6 including Caloff), Quinnipiac (3/5: the Jones brothers and Samuels-Thomas), St. Lawrence (3/5 including Greg Carey's 181 career points), Union (3/5 including Carr and Bodie), and Yale again (3/4, including Root and Agostino).
Far and away the greatest impact from loss in goal will be us. Brown (DeFilippo), Harvard (Girard), and St. Lawrence (Weninger) all either have credible backups or are losing unimpressive incumbents.
Edited 5 time(s). Last edit at 03/04/2014 10:18AM by Trotsky.
Re: Polls 2013-14
Posted by: Jim Hyla (---.arthritishealthdoctors.com)
Date: March 04, 2014 12:44PM
Trotsky
This year's good prediction was that Yale would regress, which was projected from Yale's 2013 ECAC upset loss and second half drop, and the loss of their goaltending and a substantial amount of their offense.marty
You do get points for picking Clarkson tenth rather than twelfth.
Then again, the other team that was supposed to crater by those metrics was... Colgate. Oh well.
The teams possibly in trouble in 2014-15 based on loss of senior scoring will be: Clarkson (losing 4 of their top 5 scorers), Princeton (4/6 including Caloff), Quinnipiac (3/5: the Jones brothers and Samuels-Thomas), St. Lawrence (3/5 including Greg Carey's 181 career points), Union (3/5 including Carr and Bodie), and Yale again (3/4, including Root and Agostino).
Far and away the greatest impact from loss in goal will be us. Brown (DeFilippo), Harvard (Girard), and St. Lawrence (Weninger) all either have credible backups or are losing unimpressive incumbents.
What a surprise, possibly?
___________________________
"Cornell Fans Made the Timbers Tremble", Boston Globe, March/1970
Cornell lawyers stopped the candy throwing. Jan/2005
"Cornell Fans Made the Timbers Tremble", Boston Globe, March/1970
Cornell lawyers stopped the candy throwing. Jan/2005
Re: Polls 2013-14
Posted by: Kyle Rose (---.customer.alter.net)
Date: March 04, 2014 12:58PM
Trotsky
This year's good prediction was that Yale would regress, which was projected from Yale's 2013 ECAC upset loss and second half drop, and the loss of their goaltending and a substantial amount of their offense.marty
You do get points for picking Clarkson tenth rather than twelfth.
Then again, the other team that was supposed to crater by those metrics was... Colgate. Oh well.
The teams possibly in trouble in 2014-15 based on loss of senior scoring will be: Clarkson (losing 4 of their top 5 scorers), Princeton (4/6 including Caloff), Quinnipiac (3/5: the Jones brothers and Samuels-Thomas), St. Lawrence (3/5 including Greg Carey's 181 career points), Union (3/5 including Carr and Bodie), and Yale again (3/4, including Root and Agostino).
Far and away the greatest impact from loss in goal will be us. Brown (DeFilippo), Harvard (Girard), and St. Lawrence (Weninger) all either have credible backups or are losing unimpressive incumbents.
I can't wait for the follow-up thread, "Not-Andy Iles by the numbers".
Re: Polls 2013-14
Posted by: Trotsky (---.raytheon.com)
Date: March 04, 2014 01:00PM
Possibly in the sense of if other teams lose more to defections then those teams may not wind up looking too bad.Jim Hyla
What a surprise, possibly?
Edit: oh, I get it, Princeton. Yeah, that could be a serious train wreck, but then again Cornell did pretty well in 1988.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/04/2014 01:05PM by Trotsky.
Re: Polls 2013-14
Posted by: Trotsky (---.raytheon.com)
Date: March 04, 2014 01:03PM
Or "Iles is not an answer."Kyle Rose
I can't wait for the follow-up thread, "Not-Andy Iles by the numbers".
Re: Polls 2013-14
Posted by: Swampy (131.128.163.---)
Date: March 04, 2014 01:25PM
Trotsky
This year's good prediction was that Yale would regress, which was projected from Yale's 2013 ECAC upset loss and second half drop, and the loss of their goaltending and a substantial amount of their offense.marty
You do get points for picking Clarkson tenth rather than twelfth.
Then again, the other team that was supposed to crater by those metrics was... Colgate. Oh well.
The teams possibly in trouble in 2014-15 based on loss of senior scoring will be: Clarkson (losing 4 of their top 5 scorers), Princeton (4/6 including Caloff), Quinnipiac (3/5: the Jones brothers and Samuels-Thomas), St. Lawrence (3/5 including Greg Carey's 181 career points), Union (3/5 including Carr and Bodie), and Yale again (3/4, including Root and Agostino).
Far and away the greatest impact from loss in goal will be us. Brown (DeFilippo), Harvard (Girard), and St. Lawrence (Weninger) all either have credible backups or are losing unimpressive incumbents.
Is it too early to start a "Gillam is not the answer" thread?
Re: Polls 2013-14
Posted by: Jeff Hopkins '82 (---.airproducts.com)
Date: March 04, 2014 01:28PM
Trotsky
Or "Iles is not an answer."Kyle Rose
I can't wait for the follow-up thread, "Not-Andy Iles by the numbers".
I'd hope to see "Not-Iles is the answer."
Re: Polls 2013-14
Posted by: Trotsky (---.raytheon.com)
Date: March 04, 2014 01:51PM
The accepted practice is:Swampy
Is it too early to start a "Gillam is not the answer" thread?
1. Wait for X to lose a game*.
2. Judiciously conclude X is not the answer, we are doomed, Schafer must go, and anyone who thinks differently is a Pollyanna to be reviled or pitied.
* note this can occur after any number of wins
Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 03/04/2014 01:57PM by Trotsky.
Re: Polls 2013-14
Posted by: Robb (134.223.230.---)
Date: March 04, 2014 02:13PM
You left out step 3: transfer to RPI. (or is that step 0?)Trotsky
The accepted practice is:Swampy
Is it too early to start a "Gillam is not the answer" thread?
1. Wait for X to lose a game*.
2. Judiciously conclude X is not the answer, we are doomed, Schafer must go, and anyone who thinks differently is a Pollyanna to be reviled or pitied.
* note this can occur after any number of wins
Re: Polls 2013-14
Posted by: Trotsky (---.raytheon.com)
Date: March 04, 2014 02:23PM
One does not "transfer" to RPI. One is "designated for assignment."Robb
You left out step 3: transfer to RPI. (or is that step 0?)
Re: Polls 2013-14
Posted by: Give My Regards (---.twcny.res.rr.com)
Date: March 04, 2014 10:11PM
Swampy
Is it too early to start a "Gillam is not the answer" thread?
Wow, tough crowd. After all, he does lead the team in goals scored per game played.
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Re: Polls 2013-14
Posted by: ugarte (---.dyn.optonline.net)
Date: March 05, 2014 12:19AM
whatevs. his goal scoring streak is already overGive My Regards
Swampy
Is it too early to start a "Gillam is not the answer" thread?
Wow, tough crowd. After all, he does lead the team in goals scored per game played.
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Re: Polls 2013-14
Posted by: gatefan (---.ipcom.comunitel.net)
Date: March 05, 2014 04:07AM
Trotsky
This year's good prediction was that Yale would regress, which was projected from Yale's 2013 ECAC upset loss and second half drop, and the loss of their goaltending and a substantial amount of their offense.marty
You do get points for picking Clarkson tenth rather than twelfth.
Then again, the other team that was supposed to crater by those metrics was... Colgate. Oh well.
The teams possibly in trouble in 2014-15 based on loss of senior scoring will be: Clarkson (losing 4 of their top 5 scorers), Princeton (4/6 including Caloff), Quinnipiac (3/5: the Jones brothers and Samuels-Thomas), St. Lawrence (3/5 including Greg Carey's 181 career points), Union (3/5 including Carr and Bodie), and Yale again (3/4, including Root and Agostino).
Far and away the greatest impact from loss in goal will be us. Brown (DeFilippo), Harvard (Girard), and St. Lawrence (Weninger) all either have credible backups or are losing unimpressive incumbents.
Looking at that, we (Colgate) should be in good shape entering next year, losing our No. 1A goalie (Mihalik may be back-up but we owe him 3 playoff series wins) and a fourth-liner. Then again, we also thought we were in good shape entering 2010-11 and only started playing like the team we were supposed to be all year in the postseason.
Re: Polls 2013-14
Posted by: Jim Hyla (---.arthritishealthdoctors.com)
Date: March 10, 2014 05:48PM
So, probably the last week to post the polls.
They are even less significant this time of year and reasonably match the PWR.
They are even less significant this time of year and reasonably match the PWR.
USCHO.com Division I Men's Poll March 10, 2014 Team (First) Record Points Last Poll 1 Minnesota (29) 24- 4-6 978 1 2 Boston College (19) 25- 5-4 965 2 3 Union ( 1) 24- 6-4 899 3 4 St. Cloud State ( 1) 21- 8-5 841 4 5 Wisconsin 21- 9-2 788 5 6 Ferris State 25- 9-3 719 7 6 Quinnipiac 22- 8-6 719 6 8 Massachusetts-Lowell 21- 9-4 669 8 9 Providence 19- 9-6 569 10 10 North Dakota 20-11-3 554 9 11 Notre Dame 21-12-2 481 11 12 Cornell 15- 8-5 428 13 13 Michigan 17-11-4 365 12 14 Northeastern 18-12-4 348 14 15 Vermont 19-12-3 318 15 16 Yale 17- 9-5 254 16 17 Colgate 17-12-5 213 18 18 Minnesota State 22-13-1 205 17 19 Maine 16-13-4 68 20 20 Minnesota-Duluth 16-14-4 62 19 Others receiving votes: New Hampshire 18, Clarkson 8, Western Michigan 8, Ohio State 7, Denver 6, Nebraska-Omaha 5, Air Force 4, Alaska 1. Read more: [www.uscho.com]
USA Rank School Last Week 1. Minnesota, 506 (30)1 2. Boston College, 480 (4) 2 3. Union, 439 3 4. St. Cloud State,401 4 5. Wisconsin, 371 5 6. Ferris State, 324 7 7. Quinnipiac, 319 6 8. UMass Lowell, 268 8 9. North Dakota, 219 9 10. Providence, 199 10 11. Notre Dame, 161 12 12. Cornell, 133 13 13. Michigan, 86 11 14. Northeastern, 67 14 15. Vermont, 47 RV Others receiving votes: Yale, 25; Colgate, 22; Minnesota State, 13.
PWR Rk Team PCWs RPI Rk QWB-† W-L-T Win % Wgtd Win % - ‡ 1 Minnesota 58 .6011 1 .0080 24-4-6 .7941 .7893 2 Boston College 57 .6007 2 .0083 25-5-4 .7941 .8047 3 Union 55 .5809 3 .0048 24-6-4 .7647 .7688 4 Wisconsin 55 .5643 4 .0042 21-9-2 .6875 .6831 5 St. Cloud State 54 .5634 5 .0047 21-8-5 .6912 .6836 6 Ferris State 53 .5626 6 .0006 25-9-3 .7162 .7371 7 Quinnipiac 52 .5548 7 .0045 22-8-6 .6944 .6903 8 Mass.-Lowell 51 .5537 8 .0041 21-9-4 .6765 .6766 9 Notre Dame 50 .5482 9 .0057 21-12-2 .6286 .6074 10 North Dakota 49 .5465 10 .0026 20-11-3 .6324 .6228 11 Providence 47 .5463 11 .0043 19-9-6 .6471 .6404 12 Vermont 47 .5418 12 .0026 19-12-3 .6029 .5930 13 Cornell 45 .5412 13 .0024 15-8-5 .6250 .6259 14 Michigan 44 .5404 14 .0035 17-11-4 .5938 .6013 15 Northeastern 44 .5393 15 .0065 18-12-4 .5882 .5901 16 Colgate 43 .5356 17 .0077 17-12-5 .5735 .5632
USCHO.com Division I Women's Poll March 10, 2014 Team (First) Record Points Last Poll 1 Minnesota (15) 36- 1-1 150 1 2 Cornell 24- 5-4 126 5 3 Wisconsin 27- 7-2 118 2 4 Clarkson 28- 5-5 112 3 5 Boston College 27- 6-3 87 4 6 Harvard 23- 6-4 76 6 7 Mercyhurst 23- 8-4 49 8 8 North Dakota 20-12-4 45 9 9 Boston University 24-12-1 29 NR 10 Quinnipiac 22- 6-9 23 7 Others receiving votes: Robert Morris 8, Minnesota-Duluth 1, Rochester Institute of Technology 1. Read more: [www.uscho.com]
Women’s Division I PairWise Rankings Rank Team PWR W-L-T Win % Win % RPI RPI Rank Rank 1 Minnesota 16 36-1-1 .9605 1 .6794* 1 2 Cornell 15 24-5-4 .7879 4 .6046* 2 3 Clarkson 14 28-5-5 .8026 2 .5999* 3 4 Wisconsin 13 27-7-2 .7778 5 .5980* 4 5 Harvard 12 23-6-4 .7576 6 .5832* 6 6 Boston College 11 27-6-3 .7917 3 .5886* 5 7 Mercyhurst 10 23-8-4 .7143 9 .5593* 8 8 Quinnipiac 9 22-6-9 .7162 8 .5609* 7 9 Robert Morris 8 24-8-3 .7286 7 .5568 9 10 North Dakota 7 20-12-4 .6111 12 .5529 10 11 Boston Univer 6 24-12-1 .6622 10 .5458 11 Read more: [www.uscho.com]
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Re: Polls 2013-14
Posted by: Jeff Hopkins '82 (---.airproducts.com)
Date: March 11, 2014 11:49AM
Wisconsin-Clarkson, Harvard-BC, and Quinny-Nodak, all flipped in the the Women's poll relative to the PWR. Sure looks like an anti-ECAC bias to me.
Re: Polls 2013-14
Posted by: Josh '99 (---.nyc.res.rr.com)
Date: March 11, 2014 12:01PM
Since 2005, the champship has been won by a western team every year; the runners-up have been other western teams four times, BU twice, Mercyhurst once, Cornell once. I suppose I can understand the bias on that basis.Jeff Hopkins '82
Wisconsin-Clarkson, Harvard-BC, and Quinny-Nodak, all flipped in the the Women's poll relative to the PWR. Sure looks like an anti-ECAC bias to me.
Re: Polls 2013-14
Posted by: Chris '03 (38.104.240.---)
Date: March 11, 2014 12:25PM
Josh '99
Since 2005, the champship has been won by a western team every year; the runners-up have been other western teams four times, BU twice, Mercyhurst once, Cornell once. I suppose I can understand the bias on that basis.Jeff Hopkins '82
Wisconsin-Clarkson, Harvard-BC, and Quinny-Nodak, all flipped in the the Women's poll relative to the PWR. Sure looks like an anti-ECAC bias to me.
Yeah. I think the west has earned it here. In the 13 year history of the event, which has never been won by an eastern school, the ECAC has had the runner up six times, WCHA four times, HEA twice, CHA once.
Also of note, the Frozen Four has never been on an ECAC campus before this year and won't be again until at least 2019. (Minneapolis in '15, Durham in '16, St. Charles, MO(?) in '17, and Minneapolis again (for the sixth time) in '18.
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Re: Polls 2013-14
Posted by: Trotsky (---.raytheon.com)
Date: March 11, 2014 12:39PM
This may seem like a bizarre choice (and, well, it is) but St. Charles is one of the most interesting towns in the country. It's a very strange place -- sort of if Savannah and Reno had a baby in Kansas.Chris '03
St. Charles, MO(?) in '17
Also the birthplace of Santino from Project Runway, which once you go there makes perfect sense.
Re: Polls 2013-14
Posted by: Jeff Hopkins '82 (---.airproducts.com)
Date: March 11, 2014 01:15PM
Josh '99
Since 2005, the champship has been won by a western team every year; the runners-up have been other western teams four times, BU twice, Mercyhurst once, Cornell once. I suppose I can understand the bias on that basis.Jeff Hopkins '82
Wisconsin-Clarkson, Harvard-BC, and Quinny-Nodak, all flipped in the the Women's poll relative to the PWR. Sure looks like an anti-ECAC bias to me.
Understand, yes. Accept gracefully? Never!
Re: Polls 2013-14
Posted by: Trotsky (---.hsd1.md.comcast.net)
Date: March 17, 2014 01:51PM
We drop one slot to 13. Union moves up to 2 for the first time in their history.
02 Uni 05 Qpc 13 Cor 14 Col 20 Yal 26 Clk
Re: Polls 2013-14
Posted by: Trotsky (---.raytheon.com)
Date: March 24, 2014 03:54PM
Cornell slides to #16 in USCHO.
Union is #1 for the first time in school history.
Union is #1 for the first time in school history.
01 Uni 07 Qpc 12 Col 16 Cor 21 Yal
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/24/2014 03:55PM by Trotsky.
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